From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 10:20:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Feb 1 10:20:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> Since many rockhounds are interested in astronomy and the space program, from Axel Emmermann who saved the moonrocks, to Bill Heacox who was a finalist to be a Mission Specialist, I feel a need to express our shock and sadness over the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. It is a terrible blow to the Space Program, to our nation, and to the world. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.443 / Virus Database: 248 - Release Date: 1/10/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 10:31:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sat Feb 1 10:31:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <3E3C124F.6612ADAB@cox.net> Kitty, Me too, I posted similar to two lists, got one negative reply. When something of this magnitude occurs, there is a great need to share one's horror. I personally feel very unstable at this moment, and the need to connect with others is rather urgent. Thank you for expressing my personal shock. Sincerely, Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 10:39:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 1 10:39:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle Message-ID: <9.8ca41fc.2b6d6e2d@aol.com> As one of the rockhounds also interested in the Heavens..I too am in shock and wish to convey my deepest condolences to the family and friends of the astronauts, to NASA and Mission Control who like us..feel like we've lost family members! God Speed!! Jackie In a message dated 2/1/03 1:31:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, tam2819@cox.net writes: > Kitty, > Me too, I posted similar to two lists, got one negative reply. > > When something of this magnitude occurs, there is a great need to share > one's horror. I personally feel very unstable at this moment, and the > need to connect with others is rather urgent. > > Thank you for expressing my personal shock. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 10:44:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Feb 1 10:44:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: I can only pray that the Lord has accepted into his bosom these brave men and women and will succor the grieving family and Nations. Bryan "Si vis pacem para bellum" > > Since many rockhounds are interested in astronomy and the space program, > from Axel Emmermann who saved the moonrocks, to Bill Heacox who was a > finalist to be a Mission Specialist, I feel a need to express our > shock and > sadness over the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. It is a > terrible blow > to the Space Program, to our nation, and to the world. > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 10:45:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sat Feb 1 10:45:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <3E3C168F.EA3745D8@att.net> Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > > Since many rockhounds are interested in astronomy and the space program, > from Axel Emmermann who saved the moonrocks, to Bill Heacox who was a > finalist to be a Mission Specialist, I feel a need to express our shock and > sadness over the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. It is a terrible blow > to the Space Program, to our nation, and to the world. This was a personal loss for me. Four of my mineral specimens were flying in the cargo bay as part of a passive experiment. I got up and turned on the news to watch the landing, and instead was greeted by speculation, then increasing evidence, that the shuttle was lost. I am far more grieved by the loss of life and international pain at this event, but I can't help feeling disappointment at the disatrous end of a year's worth of work and planning. I will shake it off quickly, but I am especially sad for all the schoolchildren who had experiements flying as part of the SEM 141 FREESTAR package. These people were pioneers who died doing what they loved. Our best tribute to their memory would be to continue the program and look forward to the day when space travel is far more safe and routine. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 1 19:20:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Feb 1 19:20:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <3E3C8E37.5060@Tomaszewski.net> Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > > Since many rockhounds are interested in astronomy and the space program, > from Axel Emmermann who saved the moonrocks, to Bill Heacox who was a > finalist to be a Mission Specialist, I feel a need to express our shock and > sadness over the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. It is a terrible blow > to the Space Program, to our nation, and to the world. > > Aloha, Kitty > I spent the day with my siblings cleaning out my late Mom's house. We left the TV on as we worked, and grieved together at the loss of more brave explorers. Exploration has always come at a dear price in the history of mankind, but the benefits to those who follow the pioneers have been great. I Pray that God will comfort the families, friends, and co-workers of those who have been lost. We must not allow a temporary setback to stop us from realizing the dreams of those who go before us into the unknown. Our resolve to go forward must not be weakened by shortsighted naysayers. This has been a most sad day. Kreigh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 06:32:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Feb 2 06:32:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030201081848.00a03640@mail.aloha.net> <3E3C8E37.5060@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <005401c2cac7$e3f23840$55ab77d5@pandora.be> Aloha, Kitty, Kreigh, Don & all the others it is indeed a sad day when the brave explorers that are willing to lay down their lives for the benefit of all mankind actually loose their lives. We all too often take for granted that some people have the courage to ride a hardly contained explosion into space and then, quite lterally, plunge back like a flaming meteor. This makes me wonder: if Roberts, McWhorter, Fowler and Sauer were given the choice between serving years in prison and re-enacting Neil Armstrongs mission in an exact replica of apollo 11 using only technology of the late 60's ... would they have the courage? take care Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 4:24 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Shuttle | Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: | > | > Since many rockhounds are interested in astronomy and the space program, | > from Axel Emmermann who saved the moonrocks, to Bill Heacox who was a | > finalist to be a Mission Specialist, I feel a need to express our shock and | > sadness over the loss of the Space Shuttle Columbia. It is a terrible blow | > to the Space Program, to our nation, and to the world. | > | > Aloha, Kitty | > | | I spent the day with my siblings cleaning out my late Mom's house. We | left the TV on as we worked, and grieved together at the loss of more | brave explorers. | | Exploration has always come at a dear price in the history of mankind, | but the benefits to those who follow the pioneers have been great. | | I Pray that God will comfort the families, friends, and co-workers of | those who have been lost. | | We must not allow a temporary setback to stop us from realizing the | dreams of those who go before us into the unknown. Our resolve to go | forward must not be weakened by shortsighted naysayers. | | This has been a most sad day. | | Kreigh | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 07:50:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stan Perry) Date: Sun Feb 2 07:50:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Ebay Auctions and Rare Minerals Update Message-ID: <20030202154318.88806.qmail@web11105.mail.yahoo.com> Hi All, If you don't want to read about minerals for sale delete now. I have added about 30 TN specimens to the end of my Rare Minerals page on my website. Included are a number of old timers from Colorado. Here is the link to my Rare Minerals page; http://emineralshow.com/rare.htm I also have put a number of items up for sale on Ebay most with no reserve and a starting bid of $1.00. The auctions will start ending today and there are still some bargains out there. The following are included in my Ebay auctions. Adamite w Red Calcite - Mexico Campylite var Mimetite - England Sphalerite var Marmatite - England Pseudo Clinochlore after Garnet - Mich Hemimorphite - Mexico Galena Cubes on Dolomite - Tri-State Pyrite crystals - Hannibal Missouri Vanadinite Pyramidal Crystals - AZ Yellow Fluorite w/ Sphalerite - IL Pyrrhotite Rose – Serbia Covellite Blue on Gold Chalcopyrite CO Titanite Twin w/ Double Term Quartz – Russia Golden Barite - Gilman, Colorado 1.5 Inch 50+ct Topaz Crystal – Brazil You can get to the auctions by following this link to my "about me" page on Ebay. Scroll to the bottom to see the Auction listings. http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/rgangue/ I hope you see something you would like. ===== Stan Perry Our Gangue Minerals www.emineralshow.com Ebay seller ID rgangue e-mail at rgangue@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:14:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:14:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] opportunity: encore spindle stage class with Dr. F.D. Bloss Message-ID: <3E3D44D0.9FFE8DC5@att.net> Hi all, I was going to wait until things were more definite; but in light of my need to move on from yesterday, and to bring something new and positive to the forefront, I offer the following preliminary announcement. Old-timers will recognize the significance of this; newcomers will come to realize this is a little piece of history in which they can take part. "In reaching for the stars, we might just touch the sky." Don ----------------------- For students of optical mineralogy, I am pleased to announce a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to study spindle stage techniques with Dr. F. Donald Bloss, author of "An Introduction to the Methods of Optical Crystallography", "The Spindle Stage: Principles and Practice," and others. In addition to the legendary Dr. Bloss, two of his noted proteges, Dr. Mickey Gunter and Dr. Su Chun Su, along with Dr. Robert Weaver of the prestigious McCrone Research Institute, will co-teach the seminar. The class schedule is still being formed, but should be taught in Chicago, Illinois, from July 11-13, with a possible refresher session on Thursday the 10th. Not only will this be a fantastic class, you will also experience the finest selection of restaurants any city can offer and the warm summer nights of lakeside life. This is not a beginner's class. The student would be expected to have some facility with the polarizing microscope, fundamental crystallography, refractive index, the characterization of anisotropic and uniaxial minerals, and the recognition of biaxial minerals via interference figures; plus the establishment of Köhler illumination and full use of the accessories of a polarizing microscope. The curriculum will no doubt be fast-paced and challenging. I also believe the class size will be limited, since the classes will likely be taught at the McCrone facilities and their classrooms have a fixed size and number of microscopes. For complete information, including the final dates and session prices, please contact the McCrone Research Institute directly: ndaerr@mcri.org, or by phone, 312-842-7100. Their home page is http://www.mcri.org . This special class will be held in honor of the late Dr. Walter McCrone, and in consideration of the renewed interest in optical mineralogy. We are not likely to see Dr. Bloss come out of retirement again, and along with the new availability of reasonably priced polarizing microscopes, this is a golden opportunity to improve your knowledge and self-confidence under the guidance of the man who literally wrote the book. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:44:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Cathy Gaber) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:44:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] jack Message-ID: <200302011955.h11JtEd00351@mail.his.com> Jack Nelson, member of the Micromineralogists of the National Capital Area and the Gem, Lapidary and Mineral Society of Montgomery Co., MD, has a rapidly growing inoperable brain tumor. Radiation was making his symptoms worse, so that has been discontinued. He also had a slight stroke. He can still understand much of what he hears, but he is unable to respond verbally. He has been moved to hospice care and can be reached at Casey House, 6001 Muncaster Mill Rd., Rockville, MD 20855, (240) 631-6800. www.montgomeryhospice.com. Cathy Gaber From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:44:08 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:44:08 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> Friend: OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I simply did not understand what he was telling me. I'll appreciate any help. Thanks. Bob Cowie --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (earl verbeek) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle Message-ID: I cannot recall if details of our local shuttle experiment were shared last year with this list, but list members might be interested in knowing a little more about it. Briefly: a group of 6th-grade science students in a public school in Ogdensburg, New Jersey, proposed sending various fluorescent minerals into space aboard the shuttle to see if increased exposure to radiation would change their fluorescence in any way. Their proposal was accepted by NASA. Don Halterman and I, through the Sterling Hill Mining Museum in Ogdensburg, became science advisors to this experiment. The students met at the museum, and we took them into the mine to collect their own specimens for the launch. We also provided additional specimens from other localities. The specimens were photographed and sawn in two, one half to go aboard the shuttle and the other to remain on Earth (the control specimens are presently in the Ogdensburg school with the science teacher, Claude Larson). We spent hours recording the fluorescence emission spectrum of each sample, gathering redundant data, at least four spectra for each specimen. In the following months the students waited patiently through several mission delays, and then over the past two weeks followed the progress of this mission with increasing anticipation. The specimens were to have been returned to us this spring, when we would again measure their emission spectra and compare them to the originals. Why mention all this? Because the children, when interviewed, thought little about the loss of their experiment. Instead they were focused on the loss of life and the inevitable grief that the family survivors will face in the coming months and years. I was amazed, and heartened, that people so young can sense so deeply the pain being felt by people they do not know and have never met, and that the thoughts of these students ran to others and not to themselves. During the course of the experiment, as it progressed from a dream to a plan to a reality, the students learned lessons far more valuable than reams of scientific data could have taught them. They learned that school districts, through a caring teacher and a supportive administrative staff, can encourage youthful imaginations to grow. They learned that science often becomes a cooperative venture--in this case, between a national space agency, a museum dedicated to science education, and a school district in a small town. They learned, too, that THEY matter, for if mission specialists from the largest space agency in the world were willing to work with them, then surely there are no limits on what one can do in this world. In this way the experiment was a success before the shuttle ever left the ground. And I am willing to bet that, not many years from now, NASA will list among its ranks an astronaut from Ogdensburg, New Jersey. Earl Verbeek (curator) _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:49:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (earl verbeek) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:49:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: Sounds like eudialyte to me. Deep raspberry red, quite attractive. Not all that rare, though--several localities furnish eudialyte in large quantities. Cheers- Earl Verbeek _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 08:53:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Pete Richards) Date: Sun Feb 2 08:53:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite In-Reply-To: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> Message-ID: Presumably eudialyte, a pink to red mineral found in some silica-poor rocks such as those at Mont Saint-Hilaire, the Kipewa Complex in Canada, and classic localities in Greenland and Russia. Pete Richards >Friend: > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who >sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or >something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is >nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very >attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe >that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a >simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I >simply did not understand what he was telling me. > I'll appreciate any help. > Thanks. > >Bob Cowie > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 09:46:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Feb 2 09:46:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite/Eudialyte References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> Message-ID: <003801c2cae4$48b87e80$b201560c@oemcomputer> Bob, Just seconding what Earl and Pete R. said about the eudialyte being your mineral. Almost certainly, the polished material for sale (as slabs or a jewelry box) came from the Kola Peninsula, Russia. The material is scarce but not "precious"; good quality polished material is not cheap. Here is a website with some nice pictures of eudialyte eggs & spheres: http://www.mineralminers.com/html/eudsphs.stm Sincerely, Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 9:56 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Bob Cowie From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 09:49:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Feb 2 09:49:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: Message-ID: <003e01c2cae4$a388c900$b201560c@oemcomputer> Earl, Thanks for sharing that good description of the kids' fluorescent mineral project aboard the shuttle. A very worthwhile endeavor, in all aspects, and a valuable and lasting connection for all the participating kids in spite of the tragic end. Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: earl verbeek To: Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 9:46 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Shuttle From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 10:06:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 2 10:06:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle References: Message-ID: <3E3D5DCC.D30C3729@cox.net> Earl, Thank you for sharing this information. I believe your message deserves wider exposure. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 13:13:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (kevin k conroy) Date: Sun Feb 2 13:13:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Hannibal, Missouri pyrite Message-ID: <003a01c2cb00$8fccd700$9e6b550c@kcmins> Hi Stan! Just a quick note on the pyrite from Hannibal. I heard that a study was done on these, and it concluded that the pyrite nodules found there all formed around a fossil "seed". The fossils were mainly marine in origin, and included fish teeth, crinoid stem sections and "heads", brachiopod bits; basically anything that got fossilized. I also heard that the shale layer where these were found has been worked out, and none of these have been found in situ for quite a while now. Kevin www.kcminerals.com -----Original Message----- From: Stan Perry To: yahoo rockhounds ; Rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com ; egroups rocksandfossils Cc: rgangue@yahoo.com Date: Sunday, February 02, 2003 9:51 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Ebay Auctions and Rare Minerals Update >Hi All, > >If you don't want to read about minerals for sale >delete now. > >I have added about 30 TN specimens to the end of my >Rare Minerals page on my website. Included are a >number of old timers from Colorado. Here is the link >to my Rare Minerals page; >http://emineralshow.com/rare.htm > >I also have put a number of items up for sale on Ebay >most with no reserve and a starting bid of $1.00. The >auctions will start ending today and there are still >some bargains out there. The following are included >in my Ebay auctions. > >Adamite w Red Calcite - Mexico >Campylite var Mimetite - England >Sphalerite var Marmatite - England >Pseudo Clinochlore after Garnet - Mich >Hemimorphite - Mexico >Galena Cubes on Dolomite - Tri-State >Pyrite crystals - Hannibal Missouri >Vanadinite Pyramidal Crystals - AZ >Yellow Fluorite w/ Sphalerite - IL >Pyrrhotite Rose – Serbia >Covellite Blue on Gold Chalcopyrite CO >Titanite Twin w/ Double Term Quartz – Russia >Golden Barite - Gilman, Colorado >1.5 Inch 50+ct Topaz Crystal – Brazil > >You can get to the auctions by following this link to >my "about me" page on Ebay. Scroll to the bottom to >see the Auction listings. >http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/rgangue/ > >I hope you see something you would like. > > > >===== >Stan Perry >Our Gangue Minerals >www.emineralshow.com >Ebay seller ID rgangue >e-mail at rgangue@yahoo.com > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. >http://mailplus.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 14:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Feb 2 14:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Australia Message-ID: Dear friends from down-under, I would appreciate very much if you could help me in planning our holidays in Australia in september. Our itinerary will bring us from Sydney to Cairns (yes, we will avoid the many night clubs and fancy crowded beaches in that region). After that we will spend a week in the neighbourhood of Darwin, Northern Territory. Any suggestions are welcome : dealers, collectors that we might pay a visit, coordinates of local clubs, localities where we can collect, museums we should visit and all other suggestions that might help us to enrich the trip. Many thanks in advance for your courtesy. Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15 B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium Tel. + 32 3 7706007 E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show 10-11 May 2003 - Handelsbeurs - Meir - Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 15:37:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sun Feb 2 15:37:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] kids & the shuttle: epilogue Message-ID: <3E3DACB5.883FA37E@att.net> I am still so upset that I cannot express myself with grace, but I do have one bit of heartening follow-up. I notified the local NBC affiliate that the students of nearby East Norriton, PA, had an experiment on the shuttle. They called me back about six times for background on the story, but I wanted to stay out of it and focus on the kids. They just interviewed these kids on the 6 o'clock news, and it was a nice segment; and don't you know they said almost the same things as the kids in Ogdensburg did. They were concerned about the loss of life, and the future of the space program, and one child said "we can always do this again." Theirs was an active, as opposed to passive, experiment, and they had been in touch with the shuttle crew during the mission via e-mail. Some of them seemed on the verge of tears during the interview. It is touching to see not just our best and brightest astronauts, but also our best and brightest children, participate in science. I have more faith in the character of our youth today than I have had in a long time. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 15:52:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Feb 2 15:52:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> Message-ID: <3E3DAEEA.D3D@Tomaszewski.net> Racowie@cs.com wrote: > > Friend: > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I > simply did not understand what he was telling me. > I'll appreciate any help. > Thanks. There was (is?) a Udylite Corporation in Detroit that specialized in cadmium plating. You might check the minerals that contain cadmium for a match. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 17:45:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sun Feb 2 17:45:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] kids & the shuttle: epilogue In-Reply-To: <3E3DACB5.883FA37E@att.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030202154226.00a06830@mail.aloha.net> Don and Earl have told such magnificent stories you two should send your accounts to Newsweek "My Turn," or something similar. As Don says, the focus should be on the kids, but it takes an adult to write the story well and get it to the public. Earl's story was beautifully written---it made me cry!---and could be submitted as is, with just a revision of the opening paragraph. I'm serious about the need to get these stories out. The public needs to know that the shuttle missions are affecting and inspiring young people, not just gratifying some esoteric scientists or individual egos. The future of the space program may depend on such accounts for it to continue. I've noted that the "My Turn" essays are around 500 to 600 words, and Earl's was only about half that. Earl, Don, why don't you write an essay together? (Our Turn?) In any case, many thanks for your reports. Aloha, Kitty At 01:41 PM 2/2/2003, you wrote: >I am still so upset that I cannot express myself with grace, but I do >have one bit of heartening follow-up. > >I notified the local NBC affiliate that the students of nearby East >Norriton, PA, had an experiment on the shuttle. They called me back >about six times for background on the story, but I wanted to stay out of >it and focus on the kids. They just interviewed these kids on the 6 >o'clock news, and it was a nice segment; and don't you know they said >almost the same things as the kids in Ogdensburg did. They were >concerned about the loss of life, and the future of the space program, >and one child said "we can always do this again." Theirs was an active, >as opposed to passive, experiment, and they had been in touch with the >shuttle crew during the mission via e-mail. Some of them seemed on the >verge of tears during the interview. It is touching to see not just our >best and brightest astronauts, but also our best and brightest children, >participate in science. I have more faith in the character of our youth >today than I have had in a long time. > >Don >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > >--- >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 18:47:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 2 18:47:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: <12e.21f305ae.2b6f31fe@aol.com> I've seen the Canadian material for sale several times. I think the retail price for average quality (which wasn't bad at all) was in the $10-20 range per pound. What is rare are clean pieces large enough to facet. The Canadian material is often associated with a couple different fluorescent minerals. A nice bonus but not always present. Dan In a message dated 2/2/2003 11:53:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, rpr@nike.heidelberg.edu writes: > Presumably eudialyte, a pink to red mineral found in some silica-poor rocks > such as those at Mont Saint-Hilaire, the Kipewa Complex in Canada, and > classic localities in Greenland and Russia. > > Pete Richards > > > >Friend: > > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who > > >sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or > >something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is > >nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very > >attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to > believe > >that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like > a > >simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I > >simply did not understand what he was telling me. > > I'll appreciate any help. > > Thanks. > > > >Bob Cowie > > > > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > >multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > >--- > >_______________________________________________ > >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > >Subscription Services: > >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > R. Peter Richards > rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu > > Mineral collector > Crystallographer > SHAPE for the Macintosh > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 2 19:01:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Sun Feb 2 19:01:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Australia Message-ID: <200302030300.h1330iHw009058@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi Rik I'll post this on the eMinerals group as many members are from the region. Pity your itinerary doesn't take you south instead of north. You will miss out on the beautiful island of Tasmania! Regards Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 03:13:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (horstwindisch) Date: Mon Feb 3 03:13:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite/Eudialyte References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <003801c2cae4$48b87e80$b201560c@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <000601c2cb74$3cacd600$b54227c4@horstspc> Hi all, Eudyalite has also been found in the Pilanesberg Alkaline Complex. Dr. Jos Lurie of the Witwatersrand Technikon in Johannesburg (South Africa) gave a talk to the Pretoria Gem and Mineral Club on 26th July 1999 entitled "From Lavazero to Pilansberg" in which he drew arttention to the fact of the similarities of these two localities (Lavazero is in the Kola Peninsula). Many years ago Dr. Lurie led a Club outing to this site which I attended. This was many years before Sun City was built there, and now the area where the eudyalite is found, is a wild game park; last year there was again an outing to this site, but members were accompanied by a game ranger with rifle, because of the wild animals present in the area The eudyalite we found at the time was only found in small pink specs in the host rock. Horst.----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter J. Modreski" To: Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 7:55 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite/Eudialyte > Bob, > > Just seconding what Earl and Pete R. said about the eudialyte being your > mineral. Almost certainly, the polished material for sale (as slabs or a > jewelry box) came from the Kola Peninsula, Russia. The material is scarce > but not "precious"; good quality polished material is not cheap. > > Here is a website with some nice pictures of eudialyte eggs & spheres: > http://www.mineralminers.com/html/eudsphs.stm > > Sincerely, Pete Modreski > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 9:56 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite > Bob Cowie > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 06:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Feb 3 06:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <3E3DAEEA.D3D@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001d01c2cb93$10bdcb20$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> Udylite is mostly mentioned als a nickel-brightener, a chemical product. Last year I bought my wife a pendant with a polished stone at our anual MKA-fair. The stone came from Russia and was called rare. It was also called something else which I forgot 8>D Oh well, shoot happens when you passed 50... However: it was not eudyalite! The name is very similar to udylite but not quite identical. The color is indeed a dark purple but not as red a eudialite. It is more like a raspberry stained pontifical purple that cardinals often wear. If you ask me, there's much more blue than red in this purple... naturally, is it the same stone? For those interested: I scanned the stone, adjusted the colors and sampled them. If you have a graphic program that allows it, you can recreate this color by adjusting the color of an object to these RGB settings: R=188, B=87, C=142 I can also send you a scan of the stone off list if you give me your e-mail address. Cheers Axel | > | > Friend: | > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. | > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who | > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or | > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is | > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very | > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe | > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a | > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I | > simply did not understand what he was telling me. | > I'll appreciate any help. | > Thanks. | | There was (is?) a Udylite Corporation in Detroit that specialized in | cadmium plating. You might check the minerals that contain cadmium for a | match. | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 06:53:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 3 06:53:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: <200302031452.h13Eq6XJ022935@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Two Russian minerals that come to mind are villiaumite and charoite. Sound familiar? Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 07:49:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Feb 3 07:49:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <200302031452.h13Eq6XJ022935@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <001b01c2cb9b$c94050c0$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> hmmm, I can't say that they ring a bell... Maybe a more commercial naem rather than a mineral name... My wife still has the label that came with it, somewhere ;-)))))) Hard part is getting her to find it... 8>D Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 3:52 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite | | Two Russian minerals that come to mind are villiaumite and charoite. Sound | familiar? | | Don | | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 08:56:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (horstwindisch) Date: Mon Feb 3 08:56:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] jack References: <200302011955.h11JtEd00351@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <000c01c2cba4$43101e00$d13d27c4@horstspc> Hi Cathy, So sorry to hear about Jack Nelson's problems. Have contacted him via a short e-mail at the hospice. Kind regards, Horst and Erika ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cathy Gaber" Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 9:48 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] jack > Jack Nelson, member of the Micromineralogists of the National Capital > Area and the Gem, Lapidary and Mineral Society of Montgomery Co., MD, has > a rapidly growing inoperable brain tumor. Radiation was making his > symptoms worse, so that has been discontinued. He also had a slight > stroke. He can still understand much of what he hears, but he is unable > to respond verbally. He has been moved to hospice care and can be reached > at Casey House, 6001 Muncaster Mill Rd., Rockville, MD 20855, (240) > 631-6800. www.montgomeryhospice.com. > > Cathy Gaber > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 09:16:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Cathy Gaber) Date: Mon Feb 3 09:16:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] jack Message-ID: <200302031715.h13HFlw19643@mail.his.com> Dear Horst, Thanks. It means a lot to him and Leona to have so many friends at this point. It was really heartbreaking to see him Thursday at the hospital. He has been such a good friend to me. Hope you and Erika are doing well. Cathy From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 09:28:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Cathy Gaber) Date: Mon Feb 3 09:28:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] jack Message-ID: <200302031727.h13HRdw29973@mail.his.com> sorry I didn't mean that to be public! From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 10:53:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Feb 3 10:53:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: <001b01c2cbb5$81e85000$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> Hi people, Don wrote: | Two Russian minerals that come to mind are villiaumite and charoite. Sound | familiar? Well, my wife found the label of her pendant and it seems that AGAIN my = memory played a trick on me.=20 The stone in the pendant was NOT Russian but South African. It is = sugilite from the Wessels mine. KNa2(Fe2+, Mn2+, Al)2Li3Si12O30 Sorry if I caused a confusion ;-))))) Cheers Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: = axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: = http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: = http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: = http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 11:13:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 3 11:13:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite Message-ID: <200302031912.h13JC3B7009433@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Oh yeah! That is a beautiful stone in its purest form. Sugilite can range from black (I'm guessing very managanese-rich) to transparent purple, often called "royal jelly" or "purple jelly" sugilite in the trade, and the most rare and valuable form of it. Even low lapidary grade sugilite, opaque light purple with streaks of black in it, goes for 50 cents to $1/gram raw. Supposedly only a small amount of gem- and lapidary-grade was ever mined, and there is no more: but you know how stories go so don't take my word for it. I also have a small, ugly micro of sugilite from the Japan--I'm not sure if it is the type locality. From what I understand, the South African vein was the only one of trade quality, and is only one of a few total localities in the world. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 11:14:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (horstwindisch) Date: Mon Feb 3 11:14:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <3E3DAEEA.D3D@Tomaszewski.net> <001d01c2cb93$10bdcb20$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> Message-ID: <001401c2cbb7$70463c20$c93e27c4@horstspc> Hi Axel, Could the mineral have been "sugilite"? Sugilite is purple, good quality from the Kalahari Manganese Fields fetches high prices in the USA, that's why we can't buy it locally. Regards, Horst ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 4:46 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite > Udylite is mostly mentioned als a nickel-brightener, a chemical product. > Last year I bought my wife a pendant with a polished stone at our anual > MKA-fair. > The stone came from Russia and was called rare. It was also called something > else which I forgot 8>D > Oh well, shoot happens when you passed 50... > However: it was not eudyalite! The name is very similar to udylite but not > quite identical. The color is indeed a dark purple but not as red a > eudialite. It is more like a raspberry stained pontifical purple that > cardinals often wear. If you ask me, there's much more blue than red in this > purple... naturally, is it the same stone? > For those interested: I scanned the stone, adjusted the colors and sampled > them. If you have a graphic program that allows it, you can recreate this > color by adjusting the color of an object to these RGB settings: R=188, > B=87, C=142 > I can also send you a scan of the stone off list if you give me your e-mail > address. > > Cheers > > Axel > > | > > | > Friend: > | > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > | > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The > person who > | > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or > | > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian > is > | > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very > | > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to > believe > | > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds > like a > | > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I > | > simply did not understand what he was telling me. > | > I'll appreciate any help. > | > Thanks. > | > | There was (is?) a Udylite Corporation in Detroit that specialized in > | cadmium plating. You might check the minerals that contain cadmium for a > | match. > | _______________________________________________ > | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > | Subscription Services: > | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > | > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 11:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (William S. Cordua) Date: Mon Feb 3 11:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] New web site address In-Reply-To: <200302031912.h13JC3B7009433@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: Hi, My University's Infromation Technology Service, in its great wisdom, has upgrade its system. As a consequence, all campus personal web site addresses have changed. Thus, the new address for Dr. Bill's web site (including the minerals of Wisconsin link and newsletter articles) is http://www.uwrf.edu/~william.s.cordua/ . According to IT Services, both my old and new address will work for a while, but if you've linked to me, you will want to update that link. If you haven't linked to my site - well, what are you waiting for??? Best wishes - Dr. Bill. Dr. William S. Cordua Professor of Geology/Mineralogy University of Wisconsin - River Falls 410 South Third Street River Falls, WI 54022 715-425-3139 william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu "Speak to the Earth and it shall teach thee" - Job 12:8 From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 12:23:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Frederick Olmstead) Date: Mon Feb 3 12:23:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] jack References: <200302011955.h11JtEd00351@mail.his.com> <000c01c2cba4$43101e00$d13d27c4@horstspc> Message-ID: <3E3ED2A6.5C07@rcn.com> Jack Nelson, HONORED member of the Micromineralogists of the National Capital Area and the Gem, Lapidary and Mineral Society of Montgomery Co., MD, has a rapidly growing inoperable brain tumor. Radiation was making his symptoms worse, so that has been discontinued. He also had a slight stroke. He can still understand much of what he hears, but he is unable to respond verbally. He has been moved to hospice care and can be reached at Casey House, 6001 Muncaster Mill Rd., Rockville, MD 20855, (240) 631-6800. www.montgomeryhospice.com. > > > > Cathy Gaber > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 3 12:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Feb 3 12:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <3E3DAEEA.D3D@Tomaszewski.net> <001d01c2cb93$10bdcb20$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> <001401c2cbb7$70463c20$c93e27c4@horstspc> Message-ID: <005001c2cbc2$1dd22340$3c9e77d5@pandora.be> Yes... my wife found the label... It's sugulite. Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "horstwindisch" To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 7:44 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite | Hi Axel, | | Could the mineral have been "sugilite"? Sugilite is purple, good quality | from the Kalahari Manganese Fields fetches high prices in the USA, that's | why we can't buy it locally. | | Regards, | Horst | ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Axel Emmermann" | To: | Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 4:46 PM | Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite | | | > Udylite is mostly mentioned als a nickel-brightener, a chemical product. | > Last year I bought my wife a pendant with a polished stone at our anual | > MKA-fair. | > The stone came from Russia and was called rare. It was also called | something | > else which I forgot 8>D | > Oh well, shoot happens when you passed 50... | > However: it was not eudyalite! The name is very similar to udylite but not | > quite identical. The color is indeed a dark purple but not as red a | > eudialite. It is more like a raspberry stained pontifical purple that | > cardinals often wear. If you ask me, there's much more blue than red in | this | > purple... naturally, is it the same stone? | > For those interested: I scanned the stone, adjusted the colors and sampled | > them. If you have a graphic program that allows it, you can recreate this | > color by adjusting the color of an object to these RGB settings: R=188, | > B=87, C=142 | > I can also send you a scan of the stone off list if you give me your | e-mail | > address. | > | > Cheers | > | > Axel | > | > | > | > | > Friend: | > | > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. | > | > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The | > person who | > | > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite | or | > | > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian | > is | > | > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very | > | > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to | > believe | > | > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds | > like a | > | > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and | I | > | > simply did not understand what he was telling me. | > | > I'll appreciate any help. | > | > Thanks. | > | | > | There was (is?) a Udylite Corporation in Detroit that specialized in | > | cadmium plating. You might check the minerals that contain cadmium for a | > | match. | > | _______________________________________________ | > | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | > | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | > | Subscription Services: | > | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | > | | > | > | > _______________________________________________ | > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | > Subscription Services: | > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | > | | | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 05:00:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Tue Feb 4 05:00:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shuttle Student Experiments Message-ID: <47.29e76ae7.2b711328@cs.com> Hi Everyone, Here is some more information about students who were involved with experiments aboard the Shuttle Columbia. This came from the other list to which I belong and is written by a museum curator. I thought it was touching and wanted to share it with the list. Mark "I cannot recall if details of our local shuttle experiment were shared last year with this list, but list members might be interested in knowing a little more about it. Briefly: a group of 6th-grade science students in a public school in Ogdensburg, New Jersey, proposed sending various fluorescent minerals into space aboard the shuttle to see if increased exposure to radiation would change their fluorescence in any way. Their proposal was accepted by NASA. Don Halterman and I, through the Sterling Hill Mining Museum in Ogdensburg, became science advisors to this experiment. The students met at the museum, and we took them into the mine to collect their own specimens for the launch. We also provided additional specimens from other localities. The specimens were photographed and sawn in two, one half to go aboard the shuttle and the other to remain on Earth (the control specimens are presently in the Ogdensburg school with the science teacher, Claude Larson). We spent hours recording the fluorescence emission spectrum of each sample, gathering redundant data, at least four spectra for each specimen. In the following months the students waited patiently through several mission delays, and then over the past two weeks followed the progress of this mission with increasing anticipation. The specimens were to have been returned to us this spring, when we would again measure their emission spectra and compare them to the originals. Why mention all this? Because the children, when interviewed, thought little about the loss of their experiment. Instead they were focused on the loss of life and the inevitable grief that the family survivors will face in the coming months and years. I was amazed, and heartened, that people so young can sense so deeply the pain being felt by people they do not know and have never met, and that the thoughts of these students ran to others and not to themselves. During the course of the experiment, as it progressed from a dream to a plan to a reality, the students learned lessons far more valuable than reams of scientific data could have taught them. They learned that school districts, through a caring teacher and a supportive administrative staff, can encourage youthful imaginations to grow. They learned that science often becomes a cooperative venture--in this case, between a national space agency, a museum dedicated to science education, and a school district in a small town. They learned, too, that THEY matter, for if mission specialists from the largest space agency in the world were willing to work with them, then surely there are no limits on what one can do in this world. In this way the experiment was a success before the shuttle ever left the ground. And I am willing to bet that, not many years from now, NASA will list among its ranks an astronaut from Ogdensburg, New Jersey." Earl Verbeek (curator) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 15:09:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (mysfit) Date: Tue Feb 4 15:09:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about Lortone 14inch slab saw In-Reply-To: <47.29e76ae7.2b711328@cs.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030204155058.00b3d3d8@pop.mindspring.com> Hello.....I have some stupid questions for this exceptionally knowedgeable and experienced group. I spoiled myself and purchased a Lortone Panther...it cuts well, nice straight cuts no hanging up ...but I had to install the motor and the belt and guard and I am wondering..is that supposed to get hot??? After 6 cuts of jasper/agate it was hot to touch...... Also (so I REALLY went overboard here) on the 8inch crystalite flat lap...4 pads Miracle-Lap pad (multi layered diamond polishing pad) Crystalpad (40-035) Polypad Foam Pad (40-193) Which one goes on the 'dot' disc? There are 3 plates and 1 'dot' disc..also what are the relative grits? Which is coarsest and which the final polish? I put them in the order I think goes coarsest to fine Thanks in advance! Korey From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 17:06:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Tue Feb 4 17:06:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about Lortone 14inch slab saw Message-ID: <10.2c3d402e.2b71bd63@aol.com> In a message dated 2/4/03 4:53:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, mysfit@mindspring.com writes: > ...but I had to install the motor and the belt > and guard and I am wondering..is that supposed to get hot??? After 6 cuts > of jasper/agate it was hot to touch...... > Was the heat from the motor or the belt? Electric motors can get hot but if there is heat in the belt it might be to tight. Oil ever bearing you can find. If the heat concerns you look around for an electric motor repairman and call him. I've burned my hand on a Skill saw -- but that was in Las Vegas. You can burn you hand on a Coke can there. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 17:35:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (mysfit) Date: Tue Feb 4 17:35:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about Lortone 14inch slab saw In-Reply-To: <10.2c3d402e.2b71bd63@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030204183353.00b81008@pop.mindspring.com> Most of the heat was by the motor shaft...what about little black shavings from the belt? Too tight? thanks! At 08:05 PM 2/4/2003 -0500, you wrote: >In a message dated 2/4/03 4:53:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, >mysfit@mindspring.com writes: > > > ...but I had to install the motor and the belt > > and guard and I am wondering..is that supposed to get hot??? After 6 cuts > > of jasper/agate it was hot to touch...... > > >Was the heat from the motor or the belt? Electric motors can get hot but if >there is heat in the belt it might be to tight. Oil ever bearing you can >find. If the heat concerns you look around for an electric motor repairman >and call him. I've burned my hand on a Skill saw -- but that was in Las >Vegas. You can burn you hand on a Coke can there. > >Grant > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 18:31:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Feb 4 18:31:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about Lortone 14inch slab saw References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030204183353.00b81008@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <3E40773F.B07@Tomaszewski.net> Perhaps way too tight, but too loose can also cause friction problems from spinning (usually the drive 'V' wheel) without 'biting' the belt so it moves at full speed. If you squeeze the (not moving) belt sides together in the middle of their span, you should have an inch or so movement before it gets hard to do; you should not be able to squeeze them until they touch. You may get other opinions, but I find it a good rule of thumb for most lapidary equipment. Kreigh mysfit wrote: > > Most of the heat was by the motor shaft...what about little black shavings > from the belt? Too tight? > > thanks! > > At 08:05 PM 2/4/2003 -0500, you wrote: > >In a message dated 2/4/03 4:53:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, > >mysfit@mindspring.com writes: > > > > > ...but I had to install the motor and the belt > > > and guard and I am wondering..is that supposed to get hot??? After 6 cuts > > > of jasper/agate it was hot to touch...... > > > > >Was the heat from the motor or the belt? Electric motors can get hot but if > >there is heat in the belt it might be to tight. Oil ever bearing you can > >find. If the heat concerns you look around for an electric motor repairman > >and call him. I've burned my hand on a Skill saw -- but that was in Las > >Vegas. You can burn you hand on a Coke can there. > > > >Grant > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 4 18:38:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Tue Feb 4 18:38:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about Lortone 14inch slab saw References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030204183353.00b81008@pop.mindspring.com> <3E40773F.B07@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <3E4079F2.FFD1823B@att.net> Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > If you squeeze the (not moving) belt sides together in the middle of > their span, you should have an inch or so movement before it gets hard > to do; you should not be able to squeeze them until they touch. I agree with that; this is the rule I was taught to follow. Adjusting belt tension takes a little practice. I also think that lubricant on the belt interior and on the drive wheel can cause slippage. It is also possible that your feed is too fast, putting too much strain on the motor. Mine gets hot, but not quite too hot to touch. Also make sure you have a good quality blade and there is enough lubricant in the well. Congrats on getting the 14". I have a 10" and regret it; that sounds like a lot, but there is only about 4.5" of cutting arc. Give me an 18"!!! Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 7 22:36:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 7 22:36:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad new Petrified Wood Book Message-ID: <1d3.1fb05c4.2b75ff2a@aol.com> Greetings list members: Being in the publishing business, I picked up some extra copies of the new book called "Secrets of Petrified Plants" by Ulrich Dernbach, Ruth Stockey, William Tidwell, Walt Wright, and others. It is a large format, hard cover book of 231 pages in full color with many photographs of fossil wood from worldwide locations. Chapters include discussions of ferns, Psaronius, Osmunda, Chinle woods, Tempskya, cones, conifers, cycads, Hermanophyton, and many other woods. I recommend this book to all petrified wood enthusiasts. The list price is $79.00 but I am selling it for $75.00 plus $4.00 for mail by Media Mail rate. I can accept PayPal, Visa/MasterCard, or a check. I also have a list of petrified wood specimens to sell for those interested. Contact me off list. Very truly, Frank Frank J. Daniels, publisher Western Colorado Publishing Company 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81503-9522 (970) 242-5255 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 09:16:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Feb 8 09:16:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] OT To lie, to truth Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030207180817.02936130@mail.aloha.net> Things have been pretty quiet, so I thought I'd toss out an OT observation. Since the Tucson show is still on and it involves selling and a certain amount of trust that specimens are as represented, perhaps this isn't entirely Off Topic. It's said that there are numerous words for snow among Eskimos, and I'm sure there are other places where the number of certain words reflect something about that society. So I started thinking about verbs for truth and it's opposite. I checked a thesaurus and found over 60 verbs related to dishonesty (to lie, dissemble, prevaricate, misinform, etc.). And when I looked under "truth" and "honesty" there were no verbs! We have to say "tell the truth," or "be honest." The entries related to dishonesty were almost overwhelming---tons of cross references, etc., but there were only 5 entries under "truth." What does that say about our English-speaking culture? I know a little Spanish, French and Japanese, but not enough to know if the same is true in those countries. But then again, maybe it is just that truth and honesty are fairly pure concepts, thus any deviation from them demands special words ranging from "fib" to "bamboozle," and from "equivocate" to "feign." Maybe it's just human nature, not a characteristic of a particular society. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 09:28:06 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (mysfit) Date: Sat Feb 8 09:28:06 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] OT To lie, to truth In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030207180817.02936130@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030208102140.00ba3ea0@pop.mindspring.com> Truth and honesty being pure concepts...not based on our politicians. Or many businesses. Having dealt with the Japanese on a business level, their idea of 'truth' and 'honesty' is somewhat different than ours and leads to misunderstandings.... The idealization of 'truth' and 'honesty' may seem pure...but the application is anything but. Integrity...now there's a word without much confusion, even if it is sometimes seen as a 'handicap' in the business world and politics, what a sad comment on our society (world wide). I would say integrity is more pure than truth or honesty. Then again none of them are quantitative terms....hard to 'rate' qualitative terms Korey At 07:28 AM 2/8/2003 -1000, Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: >Things have been pretty quiet, so I thought I'd toss out an OT >observation. Since the Tucson show is still on and it involves selling >and a certain amount of trust that specimens are as represented, perhaps >this isn't entirely Off Topic. > >It's said that there are numerous words for snow among Eskimos, and I'm >sure there are other places where the number of certain words reflect >something about that society. So I started thinking about verbs for truth >and it's opposite. I checked a thesaurus and found over 60 verbs related >to dishonesty (to lie, dissemble, prevaricate, misinform, etc.). And when >I looked under "truth" and "honesty" there were no verbs! We have to say >"tell the truth," or "be honest." The entries related to dishonesty were >almost overwhelming---tons of cross references, etc., but there were only >5 entries under "truth." What does that say about our English-speaking >culture? I know a little Spanish, French and Japanese, but not enough to >know if the same is true in those countries. But then again, maybe it is >just that truth and honesty are fairly pure concepts, thus any deviation >from them demands special words ranging from "fib" to "bamboozle," and >from "equivocate" to "feign." Maybe it's just human nature, not a >characteristic of a particular society. > >Aloha, Kitty > > > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/mixed > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > text/plain (text body -- kept) >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 16:33:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 8 16:33:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad new Petrified Wood Book Message-ID: <19d.10a85afc.2b76fb86@aol.com> HI Frank Are you still the DA in Denver? Sorry I missed you during your last trip to Oregon. Hope all is well with you and the family.....I guess all sales are connected to E-BAY today. I saw some yellow cat today and I thought you were selling some of that "barrel" you bought on E-BAY today....? I'm interested in the book... and would rather buy it from you then at a show. I'm going to Nevada on a plea Monday in Federal court. I worked my last case in Nevada for the past two years and found a lot of wood...... I having a great time, spending more time on wood than working criminal cases !!! I retire in 200 days ..Thank God.!.. When can you come out for a few weeks? We still have an extra bedroom and my offer still stands....My wife and I would love to have a visit from you and the family. But your girls must be about collage age or bound...by now....E-MAIL when you have time.. Don... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 20:53:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Feb 8 20:53:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] OT To lie, to truth References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030207180817.02936130@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <3E45DE81.7FED@Tomaszewski.net> Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: Snow is a mineral, so I guess this is really on topic... > It's said that there are numerous words for snow among Eskimos, and This is actually an Urban Legend and the Eskimo languages have no more words for snow than English does. See http://www.urbanlegends.com/language/eskimo_words_for_snow_more.html for the real story and how the legend grew. I think it is a good example supporting your main idea. > I checked a thesaurus and found over 60 verbs related to dishonesty > (to lie, dissemble, prevaricate, misinform, etc.). And when I looked > under "truth" and "honesty" there were no verbs! Thanks for something interesting to think about. Kreigh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 20:58:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 8 20:58:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad new Petrified Wood Book Message-ID: <14e.1b6825e0.2b7739cc@aol.com> In a message dated 2/8/2003 5:34:16 PM Mountain Standard Time, SCHATTAUER@aol.com writes: > HI Frank *****Howdy Don. Do you still have that storage unit full of wood? > > Are you still the DA in Denver? *****I am still the DA, but not in Denver - in Western Colorado. Sorry I missed you during your last trip to > > Oregon. Hope all is well with you and the family.....I guess all sales are > connected to E-BAY today. *****What do you mean? I saw some yellow cat today and I thought you were > > selling some of that "barrel" you bought on E-BAY today....? *****I have never sold anything on eBay. > > > I'm interested in the book... and would rather buy it from you then at a > show. ****So, do you want one? I'm going to Nevada on a plea Monday in Federal court. I worked my last > > case in Nevada for the past two years and found a lot of wood...... I > having > a great time, spending more time on wood than working criminal cases !!! I > retire in 200 days ..Thank God.!.. ****I will semi-retire in 23 months. > > When can you come out for a few weeks? *****Not sure - I am really busy. We still have an extra bedroom and my > > offer still stands....My wife and I would love to have a visit from you and > > the family. But your girls must be about collage age or bound *****One starts college in the fall and another two years later; that's why I can only semi-retire. > *****Let me know if you want one of these books. Frank Frank J. Daniels, publisher Western Colorado Publishing Company 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81503-9522 (970) 242-5255 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 8 21:00:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 8 21:00:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad new Petrified Wood Book Message-ID: <31.33afb85f.2b773a3e@aol.com> Sorry about that. I thought it was off list until a millisecond after I sent it. Frank --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 9 06:38:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Selby Bob) Date: Sun Feb 9 06:38:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary shop for sale Message-ID: <20030209143721.28815.qmail@web9505.mail.yahoo.com> Hi, Just wanted to let you know that we are selling two saws, a Genie, and hundreds of pounds of rocks. There is also a new 24" MK blade for sale. Check out our club members deals at: http://www.olympicrocks.com/Classified.htm Thanks for your consideration! Bob ===== ----------- Webmaster for http://www.OlympicArtists.com/ Quality and Affortable Art by Sequim, PA, Port Townsend, and Forks artists __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 10 08:36:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Mike Keim) Date: Mon Feb 10 08:36:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Tucson Show Message-ID: Hi List, just back from the Tucson show with lots of new minerals to offer. I have uploaded some of the minerals at www.marinmineral.com/tucson.html. I will be posting more minerals as I have time over the next week or two. Thanks, Mike Keim www.marinmineral.com The information contained in this e-mail is intended only for the individual or entity to whom it is addressed. Its contents (including any attachments) are confidential and may contain privileged information. If you are not an intended recipient you must not use, disclose, disseminate, copy or print its contents. If you receive this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by reply e-mail and delete and destroy the message. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 10 09:52:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Juergen Wachsmuth) Date: Mon Feb 10 09:52:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> Message-ID: <3E469001.49F9FC18@gmx.de> Guess you are speaking of eudylite from Kola peninsula. Jürgen Wachsmuth Ulm - Germany Racowie@cs.com schrieb: > Friend: > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I > simply did not understand what he was telling me. > I'll appreciate any help. > Thanks. > > Bob Cowie > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 10 10:50:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (horstwindisch) Date: Mon Feb 10 10:50:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Udylite References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <3E469001.49F9FC18@gmx.de> Message-ID: <001f01c2d134$1b9d6680$d33f27c4@horstspc> Hi Juergen, This "mystery" has been solved quite some time ago. The person was speaking of sugilite, from the Kalahari Manganese Fields, South Africa. Regards, Horst ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juergen Wachsmuth" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 7:29 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Udylite > Guess you are speaking of eudylite from Kola peninsula. > > Jürgen Wachsmuth > Ulm - Germany > > > Racowie@cs.com schrieb: > > > Friend: > > OK, this is off the wall. Sorry, but maybe you can help. > > I bought a small jewel box at the rock show in Tucson. The person who > > sold it to me told me the mineral from which it was made was udylite or > > something close to that. His English was not too good, and my Russian is > > nonexistent. The mineral is a dark reddish purple in color, and very > > attractive. Does this make any sense to you? The seller led me to believe > > that this particular mineral was hard to get now. I know, it sounds like a > > simpleton's reaction to a sales pitch, but I think he was sincere and I > > simply did not understand what he was telling me. > > I'll appreciate any help. > > Thanks. > > > > Bob Cowie > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 10 15:27:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 10 15:27:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Meet me in Orlando? References: <173.15a3a1fc.2b6dff10@cs.com> <3E469001.49F9FC18@gmx.de> Message-ID: <3E485F79.4D1A2ECE@emory.edu> Dear Gang: I'll be in Orlando, Florida this Friday and Saturday. Anybody around the area I could meet and perhaps enjoy a quickie? (field trip that is). Thanks, Anita Westlake From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 07:35:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Gary Brown) Date: Wed Feb 12 07:35:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer Message-ID: BlankWhat? Read a book? I have made my find of the year... an author for us rock geeks: Sarah Andrews. She writes mysteries that involve geology, and she writes them from the prospective of a practicing geologist, not some poseur that's read some books, but the real McCoy! Reading her stories is liking sitting around a table at a bar in Chugwater with a bunch of my old Mobil Oil buddies shooting the breeze. Try just ONE of her books, and you'll be hooked. In order of release: Tensleep A Fall In Denver Mother Nature Only Flesh and Bones Bone Hunter An Eye for Gold Fault Line Check out her website at: http://www.sonoma.edu/Geology/andrews.htm Regards, GcB Catspaw Minerals Producers of MasMils/PLUS mine locations disk http://www.catspaw-minerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 07:54:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Ronnie Van Dommelen) Date: Wed Feb 12 07:54:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Copper and spinel twinning Message-ID: <3E4A6E7D.2020406@dal.ca> Hi All, Last year I collected some really cool crystallized copper here in Nova Scotia. I have been trying to figure out some of the crystallography, but am more confused than ever. The Min Rec on Michigan copper shows several branching types for copper and mentions spinel twinning. I have also seen many small pics of spinel twinned copper crystals on the net. However I am having trouble distinguishing between twinning and just weird crystal forms on my examples (most tend to be flatish sharp but distorted crystals). I suspect that I have examples of both, some are more obvious than others. Perhaps a good drawing of spinel twinning in real-world copper would help me (I have seen the traditional drawing of the simple twinned octahedron, but that doesn't help me much). As an example I have scanned one of my specimens, front and back. It is about 5-6cm long and consists of a spine-like growth of copper which is cavernous on one side. Am I correct in assuming this is a spinel twin? If so, this is my clearest example of the twin, but most other specimens are harder for me to figure out. For instance, does spinel twinning always result in a cavernous crystal? Maybe I should scan some other specimens too... Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. http://is2.dal.ca/~dommelen/minpics/coppertwin.jpg Later, Ronnie Van Dommelen Nova Scotia, Canada From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 08:09:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (frank de wit) Date: Wed Feb 12 08:09:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Copper and spinel twinning References: <3E4A6E7D.2020406@dal.ca> Message-ID: <00af01c2d2b1$0bace600$745a79d9@cm333814A> Ronnie, I can't help u with yr question, but you've got a damn Dutch name for s-one from Novia Scotia ! Cheers! Frank (yep, Dutch (also)) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ronnie Van Dommelen" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 4:55 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Copper and spinel twinning > Hi All, > > Last year I collected some really cool crystallized copper here in Nova > Scotia. I have been trying to figure out some of the crystallography, > but am more confused than ever. The Min Rec on Michigan copper shows > several branching types for copper and mentions spinel twinning. I have > also seen many small pics of spinel twinned copper crystals on the net. > However I am having trouble distinguishing between twinning and just > weird crystal forms on my examples (most tend to be flatish sharp but > distorted crystals). I suspect that I have examples of both, some are > more obvious than others. Perhaps a good drawing of spinel twinning in > real-world copper would help me (I have seen the traditional drawing of > the simple twinned octahedron, but that doesn't help me much). > > As an example I have scanned one of my specimens, front and back. It is > about 5-6cm long and consists of a spine-like growth of copper which is > cavernous on one side. Am I correct in assuming this is a spinel twin? > If so, this is my clearest example of the twin, but most other specimens > are harder for me to figure out. For instance, does spinel twinning > always result in a cavernous crystal? Maybe I should scan some other > specimens too... > > Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. > > http://is2.dal.ca/~dommelen/minpics/coppertwin.jpg > > Later, > Ronnie Van Dommelen > Nova Scotia, Canada > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 08:48:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 12 08:48:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] wire sizing Message-ID: <1e7.1cfff11.2b7bd4a6@aol.com> Hey gang, I have a friend in Wales that is having a little problem...she is wanting to know if there is a place that she can get a conversion chart that lists guage to metric sizing for wire....She is wanting to learn wire wrapping and is on her second batch of tumbled stones. She is also having trouble finding sourses in England and Wales...Any ideas? For now and till then, JOHN --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 09:24:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Pete Richards) Date: Wed Feb 12 09:24:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Copper and spinel twinning In-Reply-To: <3E4A6E7D.2020406@dal.ca> Message-ID: It does not appear to be a twin to me - rather a series of parallel growths - like a stack of mostly intersecting cubes all pointed the same way. It's headed toward being a dendritic growth, and these can occur whether or not the copper is twinned. Spinel twinning may or may not have notches around the middle, at the twin plane, but I see no reason why it would lead to either hollow or elongated crystals. Pete Richards >Hi All, > >Last year I collected some really cool crystallized copper here in Nova >Scotia. I have been trying to figure out some of the crystallography, >but am more confused than ever. The Min Rec on Michigan copper shows >several branching types for copper and mentions spinel twinning. I have >also seen many small pics of spinel twinned copper crystals on the net. >However I am having trouble distinguishing between twinning and just >weird crystal forms on my examples (most tend to be flatish sharp but >distorted crystals). I suspect that I have examples of both, some are >more obvious than others. Perhaps a good drawing of spinel twinning in >real-world copper would help me (I have seen the traditional drawing of >the simple twinned octahedron, but that doesn't help me much). > >As an example I have scanned one of my specimens, front and back. It is >about 5-6cm long and consists of a spine-like growth of copper which is >cavernous on one side. Am I correct in assuming this is a spinel twin? >If so, this is my clearest example of the twin, but most other specimens >are harder for me to figure out. For instance, does spinel twinning >always result in a cavernous crystal? Maybe I should scan some other >specimens too... > >Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. > >http://is2.dal.ca/~dommelen/minpics/coppertwin.jpg > >Later, >Ronnie Van Dommelen >Nova Scotia, Canada > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 14:10:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John McLaughlin) Date: Wed Feb 12 14:10:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer References: Message-ID: <3E4AC78E.ED282AE3@amug.org> Thanks for the tip Gary. An excellent topic for the list. I'll get her first book immediately. For those who like nonfiction, but still highly entertaining geology books, there is no better writer than John McPhee. I have lifted the Amazon.com description of his geology oriented books in the following paragraphs. Basin and Range garnered 4.5 stars out of a possible 5 stars. McPhee was a long standing writer for the New Yorker. His four geological books (including Basin and Range) were published as Annals of the Former World in 1998. Annals of the Former World was awarded the Pulitzer Prize in 1999. Not too many Pulitzer Prizes go to books on geology! >From Amazon.com "One of the most valuable tools for the advancement of geological science has in fact been the humble road cut. United States Interstate 80 crosses the entire North American continent, in the process exposing hundreds of millions of years of geological history. In Basin and Range, McPhee, accompanied at times by Princeton geologist Kenneth S. Dreyfuss, demonstrates how the contorted and tilted rocks seen in these road cuts reveal how islands of the earth's crust have floated across the earth's surface, crashing and folding to form basin and range. This is a masterful and sometimes even poetic volume of popular writing about plate tectonics, communicating the profound satisfaction of using scientific research as a tool for understanding the world around us. This is the first of four books on North American geology by McPhee, collectively entitled Annals of the Former World. The other volumes are In Suspect Terrain, Rising from the Plains, and Assembling California." Try John McPhee right after you solve a couple of Sarah Andrews mysteries. John McLaughlin Glendale, Arizona jemstone@amug.org Gary Brown wrote: > BlankWhat? Read a book? I have made my find of the year... an author for > us rock geeks: Sarah Andrews. She writes mysteries that involve geology, > and she writes them from the prospective of a practicing geologist, not some > poseur that's read some books, but the real McCoy! Reading her stories is > liking sitting around a table at a bar in Chugwater with a bunch of my old > Mobil Oil buddies shooting the breeze. Try just ONE of her books, and > you'll be hooked. > > In order of release: > > Tensleep > A Fall In Denver > Mother Nature > Only Flesh and Bones > Bone Hunter > An Eye for Gold > Fault Line > > Check out her website at: > > http://www.sonoma.edu/Geology/andrews.htm > > Regards, > GcB > > Catspaw Minerals > Producers of MasMils/PLUS mine locations disk > http://www.catspaw-minerals.com > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/related > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > image/gif > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 15:58:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Feb 12 15:58:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer In-Reply-To: <3E4AC78E.ED282AE3@amug.org> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030212123555.024d6640@mail.aloha.net> At 12:15 PM 2/12/2003, you wrote: > >For those who like nonfiction, but still highly entertaining geology books, > >there is no better writer than John McPhee. Bill and I absolutely agree! All of John McPhee's books are excellent!!! I first came across this superb essayist when I used A Sense of Where You Are (about Bill Bradley in his basketball days) to get students interested in reading and writing back in the 1960's. In addition to the four books that comprise Annals of the Former World that John mentioned, here are review clips (from amazon.com) of two others that deal---at least in part---with geology: Irons in the Fire: Master essayist John McPhee heard about vehicles in Nevada that resemble police cars, but the cop inside was actually a "brand inspector," a lawman charged with tracking cattle rustlers. Ever curious, McPhee left his home in New Jersey for Nevada and spent a few weeks in those cars. The title essay of this collection is, as we've come to expect from McPhee, well-reported and beautifully written. Also included are essays based on McPhee's observations of a stand of virgin forest in the middle of New Jersey, a huge pile of automobile tires in California, and a long and fascinating look at forensic geologists and how stones tell a story. The Control of Nature: Master how-it-works writer John McPhee has instructed his readers in the arcana of how oranges are commercially graded, how mountains form, how canoes are built and oceans crossed. In The Control of Nature he turns his attention once more to geology and the human struggle against nature. In one sketch, he explores the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers' unrealized plan to divert the flow of the Mississippi River into a tributary, the Atchafalaya, for flood control; in another, he looks at the ingenious ways in which an Icelandic engineer saved a southern harbor on that island from being destroyed by a lava flow; in a third, he examines a complex scheme to protect Los Angeles from boulders ejected from mountains by compression and tectonic movement. As always, McPhee combines a deep knowledge of his subject with a narrative approach that is wholly accessible; you may not have thought you were interested in earthquakes and flood control, but he gently leads you to take a passionate concern in such matters. Here are some other goodies that show the enormous variety of McPhee's interest and expertise: The Ransom of Russian Art, about how Norton Townshend Dodge rescued art works. The Deltoid Pumpkin Seed, on the attempts to build the Aereon, a wingless hybrid airplane/dirigible. A Roomful of Hovings and Other Portraits, a collection of biographies of fascinating and unusual people. Pieces of the Frame, a collection of essays that include "The Search for Marvin Gardens" (yes, Monopoly), and "Birnam Wood to Dunsinane" (yes, Macbeth). Coming Into the Country, about Alaska. (OT: For those interested in Alaska and environmental issues, check out books by my brother-in-law, Kim Heacox. He's also an excellent essayist and biographer, as well as a fine photographer; some of his "coffeetable books" contain his photos and another author's text, some have his essays and other photographer's picturers, and in some cases he did both the writing and camera work.) Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 12 16:15:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Feb 12 16:15:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030212141259.0259ba10@mail.aloha.net> At 05:34 AM 2/12/2003, you wrote: >...Sarah Andrews. She writes mysteries that involve geology, >and she writes them from the prospective of a practicing geologist, not some >poseur that's read some books, but the real McCoy! Thanks for the tip. I'll check her out. Here's another one: Arthur W. Upfield writes mysteries set in Australia, with Inspector Napoleon Bonaparte as the half-aboriginal and half-white sleuth. We just finished reading The Bachelors of Broken Hill. The setting of that marvelous mining town may be interesting to rockhounds. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 13 07:08:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Lawrence Rush) Date: Thu Feb 13 07:08:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer References: Message-ID: <000501c2d371$bf956780$ccaf5a0c@fekib> ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Brown To: Rocksandfossils@Yahoogroups. Com ; Rockhounds Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 10:34 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer > BlankWhat? Read a book? I have made my find of the year... an author for > us rock geeks: Sarah Andrews. She writes mysteries that involve geology, > and she writes them from the prospective of a practicing geologist, not some > poseur that's read some books, but the real McCoy! Reading her stories is > liking sitting around a table at a bar in Chugwater with a bunch of my old > Mobil Oil buddies shooting the breeze. Try just ONE of her books, and > you'll be hooked. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Thanks, Gary! I would also recommend the writings of John Mc Phee, best known for his book "Annals of the Former World", winner of a Pulitzer prize. McPhee teams up with a professional geologist to examine and explain geologic processes based on geographic manifestations on a road trip across the US, kind of like the "Armchair Geology" series, but more in depth and easily understood by the layman. He has also written other geology related books, Assembling California, Rising From the Plains, In Suspect Terrain, and Basin and Range, among many other nature and historical ones. He has an entertaining style while being very educational at the same time. Larry Rush From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 13 07:32:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Gary Brown) Date: Thu Feb 13 07:32:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer In-Reply-To: <000501c2d371$bf956780$ccaf5a0c@fekib> Message-ID: Well.... hasn't this started a fun note string! I'll collect all the suggestions, and I'll be adding a link up on my site called "Good Reads" or something like that. If you know of links to the author's sites I'll also include that. Back to my REAL work now! GcB From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 13 08:52:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Thu Feb 13 08:52:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer Message-ID: <2595FCAD.1499E0CA.02180873@aol.com> I first encountered McPhee when I joined the cyanide group in my company. Basin and Range was handed to me as a way to get familiar with the gold business in Basin and Range Country. I went on to read In Suspect Terrane and others he wrote. Great stuff. Gene Hartstein From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 13 09:24:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Thu Feb 13 09:24:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer In-Reply-To: <000501c2d371$bf956780$ccaf5a0c@fekib> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030213072250.025f6a60@mail.aloha.net> At 05:07 AM 2/13/2003, you wrote: >I would also recommend the writings of John Mc Phee, best known for his book >"Annals of the Former World", winner of a Pulitzer prize. > >He has also written other geology related books, Assembling California, >Rising From the Plains, In Suspect Terrain, and Basin and Range, among many >other nature and historical ones. He has an entertaining style while being >very educational at the same time. > >Larry Rush Here's a small clarification, Larry. "Annals of the Former World" actually CONTAINS the other four books you listed. Here's a quote from a reviewer on amazon.com.: Be forewarned: If you are a McPhee fan, you likely already own this book ["Annals of the Former World"]. It is a compilation of four of his older works, along with a short fifth work, "Crossing the Craton", and a narrative introduction/table of contents. Only about 80 pages of this work are new material. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 13 17:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (herwig.pelckmans@pandora.be) Date: Thu Feb 13 17:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Tucson Show Message-ID: <20030214014625.D2B2A83C68@horkos.telenet-ops.be> Hi All, For those of you who will visit the TGMS Main Show, make sure to check out the booth of Collectors Stope (Aisle 17). I have some interesting mineral specimens for sale there from less current European localities, priced to sell. Hope to see you there and talk rocks !! Sincerely, Herwig Pelckmans from Belgium From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 05:57:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (earl verbeek) Date: Fri Feb 14 05:57:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer Message-ID: Has anyone mentioned this one yet? "Death Assemblage" by Susan Cummins Miller, formerly with the U.S. Geological Survey (and a probable victim of the 1995 massacre within that agency). This is her first book and is quite good. Cheers- Earl Verbeek _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 07:57:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Fri Feb 14 07:57:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy In-Reply-To: <20030214014625.D2B2A83C68@horkos.telenet-ops.be> Message-ID: <20030214155608.69852.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to do a little rock hunting. I traveled to the Gleeson AZ mining district and visited the local mine dumps. I parked on the road directly south of the Mountain range and visted two prospecting pits and the mine dumps of the closest mine (don't know the name). Around the prospecting pits adn as float I found some oxides I cannot identify. The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite slowly evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. However down on the slopes I found some highly wethered ore that does not look like either. These specims have heavy metalic lumps. Color Blue-Black They are associated with a deep dark red to alomst purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline structure sometimes but they are crstal faces on grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. However this might suggest a cleavage on some grains but not all. Anyone familar with the area could you pose a guess? ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 08:33:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John McLaughlin) Date: Fri Feb 14 08:33:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Geological Writer References: Message-ID: <3E4D1B96.1DBFCAB1@amug.org> Thanks Earl, I just looked up "Death Assemblage" on Amazon.com. The three reader reviews all gave it the maximum five stars. I'll check it out of the library right away. I'd buy the book to support a geologist/author but I spent wayyyyyyyy too long and too much in Tucson. We have a small but excellent list growing. John McLaughlin Glendale, Arizona earl verbeek wrote: > Has anyone mentioned this one yet? "Death Assemblage" by Susan Cummins > Miller, formerly with the U.S. Geological Survey (and a probable victim of > the 1995 massacre within that agency). This is her first book and is quite > good. > > Cheers- Earl Verbeek From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 10:20:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (frank de wit) Date: Fri Feb 14 10:20:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy References: <20030214155608.69852.qmail@web20005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000b01c2d455$a1516550$745a79d9@cm333814A> sounds like chalkopyrit oxidizing see http://www.mindat.org/loc.php?loc=3310 and goto http://www.mineralogie.ch/ type Gleeson at 'Fundort eingeben' to see mineral content of some mines in Gleeson area cheers, frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen stover" To: Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:56 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy > While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to do a > little rock hunting. I traveled to the Gleeson AZ > mining district and visited the local mine dumps. I > parked on the road directly south of the Mountain > range and visted two prospecting pits and the mine > dumps of the closest mine (don't know the name). > Around the prospecting pits > adn as float I found some oxides I cannot identify. > > The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite slowly > evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. However > down on the > slopes I found some highly wethered ore that does not > look like either. > > These specims have heavy metalic lumps. > > Color Blue-Black > > They are associated with a deep dark red to alomst > purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. > > The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline > structure sometimes but they are crstal faces on > grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. > > However this might suggest a cleavage on some grains > but not all. > > Anyone familar with the area could you pose a guess? > > > > ===== > Stephen F. Stover > PH (713) 829-1102 > xossfs@yahoo.com > > Wanting to hunt rocks > and play games every day! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 12:30:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dri) Date: Fri Feb 14 12:30:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Information Please Message-ID: <003701c2d467$c2f8cb00$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Hi Yall: I am a newbie' here and already am receiving an education. I am looking for a Source to purchase the grit media (sIc or is it SiC = preferred) and the polishing media for my Tumbler who has reasonable = prices. Can some one provide me with this information? Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 14 12:35:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 14 12:35:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Information Please Message-ID: <5a.17d7e91e.2b7eacb8@aol.com> http://www.kingsleynorth.com/ has what you need. (-: John Scully In a message dated 2/14/03 1:31:20 PM Mountain Standard Time, dri.anna@verizon.net writes: << Subj: [Rockhounds] Information Please Date: 2/14/03 1:31:20 PM Mountain Standard Time From: dri.anna@verizon.net (Dri) Sender: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com Reply-to: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rockhounds) Hi Yall: I am a newbie' here and already am receiving an education. I am looking for a Source to purchase the grit media (sIc or is it SiC preferred) and the polishing media for my Tumbler who has reasonable prices. Can some one provide me with this information? Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) >> From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 18:06:19 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Feb 15 18:06:19 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hawaii update Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030215153254.024e80a0@mail.aloha.net> First, we thought you all might like to know that it's cold here in Hawaii too. ;-) It got all the way down to 60 F / 15 C today and it has snowed on the tops of Hale'akala on Maui and Mauna Kea here on the big island. We looked up at the mountain behind our house this morning and saw that the snow line appears to reach down to about the 9000 foot / 2800 meter level. Lava report: A new surface flow has moved over a bit more of the Chain of Craters Road, forcing park staff to relocate the ranger hut, restrooms and visitor parking area back to a safer location. It is somehow reassuring to me that whatever political leaders, despots, maniacs or heros may do, Mother Nature proceeds to do her thing: devastation and creation---in this case, both at the same time. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 1/27/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 18:12:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 15 18:12:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Petrographic Microscopes Message-ID: <000001c2d111$35d20240$3923fea9@kuksuk> Hi, I have a couple of very nice polarizing ( petrographic ) microscopes which I'd like to find good homes for. They are in very nice shape, and complete. Bob From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 18:12:08 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Betty Fatula) Date: Sat Feb 15 18:12:08 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgerite Message-ID: <000201c2d1e4$d3a8a9f0$1b0ba8c0@RT12.com> Where would be the best place for me to view a beautiful crystal glass fulgertie that resembles a tree? From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 18:12:12 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (JAMES BUDNIK) Date: Sat Feb 15 18:12:12 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] wire sizing Message-ID: There is a magazine called "Wire Artist" from Canada that can answer this= . They do have a web page www.wag.on.ca that your friend can look at. I l= ooked at the book Jeweler's Resource" by Bruce Knuth and it has a list of= gauges. Most of the time I use 20 gauge which is .813 mm or 22 gauge whi= ch is .643 mm.I hope this helps. Judy =20 =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: RckSwapr42@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:53 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] wire sizing =20 Hey gang, I have a friend in Wales that is having a little problem...she is wanting= to =20 know if there is a place that she can get a conversion chart that lists g= uage =20 to metric sizing for wire....She is wanting to learn wire wrapping and is= on =20 her second batch of tumbled stones. She is also having trouble finding sourses in England and Wales...Any ide= as? For now and till then, JOHN --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 18:21:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sat Feb 15 18:21:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgerite References: <000201c2d1e4$d3a8a9f0$1b0ba8c0@RT12.com> Message-ID: <3E4EF69E.412653A8@att.net> I see you have a Hunterdon e-mail address; in that case, perhaps you can call the Academy of Natural Sciences in Philadelphia, and see if they still have theirs on display. By the way, not to be too picky, but it's "fulgurite." Don Betty Fatula wrote: > > Where would be the best place for me to view a beautiful crystal glass > fulgertie that resembles a tree? From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 20:05:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J. A. Barwood) Date: Sat Feb 15 20:05:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Petrographic Microscopes References: <000001c2d111$35d20240$3923fea9@kuksuk> Message-ID: <3E4F025B.199D665@bluemarble.net> I would be curious what you have. Thanks. Henry Barwood hbarwood@bluemarble.net lkuksuk@prodigy.net wrote: > Hi, > > I have a couple of very nice polarizing ( petrographic ) microscopes which > I'd like to find good homes for. > > They are in very nice shape, and complete. > > Bob > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 15 23:22:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Sat Feb 15 23:22:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" Message-ID: <200302160721.h1G7LRfE006545@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all (apologies for any multiple posts) A friend of mine panning for gold and osmiridium in a creek in the north west of Tasmania came across some unusual, perhaps unique, "epimorphs". I have added a page with images at http://www.crocoite.com/epimorphs/index.htm I would be interested to hear if anyone has seen similar things to this or if anyone has a theory as to how they may have formed. Regards Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 06:21:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen Douglas) Date: Sun Feb 16 06:21:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" References: <200302160721.h1G7LRfE006545@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000501c2d5c6$6591f3a0$2702a8c0@WorkGroup> Steve It is hard to distinguish from the pictures, but the "epimorphs" look like Helicopsychidae casings. As such, these casings are composed of agglutinated grains of sand (material varies) built by cassisfly larvae. The casings can range from being be rod shaped to turbiniform, like the snail shaped "epimorphs" in question. I originally found these casings in Niagara River gravels and they had me scratching my head for a little while. Where found, the casings are a sign that clear, well-oxygenated water with a slight current once existed at the site. Cheers, Stephen Douglas Editor, Pink Dolomite Saddle Newsletter Director, Niagara Peninsula Geological Society http://www.iaw.com/~jime/ stephendouglas@sympatico.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Sorrell" To: Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 6:21 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" > Hi all (apologies for any multiple posts) > > A friend of mine panning for gold and osmiridium in a creek in the north > west of Tasmania came across some unusual, perhaps unique, "epimorphs". > > I have added a page with images at > http://www.crocoite.com/epimorphs/index.htm > > I would be interested to hear if anyone has seen similar things to this or > if anyone has a theory as to how they may have formed. > > Regards > Steve > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 08:56:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Feb 16 08:56:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgurite In-Reply-To: <000201c2d1e4$d3a8a9f0$1b0ba8c0@RT12.com> Message-ID: Some extra information : The longest fulgurite has been found in Forster Pit, Sout Carolina, USA (J.J. PettY, 1936) : 60 ft or 818 meter ! The longest fulgurite that has been excavated and conserved completely is one from Hergenrath, Eupen, Belgium (J.H. Willems, 1961), 13 meter long and actually in the collections of the Royal Museum of Natural History in Brussels. I have (somewhere...) a photo of it, lying on a (long !) table in the museum at the time it was studied. If someone is interested I can dig it up and scan it. This is a list of important fulgurites compiled by Prof. René Van Tassel (does "vantasselite" ring a bell ??) : 1 Forster Pit, S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 60 ft 18 m 2 Rome, New York, USA C. West, 1843 50 ft 15 m 3 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1961 13 m 4 Drigg, Cumberland, UK E.L. Irton, 1814 30 ft 9 m 5 S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 20-30 ft 6-9 m 6 Zutendaal, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1958 8.4 m (*) 7 Zonhoven II, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 7.5 m (*) 8 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1964 7 m 9 Ludlington, Michigan, USA G. Monk, 1941 7 m 10 Macclesfield, UK Sainter, 1865 6.5 m 11 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 20 Fusz 5.7 m 12 Neu-Moresnet, Eupen, België P.C.R. Rademakers, 1963 5.8 m 13 New Jersey, USA W.L. Barrows, 1910 19 ft 5.8 m 14 Zonhoven I, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 5 m 15 Westerhaar, Overijsel, Nederland H. Krul, 1954 5 m (**) 16 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 15 par. Fusz 4.9 m 17 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 16 ft 4.9 m 18 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1822 8 L. el 53/4 Zoll 4.8 m 19 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1851 4.8 m (*)(***) 20 Guteborn, Saksen, Duitsland W. Fisher, 1926 4.6 m 21 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.6 m (*) 22 Stanton Co., Nebraska, USA E.H. Barbour, 1925 10-15 ft 3 - 4.5 m 23 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 13 par. Fusz 4.3 m 24 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 14 ft 4.3 m 25 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.3 m (*) 26 Hulshorst, Veluwe, Gelderland, NL N. Tinbergen, 1942 3.5 m (*) 27 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 6 Sachs. El 3.4 m (*) Stored in a museum (**) Destroyed during excavation (***) British Museum (Natural History) Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15 B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium Tel. + 32 3 7706007 E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif Large parking lot ! http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Betty Fatula Sent: 11 February, 2003 4:47 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgerite Where would be the best place for me to view a beautiful crystal glass fulgertie that resembles a tree? From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 09:11:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Sun Feb 16 09:11:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" In-Reply-To: <000501c2d5c6$6591f3a0$2702a8c0@WorkGroup> References: <200302160721.h1G7LRfE006545@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <5.2.0.5.2.20030216090825.014408e8@mail.spiritone.com> I agree; I have lots of aquatic entomology experience and these sure as heck look like caddis larvae cases. The easy way to find out is to tease them apart under a microscope; they will be held together with a fine webbing of "silk". At 09:19 AM 2/16/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Steve > It is hard to distinguish from the pictures, but the "epimorphs" look >like Helicopsychidae casings. As such, these casings are composed of >agglutinated grains of sand (material varies) built by cassisfly larvae. The >casings can range from being be rod shaped to turbiniform, like the snail >shaped "epimorphs" in question. I originally found these casings in Niagara >River gravels and they had me scratching my head for a little while. Where >found, the casings are a sign that clear, well-oxygenated water with a >slight current once existed at the site. > >Cheers, >Stephen Douglas >Editor, Pink Dolomite Saddle Newsletter >Director, Niagara Peninsula Geological Society >http://www.iaw.com/~jime/ >stephendouglas@sympatico.ca > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Steve Sorrell" >To: >Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 6:21 PM >Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" > > > > Hi all (apologies for any multiple posts) > > > > A friend of mine panning for gold and osmiridium in a creek in the north > > west of Tasmania came across some unusual, perhaps unique, "epimorphs". > > > > I have added a page with images at > > http://www.crocoite.com/epimorphs/index.htm > > > > I would be interested to hear if anyone has seen similar things to this or > > if anyone has a theory as to how they may have formed. > > > > Regards > > Steve > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! mailto:tim@OreRockOn.com Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 10:52:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (DANIEL-HARRY STEWARD) Date: Sun Feb 16 10:52:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Epimorphs from Tasmania Message-ID: <012401c2d5ed$23855020$8fe31843@uswest.net> Steve-- The pics you posted about the 'epimorphs from Tasmania look like = fossils. They will have to be examined first person but they do look = like ammonite replacements. If so, very exciting find!! Wish I had = one! Danny Steward / Seattle --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 13:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Andy Parker) Date: Sun Feb 16 13:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] wire sizing In-Reply-To: <1e7.1cfff11.2b7bd4a6@aol.com> References: <1e7.1cfff11.2b7bd4a6@aol.com> Message-ID: <3e4c258b.2251246@smtp.freeserve.net> John Rio Grande catalogue has a conversion chart, could transcribe if necessary. Source in UK for what? by all means pass on my email address and I will help if possible. Andy Parker, Agate House Lapidary Ulverston, Cumbria, England andy@agatehouse.co.uk www.agatehouse.co.uk Tel: 01229 584023 From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 20:52:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Feb 16 20:52:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgurite References: Message-ID: <3E506A3B.458@Tomaszewski.net> FYI... http://www.napa.ufl.edu/oldnews/fulgur.htm claims that as of 1997 a fulgurite with a 16 and 17 foot branch is the world's largest (per Guinness) excavated and preserved fulgurite. Longer contenders can be found with a search engine or in the literature, but not all are on display. Kreigh Rik Dillen wrote: > > Some extra information : > > The longest fulgurite has been found in Forster Pit, Sout Carolina, USA > (J.J. PettY, 1936) : 60 ft or 818 meter ! > The longest fulgurite that has been excavated and conserved completely is > one from Hergenrath, Eupen, Belgium (J.H. Willems, 1961), 13 meter long and > actually in the collections of the Royal Museum of Natural History in > Brussels. I have (somewhere...) a photo of it, lying on a (long !) table in > the museum at the time it was studied. If someone is interested I can dig it > up and scan it. > > This is a list of important fulgurites compiled by Prof. René Van Tassel > (does "vantasselite" ring a bell ??) : > > 1 Forster Pit, S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 60 ft 18 m > 2 Rome, New York, USA C. West, 1843 50 ft 15 m > 3 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1961 13 m > 4 Drigg, Cumberland, UK E.L. Irton, 1814 30 ft 9 m > 5 S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 20-30 ft 6-9 m > 6 Zutendaal, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1958 8.4 m (*) > 7 Zonhoven II, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 7.5 m (*) > 8 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1964 7 m > 9 Ludlington, Michigan, USA G. Monk, 1941 7 m > 10 Macclesfield, UK Sainter, 1865 6.5 m > 11 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 20 Fusz 5.7 m > 12 Neu-Moresnet, Eupen, België P.C.R. Rademakers, 1963 5.8 m > 13 New Jersey, USA W.L. Barrows, 1910 19 ft 5.8 m > 14 Zonhoven I, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 5 m > 15 Westerhaar, Overijsel, Nederland H. Krul, 1954 5 m (**) > 16 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 15 par. Fusz 4.9 m > 17 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 16 ft 4.9 m > 18 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1822 8 L. el 53/4 Zoll 4.8 m > 19 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1851 4.8 m (*)(***) > 20 Guteborn, Saksen, Duitsland W. Fisher, 1926 4.6 m > 21 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.6 m > (*) > 22 Stanton Co., Nebraska, USA E.H. Barbour, 1925 10-15 ft 3 - 4.5 m > 23 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 13 par. Fusz 4.3 m > 24 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 14 ft 4.3 m > 25 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.3 m > (*) > 26 Hulshorst, Veluwe, Gelderland, NL N. Tinbergen, 1942 3.5 m (*) > 27 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 6 Sachs. El 3.4 m > > (*) Stored in a museum > (**) Destroyed during excavation > (***) British Museum (Natural History) > > Greetings, > > Rik DILLEN > Doornstraat 15 > B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas > Belgium > > Tel. + 32 3 7706007 > E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > > Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > > >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) > >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! > >>> Exchange list > > Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ > >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! > > MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show > ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! > "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen > 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see > http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif > > Large parking lot ! > http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Betty Fatula > Sent: 11 February, 2003 4:47 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgerite > > Where would be the best place for me to view a beautiful crystal glass > fulgertie that resembles a tree? > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 23:45:59 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Sun Feb 16 23:45:59 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" Message-ID: <200302170745.h1H7jqlr008637@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi Stephen Thanks for the information. It is looking more and more likely. I remember caddis fly larvae from when I was growing up in England, but their cases were elongated tubes. I'm going to contact our local Museum here in Hobart to find out more. Regards Steve --------- Original message -------- From: "Stephen Douglas" To: "rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com" Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" Date: 02-16-03 09:22 Steve It is hard to distinguish from the pictures, but the "epimorphs" look like Helicopsychidae casings. As such, these casings are composed of agglutinated grains of sand (material varies) built by cassisfly larvae. The casings can range from being be rod shaped to turbiniform, like the snail shaped "epimorphs" in question. I originally found these casings in Niagara River gravels and they had me scratching my head for a little while. Where found, the casings are a sign that clear, well-oxygenated water with a slight current once existed at the site. Cheers, Stephen Douglas Editor, Pink Dolomite Saddle Newsletter Director, Niagara Peninsula Geological Society http://www.iaw.com/~jime/ stephendouglas@sympatico.