From jr50wv at yahoo.com Mon Nov 1 06:52:09 2004 From: jr50wv at yahoo.com (J. R. Hodel) Date: Mon Nov 1 06:52:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Google Message-ID: <20041101145209.38600.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Hi: I'm in favor of allowing Google to index the site - the information in the list's entrys (as well as its history) is lost pretty quickly without it. How do you think I found the list, anyways? Maybe we could ask Google to drop the email addresses rather than just revising them? A real person can click on the link to hit an individual message, and find the email addresses there. JR in WV __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From tim at orerockon.com Mon Nov 1 09:38:21 2004 From: tim at orerockon.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Mon Nov 1 09:40:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding in Nevada & OR In-Reply-To: <1c3.202bd97e.2eb73110@aol.com> References: <1c3.202bd97e.2eb73110@aol.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20041101092726.02640f98@mail.spiritone.com> The Lakeview shop has some incredible deals out back - I have bought chunks of Biggs there for 1 or 2 dollars a pound. And Eagle Point (aka Frieda) thundereggs for about 50 cents/lb. You are right, last time I looked at the regional show a month ago Tracinite was going for many dollars an OUNCE. And your agate doesn't sound like it is the classic Ochoco agate, which is now under Ochoco reservoir. That was very green, with yellowish green markings. Green sunstone is fairly rare at the Dust Devil but I have dug a few. The Corporation claim produces many small greens and the occasional blue. The blues are astounding. At 10:26 PM 10/31/2004, you wrote: >In a message dated 10/31/04 7:32:05 PM Pacific Standard Time, >jmonroe@sisna.com writes: > >The next day I drove the dirt road north from Fort Bidwell, CA to Adel, OR, >then the paved highway into Lakeview. The rockshop in Lakeview has some real >lapidary bargains; rough, slabs, tumbling mix, etc. In my years of >looking in >rockshops I've never seen lower prices. I bought a 7 pound agate for $ .70 >(yes, seventy cents) > >I don't know if it has a name but it sounds like it could be Ochoco agate. >It is cream color with a brilliant luster on a fresh fracture. I >can't see any >plumes or dendrites. The shape is like some pieces of carnelian agate I've >seen, but there is not any red in it. At the rock shop they had some samples >of polished tracinite and it is very pretty stuff. It was in the "Not for >sale" case. That's a good thing because I don't think I could afford it. > >I also went to the jewelry store and bought my wife a pair of faceted, green >sunstone ear rings. I had never seen green sunstones before. These were made >by the owner of the Dust Devil Mine. And I bought a couple sunstone >bracelets made by the same person -- for my granddaughters. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On Rockhounding Web Site Owner, Fisher Fisheries, Ltd. nospam@OreRockOn.com WWW http://OreRockOn.com From jemstone at amug.org Mon Nov 1 10:04:50 2004 From: jemstone at amug.org (John McLaughlin) Date: Mon Nov 1 10:04:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding in Nevada & OR References: <1c3.202bd97e.2eb73110@aol.com> Message-ID: <001a01c4c03d$48d6a0e0$f25a2741@MCWIDOM> Sounds like a great trip Grant. There are three partners in the Dust Devil Mine, but it was likely Terry Clark that built your jewelry, though Don and Steve may also be making jewelry - I just haven't seen their work if they do. Terry is a talented artist, though he probably doesn't see himself as an "Artiste". I missed the Lakeview shop on my last trip. I plan to be back at the Dust Devil when they start excavating the current office/parking area and get back into the upper levels of the basalt where the spectacular red material is, so I'll stop in Lakeview for groceries and visit the rock shop. For anyone in the mid section of Oregon, the Quant Rock Shop in Prineville is a similar place to Grant's description of the Lakeview shop. It's on Tim Fisher's Oregon collecting CD. They have a great quantity of rather scarce (and often classic) materials at prices that made me feel I was stealing. I bought a lot of material at such a low price that I made a voluntary contribution to the small museum they have. My partner on that trip is a slab collector and felt he had died and landed in heaven. It took me four hours to pry him out of Quant's and back on the road. Even then he kept talking about the slabs he had found from locations that have been exhausted or off limits for many years. I have also noticed that, as I grow older (especially after I turned 60) that my 4WD vehicle choice becomes more off-road capable, cutting down on the hikes into the collecting areas. John McLaughlin Glendale, Arizona > The next day I drove the dirt road north from Fort Bidwell, CA to Adel, > OR, > then the paved highway into Lakeview. The rockshop in Lakeview has some > real > lapidary bargains; rough, slabs, tumbling mix, etc. In my years of > looking in > rockshops I've never seen lower prices. I bought a 7 pound agate for $ > .70 > (yes, seventy cents) > > > I also went to the jewelry store and bought my wife a pair of faceted, > green > sunstone ear rings. I had never seen green sunstones before. These were > made > by the owner of the Dust Devil Mine. And I bought a couple sunstone > bracelets made by the same person -- for my granddaughters. > > Since I spent so much time just driving I around I didn't stop at Davis > Creek or any of the other localities we discussed. I was going to look for > tracinite but instead I decided to drive up the other way, to Cottonwood > Flat > Reservoir for the night. All in all, it was a good trip. I guess I'm > getting old > but I enjoyed driving around looking a lot more than I would have enjoyed > walking around looking. > > Grant Johnston, Chico, CA > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From alisonbugs at yahoo.com Tue Nov 2 07:44:03 2004 From: alisonbugs at yahoo.com (Alison Eichelberger) Date: Tue Nov 2 09:37:16 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhound Club Message-ID: <20041102154403.75965.qmail@web54301.mail.yahoo.com> Dear Peter, One of my geologists, Dan Swavely, would like some information about your Earth Digger Clubs and what they are about. He teaches children at our museum. I told him that I would send an email for him requesting information. Sincerely, Alison Eichelberger ===== Alison Eichelberger Collections and Exhibits Manager North Museum of Natural History & Science 400 College Ave. Lancaster, PA 17602 Phone 717-358-7188 Fax 717-358-4504 The North Museum of Natural History & Science Bringing the wonders of nature and science to Lancaster for over fifty years Anniversary Year 1954-2004 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From afox at drizzle.com Tue Nov 2 10:12:57 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Tue Nov 2 10:13:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] List Archives and Email Address Munging Message-ID: So, a little more information on the whole list archive things. Right now, the count is about 2-1 for continuing to allow Google to archive the list. However, there's only been about 25 people who have contacted me. The rest of you have been silent. Pipermail, which is a Python script, does the email address munging. It uses a simple regular expression to remove the "@" symbol and spell out the word 'at' in an email address. This used to be enough. But not anymore. It's relatively easy to write regular expressions to reconstruct the email address when obsfucated in this manner. Problems: Pipermail ONLY changes information in the message headers. It does not affect the message bodies. Unfortunately, many of the archive message bodies also contain email address information. For an example, see the link below: http://lists.drizzle.com/pipermail/rockhounds/2004-September/008216.html To truly 'clense' things would require writing scripts to parse through the entire messages, removing or munging email addresses based on a pre-determined method. The disadvantage here is that the historical context of who said what, or contacting an author for questions or republication permissions, becomes much more difficult. Not to mention the fact that it would be a custom software package that I doubt Drizzle would allow me to run. Options: 1) Password-protect the mailing list archives. This is an option. It would prevent Google from crawling the list archives. However, it would make searching difficult. Frankly, I don't have the time right now to make the archives searchable, nor the disk space. Eventually, this list will migrate to a colocated server that I run. Until then, we're stuck with Drizzle's limitations. I'm not all that in favor of this option, as it limits the ability of folks to find us and keeps the information we share aware from the rest of the Internet. 2) Attempt to improve the mailing-list address munging routine. It's Python. It should be relatively easy to replace the regular expression routines with some substitions that makes life more difficult for spammers, such as adding one of several bogus words that are obviously false (such as NoSpAm, BaDGooGle, ReMovEThiS, etc.). Not a perfect solution, but would stop some of the Google spam crawlers. I've downloaded the last publically available version of Pipermail, and will look at where changes need to be made when I get a spare minute. The point is this: Spammers are going to get your email address, no matter what you do. Unless you use single-use addresses behind a proxy, or only correspond with a limited list of people, you're vulnerable. And even then, all it takes is one email virus on one machine running Outlook or Outlook Express, to expose that person's email address book (with YOUR address in it) to the world at large. The more I think about it, the only way to truly protect your privacy is to only lurk on the Internet. Never post, only read. Unless you're willing to do that, email addresses will continue to be vulnerable. It's a question of trade-offs. I am leaning towards the following solution: --------------------------------------------- 1) Continuing to allow Google to index the archives, at least until I have a chance (in the distant future) to move us to a colocated server where I can support a private search engine and more detailed message filtering. 2) Improving pipermail to further munge the headers in the archive. This'would be a fun project for me, and may already have been done. 3) *Investigating* whether it would be feasable to munge all email addresses in the archives to make them more difficult to Sorry for the long-winded response. I figured you all should be kept in the loop. If you haven't sent me your feelings on the matter, please do so. I'll try to announce a new policy (and implement it) by the weekend. Cheers! Aaron Fox Rockhounds Admin BTW (off topic). For those of you with any inkling to learn a bit about computer programming, Python is a really, really good way to go. It grows as you do, and has a really simple but powerful syntax. More and more schools are going to it as a first language, and it's available for just about any operating system you could want, for free! If you want more information about Python or how to get started, contact me off-list, and I'll shoot things your way! From Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com Tue Nov 2 12:31:24 2004 From: Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com (Schlinsog, Anthony) Date: Tue Nov 2 12:34:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Where to collect in Kansas? Message-ID: Does anyone know of have any locations in Kansas for collecting? I would gladly trade information on the few sites that I am currently aware of. Thanks! Sincerely, Anthony Schlinsog Senior Application Developer GEHA 310 NE Mulberry Street Lee's Summit, MO 64086 Tel: (816) 257-5500 ext 4126 Fax: (816) 257-4422 Email: anthony.schlinsog@geha.com Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. From bg at his.com Tue Nov 2 12:56:19 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Tue Nov 2 12:56:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] kenneth zahn Message-ID: Dear Rockhounds, We recently heard that Kenneth Zahn, former Eastern and American Federation president, had passed away. We have not been able to locate any real evidence - funeral home, obit, etc. If anyone has any information about him, please post to me privately. thanks, Cathy Gaber bg@his.com From folmstead at rcn.com Tue Nov 2 16:00:40 2004 From: folmstead at rcn.com (Fred Olmstead) Date: Tue Nov 2 15:44:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhound Clubs In-Reply-To: <20041102154403.75965.qmail@web54301.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041102154403.75965.qmail@web54301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <41881FA8.9000401@rcn.com> http://www.amfed.org/ will have information about clubs / rockhounds etc. http://www.amfed.org/club.htm is club information..... GMO __..--..__..--..__.--..__ Alison Eichelberger wrote: >Dear Peter, >One of my geologists, Dan Swavely, would like some >information about your Earth Digger Clubs and what >they are about. He teaches children at our museum. >I told him that I would send an email for him >requesting information. >Sincerely, >Alison Eichelberger > >===== >Alison Eichelberger >Collections and Exhibits Manager >North Museum of Natural History & Science >400 College Ave. >Lancaster, PA 17602 >Phone 717-358-7188 >Fax 717-358-4504 > >The North Museum of Natural History & Science >Bringing the wonders of nature and science >to Lancaster for over fifty years >Anniversary Year 1954-2004 > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > From jonee at epix.net Tue Nov 2 15:55:17 2004 From: jonee at epix.net (E. L. Jones) Date: Tue Nov 2 15:55:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] List Archives and Email Address Munging In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41881E65.8050009@epix.net> While I am unable to determine if spam came to me from harvesting email addresses on other archives. I have gotten many inquiries from honest folks based on finding my address in a list or a response I had written. I am in favor for allowing Google to continue archiving munged ot unmunged. Elton Aaron Fox wrote: >So, a little more information on the whole list archive things. > >Right now, the count is about 2-1 for continuing to allow Google to >archive the list. However, there's only been about 25 people who have >contacted me. The rest of you have been silent. > > > From afox at drizzle.com Tue Nov 2 16:19:37 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Tue Nov 2 16:19:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Pre-emptive Strike Message-ID: This is just a little notice, in advance. ;-) NO ELECTION TALK! There are an absolute ton of blogs out there dedicated to discussing politics and the election. If you feel the need to participate, please join one of them. I know for a fact that the minute the political messages start coming across the list, things will turn into a flame war. And I hate having to be the hardass once they start and feelings get hurt. So, I'm nipping them in the bud. NO ELECTION TALK! The exception, would be, however, if any of the candidates had good rockhound sites they were willing to share.... Please do not respond to this message on-list; it is merely administrativa. Any problems or issues, contact me off-list. Thanks. a. Rockhounds Admin -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot From Lapidry at aol.com Tue Nov 2 17:08:07 2004 From: Lapidry at aol.com (Lapidry@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 2 17:08:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhound Clubs Message-ID: <7b.3736df80.2eb98977@aol.com> _http://www.amfed.org/efmls/clubs.htm_ (http://www.amfed.org/efmls/clubs.htm) would have a more complete list for someone in the Lancaster, PA area..... they're part of the EFMLS. Dan In a message dated 11/2/2004 6:45:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, folmstead@rcn.com writes: http://www.amfed.org/ will have information about clubs / rockhounds etc. http://www.amfed.org/club.htm is club information..... GMO __..--..__..--..__.--..__ Alison Eichelberger wrote: >Dear Peter, >One of my geologists, Dan Swavely, would like some >information about your Earth Digger Clubs and what >they are about. He teaches children at our museum. >I told him that I would send an email for him >requesting information. >Sincerely, >Alison Eichelberger > >===== >Alison Eichelberger >Collections and Exhibits Manager >North Museum of Natural History & Science >400 College Ave. >Lancaster, PA 17602 >Phone 717-358-7188 >Fax 717-358-4504 > >The North Museum of Natural History & Science >Bringing the wonders of nature and science >to Lancaster for over fifty years >Anniversary Year 1954-2004 > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 2 18:58:03 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 2 18:58:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo Message-ID: <1f0.2ebb84d2.2eb9a33b@aol.com> A stunning photo of Mars topography. _http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/_ (http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/) Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 2 20:06:20 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 2 20:06:28 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] modest comments Message-ID: <68.47b6c26d.2eb9b33c@aol.com> "I'm just a rockhound," said Tim Fisher of Oregon City, a consulting fisheries biologist who has made numerous extended visits over the past eight years. _http://www.registerguard.com/news/2004/10/18/b4.or.sunstone.1016.html_ (http://www.registerguard.com/news/2004/10/18/b4.or.sunstone.1016.html) >From the K. Falls newspaper. I don't know if this was on the list while I was up in Oregon. If it was, sorry about the duplicate post. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Rocks4u at prodigy.net Tue Nov 2 18:34:33 2004 From: Rocks4u at prodigy.net (Wes Lingerfelt) Date: Tue Nov 2 20:45:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] List Archives and Email Address Munging References: Message-ID: <000001c4c15f$f45dd320$eabefea9@WesMedion1918> Aaron, It makes no difference to me since my address was harvested long ago and I've learned to hit the delete key. I believe you are on top of the situation and I agree with your approach. Cheers! Wes Lingerfelt ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aaron Fox" To: "Rockhounds mailing list" Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 10:12 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] List Archives and Email Address Munging > So, a little more information on the whole list archive things. > > Right now, the count is about 2-1 for continuing to allow Google to > archive the list. However, there's only been about 25 people who have > contacted me. The rest of you have been silent. > > Pipermail, which is a Python script, does the email address munging. It > uses a simple regular expression to remove the "@" symbol and spell out > the word 'at' in an email address. This used to be enough. But not > anymore. It's relatively easy to write regular expressions to reconstruct > the email address when obsfucated in this manner. > > Problems: Pipermail ONLY changes information in the message headers. It > does not affect the message bodies. Unfortunately, many of the archive > message bodies also contain email address information. For an example, see > the link below: > http://lists.drizzle.com/pipermail/rockhounds/2004-September/008216.html > > To truly 'clense' things would require writing scripts to parse through > the entire messages, removing or munging email addresses based on a > pre-determined method. The disadvantage here is that the historical > context of who said what, or contacting an author for questions or > republication permissions, becomes much more difficult. Not to mention > the fact that it would be a custom software package that I doubt Drizzle > would allow me to run. > > Options: > 1) Password-protect the mailing list archives. This is an option. It > would prevent Google from crawling the list archives. However, it would > make searching difficult. Frankly, I don't have the time right now to > make the archives searchable, nor the disk space. Eventually, this list > will migrate to a colocated server that I run. Until then, we're stuck > with Drizzle's limitations. I'm not all that in favor of this option, as > it limits the ability of folks to find us and keeps the information we > share aware from the rest of the Internet. > > 2) Attempt to improve the mailing-list address munging routine. It's > Python. It should be relatively easy to replace the regular expression > routines with some substitions that makes life more difficult for > spammers, such as adding one of several bogus words that are obviously > false (such as NoSpAm, BaDGooGle, ReMovEThiS, etc.). Not a perfect > solution, but would stop some of the Google spam crawlers. I've > downloaded the last publically available version of Pipermail, and will > look at where changes need to be made when I get a spare minute. > > The point is this: Spammers are going to get your email address, no matter > what you do. Unless you use single-use addresses behind a proxy, or only > correspond with a limited list of people, you're vulnerable. And even > then, all it takes is one email virus on one machine running Outlook or > Outlook Express, to expose that person's email address book (with YOUR > address in it) to the world at large. > > The more I think about it, the only way to truly protect your privacy is > to only lurk on the Internet. Never post, only read. Unless you're > willing to do that, email addresses will continue to be vulnerable. It's > a question of trade-offs. > > I am leaning towards the following solution: > --------------------------------------------- > 1) Continuing to allow Google to index the archives, at least until > I have a chance (in the distant future) to move us to a colocated > server where I can support a private search engine and more detailed > message filtering. > > 2) Improving pipermail to further munge the headers in the archive. > This'would be a fun project for me, and may already have been done. > > 3) *Investigating* whether it would be feasable to munge all email > addresses in the archives to make them more difficult to > > Sorry for the long-winded response. I figured you all should be kept in > the loop. If you haven't sent me your feelings on the matter, please do > so. I'll try to announce a new policy (and implement it) by the weekend. > > Cheers! > > Aaron Fox > Rockhounds Admin > > BTW (off topic). For those of you with any inkling to learn a bit about > computer programming, Python is a really, really good way to go. It grows > as you do, and has a really simple but powerful syntax. More and more > schools are going to it as a first language, and it's available for just > about any operating system you could want, for free! > > If you want more information about Python or how to get started, contact > me off-list, and I'll shoot things your way! > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From magnet at crocoite.com Wed Nov 3 03:08:11 2004 From: magnet at crocoite.com (magnet) Date: Wed Nov 3 03:09:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: 2005 "Mineral" Calendar Message-ID: <20041103110811.26756.qmail@webmachine101.com> Hi all Apologies for any multiple posts. This is the third year of producing a mineral calendar, with previous years focussing on Tasmania and Queensland minerals. This year, I've produced a calendar based on New Zealand's South Island. Present-day New Zealand is the result of an upheaval along the line of collision between the Indian and Pacific Plates. The current surface is quite young, but it's rocks date back some 550 million years. There are two major islands known as the North Island and South Island. They are quite different geologically and both have appealing landscapes to offer. This calendar takes a trip through parts of the South Island, looking at some of the geological features as well as some of the minerals that can be found here. I hope that you enjoy this tour as much as I did being there. You can reach the calendar by following the "2005 Calendar" link at http://www.crocoite.com Regards Steve --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From william.s.cordua at uwrf.edu Wed Nov 3 04:41:30 2004 From: william.s.cordua at uwrf.edu (William Cordua) Date: Wed Nov 3 04:41:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo In-Reply-To: <1f0.2ebb84d2.2eb9a33b@aol.com> Message-ID: Gee Grant, these are stunning views. Thanks for the reference - I'll use it in class today. I'm still not convinced these are sediments rather than an eroded series of lava flows. We need a field trip to go there and find out! Dr. Bill on 11/2/04 8:58 PM, Lapadary@aol.com at Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > A stunning photo of Mars topography. > > _http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/_ > (http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/) > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From tim at orerockon.com Wed Nov 3 07:33:50 2004 From: tim at orerockon.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Wed Nov 3 07:33:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] modest comments In-Reply-To: <68.47b6c26d.2eb9b33c@aol.com> References: <68.47b6c26d.2eb9b33c@aol.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20041103072208.0268bc40@mail.spiritone.com> I didn't see it, but I was aware that it was in progress for the K-Falls paper. The reporter was there most of that day, and I think he may have been converted to a rockhound :D He said to look for it in Alaska Air's in-flight mag in the spring. If anyone sees it, I will trade a nice sunstone for the mag :) At 08:06 PM 11/2/2004, you wrote: > >"I'm just a rockhound," said Tim Fisher of Oregon City, a consulting >fisheries biologist who has made numerous extended visits over the past >eight years. >_http://www.registerguard.com/news/2004/10/18/b4.or.sunstone.1016.html_ >(http://www.registerguard.com/news/2004/10/18/b4.or.sunstone.1016.html) > > >From the K. Falls newspaper. > >I don't know if this was on the list while I was up in Oregon. If it was, >sorry about the duplicate post. > >Grant > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! nospam@OreRockOn.com Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com From tim at orerockon.com Wed Nov 3 09:02:19 2004 From: tim at orerockon.com (Tim Fisher) Date: Wed Nov 3 09:02:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Slightly OT: Global Attritioning Satellite Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20041103090017.02751458@mail.spiritone.com> A friend emailed this to me; I have no idea where it came from. Pretty funny stuff if you use a GPS with mapping capability... Global Attritioning Satellite By Lincoln Spector November 1, 2004 FADE IN: SIDEWALK BLAND: Good evening, ladies and gentleman, this is Bertrand Bland welcoming you to another broadcast of Better Opportunities with Micro Business. This week on BOMB, we're on the road with traveling salesman Skip Overit, watching how he uses a Global Positioning Satellite to help him navigate his rounds. Hello, Skip. Exactly what do you sell? OVERIT: Self-esteem. I work for the Lookingood, Outasite, and Denial Company, travelling from town to town, visiting retail boutiques, and making sure that no store is lacking self-esteem. BLAND: And how does GPS?or Global Positioning Satellite?help you in your work? OVERIT: Well, this gadget I'm holding in my hand is called the Timbuck II, and it's BLAND: It's a satellite, right? Wouldn't it be more useful in space? OVERIT: No, Bert, this isn't a satellite. It's a receiver. It finds multiple satellites in the sky, and uses them to calculate my location. BLAND: You mean I can use this little thing to find you? OVERIT: No, but I can use it to find myself. BLAND: Always important in the self-esteem business. CUT TO INSIDE CAR. OVERIT BEHIND THE WHEEL. OVERIT: The first thing I have to do, since my car didn't come with a built-in GPS unit, is attach the Timbuck II's mounting arm to the dashboard. You see this suction cup here? I press it against the dashboard, push down this lever, and?it falls right off. So I attach it to the windshield. BLAND: How much does a Timbuck II cost? OVERIT: This one cost me $983.58 BLAND: What do you think of that, folks? For that tiny amount of money you need never be lost again! OVERIT: plus an additional $158 for the map CD BLAND: Isn't that wonderful! For just?$1139.50 you need never be lost OVERIT: $239.68 if you want a map with actual streets on it. BLAND: Well, Skip, while we've been talking, you've managed to attach the mounting arm to the windshield, the Timbuck II to the mounting arm, and through this strange cable the cigarette lighter to the Timbuck II. Wow! It even lights cigarettes! OVERIT: Now I need to tell the Timbuck II my destination?which requires unplugging the cable and removing it from the mounting arm. Our first port of call is Emily's Emotions, a faux high-class shop at 4328 Kumquat St. in the town of Koozelstackandstandalot. You see, I just remove the stylus, press this button here, and tell it what city I want to go to. K O O BLAND: Do you have to type the entire name of the city? OVERIT: No. I press this and I get a selection. See. "Kooa, Kooltowne, Kooperate?" There we are: Koozelstackandstandalot. We select it, and pick the street and house number the same way. BLAND: You pick the city, then the street, then the house number? Doesn't that confuse the post office? OVERIT: Now I pop the Timbuck II back in its mounting arm, we wait for it to find the satellites and get its bearings, and we can be on our way. BLAND: How long does it take to get its bearings? OVERIT: A minute or two. FIFTEEN MINUTES LATER. BLAND: Has it found those satellites yet? OVERIT: Any minute, now. BLAND: Does it know to look up? OVERIT: Well, it's a little more Wait. There it goes. TIMBUCK II: Go straight. BLAND: Is it talking about my sexual orientation? OVERIT: No, it wants us to drive forward. TIMBUCK II: Go straight. BLAND: But we're in a driveway and facing a wall. OVERIT: It doesn't know that. Let me back out and get onto the road. BLAND: But which way will you go? OVERIT: South, of course. You think I drive anywhere without checking a roadmap? TIMBUCK II: When possible, turn around. OVERIT: Gee, maybe it knows a different route. I'll just do a u-turn right here and There we go. Now we're heading in the right direction. TIMBUCK II: When possible, turn around. BLAND: Well, I see it's working wonderfully. So tell me, can you change the voice? OVERIT: It's got two voice options, "Persistent" and "Annoying." The next version is supposed to offer celebrity voices; I'm hoping for Louis Armstrong or Mae West. TIMBUCK II: Turn left. BLAND: Where are we going? OVERIT: I don't know. But I'm sure it will get us where we're going. AN HOUR LATER BLAND: Any idea where we are? OVERIT: Not the foggiest. BLAND: Isn't the Timbuck II displaying a map? OVERIT: Probably, but it's not visible in direct sunlight. If we remain lost after dark, I'll be able to read it. TIMBUCK II: In 200 yards, go straight. BLAND: What does that mean? OVERIT: You see that fork in the road ahead. We need to decide if we're going left or right. TIMBUCK II: Go straight. OVERIT: Okay, I'm going left. TIMBUCK II: When possible, turn around. OVERIT: Okay, I'll turn around and go right. TIMBUCK II: Go left. OVERIT: Fine! I'll go left! TIMBUCK II: When possible, go strai THUMP BLAND: What happened? OVERIT: That bump in the road dislodged the Timbuck II. It fell on the floor. BLAND: Maybe we should stop and find it. OVERIT: Good idea?I just found it. It's lodged under the brake. We can't stop. Is that a cliff, up ahead? TIMBUCK II: Go straight. BLAND: Thank you, Skip, for this fascinating demonstration. And to our TV audience, my replacement will see you next week on BOMB Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! nospam@OreRockOn.com Web Site: http://OreRockOn.com From kahako at aloha.net Wed Nov 3 12:01:19 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Nov 3 11:33:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in 2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to rockhounds. This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more specific. 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of Europe. 2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a small tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to Hawaii while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & Canada. I'm a little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a flight of fancy, maybe we could do both! 3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? 4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh (where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland thoroughly. 5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do more. 5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? We look forward to your ideas and comments. Aloha, Kitty From pjmodreski at att.net Wed Nov 3 12:14:10 2004 From: pjmodreski at att.net (pjmodreski@att.net) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:14:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip Message-ID: <110320042014.3850.41893C11000BA8BA00000F0A216028074807059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net> Kitty, You mean you people have elections too, even way out there in Hawaii? Wha' d'ya know! Here's an addition to your itinerary--a friend just told me about this yesterday; if you happen to be in northern China in the winter, this can't be missed!!! It's very cool! : http://www.rtoddking.com/chinawin2003_hb_if.htm but if you're a bit more wimpy and don't want to cross Siberia and China in the winter, it looks like you can see some of the same things in southwest China (Guangxi), indoors, in the springtime even! http://english.people.com.cn/english/200101/30/eng20010130_61295.html and http://english.people.com.cn/english/200106/26/eng20010626_73518.html Have fun planning (and doing). And of course, if your wandering that year takes you through Colorado, I hope you'll get in touch and stop by to say hello. Aloha, Pete Modreski -------------- Original message from Kitty & Bill Heacox : -------------- > Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I > started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in > 2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so > we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but > for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations > take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to > rockhounds. > > This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the > World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you > had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in > collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic > interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our > dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more > specific. > > > 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical > Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of Europe. > > 2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly > to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a small > tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to Hawaii > while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & Canada. I'm a > little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a flight of fancy, > maybe we could do both! > > 3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? > > 4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh > (where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland thoroughly. > > 5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, > Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do > more. > > 5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway > and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? > > We look forward to your ideas and comments. > > Aloha, Kitty > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rik.dillen at skynet.be Wed Nov 3 12:26:29 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:26:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip (if not interested : delete) In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <000001c4c1e3$6a45e900$ee3cf051@maxdata> Hi Kitty and Bill (and others, if interested, because slightly off-topic), There are two Carraibean Islands that combine splendid tropical rain forest with geological stuff : the French Islands of Guadeloupe and Martinique (nobody speaks English there). Both are amongst the most gordious places in the world. On Guadeloupe you can go to the top of "La Soufri?re", full of gaseous emanation holes. The scenery is tropical (but, of course, you have all of that in your back-garden !), temperatures nice and warm (but you are used to that), and... o yes, you have a bunch of volcanoes also... in fact, why leave Hawaii ? OK, let's think about other places. La R?union Island ? Nope... too much Hawaii-like... just French-speaking Norway ? Way too cold... in february Lillehammer will be at -35?C (but OK in the summer). Ahaa... Western Canada, especially Vancouver Island, is one of my favourite places where I would certainly like to go back some time. You want to see real monkeys (no, not the political ones)... what about Namibia ? You can collect a few minerals there (and much more than that) as well. Japan ? Splendid, but I cannot afford to go there privately (was there once for work). And Australia... you know how it is ("region" - about 2500 km or so - between Sydney and Port Douglas is splendid... If you come to Europe there are some do's and don'ts (my opinion) : - Spain : splendid country, if you avoid the world famous costas (Costa del Sol in particular) ; Torremolinos is as Spanish as Antwerp or Brussels... crowded like hell all year around. Once you drive more inland, the situation changes drastically, because (nearly) no tourists ever leave the sand for the unknown but dramatically interesting towns like Granada (Alhambra !!) and Sevilla + surroundings. This is the real Spain... Very nice is the touristically nearly unknown north of Spain : Asturias. Madrid and Barcelona are well worth a cultural visit : nice architecture, interesting museums - Switzerland and Austria : unbelievable mountain scenery. Ride the train from Innsbruck (Austria) straight through the Alps to Geneva. That is a real unforgetable experience. If you are interested, that can be arranged very easily from here... you would find it difficult. I can also provide you with dates and places of mineral shows. - Sweden is a very quiet, nice country, with lots of woods and lakes. Here you come to rest and you will leave stressless. If there on the right moment (june) visit the Kopparberg mineral show. - Italy of course is interesting because of its marvellous cultural heritage (as is Greece), but expect impossible traffic situations and in the towns a very high degree of stress and nervosity. - Great-Britain... is very British... Very nice if you like gray drizzling rain, fog and moderate temperatures. - Paris : great for its museums - Germany : if you want to walk in hilly but not too difficult woods I would advise the Black Forest. - And Belgium... culture and historical monuments (in fact, lots of it), yes, but nature... nearly none left. After all one of the most beautiful things in this list IMHO is the train ride from Innsbruck to Gen?ve (if you want to enjoy it, you should do it in two laps of one day each). If you need any assistance in organising a trip to Europe (especially if you would plan to visit Belgium) just give me a shout. I have arranged train tickets etc. for American friends before. I invite you also to come to a monthly meeting of our club and give a lecture there about your home state. Just telling about what you can see from your back-garden will keep the attention of all our members for hours :>)) I can provide you anyway with dates and places of mineral shows throughout Europe ; you never know that an interesting one coincides with your trip (or that you can force your trip to make it happen). You stimulated my phantasy anyway to plan our next holiday trip... Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Kitty & Bill Heacox *Sent: woensdag 3 november 2004 21:01 *To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com *Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip * * *Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, *Bill and I *started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical *leave in *2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his *laptop---so *we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a *limitation, but *for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our *imaginations *take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to *rockhounds. * *This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the *World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would *you go if you *had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are *not just in *collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more *than geologic *interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we *mentioned as our *dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or *to be more *specific. * * *1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International *Astronomical *Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a *bit of Europe. * *2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought *we could fly *to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and *possibly a small *tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship *it to Hawaii *while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & *Canada. I'm a *little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a *flight of fancy, *maybe we could do both! * *3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? * *4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in *Edinburgh *(where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & *Ireland thoroughly. * *5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, *Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would *like to do *more. * *5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans *Siberia railway *and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? * *We look forward to your ideas and comments. * *Aloha, Kitty * * * * * *_______________________________________________ *Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List *WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds *Subscription Services: *http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds * * From afox at drizzle.com Wed Nov 3 12:30:44 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:30:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding / Min. Museums in Stockholm / Helsinki? Message-ID: I have been offered the opportunity to go to Stockholm, Sweden, for a few months this winter. Yes, I realize it's not the most optimum time to see a country. But, we must go where the work goes. And I'd love to do some rockhounding whilst I'm there. Anywhere interesting to go rockhounding near or around Stockholm? Any good mineral museums? Rock collections? I'll also be visiting Helsinki for a week or two to see friends, so that's a spot, too! a. -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot From morningstar at att.net Wed Nov 3 12:32:44 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:32:50 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding / Min. Museums in Stockholm / Helsinki? Message-ID: <110320042032.18742.4189406B000A9CD60000493621603762239D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> > Anywhere interesting to go rockhounding near or around Stockholm? Any > good mineral museums? Rock collections? Langban!!! That is one of the world's most interesting localities, and I've heard that the museum there is very friendly to visitors. Don From Lapadary at aol.com Wed Nov 3 12:39:30 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:39:38 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo Message-ID: <1d6.2eff6655.2eba9c02@aol.com> In a message dated 11/3/04 4:41:52 AM Pacific Standard Time, william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu writes: Gee Grant, these are stunning views. Thanks for the reference - I'll use it in class today. I'm still not convinced these are sediments rather than an eroded series of lava flows. We need a field trip to go there and find out! Dr. Bill ====================== Sign me up for that field trip!!! But before we go it would be good to have a list of lapidary items in the immediate area. Would the rock formations on Mars contain familiar collectable lapidary material? I know that any rock from outer space has value, including use in lapidary, but would we find familiar stones on Mars? Would agate form on Mars? What about opal? I know some opal deposit require water to percolate through the ground but could there be veins of massive opal on Mars? I don't think there was ever enough rain for turquoise to form -- but I'm not really sure. I've got a pretty good idea why turquoise forms in the desert, in deposits near the surface. I think Mars would have peridot -- but since coal is a precursor for diamonds I don't suppose there would be any diamonds. I would hate to waste my time looking for things like petrified wood or fossils -- but would it be a waste of time? I have a lot of questions. Does anybody have any answers? Grant Johnston, Chico, CA --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rik.dillen at skynet.be Wed Nov 3 12:43:22 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Wed Nov 3 12:43:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding / Min. Museums in Stockholm / Helsinki? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000501c4c1e5$c5caa480$ee3cf051@maxdata> Hi Aaron, not much around in Stockholm on a mineralogical point of view. And for rockhounding it will be far too cold I'm afraid. If you are interested I can send you (off list) some e-mail adresses of Swedish mineral collectors. But I encourage you VERY MUCH to visit the Vasa-Museum (can be reached on foot from the city centre) with a completely recovered ship wrek. This IMHO is one of the most perfect and interesting museums in the world ! See http://www.vasamuseet.se/Vasamuseet/Om.aspx or Google for Vasa museum Stockholm Stockholms is an extremely beautiful town.Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Fox *Sent: woensdag 3 november 2004 21:31 *To: Rockhounds mailing list *Subject: [Rockhounds] Rockhounding / Min. Museums in Stockholm */ Helsinki? * * *I have been offered the opportunity to go to Stockholm, *Sweden, for a few *months this winter. Yes, I realize it's not the most optimum *time to see a *country. But, we must go where the work goes. And I'd love to do some *rockhounding whilst I'm there. * *Anywhere interesting to go rockhounding near or around Stockholm? Any *good mineral museums? Rock collections? I'll also be visiting *Helsinki *for a week or two to see friends, so that's a spot, too! * *a. * *-- * afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox * FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your * computer. Press any key to reboot * *_______________________________________________ *Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List *WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds *Subscription Services: *http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds * From Lapadary at aol.com Wed Nov 3 13:09:26 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 3 13:09:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip Message-ID: <15b.43165817.2ebaa306@aol.com> In a message dated 11/3/04 11:34:21 AM Pacific Standard Time, kahako@aloha.net writes: 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of Europe. ============================== Kitty, Could you stretch it out until February? Quartzite and Tucson are both worth visiting -- and Clouds Jamboree, near Laughlin, NV is growing too. The area along the Colorado River is a snowbird paradise in the Winter. In fact, bird watching is one of the activities down there from Dec. on through the Spring. Because of the snowbirds all the little desert towns produce different types of cultural festivals, anything from chili cookoffs to music festivals. I go to bluegrass music festival on the weekends and hunt rocks on week days. I think it would be easy to spend 2 or 3 months in the Southwest. One word of advice though, the high desert is cold in the winter, especially after dark. A tent trailer might not be enough to keep you warm. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From mauricedegraaf at xs4all.nl Wed Nov 3 14:00:34 2004 From: mauricedegraaf at xs4all.nl (Maurice de Graaf) Date: Wed Nov 3 14:00:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Grimsvotn In-Reply-To: <15b.43165817.2ebaa306@aol.com> Message-ID: Hi All, Currently the airline traffic between the US and Europe is disrupted by a volcanic eruption of the Grimsvotn volcano on Iceland. Our TV news reported the ashplume runs all the way to the Black Sea.... Seems someone has failed topography class there, because fortunately it is not that bad. Or am I missing something? Here is a link with great pictures. The Grimsvotn caldera is located underneath the Vatnajokull glacier, making a great contrast between the black ash and white ice! http://hraun.vedur.is/ja/englishweb/eruption_grimsvotn.html Cheers, Maurice From rockhound at btinternet.com Wed Nov 3 15:03:45 2004 From: rockhound at btinternet.com (rockhound) Date: Wed Nov 3 15:03:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip References: <15b.43165817.2ebaa306@aol.com> Message-ID: <000c01c4c1f9$5f3eb8a0$619a9951@Shabon01> I have just completed part of my fantasy trip, an overnight busioness stay at Lulworth Cove, Dorset, England. Good fossils, good geology, good photos in the two hours of sunlight I had outside of work. Hopefully my next trip is Giants Causeway in Northern Ireland in January/February 2005, same work, another two hours of daylight wandering. Next year , in fall, I am hoping to get to Breckenridge, Colorado, and take an extra few days after work, so any guides to local sites would also be needed. I have failed to make it for two years on the trot, so hoping for third time lucky. Pure Fantasy now... Finding the ancient mines of Egypt, the source of their gold, it's out there in the desert somewhere. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 9:09 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > In a message dated 11/3/04 11:34:21 AM Pacific Standard Time, > kahako@aloha.net writes: > > > > > 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International > Astronomical > Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of > Europe. > > ============================== > Kitty, > > Could you stretch it out until February? Quartzite and Tucson are both > worth > visiting -- and Clouds Jamboree, near Laughlin, NV is growing too. The > area > along the Colorado River is a snowbird paradise in the Winter. In fact, > bird > watching is one of the activities down there from Dec. on through the > Spring. > > Because of the snowbirds all the little desert towns produce different > types > of cultural festivals, anything from chili cookoffs to music festivals. I > go > to bluegrass music festival on the weekends and hunt rocks on week days. > I > think it would be easy to spend 2 or 3 months in the Southwest. One word > of > advice though, the high desert is cold in the winter, especially after > dark. A > tent trailer might not be enough to keep you warm. > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From pjmodreski at att.net Wed Nov 3 16:30:26 2004 From: pjmodreski at att.net (pjmodreski@att.net) Date: Wed Nov 3 16:30:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Grimsvotn Message-ID: <110420040030.19106.418978220004358B00004AA2216038311607059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net> Maurice, Thanks for sending this notice & website link! Mount St. Helens has no monopoly on "fire and ice" eruptions this fall, and the pictures of Grimsvotn are rather more exciting. I got to see Vatnajokull (from a distance) and the outwash plains scoured by the jokullhlaups, once, on a Penn State geology field trip to Iceland, way back in 1970. Nothing was erupting then, but it was still very neat to see it all. Pete --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Wed Nov 3 16:56:23 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Wed Nov 3 16:56:28 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <00a401c4c209$1afa9320$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Fantasy trip, eh? I like the B.C. - Alberta area, from Vancouver Island to Dinosaur Provincial Park. I also like Maine. Oh, and let's not forget the Everglades and the Keys! If you want to pick up some Paleozoic fossils to ship home with your car when you go to Europe, you have to visit the Midwest - some nice sites in Kentucky and Indiana. You can send it back with the trunk filled with specimens! I spent a week in the Amazon rain forest in Peru sometime back. If you like interesting creatures, that is a good place to go. Hit Machu Pichu or other sites in the Andes for a change of pace while you are in the neighborhood. And while you are on the west coast of South America, hit the Galapagos Islands. Or try the Atacama desert -- sounds like an interesting place when the daytime temperatures aren't set on "broil." An acquaintance did some research on the K-T boundary of Seymour Island, Antarctica. True, they do get some blizzards in the summer time, and it can be quite muddy when the temps warm up, but there are places on the island covered with fossils. (No greenery whatsoever.) Some cool in-situ Pleisosaurs with gastroliths in the rib cages. The largest ammonites have to be air-lifted out, but who cares? This is a fantasy trip! Alan G. P.S. I'm trying to take my mind off the elections today. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:01 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I > started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in > 2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so > we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but > for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations > take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to > rockhounds. > > This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the > World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you > had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in > collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic > interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our > dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more > specific. > > > 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical > Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of > Europe. > > 2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly > to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a > small tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to > Hawaii while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & > Canada. I'm a little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a > flight of fancy, maybe we could do both! > > 3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? > > 4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh > (where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland > thoroughly. > > 5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, > Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do > more. > > 5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway > and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? > > We look forward to your ideas and comments. > > Aloha, Kitty > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockcurrier at cs.com Wed Nov 3 17:10:02 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Wed Nov 3 17:01:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 2 References: <200411030202.iA322oZk006188@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <014601c4c20b$040790d0$6901a8c0@rock3> The Mineralogical Society of Southern California (Los Angeles area) is offering to sell a limited number of its standard Pony display cases for $100 each. They will be made available from the warehouse of Jewel Tunnel Imports at 1300 Spring St. Baldwin Park, California. You must arrange for them to be picked up. Shipping is not available. First come first serve. About 20 to 30 units available. I think new they are running about $300. Send inquiries to jeweltunnel@hotmail.com. Rock Currier From jr50wv at yahoo.com Wed Nov 3 19:37:52 2004 From: jr50wv at yahoo.com (J. R. Hodel) Date: Wed Nov 3 19:37:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas Message-ID: <20041104033752.47557.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Kitty, et al: I would recommend Maine as well. There's terrific geology, pegmatites to mine for gem stones, and great tourism attractions. Acadia National Park, Cadillac Mountain, The granite shores with huge waves crashing on the rocks, LOBSTER! for a couple of bucks a pound! The pegmatite workshop run by Poland Mining Camp and Ray Sprague---here's some scoop on that: "The Maine Pegmatite Workshop - 2005 June 4-10, 2005 - Poland, Maine http://homepage.mac.com/rasprague/PegShop/ Rubellite Press http://homepage.mac.com/rasprague/rubellite/ Rubellite Press has posted a brand new web site and added two new books to their Book Shelf. "The Pegmatite Mines Known As Palermo" by Robert Whitmore, and "Maine's Treasure Chest" by Jane C. Perham. We are also attempting to publish another new book in time of the Tucson Show.The Maine Pegmatite Workshop - 2005 June 4-10, 2005 - Poland, Maine http://homepage.mac.com/rasprague/PegShop/ Rubellite Press http://homepage.mac.com/rasprague/rubellite/ Rubellite Press has posted a brand new web site and added two new books to their Book Shelf. "The Pegmatite Mines Known As Palermo" by Robert Whitmore, and "Maine's Treasure Chest" by Jane C. Perham. We are also attempting to publish another new book in time of the Tucson Show." There's also great collecting in Kentucky and Indiana for fossils and geodes, I could help with that as we've been collecting there several weekends a year for several years now. And there's great horse farms, and they make whiskey there, too. If you do the Pegmatite Workshop, I'll plan to see you there, cause I've been trying to attend since day one and have had to bail out year after year! Unles we actually do go to Europe this coming summer, another thing we've always wanted to do and never had time for before! Isn't fantasy travel fun! I also want to second Peru, one of my coworkers is from there, and it sounds like a great place to visit, with ancient ruins, and geology you can see without digging! Have fun! JR in WV __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Nov 3 20:46:20 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Nov 3 20:39:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <4189B271.6D66@Tomaszewski.net> Aloha, Buy your vehicle in Franklin, NJ, and follow the interstate across North America to Mt St Helens, roughly using "Annals of the Former World" by John McPhee as your geological guide. Or buy a vehicle in Alaska and see how far south you can drive, and sell it in South America. Buy another on the way thru the States and ship it home. Or buy a vehicle in Alaska, drive it to the 48 (which brings you into WA), and follow a path that covers the other 47 States, ending where you want to ship the car to the final state, which is home. All assume some side trips in Canada and Mexico for choice collecting locations. A side trip of a day or few, on any path, would take you to many you know from this list, and to many interesting collecting locations (bring a MAS/MILS disk for the laptop). Or go 'Around The World in 80 Days', see every active volcano; take side trips for collecting, but don't count any side trips towards the 80 days. I wonder how many countries you could visit in a year and still have a collecting trip in each one? What is the shortest path trip around the World that touches every Country and returns you back home in the USA? Ship what you collect home so you can travel light. Have fun! Kreigh Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > > Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I > started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in > 2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so > we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but > for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations > take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to > rockhounds. > > This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the > World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you > had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in > collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic > interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our > dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more > specific. > > 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical > Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of Europe. > > 2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly > to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a small > tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to Hawaii > while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & Canada. I'm a > little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a flight of fancy, > maybe we could do both! > > 3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? > > 4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh > (where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland thoroughly. > > 5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, > Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do > more. > > 5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway > and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? > > We look forward to your ideas and comments. > > Aloha, Kitty > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Nov 3 20:56:04 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Nov 3 20:49:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo References: <1d6.2eff6655.2eba9c02@aol.com> Message-ID: <4189B4B9.535C@Tomaszewski.net> Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 11/3/04 4:41:52 AM Pacific Standard Time, > william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu writes: > > Gee Grant, these are stunning views. Thanks for the reference - I'll use it > in class today. I'm still not convinced these are sediments rather than an > eroded series of lava flows. We need a field trip to go there and find out! > > Dr. Bill > > ====================== > Sign me up for that field trip!!! But before we go it would be good Sign me up too, Dr.Bill! > I think Mars would have peridot -- but since coal is a precursor for > diamonds I don't suppose there would be any diamonds. I would hate to waste my time > looking for things like petrified wood or fossils -- but would it be a waste > of time? > > I have a lot of questions. Does anybody have any answers? > > Grant Johnston, Chico, CA Grant, I thought that diamonds came up in deep volcanic pipes, and that there is some evidence the magma came up fairly quickly; no coal involved, though I suppose you could make artificial diamonds from coal. Kreigh From pchil at botsnet.bw Wed Nov 3 20:47:49 2004 From: pchil at botsnet.bw (P.C. Hulley) Date: Wed Nov 3 20:56:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip (if not interested : delete) References: <000001c4c1e3$6a45e900$ee3cf051@maxdata> Message-ID: <003701c4c22a$d7d51ee0$9048a7a8@hulley> Hello Kitty and Bill, How about Southern Africa? You could include Namibia and drive through Botswana. Now that would be a change of scenert for you. Mineral collecting at Brandberg and Spitskoppe, the ageless Namib desert, the Okavango Delta, numerous game parks, the stunning Table Mountain, Drakensberg and Cape fold mountains, and the amazing hospitality of the South African Mineral and Gem Societies! You could also visit a small diamond mining town in the heart of the Kalagadi desert, love to show you around! Hildagarde From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 4 01:15:20 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 4 01:15:01 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: Hi Kitty Rik wrote: >- And Belgium... culture and historical monuments (in fact, lots of it), yes, but nature... nearly none left. Have to disagree, Rik... There's still enough left to get lost in. Not much rockhoundin grounds left, that's true. >(especially if you would plan to visit Belgium) just give me a shout. Make it a loud one, so I can hear it too... ;-))) You know, aside from visiting place you would actually get a chance to meet some of those people you know from the Rockhounds list... isn't that something else? Cheers Axel From Ted at crystalgems.com Thu Nov 4 06:52:47 2004 From: Ted at crystalgems.com (Ted) Date: Thu Nov 4 06:52:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <002f01c4c27d$f48390a0$0200a8c0@gametime> Kitty: Some comments to help you plan. Time: A few weeks is a very short time. Do not do yourself a disservice and try to cram too many places into too short a period of time. Almost anywhere offers a wide array of rockhounding along with other entertainment. What is other entertainment? Well, it depends on where you are going. Museums and rock shops are pretty well global wherever you got along with scenic or historical sights. Many places also have unique events that should not be missed; for example (Tucson - rock show, Elko NV - Rodeo). Racing from one place to another really eats into the ability to enjoy these events. Vehicle: Personally, I would scratch the minivan idea. Why? Well, they may be comfortable, stylish and get good gas mileage, but they have terrible road clearance and off-road capability. If you plan on visiting areas like Mt. Antero, Sunstones near Plush Oregon, Topaz Mountain you need good road clearance and 4-wheel drive (not AWD). Still need a smaller gas sipping version, well, there are many smaller good cars (not necessarily SUVs). One rockhound I know that visits Antero every years swears by Subaru. Of course one of his reasons is that the drivers seat reclines all the way so he can sleep in the car. Plans: Spring for some luxuries that are also essentials. I list a good road map planning program as essential so set up your basic route including stops. I use Rand McNally, but there are several out there that do an excellent job. They help you calculate driving times; overnight stays; gas stops; etc. I strongly suggest a GPS unit with supporting software. A GPS unit virtually eliminates arguments over map reading as it graphically defines where you are. If you plan to go off-road, make sure you get the topo version of software. Many road programs show the terrain between major roads as completely barren. This can be disconcerting when you are deep in the desert. Get Tim Fisher's CD if you plan on visiting anywhere near the NW section of the country. Actions: Do the planning NOW and make necessary reservations! There are many desirable sights that are booked months in advance. Where are these places? Well Grand Canyon, Yosemite are two off the top of my mind. If you are planning to visit National Parks; hit the website and review the parks near where you plan to travel. There are some surprises out there. For example, Sequoia National Park may be overflowing with visitors while nearby Kings Canyon is almost empty. Laptop: I wrangled four weeks continuous vacation out of where I worked one year by promising to bring my laptop with me... Well, the bright sun out west washed out the laptop screen all day every day. I could only use the laptop at night or in hotel rooms. Unless you can get a vehicle with a darkened interior don't plan on laptopping when the sun is bright. Oh yeah, mosquitoes made for miserable laptop use at night. Have a great trip! Ted -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Kitty & Bill Heacox Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:01 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in 2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to rockhounds. This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more specific. 1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of Europe. 2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a small tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to Hawaii while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & Canada. I'm a little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a flight of fancy, maybe we could do both! 3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? 