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Sorrell" To: Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 6:21 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" > Hi all (apologies for any multiple posts) > > A friend of mine panning for gold and osmiridium in a creek in the north > west of Tasmania came across some unusual, perhaps unique, "epimorphs". > > I have added a page with images at > http://www.crocoite.com/epimorphs/index.htm > > I would be interested to hear if anyone has seen similar things to this or > if anyone has a theory as to how they may have formed. > > Regards > Steve > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 16 23:51:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Sun Feb 16 23:51:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" Message-ID: <200302170750.h1H7oqlr008979@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi Tim I'll break up one of the damaged ones and let you know the result. Notice that you call them caddis, the same as me. Regards Steve --------- Original message -------- From: "Tim Fisher" To: "rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com" Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Unusual (Unique?) Chromite "Epimorphs" Date: 02-16-03 12:13 I agree; I have lots of aquatic entomology experience and these sure as heck look like caddis larvae cases. The easy way to find out is to tease them apart under a microscope; they will be held together with a fine webbing of "silk". From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 07:35:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Mon Feb 17 07:35:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgurite In-Reply-To: <3E506A3B.458@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Of course UF makes it's own lightning which makes it easier to find fulgurites. Bryan "Si vis pacem para bellum" > > FYI... > > http://www.napa.ufl.edu/oldnews/fulgur.htm > > claims that as of 1997 a fulgurite with a 16 and 17 foot branch is the > world's largest (per Guinness) excavated and preserved fulgurite. Longer > contenders can be found with a search engine or in the literature, but > not all are on display. > > Kreigh > > > > > Rik Dillen wrote: > > > > Some extra information : > > > > The longest fulgurite has been found in Forster Pit, Sout Carolina, USA > > (J.J. PettY, 1936) : 60 ft or 818 meter ! > > The longest fulgurite that has been excavated and conserved > completely is > > one from Hergenrath, Eupen, Belgium (J.H. Willems, 1961), 13 > meter long and > > actually in the collections of the Royal Museum of Natural History in > > Brussels. I have (somewhere...) a photo of it, lying on a (long > !) table in > > the museum at the time it was studied. If someone is interested > I can dig it > > up and scan it. > > > > This is a list of important fulgurites compiled by Prof. René Van Tassel > > (does "vantasselite" ring a bell ??) : > > > > 1 Forster Pit, S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 > 60 ft 18 m > > 2 Rome, New York, USA C. West, 1843 50 ft 15 m > > 3 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1961 > 13 m > > 4 Drigg, Cumberland, UK E.L. Irton, 1814 30 ft 9 m > > 5 S.-Carolina, USA J.J. Petty, 1936 20-30 > ft 6-9 m > > 6 Zutendaal, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1958 > 8.4 m (*) > > 7 Zonhoven II, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 > 7.5 m (*) > > 8 Hergenrath II, Eupen, België J.H. Willems, 1964 > 7 m > > 9 Ludlington, Michigan, USA G. Monk, 1941 7 m > > 10 Macclesfield, UK Sainter, 1865 6.5 m > > 11 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 > 20 Fusz 5.7 m > > 12 Neu-Moresnet, Eupen, België P.C.R. Rademakers, 1963 > 5.8 m > > 13 New Jersey, USA W.L. Barrows, 1910 19 ft 5.8 m > > 14 Zonhoven I, Limburg, België R. Van Tassel, 1955 > 5 m > > 15 Westerhaar, Overijsel, Nederland H. Krul, 1954 > 5 m (**) > > 16 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 > 15 par. Fusz 4.9 m > > 17 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 16 ft 4.9 m > > 18 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1822 > 8 L. el 53/4 Zoll 4.8 m > > 19 Dresden, Saksen, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1851 > 4.8 m (*)(***) > > 20 Guteborn, Saksen, Duitsland W. Fisher, 1926 4.6 m > > 21 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, > 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.6 m > > (*) > > 22 Stanton Co., Nebraska, USA E.H. Barbour, 1925 > 10-15 ft 3 - 4.5 m > > 23 Bantelge, Münster, Duitsland K.G. Fiedler, 1817 > 13 par. Fusz 4.3 m > > 24 Starke, Florida, USA F.W. Wright Jr., 1999 14 ft 4.3 m > > 25 Sennerheide, Paderborn, Duitsland O. Suffert, > 1951 ; H. Krul, 1954 4.3 m > > (*) > > 26 Hulshorst, Veluwe, Gelderland, NL N. Tinbergen, > 1942 3.5 m (*) > > 27 Massel, Schleswig, Duitsland L.D. Hermann, 1711 > 6 Sachs. El 3.4 m > > > > (*) Stored in a museum > > (**) Destroyed during excavation > > (***) British Museum (Natural History) > > > > Greetings, > > > > Rik DILLEN > > Doornstraat 15 > > B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas > > Belgium > > > > Tel. + 32 3 7706007 > > E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > > > > Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > > > > >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) > > >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! > > >>> Exchange list > > > > Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ > > > >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! > > > > MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show > > ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! > > "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen > > 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see > > http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif > > > > Large parking lot ! > > http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Betty Fatula > > Sent: 11 February, 2003 4:47 PM > > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgerite > > > > Where would be the best place for me to view a beautiful crystal glass > > fulgertie that resembles a tree? > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 08:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Mon Feb 17 08:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy In-Reply-To: <000b01c2d455$a1516550$745a79d9@cm333814A> Message-ID: <20030217165856.62041.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> okay, let say it is chalco pryite oxidizing. What mineral does chalcopyrite weather inot idesert areas. It is not a carbonate. It is more of an oxide. with high metalic content. So what might it be? --- frank de wit wrote: > sounds like chalkopyrit oxidizing > see http://www.mindat.org/loc.php?loc=3310 > and > goto http://www.mineralogie.ch/ > type Gleeson at 'Fundort eingeben' > to see mineral content of some mines in Gleeson area > > cheers, frank > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Stephen stover" > To: > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:56 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy > > > > While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to do a > > little rock hunting. I traveled to the Gleeson AZ > > mining district and visited the local mine dumps. > I > > parked on the road directly south of the Mountain > > range and visted two prospecting pits and the mine > > dumps of the closest mine (don't know the name). > > Around the prospecting pits > > adn as float I found some oxides I cannot > identify. > > > > The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite slowly > > evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. > However > > down on the > > slopes I found some highly wethered ore that does > not > > look like either. > > > > These specims have heavy metalic lumps. > > > > Color Blue-Black > > > > They are associated with a deep dark red to alomst > > purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. > > > > The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline > > structure sometimes but they are crstal faces on > > grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. > > > > However this might suggest a cleavage on some > grains > > but not all. > > > > Anyone familar with the area could you pose a > guess? > > > > > > > > ===== > > Stephen F. Stover > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > and play games every day! > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 10:34:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Mon Feb 17 10:34:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgurite In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Correction !! > Rik Dillen wrote: > > > > Some extra information : > > > > The longest fulgurite has been found in Forster Pit, Sout Carolina, USA (J.J. PettY, 1936) : 60 ft or 818 meter ! That should be 18 meter, of course, not 818. Too much enthousiasm... sorry. Best regards, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15 B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium Tel. + 32 3 7706007 E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif Large parking lot ! http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 10:34:25 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Mon Feb 17 10:34:25 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fulgurite In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I am pretty sure that in this case the Guinness Book of Records committee did not do it's homework decently... Greetings, Rik > http://www.napa.ufl.edu/oldnews/fulgur.htm > > claims that as of 1997 a fulgurite with a 16 and 17 foot branch is the world's largest (per Guinness) excavated and preserved fulgurite. Longer contenders can be found with a search engine or in the literature, but not all are on display. > > Kreigh > > > > > Rik Dillen wrote: > > > > Some extra information : > > > > The longest fulgurite has been found in Forster Pit, Sout Carolina, USA > > (J.J. PettY, 1936) : 60 ft or 818 meter ! > > The longest fulgurite that has been excavated and conserved > completely is > > one from Hergenrath, Eupen, Belgium (J.H. Willems, 1961), 13 > meter long and > > actually in the collections of the Royal Museum of Natural History in > > Brussels. I have (somewhere...) a photo of it, lying on a (long > !) table in > > the museum at the time it was studied. If someone is interested > I can dig it > > up and scan it. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 10:54:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (frank de wit) Date: Mon Feb 17 10:54:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy References: <20030217165856.62041.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001d01c2d6b5$c39d5d50$745a79d9@cm333814A> easy one ;-) Covellin usually, Chalkosin=possible although I don't know what you mean by 'high metallic content' lustreous? try http://www.mindat.org/min-955.html http://www.mindat.org/min-1144.html etc, for more info Cheers! Frank ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen stover" To: Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 5:58 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy > okay, let say it is chalco pryite oxidizing. > > What mineral does chalcopyrite weather inot idesert > areas. It is not a carbonate. It is more of an > oxide. with high metalic content. So what might it > be? > > > > --- frank de wit wrote: > > sounds like chalkopyrit oxidizing > > see http://www.mindat.org/loc.php?loc=3310 > > and > > goto http://www.mineralogie.ch/ > > type Gleeson at 'Fundort eingeben' > > to see mineral content of some mines in Gleeson area > > > > cheers, frank > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Stephen stover" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:56 PM > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy > > > > > > > While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to do a > > > little rock hunting. I traveled to the Gleeson AZ > > > mining district and visited the local mine dumps. > > I > > > parked on the road directly south of the Mountain > > > range and visted two prospecting pits and the mine > > > dumps of the closest mine (don't know the name). > > > Around the prospecting pits > > > adn as float I found some oxides I cannot > > identify. > > > > > > The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite slowly > > > evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. > > However > > > down on the > > > slopes I found some highly wethered ore that does > > not > > > look like either. > > > > > > These specims have heavy metalic lumps. > > > > > > Color Blue-Black > > > > > > They are associated with a deep dark red to alomst > > > purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. > > > > > > The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline > > > structure sometimes but they are crstal faces on > > > grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. > > > > > > However this might suggest a cleavage on some > > grains > > > but not all. > > > > > > Anyone familar with the area could you pose a > > guess? > > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > Stephen F. Stover > > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > > and play games every day! > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > ===== > Stephen F. Stover > PH (713) 829-1102 > xossfs@yahoo.com > > Wanting to hunt rocks > and play games every day! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 17 18:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Mon Feb 17 18:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] "Epimorphs" THE ANSWER! Message-ID: <200302180258.h1I2wg8D024108@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all I have a definitive answer for what the chromite "epimorphs" are (see http://www.crocoite.com/epimorphs/index.htm). Brian Smith from the Queen Victoria Museum, Launceston, Tasmania, has identified these specimens. Although not able to provide the specific species name, they are a type of caddis fly larvae, but instead of the normal tube shaped homes that are normally built, these little critters have developed a shell-shape, mimicking a very different animal, basically as a camouflage technique!!! Regards Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 18 09:20:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Tue Feb 18 09:20:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] seeking members of Northern California Micromounters Message-ID: <200302181719.h1IHJHAN016475@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all, I'm betting someone in the list is a member of, or knows a member of, the Northern California Micromounters (I may not have the exact name). If so, please contact me off-list. I hear they have a group studying petrography and and I'm trying to get a loosely affiliated national group together. Thanks, Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 18 10:22:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dave West) Date: Tue Feb 18 10:22:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education! Message-ID: <004301c2d77a$6bb80840$59053c44@rome01.tn.comcast.net> Dear List members, I signed onto this list in November of last year hoping to "pick up some jewels and nuggets of knowledge". Being new (about a year) to the world of rocks and minerals, every discussion is a treasure chest that opens before my eyes and ears. Between rare opportunities to attend my local club meeting, conversations with a geologist friend and another friend who owns a drilling company, I learn a lot by listening. Filed guides, magazines, internet also assist me in replacing my ignorance with knowledge. But I have to say in the past few months, I have found this list to be a Ph. D. program. As I lurk and read I discover tidbits that open more and more doors for my exploration. So, thanks, everyone. I am having a ball! Back to my lurking mode. PS....In real life, I am a Pastor of a Baptist church in Rome, Georgia. Dave --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 18 12:39:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Tue Feb 18 12:39:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] seeking members of Northern California Micromounters References: <200302181719.h1IHJHAN016475@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <3E5299DB.731417F7@cox.net> Don, If believe either Robert Housley Rockhound list member or Bev Moreau can help you quickly. good luck, Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 03:48:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Wed Feb 19 03:48:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Last word on chromite "epimorphs" Message-ID: <200302191147.h1JBl4b3031624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all Brian Smith from the Queen Victoria Museum, Launceston, Tasmania, located an interesting article on this family of caddis flies. Luckily I had a copy of the publication, the Papers and Proceedings and Report of the Royal Society of Tasmania for 1878. Details are on my web site and reproduced below... No. 9 From Mr. B.R. Dyer - Specimens of curious shell-like cases made by the larva of an insect. In reference to these specimens Mr. Dyer writes: "Mr. Swainson, F.R.S., F.L.S., &c., &c., in his treatise on shells and shell-fish, gave a description and drawing, and also erected a new genus (Thelidomus) for the reception of what he supposed to be an entirely new and distinct form of fresh water shell. His disappointment must have been great when the observations of other scientists disclosed the fact that his supposed discovery was not a shell, but simply the home of a small freshwater insect, constructed with great skill out of small particles of sand cemented together with some glutinous substance. So true and exact is the formation of a Helix imitated that Swainson may reasonably be pardoned for committing such an error, especially, considering he had not had the opportunity of seeing the clever little insect which thus deceived him, and which is now known as "Swainson's mistake". It may be interesting to Naturalists to know the further distribution of these singular formations, which, hitherto, so far as I am aware, have only been found in India and Brazil. I had not heard of their presence in Tasmania before I discovered my first specimens, about nine months since, in a tributary of the Upper Huon River, where they abound in countless numbers. I had splendid opportunities of noticing the lively little insect which is the sole proprietor and tenant of its house. They are identical, in all respects, with those found in Brazil and India." The Secretary read the original description of these "cases" from Swainson's Malacology; also, a notice of the genus Thelidomus, from Sowerby's Conchological Manual. Several specimens were placed under a microscope of low power, and examined by the members. What fun! Regards Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 06:12:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tim Jokela) Date: Wed Feb 19 06:12:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Last word on chromite "epimorphs" References: <200302191147.h1JBl4b3031624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00a501c2d821$6f0c6980$b206efd1@oemcomputer> BTW, if anybody finds themselves getting interested in layman's entomology and would like to read more about caddis, just pop into a good fly fishing shop. This is an insect very dear to the hearts of fly anglers, behind only the mayfly, and there are at least a few superb books on caddis. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr tjokela@execulink.com http://www.element51.com http://www.ontariominerals.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Sorrell" To: Sent: February 19, 2003 10:47 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Last word on chromite "epimorphs" > Hi all > > Brian Smith from the Queen Victoria Museum, Launceston, Tasmania, located an > interesting article on this family of caddis flies. Luckily I had a copy of > the publication, the Papers and Proceedings and Report of the Royal Society > of Tasmania for 1878. Details are on my web site and reproduced below... > > No. 9 From Mr. B.R. Dyer - Specimens of curious shell-like cases made by the > larva of an insect. snip > What fun! > > Regards > Steve > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 09:01:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 19 09:01:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] FTIR: what exactly does it do for mineralogy? Message-ID: <200302191700.h1JH0eRD020292@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all, Recently I have come across some mineral investigations that require the use of FTIR, or Fourier-Transform InfraRed spectroscopy. I found thousands of pages in a web search, but none that explained what I want to know in the terms I want to know it. Specifically, I am interested in the use of FTIR for the determination of water content in minerals. As I understand it--and correct me if I am wrong--there is the high-temperature water content, as hydroxyl (OH), and low-temperature water, as H2O. Also as I understand, in cases where EDS or WDS is used to determine chemistry, the water content is calculated by difference (this is a phrase I see a lot). However, this empirical calculation doesn't tell the investigator whether the water is in hydroxyl or H2O bonding. Am I on track so far? Now, the way I see it, FTIR can tell you what bonding form your water takes, which can be important to classifying the species. However, this appears to be a qualitative analysis. I understand there is also another test, thermogravimetric analysis or TGA, which is used to determine total water content; but on the other hand, I can't imagine it would tell you whether you had OH or H2O. So here are some questions that may be relevant: 1. If you did an EDS or WDS to determine your chemistry in so far as those processes allow, and you determine water by calculating the difference, why would you need TGA? 2. Given #1, shouldn't FTIR be sufficient to qualify the structure of your water? 3. This whole hydroxyl thing: where is the other H? Is it shared with another unit cell? Or am I so far off that I need to re-phrase the question? Any assistance would of course be appreciated. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 09:19:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 19 09:19:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? Message-ID: <200302191718.h1JHIviQ021809@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi all, I am looking at a mineral formation that is composed of a CALCITE host rock, weathered and rotted, with coniferous trees on top, their roots sunk deep into cracks. There is a part of this formation where the water drains, stained with crusts of yellow, green, brown, and white. Assuming for a moment that I can rule out these being organics, mineraloids, or oxidation products, there is a chance that the white and light brown materials may be WHEWELLITE or WEDDLEITE or both. I've been researching this organic influence for months, and the literature is replete with the known relationship between oxalic acid from botanical products and mineral weathering. While most of these are geared toward biologists and environmentalists, I understand enough to realize this type of formation is possible. I am still photographing, collecting, and cataloguing, and haven't done any wet chemistry yet to narrow down what I might be seeing here. So now the million dollar question: is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE and WEDDELITE? There is no visible crystal morphology, so that is ruled out. Chemistry alone is not enough, since the organic oxalate anion (I presume I can call it an anion in this context) is based upon structure, not empirical chemistry. No doubt an x-ray diffraction would determine the oxalate, but before I go scrounging for someone to do the x-rays, I am hoping there is a reagent test I can perform that will help. My other option is to try sublimation, in which I hope to heat the pulverized powder and have it re-crystallize on the bottom of a glass coverslip. However, even if that works, I can't be certain that the morphology is unique enough to make a positive ID. I'm open to ideas. Thanks, Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 12:48:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Wed Feb 19 12:48:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy In-Reply-To: <001d01c2d6b5$c39d5d50$745a79d9@cm333814A> Message-ID: <20030219204701.49100.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> nahhhhh, just REE$EEAAALLLLLL Dense and Heavy. I think it may be just goethite but I am not postive. --- frank de wit wrote: > easy one ;-) > > Covellin usually, Chalkosin=possible > although I don't know what you mean by 'high > metallic content' > lustreous? > > try > http://www.mindat.org/min-955.html > http://www.mindat.org/min-1144.html > etc, for more info > > Cheers! > Frank > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Stephen stover" > To: > Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 5:58 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines > Mineralogy > > > > okay, let say it is chalco pryite oxidizing. > > > > What mineral does chalcopyrite weather inot > idesert > > areas. It is not a carbonate. It is more of an > > oxide. with high metalic content. So what might > it > > be? > > > > > > > > --- frank de wit wrote: > > > sounds like chalkopyrit oxidizing > > > see http://www.mindat.org/loc.php?loc=3310 > > > and > > > goto http://www.mineralogie.ch/ > > > type Gleeson at 'Fundort eingeben' > > > to see mineral content of some mines in Gleeson > area > > > > > > cheers, frank > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Stephen stover" > > > To: > > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:56 PM > > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines > Mineralogy > > > > > > > > > > While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to > do a > > > > little rock hunting. I traveled to the > Gleeson AZ > > > > mining district and visited the local mine > dumps. > > > I > > > > parked on the road directly south of the > Mountain > > > > range and visted two prospecting pits and the > mine > > > > dumps of the closest mine (don't know the > name). > > > > Around the prospecting pits > > > > adn as float I found some oxides I cannot > > > identify. > > > > > > > > The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite > slowly > > > > evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. > > > However > > > > down on the > > > > slopes I found some highly wethered ore that > does > > > not > > > > look like either. > > > > > > > > These specims have heavy metalic lumps. > > > > > > > > Color Blue-Black > > > > > > > > They are associated with a deep dark red to > alomst > > > > purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. > > > > > > > > The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline > > > > structure sometimes but they are crstal faces > on > > > > grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. > > > > > > > > However this might suggest a cleavage on some > > > grains > > > > but not all. > > > > > > > > Anyone familar with the area could you pose a > > > guess? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > > Stephen F. Stover > > > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > > > and play games every day! > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's > Day > > > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > ===== > > Stephen F. Stover > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > and play games every day! > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 13:25:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Feb 19 13:25:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? In-Reply-To: <200302191718.h1JHIviQ021809@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: There is a wet chemistry determination of oxalate by titration with permanganate. Search google using "oxate permanganate" and you'll get a bunch of pages telling you all about it. Being a wet chemistry method you'll need a fairly large sample, a gram or so probably depending on your lab skills and apparatus.. > Chemistry alone is not enough, since the organic oxalate anion (I > presume I can > call it an anion in this context) is based upon structure, not empirical > chemistry. No doubt an x-ray diffraction would determine the > oxalate, but I'm not sure what you are getting at here, Calcium Oxalate is a definite chemical species and yes oxalate is an anion. Oxalic acid is a strong acid as far as organic acids go. I don't have any chemical handbooks here but I seem to recall that Calcium Oxalate decomposes on heating. Bryan "Si vis pacem para bellum" > I am looking at a mineral formation that is composed of a CALCITE > host rock, > weathered and rotted, with coniferous trees on top, their roots > sunk deep into > cracks. There is a part of this formation where the water > drains, stained with > crusts of yellow, green, brown, and white. Assuming for a moment > that I can > rule out these being organics, mineraloids, or oxidation > products, there is a > chance that the white and light brown materials may be WHEWELLITE > or WEDDLEITE > or both. I've been researching this organic influence for > months, and the > literature is replete with the known relationship between oxalic > acid from > botanical products and mineral weathering. While most of these > are geared > toward biologists and environmentalists, I understand enough to > realize this > type of formation is possible. I am still photographing, collecting, and > cataloguing, and haven't done any wet chemistry yet to narrow > down what I might > be seeing here. > > So now the million dollar question: is there a simple test for > WHEWELLITE and > WEDDELITE? There is no visible crystal morphology, so that is > ruled out. > Chemistry alone is not enough, since the organic oxalate anion (I > presume I can > call it an anion in this context) is based upon structure, not empirical > chemistry. No doubt an x-ray diffraction would determine the > oxalate, but > before I go scrounging for someone to do the x-rays, I am hoping > there is a > reagent test I can perform that will help. My other option is to try > sublimation, in which I hope to heat the pulverized powder and have it > re-crystallize on the bottom of a glass coverslip. However, even if that > works, I can't be certain that the morphology is unique enough to make a > positive ID. > > I'm open to ideas. > > Thanks, > > Don > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 13:52:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Vernon Hagan) Date: Wed Feb 19 13:52:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale Message-ID: <000901c2d57c$5820c9c0$c338a218@houston.rr.com> My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and = other interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in = them? phone 281-424-5684 or email vernon --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 14:06:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dri) Date: Wed Feb 19 14:06:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy References: <20030219204701.49100.qmail@web20008.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001501c2d863$04377360$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Stephen: Due to the fact that you have not submitted a photo for us to see, I can just venture a possibility. Your description of this stone could indicate it is Bornite, an altered copper ore also known as Peacock Stone. I have a couple Peacock stones that I purchased a few years ago. If I recall correctly the person in the little shop where I purchased them indicated they came from a mining slag heap in either New Mexico or Arizona. Bornite could be found in the area of where gold has been located. Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen stover" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 12:47 Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines Mineralogy > nahhhhh, just REE$EEAAALLLLLL Dense and Heavy. I > think it may be just goethite but I am not postive. > > > --- frank de wit wrote: > > easy one ;-) > > > > Covellin usually, Chalkosin=possible > > although I don't know what you mean by 'high > > metallic content' > > lustreous? > > > > try > > http://www.mindat.org/min-955.html > > http://www.mindat.org/min-1144.html > > etc, for more info > > > > Cheers! > > Frank > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Stephen stover" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 5:58 PM > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines > > Mineralogy > > > > > > > okay, let say it is chalco pryite oxidizing. > > > > > > What mineral does chalcopyrite weather inot > > idesert > > > areas. It is not a carbonate. It is more of an > > > oxide. with high metalic content. So what might > > it > > > be? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- frank de wit wrote: > > > > sounds like chalkopyrit oxidizing > > > > see http://www.mindat.org/loc.php?loc=3310 > > > > and > > > > goto http://www.mineralogie.ch/ > > > > type Gleeson at 'Fundort eingeben' > > > > to see mineral content of some mines in Gleeson > > area > > > > > > > > cheers, frank > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Stephen stover" > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:56 PM > > > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Gleeson, AZ Mines > > Mineralogy > > > > > > > > > > > > > While attending the Tuscon show, I decided to > > do a > > > > > little rock hunting. I traveled to the > > Gleeson AZ > > > > > mining district and visited the local mine > > dumps. > > > > I > > > > > parked on the road directly south of the > > Mountain > > > > > range and visted two prospecting pits and the > > mine > > > > > dumps of the closest mine (don't know the > > name). > > > > > Around the prospecting pits > > > > > adn as float I found some oxides I cannot > > > > identify. > > > > > > > > > > The mine dumps have large piles of pyrite > > slowly > > > > > evolving inot to sulfur and Sulfuric acid. > > > > However > > > > > down on the > > > > > slopes I found some highly wethered ore that > > does > > > > not > > > > > look like either. > > > > > > > > > > These specims have heavy metalic lumps. > > > > > > > > > > Color Blue-Black > > > > > > > > > > They are associated with a deep dark red to > > alomst > > > > > purpel chert and small quatz crystal druse. > > > > > > > > > > The metalic lumps appear to have a crystaline > > > > > structure sometimes but they are crstal faces > > on > > > > > grains so I cannot work out a crystalography. > > > > > > > > > > However this might suggest a cleavage on some > > > > grains > > > > > but not all. > > > > > > > > > > Anyone familar with the area could you pose a > > > > guess? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > > > Stephen F. Stover > > > > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > > > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > > > > and play games every day! > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's > > Day > > > > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > Stephen F. Stover > > > PH (713) 829-1102 > > > xossfs@yahoo.com > > > > > > Wanting to hunt rocks > > > and play games every day! > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do you Yahoo!? > > > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > > > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > ===== > Stephen F. Stover > PH (713) 829-1102 > xossfs@yahoo.com > > Wanting to hunt rocks > and play games every day! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 14:19:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Wed Feb 19 14:19:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: Message-ID: <3E5403FF.ADFA00F@att.net> J Bryan Kramer wrote: > > There is a wet chemistry determination of oxalate by titration with > permanganate. Search google using "oxate permanganate" and you'll get a > bunch of pages telling you all about it. Many thanks! > I'm not sure what you are getting at here, Calcium Oxalate is a definite > chemical species and yes oxalate is an anion. What I meant was that, since oxalate is an organic, just the empirical determination alone won't tell you what you have. Sure, you could determine the existence of H, C, and O via ICP, AA, etc., but unless you know the bonding structure, you don't know you have oxalate. That's the whole idea of organic chemistry as I understand it: the bonds and crystal structure are very important, and you can combine C, H, O, etc., in many ways but the structure changes the properties of the molecule. I found a drawing of oxalic acid and it looks like a 3-year old was playing with his Tinkertoys. Well, maybe I'm incorrect, which is why I'm asking and looking for corrections to my presumptions. I did find one interesting page--I think it was about kidney stones--that listed what were called the organic and inorganic formulae for oxalate, which is what put the idea in my head. I can't find it at the moment, but I think part of it was written as (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. I'm not articulating the issue very well but I'm hoping you can figure out what I'm trying to say. The inorganic formula, as that page put it, is what I might also call the stoichiometric formula as well: it lists the relative quantities of elements without regard for their bonds. Make sense, or am I way off again? Anyway, I'm not even sure if that matters when trying to identify the species. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 15:36:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Feb 19 15:36:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale In-Reply-To: <000901c2d57c$5820c9c0$c338a218@houston.rr.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030219134348.01fd8af0@mail.aloha.net> At 07:01 PM 2/15/2003, you wrote: > My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and other > interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in them? > >phone 281-424-5684 or email > > vernon From the way you describe it, the collection is probably not of great monetary value, so I would suggest checking with local schools and possibly a library to see if they would like it to spark the interest of children. Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 16:08:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kris Murray) Date: Wed Feb 19 16:08:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030219134348.01fd8af0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <5BB9D548-4467-11D7-9A92-000393A96092@mac.com> i may be interested in buying them KM On Wednesday, February 19, 2003, at 03:48 PM, Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: >> My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and >> other interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested >> in them? >> >> phone 281-424-5684 or email Kris Murray J&M Publishing, Inc. www.jm-publishing.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 16:10:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Feb 19 16:10:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <200302191718.h1JHIviQ021809@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <3E541CB0.59C1@Tomaszewski.net> Several sites I found with a search engine suggest using a polarizing microscope to identify the crystal form to confirm Whewellite. Specific gravity was the other test mentioned since it is unusually low for this mineral. Kreigh morningstar@att.net wrote: > > Hi all, > > I am looking at a mineral formation that is composed of a CALCITE host rock, > weathered and rotted, with coniferous trees on top, their roots sunk deep into > cracks. There is a part of this formation where the water drains, stained with > crusts of yellow, green, brown, and white. Assuming for a moment that I can > rule out these being organics, mineraloids, or oxidation products, there is a > chance that the white and light brown materials may be WHEWELLITE or WEDDLEITE > or both. I've been researching this organic influence for months, and the > literature is replete with the known relationship between oxalic acid from > botanical products and mineral weathering. While most of these are geared > toward biologists and environmentalists, I understand enough to realize this > type of formation is possible. I am still photographing, collecting, and > cataloguing, and haven't done any wet chemistry yet to narrow down what I might > be seeing here. > > So now the million dollar question: is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE and > WEDDELITE? There is no visible crystal morphology, so that is ruled out. > Chemistry alone is not enough, since the organic oxalate anion (I presume I can > call it an anion in this context) is based upon structure, not empirical > chemistry. No doubt an x-ray diffraction would determine the oxalate, but > before I go scrounging for someone to do the x-rays, I am hoping there is a > reagent test I can perform that will help. My other option is to try > sublimation, in which I hope to heat the pulverized powder and have it > re-crystallize on the bottom of a glass coverslip. However, even if that > works, I can't be certain that the morphology is unique enough to make a > positive ID. > > I'm open to ideas. > > Thanks, > > Don > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 16:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Feb 19 16:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? In-Reply-To: <3E5403FF.ADFA00F@att.net> Message-ID: When you are talking about low molecular weight organics like oxalic acid there aren't that many ways to put 2 carbons, 4 oxygens and 2 hydrogens together so an elemental analysis would probably tell you what compound you have. Reference books (the CRC Handbook for example) will tell you what the possible compounds are for any particular elemental analysis that you get. If you get up in molecular weight then the number of possibilties multiply rapidly. So having an elemental analysis done on this material would tell you if it was calcium oxalate if you could get enough uncontaminated sample to run the analysis on. Bryan "Si vis pacem para bellum" > > J Bryan Kramer wrote: > > > > There is a wet chemistry determination of oxalate by titration with > > permanganate. Search google using "oxate permanganate" and you'll get a > > bunch of pages telling you all about it. > > Many thanks! > > > I'm not sure what you are getting at here, Calcium Oxalate is a definite > > chemical species and yes oxalate is an anion. > > What I meant was that, since oxalate is an organic, just the empirical > determination alone won't tell you what you have. Sure, you could > determine the existence of H, C, and O via ICP, AA, etc., but unless you > know the bonding structure, you don't know you have oxalate. That's the > whole idea of organic chemistry as I understand it: the bonds and > crystal structure are very important, and you can combine C, H, O, etc., > in many ways but the structure changes the properties of the molecule. > I found a drawing of oxalic acid and it looks like a 3-year old was > playing with his Tinkertoys. Well, maybe I'm incorrect, which is why > I'm asking and looking for corrections to my presumptions. I did find > one interesting page--I think it was about kidney stones--that listed > what were called the organic and inorganic formulae for oxalate, which > is what put the idea in my head. I can't find it at the moment, but I > think part of it was written as (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. I'm not > articulating the issue very well but I'm hoping you can figure out what > I'm trying to say. The inorganic formula, as that page put it, is what > I might also call the stoichiometric formula as well: it lists the > relative quantities of elements without regard for their bonds. Make > sense, or am I way off again? Anyway, I'm not even sure if that matters > when trying to identify the species. > > Don > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 16:33:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Thomas Yancey) Date: Wed Feb 19 16:33:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Last word on chromite "epimorphs" In-Reply-To: <200302191147.h1JBl4b3031624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200302191147.h1JBl4b3031624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: Folks, Steve's report is very interesting and it illustrates a very geological phenomenon. The distribution of these caddis larvae, in Tasmania, Brazil, and India, is typical of many distributions of plants and animals that are known only on continents that were formerly parts of the supercontinent of Gondwana. Gondwana broke apart in the early Cretaceous (except for Australia, which broke from Antarctica in the Eocene) and the pieces have been moving away from a location in the high latitudes of the southern hemisphere. India is the most traveled, crossing the equator and colliding with Asia, but retaining some southern hemisphere organisms. The most distinctive and common of the Gondwanan organisms occur in today's southern temperate climates, such as that in Tasmania and in Chile and Argentina in South America. In other regions formerly in Gondwana, the Gondwanan remnants are now being replaced by organisms with a more recent origin in northern hemisphere areas. The marsupial animals of Australia are a Gondwanan legacy that has been protected from invasion. South America also had an equally diverse marsupial fauna until about 5 million years ago, when the central Americal land bridge formed, allowing northern hemisphere placental mammals to invade South America and displace the marsupials, now almost entirely gone. By looking at geological history, we can discover a 'lost world' of Gondwanan life. T. Yancey >Brian Smith from the Queen Victoria Museum, Launceston, Tasmania, located an >interesting article on this family of caddis flies. Luckily I had a copy of >the publication, the Papers and Proceedings and Report of the Royal Society >of Tasmania for 1878. Details are on my web site and reproduced below... > >No. 9 From Mr. B.R. Dyer - Specimens of curious shell-like cases made by the >larva of an insect. > >In reference to these specimens Mr. Dyer writes: "Mr. Swainson, F.R.S., >F.L.S., &c., &c., in his treatise on shells and shell-fish, gave a >description and drawing, and also erected a new genus (Thelidomus) for the >reception of what he supposed to be an entirely new and distinct form of >fresh water shell. His disappointment must have been great when the >observations of other scientists disclosed the fact that his supposed >discovery was not a shell, but simply the home of a small freshwater insect, >constructed with great skill out of small particles of sand cemented >together with some glutinous substance. So true and exact is the formation >of a Helix imitated that Swainson may reasonably be pardoned for committing >such an error, especially, considering he had not had the opportunity of >seeing the clever little insect which thus deceived him, and which is now >known as "Swainson's mistake". It may be interesting to Naturalists to know >the further distribution of these singular formations, which, hitherto, so >far as I am aware, have only been found in India and Brazil. I had not heard >of their presence in Tasmania before I discovered my first specimens, about >nine months since, in a tributary of the Upper Huon River, where they abound >in countless numbers. I had splendid opportunities of noticing the lively >little insect which is the sole proprietor and tenant of its house. They are >identical, in all respects, with those found in Brazil and India." > >The Secretary read the original description of these "cases" from Swainson's >Malacology; also, a notice of the genus Thelidomus, from Sowerby's >Conchological Manual. Several specimens were placed under a microscope of >low power, and examined by the members. > >Regards >Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 18:05:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Wed Feb 19 18:05:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Last word on chromite "epimorphs" Message-ID: <200302200201.h1K21L4e031488@bubbleator.drizzle.com> You make a good point Thomas. We "rock collectors" normally only take a geological view based on the geology, the rocks themselves. A case in point is where I consider the joint lineage of Tasmania, Antarctica and South Africa based on the distribution of Jurassic dolerite. There are many biological comparisons that could probably be made, many of course, via the fossil record. Regards Steve From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 18:48:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 19 18:48:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] FTIR: what exactly does it do for mineralogy? Message-ID: <194.156ce4b6.2b859bb1@aol.com> In a message dated 2/19/03 2:19:27 PM Central Standard Time, morningstar@att.net writes: Don I will try to answer questions, as I work with these methods quite often > 1. If you did an EDS or WDS to determine your chemistry in so far as those > processes allow, and you determine water by calculating the difference, why > would you need TGA? EDS or WDS (more accurate, much slower) cannot detect light elements, to wit: H, He, Li, Be, and B, and may have difficulty with C, N, and O, although newer machines (i.e. more expensive) can detect Li, Be, B, C, N, and O. Not being able to detect all of the elements, especially H and O, means that you have to make an assumption about what you don't detect. When doing a chemical analysis, you always want to sum to 100%, otherwise, you don't know if your analysis is correct. TGA, thermogravimetric analysis, measures the lose in weight of a sample as it is heated, usually in air. So, for example, a zeolite, a weight lose will occur around 100 °C - the water contained in the zeolite 'cages'. Higher temperature weight loses would indicate the presence of more tightly bound H2O, OH, or even other groups being removed as NH3 or CO2 and maybe even H2S or SO2. Thus, while TGA can tell you how much of something, it may not tell you how much of what, hence the coupling with EDS. > 2. Given #1, shouldn't FTIR be sufficient to qualify the structure of your > water? FTIR, via adsorption of certain wavelengths, which is a function of the chemical make-up of the sample, will tell you if H2O, OH, H3O, H, CO3, etc. is present, but it is at best a qualitative technique, so TGA is needed to answer the how much, FTIR tells you what. Of course, you could take what is removed during TGA and analysis it with a MS (mass spectrometer) but that is another level of cost > 3. This whole hydroxyl thing: where is the other H? Is it shared with > another unit cell? Or am I so far off that I need to re-phrase the question? > OH is negatively charged, it is balanced with a cation, such as in brucite, Mg(OH)2 - Mg has lost two electrons, each OH has 'found' one of them. hope this helps, Jeff From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 18:54:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Sherry Pauley) Date: Wed Feb 19 18:54:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale References: <000901c2d57c$5820c9c0$c338a218@houston.rr.com> Message-ID: If no one ends up buying them, you can donate them to your local museum. I'm sure they would be appreciated. Sherry Pauley Docent / Web Master Buena Vista Museum of Natural History www.sharktoothhill.com My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and other interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in them? phone 281-424-5684 or email vernon From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 19:04:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Wed Feb 19 19:04:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Last word on chromite "epimorphs" References: <200302191147.h1JBl4b3031624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <3E544576.9346436B@cox.net> This has turned into a fascinating thread, thank you all. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 19 19:16:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 19 19:16:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale Message-ID: <1e0.272d167.2b85a269@aol.com> In a message dated 2/19/03 4:30:29 PM Pacific Standard Time, vernon1@houston.rr.com writes: > . Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in them? > What town and state do you live in? A lot of rocks are worth about $1 per pound but it cost that much to ship them. That means they have more value to somebody who lives close. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 00:46:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Feb 20 00:46:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <200302191718.h1JHIviQ021809@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <3E541CB0.59C1@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <003401c2d8bc$a7d376a0$929c77d5@pandora.be> No crystals recognizable at all? Butterfly-shaped twinning is typical for whewellite. Have you tried fluorescence under a normal blacklight? Wehwellite VERY often fluoresces a strong light blue in LW350 and LW370. Now, since you spoke of botanical decay and calcite... humic acid and consorts are known to produce a whitish to tan fluorescence in calcite and aragonite. I have no idea what the bluish wehwellite fluorescence will do when contaminated with humic acid. It's worth a try though... Another way of telling what the crust is may be the special feel of wehwellite. It forms sharp and pointed crystals that make kidney and bladder-stones so painful (yes, wehwellite there too). If the crust feels smooth or at worst porous it is probably calcite. If it really scratches you ... I'd say wehwellite is a distict possibility. cheers Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 1:20 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? | Several sites I found with a search engine suggest using a polarizing | microscope to identify the crystal form to confirm Whewellite. | | Specific gravity was the other test mentioned since it is unusually low | for this mineral. | | Kreigh | | | | | morningstar@att.net wrote: | > | > Hi all, | > | > I am looking at a mineral formation that is composed of a CALCITE host rock, | > weathered and rotted, with coniferous trees on top, their roots sunk deep into | > cracks. There is a part of this formation where the water drains, stained with | > crusts of yellow, green, brown, and white. Assuming for a moment that I can | > rule out these being organics, mineraloids, or oxidation products, there is a | > chance that the white and light brown materials may be WHEWELLITE or WEDDLEITE | > or both. I've been researching this organic influence for months, and the | > literature is replete with the known relationship between oxalic acid from | > botanical products and mineral weathering. While most of these are geared | > toward biologists and environmentalists, I understand enough to realize this | > type of formation is possible. I am still photographing, collecting, and | > cataloguing, and haven't done any wet chemistry yet to narrow down what I might | > be seeing here. | > | > So now the million dollar question: is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE and | > WEDDELITE? There is no visible crystal morphology, so that is ruled out. | > Chemistry alone is not enough, since the organic oxalate anion (I presume I can | > call it an anion in this context) is based upon structure, not empirical | > chemistry. No doubt an x-ray diffraction would determine the oxalate, but | > before I go scrounging for someone to do the x-rays, I am hoping there is a | > reagent test I can perform that will help. My other option is to try | > sublimation, in which I hope to heat the pulverized powder and have it | > re-crystallize on the bottom of a glass coverslip. However, even if that | > works, I can't be certain that the morphology is unique enough to make a | > positive ID. | > | > I'm open to ideas. | > | > Thanks, | > | > Don | > | > | > _______________________________________________ | > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | > Subscription Services: | > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 05:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Thu Feb 20 05:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] FTIR: what exactly does it do for mineralogy? Message-ID: <1ec.25d1178.2b863201@aol.com> Dear Don, Lots of acronyms. I'll tackle a few. But first, a note about water. "Water" as hydroxyl exists as OH in a mineral. It isn't H(OH) with one of the H's being ignored or shared. When you use TGA, you can understand some of the nature of the water in a mineral. Water which "evaporates" below 100 degrees C can be expressed as a broad band in the spectrum suggesting the water is adsorbed on the surface or water which is zeolitic, water loosely associated with the mineral within channels in the mineral. Adsorbed surface water and zeolitic water frequently change depending on the relative humidity of the surrounding. Changes in water that is structurally bound to a mineral usually occurs about 100 deg. C, but not always. Some minerals can spontaneously and irreversibly alter due to changes in water to hydroxyl. Some elements in a mineral can oxidize and the loss of an electron can convert one of the H+'s in a water molecule to elemental H and the left overs of the water are OH's. Lots of additional processes occur to make this happen. A particularly good example of unstable hydroxyl occurs when montroseite spontaneously and irreversibly alters to paramontroseite. The hydroxyl's hydrogen "evaporates" taking an electron with it and the V increases valance. No way to stop this one. Water lost above 100C is also full of variable causes. While you might anticipate that all zeolitic water would be gone, having given time for the specimen to react, the process might be complicated by large cations blocking the mineral's channels. Beryl has essentially zeolitic water and it can be very resistant to removal and would show up in the high temperature water loss. (I'd have to look up typical TGA results to quantify.) Frequently, water loss above 100C is structural water. Some structural water might be lost without decomposing the structure, while some water loss might begin the decomposition process. Coupled with water loss, there might be higher temperature loss of water by its being converted to hydroxyl with consequent oxidation. Some minerals are very refractory and water and/or hydroxyl can continue to be lost at intervals related to the structural significance of the site from whence the water/hydroxyl originated. There might be episodes of water and/or hydroxyl loss throughout the process as each non-equivalent component reacts to the stimulus of the heat applied. Features in a TGA spectrum can be sometimes seen up to the melting temperature. Fortunately, the behavior of minerals is a little more discreet and the behavior is frequently easily interpreted. Haven't exhausted the possibilities, just myself. Re: FTIR. The Fourier Transform is a mathematical method for reducing the data. IR wasn't usually quantitative when I went to grad school, so we didn't have it in my day. (Also had to walk 12 miles one way to school, in the snow. LOL) IR causes certain atoms, atomic groups, radicals, etc., to vibrate as they absorb the radiation and when the affected materials release that energy, it is released according to the characteristics of the particular group, etc., and so you can identify particular kinds of water, etc., using the technique. (When I went through security at the airport recently, the agent swabbed the handle of the suitcases and put the swab in what I thought was an IR machine. The spectrum was apparently interpreted by the computer and I passed - no known hazardous chemicals on the surface. If anyone's familiar with what's really happening, I'd like to hear the slightly off-topic response.) Re: EDS and other methods which can't detect light elements, such as H and O, calculating water by difference does involve seeing what charge balance is required. The analyst might apportion some of the calculated water as hydroxyl or all of it. Calculated water by difference is beginning to re-appear in mineral analyses as there is getting to be a better quantification of the water that really was in the mineral. Water by difference can be troublesome, especially when you have significant quantities of elements which commonly exist in several oxidation states such as Fe. In short, EDS doesn't measure water. If water isn't determined directly, water calculated by difference from the chemicals which are measured directly can be tricky. If you have a hydrated carbonate, you could be doomed. Calculating two components by difference would be voodoo mineralogy. The IMA felt that calculating water by difference, by itself, was voodoo mineralogy and banned the practice for many years. The world champion mineral to pass through the process was whitmoreite. Paulus (at that time Paul) Moore established the chemical formula of whitmoreite from a priori reasoning of the crystal structure. The chemical formula was completely derived from the crystal structure of an unknown chemical compound. To be sure, he had enough clues to make life easier, but he determined all atoms by their scattering factors and bond lengths. In the course of my researching mineral history, I discovered a neat bit of history. In the early 1860's, there was quite a bit of controversy concerning the role of hydroxyl and fluorine in minerals and there were flame wars in print over amblygonite and montebrasite. After that died down, the was a new flurry concerning triplite and triploidite. No real flame wars this time. By 1894 and many papers on the chemistry of herderite, again no real flame wars, but lots of controversy, the role of hydroxyl in minerals was satisfactorily established and the new species "hydroherderite" was established. There were three episodes involving phosphates to establish the concept. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 07:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Thu Feb 20 07:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education! In-Reply-To: <004301c2d77a$6bb80840$59053c44@rome01.tn.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20030220152840.36856.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> Dave, Being in Rome, Ga you are in a prime mineral and rock hunting location. I was part of the Georgia mineral Club that meets in Atlanta for many years when i was a kid. My grandmother took me to the meetings and the hunts (Mary Stover) and becasue of that I got a degree in Geophysics. I live in houston now but make my way back to the Georgia hills. Two resources for you if you have not used thme yet. There is a Mineal museum on I-75 north The Wyman(sp) Mineral Museum, you will see the brosn sign along I-75. The museum will show amny of the states treasures. next is the Club web site found at http://www.gamineral.org/ This picture site is great. http://www.gamineral.org/ft-photo_page-frame-main.htm Check out hackneys farm and somewhere in there are garnets the size of cannonballs. I envy you beign so close to the collecting and those beautifal N. GA hills Stephen Stover --- Dave West wrote: > Dear List members, > I signed onto this list in November of last year > hoping to "pick up some jewels and nuggets of > knowledge". Being new (about a year) to the world > of rocks and minerals, every discussion is a > treasure chest that opens before my eyes and ears. > Between rare opportunities to attend my local club > meeting, conversations with a geologist friend and > another friend who owns a drilling company, I learn > a lot by listening. Filed guides, magazines, > internet also assist me in replacing my ignorance > with knowledge. But I have to say in the past few > months, I have found this list to be a Ph. D. > program. As I lurk and read I discover tidbits that > open more and more doors for my exploration. So, > thanks, everyone. I am having a ball! Back to my > lurking mode. > PS....In real life, I am a Pastor of a Baptist > church in Rome, Georgia. > Dave > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 07:51:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Thu Feb 20 07:51:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education! References: <20030220152840.36856.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E54F956.000023.00988@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Hi Stephen: (and Dave)=0D I never met your mother but I have been a member of the Georgia Minera= l Society for about 15 years. Thanks for the plug on our website. It's a gr= eat place to visit! =0D The gem and mineral museum you mentioned is the Weinman Mineral Museum = in Cartersville, GA. The director and curator is Jose Santamaria who is a member of the Ga Mineral Society as well as the Rome club. Dave: you may want to stop by and talk to Jose about the local Rome club, but it sounds like you may already be a member there.=0D Stephen, as you mentioned, Hackney's Farm, in Blue Ridge, GA has our st= ate mineral: staurolite, in abundance. =0D The place for grapefruit size garnets is in Epworth, GA and is on private property. As members of the Ga Mineral Society, we're allowed to dig up t= his farmer's field once a year in the Spring. A friend of mine found a single garnet that weighed 9.75 pounds! =0D It's a wonderful hobby, full of fun facts to know and tell. When I star= ted I didn't know a rock from a hard place. Now I give lectures all over the Southeast!=0D =0D All the best,=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:29:11 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education!=0D =0D Dave,=0D =0D Being in Rome, Ga you are in a prime mineral and rock=0D hunting location. I was part of the Georgia mineral=0D Club that meets in Atlanta for many years when i was a=0D kid. My grandmother took me to the meetings and the=0D hunts (Mary Stover) and becasue of that I got a degree=0D in Geophysics. I live in houston now but make my way=0D back to the Georgia hills.=0D =0D Two resources for you if you have not used thme yet. =0D There is a Mineal museum on I-75 north The Wyman(sp)=0D Mineral Museum, you will see the brosn sign along=0D I-75. The museum will show amny of the states=0D treasures.=0D =0D next is the Club web site found at=0D =0D http://www.gamineral.org/=0D =0D This picture site is great.=0D http://www.gamineral.org/ft-photo_page-frame-main.htm=0D =0D Check out hackneys farm and somewhere in there are=0D garnets the size of cannonballs.=0D =0D I envy you beign so close to the collecting and those=0D beautifal N. GA hills=0D =0D =0D Stephen Stover=0D =0D =0D --- Dave West wrote:=0D > Dear List members,=0D > I signed onto this list in November of last year=0D > hoping to "pick up some jewels and nuggets of=0D > knowledge". Being new (about a year) to the world=0D > of rocks and minerals, every discussion is a=0D > treasure chest that opens before my eyes and ears. =0D > Between rare opportunities to attend my local club=0D > meeting, conversations with a geologist friend and=0D > another friend who owns a drilling company, I learn=0D > a lot by listening. Filed guides, magazines,=0D > internet also assist me in replacing my ignorance=0D > with knowledge. But I have to say in the past few=0D > months, I have found this list to be a Ph. D.=0D > program. As I lurk and read I discover tidbits that=0D > open more and more doors for my exploration. So,=0D > thanks, everyone. I am having a ball! Back to my=0D > lurking mode.=0D > PS....In real life, I am a Pastor of a Baptist=0D > church in Rome, Georgia. =0D > Dave=0D > =0D > =0D > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D > multipart/alternative=0D > text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D > text/html=0D > ---=0D > _______________________________________________=0D > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > Subscription Services:=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =0D =0D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0D Stephen F. Stover=0D PH (713) 829-1102=0D xossfs@yahoo.com=0D =0D Wanting to hunt rocks =0D and play games every day!=0D =0D __________________________________________________=0D Do you Yahoo!?=0D Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more=0D http://taxes.yahoo.com/=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 08:07:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Thu Feb 20 08:07:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education! References: <20030220152840.36856.qmail@web20006.mail.yahoo.com> <3E54F956.000023.00988@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: <3E54FD01.310FF616@cox.net> Anita, Now that is an impressive Web Site. Thank you so very much for the link. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 10:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (earl verbeek) Date: Thu Feb 20 10:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale Message-ID: > My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and other >interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in them? > Here's a possible suggestion: I've been corresponding with a geologist up near Amarillo who runs a program for Webelos and Boy Scouts--hundreds of them. Apparently he scatters rocks and minerals all over the ground and has the scouts search for them, and then identify what they've got, which they can keep. He also gives out prizes of some of the better minerals for correct identifications. Sounds like a good program to me, and he's always looking for more material to put out there for the scouts. If you'd like his contact information I'd be glad to supply it--I assume from your e-mail address that you're both in the same state (though Amarillo and Houston are still far apart; I've driven it quite a few times). Cheers- Earl Verbeek Curator, Thomas S. Warren Museum of Fluorescence Ogdensburg, New Jersey _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 15:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dave Guin) Date: Thu Feb 20 15:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Ad new Petrified Wood Book References: <1d3.1fb05c4.2b75ff2a@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E556377.1040005@earthlink.net> Cycadwood@aol.com wrote: >Greetings list members: >Being in the publishing business, I picked up some extra copies of the new >book called "Secrets of Petrified Plants" by Ulrich Dernbach, Ruth Stockey, >William Tidwell, Walt Wright, and others. > My copy arrived today. It is gorgeous and the info in it is top rate! Allow this to serve as my highest recomendation. Peace, dave From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 15:39:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Thu Feb 20 15:39:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? Message-ID: <1d5.34b4fb6.2b86c0d6@aol.com> Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae are not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic di-acid). C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the former and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or even C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the structure, while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that does not exist for this molecule. Just my 2 cents Gene Hartstein In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, morningstar@att.net writes: > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 16:45:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Mike Flannigan) Date: Thu Feb 20 16:45:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Nondeliverable mail References: <0a95c1535001523MCIS-03@mail.houston.rr.com> Message-ID: <3E5576A4.7907A487@earthlink.net> I'm sure you guys have figured this out by now, but both the phone number and e-mail address are defunct. Mike postmaster@houston.rr.com wrote: > ------Transcript of session follows ------- > vernon1@houston.rr.com > The user's email name is not found. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale > Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:35:32 -0600 > To: vernon1@houston.rr.com > References: <04ac12006031423MCIS-09@mail.houston.rr.com> > > Trying again, since the first one bounced: > > > > > Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale > > Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 21:04:55 -0600 > > From: Mike Flannigan > > Organization: Southwestern Bell Internet Services > > To: vernon1@houston.rr.com > > References: <20030220020003.31417.97429.Mailman@bubbleator.drizzle.com> > > > > You might consider giving it to one of the local rock clubs. > > I am in Clear Lake, near where Middlebrook and FM2351 > > come together. Where are you in Houston? > > > > This club has a rock show this weekend: > > http://www.ghgcorp.com/gpenning/annual.htm > > > > http://www.hgms.org/ > > > > Mike Flannigan > > > > > From: "Vernon Hagan" > > > To: > > > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 23:01:22 -0600 > > > Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale > > > Reply-To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > > > > > My deceased father in law left a small collection of geodes and = > > > other interesting rocks. Do you know of/if anyone would be interested in = > > > them? > > > > > > phone 281-424-5684 or email > > > > > > vernon > > > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 19:14:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Thu Feb 20 19:14:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad new Quartz and Petrified Wood Books Message-ID: <6.abd6e51.2b86f36e@aol.com> In a message dated 2/20/2003 7:53:00 PM Mountain Standard Time,=20 dguin@earthlink.net writes: > My copy arrived today. It is gorgeous and the info in it is top rate!=20 > Allow this to serve as my highest recommendation. >=20 > Peace, > dave >=20 *****Okay Dave likes the new book on fossil woods and so do I. That's why I=20 got some extras to distribute. I also think the new book on Quartz is a grea= t=20 book. Both are of limited printings and both are in hard cover. I was told=20 that there are only 2,000 English versions of the fossil wood book and only=20 1,000 hard cover copies of the quartz book. I definitely want one of each in= =20 my library. I can accept payment through Visa/MasterCard, PayPal, or a check= .=20 Information on each book follows. Sorry about the repeated post but I=20 neglected to include payment information.=20 NEW RELEASE:=A0 Quartz: decoding messages from inside the earth. Hot off the= =20 presses. I was able to get several extra copies of this first edition,=20 limited edition (only 1,000 hard cover copies printed) lovely and interestin= g=20 new book. Written by Harold Dibble, copyrighted in 2002, and just printed=20 last month. Here is how it reads on the inside flap of the dust jacket: "Thi= s=20 book breaks new ground in several ways. The internal structure of quartz=20 crystals are covered as well as its external forms. It describes many forms=20 of quartz crystals that have not been covered in previous books. The CD,=20 which is included, is an educational tool beyond anything that has been used= =20 before. It clearly illustrates the internal atomic arrangements and growth=20 mechanisms in a manner that the two-dimensional pages of a book cannot. The=20 specimens used in the book were not selected merely for their beauty, but fo= r=20 their unique qualities." The 178 photographs are very well done by such=20 top-notch photographers as Jeff Scovil and Rainer Bode. The format is 8 =BD=20= by=20 11 with 100 pages plus the Java Applet CD. List price is $55.00. My price is= =20 $47.50 plus $3 S/H. NEW RELEASE: "Secrets of Petrified Plants" by Ulrich Dernbach, Ruth Stockey,= =20 William Tidwell, Walt Wright, and others. It is a large format, hard cover=20 book of 231 pages in full color with many photographs of fossil wood from=20 worldwide locations. Chapters include discussions of ferns, Psaronius,=20 Osmunda, Chinle woods, Tempskya, cones, conifers, cycads, Hermanophyton, and= =20 many other woods. I recommend this book to all petrified wood enthusiasts.=20 The list price is $79.00 but I am selling it for $75.00 plus $4.00 for mail.= =20 It weighs three and a half pounds! I can accept PayPal, Visa/MasterCard, or=20= a=20 check.=20 Thanks, Frank Frank J. Daniels, publisher Western Colorado Publishing Company 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81503-9522 (970) 242-5255 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 19:22:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dennis Bomke) Date: Thu Feb 20 19:22:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Ad new Petrified Wood Book References: <1d3.1fb05c4.2b75ff2a@aol.com> <3E556377.1040005@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <010e01c2d958$81e5b6a0$63f2dd0c@PAVILION> I will second that. I received my copy and it is an excellent resource. Dennis ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Guin" To: Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2003 5:23 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Ad new Petrified Wood Book > Cycadwood@aol.com wrote: > > >Greetings list members: > >Being in the publishing business, I picked up some extra copies of the new > >book called "Secrets of Petrified Plants" by Ulrich Dernbach, Ruth Stockey, > >William Tidwell, Walt Wright, and others. > > > My copy arrived today. It is gorgeous and the info in it is top rate! > Allow this to serve as my highest recomendation. > > Peace, > dave > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 20 20:40:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Thu Feb 20 20:40:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <1d5.34b4fb6.2b86c0d6@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E55AE9E.4562AE88@att.net> FOSSILNUT@aol.com wrote: > > Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae are > not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic di-acid). > C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the former > and 5 in the latter). Go ahead and be pedantic--I'm after the truth, not coddling. And remember you are talking to the person who can win a contest for being insufferably nitpicky. I had a feeling, after digesting the readings, that the style (COOH)2 would necessarily be correct because it reflects the organic nature of the polyatomic anion, something that strict mineralogists apparently dislike categorically (organic minerals, that is). We'll save that debate for another time and place, but as far as I'm concerned, if it didn't pop out of my urinary tract, and it was formed through entirely environmental processes, I like it well enough. [brief time lapse] Of course I've been buying all these ponderous used books and I should read them. So, armed with the structural params, I'm taking a look at "The International Tables for X-Ray Crystallography," and I get a sense of the form. I'm still over my head, but now I can point to something and say "this is the thing I need to understand." Thanks to everyone who answered some part of my byzantine question. This gives me a better direction to follow. It will be a great learning experience, even if these odd items turn out to be nothing. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 03:05:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Feb 21 03:05:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <1d5.34b4fb6.2b86c0d6@aol.com> Message-ID: <006c01c2d999$1e536240$95ab77d5@pandora.be> Roughly O O - H \ / C - C / \ H - O O Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:37 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? | Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae are | not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic di-acid). | C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the former | and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or even | C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the structure, | while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that does | not exist for this molecule. | Just my 2 cents | | Gene Hartstein | | In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, | morningstar@att.net writes: | | > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. | | | | --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- | multipart/alternative | text/plain (text body -- kept) | text/html | --- | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 03:36:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Feb 21 03:36:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <1d5.34b4fb6.2b86c0d6@aol.com> <006c01c2d999$1e536240$95ab77d5@pandora.be> Message-ID: <007b01c2d99d$93a433e0$95ab77d5@pandora.be> Actually more like. Sorry, I forgot the double bonds... ;-))))) | | O O - H | \\ / | C - C | / \\ | H - O O | | | Axel Emmermann | Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen | Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties | Home : Lobbesplein 12 | B-2640 Mortsel | Belgium | Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 | E-mail: | axel.emmermann@pandora.be | Visit our homepage: | http://www.minerant.org/index.html | Bezoek onze web-site: | http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html | My own web-site: | http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm | ----- Original Message ----- | From: | To: | Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:37 AM | Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? | | | | Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae | are | | not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic | di-acid). | | C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the | former | | and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or even | | C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the structure, | | while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that does | | not exist for this molecule. | | Just my 2 cents | | | | Gene Hartstein | | | | In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, | | morningstar@att.net writes: | | | | > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. | | | | | | | | --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- | | multipart/alternative | | text/plain (text body -- kept) | | text/html | | --- | | _______________________________________________ | | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | | Subscription Services: | | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | | | | | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 06:06:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 21 06:06:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] rocks for sale Message-ID: Alternatively, you may wish to ask one of your father's friends if there are any specimens which have value. Lots of opportunities could have come forward, including outright gifts. I had a friend give away a $35,000 micromount collection because he told his son the specimens had no value. One way to distribute a small estate is to ask the local club to auction off the collection. I know of a different estate where some collecting "buddies" gave the widow $1,000 for what was probably $50,000 worth of minerals. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 06:15:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 21 06:15:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] opportunity: encore spindle stage class with Dr. F.D. Bloss Message-ID: <180.169dc4de.2b878e58@aol.com> Is there any chance that you could videotape the class? Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 06:52:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 21 06:52:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] opportunity: encore spindle stage class with Dr. F.D. Bloss Message-ID: <200302211451.h1LEpsuv003281@bubbleator.drizzle.com> I was thinking about that. I am guessing that McCrone wouldn't allow it, but I'll ask. I don't have a video camera (yes, I have 7 microscopes, but no video camera and no DVD player). I'd need to borrow a video camera and 24 hrs. of video tape (3 days x @8 hrs. = 24 class hrs.) I'm hoping they give out some class materials, in which case I can provide you that. Don > Is there any chance that you could videotape the class? > > Van > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 08:09:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Fri Feb 21 08:09:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education! In-Reply-To: <3E54F956.000023.00988@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: <20030221160759.64140.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> Some of the old timers maybe will remember Mary Stover, ask Kim Cohran the next time you see him. She now lives in anursing home in Dahlonga and my favorite place is a closed site called Withalocochee river. Wwent there when I was a boy and loved it. --- Anita Westlake wrote: > Hi Stephen: (and Dave) > I never met your mother but I have been a member > of the Georgia Mineral > Society for about 15 years. Thanks for the plug on > our website. It's a great > place to visit! > The gem and mineral museum you mentioned is the > Weinman Mineral Museum in > Cartersville, GA. The director and curator is Jose > Santamaria who is a > member of the Ga Mineral Society as well as the Rome > club. Dave: you may > want to stop by and talk to Jose about the local > Rome club, but it sounds > like you may already be a member there. > Stephen, as you mentioned, Hackney's Farm, in Blue > Ridge, GA has our state > mineral: staurolite, in abundance. > The place for grapefruit size garnets is in Epworth, > GA and is on private > property. As members of the Ga Mineral Society, > we're allowed to dig up this > farmer's field once a year in the Spring. A friend > of mine found a single > garnet that weighed 9.75 pounds! > It's a wonderful hobby, full of fun facts to know > and tell. When I started > I didn't know a rock from a hard place. Now I give > lectures all over the > Southeast! > > All the best, > > Anita > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Date: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:29:11 AM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing > education! > > Dave, > > Being in Rome, Ga you are in a prime mineral and > rock > hunting location. I was part of the Georgia mineral > Club that meets in Atlanta for many years when i was > a > kid. My grandmother took me to the meetings and the > hunts (Mary Stover) and becasue of that I got a > degree > in Geophysics. I live in houston now but make my way > back to the Georgia hills. > > Two resources for you if you have not used thme yet. > > There is a Mineal museum on I-75 north The Wyman(sp) > Mineral Museum, you will see the brosn sign along > I-75. The museum will show amny of the states > treasures. > > next is the Club web site found at > > http://www.gamineral.org/ > > This picture site is great. > http://www.gamineral.org/ft-photo_page-frame-main.htm > > Check out hackneys farm and somewhere in there are > garnets the size of cannonballs. > > I envy you beign so close to the collecting and > those > beautifal N. GA hills > > > Stephen Stover > > > --- Dave West wrote: > > Dear List members, > > I signed onto this list in November of last year > > hoping to "pick up some jewels and nuggets of > > knowledge". Being new (about a year) to the world > > of rocks and minerals, every discussion is a > > treasure chest that opens before my eyes and ears. > > > Between rare opportunities to attend my local club > > meeting, conversations with a geologist friend and > > another friend who owns a drilling company, I > learn > > a lot by listening. Filed guides, magazines, > > internet also assist me in replacing my ignorance > > with knowledge. But I have to say in the past few > > months, I have found this list to be a Ph. D. > > program. As I lurk and read I discover tidbits > that > > open more and more doors for my exploration. So, > > thanks, everyone. I am having a ball! Back to my > > lurking mode. > > PS....In real life, I am a Pastor of a Baptist > > church in Rome, Georgia. > > Dave > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > ===== > Stephen F. Stover > PH (713) 829-1102 > xossfs@yahoo.com > > Wanting to hunt rocks > and play games every day! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > . > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/related > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > image/gif > image/jpeg > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 10:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Fri Feb 21 10:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA References: <20030221160759.64140.qmail@web20004.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E5673FD.00002E.01192@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite place of all time. I was ab= le to collect there about 4 times before the place was closed off. Here's my story from that special place:=0D =0D One day I was standing in the middle of the river, bending over and feeli= ng around in the dark water for coral heads. It was always kind of creepy collecting this way because you never knew what you'd touch. Sometimes ev= en after you touched it, you didn't know what you'd touched! I had heard of = the occasional alligator swimming by (but had never seen one) and as I stood contemplating dangerous wildlife (including irate Southern sheriffs) I sa= w=20 a water moccasin glide by up river. It was exciting and frightening at th= e same time. =0D =0D Anyway, I got my hands around a nice sized coral and pulled it out of the murky black water. It had a hole in it the size of an egg. I held the pie= ce over my shoulders and shook it to dump the water and sand out of the hea= d. With it came a small fish. It fell out of the coral and went straight dow= n the front of my shirt. I didn't know whether to drop the coral head, scre= am, laugh, or dislodge the fish. I did the last three. Lord knows I wasn't ab= out to let go of that coral. Turns out, it was the best piece of agatized cor= al I ever found, before or since. I always get a kick out of telling the sto= ry whenever I show that piece. My skin still crawls just a little bit when I think of that poor, frightened fish swimming around in my shirt.=0D =0D By the way, this is a true story; not a fish tale!=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Friday, February 21, 2003 11:09:16 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing education!=0D =0D Some of the old timers maybe will remember Mary=0D Stover, ask Kim Cohran the next time you see him. She=0D now lives in anursing home in Dahlonga and my favorite=0D place is a closed site called Withalocochee river. =0D Wwent there when I was a boy and loved it.=0D =0D =0D --- Anita Westlake wrote:=0D > Hi Stephen: (and Dave)=0D > I never met your mother but I have been a member=0D > of the Georgia Mineral=0D > Society for about 15 years. Thanks for the plug on=0D > our website. It's a great=0D > place to visit! =0D > The gem and mineral museum you mentioned is the=0D > Weinman Mineral Museum in=0D > Cartersville, GA. The director and curator is Jose=0D > Santamaria who is a=0D > member of the Ga Mineral Society as well as the Rome=0D > club. Dave: you may=0D > want to stop by and talk to Jose about the local=0D > Rome club, but it sounds=0D > like you may already be a member there.=0D > Stephen, as you mentioned, Hackney's Farm, in Blue=0D > Ridge, GA has our state=0D > mineral: staurolite, in abundance. =0D > The place for grapefruit size garnets is in Epworth,=0D > GA and is on private=0D > property. As members of the Ga Mineral Society,=0D > we're allowed to dig up this=0D > farmer's field once a year in the Spring. A friend=0D > of mine found a single=0D > garnet that weighed 9.75 pounds! =0D > It's a wonderful hobby, full of fun facts to know=0D > and tell. When I started=0D > I didn't know a rock from a hard place. Now I give=0D > lectures all over the=0D > Southeast!=0D > =0D > All the best,=0D > =0D > Anita=0D > =0D > =0D > -------Original Message-------=0D > =0D > From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D > Date: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:29:11 AM=0D > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanks for my ongoing=0D > education!=0D > =0D > Dave,=0D > =0D > Being in Rome, Ga you are in a prime mineral and=0D > rock=0D > hunting location. I was part of the Georgia mineral=0D > Club that meets in Atlanta for many years when i was=0D > a=0D > kid. My grandmother took me to the meetings and the=0D > hunts (Mary Stover) and becasue of that I got a=0D > degree=0D > in Geophysics. I live in houston now but make my way=0D > back to the Georgia hills.=0D > =0D > Two resources for you if you have not used thme yet.=0D > =0D > There is a Mineal museum on I-75 north The Wyman(sp)=0D > Mineral Museum, you will see the brosn sign along=0D > I-75. The museum will show amny of the states=0D > treasures.=0D > =0D > next is the Club web site found at=0D > =0D > http://www.gamineral.org/=0D > =0D > This picture site is great.=0D >=0D http://www.gamineral.org/ft-photo_page-frame-main.htm=0D > =0D > Check out hackneys farm and somewhere in there are=0D > garnets the size of cannonballs.=0D > =0D > I envy you beign so close to the collecting and=0D > those=0D > beautifal N. GA hills=0D > =0D > =0D > Stephen Stover=0D > =0D > =0D > --- Dave West wrote:=0D > > Dear List members,=0D > > I signed onto this list in November of last year=0D > > hoping to "pick up some jewels and nuggets of=0D > > knowledge". Being new (about a year) to the world=0D > > of rocks and minerals, every discussion is a=0D > > treasure chest that opens before my eyes and ears.=0D > =0D > > Between rare opportunities to attend my local club=0D > > meeting, conversations with a geologist friend and=0D > > another friend who owns a drilling company, I=0D > learn=0D > > a lot by listening. Filed guides, magazines,=0D > > internet also assist me in replacing my ignorance=0D > > with knowledge. But I have to say in the past few=0D > > months, I have found this list to be a Ph. D.=0D > > program. As I lurk and read I discover tidbits=0D > that=0D > > open more and more doors for my exploration. So,=0D > > thanks, everyone. I am having a ball! Back to my=0D > > lurking mode.=0D > > PS....In real life, I am a Pastor of a Baptist=0D > > church in Rome, Georgia. =0D > > Dave=0D > > =0D > > =0D > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D > > multipart/alternative=0D > > text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D > > text/html=0D > > ---=0D > > _______________________________________________=0D > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > > Subscription Services:=0D > >=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D > =0D > =0D > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0D > Stephen F. Stover=0D > PH (713) 829-1102=0D > xossfs@yahoo.com=0D > =0D > Wanting to hunt rocks =0D > and play games every day!=0D > =0D > __________________________________________________=0D > Do you Yahoo!?=0D > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more=0D > http://taxes.yahoo.com/=0D > _______________________________________________=0D > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > Subscription Services:=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D > . =0D > =0D > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D > multipart/related=0D > multipart/alternative=0D > text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D > text/html=0D > image/gif=0D > image/jpeg=0D > ---=0D > _______________________________________________=0D > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > Subscription Services:=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =0D =0D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0D Stephen F. Stover=0D PH (713) 829-1102=0D xossfs@yahoo.com=0D =0D Wanting to hunt rocks =0D and play games every day!=0D =0D __________________________________________________=0D Do you Yahoo!?=0D Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more=0D http://taxes.yahoo.com/=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 11:47:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Fri Feb 21 11:47:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? Message-ID: <1BBD9E3C.707424AD.02180873@aol.com> Ok. Didn't think you could draw a structure without a drawing program. Wow.... Can you do Benznathrone (organic chicken wire)? ;-) Gene In a message dated 2/21/2003 8:37:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, "Axel Emmermann" writes: >Actually more like. >Sorry, I forgot the double bonds... ;-))))) >| >|       O           O - H >|          \\         / >|           C - C >|          /        \\ >| H - O          O >| >| >| Axel Emmermann >| Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen >| Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties >| Home : Lobbesplein 12 >|             B-2640 Mortsel >|             Belgium >| Tel:      +32 (0)3 295.35.54 >| E-mail: >| axel.emmermann@pandora.be >| Visit our homepage: >| http://www.minerant.org/index.html >| Bezoek onze web-site: >| http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html >| My own web-site: >| http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm >| ----- Original Message ----- >| From: >| To: >| Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:37 AM >| Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? >| >| >| | Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae >| are >| | not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic >| di-acid). >| | C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the >| former >| | and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or even >| | C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the >structure, >| | while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that >does >| | not exist for this molecule. >| | Just my 2 cents >| | >| | Gene Hartstein >| | >| | In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, >| | morningstar@att.net writes: >| | >| | > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. >| | >| | >| | >| | --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >| | multipart/alternative >| |   text/plain (text body -- kept) >| |   text/html >| | --- >| | _______________________________________________ >| | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >| | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >| | Subscription Services: >| | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >| | >| >| >| _______________________________________________ >| Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >| WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >| Subscription Services: >| http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >| > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 11:56:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Cathy Gaber) Date: Fri Feb 21 11:56:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] spelling Message-ID: <200302211955.h1LJtqt28840@mail.his.com> Dear Rockhounds: asterated or asteriated? Thanks, Caty From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 12:01:09 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Henry Barwood) Date: Fri Feb 21 12:01:09 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA In-Reply-To: <3E5673FD.00002E.01192@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: Anita Westlake wrote: > Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite place of all time. I > was able to collect there about 4 times before the place was closed Pardon my ignorance, but what happened to this locality? I remember years ago there would be regular trips there. If it is in the bottom of the river, I would assume you could boat down and collect. Thanks. Henry Barwood From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 12:27:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (William S. Cordua) Date: Fri Feb 21 12:27:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] spelling In-Reply-To: <200302211955.h1LJtqt28840@mail.his.com> Message-ID: >Dear Rockhounds: > >asterated or asteriated? > >Thanks, Caty My glossary of geology says "asteriated". I'd have guessed the opposite. Shows what I know. Best wishes - Bill C. Dr. William S. Cordua Professor of Geology/Mineralogy University of Wisconsin - River Falls 410 South Third Street River Falls, WI 54022 715-425-3139 william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu "Speak to the Earth and it shall teach thee" - Job 12:8 From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 13:17:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Feb 21 13:17:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <1BBD9E3C.707424AD.02180873@aol.com> Message-ID: <003b01c2d9ee$b02bcea0$d29e77d5@pandora.be> I know... we Belgians are a crazy lot... If you remove the spacings and tabs from my structure-formula it kinda looks like a drooling roadkill on marihuana... Wow, even I didn't know I could do that! Cheers Gene 8

To: Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 8:45 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? | Ok. Didn't think you could draw a structure without a drawing program. Wow.... Can you do Benznathrone (organic chicken wire)? | | ;-) | | Gene | | | In a message dated 2/21/2003 8:37:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, "Axel Emmermann" writes: | | >Actually more like. | >Sorry, I forgot the double bonds... ;-))))) | >| | >| O O - H | >| \\ / | >| C - C | >| / \\ | >| H - O O | >| | >| | >| Axel Emmermann | >| Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen | >| Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties | >| Home : Lobbesplein 12 | >| B-2640 Mortsel | >| Belgium | >| Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 | >| E-mail: | >| axel.emmermann@pandora.be | >| Visit our homepage: | >| http://www.minerant.org/index.html | >| Bezoek onze web-site: | >| http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html | >| My own web-site: | >| http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm | >| ----- Original Message ----- | >| From: | >| To: | >| Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:37 AM | >| Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? | >| | >| | >| | Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 formulae | >| are | >| | not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic | >| di-acid). | >| | C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in the | >| former | >| | and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or even | >| | C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the | >structure, | >| | while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that | >does | >| | not exist for this molecule. | >| | Just my 2 cents | >| | | >| | Gene Hartstein | >| | | >| | In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, | >| | morningstar@att.net writes: | >| | | >| | > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. | >| | | >| | | >| | | >| | --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- | >| | multipart/alternative | >| | text/plain (text body -- kept) | >| | text/html | >| | --- | >| | _______________________________________________ | >| | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | >| | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | >| | Subscription Services: | >| | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | >| | | >| | >| | >| _______________________________________________ | >| Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | >| WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | >| Subscription Services: | >| http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | >| | > | > | >_______________________________________________ | >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | >Subscription Services: | >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | > | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 14:48:47 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dri) Date: Fri Feb 21 14:48:47 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding Message-ID: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Hi: My companion and I are newbie/novice Rockhounders. I am posting to find out if there are Rockhounders from the Puget Sound area on this List? I would love to make contact with them as local sources, specifically individuals, are the best teachers there are. I have downloaded the Washington Rockhounders places to go Data Base. One of the sites I wish to visit, after the snows are no longer plauging Snoqualmie pass and before the summer weather becomes hot (warm to a transplanted Texan such as I) is First Creek in Kittitas County. So, to start with is, I would like information from any WA Rockhounders who have experienced this location. Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 16:44:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Feb 21 16:44:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] spelling References: <200302211955.h1LJtqt28840@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <3E56C7A1.28A1@Tomaszewski.net> Cathy Gaber wrote: > > Dear Rockhounds: > > asterated or asteriated? http://www.dictionary.com says no words found for asterated but hinted with asteriated, that had three hits. But when you look it up online you miss the fun of reading all the other words on that page of the dictionary. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 16:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Fri Feb 21 16:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding In-Reply-To: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: First creek is a good late-spring destination. However, the last time I went, it took quite a bit of work to find anything worthwhile. Much of the soil along the road has been pretty well-picked over. If you move up the sides of the mountain, you might have better luck. YMMV. When you're over that way, hit Red Top while you are at it. Good camping spots, nice view, okay agates. For novices, a trip up to Walker Valley (Skagit County) is always fun. It takes heavy tools and a lot of digging to work the cliff, but there's always cool stuff in the talus slope just waiting to be picked up. afox > Hi: > My companion and I are newbie/novice Rockhounders. > I am posting to find out if there are Rockhounders from the Puget Sound area > on this List? I would love to make contact with them as local sources, > specifically individuals, are the best teachers there are. > I have downloaded the Washington Rockhounders places to go Data Base. > One of the sites I wish to visit, after the snows are no longer plauging > Snoqualmie pass and before the summer weather becomes hot (warm to a > transplanted Texan such as I) is First Creek in Kittitas County. So, to > start with is, I would like information from any WA Rockhounders who have > experienced this location. > Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > -- afox@drizzle.com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox GnuPG Public Key Available upon Request "Disinformation is not as good as datinformation..." From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 17:11:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Fri Feb 21 17:11:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] spelling In-Reply-To: <200302211955.h1LJtqt28840@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030221152319.0292cec0@mail.aloha.net> At 09:48 AM 2/21/2003, you wrote: >Dear Rockhounds: > >asterated or asteriated? > >Thanks, Caty Not to be picky, but: Caty or Cathy? Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 17:13:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Fri Feb 21 17:13:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It is still a major canoing river so I don't see why you couldn't collect there. A lot of people put in near Valdosta GA and run down to the Suwanee in Florida. Bryan "Si vis pacem para bellum" > > > Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite place of all time. I > > was able to collect there about 4 times before the place was closed > > Pardon my ignorance, but what happened to this locality? I remember years > ago there would be regular trips there. If it is in the bottom of > the river, > I would assume you could boat down and collect. Thanks. > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 17:31:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tim Jokela) Date: Fri Feb 21 17:31:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] ad: ten lovely barites References: <200301212023.h0LKNSB25138@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <001401c2da12$88cd0800$4204efd1@oemcomputer> Fans of BaSO4 should check out http://www.element51.com/update.june21.htm. I've just posted ten particularly beautiful barite specimens. All are top display quality pieces, carefully selected by a collector with excellent taste, and this is only a fifth of the collection. Localities include Cumbria, Kansas, Colorado, Italy, Nevada, Poland, Spain, Germany, and Illinois. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr tjokela@execulink.com http://www.element51.com http://www.ontariominerals.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 18:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Feb 21 18:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? References: <1BBD9E3C.707424AD.02180873@aol.com> <003b01c2d9ee$b02bcea0$d29e77d5@pandora.be> Message-ID: <3E56DF1F.5DEA@Tomaszewski.net> Hhhmmmm, stoned road kill.... Is that one that has baked in the sun so long it is as hard as a fossil? Kreigh Axel Emmermann wrote: > > I know... we Belgians are a crazy lot... > If you remove the spacings and tabs from my structure-formula it kinda looks > like a drooling roadkill on marihuana... > Wow, even I didn't know I could do that! > > Cheers Gene 8