4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh (where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland thoroughly. 5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do more. 5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? We look forward to your ideas and comments. Aloha, Kitty _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From horstwindisch at absamail.co.za Thu Nov 4 11:21:55 2004 From: horstwindisch at absamail.co.za (Horst Windisch) Date: Thu Nov 4 11:37:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP Message-ID: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> Hello Kitty and Bill, Latching on to Hildegarde Hulley's suggestion, a trip to Southern Africa would be the nvy of all your friends. On the astronomy side, you could plan a "busman's holiday" to our big Obsercatory at Sutherland (where they are busy installing a very large new telescope - not being interested in astronomy to such a degree, I don't have the technical specifications for it, but you can probably get the details from the relevant literature). Before you come, I can work out an itinerary for you, to cover any subject you want. I have been doing this for the past 235 years now for visiting rockhounds from all over the world. WEe normally ask new arrivals to spend the first day or two with us here in Pretoria, to go over the final points of your itinrary and last minute tips. If the trip is arranged far in advance, I can organise you permission to viit various collecting areas before-hand,, like visiting the working mines at Phalaborwa, an underground visit to a diamond mine, etc. Also give you the "lowdown" on collecting trips to Namibia to where I have organised long tours for our Federation members in the past, travelling as groups, varying between 60 and 26 persons. Your biggest expense of course will be your air-line tickets, but there are some "bargain" flights available (for fear of adverising will not mention the relevant airline in this message). Think about it; if interested, get back to me privately. Kind regards, Horst From bg at his.com Thu Nov 4 11:52:41 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Thu Nov 4 11:52:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP In-Reply-To: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> Message-ID: <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> sorry horst, i can't help it. i know you've been at this a long time, but 235 years??!! anyway, kitty and bill, if you can get to south africa, you'll be in good hands with horst. cathy On Nov 4, 2004, at 2:21 PM, Horst Windisch wrote: > Hello Kitty and Bill, > > Latching on to Hildegarde Hulley's suggestion, a trip to Southern > Africa > would be the nvy of all your friends. On the astronomy side, you could > plan > a "busman's holiday" to our big Obsercatory at Sutherland (where they > are > busy installing a very large new telescope - not being interested in > astronomy to such a degree, I don't have the technical specifications > for > it, but you can probably get the details from the relevant literature). > > Before you come, I can work out an itinerary for you, to cover any > subject > you want. I have been doing this for the past 235 years now for > visiting > rockhounds from all over the world. WEe normally ask new arrivals to > spend > the first day or two with us here in Pretoria, to go over the final > points > of your itinrary and last minute tips. If the trip is arranged far in > advance, I can organise you permission to viit various collecting areas > before-hand,, like visiting the working mines at Phalaborwa, an > underground > visit to a diamond mine, etc. Also give you the "lowdown" on collecting > trips to Namibia to where I have organised long tours for our > Federation > members in the past, travelling as groups, varying between 60 and 26 > persons. > > Your biggest expense of course will be your air-line tickets, but > there are > some "bargain" flights available (for fear of adverising will not > mention > the relevant airline in this message). > > Think about it; if interested, get back to me privately. > > Kind regards, > Horst > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rik.dillen at skynet.be Thu Nov 4 12:02:39 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Thu Nov 4 12:03:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP In-Reply-To: <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> Message-ID: <000901c4c2a9$402c1970$7cc5f051@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Catherine Gaber *Sent: donderdag 4 november 2004 20:53 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP *i can't help it. i know you've been at this a long time, but 235 years??!! *anyway, kitty and bill, if you can get to south africa, you'll be in good hands with horst. * >>>>> I can second that, as Horst received my daughter with open arms a few years ago when she made her very first professional trip on her own to an overseas country. She will never forget that hospitability. And, BTW, Tine didn't even know that I knew Horst as well. I heart about it afterwards, purely accidentally. Isn't it a small world we live in ? Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From Lapadary at aol.com Thu Nov 4 12:48:49 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 4 12:48:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas Message-ID: <1df.2e181079.2ebbefb1@aol.com> In a message dated 11/3/04 7:38:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, jr50wv@yahoo.com writes: There's also great collecting in Kentucky and Indiana for fossils and geodes, I could help with that as we've been collecting there several weekends a year for several years now. And there's great horse farms, and they make whiskey there, too. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Back in I went to a conference in Louisville, Kentucky. It was a Bluegrass Music conference, with music on stage 16 hours each day and jamming all nighrt, so I didn't have any time to explore the area. However, the day we left we were driving west on Interstate 64, going through miles of road cuts. The had cut through limestone beds to grade the Interstate. I saw a person in one road cut working at removing something so I just had to stop. When we found a turnout big enough for our motor home we pulled over. The limestone was full of fossils. I didn't stay long so I'm not sure if the local police disapprove of collecting fossils along the Interstate. After I got home I discovered that just across the Ohio River from Louisville was the Falls of the Ohio State Park, the largest naturally exposed Devonian fossil beds in the world. If you are in that area I think that would be a great place to visit. And if I was ever there again I would spend some time looking for collecting areas. I might even try digging in one of those road cuts on I-64 West. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From folmstead at rcn.com Thu Nov 4 14:09:50 2004 From: folmstead at rcn.com (Fred Olmstead) Date: Thu Nov 4 13:53:49 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP In-Reply-To: <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> Message-ID: <418AA8AE.8070703@rcn.com> GeorgiaO Hello You didn't look a day over 23!!! OR was that 35??? at least, a 'couple' of years ago __..--..__ Catherine Gaber wrote: > sorry horst, > > i can't help it. i know you've been at this a long time, but 235 > years??!! > > anyway, kitty and bill, if you can get to south africa, you'll be in > good hands with horst. > > cathy > > On Nov 4, 2004, at 2:21 PM, Horst Windisch wrote: > >> Hello Kitty and Bill, >> >> Latching on to Hildegarde Hulley's suggestion, a trip to Southern Africa >> would be the nvy of all your friends. On the astronomy side, you >> could plan >> a "busman's holiday" to our big Obsercatory at Sutherland (where they >> are >> busy installing a very large new telescope - not being interested in >> astronomy to such a degree, I don't have the technical specifications >> for >> it, but you can probably get the details from the relevant literature). >> >> Before you come, I can work out an itinerary for you, to cover any >> subject >> you want. I have been doing this for the past 235 years now for visiting >> rockhounds from all over the world. WEe normally ask new arrivals to >> spend >> the first day or two with us here in Pretoria, to go over the final >> points >> of your itinrary and last minute tips. If the trip is arranged far in >> advance, I can organise you permission to viit various collecting areas >> before-hand,, like visiting the working mines at Phalaborwa, an >> underground >> visit to a diamond mine, etc. Also give you the "lowdown" on collecting >> trips to Namibia to where I have organised long tours for our Federation >> members in the past, travelling as groups, varying between 60 and 26 >> persons. >> >> Your biggest expense of course will be your air-line tickets, but >> there are >> some "bargain" flights available (for fear of adverising will not >> mention >> the relevant airline in this message). >> >> Think about it; if interested, get back to me privately. >> >> Kind regards, >> Horst >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Thu Nov 4 14:53:16 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Thu Nov 4 14:55:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip References: <110320042014.3850.41893C11000BA8BA00000F0A216028074807059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net> Message-ID: <003401c4c2c1$13052f00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Pete, We are THE Wimpees, & from what we've seen about China, the trip would be great. Now if we can find a sponsor to pay the costs..... Have a great trip Kitty & Bill!!!!!!!! Glenn & Jeanette Wimpee From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Thu Nov 4 16:36:57 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Thu Nov 4 16:37:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas References: <1df.2e181079.2ebbefb1@aol.com> Message-ID: <00b901c4c2cf$8ec265a0$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Grant & others, Next time you are at the Falls of the Ohio, look me up. I am the paleontologist there! (Actually, let me know in advance, I'm always busy and lots of people that drop in to find me don't always succeed.) Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 3:48 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas > In a message dated 11/3/04 7:38:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > jr50wv@yahoo.com writes: > > > > There's also great collecting in Kentucky and Indiana > for fossils and geodes, I could help with that as > we've been collecting there several weekends a year > for several years now. And there's great horse farms, > and they make whiskey there, too. > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Back in I went to a conference in Louisville, Kentucky. It was a Bluegrass > Music conference, with music on stage 16 hours each day and jamming all > nighrt, so I didn't have any time to explore the area. However, the day we > left we > were driving west on Interstate 64, going through miles of road cuts. The > had > cut through limestone beds to grade the Interstate. > > I saw a person in one road cut working at removing something so I just had > to stop. When we found a turnout big enough for our motor home we pulled > over. > The limestone was full of fossils. I didn't stay long so I'm not sure if > the > local police disapprove of collecting fossils along the Interstate. > > After I got home I discovered that just across the Ohio River from > Louisville was the Falls of the Ohio State Park, the largest naturally > exposed > Devonian fossil beds in the world. If you are in that area I think that > would be a > great place to visit. And if I was ever there again I would spend some > time > looking for collecting areas. I might even try digging in one of those > road > cuts on I-64 West. > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From kahako at aloha.net Thu Nov 4 17:28:28 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Thu Nov 4 16:59:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip In-Reply-To: <002f01c4c27d$f48390a0$0200a8c0@gametime> References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041103082322.02cabeb0@mail.aloha.net> <002f01c4c27d$f48390a0$0200a8c0@gametime> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041104082826.02feeeb0@mail.aloha.net> Many thanks for the practical tips. Re Time: I agree that we want to avoid doing too much with too little time. I said "several weeks" in my question, and that would be for each segment of the trip...several weeks driving around the US and Canada, several weeks in Europe, and so on. We will actually be free to leave here June 1st, and should return around Christmas. Thus I expect our biggest limitation will be money, not time. We appreciate all the ideas---and invitations!---so far, we look forward to more, and hope the idea has stimulated your minds to wander to places you would like to go, even if just in your imaginations! Aloha, Kitty At 04:52 AM 11/4/2004, you wrote: >Kitty: >Some comments to help you plan. > >Time: >A few weeks is a very short time. Do not do yourself a disservice and try to >cram too many places into too short a period of time. Almost anywhere offers >a wide array of rockhounding along with other entertainment. What is other >entertainment? Well, it depends on where you are going. Museums and rock >shops are pretty well global wherever you got along with scenic or >historical sights. Many places also have unique events that should not be >missed; for example (Tucson - rock show, Elko NV - Rodeo). Racing from one >place to another really eats into the ability to enjoy these events. > >Vehicle: >Personally, I would scratch the minivan idea. Why? Well, they may be >comfortable, stylish and get good gas mileage, but they have terrible road >clearance and off-road capability. If you plan on visiting areas like Mt. >Antero, Sunstones near Plush Oregon, Topaz Mountain you need good road >clearance and 4-wheel drive (not AWD). Still need a smaller gas sipping >version, well, there are many smaller good cars (not necessarily SUVs). One >rockhound I know that visits Antero every years swears by Subaru. Of course >one of his reasons is that the drivers seat reclines all the way so he can >sleep in the car. > >Plans: >Spring for some luxuries that are also essentials. I list a good road map >planning program as essential so set up your basic route including stops. I >use Rand McNally, but there are several out there that do an excellent job. >They help you calculate driving times; overnight stays; gas stops; etc. I >strongly suggest a GPS unit with supporting software. A GPS unit virtually >eliminates arguments over map reading as it graphically defines where you >are. If you plan to go off-road, make sure you get the topo version of >software. Many road programs show the terrain between major roads as >completely barren. This can be disconcerting when you are deep in the >desert. Get Tim Fisher's CD if you plan on visiting anywhere near the NW >section of the country. > >Actions: >Do the planning NOW and make necessary reservations! There are many >desirable sights that are booked months in advance. Where are these places? >Well Grand Canyon, Yosemite are two off the top of my mind. If you are >planning to visit National Parks; hit the website and review the parks near >where you plan to travel. There are some surprises out there. For example, >Sequoia National Park may be overflowing with visitors while nearby Kings >Canyon is almost empty. > >Laptop: >I wrangled four weeks continuous vacation out of where I worked one year by >promising to bring my laptop with me... Well, the bright sun out west washed >out the laptop screen all day every day. I could only use the laptop at >night or in hotel rooms. Unless you can get a vehicle with a darkened >interior don't plan on laptopping when the sun is bright. Oh yeah, >mosquitoes made for miserable laptop use at night. > >Have a great trip! >Ted > >-----Original Message----- >From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Kitty & Bill >Heacox >Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:01 PM >To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > >Last night while trying to take our minds off the elections, Bill and I >started talking about what we will do when he takes sabbatical leave in >2006. He will be writing a textbook---which he can do on his laptop---so >we can go wherever we like. Of course finances will be a limitation, but >for fun we decided to ignore that little factor and let our imaginations >take flight. ;-) This morning I decided to toss the idea out to >rockhounds. > >This differs slightly from Hans Durstling's "Geological Wonders of the >World" topic some time ago. This question is, "Where would you go if you >had several weeks to explore?" In our case, our interests are not just in >collecting rocks, so if your suggested locations have more than geologic >interest, so much the better. I'll list the things we mentioned as our >dream destinations, and invite you to add your suggestions, or to be more >specific. > > >1. We will definitely attend the meeting of the International Astronomical >Union in Prague in August, 2006, so we must include at least a bit of >Europe. > >2. We will also need to buy a new car by then, so we thought we could fly >to the US mainland, buy a car (maybe a minivan or SUV, and possibly a small >tent trailer), drive around for several weeks, and then ship it to Hawaii >while we take off for Europe. Bill wants to do western US & Canada. I'm a >little more in favor of eastern US & Canada. This being a flight of fancy, >maybe we could do both! > >3. Head down to Mexico?...keep on going south? > >4. After the Prague conference, set up for an extended stay in Edinburgh >(where Bill has astronomy contacts) and explore Britain & Ireland >thoroughly. > >5. We'd like to go back to Australia some day. We did Broken Hill, >Lightening Ridge, White Cliffs, and the Sydney area, but would like to do >more. > >5. From Europe, go into Russia, then maybe take the Trans Siberia railway >and spend a while in Japan? Thailand? > >We look forward to your ideas and comments. > >Aloha, Kitty > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pbhewitt at comcast.net Thu Nov 4 17:47:16 2004 From: pbhewitt at comcast.net (Paul Hewitt) Date: Thu Nov 4 17:47:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] tanzanite crystal References: <200411030202.iA322oZk006188@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <014601c4c20b$040790d0$6901a8c0@rock3> Message-ID: <001f01c4c2d9$6483fd80$6501a8c0@DellLaptop> Hello to the group. I am looking for a natural (unenhanced) tanzanite crystal. I dont want to spend a fortune on one so I guess I can only expect to buy one that is pretty small. I have done a google search for them but did not find anything I liked. If anyone has any to sell please contact me at pbhewitt@gmail.com. Thanks! Paul From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Thu Nov 4 17:51:53 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Thu Nov 4 17:51:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <1d6.2eff6655.2eba9c02@aol.com> <4189B4B9.535C@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <00f101c4c2da$0659e430$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. Graphite would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the limestone got subducted into the upper mantle. Alan ----- Original Message ----- > Grant, > > I thought that diamonds came up in deep volcanic pipes, and that there > is some evidence the magma came up fairly quickly; no coal involved, > though I suppose you could make artificial diamonds from coal. > > Kreigh From Lapadary at aol.com Thu Nov 4 19:14:59 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 4 19:15:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds Message-ID: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> In a message dated 11/4/04 5:52:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, deepskyspy@insightbb.com writes: I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. Graphite would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the limestone got subducted into the upper mantle. =====================> I admit my research for that was a Superman comic book. Remember the one where he squeezed a lump of coal until it turned into a beautifully faceted diamond? That belief was reinforced by the words to the classic country song, "I'm just an old lump of coal (but I'm gonna be a diamond someday.)" If Superman did it and Johnny Cash sang it how can it not be true? :-] But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we expect to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Thu Nov 4 19:48:33 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Thu Nov 4 19:48:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> Message-ID: <016301c4c2ea$531f9110$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> There is a lot of basalt on Mars. Whether it is identical to Earth's basalt, I don't know. Viking did some sample analysis in the mid 1970's and the current Spirit / Opportunity research is on-going, but I'm sure NASA has preliminary analysis available. Now we know Mars has a lot of dust, which contains iron (you know, the "red" planet) presumably from the weathering and erosion of the igneous rock. There is ample evidence of river-borne deposits, but they may in fact be similar in composition to the dust. That depends on how long liquid water existed on Mars and what minerals were created as the country rock reacted with said water. Look at the various environments that agate, feldspar and limestone are found on Earth. Do or did the same conditions occur on Mars? If they did, then perhaps they can be found. Whether there was enough calcium available, I doubt it, but I'm don't know for sure. Certainly shale, siltstone and sandstone deposits could exist on the planet. Those rocks might not thrill you, but geologists would do some cartwheels! Microscopic diamonds have been found in some meteorites, so there should be no doubt that some of these diamonds are littering the surface of Mars. Got an electron microscope? Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:14 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds > In a message dated 11/4/04 5:52:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, > deepskyspy@insightbb.com writes: > > I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. > Graphite > would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form > diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the > limestone > got subducted into the upper mantle. > > =====================> > I admit my research for that was a Superman comic book. Remember the one > where he squeezed a lump of coal until it turned into a beautifully > faceted > diamond? That belief was reinforced by the words to the classic country > song, > "I'm just an old lump of coal (but I'm gonna be a diamond someday.)" > > If Superman did it and Johnny Cash sang it how can it not be true? :-] > But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we > expect > to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 4 20:09:48 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 4 19:59:42 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> <418AA8AE.8070703@rcn.com> Message-ID: <418AFAA6.1C5@Tomaszewski.net> Horst, 235 is 33 1/2 in 'dog' years, but its still pretty short on a geologic time scale (extra point for making topic). Or is that in months, and we're just talking just under 20 _long_ years (and I refrain from suggesting why years may seem long)? Nice to see I'm not the only one with a typewronger keyboard. Hehehe. Kreigh Fred Olmstead wrote: > > GeorgiaO > > Hello > You didn't look a day over 23!!! > OR > was that 35??? > > at least, a 'couple' of years ago > __..--..__ > > Catherine Gaber wrote: > > > sorry horst, > > > > i can't help it. i know you've been at this a long time, but 235 > > years??!! > > > > On Nov 4, 2004, at 2:21 PM, Horst Windisch wrote: > > > >> you want. I have been doing this for the past 235 years now for visiting > >> rockhounds from all over the world. WEe normally ask new arrivals to > >> spend > >> the first day or two with us here in Pretoria, to go over the final From kahako at aloha.net Thu Nov 4 20:36:55 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Thu Nov 4 20:07:59 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Grimsvotn In-Reply-To: References: <15b.43165817.2ebaa306@aol.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041104182448.032c9db0@mail.aloha.net> At 12:00 PM 11/3/2004, Maurice de Graaf wrote: >...Currently the airline traffic between the US and Europe is disrupted by a >volcanic eruption of the Grimsvotn volcano on Iceland. .... Seems someone >has failed >topography class there, because fortunately it is not that bad. Or am I >missing something? On NBC TV news tonight they showed great video of the eruption, and said the plume went 40,000 feet (13,000 meters?) in the air. Most airplanes fly between 30,000 and 40,000 feet altitude, and the great circle routes between the west coast of the USA and northern Europe do go right over Iceland. Aloha, Kitty From Bozo5 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 20:09:45 2004 From: Bozo5 at aol.com (Bozo5@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 4 20:09:52 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds Message-ID: <1c3.20571fb8.2ebc5709@aol.com> But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we expect to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? Stromatolite maybe? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tam2819 at cox.net Thu Nov 4 20:21:45 2004 From: tam2819 at cox.net (T.A.Masters) Date: Thu Nov 4 20:21:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> Message-ID: <418AFFD9.6090003@cox.net> Kitty, Time I weighed in on this one. There have been some wonderful suggestions and almost circumventing the globe. RV'ing, camping out and rockhounding, I drove a Van Conversion some 100k miles back and forth cross country with my grandsons every third month. We did Themes as has been mentioned. They were all great, Caverns, National Parks, Battlegrounds, and of course Rockhounding. Baseball Parks and Games did not happen as the teams were on strike during that month. RV's, Camper Vans and Tent Trailers are all available for rent by weeks, months, and of course by days. I totally recommend that for the US.of A. I traveled Europe extensively between '55-63. Enjoyed almost all of it. Next I began traveling into the Orient, Europe took a back seat. That is a trip to consider, but easier from Hawaii continuing West, perhaps another time. As you have a commitment in Europe, perhaps using that as a platform is geographically less challenging. Good suggestions have been made about Countries, Museums, etc. I saw the offer from South Africa. Africa as a whole is incredible, whether cities or the bush. You can consider traveling from Spain to Gibraltar and from there to Morocco. After experiencing the local culture and trips to the countryside, you can travel down East Africa and enjoy the many wonders there. There is so very much to become involved in there and I know you can prearrange contacts there for digging and camera safaris. After a day beating through the brush in a Range Rover, watching wild life up close and personal, you can go back to a tent city and have a 9 course formal meal served by staff wearing white gloves. It is not to be believed. From there a girl friend and I rented a Hertz car and drove the Garden Road down into South Africa, a 2K mile drive, and beautiful the entire length with the Ocean on the left. We were safe and secure and were amazed by the cities we found in SA. Cosmopolitan, clean, neat and well arranged. We drove through Kruger National Park on our own, again feeling completely comfortable and enjoying every moment. During an earlier trip to Kenya, on a camera safari, our guide/driver was bitten on the foot by a nasty insect, a Scorpion if I remember correctly. Rather than shorten the trip a friend and I took over the driving. What an experience. There are so many list members from around this Planet that whatever you decide to do, you will be welcomed by one or more of them, so go for it. This is a wonderful world we live in and many wonderful people out there, I know you will treasure your time wherever. By the way, there is a room, bath, and an open invitation to both of you should you get anywhere near Southern California. Hugs and happy planning, Terrie From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 4 20:46:21 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 4 20:36:12 2004 Subject: OT: Re: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <1d6.2eff6655.2eba9c02@aol.com> <4189B4B9.535C@Tomaszewski.net> <00f101c4c2da$0659e430$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <418B0333.1313@Tomaszewski.net> When I think of 'coal' and 'diamonds' together I can't help but be reminded of the 'old' "Superman" TV series, where coal was sometimes squeezed into diamonds by the 'Hero'. Kreigh Alan Goldstein wrote: > > I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. Graphite > would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form > diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the limestone > got subducted into the upper mantle. > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > Grant, > > > > I thought that diamonds came up in deep volcanic pipes, and that there > > is some evidence the magma came up fairly quickly; no coal involved, > > though I suppose you could make artificial diamonds from coal. > > > > Kreigh > From horstwindisch at absamail.co.za Thu Nov 4 20:58:19 2004 From: horstwindisch at absamail.co.za (Horst Windisch) Date: Thu Nov 4 20:59:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> <16A9F240-2E9B-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> Message-ID: <000201c4c2f4$4639ac10$834227c4@privatehome> Hi List, SORRY, I am not Methusalem, it was just a "slip" of my right hand middle finger on the keyboard (and no checking afterwards). (It should have read "35" instead of "235") Everybody is welcome at our home here in Pretoria, the capital city in the world with the most sunshine days (or so I have been told) Regards, Horst ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catherine Gaber" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:52 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP > sorry horst, > > i can't help it. i know you've been at this a long time, but 235 > years??!! > > anyway, kitty and bill, if you can get to south africa, you'll be in > good hands with horst. > > cathy > > On Nov 4, 2004, at 2:21 PM, Horst Windisch wrote: > > > Hello Kitty and Bill, > > > > Latching on to Hildegarde Hulley's suggestion, a trip to Southern > > Africa > > would be the nvy of all your friends. On the astronomy side, you could > > plan > > a "busman's holiday" to our big Obsercatory at Sutherland (where they > > are > > busy installing a very large new telescope - not being interested in > > astronomy to such a degree, I don't have the technical specifications > > for > > it, but you can probably get the details from the relevant literature). > > > > Before you come, I can work out an itinerary for you, to cover any > > subject > > you want. I have been doing this for the past 235 years now for > > visiting > > rockhounds from all over the world. WEe normally ask new arrivals to > > spend > > the first day or two with us here in Pretoria, to go over the final > > points > > of your itinrary and last minute tips. If the trip is arranged far in > > advance, I can organise you permission to viit various collecting areas > > before-hand,, like visiting the working mines at Phalaborwa, an > > underground > > visit to a diamond mine, etc. Also give you the "lowdown" on collecting > > trips to Namibia to where I have organised long tours for our > > Federation > > members in the past, travelling as groups, varying between 60 and 26 > > persons. > > > > Your biggest expense of course will be your air-line tickets, but > > there are > > some "bargain" flights available (for fear of adverising will not > > mention > > the relevant airline in this message). > > > > Think about it; if interested, get back to me privately. > > > > Kind regards, > > Horst > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 4 21:12:15 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 4 21:02:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] FANATASY TRIP References: <000501c4c2a5$ab1c5690$764227c4@privatehome> <418AFFD9.6090003@cox.net> Message-ID: <418B0942.63D1@Tomaszewski.net> T.A.Masters wrote: > > Kitty, > By the way, there is a room, bath, and an open invitation to both of you > should you get anywhere near Southern California. Kitty (and Bill), I think I can speak for most of "the" 'list' -- there is 'Room at the Inn', for you and Bill, anytime, in most of the "World" (and at our house!); just tell 'The List' where you want to go, and when, and let us help! -- by saying that 'we' would be honored to have you as Guests. Kreigh From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 4 21:37:56 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Thu Nov 4 21:30:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <1d6.2eff6655.2eba9c02@aol.com> <4189B4B9.535C@Tomaszewski.net> <00f101c4c2da$0659e430$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <002b01c4c2f9$a28e5a60$8ea4490c@pete> It's probably very unlikely that coal ever gets turned into diamonds. Coal deposits mostly form on continents, or on their margins; and this continental material rarely if ever gets subducted down into the mantle where it would be deep enough to become diamond. Actually,"conventional wisdom" is that diamonds represent primordial carbon, that was trapped deep within the Earth when the planet first accreted and formed, and has been there ever since. Supporting this are radiometric age determinations that have been done, not on diamonds themselves but on some of the mineral inclusions within diamond, most of which show old ages (Precambrian, I believe typically about 2 billion years old or more) for these minerals and their host diamonds. I think the predominance of opinion is that most diamonds on earth have probably formed this way. Some more recent work has shown younger ages for some diamonds, from certain areas; and also carbon isotopic measurements which can be interpreted to mean that some diamonds may have formed from what was once organic carbon. Thus, it is coming to be believed, that at least some diamonds have formed from organic carbon that has been subducted (via oceanic crust) down (I could say, "back down", because it probably came from there originally) into the mantle, where it crytallized to form diamond. And yes, no one can say what form the organic carbon might have been at one time (though probably most of it was just marine algae or bacteria on the sea floor), but some of it COULD have been coal, too. Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Goldstein" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 6:51 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds > I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. Graphite > would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form > diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the limestone > got subducted into the upper mantle. > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > Grant, > > > > I thought that diamonds came up in deep volcanic pipes, and that there > > is some evidence the magma came up fairly quickly; no coal involved, > > though I suppose you could make artificial diamonds from coal. > > > > Kreigh > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 4 21:40:55 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Thu Nov 4 21:33:42 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip References: <110320042014.3850.41893C11000BA8BA00000F0A216028074807059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net> <003401c4c2c1$13052f00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <003601c4c2fa$069299e0$8ea4490c@pete> Forgive me for using the "wimpy" word--thanks for not being offended! (Gotta watch what you say.) I never will have that problem with "Modreski", though, I do sometimes not totally appreciate it when someone talks about something "petering out"! Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenn Wimpee" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 3:53 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > Pete, > > We are THE Wimpees, & from what we've seen about China, the trip would be > great. > > Now if we can find a sponsor to pay the costs..... > > Have a great trip Kitty & Bill!!!!!!!! > > Glenn & Jeanette Wimpee > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 4 21:52:02 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Thu Nov 4 21:45:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> <016301c4c2ea$531f9110$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <005a01c4c2fb$9f809340$8ea4490c@pete> As to Grant's question about what minerals might be found on Mars; just this evening, we had a talk (at our bimonthly Friends of Mineralogy - Colorado Chapter meeting) about meteorites; at which, our speaker (Fred Olsen, local collector and quite knowlegeable paleo and mineral guy), commented, that few places in the solar system other than earth, probably have the variety of well-crystallized minerals that we see here. His reasons would be plate tectonics, that is responsible for so much of the "moving things around" the planet's crust that helps produce mineral deposits--we don't have any evidence that any other planets have vigorously active plate tectonics like present-day earth does; and secondly, the abundance of water, which plays a big role in forming so many of our minerals (even, for example, pegmatites; though igneous, it is the water which concentrates in the last portions of magma to crystallize, that concentrates the unusual elements and produces the luxurient crystal growth in pegmatite pockets). The reasoning makes sense to me. So mineral collecting on Mars may be limited to igneous minerals like olivine and pyroxene and feldspar, plus some low-temperature cruddy powdery stuff (hematite, jarosite) that forms near the surface. Pete > > > But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we > > expect > > to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? > > > > Grant > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From morningstar at att.net Fri Nov 5 05:29:53 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Fri Nov 5 05:29:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds Message-ID: <110520041329.19939.418B8051000000DB00004DE321603763169D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> > So mineral collecting on Mars may be limited to igneous minerals like > olivine and pyroxene and feldspar, plus some low-temperature cruddy powdery > stuff (hematite, jarosite) that forms near the surface. See, that's why locality and proper labeling make a world of difference. A common mineral with a Mars label is so much more collectible. I sent a radio message to Mars offering to trade some type locality jarosite for some first-find martian jarosite. So far, no one has responded. I think the inhabitants are busy running away from those two weird square creatures who dropped in and began rolling around probing everything. Don From pjmodreski at att.net Fri Nov 5 07:50:26 2004 From: pjmodreski at att.net (pjmodreski@att.net) Date: Fri Nov 5 07:50:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, etc. Message-ID: <110520041550.3854.418BA1420008037100000F0E216037602107059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net> Ah, the matter of "locality" for determining the value of a mineral specimen. I always am amazed at the die-hard Franklin-Sterling Hill collectors (I know there are some out there on this List, so hi, Don and Earl and others), who go bananas and shell out the big dollar$$$ for scruffy ugly specimens of things like cruddy galena without even any crystal faces visible--or maybe ugly clay minerals--just because they are from Franklin and "it's very rare for the locality". Even quartz, for heavens sake! cheers to all (don't get me wrong, F-SH is of course THE planet's premier mineral locality, none other even close... maybe.). Pete -------------- Original message from morningstar@att.net: -------------- > > > So mineral collecting on Mars may be limited to igneous minerals like > > olivine and pyroxene and feldspar, plus some low-temperature cruddy powdery > > stuff (hematite, jarosite) that forms near the surface. > > See, that's why locality and proper labeling make a world of difference. A > common mineral with a Mars label is so much more collectible. > > I sent a radio message to Mars offering to trade some type locality jarosite for > some first-find martian jarosite. So far, no one has responded. I think the > inhabitants are busy running away from those two weird square creatures who > dropped in and began rolling around probing everything. > > > Don > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From morningstar at att.net Fri Nov 5 10:16:29 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Fri Nov 5 10:16:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] message from Mars Message-ID: <110520041816.24188.418BC37D0006948500005E7C21603763169D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> With regard to my last post: I guess someone got my message after all: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=624&ncid=624&e=5&u=/ap/20041105/ap_on_sc/mars_rovers_3 Don From jayhawkmn at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 11:07:19 2004 From: jayhawkmn at yahoo.com (June Young) Date: Fri Nov 5 11:07:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo In-Reply-To: <4189B4B9.535C@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <20041105190719.58877.qmail@web51001.mail.yahoo.com> I am new to the group this week. Was there an original attachedment or photo of Mars? Thanks June Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 11/3/04 4:41:52 AM Pacific Standard Time, > william.s.cordua@uwrf.edu writes: > > Gee Grant, these are stunning views. Thanks for the reference - I'll use it > in class today. I'm still not convinced these are sediments rather than an > eroded series of lava flows. We need a field trip to go there and find out! > > Dr. Bill > > ====================== > Sign me up for that field trip!!! But before we go it would be good Sign me up too, Dr.Bill! > I think Mars would have peridot -- but since coal is a precursor for > diamonds I don't suppose there would be any diamonds. I would hate to waste my time > looking for things like petrified wood or fossils -- but would it be a waste > of time? > > I have a lot of questions. Does anybody have any answers? > > Grant Johnston, Chico, CA Grant, I thought that diamonds came up in deep volcanic pipes, and that there is some evidence the magma came up fairly quickly; no coal involved, though I suppose you could make artificial diamonds from coal. Kreigh _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com/a --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From CrescentStoneINC at aol.com Fri Nov 5 12:40:31 2004 From: CrescentStoneINC at aol.com (CrescentStoneINC@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 5 12:40:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fossilized Stromatolite stone for sale? Message-ID: <1a3.2b79f8b5.2ebd3f3f@aol.com> Dear Peter; We did not realize this was not appropriate, please remove us if that is your wish. We thought that materials for sale would only be another way to promote everyone's interest. We apologise for any discomfort. Sincerely: Steve DeLong/Owner/Crescent Stone Company --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Fri Nov 5 12:46:06 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 5 12:46:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo Message-ID: <142.381037fb.2ebd408e@aol.com> In a message dated 11/2/04 6:59:04 PM Pacific Standard Time, Lapadary@aol.com writes: A stunning photo of Mars topography. (_http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/_ (http://www.msss.com/mars_images/moc/2004/10/31/) ) For the person who asked about the Mars site. For some reason, AOL makes 2 copies of every URL I send. If you try to use both you will wind up seeing double. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Fri Nov 5 12:57:35 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 5 12:57:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo home page Message-ID: _http://www.msss.com/_ (http://www.msss.com/) Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kahako at aloha.net Fri Nov 5 13:30:41 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Fri Nov 5 13:01:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mars photo In-Reply-To: <142.381037fb.2ebd408e@aol.com> References: <142.381037fb.2ebd408e@aol.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041105112915.02cb5e90@mail.aloha.net> It's just as well, Grant, because at least on my computer, only the second copy works. Kitty >In a message dated 11/2/04 6:59:04 PM Pacific Standard Time, >Lapadary@aol.com writes: > > For some reason, AOL makes 2 >copies of every URL I send. If you try to use both you will wind up seeing >double. > >Grant > From Lapadary at aol.com Fri Nov 5 13:11:04 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 5 13:11:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mars rocks Message-ID: <29.6576b0fd.2ebd4668@aol.com> I found this about the rocks in the hills were formed. I cut and pasted from an AOL news story. "The leading theory is that the rocks began as volcanic ash that fell out of the sky or moved along the ground in ash flows, and minerals inside them were subsequently altered by ground water, said Ray Arvidson, the rover deputy principal investigator from Washington University in St. Louis, Mo." Water seems to be an important factor in rock formation, even on a dry planet. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From geenet2 at mchsi.com Fri Nov 5 13:45:05 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Fri Nov 5 13:45:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] weird last names was Fantasy Trip References: <110320042014.3850.41893C11000BA8BA00000F0A216028074807059C0A9D0B0103069F@att.net><003401c4c2c1$13052f00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> <003601c4c2fa$069299e0$8ea4490c@pete> Message-ID: <002801c4c380$b6f73120$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> You are forgiven. ;-) Just think of our daughters, who had to go thru school in the days of the "wimpy, wimpy, wimpy, hefty, hefty, hefty" commercial for the garbage bags. They had to get tough or die like the boy named "Sue", and they did! Actually the Wimpee or Wimpey name is an old English name and I hear there are still many of them left in Britain. Anyone from the Isles that can tell me how many there are in their phone book? Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter J. Modreski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 11:40 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > Forgive me for using the "wimpy" word--thanks for not being offended! > (Gotta watch what you say.) I never will have that problem with "Modreski", > though, I do sometimes not totally appreciate it when someone talks about > something "petering out"! > > Pete > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Glenn Wimpee" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 3:53 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] fantasy trip > > > > Pete, > > > > We are THE Wimpees, & from what we've seen about China, the trip would be > > great. > > > > Now if we can find a sponsor to pay the costs..... > > > > Have a great trip Kitty & Bill!!!!!!!! > > > > Glenn & Jeanette Wimpee > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Fri Nov 5 15:02:20 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Fri Nov 5 15:04:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> Message-ID: <000901c4c38b$83cc6ee0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Soooooo... Exactly how is cubic zirconia made? I know it does not qualify as a natural mineral... just curious. What is the molecular compound and how is it produced? And what is it on the mohs scale? BTW, I all too well remember when Superman made the diamond from a lump of common coal...LOL! And (no flame intended) Billy Joe Shaver was the artist who sang that great country song in 1973. Please add my name to the field trip. Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds > In a message dated 11/4/04 5:52:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, > deepskyspy@insightbb.com writes: > > I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. Graphite > would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form > diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the limestone > got subducted into the upper mantle. > > =====================> > I admit my research for that was a Superman comic book. Remember the one > where he squeezed a lump of coal until it turned into a beautifully faceted > diamond? That belief was reinforced by the words to the classic country song, > "I'm just an old lump of coal (but I'm gonna be a diamond someday.)" > > If Superman did it and Johnny Cash sang it how can it not be true? :-] > But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we expect > to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Fri Nov 5 15:05:27 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Nov 5 15:05:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mars rocks In-Reply-To: <29.6576b0fd.2ebd4668@aol.com> Message-ID: Don't go looking if your serious about Mars... There's some good chuckles on the red planet though ;-))) The most spectacular photos of Mars in a powerpoint presentation (400 Kb): http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/posted/Mars%20Photos.ppt and or the real mars lovers (1.34 Mb): http://users.pandora.be/axel.emmerman/posted/mars.wmv Enjoy... Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Lapadary@aol.com Verzonden: vrijdag 5 november 2004 22:11 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] Mars rocks I found this about the rocks in the hills were formed. I cut and pasted from an AOL news story. "The leading theory is that the rocks began as volcanic ash that fell out of the sky or moved along the ground in ash flows, and minerals inside them were subsequently altered by ground water, said Ray Arvidson, the rover deputy principal investigator from Washington University in St. Louis, Mo." Water seems to be an important factor in rock formation, even on a dry planet. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Fri Nov 5 15:19:45 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Fri Nov 5 15:22:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Grimsvotn References: <15b.43165817.2ebaa306@aol.com> <6.1.2.0.0.20041104182448.032c9db0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <001101c4c38d$f12bc880$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Great short video of the "big bang" on msnbc.com >link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3033055/ Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:36 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Grimsvotn > At 12:00 PM 11/3/2004, Maurice de Graaf wrote: > >...Currently the airline traffic between the US and Europe is disrupted by a > >volcanic eruption of the Grimsvotn volcano on Iceland. .... Seems someone > >has failed > >topography class there, because fortunately it is not that bad. Or am I > >missing something? > > > On NBC TV news tonight they showed great video of the eruption, and said > the plume went 40,000 feet (13,000 meters?) in the air. Most airplanes fly > between 30,000 and 40,000 feet altitude, and the great circle routes > between the west coast of the USA and northern Europe do go right over Iceland. > > Aloha, Kitty > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Nov 5 18:27:46 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Nov 5 18:14:41 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds References: <110520041329.19939.418B8051000000DB00004DE321603763169D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> Message-ID: <418C3389.31C5@Tomaszewski.net> morningstar@att.net wrote: > I sent a radio message to Mars offering to trade some type locality jarosite for some first-find martian jarosite. So far, no one has responded. I think the inhabitants are busy running away from those two weird square creatures who dropped in and began rolling around probing everything. > > Don Actually, the Martians have been sneaking up on the rovers at night and cleaning them off. This is why Opportunity is showing an unexpected power boost. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3987031.stm From morningstar at att.net Fri Nov 5 19:10:22 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Fri Nov 5 19:06:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds In-Reply-To: <418C3389.31C5@Tomaszewski.net> References: <110520041329.19939.418B8051000000DB00004DE321603763169D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> <418C3389.31C5@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <418C409E.200@att.net> Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > Actually, the Martians have been sneaking up on the rovers at night and > cleaning them off. This is why Opportunity is showing an unexpected > power boost. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3987031.stm Oh I'm ahead of you on that one--check my later post. But really, we should send them a portable diffractometer. They have some good instruments on the rovers but they can't do everything. The only problem is they shouldn't go dropping it on the surface with those airbag things--knocks it out of alignment. Don From rainforest1950 at lycos.com Sat Nov 6 07:41:10 2004 From: rainforest1950 at lycos.com (rain forest) Date: Sat Nov 6 07:41:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] (no subject) Message-ID: <20041106154110.77CDB3384B@ws7-3.us4.outblaze.com> For the Mars Rovers: http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html Cassini-Huygens Saturn Mission: http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.cfm European Space Agency (Great high resolution photos of Mars!) http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.cfm Mt. St. elens Volcano cam: Clear skies today!! http://www.fs.fed.us/gpnf/volcanocams/msh/ As for the diamond theory; I've read that scientists believe that the cores of the gas giants are made up of huge diamonds. It is also theorized that the cores of burned our stars are massive compressed carbon. David Bese The Rainforest Hippie Pt. Orchard, Wa. "There is always some madness in love. But there is also always some reason in madness." "Turbulence is life force. It is opportunity. Let's love turbulence and use it for change." "Every time you don't follow your inner guidance, you feel a loss of energy, loss of power, a sense of spiritual deadness." -- _______________________________________________ Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10 From jabac at hal-pc.org Sat Nov 6 10:53:44 2004 From: jabac at hal-pc.org (john) Date: Sat Nov 6 09:51:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds In-Reply-To: <016301c4c2ea$531f9110$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> <016301c4c2ea$531f9110$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <1099767224.2723.28.camel@localhost> On Thu, 2004-11-04 at 21:48, Alan Goldstein wrote: > There is a lot of basalt on Mars. Whether it is identical to Earth's basalt, > I don't know. Viking did some sample analysis in the mid 1970's and the > current Spirit / Opportunity research is on-going, but I'm sure NASA has > preliminary analysis available. > > Now we know Mars has a lot of dust, which contains iron (you know, the "red" > planet) presumably from the weathering and erosion of the igneous rock. > There is ample evidence of river-borne deposits, but they may in fact be > similar in composition to the dust. That depends on how long liquid water > existed on Mars and what minerals were created as the country rock reacted > with said water. > > Look at the various environments that agate, feldspar and limestone are > found on Earth. Do or did the same conditions occur on Mars? If they did, > then perhaps they can be found. Whether there was enough calcium available, > I doubt it, but I'm don't know for sure. Certainly shale, siltstone and > sandstone deposits could exist on the planet. Those rocks might not thrill > you, but geologists would do some cartwheels! > > Microscopic diamonds have been found in some meteorites, so there should be > no doubt that some of these diamonds are littering the surface of Mars. Got > an electron microscope? > > Alan I should expect that the mineral makeup of mars would be quite similar to Earth since both planets formed presumably from the same source. Being a bit further out, centrifugal force may have caused some minor segmentation of the heavier elements, but the presence of iron (and nickel since they are usually found together in large masses and meteorites) would seem to indicate that most of the 92 natural elements are present in Mars. They may be present in a different proportion than on Earth, but they are most probably all there. Since there are volcanoes, there are surely plutonic and metamorphic rocks like those on Earth. (Geochemistry is everywhere the same.) The real question is the amount and extent of sedimentary rock and whether or not it is fossiliferous. Limestone is a sedimentary rock, usually helped along mightily by lifeforms. The Ca in it originally came from plutonic rocks, so its presence should not be a problem. Sandstone could be formed by wind and accretion, so is not necessarily indicative of life or water. As Pete says elsewhere, the lack of enough free water would hamper the variety of minerals a great deal. Agate and thundereggs, for instance, are probably quite rare. Supergene ore deposits should also be rare though one would expect to find massive sulfides and some vein metallics and fluorite. Interestingly enough, rock crystal would be quite probably rare. Now if we could only find some Marble... john From kadok at infowest.com Sat Nov 6 16:05:47 2004 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Sat Nov 6 16:05:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <20041106154110.77CDB3384B@ws7-3.us4.outblaze.com> Message-ID: <20041107000541.BF360CB9ED6@delivery.infowest.com> -----Original Message----- To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] (no subject) European Space Agency (Great high resolution photos of Mars!) http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.cfm Umm -- Dave -- this one is not Mars. It is actually an IR shot of Titan, one of Saturn's moons. Great shot, though! Margaret David Bese The Rainforest Hippie Pt. Orchard, Wa. "There is always some madness in love. But there is also always some reason in madness." "Turbulence is life force. It is opportunity. Let's love turbulence and use it for change." "Every time you don't follow your inner guidance, you feel a loss of energy, loss of power, a sense of spiritual deadness." -- _______________________________________________ Find what you are looking for with the Lycos Yellow Pages http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp ?SRC=lycos10 _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From jbryankramer at msn.com Sat Nov 6 17:18:48 2004 From: jbryankramer at msn.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Nov 6 17:18:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds In-Reply-To: <1099767224.2723.28.camel@localhost> Message-ID: <003901c4c467$bc978a20$6601a8c0@bryan> I thought that the formation of the moon was supposed to have greatly changed the composition of the upper mantle by removing a lot of light elements. This didn't happen on Mars and probably means that the composition isn't like Earth's. Bryan -------Original Message----- --I should expect that the mineral makeup of mars would be --quite similar to Earth since both planets formed presumably --from the same source. --Being a bit further out, centrifugal force may have caused --some minor segmentation of the heavier elements, but the --presence of iron (and nickel since they are usually found --together in large masses and --meteorites) would seem to indicate that most of the 92 --natural elements are present in Mars. They may be present in --a different proportion than on Earth, but they are most --probably all there. -- --Since there are volcanoes, there are surely plutonic and --metamorphic rocks like those on Earth. (Geochemistry is --everywhere the same.) The real question is the amount and --extent of sedimentary rock and whether or not it is --fossiliferous. Limestone is a sedimentary rock, usually --helped along mightily by lifeforms. The Ca in it originally --came from plutonic rocks, so its presence should not be a problem. -- --Sandstone could be formed by wind and accretion, so is not --necessarily indicative of life or water. -- --As Pete says elsewhere, the lack of enough free water would --hamper the variety of minerals a great deal. Agate and --thundereggs, for instance, are probably quite rare. Supergene --ore deposits should also be rare though one would expect to --find massive sulfides and some vein metallics and fluorite. --Interestingly enough, rock crystal would be quite probably rare. -- --Now if we could only find some Marble... From morningstar at att.net Sat Nov 6 17:30:23 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Sat Nov 6 17:26:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds In-Reply-To: <003901c4c467$bc978a20$6601a8c0@bryan> References: <003901c4c467$bc978a20$6601a8c0@bryan> Message-ID: <418D7AAF.2030508@att.net> J Bryan Kramer wrote: > I thought that the formation of the moon was supposed to have greatly > changed the composition of the upper mantle by removing a lot of light > elements. This didn't happen on Mars and probably means that the composition > isn't like Earth's. Following that train of thought: if Jupiter, Saturn, Venus, etc., are so much different from Earth, then why wouldn't Mars be? Sure, Mars is *earth-like*, but how much like? For one thing, as Pete pointed out, the lack of water and a substantial atmosphere would affect the formation of a number of minerals. Earth currently has over 4,000 naturally occurring species (though some of these are dubious and might be considered as deriving from organic processes; whewellite and newberyite come to mind) . . . I wonder how many distinct species are on the other planets. I hope that some time in my geology curriculum, we will study planetary formation, even if it is a survey course. I bet a lot of these questions are answered there. Don From mela at bartnet.net Sat Nov 6 19:07:25 2004 From: mela at bartnet.net (Mel Albright) Date: Sat Nov 6 19:07:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] virus sourse Message-ID: <000801c4c476$ead0e440$6401a8c0@jessie> I'm being buried with virus mail from yahoo (supposedly) - 5 today. Anyone know where it is coming from? Mel Albright --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From njn22r at hotmail.com Thu Nov 4 14:18:58 2004 From: njn22r at hotmail.com (Nyal Niemuth) Date: Sat Nov 6 19:17:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rich Hill AZ article Message-ID: Just read your CA Mining Journal article (Dec03 -don't ask me why a year later) and wonder if you read Erik Melchiorre et al's book about Rich Hill. Alhough written by a PHD ( he's at UCSB) and others its aimed at a popular audience. He suggests that the source for the gold might be the weathering of an apophysis similar to the Vulture mine's geology. Given the detachment faulting in the area and possible reversal of drainages like at the Mogollon rim this idea is an intriguing concept for exploration. Hope your doing well. Drop by and I'll take you to lunch during your winter visit so we can chat about your prosepecting and desert travels. Nyal J. Niemuth Az Dept. Mines and Mineral Resources (ADMMR) 1502 West Washington St. Phoenix, AZ 85007 wk 602-255-3795 ext. 14 Fx 602-255-3777 njn22r@hotmail.com www.admmr.state.az.us --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sat Nov 6 19:28:14 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Nov 6 19:26:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] virus sourse References: <000801c4c476$ead0e440$6401a8c0@jessie> Message-ID: <418D95E5.7E40@Tomaszewski.net> Mel Albright wrote: > > I'm being buried with virus mail from yahoo (supposedly) - 5 today. Anyone know where it is coming from? > > Mel Albright Look at the full headers of the virus messages. Find out where your ISP 'Received' the messages from to identify the source. From Lapadary at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:41:42 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 6 20:41:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: space flight Message-ID: <1b9.5ef2dd2.2ebf0186@aol.com> In a message dated 11/6/04 5:27:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, morningstar@att.net writes: . . . I wonder how many distinct species are on the other planets. We need to talk to Burt Rutan. Some body just upped the ante for space exploration to $50,000,000. I don't know what Rutan needs to do to collect on this one but if he needs a rockhound to help, I'll volunteer. _http://spaceflightnow.com/news/n0409/27bigelow/_ (http://spaceflightnow.com/news/n0409/27bigelow/) Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From hammerron at yahoo.com Sun Nov 7 07:08:00 2004 From: hammerron at yahoo.com (The Hammer) Date: Sun Nov 7 07:12:16 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds (now cubic zirconia) References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com> <000901c4c38b$83cc6ee0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <012201c4c4dc$216f2d80$99e7fc40@j9yhq01> Glen, Hope this link about cubic zirconia is helpful: http://www.emporia.edu/earthsci/amber/go340/students/berg/cz.html -Ron ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenn Wimpee" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 6:02 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds > Soooooo... > > Exactly how is cubic zirconia made? > > I know it does not qualify as a natural mineral... just curious. > > What is the molecular compound and how is it produced? > > And what is it on the mohs scale? > > BTW, I all too well remember when Superman made the diamond from a lump of > common coal...LOL! > > And (no flame intended) Billy Joe Shaver was the artist who sang that great > country song in 1973. > > Please add my name to the field trip. > > Glenn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:14 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds > > > > In a message dated 11/4/04 5:52:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > deepskyspy@insightbb.com writes: > > > > I would think coal has too many impurities to make good diamonds. > Graphite > > would be a better alternative. Although I read that limestone might form > > diamonds (the "C" in CaCO3) in one Australian deposit. I guess the > limestone > > got subducted into the upper mantle. > > > > =====================> > > I admit my research for that was a Superman comic book. Remember the one > > where he squeezed a lump of coal until it turned into a beautifully > faceted > > diamond? That belief was reinforced by the words to the classic country > song, > > "I'm just an old lump of coal (but I'm gonna be a diamond someday.)" > > > > If Superman did it and Johnny Cash sang it how can it not be true? :-] > > But my question was, when we go on Dr. Bill's field trip to Mars, can we > expect > > to find agate? the feldspar group? limestone? > > > > Grant > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From Lapadary at aol.com Sun Nov 7 11:51:17 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Sun Nov 7 11:51:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds (now cubic zirconia) Message-ID: <1aa.2ac6ea60.2ebfd6b5@aol.com> In a message dated 11/7/04 7:12:40 AM Pacific Standard Time, hammerron@yahoo.com writes: Glen, Hope this link about cubic zirconia is helpful: http://www.emporia.edu/earthsci/amber/go340/students/berg/cz.html ====================================== Thank you Ron, I went from tthe CZ article to the home page and discovered all kinds of goodies. _http://www.emporia.edu/earthsci/amber/go340/students/stupages.htm_ (http://www.emporia.edu/earthsci/amber/go340/students/stupages.htm) Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockcurrier at cs.com Sun Nov 7 15:31:09 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Sun Nov 7 15:31:15 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 