> Axel Emmermann > Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen > Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties > Home : Lobbesplein 12 > B-2640 Mortsel > Belgium > Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 > E-mail: > axel.emmermann@pandora.be > Visit our homepage: > http://www.minerant.org/index.html > Bezoek onze web-site: > http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html > My own web-site: > http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 8:45 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? > > | Ok. Didn't think you could draw a structure without a drawing program. > Wow.... Can you do Benznathrone (organic chicken wire)? > | > | ;-) > | > | Gene > | > | > | In a message dated 2/21/2003 8:37:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, "Axel > Emmermann" writes: > | > | >Actually more like. > | >Sorry, I forgot the double bonds... ;-))))) > | >| > | >| O O - H > | >| \\ / > | >| C - C > | >| / \\ > | >| H - O O > | >| > | >| > | >| Axel Emmermann > | >| Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen > | >| Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties > | >| Home : Lobbesplein 12 > | >| B-2640 Mortsel > | >| Belgium > | >| Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 > | >| E-mail: > | >| axel.emmermann@pandora.be > | >| Visit our homepage: > | >| http://www.minerant.org/index.html > | >| Bezoek onze web-site: > | >| http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html > | >| My own web-site: > | >| http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm > | >| ----- Original Message ----- > | >| From: > | >| To: > | >| Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 12:37 AM > | >| Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] is there a simple test for WHEWELLITE? > | >| > | >| > | >| | Without meaning to be too pedantic, one should note that the 2 > formulae > | >| are > | >| | not equivalent. (COOH)2 is correct (the simplest possible organic > | >| di-acid). > | >| | C2O4*H20 has an extra oxygen that should not be there. (count 4 in > the > | >| former > | >| | and 5 in the latter). I guess you could write oxalic as C2H2O4 or > even > | >| | C203*H2O. The former is literal and tells you nothing about the > | >structure, > | >| | while the latter is numerically correct but suggests a structure that > | >does > | >| | not exist for this molecule. > | >| | Just my 2 cents > | >| | > | >| | Gene Hartstein > | >| | > | >| | In a message dated 2/19/2003 5:19:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, > | >| | morningstar@att.net writes: > | >| | > | >| | > (COOH)2 instead of C2O4 * H2O. > | >| | > | >| | > | >| | > | >| | --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > | >| | multipart/alternative > | >| | text/plain (text body -- kept) > | >| | text/html > | >| | --- > | >| | _______________________________________________ > | >| | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > | >| | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > | >| | Subscription Services: > | >| | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > | >| | > | >| > | >| > | >| _______________________________________________ > | >| Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > | >| WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > | >| Subscription Services: > | >| http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > | >| > | > > | > > | >_______________________________________________ > | >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > | >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > | >Subscription Services: > | >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > | > > | _______________________________________________ > | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > | Subscription Services: > | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > | > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 19:02:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Pete Richards) Date: Fri Feb 21 19:02:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector In-Reply-To: <3E3D44D0.9FFE8DC5@att.net> Message-ID: Tucson is over. The snow is melting quickly. Is it really spring? Pete Richards -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 19:50:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dave West) Date: Fri Feb 21 19:50:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks Again Message-ID: <004801c2da25$51d73a60$59053c44@rome01.tn.comcast.net> Folks, As you can tell I don't always get to pull up my email as regularly as I should. Looking over the comments several of you posted about my area is exciting. Yes, I do belong to the local club which has its annual show coming up next month. Yes, the museum in Cartersville is great and Jose and his wife are super folks that make you feel as if you have know them forever. Currently I am planning my Spring and summer outings. Wow, am I ready to go and dig something up! DaveW --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 21 20:17:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Fri Feb 21 20:17:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector In-Reply-To: References: <3E3D44D0.9FFE8DC5@att.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030221174611.02f68200@mail.aloha.net> At 05:01 PM 2/21/2003, you wrote: >Tucson is over. >The snow is melting quickly. >Is it really spring? > >Pete Richards Snow melt, spring coming, A rockhound who knows haiku. Wonders never cease. Kitty Heacox --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 05:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 22 05:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history Message-ID: Mineral history is still being made in the world, but less and less of it is being preserved in our electronic society. I understand there is now an organization trying to archive electronic data. Future generations will be without photos of their ancestors because there were few hardcopies of digital images and the few actually printed images will have been either printed on easily damaged paper, especially damageable by water, or printed using dyes which will fade before your children grow up enough to ask "What did you look like when you were young?" Same is true of fieldtrip photos. There will come a time when your children will ask you - "What's a CD?" Best Regards, Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 09:06:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sat Feb 22 09:06:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history References: Message-ID: <3E57ADC5.B01FBF8B@cox.net> Van, About media for future generations, couple of thoughts. I was reading the current edition of Costco's magazine. Therein I saw an ad for a Print on Canvas from your digital camera. Guess you could call it print a portrait. I do want to know more about that process and just how stable the end result will be. Next, some years ago we made a wonderful video tape of my parents talking about their life together. We are now planning to copy it to cd or dvd. That will give some additional life to the original. What the next method of storage is to be, who knows. If there is to be a custodian of the visual lineage, perhaps the images will be then copied to the next generation of media. My son has recently asked me to look through the albums passed on to me from my parents and my mother's sister. I need to get a system in place that allows me to transfer these old photos onto cd or dvd media, so they can be shared with my grandsons. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 09:34:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 22 09:34:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Maybe, maybe not. On the personal level, that may be true, fewer printed family photos and no one maintaining the electronic archives, thus historical family photos lost. Could be. Outside of the family photo setting, same problems, but also many advanatages. I am working on books (ebooks) that would never have been published in a paper format because of the economics (too small of a market, thus too few copies would be sold). As an ebook, the books will be longer and have a lot more photos (all in color). Right now, the web is loaded with mineral and rockhound "publications" that would never have been published in any other format. Some of these will survive long term, those that don't, probably wouldn't have been published in any form. PDF files and CD/DVDs will last quite a few years yet. I agree that many "epublications" will not be moved to the next format and will thus be eventually lost, but there are a lot more publications available now than when all we had was paper. Also, according to the data I read, we are printing on more and more pages of paper each year, so perhaps the "epublications" are just a supplement, not a replacement (at least in the midterm). I'll take a printed page over an electronic page any day, but I would rather have an ebook than no book at all! Regards, Lanny >Mineral history is still being made in the world, but less and less of it is >being preserved in our electronic society. I understand there is now an >organization trying to archive electronic data. > >Future generations will be without photos of their ancestors because there >were few hardcopies of digital images and the few actually printed images >will have been either printed on easily damaged paper, especially damageable >by water, or printed using dyes which will fade before your children grow up >enough to ask "What did you look like when you were young?" Same is true of >fieldtrip photos. There will come a time when your children will ask you - >"What's a CD?" > >Best Regards, Van > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Lanny R. Ream - lanny@mineralnews.com - http://www.mineralnews.com Owner/Publisher - LR Ream Publishing Publisher of Mineral News, mineral guidebooks and mineral software: MinDex: the Mineral-Periodical Index and The Mineral Database From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 10:39:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Feb 22 10:39:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector References: Message-ID: <002701c2daa1$cbbdd240$5d9d77d5@pandora.be> | Tucson is over. | The snow is melting quickly. | Is it really spring? Tonight it will be freezing again... maybe it has just sprung? Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pete Richards" To: Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 4:01 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector | Tucson is over. | The snow is melting quickly. | Is it really spring? | | Pete Richards | | -------------------------------------------------------------------- | R. Peter Richards | rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu | | Mineral collector | Crystallographer | SHAPE for the Macintosh | | | _______________________________________________ | Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List | WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds | Subscription Services: | http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds | From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 13:26:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 22 13:26:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector Message-ID: <66.2ee3a9a1.2b8944c1@aol.com> Here the snow is melting a little too quickly. A little over 2 feet of the stuff seems to want to melt in 1 day, along with about 2 inches of rain..... Floods stir up the collecting streams so the goodies are on top of the gravel bars when the water recedes Gene Hartstein Newark, DE In a message dated 2/21/2003 11:17:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, kahako@aloha.net writes: > >Tucson is over. > >The snow is melting quickly. > >Is it really spring? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 16:33:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sat Feb 22 16:33:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history In-Reply-To: <3E57ADC5.B01FBF8B@cox.net> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222190322.00a7e820@mail.charter.net> Teresa Wrote: "Next, some years ago we made a wonderful video tape of my parents talking about their life together. We are now planning to copy it to cd or dvd. That will give some additional life to the original. What the next method of storage is to be, who knows. If there is to be a custodian of the visual lineage, perhaps the images will be then copied to the next generation of media." Probably the safest would be a transcript printed on acid free paper and put in an acid free box. You can still read a 500 year old book and not even need a playback machine. The playback technology is I think going to be the problem. Take screen shots of the video tape, and print them with archival black and white ink on acid free paper and store them with the transcript in a sealed fire proof box or safe. Save it to a dvd today in a certain format and 80years from now, you might not be able to find a suitable player that will play back that format. Hopefully the English language will still be around, or at least someone who can translate it. Digital is great--and I would strongly suggest that you burn them as a dvd (cd technology will be like the 5 1/4" floppy in ten years). The data might still be readable (unlikely for a 5 1/4) but who has a 5 1/4" disc player? "My son has recently asked me to look through the albums passed on to me from my parents and my mother's sister. I need to get a system in place that allows me to transfer these old photos onto cd or dvd media, so they can be shared with my grandsons." dvd is great to "share" but, whatever you do, do not get rid of the originals. And for those special pictures, you may want to get them reprinted (and while doing this, you can get them enhanced or reconstructed) and have them printed archivally. The old ones are probably in black and white or sepia toned anyway. If you have photoshop or equivalent and a good scanner, you can scan the pics in, enhance them, and then send the file to a photo developer that specializes in archival printing. You could then use these same files for sharing. Or you can print them yourself, but make sure to use paper that completely acid free and inks that are archival. And transfer that old VHS to dvd as soon as possible as the life of a VHS tape is not but around 10 years before serious degradation sets in. I think I remember reading that the life of a dvd is about 80-100 years if properly stored. Tommy Armstrong At 09:05 AM 2/22/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Van, >About media for future generations, couple of thoughts. > >I was reading the current edition of Costco's magazine. Therein I saw an >ad for a Print on Canvas from your digital camera. Guess you could call >it print a portrait. I do want to know more about that process and just >how stable the end result will be. > >Next, some years ago we made a wonderful video tape of my parents >talking about their life together. We are now planning to copy it to cd >or dvd. That will give some additional life to the original. What the >next method of storage is to be, who knows. If there is to be a >custodian of the visual lineage, perhaps the images will be then copied >to the next generation of media. > >My son has recently asked me to look through the albums passed on to me >from my parents and my mother's sister. I need to get a system in place >that allows me to transfer these old photos onto cd or dvd media, so >they can be shared with my grandsons. >Teresa > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 16:50:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sat Feb 22 16:50:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222190322.00a7e820@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E581AB5.AAE8AF70@cox.net> Tommy, Thank you very much for some solid suggestions. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 17:27:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sat Feb 22 17:27:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history Message-ID: In a message dated 2/22/03 5:30:52 AM Pacific Standard Time, ANNWB2@aol.com writes: > . There will come a time when your children will ask you - > "What's a CD?" > It is kinda like an 8-track. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 23:10:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Feb 22 23:10:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector In-Reply-To: <002701c2daa1$cbbdd240$5d9d77d5@pandora.be> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222211922.02b494f0@mail.aloha.net> At 08:39 AM 2/22/2003, you wrote: >| Tucson is over. >| The snow is melting quickly. >| Is it really spring? > >Tonight it will be freezing again... >maybe it has just sprung? > >Axel Emmermann Please permit me to translate your response into a haiku: Tonight it will be Freezing again; could it be That spring has just sprung? Aloha, Kitty --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sat Feb 22 23:17:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Feb 22 23:17:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector In-Reply-To: <66.2ee3a9a1.2b8944c1@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222211449.02b493b0@mail.aloha.net> At 11:25 AM 2/22/2003, you wrote: >Here the snow is melting a little too quickly. A little over 2 feet of the >stuff seems to want to melt in 1 day, along with about 2 inches of rain..... > >Floods stir up the collecting streams so the goodies are on top of the gravel >bars when the water recedes > >Gene Hartstein Please let me translate your message into haiku form: Snow melts too quickly; More than two feet melts today With two inches rain. Floods stir collecting Streams; goodies on gravel rise When water recedes. See? You're a poet and don't know it! --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 05:24:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 23 05:24:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <1ab.1147a0ed.2b8a255c@aol.com> There will certainly be electronic format translators as time goes by and new technology is introduced. Data don't seem to get important until it's about to disappear. (Yes, data don't take the singular verb as the word is the plural. Sounds weird though.) Right on about publishing Lanny. We're getting more than ever now. Wish that more clubs would have an historical link with the local historical society. Some mineral clubs have an historian, but when there's a new election of officers, there's sometimes a gap in transfer as some folders just don't seem to be where they should be or the slot remains empty. When there's a sudden loss of a club historian, the family rarely knows where the files were kept and "will let the club know if it turns up." Having worked as a mineral appraiser of many mineral estates over the years, I have been shocked at how poorly the executors have behaved towards mineral collectors in general. The first thing that goes into the trash are the correspondence, fieldtrip notes, club bulletins, meeting notes, magazines including Rocks and Minerals, Mineralogical Record, Matrix, etc. The second thing that goes are relatively undetailed labeled minerals in flats, boxes, or crates, even if they're trading stock. One Brooklyn collector who had a mineral named for him and his son actually collected fossils, had the non-display part of his collection put out to the curbside. Fortunately, local collectors made regular pilgramages and got there before the trash man. The best thing you can do for your collection - of anything, is to make sure someone in your family knows what is "good" and what isn't and there should be some information as to whom to contact to recycle your treasures, especially if you have someone you love who could benefit from the proceeds. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 06:08:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (liz fodi) Date: Sun Feb 23 06:08:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving mineral history References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222190322.00a7e820@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E58D759.9EC08A4F@utoronto.ca> I would add that if digitising use archival quality cds, dvds, pens, jewel boxes etc. For a good reference on factors to consider go to: http://aabc.bc.ca/aabc/newsletter/11_3/bc_archival_preservation_service.htm Liz Fodi Erwin WTP wrote: > > Digital is great--and I would strongly suggest that you burn them as a dvd > (cd technology will be like the 5 1/4" floppy in ten years). The data might > still be readable (unlikely for a 5 1/4) but who has a 5 1/4" disc player? From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 07:17:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Sun Feb 23 07:17:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Equipment for Sale Message-ID: <5.2.0.5.2.20030223071104.014507a8@mail.spiritone.com> GENIE, 12" SAW, 8" TRIM SAW, CABBER, AUTO HOLE DRILLER, TRIM SAW Diamond Pacific Genie: 6" all diamond unit. This machine has been used for approx. 1 year; looks very well kept and the wheels (the most expensive part) have a lot of life left in them; I'd estimate they are 25% or less used. Comes with everything included in the original package from Diamond Pacific: 1/4 Horsepower 1800 RPM Motor Spray Mist Coolant System Two 6" x 1-1/2" Galaxy Wheels: 80 grit and 220 grit Four 6" x 1-1/2" Nova Wheels: 280, 600, 1,200 and 14,000 grit 5-1/2" Treated Canvas Polishing Pad Lamp Magnifier Cab Rest Base for Geyser Coolant Sprayer 50,000 Grit Diamond Compound Four Splash Guards Instruction Manual Saw Attachment: "You can quickly convert your Genie into an 8" saw with the saw attachment. Unscrew the arbor with all the wheels on the right side of the Genie intact and screw in the Saw Attachment arbor and blade. Replace the coolant pan with the one supplied with the Saw Attachment. Now have an 8" saw with a high quality, aggressive MK blade!" Lortone 12" Slab Saw: Automatic feed; almost new high-speed professional MK continuous rim diamond blade (lists for $166 new). These blades ROCK! Set up for high speed operation. Pretty much everything that came with the original saw is still on it; the motor is newer than the saw (saw is 1970s vintage). Vise is a little wobbly (from wear). New bearings, belt, motor switch, feed switch, lid hinge, arbor, and pulleys. I will not ship the stand (it's welded together and way too bulky to ship). Lortone 8" Trim Saw Manual feed vise; set up for normal speed operation. Newer motor and switch. Runs good; never had to monkey with anything. Star Diamond Cabber: All-in-one cabbing unit with EVERYTHING included to get you started! Hardly used! 3 water supply inlets, one for each wheel, expandable drum sander, coarse and fine grit corundum grinding wheels, felt and leather polishing discs, flat sanding disc, trim saw, belt, motor, recirculating filtering water supply. Comes with an extra grinding wheel, many sanding discs, trim saw attachment & blades, leather polishing disc and extra pad, recirculating pump, Beacon Star filtering box, 1/3 HP motor, switch, and mounting brackets. "Pro Carva - Gem Drill" Vintage 1972, hardly used. I don't know much about this but I do have a copy of the one-page manual. I do know it accepts core drills that use carborundum grit as well as diamond drills. It has a cam to operate in automatic mode or it can operate without the cam. There is another pulley for slower applications but it was not with the unit when I bought it. The manual says the head can be tilted and used as a carving tool but I don't know anything about how to do that. The collet for using a carving attachment seems to be included. Includes Allen wrenches and chuck key. 6" Highland Park trim saw With 1/4 HP motor & switch; blade not included. I have it set up to run a high-speed opal trim blade; if you want to use a regular blade just double the size of the pulley on the motor. CLICK THE SITE LINK BELOW FOR PRICING AND PICS! Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! mailto:tim@OreRockOn.com Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 08:01:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 23 08:01:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <1ab.1147a0ed.2b8a255c@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E58F036.882B7903@cox.net> Van, Well said, but easier said than done. Sometime, there is no tomorrow. I have suggested to a Federation they consider digitizing records held in the possession of the historian. If indeed this is say done onto a DVD, then down the line this specific media can be transferred to the next form of storage. I believe this is an issue that needs to be addressed in the US by the AFMS, and in other countries by similar societies. An initial massive task, but once caught up to date, easy to maintain. I love books and continue to collect them, unless I begin to disperse them now they most likely will wind up in a thrift shop. For now I enjoy having them around. A dilemma. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 08:39:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sun Feb 23 08:39:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: <1ab.1147a0ed.2b8a255c@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223104200.00a8e158@mail.charter.net> Van Wrote: At 08:23 AM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >There will certainly be electronic format translators as time goes by and new >technology is introduced. Data don't seem to get important until it's about >to disappear. (Yes, data don't take the singular verb as the word is the >plural. Sounds weird though.) I agree that there will be format translators in the future. My main concept of using paper as the primary source is that the future generations of Teresa will probably not have one of those available--the Smithsonian and university libraries will (at least I hope they will). If data are saved in some kind of database format, it becomes even more problematic when that format falls out of favor. There is a push towards xml now for a kind of universal data exchange format and the standards are published (although constantly evolving), and it does appear that for at least the next decade or two that it is going to become the de facto format. html will probably be around and translatable for a long time--but there are many variations of that also. I'm really thinking long time for valuable family records (and mineral specimens) and therefore believe paper and ink is still the most viable storage media. If you have it in print, later generations can convert it to whatever the format of the future that is then prevalent. Unless there is a total collapse of civilization, an interview printed on paper in any of the major languages will always be translatable by a good number of the population. As for mineral specimens, I see the main problem is keeping the rock and its label(s) together with some sort of system to reliably know that a particular label is indeed to be associated with a particular specimen. And that the label contains enough information to adequately describe the specimen's uniqueness. The rest of info about the mineral can of course be looked up in references. But things like the collector, when collected, exact location, cost, who was the seller etc. cannot. Such info needs to recorded. lat-long info will always be "translatable". Perhaps a good thread would be just what needs to be on a label--we might have covered this round before but I missed it. Don, what fields do you include in your custom database? Which should be included on the label? I had the good fortune to be able to purchase a nice pyromorphite with an old pre-WWII Dr. Pough label. I was really excited and low an behold I lost the label while showing it off to my son in a restaurant. The specimen is still as good as it was, but I sure wish I had not lost that label--one of the main reasons I purchased the specimen in the first place. Tommy Armstrong From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 09:22:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sun Feb 23 09:22:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223104200.00a8e158@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E590457.AE8C7706@att.net> Erwin WTP wrote: > > As for mineral specimens, I see the main problem is keeping the rock and > its label(s) together with some sort of system to reliably know that a > particular label is indeed to be associated with a particular specimen. > > Perhaps a good thread would be just what needs to be on a label--we might > have covered this round before but I missed it. > > Don, what fields do you include in your custom database? Which should be > included on the label? This has been discussed several times. There are best practices for this. First thing: it is not the *label* that needs all that info, it is the *catalog*. The catalog database has something like 60 fields (I'll mail you a copy soon). The label itself need not contain anything more than the specimen number, minerals within, and locality. Example: ------------------------------ TA19283 DOLOMITE, SPHALERITE, GALENA Viburnum Trend Mine, 200' Level, Leadtown, Missouri Tommy Armstrong Collection ------------------------------ The specimen number should be the key to the catalog entry, and a small number should be printed on acid-free paper and affixed to the specimen, if possible, with neutral-pH white glue such as the Lineco brand. You will find older books and articles--and some old-timers--who will propose grand and complex schemes for catalog numbers, including Dana class, Strunz class, year found, etc. This is not only unwieldy but is incomprehensible to anyone who doesn't know the secret code. It is also difficult for anyone acquiring your collection to make sense of what is there, what is missing, and how many specimens you have. A number of curators to whom I have spoken advocate simple numbers and a collection identifier. For private individuals, I recommend initials, hence my specimens start with DJH1 and progress numerically. Ironically, your example of losing the Pough label is a perfect example of why the label should not be the sole source of information for the specimen. I don't know if Dr. Pough kept a catalog, but if he did, and there was a specimen number attached to the specimen, you could contact him and retrieve all the necessary info. Labels become separated and lost. In recent years I have seen two prime collections that were diminished by the fact that the labels were jumbled in one box and the minerals in another! People are free to collect as they wish, and no one is required to do anything with their collection. However, if one wants to consider one's self a serious or advanced collector, having a detailed catalog is an essential step. I would rather by a collection of 100 specimens with detailed documentation than one for the same price containing 1,000 specimens and not one shred of documentation. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 09:27:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sun Feb 23 09:27:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <1ab.1147a0ed.2b8a255c@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E59055A.8B102B2C@att.net> ANNWB2@aol.com wrote: > > The best thing you can do for your collection - of anything, is to make sure > someone in your family knows what is "good" and what isn't and there should > be some information as to whom to contact to recycle your treasures Oh that is so true. I have seen several collections come to a bad end. In addition to having a detailed catalog and a simple numbering system, there should be a will, or at least well-distributed written instructions, describing what should be done with the collection. I have heard that the noted collector Bill Yost spent the last ten days of his life writing down what to do with his collection (if it wasn't Bill, it was another mircromounter who died in the last decade), and that was a noble effort; but I can't help thinking he could have spent his final days more peacefully if he had planned ahead and had that all arranged. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 09:44:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 23 09:44:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <6c.2a7dc767.2b8a6258@aol.com> In a message dated 2/23/2003 12:27:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, morningstar@att.net writes: > ANNWB2@aol.com wrote: > > > > The best thing you can do for your collection - of anything, is to make > sure > > someone in your family knows what is "good" and what isn't and there > should > > be some information as to whom to contact to recycle your treasures I agree. It does not have to be as elaborate as cataloging the ENTIRE collection. Too often that task is too intimidating and never gets completed. However, taking the time to inventory or mark or label the BEST mineral specimens will prevent good items from being overlooked. John Betts www.johnbetts-fineminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 09:45:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Scott Blair) Date: Sun Feb 23 09:45:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: Dear Group: Warning - this got a little long, so if you're not interested, please delete. Some random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson: Quartzsite was very slow this year, and continues in a downhill slide that started several years back. The Tyson Wells show, and the Main Event show were well attended, as they are long established shows and seem to have the inertia going. The Desert Gardens show was very slow and the dealers were all crying. One guy was calling it "deserted gardens" Imho one of the things that they could do to propel Desert Gardens into the future is to sport a few porta-potties! (In the name of all that is good and almost sanitary) Quartzsite just is what it is- the dust, the shower scene, the deep fried food. I longed for a salad, a fresh vegetable, the crisp bite of celery, something. Even the pizza was all canned ingrediants. They scheduled the Pow Wow this year to open on the same day as a lot of the Tucson shows, so I think that was a mistake. I was in Tucson by that time. Tucson was a little weaker this time also, as to be expected with the weak economy. For some of the international dealers, it was difficult to get goods in time. Some rooms remained empty long into the show or else just had a small selection of materials. Almost all the dealers I talked to said it was down this year. Prices on material were definitely coming down by the 2nd week of the shows - a sign that the inflated, wishful, high pricing that was spurred by "Tucson fever" in the opening had become more realistic, and more keyed into what the reality of the year actually was. At the very tip top, high end, I think there will always be buyers - if you have the very best piece of something, someone will want to buy it. And at the low end, where you can buy volume for resale at very low prices, there will continue to be a market. What's being phased out is that vast middle section of materials defined neither by best pricing, nor by best quality. It's too bad too, because this is where the flavor and diversity comes from. But I certainly understand why a person can't afford to sell there. With the average hotel room well over $100 per day, ever increasing shipping costs coupled with rigorous security measures that threaten delays on the arrival of materials, high dealer fees, and the cost of all the incidentals, you would have to sell a lot of rocks just to break even. In a rough year like this one, it gets harder to sell a lot of rocks. Here's how I break it down: (These figures are all just mythical) hotel room - 20 days at $125/day - $2500 dealer fee - $700 shipping - .50/lb on 1000lbs - $500 meals - $25/day for 20 days - $500 round trip air fair- -$250 cost of materials, average based on $10,000 worth of sales -$4200 Total expenses $8650 Profit $1350 Was it worth it? You tell me. Obviously there are other valuable aspects to being in Tucson - the connections you make, the clan gathering, etc. I got there early and watched the dirtbag hotels change their rates from $19.95 a night to $50 or $60 a night. I told em what I thought about this - ya sure, you betcha. They didn't care and looked at me like I was a flea in their armpit. So I got em up in the morning, crack of dawn style, to give back the key, and made sure I commented on their fine hair styling at that surprising hour. Anyway, that's just a small example of the rather opportunistic greed that has entangled itself with the largest show in the world. Don't get me wrong. The good neighborly spirit of good gem and mineral people can still be felt. Like almost anything real and alive - the beauty and the pain are are all rolled up into one. One of my more laughable memories is of a friend and fellow store owner, anxously scanning the ceiling of his hotel room, with his one good eye, while a proliferation of cockroaches all seemed to choose that exact time to begin their evening foray. Of course I was as sympathetic as I could be in the moment, but I take some satisfiction in knowing that nobody escapes an occasional bout with the heebee geebees. I spoke with an established mineral dealer several Tucsons ago ( Tucsons = the unit that rockhounds measure time in) and he said he felt that mineral dealing was on a long, slow decline. I have since wondered if that was an accurate forecast, or if that was just his own personal opinion based on his age, his burnout level, and the type of materials he was selling (that vast middle level) He has since stopped selling at Tucson. It wasn't worth it to him. But I wonder if his prediction could possibly take into account all the variables. I don't think it could. An interesting observation this year was the markedly increased number of those who I call "dreddy kids". These are the modern day hippies, if there can be such a thing. And you might laugh, but they do have their network. So as a dealer, I have to look at these things. This year along the freeway frontage, there was a tea tent, the Om Shanti Cafe, a sort of Deadhead booth, and a couple of others, as well as dreddy kids selling their wares along that middle stretch of sidewalk between the Days Inn, and the Holiday Inn Express. So this raises the question as to whether that vanishing middle ground will be replaced by food, trinkets, and other paraphenalia in the future. Some sections of Tucson could go the route of other gem show, seeing an increase in non rock related materials. Some kids paired up with registered dealers and obtained a few square feet of space in which to set out a case. I'll give em credit. I thought that was a fairly creative solution to the high cost of being at Tucson. I kept hearing the words of Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park: "Life finds a way". Next year there will probably be a city ordinance against street vending. Or if there already is, next year it will be enforced. Then the kids will have to find somewhere just around the corner where they can be less visible but still engage in trade. I camped in the dust, stayed in posh hotels, played music all night by a fire, visited with the affluent as well as the squalid, rockhounded for a week, got lost one dark night, but finally found my rig, dined in the finest clubs, scraped the last of my campfire beans with a melted plastic fork, went hot tubbing with some beautiful internationals, lost blood in the hills, and generally had a great time. I'll be back next year! Warm Regards to all - Scott Blair Ashland Rock Shop, Ashland, Oregon From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 09:57:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 23 09:57:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson Message-ID: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> In a message dated 2/23/2003 12:45:50 PM Eastern Standard Time, spocksrocks@hotmail.com writes: > I spoke with an established mineral dealer several Tucsons ago and he said > he felt that mineral > dealing was on a long, slow decline. I could not DISAGREE more with this statement. Attendance at minerals shows is steady. Some clubs (the ones that understand the importance of remaining fresh and interesting) are growing in membership. And new collectors are discovering (or rediscovering if they had stopped collecting) the joys of collecting minerals. I believe the Internet has allowed cabin-bound collectors to make contacts all over the world - and that keeps them interested. In my youth, I gave up mineral collecting because I had no access to places for collecting. It was very frustrating. The Internet is a way of extending a collector's reach to otherwise inaccessible places. John Betts www.johnbetts-fineminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:00:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:00:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: <3E590457.AE8C7706@att.net> References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223104200.00a8e158@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223122958.00adf1d0@mail.charter.net> I agree wholeheartedly. The database is absolutely the best way to create a catalog and keep it updated. I myself am an Access programmer along with running a water treatment plant (that is what the WTP stands for--I'm writing this from work). I have written a fairly sophisticated program that keeps up with over 300 parameters involved with running a water plant and a waste water plant; and I know the effort involved to get a good design that is easy to use for a non-programmer. In my case I had to create a wizard that would allow the user to easily add fields to the table and a form wizard so that they could then create a standardized form based on the fields they wanted to use. But with all the trending and querying and myriad ways of looking at the data, the EPA still requires their reports to be printed and signed by me and the City Manager, sent to them, and a copy of it to be kept on paper at the facility for 7 years. So once I generate the catalog, I intend to print it out (and include it with my will). Should have a field for estimated value, so at least the kids will have some conception of what they are really worth and not have a fire sale--- at least for the good items). When specimens are added or subtracted, just print it out again. Looking forward to getting the application. Tommy PS I have a computerized engraving machine that is wonderful for making labels, signs, etc and would be glad to trade some for your app. (I engrave LEGO bricks of all things along with other do-dads as a sideline) Tommy At 12:26 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Erwin WTP wrote: > > > > As for mineral specimens, I see the main problem is keeping the rock and > > its label(s) together with some sort of system to reliably know that a > > particular label is indeed to be associated with a particular specimen. > > > > Perhaps a good thread would be just what needs to be on a label--we might > > have covered this round before but I missed it. > > > > Don, what fields do you include in your custom database? Which should be > > included on the label? > > >This has been discussed several times. There are best practices for >this. First thing: it is not the *label* that needs all that info, it >is the *catalog*. The catalog database has something like 60 fields >(I'll mail you a copy soon). The label itself need not contain anything >more than the specimen number, minerals within, and locality. Example: > >------------------------------ >TA19283 > > DOLOMITE, SPHALERITE, GALENA > > Viburnum Trend Mine, 200' > Level, Leadtown, Missouri > > > Tommy Armstrong Collection >------------------------------ > >The specimen number should be the key to the catalog entry, and a small >number should be printed on acid-free paper and affixed to the specimen, >if possible, with neutral-pH white glue such as the Lineco brand. You >will find older books and articles--and some old-timers--who will >propose grand and complex schemes for catalog numbers, including Dana >class, Strunz class, year found, etc. This is not only unwieldy but is >incomprehensible to anyone who doesn't know the secret code. It is also >difficult for anyone acquiring your collection to make sense of what is >there, what is missing, and how many specimens you have. A number of >curators to whom I have spoken advocate simple numbers and a collection >identifier. For private individuals, I recommend initials, hence my >specimens start with DJH1 and progress numerically. > >Ironically, your example of losing the Pough label is a perfect example >of why the label should not be the sole source of information for the >specimen. I don't know if Dr. Pough kept a catalog, but if he did, and >there was a specimen number attached to the specimen, you could contact >him and retrieve all the necessary info. Labels become separated and >lost. In recent years I have seen two prime collections that were >diminished by the fact that the labels were jumbled in one box and the >minerals in another! > >People are free to collect as they wish, and no one is required to do >anything with their collection. However, if one wants to consider one's >self a serious or advanced collector, having a detailed catalog is an >essential step. I would rather by a collection of 100 specimens with >detailed documentation than one for the same price containing 1,000 >specimens and not one shred of documentation. > > >Don >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:05:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:05:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030222211922.02b494f0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <000d01c2db66$27023b40$619c77d5@pandora.be> | Please permit me to translate your response into a haiku: | | Tonight it will be | Freezing again; could it be | That spring has just sprung? Haiku??? I would send you one calligraphed, rice-paper can't write Japanese Passed? Axel Emmermann Mineralogische Kring Antwerpen Werkgroepen Fluorescentie & Technische Realisaties Home : Lobbesplein 12 B-2640 Mortsel Belgium Tel: +32 (0)3 295.35.54 E-mail: axel.emmermann@pandora.be Visit our homepage: http://www.minerant.org/index.html Bezoek onze web-site: http://www.minerant.org/MKA/index.html My own web-site: http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/home/index.htm From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:21:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:21:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding In-Reply-To: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <5.2.0.5.2.20030223101711.014822e8@mail.spiritone.com> Ron Winter (where are you bud?) has great site on WA locations http://stonetrails.com At 02:44 PM 2/21/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Hi: >My companion and I are newbie/novice Rockhounders. >I am posting to find out if there are Rockhounders from the Puget Sound area >on this List? I would love to make contact with them as local sources, >specifically individuals, are the best teachers there are. >I have downloaded the Washington Rockhounders places to go Data Base. >One of the sites I wish to visit, after the snows are no longer plauging >Snoqualmie pass and before the summer weather becomes hot (warm to a >transplanted Texan such as I) is First Creek in Kittitas County. So, to >start with is, I would like information from any WA Rockhounders who have >experienced this location. >Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! mailto:tim@OreRockOn.com Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:21:11 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:21:11 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: <1ab.1147a0ed.2b8a255c@aol.com> Message-ID: And, let's not forget Van, that all is not so rosy with paper and books. A 500 year old book may be in good condition and safe to allow the public to handle, but a 100 year old book (on acid paper) may be very fragile, or already beyond handling. And, there is more: Those "important" family photos of "old style" film and paper origins, of great historical value to the family, perhaps the town the "pioneer" family lives in and to the geneaologists, may well be sitting in two big shoeboxes, unlabeled, uncared for and finally discarded with the grandchild who inherits them.... As to text, I keep upgrading my files (those that I care to have published and or saved in any format) to new software. Right now it is PDF that is the "in" thing that can be read on any computer system with an Acrobat Reader to translate it. Also there is the old standby that has always (in the 25 years of "desktop" computers, and before that) been with us, and in reality makes up the files we read on the web: text files. Most likely, text files will "always" be readable. Thus, no matter what you create text with, save a copy in an ASCII text format. Lanny >There will certainly be electronic format translators as time goes by and new >technology is introduced. Data don't seem to get important until it's about >to disappear. (Yes, data don't take the singular verb as the word is the >plural. Sounds weird though.) > >Right on about publishing Lanny. We're getting more than ever now. Wish that >more clubs would have an historical link with the local historical society. >Some mineral clubs have an historian, but when there's a new election of >officers, there's sometimes a gap in transfer as some folders just don't seem >to be where they should be or the slot remains empty. When there's a sudden >loss of a club historian, the family rarely knows where the files were kept >and "will let the club know if it turns up." > >Having worked as a mineral appraiser of many mineral estates over the years, >I have been shocked at how poorly the executors have behaved towards mineral >collectors in general. The first thing that goes into the trash are the >correspondence, fieldtrip notes, club bulletins, meeting notes, magazines >including Rocks and Minerals, Mineralogical Record, Matrix, etc. The second >thing that goes are relatively undetailed labeled minerals in flats, boxes, >or crates, even if they're trading stock. One Brooklyn collector who had a >mineral named for him and his son actually collected fossils, had the >non-display part of his collection put out to the curbside. Fortunately, >local collectors made regular pilgramages and got there before the trash man. > >The best thing you can do for your collection - of anything, is to make sure >someone in your family knows what is "good" and what isn't and there should >be some information as to whom to contact to recycle your treasures, >especially if you have someone you love who could benefit from the proceeds. > >Van > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Lanny R. Ream - lanny@mineralnews.com - http://www.mineralnews.com Owner/Publisher - LR Ream Publishing Publisher of Mineral News, mineral guidebooks and mineral software: MinDex: the Mineral-Periodical Index and The Mineral Database From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:33:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:33:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223104200.00a8e158@mail.charter.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20030223122958.00adf1d0@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E5913A1.4845E27D@cox.net> Tommy, One thing for sure I will pass along to great-grandchildren are the Lego Bricks, their dads enjoyed while living with me for 4 years. Now to be fair, do I just laboriously go through with a box designated to each of my grandsons, one black 8 nub for Anthony, one for Brendon???????? That is the primary reason they are still sitting on the shelves as the boys left them when they rejoined my son in Texas. My need to be exactly fair with each boy. Teresa, smiling. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:54:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:54:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223104200.00a8e158@mail.charter.net> <5.1.0.14.0.20030223122958.00adf1d0@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E5919E2.F0D1C585@att.net> Erwin WTP wrote: > > So once I generate the catalog, I intend to print it out (and include it > with my will). Should have a field for estimated value, so at least the > kids will have some conception of what they are really worth and not have a > fire sale--- at least for the good items). When specimens are added or > subtracted, just print it out again. We've gone one step further. There is a separate table for appraisal values, and this is what is called a "multi-valued attribute": for every specimen, there may be one to many appraisals. All of them should be kept on record as time goes by. There is a separate, single field for purchase price (if any, otherwise the default value is $0). The appraisal table has several fields, including appraised value, date, appraiser, appraiser comments, and appraiser affiliation. This is what I mean by having sufficient detail. For example, a subset of records might say: $120 / 20 February 2000 / Larry H. Conklin / L.H. Conklin Minerals / (no comment) $75 / 12 January 2003 / Vandall T. King / independent / value decreased due to new find at locality Don't forget to print your catalog on acid-free archival paper. The benefit of having the master catalog arranged by specimen number is that you can add pages to the end as you add specimens. And if you expect to change specimen records often, you can create your application to print out one specimen per page, so that you only need insert a change page and not re-print the whole catalog. Of course, you can print out queries and reports as often as you need them. It is good to hole-punch the pages and keep them in archival binders (*not* PVC, since PVC binders leach nasty chemicals over a short period of time). If you expect to have a large catalog, you can purchase an inexpensive filing cabinet and use that. > PS I have a computerized engraving machine that is wonderful for making > labels, signs, etc and would be glad to trade some for your app. Actually the museum needs an engraved plaque for one of our new cases, we are dedicating the case to someone. Five lines, about 3 in. x 7 in.; I'll contact you off-list. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 10:57:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Scott Blair) Date: Sun Feb 23 10:57:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> Message-ID: Thanks John - I wanted not to believe that statement. And there is certainly a lot of evidence to the contrary. But it's interesting to look at the perspectives of other dealers, in an effort to understand how they came to their opinions, and what experiences influenced their comments. In this way, I can sample possible outcomes of some of my own current choices, and make some projections about where I might end up 15 years down the road. Hopefully not too burned out:) Warm Regards - Scott Blair Ashland Rock Shop, Ashland, Oregon From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 11:18:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Feb 23 11:18:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This subject has been treated extensively back in 2001. Here is a copy of my contribution at that time. Greetings, Rik -----Original Message----- From: Rik Dillen [mailto:rik.dillen@skynet.be] Sent: 18 December, 2001 8:49 PM To: Rockhounds Subject: Labeling mineral specimens Since I wrote down a story concerning labeling and cataloguing of minerals, it is not much trouble to send it to the list. Sorry for those old-timers who have got a story of this kind already (with my sincere thanks to Mark Rahn, UK, who corrected my grammatical errors... so this time it should be readable :>)). First of all, IMHO it is imperative that every specimen should have some sort of a unique identification tag ATTACHED, so that it cannot get lost. On the other hand I'm not in favour of correction fluid or white lacquer or so, because that cannot or only hardly be removed. I have some specimens from old collections that have had different owners, and some of them are now nearly fully painted in black-and-white. Attaching all data on the sample is physically impossible, unless you attach a microfilm (which, believe me or not, some people do!). The only thing that I attach to the specimen itself is a unique code-number according to "Strunz Mineralogische Tabellen". I have my own system based on a list that was made by Albert Van hee in the sixties, and improved by Willy Israel, a Belgian collector, in the seventies. It is based on the Strunz 6th edition (1977). Since then I try to attribute a new number in the existing system myself every time I acquire a new mineral that is not listed yet. Nowadays this is made easy by the splendid mineral databases available on the web, e.g. http://www.webmineral.com/strunz.shtml Other people prefer the Dana classification system http://www.webmineral.com/danaclass.shtml Other interesting sites in this respect are http://un2sg4.unige.ch/athena/mineral/mineral.html http://www.mindat.org/index.php and there are many more available. I always keep a printed copy of the data of each specimen, just in case (not to speak about the backups of the database, both on a CD-ROM and on a ZIP-disk...). That means that I have at present a catalogue of a few thousand pages, some of which were printed with a 9-pins needle printer. By the way the database is only 3 Mbytes in its current state! It contains for every specimen the following data: Now the question of labeling as such. I use always self-adhesive labels of 8 x 12 mm (I used to have 9 x 13 mm labels, which were more convenient, but I can't find them anymore). When a specimen has a smooth face on which the label adheres well, there is no problem. I just attach the label with it's own glue. For samples with only rough or, even worse, brittle surfaces I have experimented with self-adhesive medical type plaster, nail polish, and different types of glue. Eventually I abandoned all of these. The plaster leaves dirty and sticky traces when removed after a few years, and moreover the rubbish is very fluorescent. The glueing properties of nail polish are not ideal (drying time too long when not exposed, meaning under the label), and all types of glues are a mess to work with. Nowadays I attach the label with a tiny little bit of sticky stuff as used to attach small specimens in Jousi (Europe) or Perky (US). When the quality of that stuff is OK (which is not always the case!) it will adhere to most surfaces, even brittle ones, and the label can be removed without leaving any trace. The only risk is the behaviour of the sticky stuff after 10-20 years. The label on the specimen contains only the Strunz-number and a sequence number, e.g. 7.4.5.12 / 18 would mean specimen number 18 of vantasselite. On the box, in which I put the specimen (carton folded open boxes) I put a small label with only the name of the mineral. This is redundant information, as the Strunz-number is unique, but it's convenient to find a specimen quickly back. Summary of my actual system: each specimen has a tag attached with sticky putty, which shows the Strunz classification number of the species and the sequence number of the specimen of that species. The mineral name on the box is optional. Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15 B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium Tel. + 32 3 7706007 E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif Large parking lot ! http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 12:48:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J. A. Barwood) Date: Sun Feb 23 12:48:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E592818.C24A1433@bluemarble.net> I teach Earth Science, and of the roughly 90-135 students I teach each semester, only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a science requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in earth science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general science (!). In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and hard). I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the future, we are in deep trouble. As for Tucson and Quartzite, and all the other shows, as long as people are willing to fork over the bucks, they will continue. If one year no one showed up, I suspect things would change dramatically the next year. Henry Barwood From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 12:58:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Cathy Gaber) Date: Sun Feb 23 12:58:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson Message-ID: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a >science >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in >earth >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general >science (!). >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and >hard). >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the >future, we >are in deep trouble. Dear Henry, Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there to recruit graduate students. Cathy From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 13:03:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (mysfit) Date: Sun Feb 23 13:03:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <3E592818.C24A1433@bluemarble.net> References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030223135317.00b603d0@pop.mindspring.com> I think we had this discussion before; how the earth sciences labor under the misperception that they are 'soft', easy and not very useful. Geology and Astronomy tend to be where non science/tech majors go to fulfill the 'science' requirement. There is not a great deal of exposure to Geology until college. And what do people do with a Geology degree? Not a whole lot of jobs....oil, hydrogeology and environmental geology are the main areas. Heck, I ended up in High Tech growing silicon..(now I am in Boise, ID looking for work if anyone has any suggestions, with Micron laying off things are looking rather grim). Henry, you get stuck with mostly people not interested in the sciences at all...don't be too discouraged. I think there will always be rockhounds, not many, just a steady group. Korey At 02:59 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I teach Earth Science, and of the roughly 90-135 students I teach each >semester, >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a >science >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in earth >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general >science (!). >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and >hard). >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the >future, we >are in deep trouble. > >As for Tucson and Quartzite, and all the other shows, as long as people are >willing to fork over the bucks, they will continue. If one year no one showed >up, I suspect things would change dramatically the next year. > >Henry Barwood > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 16:54:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sun Feb 23 16:54:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <3E592818.C24A1433@bluemarble.net> References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223195224.00acffa8@mail.charter.net> My girl who is in 9th grade dreaded taking earth sciences--and I with rocks all over the house. But there is hope. She got a teacher that she really likes and is thoroughly enjoying it---more because of the teacher than the subject matter, probably. But anyway, they have this thing called Science Olympiad and have earth science, no tutoring, and she came in first in the region. Its amazing what a good teacher can accomplish with a good student. Tommy At 02:59 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >I teach Earth Science, and of the roughly 90-135 students I teach each >semester, >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a >science >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in earth >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general >science (!). >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and >hard). >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the >future, we >are in deep trouble. > >As for Tucson and Quartzite, and all the other shows, as long as people are >willing to fork over the bucks, they will continue. If one year no one showed >up, I suspect things would change dramatically the next year. > >Henry Barwood > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 17:35:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J. A. Barwood) Date: Sun Feb 23 17:35:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> Hi Cathy, This does not surprise me. The students I teach consider science 1) difficult 2) boring 3) lacking in earnings potential and 4) a course they can catch up on sleep in (!). Of course here in Alabama, we have had almost a decade of under funding of higher education. K-12 has fared a little better, but not much. Sad fact is that I can teach teachers science, but I am not qualified to teach in high school (no certificate!). Go figure. Henry Cathy Gaber wrote: > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > >science > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in > >earth > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > >science (!). > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > >hard). > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > >future, we > >are in deep trouble. > > Dear Henry, > > Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in > science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there > to recruit graduate students. > > Cathy > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 17:42:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J. A. Barwood) Date: Sun Feb 23 17:42:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> <5.1.1.6.2.20030223135317.00b603d0@pop.mindspring.com> Message-ID: <3E596CF4.B814A037@bluemarble.net> I'm not discouraged, just working my tail off to get their attention. I left research to come "home" and teach. Every so often a bulb goes off and one of them begins to understand. Of course on a recent test I asked for two of the three minerals commonly found in granite. I got such winners as "sand and gravel" and "basalt and rhyolite" (I didn't make these up, honest). This was after pointedly telling them that this question would be on the test (they didn't listen, obviously). Henry mysfit wrote: > I think we had this discussion before; how the earth sciences labor under > the misperception that they are 'soft', easy and not very useful. Geology > and Astronomy tend to be where non science/tech majors go to fulfill the > 'science' requirement. There is not a great deal of exposure to Geology > until college. And what do people do with a Geology degree? Not a whole lot > of jobs....oil, hydrogeology and environmental geology are the main areas. > Heck, I ended up in High Tech growing silicon..(now I am in Boise, ID > looking for work if anyone has any suggestions, with Micron laying off > things are looking rather grim). > > Henry, you get stuck with mostly people not interested in the sciences at > all...don't be too discouraged. I think there will always be rockhounds, > not many, just a steady group. > > Korey > > At 02:59 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: > >I teach Earth Science, and of the roughly 90-135 students I teach each > >semester, > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > >science > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in earth > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > >science (!). > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > >hard). > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > >future, we > >are in deep trouble. > > > >As for Tucson and Quartzite, and all the other shows, as long as people are > >willing to fork over the bucks, they will continue. If one year no one showed > >up, I suspect things would change dramatically the next year. > > > >Henry Barwood > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > >Subscription Services: > >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 17:48:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J. A. Barwood) Date: Sun Feb 23 17:48:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <17.365c10be.2b8a653a@aol.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030223195224.00acffa8@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E596E42.6A6DB3B8@bluemarble.net> This gives me hope! There are good teachers out there, but they are rare and tend to be under appreciated. Henry Erwin WTP wrote: > My girl who is in 9th grade dreaded taking earth sciences--and I with rocks > all over the house. But there is hope. She got a teacher that she really > likes and is thoroughly enjoying it---more because of the teacher than the > subject matter, probably. But anyway, they have this thing called Science > Olympiad and have earth science, no tutoring, and she came in first in the > region. Its amazing what a good teacher can accomplish with a good student. > > Tommy > > At 02:59 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: > >I teach Earth Science, and of the roughly 90-135 students I teach each > >semester, > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > >science > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in earth > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > >science (!). > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > >hard). > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > >future, we > >are in deep trouble. > > > >As for Tucson and Quartzite, and all the other shows, as long as people are > >willing to fork over the bucks, they will continue. If one year no one showed > >up, I suspect things would change dramatically the next year. > > > >Henry Barwood > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > >Subscription Services: > >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 18:21:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (mysfit) Date: Sun Feb 23 18:21:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> References: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030223191546.00b3bb90@pop.mindspring.com> Science is difficult Only if one is unable or too lazy to expend the effort to THINK. When all is said and done, science and engineering both require the ability to think critically, to ask questions, to make reasonable assumptions, to test those assumptions and to learn from them. Next time one of them mentions the earnings potential thing, mention Bill Gates. I apologize, I just see this as a symptom of over all laziness and a wish to sleepwalk through life (or at least to not be challenged by anything) it's hardly restricted to youth but it is discouraging to see on a large scale. Heck just look at the crap that 'the media' has reported on Columbia, it bears almost no reality to the actual information they were given during tech briefings. ggrrrrrrggrrrrgrrrrrrrr At 07:46 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >Hi Cathy, > >This does not surprise me. The students I teach consider science 1) >difficult 2) >boring 3) lacking in earnings potential and 4) a course they can catch up on >sleep in (!). Of course here in Alabama, we have had almost a decade of under >funding of higher education. K-12 has fared a little better, but not much. Sad >fact is that I can teach teachers science, but I am not qualified to teach >in high >school (no certificate!). Go figure. > >Henry > >Cathy Gaber wrote: > > > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > > >science > > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in > > >earth > > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > > >science (!). > > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have > picked > > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > > >hard). > > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > > >future, we > > >are in deep trouble. > > > > Dear Henry, > > > > Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in > > science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there > > to recruit graduate students. > > > > Cathy > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 19:02:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rocks4u) Date: Sun Feb 23 19:02:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <000a01c2dbb1$9c7590c0$b76b1c43@s4b5j4> You could not have said it better. I've been pondering the situation ever since leaving Quartzsite; wondering when the end will finally come. Clouds in Laughlin was no better. One nice thing about this year over last was the weather was perfect for the week I was there. Cheers! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Blair" To: Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:43 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson > Dear Group: > > Warning - this got a little long, so if you're not interested, please > delete. > > Some random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson: > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 19:17:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (williams) Date: Sun Feb 23 19:17:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> Message-ID: <003601c2dbd5$577e30c0$d3d14fd1@oemcomputer> Hi Henry, Just thought I would throw in my 2 bits worth. I understand what you are going through. One of my college classes that I really enjoyed was "Rocks and minerals of California". This class included field trips to collect rocks & minerals. The class requirements were to be able to identify by sight 15 rocks and 25 minerals that we studied in class. Also, each student had to create their own collection of 15 rocks & 20 minerals that they had found on the field trips. The collection had to include the name, location and date that it was found as well as the composition, if a mineral and the classification ,if a rock. Most of the class was learning all about Geology as this was a lower class and the only prerequisite was Geology 1a. About 5 students dropped out and 4 more could not attend field trips or did not complete the collections. I, on the other hand excelled and received an A+. That was the second of many Geology courses that I took--even though I was an Accounting major. Years later, I received a Geology degree as well. As far as I know, I am the only student that really "got it" and pursued this wonderful "hobby"?. I have helped start a "junior program" at our local club and tried to include field trips. The kids wanted to go ,but, the parents had more important things to do. I would even bring my scopes and ultraviolet lights to the classes along with minerals that I had collected and clear plastic containers for the kids to put them in. Alas, it was the parents that prevented the kids from attending because they had other things to do. There are still some of the same kids showing up,but, since I left, they are only working with non minerals. I also, go to schools, when requested and spend the day talking about Rocks, Minerals, Elements & Fossils. and it is like a childrens introduction to Geology and Mineral collecting since I also bring specimens that I put out on the tables---properly labeled , of course, for the kids to take home for themselves. The kids learn the differences between R&M&E&F. We talk about earthquakes and volcanoes and how they affect what I collect and why. The theme is usually "The wonderful worl of Copper", since almost every color that they can think of, there is a copper mineral with that color. This works, whether it is in Grade school , Junior high, or even in the High school classes that I have spoken to. I could go on and on,but, I won't. We can only be available to those who want to learn and expose those who are semi curious about "our world" to it. Only time will tell how succesful we are and WE cannot quit being available. I am still an accountant first and geologist (amateur Mineralogist) second. Don't give up! Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "J. A. Barwood" To: Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 12:46 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson > Hi Cathy, > > This does not surprise me. The students I teach consider science 1) difficult 2) > boring 3) lacking in earnings potential and 4) a course they can catch up on > sleep in (!). Of course here in Alabama, we have had almost a decade of under > funding of higher education. K-12 has fared a little better, but not much. Sad > fact is that I can teach teachers science, but I am not qualified to teach in high > school (no certificate!). Go figure. > > Henry > > Cathy Gaber wrote: > > > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > > >science > > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in > > >earth > > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > > >science (!). > > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked > > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > > >hard). > > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > > >future, we > > >are in deep trouble. > > > > Dear Henry, > > > > Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in > > science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there > > to recruit graduate students. > > > > Cathy > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 19:36:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dri) Date: Sun Feb 23 19:36:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding References: <5.2.0.5.2.20030223101711.014822e8@mail.spiritone.com> Message-ID: <000b01c2dbb5$d2f79680$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Thank you Tim. Ron's Data Base has been downloaded and printed. Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Fisher" To: Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 10:19 Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding > Ron Winter (where are you bud?) has great site on WA locations > http://stonetrails.com > > At 02:44 PM 2/21/2003 -0800, you wrote: > >Hi: > >My companion and I are newbie/novice Rockhounders. > >I am posting to find out if there are Rockhounders from the Puget Sound area > >on this List? I would love to make contact with them as local sources, > >specifically individuals, are the best teachers there are. > >I have downloaded the Washington Rockhounders places to go Data Base. > >One of the sites I wish to visit, after the snows are no longer plauging > >Snoqualmie pass and before the summer weather becomes hot (warm to a > >transplanted Texan such as I) is First Creek in Kittitas County. So, to > >start with is, I would like information from any WA Rockhounders who have > >experienced this location. > >Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) > > Tim Fisher > Ore-ROCK-On! > mailto:tim@OreRockOn.com > Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 19:53:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sun Feb 23 19:53:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030223191546.00b3bb90@pop.mindspring.com> References: <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223215932.00a7ca10@mail.charter.net> Not to get too deeply into a discussion of education, but it is my firm belief that although most kids (and adults) are basically lazy, once they are motivated in a certain direction, they tend to cure themselves of that natural laziness, at least in the direction of motivation. Educational law #1="The amount of energy put forth by the student is directly proportional to the amount of motivational impetus contained in the student" Lets face it, science ,to most kids, IS boring the way it is usually taught in public schools. Students motivate themselves in spite of, instead of because of the normal science curriculum. Most teachers really are boring. Most teachers cannot ignite that spark that yields the that chain reaction. When I was coming along, the sputnik and the space race captured attention and sparked an interest in science. There is nothing equivalent today, although the environmental movement seems to grab the attention of budding young biologists. Many has been the child that has struck the flint only to have no fuel provided for a flame. And the fact is that they do not strike it often, and when they do, someone needs to step up. First and foremost it is the parent's job to provide the fuel, but alas most of the time they are too busy or not willing. It then falls to the teacher. They too are too busy most of the time. Classes are too large, discipline, etc. etc. blah, blah blah. But if a kid shows an interest, its the teachers job to kindle it. That's what they get paid for. And 2% isn't that bad of a percentage. That's 2 out of every 100. Just don't lose that 2% and we will be alright. Literature is difficult Music is difficult Art is difficult Auto Mechanics if difficult Computer programming is difficult Law is difficult Medicine is difficult Ray Bradbury once told a student who asked what he should take in college if he wanted to be a writer. He said skip college and write, because college will just extinguish the spark. (paraphrased) Science cannot really be approached that way, because of the special nature of the knowledge that must be acquired to be proficient. But one must be able to show the beauty and the fun in solving a problem, show the bigger picture. And remember, Bill Gates dropped out of Harvard because they were not supplying him with the fuel he wanted. He did OK. Off my soap box now. Great rocks should be appreciated like great works of art and literature. They have beauty, complexity, and a story to be told. The quest for them is like a journey, and the rewards are the journey itself. I envy those of yall that can go out and collect in the field. But collecting on the Internet is also fun, as is collecting in books and magazines. Acquiring knowledge about a subject is pretty useless unless it heightens the appreciation of that subject. Tommy Armstrong At 07:20 PM 2/23/2003 -0700, you wrote: >Science is difficult > >Only if one is unable or too lazy to expend the effort to THINK. When all >is said and done, science and engineering both require the ability to >think critically, to ask questions, to make reasonable assumptions, to >test those assumptions and to learn from them. > >Next time one of them mentions the earnings potential thing, mention Bill >Gates. > >I apologize, I just see this as a symptom of over all laziness and a wish >to sleepwalk through life (or at least to not be challenged by anything) >it's hardly restricted to youth but it is discouraging to see on a large >scale. Heck just look at the crap that 'the media' has reported on >Columbia, it bears almost no reality to the actual information they were >given during tech briefings. > >ggrrrrrrggrrrrgrrrrrrrr > > >At 07:46 PM 2/23/2003 -0500, you wrote: >>Hi Cathy, >> >>This does not surprise me. The students I teach consider science 1) >>difficult 2) >>boring 3) lacking in earnings potential and 4) a course they can catch up on >>sleep in (!). Of course here in Alabama, we have had almost a decade of under >>funding of higher education. K-12 has fared a little better, but not >>much. Sad >>fact is that I can teach teachers science, but I am not qualified to >>teach in high >>school (no certificate!). Go figure. >> >>Henry >> >>Cathy Gaber wrote: >> >> > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a >> > >science >> > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall >> > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in >> > >earth >> > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general >> > >science (!). >> > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly >> have picked >> > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and >> > >hard). >> > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the >> > >future, we >> > >are in deep trouble. >> > >> > Dear Henry, >> > >> > Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in >> > science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there >> > to recruit graduate students. >> > >> > Cathy >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> > Subscription Services: >> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >>Subscription Services: >>http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:01:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:01:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> Message-ID: <3E5998E6.2829F8F9@cox.net> Henry, Out here in California the teacher's union goes out of its way to discredit teachers without certificates. We do have persons such as yourself teaching rather effectively, but guess they do not pay union dues. Money talks louder than experience and love of a specific topic such as earth sciences, etc. I know Rockhounds without college degrees who not only can teach rocks and minerals, but also with such enthusiasm and zest, that youngsters do follow the geology path in college. Go figure, Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:09:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John Cornish) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:09:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <00f001c2dbbb$a0ba81e0$c9a1dccf@rockman> Hi Scott, A terrific, great paper, thank you very much for sharing it with the rest of us. The Tucson experience is sooo vast that no one individual can expect to take more then a pittance of it in. It's spread over such a wide area encompassing so many people and things that it's really quite overwhelming. I loved your perspective of movement and the images and observations you conveyed as you traveled from one place to another. Being locked down as I was, its great to get anothers perspective of the events surrounding me. Since I've been home, I've been catching up. One of the things I'm working on is my own Tucson Show Report. I hope mine reads as well as yours! Thanks again for taking the time to produce such a good write. All the best, John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Blair" To: Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:43 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson > Dear Group: > > Warning - this got a little long, so if you're not interested, please > delete. > > Some random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson: > > Quartzsite was very slow this year, and continues in a downhill slide that > started several years back. The Tyson Wells show, and the Main Event show > were well attended, as they are long established shows and seem to have the > inertia going. The Desert Gardens show was very slow and the dealers were > all crying. One guy was calling it "deserted gardens" Imho one of the > things that they could do to propel Desert Gardens into the future is to > sport a few porta-potties! (In the name of all that is good and almost > sanitary) Quartzsite just is what it is- the dust, the shower scene, the > deep fried food. I longed for a salad, a fresh vegetable, the crisp bite of > celery, something. Even the pizza was all canned ingrediants. They scheduled > the Pow Wow this year to open on the same day as a lot of the Tucson shows, > so I think that was a mistake. I was in Tucson by that time. > > Tucson was a little weaker this time also, as to be expected with the weak > economy. For some of the international dealers, it was difficult to get > goods in time. Some rooms remained empty long into the show or else just had > a small selection of materials. Almost all the dealers I talked to said it > was down this year. Prices on material were definitely coming down by the > 2nd week of the shows - a sign that the inflated, wishful, high pricing that > was spurred by "Tucson fever" in the opening had become more realistic, and > more keyed into what the reality of the year actually was. > > At the very tip top, high end, I think there will always be buyers - if you > have the very best piece of something, someone will want to buy it. And at > the low end, where you can buy volume for resale at very low prices, there > will continue to be a market. What's being phased out is that vast middle > section of materials defined neither by best pricing, nor by best quality. > It's too bad too, because this is where the flavor and diversity comes from. > > But I certainly understand why a person can't afford to sell there. With the > average hotel room well over $100 per day, ever increasing shipping costs > coupled with rigorous security measures that threaten delays on the arrival > of materials, high dealer fees, and the cost of all the incidentals, you > would have to sell a lot of rocks just to break even. In a rough year like > this one, it gets harder to sell a lot of rocks. Here's how I break it down: > (These figures are all just mythical) > > hotel room - 20 days at $125/day - $2500 > dealer fee - $700 > shipping - .50/lb on 1000lbs - $500 > meals - $25/day for 20 days - $500 > round trip air fair- -$250 > cost of materials, average based > on $10,000 worth of sales -$4200 > > Total expenses $8650 > Profit $1350 > > Was it worth it? You tell me. > > Obviously there are other valuable aspects to being in Tucson - the > connections you make, the clan gathering, etc. I got there early and watched > the dirtbag hotels change their rates from $19.95 a night to $50 or $60 a > night. I told em what I thought about this - ya sure, you betcha. They > didn't care and looked at me like I was a flea in their armpit. So I got em > up in the morning, crack of dawn style, to give back the key, and made sure > I commented on their fine hair styling at that surprising hour. > > Anyway, that's just a small example of the rather opportunistic greed that > has entangled itself with the largest show in the world. Don't get me wrong. > The good neighborly spirit of good gem and mineral people can still be felt. > Like almost anything real and alive - the beauty and the pain are are all > rolled up into one. One of my more laughable memories is of a friend and > fellow store owner, anxously scanning the ceiling of his hotel room, with > his one good eye, while a proliferation of cockroaches all seemed to choose > that exact time to begin their evening foray. Of course I was as sympathetic > as I could be in the moment, but I take some satisfiction in knowing that > nobody escapes an occasional bout with the heebee geebees. > > I spoke with an established mineral dealer several Tucsons ago ( Tucsons = > the unit that rockhounds measure time in) and he said he felt that mineral > dealing was on a long, slow decline. I have since wondered if that was an > accurate forecast, or if that was just his own personal opinion based on his > age, his burnout level, and the type of materials he was selling (that vast > middle level) He has since stopped selling at Tucson. It wasn't worth it to > him. But I wonder if his prediction could possibly take into account all the > variables. I don't think it could. > > An interesting observation this year was the markedly increased number of > those who I call "dreddy kids". These are the modern day hippies, if there > can be such a thing. And you might laugh, but they do have their network. So > as a dealer, I have to look at these things. This year along the freeway > frontage, there was a tea tent, the Om Shanti Cafe, a sort of Deadhead > booth, and a couple of others, as well as dreddy kids selling their wares > along that middle stretch of sidewalk between the Days Inn, and the Holiday > Inn Express. So this raises the question as to whether that vanishing middle > ground will be replaced by food, trinkets, and other paraphenalia in the > future. Some sections of Tucson could go the route of other gem show, seeing > an increase in non rock related materials. > > Some kids paired up with registered dealers and obtained a few square feet > of space in which to set out a case. I'll give em credit. I thought that was > a fairly creative solution to the high cost of being at Tucson. I kept > hearing the words of Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park: "Life finds a way". > Next year there will probably be a city ordinance against street vending. Or > if there already is, next year it will be enforced. Then the kids will have > to find somewhere just around the corner where they can be less visible but > still engage in trade. > > I camped in the dust, stayed in posh hotels, played music all night by a > fire, visited with the affluent as well as the squalid, rockhounded for a > week, got lost one dark night, but finally found my rig, dined in the finest > clubs, scraped the last of my campfire beans with a melted plastic fork, > went hot tubbing with some beautiful internationals, lost blood in the > hills, and generally had a great time. I'll be back next year! > > Warm Regards to all - Scott Blair > Ashland Rock Shop, Ashland, Oregon > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:10:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John Cornish) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:10:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding References: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <00f101c2dbbb$b50a8cd0$c9a1dccf@rockman> Hi Dri, I live a bit west of you in Port Angeles. I've not been to First Creek. There are several sites on the net with abundant NW information and your on the right track asking questions of your own. There are some active clubs in the area also if your so inclined. Keep plugging away and you'll find the satisfaction your looking for. My interests are primarily in field collecting. All the best to you, John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dri" To: "Rockhounds" Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 2:44 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] WA Rockhounding > Hi: > My companion and I are newbie/novice Rockhounders. > I am posting to find out if there are Rockhounders from the Puget Sound area > on this List? I would love to make contact with them as local sources, > specifically individuals, are the best teachers there are. > I have downloaded the Washington Rockhounders places to go Data Base. > One of the sites I wish to visit, after the snows are no longer plauging > Snoqualmie pass and before the summer weather becomes hot (warm to a > transplanted Texan such as I) is First Creek in Kittitas County. So, to > start with is, I would like information from any WA Rockhounders who have > experienced this location. > Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:18:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Erwin WTP) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:18:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <00f001c2dbbb$a0ba81e0$c9a1dccf@rockman> References: <013401c2d9fa$d5bd4e80$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223231356.00a9d9f8@mail.charter.net> ditto, I love to read reports about shows. I was really disappointed that rockhounds.com did not have reports on the show this year. John of trinityminerals.com always writes good reports. http://www.trinityminerals.com/tucson2003/index.shtml TA At 08:17 PM 2/23/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Scott, > >A terrific, great paper, thank you very much for sharing it with the rest of >us. The Tucson experience is sooo vast that no one individual can expect to >take more then a pittance of it in. It's spread over such a wide area >encompassing so many people and things that it's really quite overwhelming. >I loved your perspective of movement and the images and observations you >conveyed as you traveled from one place to another. Being locked down as I >was, its great to get anothers perspective of the events surrounding me. >Since I've been home, I've been catching up. One of the things I'm working >on is my own Tucson Show Report. I hope mine reads as well as yours! Thanks >again for taking the time to produce such a good write. All the best, > >John > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Scott Blair" >To: >Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:43 AM >Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson > > > > Dear Group: > > > > Warning - this got a little long, so if you're not interested, please > > delete. > > > > Some random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson: > > > > Quartzsite was very slow this year, and continues in a downhill slide that > > started several years back. The Tyson Wells show, and the Main Event show > > were well attended, as they are long established shows and seem to have >the > > inertia going. The Desert Gardens show was very slow and the dealers were > > all crying. One guy was calling it "deserted gardens" Imho one of the > > things that they could do to propel Desert Gardens into the future is to > > sport a few porta-potties! (In the name of all that is good and almost > > sanitary) Quartzsite just is what it is- the dust, the shower scene, the > > deep fried food. I longed for a salad, a fresh vegetable, the crisp bite >of > > celery, something. Even the pizza was all canned ingrediants. They >scheduled > > the Pow Wow this year to open on the same day as a lot of the Tucson >shows, > > so I think that was a mistake. I was in Tucson by that time. > > > > Tucson was a little weaker this time also, as to be expected with the weak > > economy. For some of the international dealers, it was difficult to get > > goods in time. Some rooms remained empty long into the show or else just >had > > a small selection of materials. Almost all the dealers I talked to said it > > was down this year. Prices on material were definitely coming down by the > > 2nd week of the shows - a sign that the inflated, wishful, high pricing >that > > was spurred by "Tucson fever" in the opening had become more realistic, >and > > more keyed into what the reality of the year actually was. > > > > At the very tip top, high end, I think there will always be buyers - if >you > > have the very best piece of something, someone will want to buy it. And at > > the low end, where you can buy volume for resale at very low prices, there > > will continue to be a market. What's being phased out is that vast middle > > section of materials defined neither by best pricing, nor by best quality. > > It's too bad too, because this is where the flavor and diversity comes >from. > > > > But I certainly understand why a person can't afford to sell there. With >the > > average hotel room well over $100 per day, ever increasing shipping costs > > coupled with rigorous security measures that threaten delays on the >arrival > > of materials, high dealer fees, and the cost of all the incidentals, you > > would have to sell a lot of rocks just to break even. In a rough year like > > this one, it gets harder to sell a lot of rocks. Here's how I break it >down: > > (These figures are all just mythical) > > > > hotel room - 20 days at $125/day - $2500 > > dealer fee - $700 > > shipping - .50/lb on 1000lbs - $500 > > meals - $25/day for 20 days - $500 > > round trip air fair- -$250 > > cost of materials, average based > > on $10,000 worth of sales -$4200 > > > > Total expenses $8650 > > Profit $1350 > > > > Was it worth it? You tell me. > > > > Obviously there are other valuable aspects to being in Tucson - the > > connections you make, the clan gathering, etc. I got there early and >watched > > the dirtbag hotels change their rates from $19.95 a night to $50 or $60 a > > night. I told em what I thought about this - ya sure, you betcha. They > > didn't care and looked at me like I was a flea in their armpit. So I got >em > > up in the morning, crack of dawn style, to give back the key, and made >sure > > I commented on their fine hair styling at that surprising hour. > > > > Anyway, that's just a small example of the rather opportunistic greed that > > has entangled itself with the largest show in the world. Don't get me >wrong. > > The good neighborly spirit of good gem and mineral people can still be >felt. > > Like almost anything real and alive - the beauty and the pain are are all > > rolled up into one. One of my more laughable memories is of a friend and > > fellow store owner, anxously scanning the ceiling of his hotel room, with > > his one good eye, while a proliferation of cockroaches all seemed to >choose > > that exact time to begin their evening foray. Of course I was as >sympathetic > > as I could be in the moment, but I take some satisfiction in knowing that > > nobody escapes an occasional bout with the heebee geebees. > > > > I spoke with an established mineral dealer several Tucsons ago ( Tucsons = > > the unit that rockhounds measure time in) and he said he felt that mineral > > dealing was on a long, slow decline. I have since wondered if that was an > > accurate forecast, or if that was just his own personal opinion based on >his > > age, his burnout level, and the type of materials he was selling (that >vast > > middle level) He has since stopped selling at Tucson. It wasn't worth it >to > > him. But I wonder if his prediction could possibly take into account all >the > > variables. I don't think it could. > > > > An interesting observation this year was the markedly increased number of > > those who I call "dreddy kids". These are the modern day hippies, if there > > can be such a thing. And you might laugh, but they do have their network. >So > > as a dealer, I have to look at these things. This year along the freeway > > frontage, there was a tea tent, the Om Shanti Cafe, a sort of Deadhead > > booth, and a couple of others, as well as dreddy kids selling their wares > > along that middle stretch of sidewalk between the Days Inn, and the >Holiday > > Inn Express. So this raises the question as to whether that vanishing >middle > > ground will be replaced by food, trinkets, and other paraphenalia in the > > future. Some sections of Tucson could go the route of other gem show, >seeing > > an increase in non rock related materials. > > > > Some kids paired up with registered dealers and obtained a few square feet > > of space in which to set out a case. I'll give em credit. I thought that >was > > a fairly creative solution to the high cost of being at Tucson. I kept > > hearing the words of Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park: "Life finds a way". > > Next year there will probably be a city ordinance against street vending. >Or > > if there already is, next year it will be enforced. Then the kids will >have > > to find somewhere just around the corner where they can be less visible >but > > still engage in trade. > > > > I camped in the dust, stayed in posh hotels, played music all night by a > > fire, visited with the affluent as well as the squalid, rockhounded for a > > week, got lost one dark night, but finally found my rig, dined in the >finest > > clubs, scraped the last of my campfire beans with a melted plastic fork, > > went hot tubbing with some beautiful internationals, lost blood in the > > hills, and generally had a great time. I'll be back next year! > > > > Warm Regards to all - Scott Blair > > Ashland Rock Shop, Ashland, Oregon > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:23:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:23:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> Message-ID: <3E599E1D.26AE@Tomaszewski.net> Henry, For more than 15 years I have been visiting classrooms in lower elementary and jr hi to share some of my collection (and corresponding knowledge of geology and history and science), and the joy of collecting and learning. A mineral collection, or the learned lessions from geology, has no value if it is not shared with the next generation. I have found that about 20% of any class (of any age) will actually be interested in what I present (and 80% of the rest will at least pay attention). Diminishing returns, as the long term seems to involve (at least) one more iteration of the 80/20 rule; 4% is the best that can be expected to pursue rockhounding/mineralogy long term. My Rockhounding hobby has given me much pleasure and knowledge over the past 40 some years. I believe I have a responsibility to pass my acquired knowledge and joy I treasure the (few) students who have come back to thank me for my part time efforts. My hat is off to you for taking on the future of our shared interests full-time. Kreigh J. A. Barwood wrote: > > Hi Cathy, > > This does not surprise me. The students I teach consider science 1) difficult 2) > boring 3) lacking in earnings potential and 4) a course they can catch up on > sleep in (!). Of course here in Alabama, we have had almost a decade of under > funding of higher education. K-12 has fared a little better, but not much. Sad > fact is that I can teach teachers science, but I am not qualified to teach in high > school (no certificate!). Go figure. > > Henry > > Cathy Gaber wrote: > > > >only about 2% plan on using the course for anything other than meeting a > > >science > > >requirement. The 2% are studying to be science teachers. I polled my fall > > >semester classes and only about 1 out of 10 students had any training in > > >earth > > >science in high school, and most of that was in 7-9th grade general > > >science (!). > > >In fact one of my students asked me recently how I could possibly have picked > > >science for a career. She felt that science was exceptionally boring (and > > >hard). > > >I can't speak for mineral collectors, but if my classes represent the > > >future, we > > >are in deep trouble. > > > > Dear Henry, > > > > Our son in law just got back from China. There are so few US graduates in > > science (he is some kind of a physicist), that he is having to go there > > to recruit graduate students. > > > > Cathy From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 20:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 23 20:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> <5.1.0.14.0.20030223215932.00a7ca10@mail.charter.net> Message-ID: <3E599F6F.1071384C@cox.net> Tommy, I have yet to meet the child for whom school "is boring," fail in a video game. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 22:24:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tommy Armstrong) Date: Sun Feb 23 22:24:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <3E599F6F.1071384C@cox.net> Message-ID: Teresa You are right I wish someone would design a game that could teach me miller indices as well as some of the other aspects of crytalography that I'd like to learn. But reading Patrick O'Brian is so much more fun. Tommy PS The reason some video games are not boring to children is that they are designed not to be boring. Perhaps some curricula could learn from their techniques. Traditional educators designing games make for boring games. Maybe we need to turn game designers into educators. Just a thought. I could imagine a pretty neat game that involved bouncing off ions in crystalline structure. > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Teresa Masters > Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 11:29 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson > > > Tommy, > I have yet to meet the child for whom school "is boring," fail in a > video game. > Teresa > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 23:05:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Sun Feb 23 23:05:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: Message-ID: <3E59C40E.B56AF085@cox.net> Tommy, Just think, giving a game programmer the idea to base the game's progress on coordinates of crystal faces. Or involving orbits of Planets into saving the World. Highly educated friends with a first born with retardation did not realize the depth of his ability until I pointed out to them his ease of use of Logo without being able to read. When my son gave his sons some slack in math comprehension, I pointed out to him their abilities to master angles or trajectories of weapons in their video games. I was amazed how few young ones today follow space shuttle activity, and even how lame some news media reporters were. How in just one to two generations did we get so blasé and blind to the earth and space? The methodology of educating the youth of today must change. One puffed out chest on another list maligned American Education recently. My ears got red. Somehow or other, we are missing the boat. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sun Feb 23 23:28:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sun Feb 23 23:28:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030223191546.00b3bb90@pop.mindspring.com> References: <3E596B59.A180E550@bluemarble.net> <200302232057.h1NKvl709707@mail.his.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223165136.023b2e90@mail.aloha.net> What I find puzzling and frustrating is that YOUNG kids are fascinated by science and engineering. Kindergarten children love Legos and trying to put things together and take them apart and figure out how things work. They love bugs and rocks and turtles. Up through fourth grade---and often through seventh or eighth grade---kids love doing science experiments and entering science fairs. But by age 14 or 15 most kids have begun to think that science is too hard and/or boring. My husband gives astronomy and I give rock & mineral demonstrations and talks at public schools, and we find that the interest and enthusiasm is highest at about grade four. By high school it is way down. The older kids slouch into the room with a very negative attitude. We can usually kindle some interest by the fact that we're doing or showing things their regular teachers don't, and by using all the tricks in our bags of teaching experience and our personal enthusiasm for our topics, but it's not easy. We've done this over a dozen years, and in some cases have gone back and seen the exact same kids who were wildly enthusiastic and entranced at age nine, appear bored and hostile eight years later. I realize that it is natural for kids to lose some of their enthusiasm as they get older, but I also have a depressing feeling that many science teachers at the higher grade levels are not of very high calibre. And I suspect that part of the reason for that is the low salaries that school teachers get in many states. Many teachers who are put in high school science classrooms have little or no science background, much less any training in special methods to teach science effectively. The reason for that is that bright college students who major in a science are seldom attracted to joining a profession that is not greatly respected by the general public and involves dealing with teenagers who are often troublesome or unmotivated, especially when those teachers often can aspire to earn only $34,000 a year at maximum number of years experience and amount of education (many states pay bonuses only for Masters Degrees...if you have a PhD...sorry about that). I have to believe that if individuals take an active part in our schools by volunteering in any way---not just in science, but also in art, music and performing arts (other areas that are often neglected)---they will will help improve the education of our youth. But supporting efforts to raise teacher salaries will also help. Citizens are willing to pay high fees for doctor and lawyers. Why do they balk at paying decent wages to those professionals who are responsible for our children's education, as well as their welfare for roughly 1/3 of the day five days a week? I guess I should apologize for getting a bit off topic and carried away, but I'm a retired teacher with 40 years of being loved by students and parents, but underpaid and denigrated by government administrations. Yes we teachers get a summer vacation, but most of us have to get extra summer jobs to meet expenses, and boy do we ever do unpaid overtime, from chaperoning dances to grading papers, from preparing lessons to guiding extracurricular activities---like Geology Club, or putting on the Spring Play! Aloha, Kitty At 04:20 PM 2/23/2003, you wrote: >Science is difficult > >Only if one is unable or too lazy to expend the effort to THINK. When all >is said and done, science and engineering both require the ability to >think critically, to ask questions, to make reasonable assumptions, to >test those assumptions and to learn from them. > >Next time one of them mentions the earnings potential thing, mention Bill >Gates. > >I apologize, I just see this as a symptom of over all laziness and a wish >to sleepwalk through life (or at least to not be challenged by anything) >it's hardly restricted to youth but it is discouraging to see on a large >scale. Heck just look at the crap that 'the media' has reported on >Columbia, it bears almost no reality to the actual information they were >given during tech briefings. > >ggrrrrrrggrrrrgrrrrrrrr --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) text/plain (text body -- kept) --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 03:55:59 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 03:55:59 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA References: Message-ID: <3E5A0836.000001.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Henry:=0D The local yokels didn't want us there. A property owner from across th= e river threatened to shoot us if we "trepassed" more than half way across = the river. Finally, the paper mill that allowed us access through their prope= rty withdrew their permission. We tried gaining access from a point further upstream and were run off by the sheriff. They threatened to put us in j= ail (I'm not sure what the charges would have been). Not wishing to slowly r= ot in a south Georgia jail, we stopped going. =0D There's more to the story, but it's not fit for publication.=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Friday, February 21, 2003 03:01:25 PM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA=0D =0D Anita Westlake wrote:=0D =0D =0D > Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite place of all time. I=0D > was able to collect there about 4 times before the place was closed=0D =0D Pardon my ignorance, but what happened to this locality? I remember years= =0D ago there would be regular trips there. If it is in the bottom of the riv= er,=0D I would assume you could boat down and collect. Thanks.=0D =0D Henry Barwood=0D =0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 04:25:10 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 04:25:10 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Haiku for a mineral collector References: <66.2ee3a9a1.2b8944c1@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E5A0EF4.000007.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Minerals, fossils=0D Vying for my attention=0D Time, so little time=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D > >Tucson is over.=0D > >The snow is melting quickly.=0D > >Is it really spring?