6 References: <200411070203.iA723Km1008879@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <006701c4c521$dcf25c40$bcf3a5d8@rock5> I don't know if the following is suitable for the Rockhounds list but I thought I would send it and let the webmaster include it or not. Dear Friends & associates of Richard. I am assuming that all of you know of our sad news of his death last week & am certainly hoping not to have this be a big shock as you read this. Many of you live outside of Tucson &/or don't regularly look at the Tucson news & for this reason I wanted to send you a "copy" of the obituary which is running in the papers here this weekend. Thank you very much for the calls & cards & emails which you've sent to the family. If you know of anyone who was inadvertently left out of this email we would appreciate you forwarding it on. I hope to see you in February. Sincerely, Janet Bideaux RICHARD A. BIDEAUX Native Tucsonan born to long-time residents George A. & Jeanette Bideaux on March 28, 1935. Richard died suddenly on October 26, 2004 at his summer residence in Prescott, AZ. Preceded in death by his parents and survived by his sister Janet Bideaux of Tucson, nephew Tayo (Kristine) and grand nephew Aidan van Marle all of Liberty Lake, Washington. Richard was a well known, respected mineralogist, author, collector and mineral dealer. Educated locally at Tucson High and the University of Arizona in the field of geology, he later went on to obtain a graduate degree at Harvard University with a specialty in crystallography. His mineral collecting started as a young boy during summers spent in southeast Arizona. His collection of local Arizona specimens won him a Science Talent Search in 1952 and the trip to Washington, D.C. enabled him to become familiar with the mineral collections at the Smithsonian Institute. During his two years of army service in N.J. he learned computer programming and took advantage of the east coast's mineral museums and collectors. Following the army, Richard worked for Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, CA. During the Surveyor missions he was responsible for processing imaging data of the first pictures received by the USA from the moon. However, he was determined to live in Tucson with its mountains and beloved Sonoran Desert. Returning to Tucson, he founded the business, Computing Associates, with two partners. This was a pioneering company in computer applications in geology & mine engineering and was responsible for determining the ore reserves of many mining companies throughout the world. During the 60s he had also started a mineral store, Bideaux Minerals, with his father. The rare mineral species "BIDEAUXITE" was named in his honor in 1970. In 1977 he co-authored the first edition of the MINERALOGY OF ARIZONA. In 1978 he was awarded an honorary degree from the U of A for his work. In the early 1980s, in collaboration with three other authors, he started writing the five-volume HANDBOOK OF MINERALOGY and finished it in 2003. It is a major work of descriptive mineralogy and mineralogical references. Richard was an active long-time member of several mineral and geological societies. He collected minerals throughout his life and was especially partial to ones from Arizona. He was very active in the Tucson Gem & Mineral show and enjoyed its 50th anniversary last year. He won a blue ribbon at the first show. His love of Arizona also led him to collect a large number of Arizona history books. He gave freely of his knowledge and time to various individuals and organizations associated with minerals. His encyclopedic knowledge of minerals, his sense of humor, his generosity and his friendship will be greatly missed. A memorial service is planned in February during the annual Tucson Gem & Mineral Show. Donations in Richard's memory may be made to the American Heart Association or a charity of your choice. From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Sun Nov 7 16:06:37 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sun Nov 7 16:11:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds (now cubic zirconia) References: <8b.1959c49f.2ebc4a33@aol.com><000901c4c38b$83cc6ee0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> <012201c4c4dc$216f2d80$99e7fc40@j9yhq01> Message-ID: <003501c4c526$d1e52120$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Thank you Hammer! A really good explanation is given at http://www.bodyjewels.net/cubiczirconiainformation.html which I found referenced on the link you sent. It is also interesting to learn the CZ is a true mineral found in a natural state. This was noted in the history section on your original link. The guys who "discovered" it in a sample given to them were not very impressed as it was only by x-ray they found it was in a cubic crystal form. If anyone else is interested, these are great links with easy to understand, and brief, text with good pix included. Thanks again, Ron! Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Hammer" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 9:08 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds (now cubic zirconia) > Glen, > > Hope this link about cubic zirconia is helpful: > http://www.emporia.edu/earthsci/amber/go340/students/berg/cz.html > > -Ron > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Glenn Wimpee" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 6:02 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] now: diamonds > > > > Soooooo... > > > > Exactly how is cubic zirconia made? > > > > I know it does not qualify as a natural mineral... just curious. > > > > What is the molecular compound and how is it produced? > > > > And what is it on the mohs scale? > > > > BTW, I all too well remember when Superman made the diamond from a lump of > > common coal...LOL! > > > > And (no flame intended) Billy Joe Shaver was the artist who sang that > great > > country song in 1973. > > > > Please add my name to the field trip. > > > > Glenn From bg at his.com Sun Nov 7 16:12:58 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Sun Nov 7 16:13:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality Message-ID: dear folks, i have a piece of gypsum whose label is partially destroyed. the word wade seems pretty clear and it might say wade property. a quick search does not reveal anything useful. can anyone help? thanks, cathy From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Nov 7 18:52:08 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Nov 7 18:47:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality References: Message-ID: <418EDE30.263@Tomaszewski.net> Catherine Gaber wrote: > > dear folks, > > i have a piece of gypsum whose label is partially destroyed. the word > wade seems pretty clear and it might say wade property. a quick search > does not reveal anything useful. can anyone help? > > thanks, cathy Wade Hampton Mine, Cochise Co., Arizona Wade Hampton Mine, Yavapai Co., Arizona Wade Mine, Cherokee Co., Kansas Wade Mine, Androscoggin Co., Maine E.B. Wade Mine, Berks Co., Pennsylvania But I don't think any of them have gypsum. From jabac at hal-pc.org Sun Nov 7 20:37:16 2004 From: jabac at hal-pc.org (john) Date: Sun Nov 7 19:35:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] was: mars photo, now: diamonds In-Reply-To: <003901c4c467$bc978a20$6601a8c0@bryan> References: <003901c4c467$bc978a20$6601a8c0@bryan> Message-ID: <1099888636.2723.4.camel@localhost> On Sat, 2004-11-06 at 19:18, J Bryan Kramer wrote: > I thought that the formation of the moon was supposed to have greatly > changed the composition of the upper mantle by removing a lot of light > elements. This didn't happen on Mars and probably means that the composition > isn't like Earth's. > > Bryan > > -------Original Message----- > --I should expect that the mineral makeup of mars would be > --quite similar to Earth since both planets formed presumably > --from the same source. The overall composition -- maybe -- but the composition of the rocks and minerals would be basically the same; they were formed from the same materials and some of the same processes. john From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Nov 8 02:34:19 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Nov 8 02:34:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Cathy Every "wade" possibility has probably been explored by now... So I'll step off the beaten track... Is it possible that maybe "Wade" is "Wadi"? If the gypsum is from Africa: many "wadis" are sources of gypsum. Can you still scan it or is the damage more physical that just fading ink? Scanning it (full color, high resolution, NOT saving as JPG but as TIF) may allow someone who knows what he's doing with graphic software to retrieve some information that is no longer visible to the unaided eye. If you have a flatbed scanner, you may send me a scan off list(try to crop it for size, a tiff file can get quite large.) Remember: full color, high resolution and no JPG (compression creates more artefacts than there are already there) Attachments up to 10 Mb are no problem. Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Catherine Gaber Verzonden: maandag 8 november 2004 1:13 Aan: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com"@telenet-ops.be :A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality dear folks, i have a piece of gypsum whose label is partially destroyed. the word wade seems pretty clear and it might say wade property. a quick search does not reveal anything useful. can anyone help? thanks, cathy _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Mon Nov 8 06:06:04 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Mon Nov 8 05:58:38 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality References: Message-ID: <000b01c4c59c$16c9a3e0$0ba5490c@pete> To Cathy, about the gypsum, You know, if your specimen is from one of the better-known localities, collectors can often recognize where it is from, just from the appearance. Axel asked about scanning & sending a copy of the label, but not the crystal itself. If you had a digital camera to take & post or send a picture of the crystal, there's a fair chance that people might recognize it as being typical of some known locality. Just a thought, Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 3:34 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality > Hi Cathy > > Every "wade" possibility has probably been explored by now... So I'll step > off the beaten track... > Is it possible that maybe "Wade" is "Wadi"? > If the gypsum is from Africa: many "wadis" are sources of gypsum. > > Can you still scan it or is the damage more physical that just fading ink? > Scanning it (full color, high resolution, NOT saving as JPG but as TIF) may > allow someone who knows what he's doing with graphic software to retrieve > some information that is no longer visible to the unaided eye. > If you have a flatbed scanner, you may send me a scan off list(try to crop > it for size, a tiff file can get quite large.) > Remember: full color, high resolution and no JPG (compression creates more > artefacts than there are already there) > Attachments up to 10 Mb are no problem. > > Axel > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Catherine Gaber > Verzonden: maandag 8 november 2004 1:13 > Aan: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com"@telenet-ops.be :A mailing list for rock > and gem collectors > Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality > > > dear folks, > > i have a piece of gypsum whose label is partially destroyed. the word > wade seems pretty clear and it might say wade property. a quick search > does not reveal anything useful. can anyone help? > > thanks, cathy > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 8 08:41:06 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 8 08:42:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Sand References: <000b01c4c59c$16c9a3e0$0ba5490c@pete> Message-ID: <008101c4c5b1$e6caf340$b75e70d1@S0033035959> I have been sifting and washing soil from my garden looking for diamonds and amazonite. The latter we have found about a dozen pieces just walking around after a rain and not surprisingly, no diamonds. What is interesting is that after about a bushel of gravel, I have found nothing at all of any interest. Not a single piece of clear crystal of any sort and nothing else with any interesting color. Yesterday I took some of the fine sand that had collected in the bottom of the washer and looked at it under the microscope. Much to my surprise, it is about 90% or more, clear grains. There is only a sprinkling of non-transparent grains. I would have assumed that the sand would be a small scale rendering of the coarser gravel but this is not the case at all and I do not understand why. Finally, does anyone have any thoughts on seperating diamonds from the rest of this sand? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From willows at rose.net Mon Nov 8 08:43:49 2004 From: willows at rose.net (Rollins) Date: Mon Nov 8 08:46:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] UV at WM Message-ID: <003301c4c5b2$20873940$1e0611ac@willows> I got a neat little key chain UV at our local Wal-Mart. They were getting rid of their Halloween stuff. There is a flourescent grease paint kit with a UV light on a cheap chain. The UV light is about the size of two quarters together. It was only 85 Cents! James A. Rollins willows@rose.net From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Mon Nov 8 08:46:57 2004 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Mon Nov 8 08:47:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Microminerals from Sauktown Sales Message-ID: <20041108164657.29705.qmail@web51010.mail.yahoo.com> There's a new update to the pricelist of microminerals on www.sauktown.com Some of the new items: Catapleiite, Mont St. Hilaire Uraninite, Palermo A multi-species specimen, Palermo Meionite, Monte Somma, Italy Althausite, Norway Medaite, Italy Kornelite, Nevada Anapaite, Spain Segnitite, Portugal Libethenite, Portugal Some of these are in short supply, and first come, first served! As always, if you don't want these updates, please let me know. Jim Daly Sauktown Sales __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com From SMKELL45 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 09:35:23 2004 From: SMKELL45 at aol.com (SMKELL45@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 09:35:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] hexagonal calcite Message-ID: <693930CD.4F6BD26A.0079B709@aol.com> I received a specimen of calcite,and pyrite from Peru. It fluoreses and is mostly hexagonal with a few rhombs. Anyone have any idea where exactly this hexagonal material might come from in Peru? smkell From bg at his.com Mon Nov 8 09:48:51 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Mon Nov 8 09:48:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality In-Reply-To: <000b01c4c59c$16c9a3e0$0ba5490c@pete> References: <000b01c4c59c$16c9a3e0$0ba5490c@pete> Message-ID: <7370783D-31AE-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> pete, axel and kreigh, thanks for your suggestions. steve chamberlain cleared it up: > Wade Property, east of Rt. 3, Pitcairn, St. Lawrence Co., NY cathy On Nov 8, 2004, at 9:06 AM, Peter J. Modreski wrote: > To Cathy, about the gypsum, > > You know, if your specimen is from one of the better-known localities, > collectors can often recognize where it is from, just from the > appearance. > Axel asked about scanning & sending a copy of the label, but not the > crystal > itself. If you had a digital camera to take & post or send a picture > of the > crystal, there's a fair chance that people might recognize it as being > typical of some known locality. Just a thought, > > Pete Modreski > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Axel Emmermann" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > > Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 3:34 AM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality > > >> Hi Cathy >> >> Every "wade" possibility has probably been explored by now... So I'll >> step >> off the beaten track... >> Is it possible that maybe "Wade" is "Wadi"? >> If the gypsum is from Africa: many "wadis" are sources of gypsum. >> >> Can you still scan it or is the damage more physical that just fading >> ink? >> Scanning it (full color, high resolution, NOT saving as JPG but as >> TIF) > may >> allow someone who knows what he's doing with graphic software to >> retrieve >> some information that is no longer visible to the unaided eye. >> If you have a flatbed scanner, you may send me a scan off list(try to >> crop >> it for size, a tiff file can get quite large.) >> Remember: full color, high resolution and no JPG (compression creates >> more >> artefacts than there are already there) >> Attachments up to 10 Mb are no problem. >> >> Axel >> >> >> >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Catherine Gaber >> Verzonden: maandag 8 november 2004 1:13 >> Aan: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com"@telenet-ops.be :A mailing list for rock >> and gem collectors >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] gypsum locality >> >> >> dear folks, >> >> i have a piece of gypsum whose label is partially destroyed. the word >> wade seems pretty clear and it might say wade property. a quick search >> does not reveal anything useful. can anyone help? >> >> thanks, cathy >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Nov 8 10:17:56 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Nov 8 10:17:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] hexagonal calcite In-Reply-To: <693930CD.4F6BD26A.0079B709@aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Smkell (???) Pyrite can't fluoresce. Calcite from Peru often fluoresces red. Hexagonal crystals could point towards one of the apatites (fluor, hydroxyl, carbonate,...) It would be interesting to know in what color the hexagonal XX fluoresce, how bright and under which wavelengths (LW, MW, SW). Is there any phosphorescence? Fluorescence is, in most cases, an unreliable tool at best in the identification process of minerals. If you choose to use it, you should be as thorough as possible. ALL data should be taken in to account and by the looks of it you didn't give us much to go on... Can you be a bit more precise? Xlae ;-) -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens SMKELL45@aol.com Verzonden: maandag 8 november 2004 18:35 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] hexagonal calcite I received a specimen of calcite,and pyrite from Peru. It fluoreses and is mostly hexagonal with a few rhombs. Anyone have any idea where exactly this hexagonal material might come from in Peru? smkell _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Nov 8 10:38:14 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Nov 8 10:36:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Sand References: <000b01c4c59c$16c9a3e0$0ba5490c@pete> <008101c4c5b1$e6caf340$b75e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <418FBCA7.10ED@Tomaszewski.net> Jack, You must have a fun garden if you are pulling amazonite out of it. ;-} The sand is what is left after all the softer stuff gets weathered and ground so fine it washes away as mud or clay. Common sand is mostly quartz, but occasionally you find something else that is interesting. Diamond has a specific gravity of 3.5, and quartz is 2.65. Sorting by density gives several solutions; a liquid with a density between the two to float off the sand, elutriation with air or water to float off the sand, and they all scale from tabletop to dump truck loads. Kreigh Jack Schmidling wrote: > > I have been sifting and washing soil from my garden looking for diamonds and > amazonite. The latter we have found about a dozen pieces just walking > around after a rain and not surprisingly, no diamonds. > > What is interesting is that after about a bushel of gravel, I have found > nothing at all of any interest. Not a single piece of clear crystal of any > sort and nothing else with any interesting color. > > Yesterday I took some of the fine sand that had collected in the bottom of > the washer and looked at it under the microscope. Much to my surprise, it > is about 90% or more, clear grains. There is only a sprinkling of > non-transparent grains. > > I would have assumed that the sand would be a small scale rendering of the > coarser gravel but this is not the case at all and I do not understand why. > > Finally, does anyone have any thoughts on seperating diamonds from the rest > of this sand? > > js > From danweinrich at charter.net Mon Nov 8 10:37:05 2004 From: danweinrich at charter.net (Dan Weinrich) Date: Mon Nov 8 10:37:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] hexagonal calcite References: <693930CD.4F6BD26A.0079B709@aol.com> Message-ID: <005a01c4c5c1$f2405980$6601a8c0@S0029989181> Hi! If you have a photo I might be able to help. Dan Weinrich http://www.danweinrich.