=0D =0D =0D =0D --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D multipart/alternative=0D text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D text/html=0D ---=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 05:44:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 05:44:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia? Message-ID: <102.276f6cc0.2b8b7b7f@aol.com> Has anyone offered to pay for a fieldtrip to any of the land owners? Seems like at $5 per person a landowner would get over $100 for a day's permission for a club. There'll always be attempted trespassing, but an owner might get less trigger happy if once in a while he gets compensated for use of his resources. The fieldtrips could even alternate on different parts of the river. The local tax maps would give you the owner information. {There has been many a tale of false landowners saying you have to leave.} If you really wanted to go there, there must be a publicly owned bridge within a mile or so. Looking up the chapter and verse of the state's right of public access and sending a letter to the sheriff of your organization's intention's, citing these verses, would also be in order. You'd better have a legal place to park and a receipt! Taking pictures to prove your point would also help. Are there any local sportsman's organizations to offer advice or help? Certainly, mineral clubs might benefit by paying for an individual's membership to help the politics of it all. If you've already discussed these options, please accept my apologies for being inattentive. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 05:51:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 05:51:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <10f.1ee6195d.2b8b7cf6@aol.com> I was told that Bill Roberts' (robertsite, author SD Mineralogy, Encyclopedia of Minerals) library of antique mineral books ended up at a Goodwill Thrift Store in Rapid City, SD. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 05:51:08 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 05:51:08 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia? References: <102.276f6cc0.2b8b7b7f@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E5A2332.00001F.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Van:=0D You have given me some food for thought. Thanks for the suggestions. I'= ll be taking this up with the executive board of my mineral club when next w= e meet. =0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Monday, February 24, 2003 08:44:19 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia?=0D =0D Has anyone offered to pay for a fieldtrip to any of the land owners? Seem= s =0D like at $5 per person a landowner would get over $100 for a day's permiss= ion =0D for a club. There'll always be attempted trespassing, but an owner might = get =0D less trigger happy if once in a while he gets compensated for use of his = =0D resources. The fieldtrips could even alternate on different parts of the = =0D river. The local tax maps would give you the owner information. {There ha= s =0D been many a tale of false landowners saying you have to leave.}=0D =0D If you really wanted to go there, there must be a publicly owned bridge =0D within a mile or so. Looking up the chapter and verse of the state's righ= t of =0D public access and sending a letter to the sheriff of your organization's = =0D intention's, citing these verses, would also be in order. You'd better ha= ve a =0D legal place to park and a receipt! Taking pictures to prove your point wo= uld =0D also help. Are there any local sportsman's organizations to offer advice = or =0D help? Certainly, mineral clubs might benefit by paying for an individual'= s =0D membership to help the politics of it all.=0D =0D If you've already discussed these options, please accept my apologies for= =0D being inattentive.=0D =0D Van=0D =0D =0D --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D multipart/alternative=0D text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D text/html=0D ---=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 05:55:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 05:55:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <18.2d297360.2b8b7e0d@aol.com> Yes, hard copy is preferable and I only use hardcopy whenever possible.Format changes will likely slow down after a while and become less of a headache. I wonder how many clubs have an archive of their last ten presidents? Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:00:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:00:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <18.2d297360.2b8b7e0d@aol.com> Message-ID: <3E5A253F.000022.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> The Georgia Mineral Society has an archive of all our past presidents, starting in 1935! We also have an "historian" who keeps a copy of our newsletters and files them with the Atlanta Historical Society along with other papers we wish to preserve. You know what might be a good idea? To have someone write a brief bio on the past presidents. Years from now (or even tomorrow) we won't have a clue who those folks were.=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Monday, February 24, 2003 08:55:10 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection=0D =0D Yes, hard copy is preferable and I only use hardcopy whenever possible Format =0D changes will likely slow down after a while and become less of a headache= =2E=0D =0D I wonder how many clubs have an archive of their last ten presidents?=0D =0D Van=0D =0D =0D --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D multipart/alternative=0D text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D text/html=0D ---=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:00:59 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:00:59 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <120.1e470165.2b8b7f90@aol.com> I was the estate appraiser for Arnold Fainberg's collection. It had 1100 flats of specimens, of these 600 flats had no labels therein. There were, however, about ten flats of isolated labels. I managed to identify about 200 of the flats, but as he was interested in very erudite localities, the rest went to a dealer as is. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:10:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Henry Barwood) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:10:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia? In-Reply-To: <3E5A2332.00001F.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: Anita, One other suggestion, A lot of mineral rich land is tied up in hunting clubs. If the mineral clubs could band together and offer an incentive to the timber companies to make the area available to rock and mineral collecting during the off-season it might prove to be a worthwhile effort. I can see that this might be palatable to the hunting clubs if some agreement to shoulder part of their fees could be arranged. You might mention this. Along with the DMC, this would be one of the best ways I can think of to ensure continued access to collecting areas. Henry -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Anita Westlake Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 7:51 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia? Van: You have given me some food for thought. Thanks for the suggestions. I'll be taking this up with the executive board of my mineral club when next we meet. Anita -------Original Message------- From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Date: Monday, February 24, 2003 08:44:19 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] No free ride in Georgia? Has anyone offered to pay for a fieldtrip to any of the land owners? Seems like at $5 per person a landowner would get over $100 for a day's permission for a club. There'll always be attempted trespassing, but an owner might get less trigger happy if once in a while he gets compensated for use of his resources. The fieldtrips could even alternate on different parts of the river. The local tax maps would give you the owner information. {There has been many a tale of false landowners saying you have to leave.} If you really wanted to go there, there must be a publicly owned bridge within a mile or so. Looking up the chapter and verse of the state's right of public access and sending a letter to the sheriff of your organization's intention's, citing these verses, would also be in order. You'd better have a legal place to park and a receipt! Taking pictures to prove your point would also help. Are there any local sportsman's organizations to offer advice or help? Certainly, mineral clubs might benefit by paying for an individual's membership to help the politics of it all. If you've already discussed these options, please accept my apologies for being inattentive. Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds . --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:12:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:12:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <14c.1c400eec.2b8b81f9@aol.com> Yes, you're right. All of our discussions hinge on the idea that somebody actually cares. Have lots of family photos without identifications on the back. No one left to ask about the names of the people - friends, family, bystanders? Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:18:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:18:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson Message-ID: <17b.16b27388.2b8b837a@aol.com> You got to remember that Tucson started the day of the space shuttle tragedy. It shouldn't be much of a strectch for the airlines to realize that flying is less fun. I now talk off my shoes with the metal shanks to save the time. Also stip off my belt. Maybe you could make a fortune in an airplane friendly clothing line? Van --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:45:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Gary Brown) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:45:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223165136.023b2e90@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: Well said! Volunteering is really important. Due to budget cuts the band director in my son's junior high has to teach...ready for this...EIGHT bands. I've volunteered to take the jazz band (Tuesday and Thursday mornings at 7 AM is Waaayyyy too early). As I told the band leader...if 40 years from now just ONE kid from that jazz band is hanging around a bar after a gig talking music with his or her buddies I've done my job. That reminds me... I've got to make up a bag of shark's teeth for my sweetie's 5th grade class. That is...if she still has a job. She teaches in inner-city Minneapolis. 90% poverty level. 20% ESL. And what are they going to do? Possibly cut her job and make the left-over classes bigger. Oh well, I guess they are willing to spend $100 in the future for jail costs when you could have kept a kid out of the slammer for $10 in classroom support. Go figure. GcB I have to believe that if individuals take an active part in our schools by volunteering in any way---not just in science, but also in art, music and performing arts (other areas that are often neglected)---they will will help improve the education of our youth. But supporting efforts to raise teacher salaries will also help. Citizens are willing to pay high fees for doctor and lawyers. Why do they balk at paying decent wages to those professionals who are responsible for our children's education, as well as their welfare for roughly 1/3 of the day five days a week? From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 06:47:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Gary Brown) Date: Mon Feb 24 06:47:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: <10f.1ee6195d.2b8b7cf6@aol.com> Message-ID: *gack* That's depressing. I took mineralogy at SD Tech back in the early 70's. I used to love going over to the museum and hanging around with that bunch. gcb > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of ANNWB2@aol.com > Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 7:50 AM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection > > > I was told that Bill Roberts' (robertsite, author SD Mineralogy, > Encyclopedia > of Minerals) library of antique mineral books ended up at a > Goodwill Thrift > Store in Rapid City, SD. > > Van > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 07:43:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Tommy Armstrong) Date: Mon Feb 24 07:43:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223165136.023b2e90@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: Kitty Wrote: " but I also have a depressing feeling that many science teachers at the higher grade levels are not of very high calibre. And I suspect that part of the reason for that is the low salaries that school teachers get in many states. Many teachers who are put in high school science classrooms have little or no science background, much less any training in special methods to teach science effectively." All that I have found to be true with two through HS and one in. But what I have found is that most science teachers, and teachers in general have very little enthusiasm about what they teach. I always used to complain about athletic coaches teaching academic subjects. But I have changed my mind this year. My girl's earth science teacher is a coach of the girls basketball team, I think. Being a good coach involves enthusiasm and motivation and a little bit of theory. Lets face it, anyone with a fair amount of study and a reasonable intelligence can master the material of most of a high school curricula(except perhaps for cooking and calculus). We are not talking x-ray crystallography or miller indices here. The curriculum is pretty much laid out with the books and teacher guides. What is needed is the enthusiasm, and most of all a good sense of humor and a willingness to relate to the students, and if possible relate the subject to their lives. This is the reason the so called certification is very much a sham. There are literally thousands out there who could be great teachers in their area of expertise but are prevented because they have not taken child psychology or whatever. And now that I think of it, you never teach a kid to learn anything---you just coach him to learn it himself. (of course there are a lot of bad coaches, too). I once had a geometry teacher who taught half the principles of geometry with analogies to a pool table. Now that is relating to something USEFUL. Kitty Wrote: > I guess I should apologize for getting a bit off topic and carried away,... Don't apologize! Tommy Armstrong N 35* 23' 52'' W 78* 49' 9'' > as well as > their welfare for roughly 1/3 of the day five days a week? > > I guess I should apologize for getting a bit off topic and carried away, > but I'm a retired teacher with 40 years of being loved by students and > parents, but underpaid and denigrated by government administrations. Yes > we teachers get a summer vacation, but most of us have to get > extra summer > jobs to meet expenses, and boy do we ever do unpaid overtime, from > chaperoning dances to grading papers, from preparing lessons to guiding > extracurricular activities---like Geology Club, or putting on the > Spring Play! > > Aloha, Kitty > > > > > At 04:20 PM 2/23/2003, you wrote: > > >Science is difficult > > > >Only if one is unable or too lazy to expend the effort to THINK. > When all > >is said and done, science and engineering both require the ability to > >think critically, to ask questions, to make reasonable assumptions, to > >test those assumptions and to learn from them. > > > >Next time one of them mentions the earnings potential thing, > mention Bill > >Gates. > > > >I apologize, I just see this as a symptom of over all laziness > and a wish > >to sleepwalk through life (or at least to not be challenged by anything) > >it's hardly restricted to youth but it is discouraging to see on a large > >scale. Heck just look at the crap that 'the media' has reported on > >Columbia, it bears almost no reality to the actual information they were > >given during tech briefings. > > > >ggrrrrrrggrrrrgrrrrrrrr > > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release Date: 2/13/2003 > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/mixed > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/plain (text body -- kept) > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 07:58:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Mon Feb 24 07:58:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <18.2d297360.2b8b7e0d@aol.com> <3E5A253F.000022.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: <3E5A40F2.8ED1AC85@cox.net> Anita, and all, Most suggestions are solid and pertinent. Yours about a bio needs to be extended. There is more information in graves then in the historian's record, and when the historian dies. Heirs and Bank Trustees have no clue to the value of those boxes of papers and photos, and yes some do wind up in Thrift Stores, but most in the dumpster. I received two cartons of material when I reached chair of a committee, it was a hodge podge a former society president and I were hard pressed to identify. When was this Crystal Award won, for what, by whom? Each significant piece must be accompanied by a short bio, otherwise history is lost. Personality is another factor, committee appointments are too frequently not well thought out. We encountered a new member who felt the protocol was cumbersome and not necessary. That was a very destructive year, regular donations were halted because they were not properly acknowledged. Records were "lost." Some were afraid to make waves, resolution came too late. We are all volunteers in most societies, in some cases the paperwork can be as important as the minerals, prior posts attest to that. Homes now sit on, cars no park on some of the greatest collecting areas ever. Owners of the homes, drivers of the cars have no clue. Records of the sites former life is in the city dump. There has to be a better way, and everyone must agree just what it is. Federations and clubs need to set this in motion while we still have some of both. There are more former members of both who hounded by club politics, left in frustration. Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:10:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:10:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA In-Reply-To: <3E5A0836.000001.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: <20030224160904.46319.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> Check with the (I don't know whcih dept) but if it is declared a navigalble waterway no one can stop you from going on ther river or collecting in it up to the high water bank.... That is where most peoples property starts) but the river bottom is yours. However the creek that we collected in at Georgia Pacific is on Private land. However I heard that you got run off over 15 years ago. Maybe people and definityl sheriffs changed. I would go back and re-try the whole thing because it was a sweet thanksgiving spot. You aught to see the Carnellian pieces I got form down there. --- Anita Westlake wrote: > Henry: > The local yokels didn't want us there. A property > owner from across the > river threatened to shoot us if we "trepassed" more > than half way across the > river. Finally, the paper mill that allowed us > access through their property > withdrew their permission. We tried gaining access > from a point further > upstream and were run off by the sheriff. They > threatened to put us in jail > (I'm not sure what the charges would have been). > Not wishing to slowly rot > in a south Georgia jail, we stopped going. > There's more to the story, but it's not fit for > publication. > > Anita > > -------Original Message------- > > From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Date: Friday, February 21, 2003 03:01:25 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA > > Anita Westlake wrote: > > > > Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite > place of all time. I > > was able to collect there about 4 times before the > place was closed > > Pardon my ignorance, but what happened to this > locality? I remember years > ago there would be regular trips there. If it is in > the bottom of the river, > I would assume you could boat down and collect. > Thanks. > > Henry Barwood > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > . > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/related > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > image/gif > image/jpeg > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:18:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (William S. Cordua) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:18:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.0.20030223165136.023b2e90@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: I have to agree that enthusiasm is a crucial factor in educating - even in college level teaching. If the students see that you care passionately about your topic, they will begin to care too. I recall hearing a new professor lamenting that they had to leacture that day on weathering in introductory geology, a topic they found boring. To me, that is an exciting topic because it relates to geological processes that one can walk right out the door anywhere and SEE IMMEDIATELY. Sure, there are no erupting volcanoes or sparkly gemstones, but we are talking about what hits you in the pocket book in the form of pot holes or what gives us soil for our food. I guess the point is that ANY topic can be made interesting if you put some thought into the approach. Skilled, motivated teachers do that - and they deserve better than what they get. It takes background and knowledge to to see the various angles you might take with a subject. Incidentally some one recently commented on the list about a professor who refered to people as "temporarily not soil". That was the late Francis Hole, a soils professor at UW- Madison. He was, among other distinguished achievements, the driving force behind our state legislature designating a state soil - the Antigo silt loam. He reasoned that an agricultural state like Wisconsin needed to commemorate one of its most fertile soils. He even wrote a song about it (words set to the tune of "Simple Gifts") which was taught to school children who enthusiastically sang it. Now there was a great teacher! Best wishes - Bill Cordua Dr. William S. Cordua Professor of Geology/Mineralogy University of Wisconsin - River Falls 410 South Third Street River Falls, WI 54022 715-425-3139 william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu "Speak to the Earth and it shall teach thee" - Job 12:8 From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:26:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Henry Barwood) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:26:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection In-Reply-To: <3E5A40F2.8ED1AC85@cox.net> Message-ID: Teresa, and all, If I might respond on a personal note. Three years ago my father died of Alzheimer's after nearly a decade long battle with the disease. His passing, and the degeneration of his memory, took vast amounts of information that he had regarding mineral and fossil localities to his grave. In the real world we call this "institutional memory". I could cite literally dozens of examples where the life work of an individual was made useless by lack of documentation and simply writing down something. When I was young(er) I didn't make notes and prepare road logs to localities. Now many of them are simply gone. For the last 20 years, I keep reasonably detailed field notebooks that record where I went, what I found and all pertinent details about a location. Someday my son and daughter may want to use them to find a spot. Who knows? Henry -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Teresa Masters Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 9:58 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Anita, and all, Most suggestions are solid and pertinent. Yours about a bio needs to be extended. There is more information in graves then in the historian's record, and when the historian dies. Heirs and Bank Trustees have no clue to the value of those boxes of papers and photos, and yes some do wind up in Thrift Stores, but most in the dumpster. I received two cartons of material when I reached chair of a committee, it was a hodge podge a former society president and I were hard pressed to identify. When was this Crystal Award won, for what, by whom? Each significant piece must be accompanied by a short bio, otherwise history is lost. Personality is another factor, committee appointments are too frequently not well thought out. We encountered a new member who felt the protocol was cumbersome and not necessary. That was a very destructive year, regular donations were halted because they were not properly acknowledged. Records were "lost." Some were afraid to make waves, resolution came too late. We are all volunteers in most societies, in some cases the paperwork can be as important as the minerals, prior posts attest to that. Homes now sit on, cars no park on some of the greatest collecting areas ever. Owners of the homes, drivers of the cars have no clue. Records of the sites former life is in the city dump. There has to be a better way, and everyone must agree just what it is. Federations and clubs need to set this in motion while we still have some of both. There are more former members of both who hounded by club politics, left in frustration. Teresa _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:42:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:42:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <200302241641.h1OGfaB1020396@bubbleator.drizzle.com> > There has to be a better way, and everyone must agree just what it is. My dear Teresa, et al., I don't think the problem is knowing the better way; I think the real problem-- with anything that needs to be fixed, in any context--boils down to time or money or both. There are plenty of people who know the best way to do things; but they simply don't get done. By the way, surely as a child you heard the fable, "Who will bell the cat"? A few cases in point: * In my computing career, I have often written best practices, one guide being 200 pages long. Management might praise such efforts, and initial enthusiasm might give hope, but unless such practices are adopted with consistency and discipline, and instilled in each new generation, they have only theoretical value. * Often, in the volunteer world, a member will say, "Someone should . . . " When I am in a position of leadership, I will answer, "That's true, someone should; would you like to?" Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't, but for the record, I have never seen a membership list containing the names "Some One" or "Some Body." I have been fortunate to know some very motivated people. However, whether you are talking about work or hobbies, you find 20% of the people doing 80% of the work, and the more you do the more they ask of you. That's how I got myself into a bind, by overcommitting to things, and only in the last year did I really learn to say "Sorry, no" a lot. * I fund my own research and get some minimal support from people and institutions. However, the balance is far in the red on my half. Yet, every time I give a demonstration or lecture, afterward someone is sure to say, "You know what you should do, run an analysis of and that way you'd find out the rare earth activators . . . " To which my response is along the lines of, "That's a good idea, tell you what, buy me an inductively coupled plasma spectrometer, which is the only way to do that test, and I'll gladly run it." That might sound harsh, but 90% of the time their heads wobble like a cartoon character who just had an anvil dropped on his head, and they are enlightened. Everything costs money in some way or another. Even keeping tons of club archives takes up effort and space and the cost of printing, and buying folders and binders, etc. Bottom line: we know what we should do. We know how to do it. Now, who is going to do it, and who is going to do it after they die, forever throughout time? In my 39 brief years on earth, I've seen the same patterns exhibit themselves in every club, charity, military unit and workplace I've been. Those in which a motivated, disciplined, cohesive group of people work together survive; those in which they don't, don't. This is the great strength and also the great weakness of humanity. Don From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:47:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:47:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] spelling In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030221152319.0292cec0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <20030224164652.80101.qmail@web20001.mail.yahoo.com> No,.... Katy, Texas :-) --- Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > At 09:48 AM 2/21/2003, you wrote: > > >Dear Rockhounds: > > > >asterated or asteriated? > > > >Thanks, Caty > > > Not to be picky, but: Caty or Cathy? > > Kitty > > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system > (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.455 / Virus Database: 255 - Release > Date: 2/13/2003 > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/mixed > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/plain (text body -- kept) > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:57:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Scott Blair) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:57:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: Message-ID: Dear Group: Thanks to everyone for all the positive comments. I always appreciate the unexpected turns a thread.will take, expecially when people cooperate, and tolerate, and there are no flames. I was in Tucson, at the Inn Suites, running around, doing my best, like an ant in the sugar bowl, when I saw a somber faced President Bush on one of the dealer's TV screens. He was saying something about courage, and "they will always have the respect and gratitude of this county" etc. Honestly, it took me a minute to realize he was talking about something other than war. Then I saw the all too familiar (for me) debris streaking across the sky. I still remember the Challenger shuttle disaster, almost like it was yesterday. Does time perception change as you age? I'm afraid that I'll reach the end of my life and be saying, "wait a minute, I'm still a child, I never got to experience real adulthood!" Since this thread seemed to turn into a discussion of the state of science education, I'll say this: I too go into schools periodically to give basic geology presentations. I don't advertise it, because I'm afraid that if I did, I'd be swamped. In the ridiculous pace of today's schools, there's a lot of teachers who are desperate for any kind of a break so that they can regain a semblance of composure. One of the things I did was hold a mini rock sale at a local elementary school, in the main hall, during the lunch hour. I had real low educational type pricing, and I brought materials that I was sick of looking at, but that would be real cool to have if you were a grade schooler. I tell you I was swamped! I was far more busy than I have ever been at any "official" gem and mineral show. I'm telling you, it's a good thing I had a lot of pennys and nickles in the old change box, because trading was brisk! The kids went nuts. They were talking about rocks and comparing specimens in the halls, on the playground, in the principal's office. The whole school just ignited with enthusiasm. I almost felt guilty for starting some kind of a riot or something. We have lost that school since then, due to the budget cuts. Those halls no longer echo with excited voices. But I still have to laugh, remembering all that ruckus:) Warm Regards - Scott Blair Ashland Rock, Ashland, Oregon From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 08:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Stephen stover) Date: Mon Feb 24 08:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Texas Topas's -- Sequist Ranch In-Reply-To: <200302241641.h1OGfaB1020396@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <20030224165805.57756.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> Alright guys, Yesterday I was hunting Texas Topazes out on Sequist Ranch. This is the second time I have been out there and the only thing I found was a pretty well made broker arrow point. However, unless somje of this stuff I got is a topaz I did not get any ghems. What I want to know is.... has anyone found any and if you did some inof about the gems. Size of the stones what they look like, and where did you find it in honey creek or up in the gulch among the granite knobs. I just want to know where to go the next time. By the way the trip still was great. I got a couple nice big pices of flint and large grain pink granite. Communing with nature is always a trill and wathcing my 5 year old jump among the rocks and splash in the creek was great. He is becoming a real outdoorsboy. ===== Stephen F. Stover PH (713) 829-1102 xossfs@yahoo.com Wanting to hunt rocks and play games every day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 09:26:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 09:26:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA References: <20030224160904.46319.qmail@web20007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E5A5591.000042.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Yes, we tried using the "navigable waterway" tactic but we didn't have al= l the facts and were dealing with people who talk with guns first. We were also aware that the landowner couldn't claim his property stretched halfw= ay across the river. But out of respect for his feelings, (and our hides) we only collected on the opposite side. We got run off about 10 years ago. I= t's definitely worth pursuing again, but "armed" with better information and maybe a couple of pecan pies this time!=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Monday, February 24, 2003 11:10:15 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA=0D =0D Check with the (I don't know whcih dept) but if it is=0D declared a navigalble waterway no one can stop you=0D from going on ther river or collecting in it up to the=0D high water bank.... That is where most peoples=0D property starts) but the river bottom is yours. =0D However the creek that we collected in at Georgia=0D Pacific is on Private land. However I heard that you=0D got run off over 15 years ago. Maybe people and=0D definityl sheriffs changed. I would go back and=0D re-try the whole thing because it was a sweet=0D thanksgiving spot.=0D =0D You aught to see the Carnellian pieces I got form down=0D there.=0D =0D =0D --- Anita Westlake wrote:=0D > Henry:=0D > The local yokels didn't want us there. A property=0D > owner from across the=0D > river threatened to shoot us if we "trepassed" more=0D > than half way across the=0D > river. Finally, the paper mill that allowed us=0D > access through their property=0D > withdrew their permission. We tried gaining access=0D > from a point further=0D > upstream and were run off by the sheriff. They=0D > threatened to put us in jail=0D > (I'm not sure what the charges would have been).=0D > Not wishing to slowly rot=0D > in a south Georgia jail, we stopped going. =0D > There's more to the story, but it's not fit for=0D > publication.=0D > =0D > Anita=0D > =0D > -------Original Message-------=0D > =0D > From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D > Date: Friday, February 21, 2003 03:01:25 PM=0D > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA=0D > =0D > Anita Westlake wrote:=0D > =0D > =0D > > Ah, yes! The Withlacoochee River! My favorite=0D > place of all time. I=0D > > was able to collect there about 4 times before the=0D > place was closed=0D > =0D > Pardon my ignorance, but what happened to this=0D > locality? I remember years=0D > ago there would be regular trips there. If it is in=0D > the bottom of the river,=0D > I would assume you could boat down and collect.=0D > Thanks.=0D > =0D > Henry Barwood=0D > =0D > _______________________________________________=0D > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > Subscription Services:=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D > . =0D > =0D > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---=0D > multipart/related=0D > multipart/alternative=0D > text/plain (text body -- kept)=0D > text/html=0D > image/gif=0D > image/jpeg=0D > ---=0D > _______________________________________________=0D > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D > Subscription Services:=0D > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =0D =0D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=0D Stephen F. Stover=0D PH (713) 829-1102=0D xossfs@yahoo.com=0D =0D Wanting to hunt rocks =0D and play games every day!=0D =0D __________________________________________________=0D Do you Yahoo!?=0D Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more=0D http://taxes.yahoo.com/=0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 09:46:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Mon Feb 24 09:46:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Random thoughts on Quartzsite and Tucson References: Message-ID: <3E5A5A2D.4E4B3D8@cox.net> Scott, Re: > Does time perception change as you age? I'm afraid > that I'll reach the end of my life and be saying, "wait a minute, I'm still > a child, I never got to experience real adulthood!" > > It is your personal enthusiasm that is the catalyst. I still remember my grandson happily clambering in the back of your pick up, going through flats with your permission, and enjoying his finds. There are still clubs who do not allow children, some of those members do also go to schools at the request of teachers. Many of them are wonderful, some are dour. You know the results. Look around at shows and tailgates where there is a school field day. Clever dealers who realize what children represent provide materials their quarters and folded dollars can buy. Others sit there beer in hand and glower at the kids to make sure they don't steal anything. Some of these folks never had a kid in them, depression time forced that out of them and they never regained a glint in the eye or enjoyed anything. They are good salt of the earth people, they are our friends, fellow club members, firm in their beliefs that kids today have it too easy and do not have to work for a thing. They are also parents or grandparents of today's teachers, So now what do we do? I love what you did, in that no longer school. Perhaps you have given that idea to many among us, I hope so. We have to find a way to make up for the field trips schools no longer offer. Yes, bring the Museum to the school yard. We already have lost too much, lets stop the bleed. What I had as part of my education in public schools in addition to academic subjects, that is no longer part of many school district protocols. Art Appreciation, Music Appreciation, Home Economics, sewing, cooking, embroidery, Literature Appreciation History and Geography as single subjects, not Social Studies, Civics, What was available for the "boys" but not girls, Wood Shop Electric Shop Metals Shop. What my grandsons had that was not available in my time, Critical thinking, Logical thinking, Math Games using Legos and Robots. Yup, just thinking out loud again. Teresa --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 09:48:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Mon Feb 24 09:48:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <200302241641.h1OGfaB1020396@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <3E5A5ACD.576F62F1@cox.net> Don, Amen, Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 09:51:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Mon Feb 24 09:51:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: Message-ID: <3E5A5B4A.D5418C41@cox.net> Henry, Too often the memory is gone before we realize it, if ever. Watching it happen is extremely painful, I know. Thanks, Teresa From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 09:55:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Anita Westlake) Date: Mon Feb 24 09:55:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection References: <200302241641.h1OGfaB1020396@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <3E5A5C43.000045.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Don:=0D You are wise beyond your years. I have always enjoyed reading your well written posts and find you to be a highly evolved being. If I had money, = I'd fund any type of research you'd care to do. If I win the lottery, I'll se= nd you an email and we'll chat!=0D =0D Anita=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Date: Monday, February 24, 2003 11:42:12 AM=0D To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com=0D Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection=0D =0D > There has to be a better way, and everyone must agree just what it is.=0D =0D My dear Teresa, et al.,=0D =0D I don't think the problem is knowing the better way; I think the real problem--=0D with anything that needs to be fixed, in any context--boils down to time = or money =0D or both. There are plenty of people who know the best way to do things; b= ut they =0D simply don't get done. By the way, surely as a child you heard the fable,= =20 Who will =0D bell the cat"? A few cases in point:=0D =0D * In my computing career, I have often written best practices, one guide being 200 pages =0D long. Management might praise such efforts, and initial enthusiasm might give hope, but =0D unless such practices are adopted with consistency and discipline, and instilled in each new =0D generation, they have only theoretical value.=0D =0D * Often, in the volunteer world, a member will say, "Someone should . . .= " When I am in a =0D position of leadership, I will answer, "That's true, someone should; woul= d you like to?" Sometimes =0D they do, sometimes they don't, but for the record, I have never seen a membership list containing =0D the names "Some One" or "Some Body." I have been fortunate to know some v= ery motivated people. =0D However, whether you are talking about work or hobbies, you find 20% of t= he people doing 80% of the work,=0D and the more you do the more they ask of you. That's how I got myself int= o a bind, by overcommitting to=0D things, and only in the last year did I really learn to say "Sorry, no" a lot.=0D =0D * I fund my own research and get some minimal support from people and institutions. However, the =0D balance is far in the red on my half. Yet, every time I give a demonstrat= ion or lecture, afterward someone =0D is sure to say, "You know what you should do, run an analysis of and that way you'd find out the =0D rare earth activators . . . " To which my response is along the lines of,= =20 That's a good idea, tell you what, =0D buy me an inductively coupled plasma spectrometer, which is the only way = to do that test, and I'll gladly run it."=0D That might sound harsh, but 90% of the time their heads wobble like a cartoon character who just had an anvil =0D dropped on his head, and they are enlightened. Everything costs money in some way or another. Even keeping tons =0D of club archives takes up effort and space and the cost of printing, and buying folders and binders, etc.=0D =0D Bottom line: we know what we should do. We know how to do it. Now, who is going to do it, and who is going to do it =0D after they die, forever throughout time? In my 39 brief years on earth, I= 've seen the same patterns exhibit themselves =0D in every club, charity, military unit and workplace I've been. Those in which a motivated, disciplined, cohesive group =0D of people work together survive; those in which they don't, don't. This i= s the great strength and also the great weakness=0D of humanity.=0D =0D Don=0D =0D =0D _______________________________________________=0D Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List=0D WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds=0D Subscription Services:=0D http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds=0D =2E=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/gif image/jpeg --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 10:03:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Henry Barwood) Date: Mon Feb 24 10:03:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA In-Reply-To: <3E5A5591.000042.01180@anitaw.library.emory.edu> Message-ID: I've done a lot of field work over the years and some people are just plain unreasonable. About 1 in 10 landowners are convinced that anything you dig up has GOT to be valuable. I gave up a long time ago trying to convince them otherwise. Some landlords are nice people and if you show them what you are doing they not only treat you nicely, but often will become collectors themselves (!). There are places I collect year after year because the atmosphere towards collectors is favorable. I would rather collect "dog rock" at a place a feel comfortable (and welcome) than rubies looking at a gun toting curmudgeon. Henry -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Anita Westlake Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 11:26 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Withlacoochee River, GA Yes, we tried using the "navigable waterway" tactic but we didn't have all the facts and were dealing with people who talk with guns first. We were also aware that the landowner couldn't claim his property stretched halfway across the river. But out of respect for his feelings, (and our hides) we only collected on the opposite side. We got run off about 10 years ago. It's definitely worth pursuing again, but "armed" with better information and maybe a couple of pecan pies this time! Anita From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 11:38:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (William S. Cordua) Date: Mon Feb 24 11:38:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Antigo silt loam song Message-ID: Well, gang, since I brought it up, several folks have asked about the Antigo soil song. You can get the transcripts of it, as well as see other work by the late Francis Hole at; http://www.wi.nrcs.usda.gov/soil/antigo.asp .Scan down the page a bit for more links on soil education (including a soil puppet show with Terre Loam). I think this is on-topic - after all, a lot of soil is just micromounts with organic material mixed in. One of the items on the page is this quote - relevant to earth science teaching for certain. We do miss Francis. - Bill Cordua >I remember taking a hike led by Francis Hole during a "Prairies Jubilee" >festival held at Goose Pond > Sanctuary in Arlington, Wisconsin. We walked down the road a bit, >with Dr. Hole in the lead, playing his > fiddle and singing songs extolling the glories and mysteries of >Soil. Suddenly he stopped playing, halting the > march. He had us take off our shoes and socks and step barefooted >out onto the prairie soil. "No talking > now," he said. "Just walk quietly through the grasses and >contemplate the complex and beautiful, yet > unseen, world beneath your feet." He led on, playing a soft tune on >his fiddle. I had a feeling that I was in a > wonderful church. > --Martha C. Anderson, PhD (Astronomy), Asst. Scientist (Soil Sci.) Dr. William S. Cordua Professor of Geology/Mineralogy University of Wisconsin - River Falls 410 South Third Street River Falls, WI 54022 715-425-3139 william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu "Speak to the Earth and it shall teach thee" - Job 12:8 From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 14:30:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 14:30:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Saving your own collection Message-ID: <76.2a9b8314.2b8bf6bb@aol.com> In a message dated 2/24/03 2:01:34 PM Pacific Standard Time, hbarwood@troyst.edu writes: > His passing, and the degeneration of his memory, took vast amounts of > information that he had regarding mineral and fossil localities to his > grave. In the real world > we call this "institutional memory". > Also, unless he was a genealogist -- and a writer -- he took volumes of information about your ancestors with him. I saw a line once about 'every time an old person dies it is like a library burning down.' I wish I had sent more time listing to my parents and less time trying to change their belief system. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 18:46:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 18:46:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gem Show Message-ID: <95.2a574b17.2b870159@aol.com> Delaware Mineralogical Society, Inc. 40th Annual Earth Science Gem and Mineral Show http://www.delminsociety.org Saturday, March 1, 2003 - 10 A.M. to 6 P.M. Sunday, March 2, 2003 - 11 A.M. to 5 P.M. Waterfall Banquet and Conference Center (formerly Brandywine Terrace); 3416 Philadelphia Pike; Claymont, DE To foster interest in geology, mineralogy, paleontology and the lapidary arts Tickets available at the door; Adults $4.00, Seniors $3.00, Juniors $2.50 (12-16), and children under 12 free with paying adult Show Features include: Interesting and educational exhibits of mineral, lapidary and fossil specimens, Displays from regional and university museums, Outstanding dealers of minerals, fossils, gems, jewelry and lapidary supplies, Hourly door prizes and large specimen raffle, Lapidary demonstrations, Microscopes for viewing mineral specimens, Children's booth where youngsters may purchase inexpensive minerals, fossils and grab bags. For further information, contact: Gene Hartstein, (302) 234-4488 (E-Mail- fossilnut@aol.com) (Publicity Chair) or Keith Robertson (302) 838-6989 (E-Mail- hemipristis@aol.com) (President) or Alex Kane (610) 274-8228 (E-Mail- Aandmkane@aol.com) (Show Chair) Directions to Show: >From Philadelphia and Northeast: Take the I-95 SOUTH to I-495 SOUTH. Take the US-13/PHILA. PIKE exit South towards CLAYMONT. Keep RIGHT at the fork in the ramp. Merge onto PHILADELPHIA PIKE/US-13. South. Stay straight on PHILADELPHIA PIKE/US-13 South. The location is on the west side (right) of the road less than 1-mile from the I-495 Exit. >From Baltimore and South: Take I-95 NORTH to Harvey Road exit. Bear right at exit and proceed to T in road. Turn Left at T onto US 13 North and proceed approximately 1 mile. The location is on the left side of the road. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 18:46:32 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (J Panico) Date: Mon Feb 24 18:46:32 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Californian Gem and Mineral Show this Weekend. Message-ID: <3E5AD0F9.6B14EF4A@attbi.com> The Castro Valley Gem and Mineral Society is having our annual show this coming weekend, February 28 - March 3. (10-6 Friday and Saturday. 10-5 Sunday.) Held in Hayward at Centineal Hall off Foothill Blvd. Live Auction held @ 2pm on Sunday. Demonstrations, food and more. Fluorescent Mineral Display being featured along with other display cases from members. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 21:22:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Russ R) Date: Mon Feb 24 21:22:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] kentucky collecting Message-ID: <3E5AFCB1.B69EBD50@provide.net> Hi all Ill be takeng a trip to the Mammoth Cave area next weekend and would like to do a little collecting. This winter collecting in a rock shop makes sense but field collecting is always preferred. My target area is between Louisville and Bowling Green. I did a search for rock shops in the yellow pages and came up empty. If anyone has a favorite shop or a stream bed or field that they would like to share I would be thankfull. Russ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 22:46:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Mon Feb 24 22:46:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3E5ABD6C.11290.181988A@localhost> This is a long story, just so you know. Thanks for your report, Scott, and your musings on Tucson. Since the thread went off on a tangent, I thought I'd follow the path you started, and share my experiences in Tucson. I'll actually start before we ever left Austin. We've usually waited 'til the last minute to find a place to stay, thinking that we could always default to our usual motel far north of town, if needed. However, this time we tried to get something in advance, calling one of the dumpy places located close to downtown. The motel manager said he had "two rooms available, and can you hold for just a second?" When he came back on the line, we said that we'd take them. "Errr, I only have one now. I just rented the other to a walk-in." #@**8@## My buddy just wanted to wait until we got there, but I was a little nervous. I called "old reliable" and found out there was only one room left. Needless to say I snagged it. $89 a night.......and when we checked out on Sunday (the end of the first full week) the sign had been changed to $56. Fast forward to the airport for departure. I was carrying a thumb sized crystal on a hand sized matrix, in my coat pocket.....the better to keep it safe and unbroken. The screener didn't like the looks of it on the x-ray. I unwrapped it, explained how delicate it was, and why I had it in my pocket. Her response......"that is all fine and good, but it looks like that rock could be used as a weapon to hit someone, so it will have to be put into checked luggage." Then I wasn't allowed to pack it because the luggage was already checked. So one of the airline folks placed it in the bag. Luckily it made it undamaged, but I had had my doubts. Now I know they were only doing their job, and it was a little humorous, in an inconvenient sort of way. This was my fourth year in Tucson, and I still haven't got a handle on what to do when finding something new. Buy it now, or wait until later when the price comes down. A few years ago, when the green Rogerly mine fluorite was all the rage, I bought early, and paid dearly. Now, it is plentiful, and relatively inexpensive. Last year everyone buzzed about the radial apophyllite flowers (or disco balls). I seriously considered getting one, then opted instead for a wonderful tourmaline. The apophyllite was a one time find.....now dubbed "the old find". There was a "new find", but the material was not as esthetic, or symmetrical. Very little of the "old find" remains, and is priced accordingly. The "new find" is pretty, and reasonably priced, but not the same. I saw the new Richterites, but the remaining specimens were dinged, as well as the dravite tourmalines from Afghanistan. I picked up a piece of the new find of yellow fluorite on chalcedony from Argentina. I saw the new red beryls from Madagascar, but they were out of my range. Chinese minerals seemed to be plentiful with much more variety than last year, at least in the fluorites. South Sea pearls were at least half of what they were last year, and even more favorably priced than a few years ago. Seems there was a virus that wiped out the oyster population a few years ago, and the price of the S.S. pearls went through the roof. Now there is somewhat of a glut of pearls in the market....at least this is what my jeweler buddies tell me. One of the great experiences of Tucson is being a part of an international gathering of likeminded people. One ride on the shuttle stands out. I was sitting next to a gentleman from Nigeria. We struck up a conversation, and he showed me his aquamarine rough. Then the Chinese lady on my other side was eager to tell me about her company...she was an engineer that ran a large jewelry manufacturing plant...her family business. We got to talking about treating stones, and I specifically mentioned the orange sapphires....when a pretty gemologist from Thailand sitting in front, joined in, talking about the once secret process (last year) of heating the sapphire with chrysoberyl. I thought the ride was really cool. Here are three people riding around in a van packed with strangers, in a foreign country, sitting quietly,listening to the others around them speak in English. Yet their bubbly personalities were just waiting for some chance to get into a conversation. I must comment on the idea of "caveat emptor", or the buyer beware. I've heard stories of faked fossils, and stone enhancements. Do you think all those nests of dino eggs are the real deal? Anyway, I was looking for heliodor from Tajikstan. I didn't really see any among the Pakistani dealers, or other dealers at the Inn Suites, or Exec Inn. In fact, I asked a Paki dealer about this heliodor. He told me to be careful, that the Tajik stuff was faked, or was sintered. Later I wandered into a tent/booth that had these specimens. The dealer went to great lengths to dispel any rumours of fraud. He even had an article that showed the effects of heating, which deepened the color, or irradiation which makes quartz smoky. It would be obvious, he said, if any treatment was done. This report even dropped the name of the photographer Jeff? Scovill who took before and after pictures. Still in my mind, this didn't preclude some other treatment before the documented treatments. However, later I found another Paki dealer who had one specimen of this heliodor from Tajikstan. I asked him about the possible fake specimens (or at least treated). He said his was real, but that there was this one guy who was buying Goshenite, which is colorless beryl, and treating it to appear as heliodor....and bragging that no one could tell, or prove it was treated. So......keep this in mind. I don't know if it is true or not, but it sounds plausible. I thought I'd mention some of the eating places we have discovered. For "hole in the wall" it is hard to beat Peppy Lou's. Cheap breakfasts in a rundown atmosphere. My wife wouldn't go for it, but definitely a guy's place. If you like sushi, and I can't for the life of me figure out why there would be good sushi in the desert, you must try out Sushi Ten. Huge platters of fresh sashimi.....$15....equivalent to what we pay $50 for here in Austin. Now admittedly, I'm not an expert, but those that are, rave about it as I do. The nice Mexican restaurant on Oracle I believe is called "La Fuente". This has long waits, as many make reservations, but is very good, and priced well. Try the carne seca. Finally, we found a new Mexican place for breakfast. It is a few blocks off Oracle on Grant. It is called Jauntino's. Very clean, including the kitchen, and marvelous food. Try the tacos al pastor, or tacos de cabeza, which are served on corn tortillas. Cheap, good, and authentic. I must end the story with the tale of our flight out of Tucson. We arrived at 9:00 a.m. for our 11:00 flight. At 10:45 an announcement was made that the pilot would not sign off on the flight. Our flight was cancelled, and all flights had been oversold that day. We finally had an attendant get us seats on a flight in Phoenix in three hours. We rented a car, flew down the interstate at 85 mph (118 miles away), and by the time we went through screening, made the flight with 15 minutes to spare. This story turned out to be a lot more longwinded than I thought. There is just so much to see, do, and buy.......and I can't wait to go again next year. Paul From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Mon Feb 24 22:54:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Chengi Kuo) Date: Mon Feb 24 22:54:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Teaching Message-ID: <6056708.1046155998302.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I see someone has covered the part about relating rocks to other aspects of life. Or, the teaching of other subjects, and using rocks to show or explain the subject matter. I'll start with some, and hope others can add to this. And the purpose would be, rather than going to the earth science teacher about doing a rocks and minerals class, engaging a different teacher in one of these other topics... Using fluorescence to teach chemical orbitals, energy levels. Convince kids, some who might have blacklights at home, to collect rocks (or other things) and check them out with their blacklights. Comparing earthquakes to lock picking. Some ears will perk up when you explain how one picks locks. :-) (An earth quake is one blocking factor slipping. Then another point becomes the blocking factor against the plate slipping some more... Lock picking is like that. One notch blocks the lock from turning. Set that correctly, the locking mechanism slips a little, and another notch becomes the next blocking factor.) Anything can be used as fractal examples... Electrolysis for purifying metals (copper plating). Free radicals, ions, whatever... Would be wonderful to hear other examples. Jimmy From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 00:50:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Teresa Masters) Date: Tue Feb 25 00:50:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Teaching References: <6056708.1046155998302.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <3E5B2E1A.F2C205A5@cox.net> Jimmy, Hi! Great suggestions, lock picking, earthquakes, yup that will stir up the imaginations for sure Now we need a "Keeper of the Suggestions" for compilation and dissemination. Kreigh are you there? The rains just started here, about 4 hours later then predicted. Terrie From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 06:56:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Lawrence Rush) Date: Tue Feb 25 06:56:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advertisement- Text Books for Sale References: <6056708.1046155998302.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> <3E5B2E1A.F2C205A5@cox.net> Message-ID: <000a01c2dcde$137859a0$a8af5a0c@fekib> For Sale: (I will pay postage) Mineralogy; Kraus, Hunt & Ramsdell, good condition, 1959 ($30) Manual of Geology; James D. Dana, 3rd. edition,1880, fair condition ($45) Textbook of Mineralogy; E. S. Dana, W. E. Ford, 4th.edition,1926, good condition($55) Larry Rush larryrush@att.net From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 06:58:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Tue Feb 25 06:58:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... Message-ID: <4B08CC55.5C76C81B.02180873@aol.com> Another great Mexican Restaurant on Oracle is La Parilla Suiza. Long waits if you get there late, but well worth it. Try the tortilla soup and just about anything with Chorizo in it. We also ate at a restaurant on E 22nd St and S4th Ave..... cannot remember the name of it. It had the best red salsa I've ever tied. I learned from the owner it was made with roasted chiles and tomatoes. It had a rich smoky sort of taste to it, very flavorful. I guess from a fossil point of view I was somewhat disappointed. For the most part I did not see a lot of new and different stuff and the prices on most of the stuff was not better than last year. I did enjoy rummaging through the new Norcross Madagascar warehouse for neat petrified wood and other Madagascar fossils. And I did score a large load of Australian opal clams. Most had little fire, but 80% of them are really good clams and great fossils. Of course there are always great upper range fossils (5K and up) but little that really excited me in the $100 to $700 range. I saw many more dealers seriously looking to get a retail price for what they had (which makes it tough for me as a reseller) although I have to admit I couldn't hang around for late in the show when prices might get more realistic. Several dealers complained of containers being held up in customs and logistics of getting the stuff to Tucson. My buddy, who likes minerals fared better. He scored a really nice Topaz in the 150 to 200 ct range from either Pakistan or Afganistan.... I forgot to ask him. Still it was a nice few days in the sun and surrounded by loads of rocks, fossils, minerals, beads and jewelry. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 07:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Michael Schmidt) Date: Tue Feb 25 07:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... References: <4B08CC55.5C76C81B.02180873@aol.com> Message-ID: <001101c2dce2$ea1c0660$bacb94d1@remains> We also ate at a restaurant on E 22nd St and S4th Ave..... cannot remember the name of it.............. pico de mayo??? ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 7:57 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... > Another great Mexican Restaurant on Oracle is La Parilla Suiza. Long waits if you get there late, but well worth it. Try the tortilla soup and just about anything with Chorizo in it. We also ate at a restaurant on E 22nd St and S4th Ave..... cannot remember the name of it. It had the best red salsa I've ever tied. I learned from the owner it was made with roasted chiles and tomatoes. It had a rich smoky sort of taste to it, very flavorful. > > I guess from a fossil point of view I was somewhat disappointed. For the most part I did not see a lot of new and different stuff and the prices on most of the stuff was not better than last year. I did enjoy rummaging through the new Norcross Madagascar warehouse for neat petrified wood and other Madagascar fossils. And I did score a large load of Australian opal clams. Most had little fire, but 80% of them are really good clams and great fossils. > > Of course there are always great upper range fossils (5K and up) but little that really excited me in the $100 to $700 range. I saw many more dealers seriously looking to get a retail price for what they had (which makes it tough for me as a reseller) although I have to admit I couldn't hang around for late in the show when prices might get more realistic. > > Several dealers complained of containers being held up in customs and logistics of getting the stuff to Tucson. > My buddy, who likes minerals fared better. He scored a really nice Topaz in the 150 to 200 ct range from either Pakistan or Afganistan.... I forgot to ask him. > > Still it was a nice few days in the sun and surrounded by loads of rocks, fossils, minerals, beads and jewelry. > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 10:33:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Lunarcowgirl) Date: Tue Feb 25 10:33:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Gem Show This Weekend in California In-Reply-To: <001101c2dce2$ea1c0660$bacb94d1@remains> Message-ID: <20030225183202.76078.qmail@web40303.mail.yahoo.com> The Castro Valley Gem and Mineral Society is having our annual show this coming weekend, February 28 - March 3. (10-6 Friday and Saturday. 10-5 Sunday.) Held in Hayward at Centineal Hall off Foothill Blvd. Live Auction held @ 2pm on Sunday. Demonstrations, food and more. Fluorescent Mineral Display being featured along with other display cases from members. If you have any questions please contact : japanico@attbi.com Thank you. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 17:41:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John Cornish) Date: Tue Feb 25 17:41:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] My 2003 Tucson Show Report Message-ID: <034501c2dd39$360c5f10$c9a1dccf@rockman> Hi Everyone, Greetings and welcome to this year's 2003 Tucson Show Report. As I = write, I'm thrilled to once again be home. Since I've been back, I've = had time to catch up and tie down most of the unfinished business which = always seems to accumulate when a person's away for any length of time = and I've also successfully unpacked my two bulging 70 pound suit cases = without incident! And now, with the soft patter of our ever-falling NW = rain, I can settle in and while relaxing, share this year's terrific = adventure. So, there's the intro, ya know what's coming. Hit the ol' = delete button if you've a mind, otherwise, here we go...=20 My trip started during the last week of January and ended during the = third week of February. It was a power-packed, relentless time of = mineral depravity and excess and I loved every minute of it! I arrived = in Tucson during the wee hours of the morning and was met by my good = friend Jim Stoutmeyer. Jim was gracious enough to invite me to his house = for the night and it's there that I enjoyed my first night's rest. In = the morning after visiting, I took off for the Inn Suites where this = year's mineral adventures would truly begin. This would be my first year running a room in the Inn Suites, and I must = say, this place is a welcome step up from my old haunts at the Executive = Inn. My room, actually the room of Stuart Wilensky Fine Minerals and Irv = Brown, faced into a beautiful grassed and orange tree lined court yard. = The soft cooing of the doves and the accompanied songs of the other = birds gave a peaceful, relaxing tone to the whole surroundings which I = found immediately enjoyable and comforting. Our room was in the midst of = these park-like surroundings, # 167, in Building F.=20 This is my first year working with Stuart and Irv and what an = inspirational time it was. They were great as individuals and = professional in every sense. They were sincere and I was at once made to = feel welcome and a part of their adventure. Stuart and I met up first, = while Irv arrived several days later. Our first matter of business would = be to move the room about to accommodate the three rented 6 foot glass = display cases which would soon be arriving. We did this right on time, = as moments after finishing, the movers arrived with the first of the = cases to bring in. We jostled things about and eventually had everything = set in it's place. We followed this with the addition of three light = boxes, one of these was placed atop of each display case and to these we = mounted several additional lamps illuminating downwards into the cases = themselves. Next I dove into the endless pleasure of glass cleaning, = followed by the positioning and the mounting of the shelves themselves. = Our specimens arrived about an hour after this initial set-up had been = completed. We moved the minerals carefully from their transport vehicle = in several cart loads until finally all of the stock was safely in the = room. The next several hours saw us unwrapping specimens and placing = them with their corresponding labels onto the shelves for display.=20 =20 This was a slow procedure. Many of the specimens were extremely delicate = and their values ranged from hundreds of dollars to tens of thousands of = dollars and each required our utmost concentration when handling. Every = move was calculated and carefully plotted, the last thing we'd want was = to slam a specimen into a partially closed case door. Like I said, we = moved carefully and cautiously. After several hours we'd placed the = majority of the specimens, and their packing boxes and materials were = cleared away for the start of business tomorrow afternoon. This left the = morning for fine tuning and breakfast! It'd been a long day, but with = everything more or less in place, we finally called it quits for the = evening. Dinner time! Over the course of the next several days, I ran this room for the guys. = This left them free to shop for specimens and to visit with other = dealers. Me, I was in my element, I'm surrounded by great rocks in the = heart of the World's greatest gem and mineral shows and it's my little = slice of heaven. We had fantastic specimens in the room and this was = acknowledged by the constant compliments shared by folks while they = visited and shopped. Examples of some of the superlative specimens in = our room could include the exquisite soft-pink colored morganite = penetrated by two impressive pyramidally terminated gemmy green = tourmalines, the only known example of this association from the world = renowned Pederneira Mine in a flawless, undamaged, cabinet sized = specimen. Or perhaps the bright reds of rhodochrosite, or vanadinite, or = beryl appeals, or perhaps the fiery orange of an Idaho pyromorphite with = perfect nearly 3 inch crystals beckons? Maybe the bright yellow of = elemental sulfur overlain by soft, sky-blue celestite calls, or maybe = it's the tones of a yellow Illinois fluorite with its flower-like = adornment of blue fluorites that is more to your liking? I loved the = blues of the aquamarines from their varied localities and their = sparkling brethren, the gemmy, alluring emerald from Colombia, the = single golden artistically patterned helidor from the Ukraine, or the = previously mentioned red beryl of Utah or pink morganite from Brazil. We = had dinner plate sized stibnite perfection in matrix groups and = specimens of stibnite associated with barite, and with golden calcite. = There were fluorites from China, pretty things in greens, blues and = purples. There were big purple fluorites in impressive blocky crystals = from England and there were killer gemmy-clear fluorites from = Dalnegorsk. Everywhere a person looked, grace lay upon each shelf, each = and every one. Crystals sweet like the yummiest candy. The splashes of = their color, their rhythm of line, each specimen crystal perfection, = each like a bright shining dream come true. And there were so many too, = but did I have a favorite you ask? Ah yes, I do I reply with a cock-eyed = grin, it's this little beastie here in the corner...=20 And that's when they gasp. That's when most folks actually stop dead in = their tracks and just glaze over in awe as they partake of my favorite = rock in the room. The baby! All approximate 35 plus pounds of it. It's = an exquisite single crystal of gem spodumene from Resplendor, Minas = Gerais, Brazil which is doubly terminated and grades in color from a = Kunzite lilac-pink to a soft green over its nearly two foot long length. = What a great rock, but don't take my word for it, you make the call. = Check the following link and scroll down the page! = http://www.imageevent.com/number9/rocknetgroup Some of these, and = other great specimens, are available for viewing and purchase online at = the website of Stuart and Donna Wilensky Fine Minerals. For your = convenience, consider visiting www.wilenskyminerals.com Approximately half way through our Inn Suites Show, we shifted gears and = stepped it up a notch. We began this process by breaking down part of = the room's displays. We repacked these specimens and added them to other = as yet unshown specimens for a new Show we'd be opening in at the = Westward Look Resort. The Westward Look Resort is a classy place on the = outskirts of town hosting this second year Show created by my friend = Dave Waisman. Dave has brought some of the finest dealers together in = this beautiful desert setting for a wonderfully unique experience which = is prospering in both dealer and collector popularity. We shared a = building with 3 other dealers and enjoyed an experience resulting in our = signing contracts for continuing patronage. Additionally to the = outstanding dealers, there were several special functions, of these I = was only able to attend one, the special Saturday event of Gene Meieran = Day. Gene is an enthusiastic and accomplished collector and for just = this one day, he brought and displayed in the Resort Lobby several = outstanding examples of specimens from his personal collection. The = specimens were splendid things, monstrous blue gem euclase and = multi-colored tourmaline, topaz, beryl, and on and on. What a = sensational gathering of phenomenal specimens. I wish everyone could = have seen this wonderful display, it was really something special! This = Show spanned a five day period, but like all good things, even this had = to eventually come to an end.=20 And again, the cycle repeats. Being infinitely careful, we packed the = specimens yet again and brought them back to the Inn Suites. I bet you = can guess what I did for the next several hours! Yup that's right, I = unpacked everything and set it all back into the cases creating new = displays for our morning's guests. Now, least I pass on the impression = that this is a type of drudgery, let me confess, this is a grand time, = an intimate time between the minerals and myself. During this time with = the room closed, I get to examine intimately each specimen, judging its = perfection, grading its value, reveling in its singular beauty. This is = inspiring education! I worked late into the night until finally, I = called it quits and turned out the lights and closed my eyes to sleep. The Inn Suites room had been open the entire time in addition to the = Westward Look Show and we'd been busy moving back and forth between the = two venues. When the Westward Look closed and we re-opened again in full = force at the Inn Suites, we were on our final stretch. These last days = went by quickly until finally, the closing day of the Show arrived and = it was time to pack those treasures as yet remaining unsold for the long = ride back to New York. We packed everything ultra carefully this last = time in hopes our efforts would counter the effects of every bump and = rattle encountered while traveling across the country. The hours = stretched by slowly before somehow mysteriously, and all to soon, = everything was done and it was time to say goodbye. It'd been a great = run and I felt thankful and fortunate to have had the opportunity to = work with Stuart and Irv. Additionally, it's a pleasure to be able to = announce that they've invited me back for 2004. The days won't go by = fast enough... And then that was it. The dust swirled around their tires as they drove = away heading back to the world that exists away from Tucson. But for me, = my work wasn't quite done yet. I had a few hours to kill and did so = while rambling around the Inn Suites looking at rooms. Afterwards, I = took the shuttle to the airport to take possession of my rental car. I'd = use it to cruise a bit today and to move back and forth from my hotel to = my new gig at the Tucson Convention Center working for Les and Paula = Presmyk and their business, De Natura. This would be my third year = working with Les and Paula, and I've really been looking forward to this = year's show. But before starting up again, I wanted to use the day to be = a tourist and just check out the sights at the TCC. The displays were = incredible in the show as were the glittering stocks displayed by the = dealers. One of the greatest joys of visiting Tucson and its shows is = the simple fact that a person is essentially moving from one world class = mineral museum to another as they visit each display, booth or room. = It's really an incredible thing that one must truly experience to = comprehend. In awe, I walked the brightly lit aisles of the show until = forced with all the other mineral junkies to leave at the end of the = day. In the morning I packed my stuff completely and vacated the room at the = Inn Suites. The prices were just too high to justify my staying and now = with the rental car, I was mobile. I hit the TCC in the early AM and = then waited for a bit until the doors at the Dealers entrance were = opened. This happened an hour prior to the shows opening for the general = public. I used every spare minute to visit with friends and to see the = displays before returning back to open the booth. We had sheets to pull = back and glass to clean and then the announcer's voice chimed in to open = the Show. After this, the people came. I was kept busy as usual with the = Presmyk's breaking geodes. This is such a fun job and one I really = enjoy. We use a monstrous wrench to crack the geodes open and do so = while always attracting a big crowd. The wrench squeezes and the geode = pops, the dust falls and the people gasp as crystal treasure tumbles out = from beneath the protective confines of the towel we use to hold down = the dust. Crystals of quartz, calcite, selenite and goethite often grace = the geodes interior cavity spectacularly and each is a unique treasure = we get to send home with some lucky collector. Everybody smiles and it's = so much fun, I have one of the most enjoyable jobs in the show! The = hours pass by very quickly and soon morning has passed into evening and = the announcer's voice calls out to again close the show until the = morrow. Slowly, reluctantly, the people filter out of the hall and the = roar and the noise subsides. As it's Saturday evening, rather then = taking off, I head upstairs for the benefit auction and awards = ceremonies dinner.=20 Sunday dawns and its back to the TCC for the last day of the Show. The = day is pretty much a repeat of yesterday, or more succinctly, it was = another great day. We broke geodes till the cows came home and shared a = million smiles. This continued until the announcer's voice closed for = the last time this year's 2003 TGMS Show. And then the rattle and hum = escalates and the air resounds with the flurry of packing people. Flats = come out and minerals disappear. Lights are turned off and cords are = wrapped until both are packed away. Cases are broken down and moving = carts are set up. Everything is moving and from the vantage of the upper = floor windows, scores of folks just stand and stare, watching the buzz = of the hive as everything comes down and is readied for transport. = Eventually we begin to load, the back of the Bronco gets filled with the = most important minerals and the trailer takes the burden of everything = else. The sweat really flies. And then this to is done. A wonderful = dinner follows and then once again, the good-byes are said. Les and = Paula are great people and I'm very fortunate to work with them each = year. As I drive away from dinner, I do so knowing that for me, Tucson has = officially ended. Today was my last scheduled day of work and tomorrow = I'd be flying out and heading for home. I drove a bit slower back to my = room taking a couple of side trips through some of the other Show = parking lots looking for open doors. The few I saw were filled with = folks packing and I just kept on driving. Back in the room I packed my = own things for the last time and readied myself for tomorrow's trip = home.=20 My flight(s) was uneventful in every sense other then one, both of my = checked in bags were opened and examined behind the scenes by airport = security personnel. They announced this by placing a notification flyer = within the suitcase announcing their presence. All of my goods were = found in perfect order after this incursion and my one bag had even been = additionally sealed with tape as a preventative measure exactly as I'd = submitted it (they'd cut my original tape and then re-taped it again = securely for me). I felt no inconvenience by this and was thankful for = their professional handling of my materials. My 50 pound carry-on was = also checked as thoroughly and as professionally. And then that was it, = I was home. For this year's trip to Tucson, I'd brought several flats of minerals to = sell and had been fortunate to place them within the stocks of several = well known dealers. My sales were decent, but to be honest, I didn't = sell the 400 pieces I'd sold last year in Denver. I'm not sure why they = didn't move as well here in Tucson, I guess it's just the way it goes = sometimes. The pieces are good and I know they'll find a home with = someone who will really enjoy them. Plus on the lighter side (chuckle), = it gave me the chance to buff-up lugging them through the airports! I = did manage successfully however to sell a batch of old Mineralogical = Records I'd brought. I then used the money to buy books. One of my best = finds was a copy of Medenbach and Wilk's, The Magic of Minerals. Also, I = was able to find Themelis's, Mogok- Valley of Rubies and Sapphires, and = Wards, Emeralds. Also, The Robert Haag Collection of Meteorites and = several years worth of the Journal of Gemmology. I also picked up the = video Maroc - The Minerals of Morocco and Jesse Fisher's CD, The Rogerly = and Other Fluorite Mines of Northern England. As a last, final bonus, I = also now have the newest, Vol 37, DVD catalog of Wilensky Fine Minerals. = Quite a happy haul for me and a guarantee for many enjoyable hours. I = even managed to bring home a couple of specimens for the collection this = year. One is a pseudomorph of malachite after azurite with azurite on = smithsonite from Tsumeb and the other is a nice vivianite in clam from = the Kerch Peninsula, Ukrania. Both specimens came to me via a mineral = trade.=20 Over the last several weeks, I've treasured every minute of the time I = had visiting with old, and meeting new, friends. The people this year = were terrific and I only wish that I'd have had more time to have shared = in everyone's company. Everywhere were smiles and it was a fantastic = 2003 Tucson good time! Thanks for sharing my little part of the = experience that is Tucson. Take care everyone and all the very best, =20 John=20 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Tue Feb 25 18:40:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Feb 25 18:40:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Teaching References: <6056708.1046155998302.JavaMail.nobody@misspiggy.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <3E5C28C1.64FA@Tomaszewski.net> Hi Jimmy! I like your idea of sneaking up on unsuspecting students and hitting them with rocks to get around their preconceived boring attitude. Do some story problem long division with questions that involve computing specific gravity. This week's spelling test will be on words describing the luster of minerals. In Art (or Math) we're going to look at symmetry drawing the standard crystal forms. How many cities that are mineral type locations could you use in a Geography lesson? Look at History from the perspective of mining. You know, its much easier to sneak up on students in the sciences. Kreigh Chengi Kuo wrote: > > I see someone has covered the part about relating rocks to other aspects of life. Or, the teaching of other subjects, and using rocks to show or explain the subject matter. > > I'll start with some, and hope others can add to this. And the purpose would be, rather than going to the earth science teacher about doing a rocks and minerals class, engaging a different teacher in one of these other topics... > > Using fluorescence to teach chemical orbitals, energy levels. Convince kids, some who might have blacklights at home, to collect rocks (or other things) and check them out with their blacklights. > > Comparing earthquakes to lock picking. Some ears will perk up when you explain how one picks locks. :-) (An earth quake is one blocking factor slipping. Then another point becomes the blocking factor against the plate slipping some more... Lock picking is like that. One notch blocks the lock from turning. Set that correctly, the locking mechanism slips a little, and another notch becomes the next blocking factor.) > > Anything can be used as fractal examples... > > Electrolysis for purifying metals (copper plating). Free radicals, ions, whatever... > > Would be wonderful to hear other examples. > > Jimmy > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 06:04:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Wed Feb 26 06:04:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Teaching Message-ID: <1AC3700B.2D4273D0.0BECD81D@aol.com> Hi all - I teach Geometry and go rock collecting whenever I get a chance (and you have to go a long ways when you live in New Orleans since there aren't any rocks here). My students laugh about all the times I'm headed out for the weekend to get a load of rocks. But, whenever I get a chance, I show them or tell them about whatever connections I can make to minerals and to the places I go (using maps, especially). Please keep your ideas coming, I'm constantly looking for new suggestions to use with them. Linda New From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 07:30:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Michael Schmidt) Date: Wed Feb 26 07:30:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] collector's stones References: Message-ID: <003401c2ddab$d4e133f0$39cb94d1@remains> Hi I don't know if anyone on this list would be interested or not, but it never hurts to ask! A friend of mine is allowing me to sell a few pieces out of his cut stone collection. These are all facetted or cabochon stones, and comprise both collector's stones and jewellery grade materials. There are a lot of incredible pieces in this collection......including some record holders for largest known examples of. If anyone on the list has any interest in any further info concerning the material, please let me know offlist. Thanks Michael From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 09:55:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John McLaughlin) Date: Wed Feb 26 09:55:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising References: Message-ID: <3E5D0128.FBF99DD7@amug.org> Hi All, The Maricopa Lapidary Society is hold its 53rd annual gem, mineral and lapidary art show on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, February 28th through March 2nd. The show will be at the Mesa Centennial Center, 263 N. Center St., Mesa, AZ. Show hours are: Friday and Saturday 10am to 5pm. Sunday 10am to 4pm. There will be gems, lapidary rough and supplies, minerals, jewelry, geodes and other goodies to supply your daily need for minerals. Please come and spend lots of money. John McLaughlin jemstone@amug.org From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 12:16:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Dri) Date: Wed Feb 26 12:16:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising References: <3E5D0128.FBF99DD7@amug.org> Message-ID: <009601c2ddd3$f3fd58e0$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Do they have a show like this in Seattle? As.... Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) ----- Original Message ----- From: "John McLaughlin" To: ; ; ; Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 10:02 Subject: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising > Hi All, > > The Maricopa Lapidary Society is hold its 53rd annual gem, mineral and lapidary > art show on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, February 28th through March 2nd. The > show will be at the Mesa Centennial Center, 263 N. Center St., Mesa, AZ. > > Show hours are: Friday and Saturday 10am to 5pm. Sunday 10am to 4pm. > > There will be gems, lapidary rough and supplies, minerals, jewelry, geodes and > other goodies to supply your daily need for minerals. Please come and spend > lots of money. > > John McLaughlin > jemstone@amug.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 13:57:17 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Gary Brown) Date: Wed Feb 26 13:57:17 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] My 2003 Tucson Show Report In-Reply-To: <034501c2dd39$360c5f10$c9a1dccf@rockman> Message-ID: Great report, John! *sigh* maybe next year! gcb > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of John Cornish > Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 7:49 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] My 2003 Tucson Show Report > > > Hi Everyone, > > Greetings and welcome to this year's 2003 Tucson Show Report. As > I write, I'm thrilled to once again be home.... From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 22:15:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John Cornish) Date: Wed Feb 26 22:15:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising References: <3E5D0128.FBF99DD7@amug.org> <009601c2ddd3$f3fd58e0$6801a8c0@dslverizon.net> Message-ID: <00b001c2de28$a7cd8f80$7ba3dccf@rockman> Hi Dri, The Seattle Regional Gem and Mineral Show wil be held on the weekend of April 26th (10 to 6) and 27th (10 to 5) at the Seattle Center in the Olympic Room and San Juan Suite of the Northwest Rooms This is next to Key Arena and the International Fountain. I'll be there with my bright pink heulandites from Idaho and my geodes from Mexico. Take care, John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dri" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 12:16 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising > Do they have a show like this in Seattle? As.... supplies, minerals, jewelry, geodes and other goodies to supply your daily > need for minerals?> > Dri-Anna (Two Spirit) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John McLaughlin" > To: ; ; > ; > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 10:02 > Subject: [Rockhounds] Maricopa Lapidary Society Show - Phoenix Gems Arising > > > > Hi All, > > > > The Maricopa Lapidary Society is hold its 53rd annual gem, mineral and > lapidary > > art show on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, February 28th through March 2nd. > The > > show will be at the Mesa Centennial Center, 263 N. Center St., Mesa, AZ. > > > > Show hours are: Friday and Saturday 10am to 5pm. Sunday 10am to 4pm. > > > > There will be gems, lapidary rough and supplies, minerals, jewelry, geodes > and > > other goodies to supply your daily need for minerals. Please come and > spend > > lots of money. > > > > John McLaughlin > > jemstone@amug.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Wed Feb 26 22:20:02 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (John Cornish) Date: Wed Feb 26 22:20:02 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... References: <3E5ABD6C.11290.181988A@localhost> Message-ID: <00b801c2de29$614da8a0$7ba3dccf@rockman> Hi Paul, I just wanted to thank you for your report also. The perspectives of the reports really show the diversity of the experience. A great read! Thank you, John ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 10:48 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Tucson report; was random... > This is a long story, just so you know. > > Thanks > for your report, Scott, and your musings on Tucson. Since the thread > went off on a tangent, I thought I'd follow the path you started, and share > my experiences in Tucson. > > I'll actually start before we ever left Austin. We've usually waited 'til the last > minute to find a place to stay, thinking that we could always default to our > usual motel far north of town, if needed. However, this time we tried to get > something in advance, calling one of the dumpy places located close to > downtown. The motel manager said he had "two rooms available, and can > you hold for just a second?" When he came back on the line, we said that > we'd take them. "Errr, I only have one now. I just rented the other to a > walk-in." #@**8@## > > My buddy just wanted to wait until we got there, but I was a little nervous. I > called "old reliable" and found out there was only one room left. Needless > to say I snagged it. $89 a night.......and when we checked out on Sunday > (the end of the first full week) the sign had been changed to $56. > > Fast forward to the airport for departure. I was carrying a thumb sized > crystal on a hand sized matrix, in my coat pocket.....the better to keep it > safe and unbroken. The screener didn't like the looks of it on the x-ray. I > unwrapped it, explained how delicate it was, and why I had it in my pocket. > Her response......"that is all fine and good, but it looks like that rock could > be used as a weapon to hit someone, so it will have to be put into checked > luggage." Then I wasn't allowed to pack it because the luggage was > already checked. So one of the airline folks placed it in the bag. Luckily it > made it undamaged, but I had had my doubts. Now I know they were only > doing their job, and it was a little humorous, in an inconvenient sort of way. > > This was my fourth year in Tucson, and I still haven't got a handle on what > to do when finding something new. Buy it now, or wait until later when the > price comes down. A few years ago, when the green Rogerly mine fluorite > was all the rage, I bought early, and paid dearly. Now, it is plentiful, and > relatively inexpensive. Last year everyone buzzed about the radial > apophyllite flowers (or disco balls). I seriously considered getting one, then > opted instead for a wonderful tourmaline. The apophyllite was a one time > find.....now dubbed "the old find". There was a "new find", but the material > was not as esthetic, or symmetrical. Very little of the "old find" remains, > and is priced accordingly. The "new find" is pretty, and reasonably priced, > but not the same. > > I saw the new Richterites, but the remaining specimens were dinged, as > well as the dravite tourmalines from Afghanistan. I picked up a piece of the > new find of yellow fluorite on chalcedony from Argentina. I saw the new red > beryls from Madagascar, but they were out of my range. > > Chinese minerals seemed to be plentiful with much more variety than last > year, at least in the fluorites. South Sea pearls were at least half of what > they were last year, and even more favorably priced than a few years ago. > Seems there was a virus that wiped out the oyster population a few years > ago, and the price of the S.S. pearls went through the roof. Now there is > somewhat of a glut of pearls in the market....at least this is what my > jeweler buddies tell me. > > One of the great experiences of Tucson is being a part of an international > gathering of likeminded people. One ride on the shuttle stands out. I was > sitting next to a gentleman from Nigeria. We struck up a conversation, and > he showed me his aquamarine rough. Then the Chinese lady on my other > side was eager to tell me about her company...she was an engineer that > ran a large jewelry manufacturing plant...her family business. We got to > talking about treating stones, and I specifically mentioned the orange > sapphires....when a pretty gemologist from Thailand sitting in front, joined > in, talking about the once secret process (last year) of heating the sapphire > with chrysoberyl. I thought the ride was really cool. Here are three people > riding around in a van packed with strangers, in a foreign country, sitting > quietly,listening to the others around them speak in English. Yet their > bubbly personalities were just waiting for some chance to get into a > conversation. > > I must comment on the idea of "caveat emptor", or the buyer beware. I've > heard stories of faked fossils, and stone enhancements. Do you think all > those nests of dino eggs are the real deal? Anyway, I was looking for > heliodor from Tajikstan. I didn't really see any among the Pakistani > dealers, or other dealers at the Inn Suites, or Exec Inn. In fact, I asked a > Paki dealer about this heliodor. He told me to be careful, that the Tajik > stuff was faked, or was sintered. Later I wandered into a tent/booth that > had these specimens. The dealer went to great lengths to dispel any > rumours of fraud. He even had an article that showed the effects of heating, > which deepened the color, or irradiation which makes quartz smoky. It > would be obvious, he said, if any treatment was done. This report even > dropped the name of the photographer Jeff? Scovill who took before and > after pictures. Still in my mind, this didn't preclude some other treatment > before the documented treatments. > > However, later I found another Paki dealer who had one specimen of this > heliodor from Tajikstan. I asked him about the possible fake specimens (or > at least treated). He said his was real, but that there was this one guy who > was buying Goshenite, which is colorless beryl, and treating it to appear as > heliodor....and bragging that no one could tell, or prove it was treated. > So......keep this in mind. I don't know if it is true or not, but it sounds > plausible. > > I thought I'd mention some of the eating places we have discovered. For > "hole in the wall" it is hard to beat Peppy Lou's. Cheap breakfasts in a > rundown atmosphere. My wife wouldn't go for it, but definitely a guy's > place. If you like sushi, and I can't for the life of me figure out why there > would be good sushi in the desert, you must try out Sushi Ten. Huge > platters of fresh sashimi.....$15....equivalent to what we pay $50 for here in > Austin. Now admittedly, I'm not an expert, but those that are, rave about it > as I do. The nice Mexican restaurant on Oracle I believe is called "La > Fuente". This has long waits, as many make reservations, but is very > good, and priced well. Try the carne seca. Finally, we found a new > Mexican place for breakfast. It is a few blocks off Oracle on Grant. It is > called Jauntino's. Very clean, including the kitchen, and marvelous food. > Try the tacos al pastor, or tacos de cabeza, which are served on corn > tortillas. Cheap, good, and authentic. > > I must end the story with the tale of our flight out of Tucson. We arrived at > 9:00 a.m. for our 11:00 flight. At 10:45 an announcement was made that > the pilot would not sign off on the flight. Our flight was cancelled, and all > flights had been oversold that day. We finally had an attendant get us > seats on a flight in Phoenix in three hours. We rented a car, flew down the > interstate at 85 mph (118 miles away), and by the time we went through > screening, made the flight with 15 minutes to spare. > > This story turned out to be a lot more longwinded than I thought. There is > just so much to see, do, and buy.......and I can't wait to go again next year. > > Paul > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 09:09:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Lynn McGowan) Date: Thu Feb 27 09:09:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Please remove from mailing list References: <20030225183202.76078.qmail@web40303.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E5E46BC.5D7CF863@earthlink.net> Remove this address from the mailing list please. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 12:59:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Preston White) Date: Thu Feb 27 12:59:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds Message-ID: <00ae01c2dea2$a626e3f0$0500a8c0@admin> Dear Friends, Preston here with a big ol update on the website, Update It's OPEN at = http://www.worldofrockhounds.com I am sorry it has taken so long to get = it open but we wanted it to be done right and it did get to 200 pages to = satisfy me. First of all I would like everyone to go visit the site and = give us feedback on its completion. Second I would like to tell you = about a few important features: Storefronts.... We have an automated store system where you can signup and list your = items in text form or with a picture. It is a fast system that allows = you to add and remove your items at will and any inquiries or purchases = go directly through you. The storefronts are free for two months so that = you can try it out and will be 15.00 per month thereafter. Try one out = today you will enjoy how easy it is. Auction.... We have a simple automated auction system that will open April 15th so = collect up a few items and signup it should be a very active auction. = You can post your items for free until the opening and then it becomes = 50 cents per listing after that. Advertising.... We have about 1000 banner spaces on the site and would like to encourage = you on a first come first served basis to get some of the best positions = available before they are all gone. Since we are a website development = company and we also built WOR we can build a set of banners for you at = nominal cost that could promote your site, phone number or address to = generate sales. Editors.... We are looking for editors who will help us get the ball rolling. These = will be paid positions. We built this site so that it is self sustaining = and at our end we can have one employee continue to build the site till = the sun don't shine and cover that cost. This site was not built to make = alot of money but it will hopefully sustain itself and pay it's own = bills. If you would like to write for the site please give us a call. There are so many items to list it is hard to name it all, best part we = want you to become involved and let us know what you think of the site. = Your opinion counts here. Please remember we are at your service. Preston White CEO Northwest Internet Technologies http://www.website-services.biz 719-528-7122 719-290-5967 - cell Ps: We are one of the top search engine optimization companies in the = world so If your site needs to get a better listing on the major search = engines we can do it if you only give us a call. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 13:29:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Roy) Date: Thu Feb 27 13:29:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] trilotopia Message-ID: <000501c2dd21$313fcfc0$08fe0c44@Fossilzone> Hello, They have used my trilobites also. Roy Ainsworth Fossilzone.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 13:29:14 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (James Dagda) Date: Thu Feb 27 13:29:14 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello :-) Message-ID: <20030226205710.50930.qmail@web40411.mail.yahoo.com> I'm a gemology student with GIA's distance education program. I ran across your group while searching for specific gravity fluids. I am wondering if anybody here knows where a person can order or purchase methylene iodide and benzyl benzoate to use for specific gravity float/sink testing. Thank you in advance. James. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 13:48:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Rik Dillen) Date: Thu Feb 27 13:48:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Methylene iodide - benzoyl benzoate In-Reply-To: <20030226205710.50930.qmail@web40411.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Methylene iodide = diodomethane is a VERY expensive product. It is available from Merck (ref. 106053 "for separation of minerals" costed in 1996 about 250 USD per 100 ml ; ref. 818153 "for synthesis" about 150 USD per 100 ml) benzyl benzoate : Merck 818701 or 101806 = about 25 USD/liter - the density is (only) 1.1 g/cm3 so I think there are many less expensive and less harmfull alternatives. Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15 B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium Tel. + 32 3 7706007 E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals (ardennite, vantasselite, ferristrunzite and more) >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ >>> The Dana errata page, the Virtual Quarry and much more ! MINERANT 2003 - Minerals and fossils show ATTENTION ! NEW LOCATION ! "Stuurboord - hangar 26-27", Rijnkaai 96, B-2000 Antwerpen 10 ' north of "Het Steen", Schelde - see http://www.stuurboord.com/gif/map.gif Large parking lot ! http://www.minerant.org/MKA/minerantnl.html -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-admin@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of James Dagda Sent: 26 February, 2003 9:57 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello :-) I'm a gemology student with GIA's distance education program. I ran across your group while searching for specific gravity fluids. I am wondering if anybody here knows where a person can order or purchase methylene iodide and benzyl benzoate to use for specific gravity float/sink testing. Thank you in advance. James. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 13:48:13 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Steve Sorrell) Date: Thu Feb 27 13:48:13 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds Message-ID: <200302272147.h1RLlEv5025357@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hi Preston Love the locality map facility. Be interesting to see what it looks like when a lot more entries are put on. Regards Steve From: "Preston White" Subject: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds Dear Friends, Preston here with a big ol update on the website, Update It's OPEN at http://www.worldofrockhounds.com... From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 13:54:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Preston White) Date: Thu Feb 27 13:54:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds References: <200302272147.h1RLlEv5025357@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00e601c2deaa$b5a7e100$0500a8c0@admin> Did you add your favorite sites? That is why it is so interesting. Lets us all know where to look wherever we go! Happy hunting. Preston ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Sorrell" To: Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 6:47 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds > Hi Preston > > Love the locality map facility. Be interesting to see what it looks like > when a lot more entries are put on. > > Regards > Steve > > From: "Preston White" > Subject: [Rockhounds] World of Rockhounds > > Dear Friends, > > Preston here with a big ol update on the website, Update It's OPEN at > http://www.worldofrockhounds.com... > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 14:08:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Don H) Date: Thu Feb 27 14:08:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello :-) References: <20030226205710.50930.qmail@web40411.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3E5E8D3F.4D738115@att.net> Try calling Cargille: http://cargille.com/ Their website is much, much improved since I last used it, but you may be better off calling and talking to them about what you need. They have a variety of liquids which will suit the specific needs of your GIA program. Doesn't the GIA program include a set of liquids and "mystery" gems to ID? Someone gave me a set of books and also a set of heavy liquids with little stones in them, all part of a GIA certification course. Don James Dagda wrote: > > I'm a gemology student with GIA's distance education program. I ran across your group while searching for specific gravity fluids. I am wondering if anybody here knows where a person can order or purchase methylene iodide and benzyl benzoate to use for specific gravity float/sink testing. Thank you in advance. James. From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 16:49:00 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Feb 27 16:49:00 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Elutriation Message-ID: <3E5EB1E9.2B27@Tomaszewski.net> I have a short writeup on my website for making a small elutriation unit for recycling tumbling grits. Elutriation uses a stream of water flowing upwards to seperate particles by size/density. It is used commercially for concentrating ore and in mining gold. As the result of my website article I have been contacted by a foreign mining firm asking if I can help identify any firms that make elutriation equipment commercially. Can anyone point me at some companies that make/sell elutriation equipment? Kreigh From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Thu Feb 27 21:04:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com) Date: Thu Feb 27 21:04:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Kentucky collecting Message-ID: <20030227.215756.-354483.1.stevenkaminski@juno.com> Try Big Mikes Rock Shop on one of the roads into the Park. If you see Joe Meiman (he's the local hydrogeo muckity muck at the Park), tell him a punk undergrad says Hi.:) Enjoy KY, I miss it dearly...then I remember how cold it is there. ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 28 09:16:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Fri Feb 28 09:16:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello :-) References: <20030226205710.50930.qmail@web40411.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001d01c2df4c$706d1220$c11fbed8@powertech.net> > I'm a gemology student with GIA's distance education program. I ran across your group while searching for specific gravity fluids. I am wondering if anybody here knows where a person can order or purchase methylene iodide and benzyl benzoate to use for specific gravity float/sink testing. Thank you in advance. James. Just about any Chemical supply house should have them. Check with the chem teacher at your high school and see where he gets his supplies. If you want to use them for that sort of tests you would want to get good quality analytical reagents; not technical grade stuff. margaret > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Fri Feb 28 22:02:01 2003 From: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Feb 28 22:02:01 2003 Subject: [Rockhounds] Elutriation References: <3E5EB1E9.2B27@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <3E604C9F.3C0D@Tomaszewski.net> My thanks to those that contacted me off-list with suggestions. I was able to identify a number of suppliers (including suprises from the water filtration and dust reduction industries) that pleased my contact. I learned a lot about cyclonic air systems (air is a fluid and can be used for elutriation), water filtration, and ore concentration that was unexpected. Thank you! This is a _GREAT_ list! Kreigh Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > I have a short writeup on my website for making a small elutriation unit > for recycling tumbling grits. Elutriation uses a stream of water flowing > upwards to seperate particles by size/density. It is used commercially > for concentrating ore and in mining gold. > > As the result of my website article I have been contacted by a foreign > mining firm asking if I can help identify any firms that make > elutriation equipment commercially. Can anyone point me at some > companies that make/sell elutriation equipment? > > Kreigh