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:35 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] hexagonal calcite > I received a specimen of calcite,and pyrite from Peru. It fluoreses and is > mostly hexagonal with a few rhombs. Anyone have any idea where exactly > this hexagonal material might come from in Peru? smkell > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From murowchickj at umkc.edu Mon Nov 8 11:28:14 2004 From: murowchickj at umkc.edu (J B Murowchick) Date: Mon Nov 8 11:28:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Sand In-Reply-To: <418FBCA7.10ED@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Jack- I haven't tried this myself, but here's what I've been told about collecting diamonds. Diamonds are hydrophobic, and will not wet, but they will stick to grease. The common silicate minerals are hydrophilic, and will get wetted with water, and when wet, won't stick to grease. Commercial diamond operations run a slurry of their sand and gravel over copper sheets coated with grease. The diamonds stick to the grease while the other materials flow on past with the water. The diamond-bearing grease is then scraped off the sheets, and the grease removed with a solvent or heat, leaving clean diamonds behind. I would like to try this sometime with concentrates collected from Crater of Diamonds State Park near Murfreesboro, Arkansas, using a cookie sheet smeared with Crisco. I'd run water with the sandy concentrates over the sheet, with the sheet at a shallow slope. If all goes well, the diamonds should be left stuck to the sheet. If anyone tries, or has tried this method, I'd be interested in your comments. Jim Murowchick __________________________________________________________ Dr. James B. Murowchick Associate Professor Office: (816) 235-2979 Geosciences, 420 Flarsheim Hall Fax: (816) 235-5535 University of Missouri-Kansas City E-mail: murowchickj@umkc.edu 5110 Rockhill Road Kansas City, MO 64110 on 11/8/04 12:38 PM, Kreigh Tomaszewski at Kreigh@Tomaszewski.net wrote: > Jack, > > You must have a fun garden if you are pulling amazonite out of it. ;-} > > The sand is what is left after all the softer stuff gets weathered and > ground so fine it washes away as mud or clay. Common sand is mostly > quartz, but occasionally you find something else that is interesting. > > Diamond has a specific gravity of 3.5, and quartz is 2.65. Sorting by > density gives several solutions; a liquid with a density between the two > to float off the sand, elutriation with air or water to float off the > sand, and they all scale from tabletop to dump truck loads. > > Kreigh > > > > > > Jack Schmidling wrote: >> >> I have been sifting and washing soil from my garden looking for diamonds and >> amazonite. The latter we have found about a dozen pieces just walking >> around after a rain and not surprisingly, no diamonds. >> >> What is interesting is that after about a bushel of gravel, I have found >> nothing at all of any interest. Not a single piece of clear crystal of any >> sort and nothing else with any interesting color. >> >> Yesterday I took some of the fine sand that had collected in the bottom of >> the washer and looked at it under the microscope. Much to my surprise, it >> is about 90% or more, clear grains. There is only a sprinkling of >> non-transparent grains. >> >> I would have assumed that the sand would be a small scale rendering of the >> coarser gravel but this is not the case at all and I do not understand why. >> >> Finally, does anyone have any thoughts on seperating diamonds from the rest >> of this sand? >> >> js >> > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com Mon Nov 8 11:46:43 2004 From: scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) Date: Mon Nov 8 11:54:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] A field find of Stibnite-Included Quartz Crystals in Nevada- Message-ID: <010901c4c5cb$ad624cb0$0d1ac93f@gbm> Hello Rockhounds! I wanted you let you all know that I have posted some pictures of a fun and productive, recent Nevada collecting trip on my web site for all to enjoy- http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite-Included%20Quartz%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Mon Nov 8 13:35:55 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 13:36:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence Message-ID: In a message dated 11/8/04 10:17:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: Hi Smkell (???) Pyrite can't fluoresce. ================== If I have ever seen a statement begging for a question, that is it. Why can't pyrite fluoresce? Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From BETDAV97 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 13:49:28 2004 From: BETDAV97 at aol.com (BETDAV97@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 13:49:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence Message-ID: <1e6.2e478963.2ec143e8@aol.com> Hey Folks, As usual someone didn't read well, the gentleman didn't say that the pyrite fluoresced, the specimen in general fluoresced. Which is common for calcite. The question was about the shape of the crystals. I once saw a specimen from Paterson, New Jersey that was calcite, but due to the complexness of the crystals I swore at first they were quartz. Even told the fellow the label was wrong. I ended up buying the specimen, but sold it last year at Gaithersburg, MD. Lets get back on the correct topic. Hate mail and flames are welcome, just reply off list. Thanks, Dave Sunset Fossils & Minerals _Betdav97@aol.com_ (mailto:Betdav97@aol.com) _WVFossils@aol.com_ (mailto:WVFossils@aol.com) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From italianminerals at libero.it Mon Nov 8 23:26:01 2004 From: italianminerals at libero.it (ItalianMinerals) Date: Mon Nov 8 14:25:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD - MINERALS UPDATE Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041108232432.0255b928@popmail.libero.it> Just finished updating our web site ! Lot of interesting specimens ! We have updated our pages with the most recent aquisitions. Goto: http://www.italianminerals.com/whatsnew-12.html The update includes 2 special pages : * CARACOLITE from Chile (http://www.italianminerals.com/Sudamerica/CARACOLITE.htm) * BENITOITE from S.Benito Gem mine, CA, USA (http://www.italianminerals.com/USA/benitoite.html) and a new UPDATE http://www.italianminerals.com/whatsnew-12.html You can find also: * amethyst shepter from Madagascar * almandine garnets on matrix from Madagascar * lawsonite from California, USA * vesuvianite from Italy * litticoatite from Madagascar * pyrargirite from Peru * brasilianite on matrix from Brasil * brookite from Magnet cove, USA * franklinite from Franklin, NJ, USA * boleite from Mexico * apatite (big perfect crystal!) from Pakistan * rhodocrosite from Romania * analcime from Italy * sphalerite from China * fluorite from China * cinnabar from China * sphalerite from Italy * strontianite from Italy * leucite (large crystals!!) from Italy * anglesite from Italy * osumilite from Italy * fluorite from Italy * fluorite from USA * erythrite from Marocco * pezzottaite from Madagascar (goto: http://www.italianminerals.com/AFRICA/pezzottaite.htm) and many others on the pages of the specific continents ! follow the links on: www.ItalianMinerals.com we will be pleased if you take the chance to visit us ! ===================== Visit us at: http://www.ItalianMinerals.com for quality minerals !! Check our auctions on Ebay at: http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=italianminerals&include=0&since=-1&sort=3&rows=50 ===================== --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jpjunk at mc.net Mon Nov 8 14:50:11 2004 From: jpjunk at mc.net (jjunkroski) Date: Mon Nov 8 14:47:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas- Europe In-Reply-To: <20041104033752.47557.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: My wife and I are planning a two to three week trip to Europe next Summer. We will fly to Amsterdam and use a Eurailpass ( and/or rental car) to get to Athens, Greece. I'm trying to fit in two or three days of collecting (especially fluorescents). Anybody done any collecting in Europe? Any suggestions for "must see" mineral locations, collections, shows, museums? Any club contacts who might be doing field trips? Any hints, tips or warnings? Thanks "Junk" From JScully216 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 14:51:02 2004 From: JScully216 at aol.com (JScully216@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 14:51:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: New Mexico Specimens on E-Bay Message-ID: Hi, A new set of new mexico specimens on E-Bay under jscully216 including Nacimiento Mine azurite concretions. "60" mine goethite Mule Creek scepters in two batches -- very nice specimens, cheap Pecos diamond starburst crystals Native copper As usual, you are invited to take a lookat specimens on my website also at http://www.feraloldguy.com/general.htm Thanks John Scully --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Mon Nov 8 14:59:35 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 14:59:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence Message-ID: <1eb.2d4756c2.2ec15457@aol.com> In a message dated 11/8/04 1:49:43 PM Pacific Standard Time, BETDAV97@aol.com writes: Hey Folks, As usual someone didn't read well, the gentleman didn't say that the pyrite fluoresced, the specimen in general fluoresced. Which is common for calcite. The question was about the shape of the crystals. +++++++++++++++++++++++ We are in agreement, someone didn't read well. When Axel replied to the initial post his response indicated that fluorescing was not very good for identifying calcite and that pyrite doesn't fluoresce at all. He obviously understood what he read and I think I understand his reply. Because I understand his reply and I know he has a lot of knowledge about those things I wondered why pyrite never fluoresces. That question had nothing to do with any specimen being discussed. It is a simple question about why pyrite never fluoresces. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From bg at his.com Mon Nov 8 15:00:46 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Mon Nov 8 15:00:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas- Europe In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <067143EB-31DA-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> if you are going to greece, you might want to get to the mineral museum in laurium or lavrion (same place, different spellings). it is down near the bottom of the attic peninsula, southeast of athens. i went there before we even got interested in minerals and was pretty impressed. cathy On Nov 8, 2004, at 5:50 PM, jjunkroski wrote: > My wife and I are planning a two to three week trip to Europe next > Summer. > > We will fly to Amsterdam and use a Eurailpass ( and/or rental car) to > get to > Athens, Greece. > I'm trying to fit in two or three days of collecting (especially > fluorescents). > > Anybody done any collecting in Europe? > > Any suggestions for "must see" mineral locations, collections, shows, > museums? > > Any club contacts who might be doing field trips? > > Any hints, tips or warnings? > > Thanks > "Junk" > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Nov 8 15:15:18 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Nov 8 15:14:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For a number of reasons, Grant. I'm the one that said pyrite can't fluoresce so I'll take responsibility for my bold statement ;-))) The reason that pyrite has this metallic luster is the same a the reason that metals have a metallic luster and conduct electricity... Has to do with the behavior of the outer electrons that move about rather easily. I THINK that most of the UV would be converted in small currents and heat instead of fluorescence. But I'm not really into that. You should get a much better explanation from the fluorescence buffs... Earl, Don, Glen, Pete, Greg, and I'm forgetting a few... other very good reasons : - colored ions absorb the UV as well as any fluorescence resulting from it. Iron is a strong colored ion. Pyrite may appear relatively light colored but the black-green streak color of the mineral tells us otherwise. - There's always some trivalent iron present in minerals that are made up of divalent iron and vice versa. The UV would loose all its energy in kicking electrons from Fe2+ to Fe3+. As a result the Fe2+ becomes Fe3+ and vice versa... This "charge transfer" drains the UV's energy very effectively. Again: this is NOT the gospel (at least not all the verses), it's what I think to be a fairly good description of why pyrite doesn't EVER fluoresce. Personally I know a few guys who can explain this with exactly the right words and I think their keyboards are just itching to write them down Cheers Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Lapadary@aol.com Verzonden: maandag 8 november 2004 22:36 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence In a message dated 11/8/04 10:17:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: Hi Smkell (???) Pyrite can't fluoresce. ================== If I have ever seen a statement begging for a question, that is it. Why can't pyrite fluoresce? Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From BETDAV97 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 15:26:42 2004 From: BETDAV97 at aol.com (BETDAV97@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 8 15:26:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence Message-ID: <88.19022214.2ec15ab2@aol.com> Hi again group, As usual I have an ass out of myself, not for the first time. I was much more interested in hearing about the calcite. Dave --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Mon Nov 8 16:36:07 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Mon Nov 8 16:36:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] A field find of Stibnite-Included Quartz Crystals inNevada- References: <010901c4c5cb$ad624cb0$0d1ac93f@gbm> Message-ID: <004401c4c5f4$1a4d4460$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Wow - that's quite the trench! No danger of collapse? Are you suppose to refill those trenches when you are done? Just curious... I hope to dig in some prospects in the not-to-distant future for some smithsonite coated fluorite that I recently encountered. Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 2:46 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] A field find of Stibnite-Included Quartz Crystals inNevada- Hello Rockhounds! I wanted you let you all know that I have posted some pictures of a fun and productive, recent Nevada collecting trip on my web site for all to enjoy- http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite-Included%20Quartz%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Nov 8 17:16:32 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Nov 8 17:13:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence References: Message-ID: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 11/8/04 10:17:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, > axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: > > Hi Smkell (???) > > Pyrite can't fluoresce. > > ================== > If I have ever seen a statement begging for a question, that is it. Why > can't pyrite fluoresce? > > Grant > Grant, Let me try to give you an explanation, but it gets complicated and I may not be clear. Hopefully a real expert will step in, but here goes... Electrons orbit the nucleus in an atom. The electrons have a variety of fixed orbitals they can use, but they prefer to stay in lower energy orbits. A certain amount of energy is needed to push an electron in one particular orbital to some particular other orbital. When the electron drops back to the preferred lower energy orbital the energy difference is released as light -- a photon with a particular energy/frequency. Each orbital pair has its own energy difference, and only some of these fall in the range of visible light. Black light shining on your specimen is pumping energy into the atoms, and electrons are moving to higher energy orbits. When they drop back your specimen fluoresces. There may be multiple steps in a single atom, or chains of excitation with different elements involved, or it may be a single step. The exciting energy needs to be correct because electrons usually only accept exact change. So the answer to your question is that pyrite simply doesn't have any orbital jumps that produce visible light. Or at least none have been identified. The electrons know what they are doing, even when we don't understand. Kreigh From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 8 20:02:25 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 8 20:55:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID Message-ID: <018b01c4c618$48d37970$b75e70d1@S0033035959> I suppose this is an exercise in futility but one of the reasons I blow hot and cold on this science is the frustration of trying to figure out what a particular piece of rock or mineral is. When I was a kid I had a mentor who was pretty good at it but she is long gone and 50 years later I am still struggling to identiy more than a handfull of minerals by sight. It occurred to me that (thanks to Al Gore) we can post pictures to the web and at least get suggestions of where to start looking for the answers. A typical rock I frequently bring in because it looks something like amazonite but turns out not to be after cutting and/or washing. It has a greenish look to it and a somewhat greasy feel but when sliced open is nearly black with sometimes a marble pattern of light material in it. It looks a lot like a new counter top we just bought. I have taken a picture of one such rock which includes the rock and a sliced surface. I am having problems with my FTP but when I resolve it, it will be at: http://schmidling.com/rock1.htm Have a look and give me some ideas. Thanks, p.s. I presume that image attachements are not allowed on the list? PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From herwig.pelckmans at pandora.be Mon Nov 8 22:04:47 2004 From: herwig.pelckmans at pandora.be (herwig pelckmans) Date: Mon Nov 8 22:07:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas- Europe References: Message-ID: <003d01c4c622$04584d20$5ced76d5@pandora.be> Dear Junk, There are so many hints, tips, remarks, etc to give that I find it hard where to start. Anyhow, the most important thing to consider is what you (and your wife) REALLY WANT to see & do & experience. Even three full weeks is way to short to even get a good impression of the different countries you will be travelling through... Compare it with someone planning a trip by train from NY to LA in 2 or 3 weeks ... not the best way to see the US in my opinion. Same in Europe. Even though our public transport is a bit more "widespread", you will still have a hard time getting to some places (unless you rent a cab, but that can get expensive as well). So if you like to go your own way and stop & stay where you want, renting a car is the best way to go. The bad news: our gasoline prices are "a bit" higher than yours... Other things to consider while planning your trip: * do you care about good weather? * "summer" => when exactly? Avoid peak holiday season (= highest prices) in July/August if possible * eventually try to stick to a few countries instead of "doing it all" * try to decide what "topics" are most important : culture, nature, mineral collecting, ... and try to plan your trip accordingly. Cheers, Herwig Herwig Pelckmans Worldwide Mineral Collector Cardijnstraat 12 B-3530 Helchteren Belgium Europe http://www.xlizd.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "jjunkroski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:50 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Fantasy trip ideas- Europe > My wife and I are planning a two to three week trip to Europe next Summer. > > We will fly to Amsterdam and use a Eurailpass ( and/or rental car) to get to > Athens, Greece. > I'm trying to fit in two or three days of collecting (especially > fluorescents). > > Anybody done any collecting in Europe? > > Any suggestions for "must see" mineral locations, collections, shows, > museums? > > Any club contacts who might be doing field trips? > > Any hints, tips or warnings? > > Thanks > "Junk" > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Tue Nov 9 02:29:27 2004 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Tue Nov 9 04:30:49 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID References: <018b01c4c618$48d37970$b75e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <002101c4c647$024265a0$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Jack, I can't seem to access your photo but I'll throw out a guess. Possibly serpentinite? John > A typical rock I frequently bring in because it looks something like > amazonite but turns out not to be after cutting and/or washing. It has a > greenish look to it and a somewhat greasy feel but when sliced open is > nearly black with sometimes a marble pattern of light material in it. It > looks a lot like a new counter top we just bought. From arf at mc.net Tue Nov 9 04:46:24 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Tue Nov 9 05:02:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID References: <018b01c4c618$48d37970$b75e70d1@S0033035959> <002101c4c647$024265a0$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Message-ID: <003001c4c65c$5ce68a80$275f70d1@S0033035959> From: "John Siebel" > I can't seem to access your photo but I'll throw out a guess. Possibly > serpentinite? I posted the wrong url anyway... Try.... http://schmidling.com/rock1.jpg js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Tue Nov 9 07:23:56 2004 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Tue Nov 9 07:24:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID In-Reply-To: <018b01c4c618$48d37970$b75e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <20041109152356.95528.qmail@web51005.mail.yahoo.com> What's the hardness? Sounds kinda like serpentine. That's soft- around 3, I think. Jim --- Jack Schmidling wrote: > I suppose this is an exercise in futility but one of > the reasons I blow hot > and cold on this science is the frustration of > trying to figure out what a > particular piece of rock or mineral is. When I was > a kid I had a mentor who > was pretty good at it but she is long gone and 50 > years later I am still > struggling to identiy more than a handfull of > minerals by sight. > > It occurred to me that (thanks to Al Gore) we can > post pictures to the web > and at least get suggestions of where to start > looking for the answers. > > A typical rock I frequently bring in because it > looks something like > amazonite but turns out not to be after cutting > and/or washing. It has a > greenish look to it and a somewhat greasy feel but > when sliced open is > nearly black with sometimes a marble pattern of > light material in it. It > looks a lot like a new counter top we just bought. > > I have taken a picture of one such rock which > includes the rock and a sliced > surface. > > I am having problems with my FTP but when I resolve > it, it will be at: > > http://schmidling.com/rock1.htm > > Have a look and give me some ideas. > > Thanks, > > p.s. I presume that image attachements are not > allowed on the list? > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > http://schmidling.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From DOMMELEN at DAL.CA Tue Nov 9 07:55:04 2004 From: DOMMELEN at DAL.CA (Ronnie Van Dommelen) Date: Tue Nov 9 07:55:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] pyrite fluorescence In-Reply-To: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> References: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <1100015704.4190e8583a312@my2.dal.ca> > > If I have ever seen a statement begging for a question, that is it. Why > > can't pyrite fluoresce? > > > > Grant Grant, Might be making a fool of myself here, but the best way to learn is to try to explain something. So, here is what my answer would be. Metallic ions in a host material often fluoresce. The outer electron orbitals of the single atom are not perfectly filled. They either have an excess or shortage of electrons. Thus the electrons can easily be bumped into higher energy states and return to a lower energy state - fluorescing. On the other hand in a solid metallic mineral there are no energy bands - no forbidden energy gaps. That is what makes a metal and why metals are opaque, why they are shiney, and why they conduct heat and electricity (as Axel said). A UV photon will be easily absorbed by the pyrite (or another metallic mineral) but the energy will be given up entirely as heat and mechanical energy. This is because the high energy electron will zip around through the mineral, collide with other electrons and give up only small amounts of energy at a time as far infrared photons (heat) and phonons (crystal lattice vibrations). Later, Ronnie Van Dommelen From DOMMELEN at DAL.CA Tue Nov 9 08:29:43 2004 From: DOMMELEN at DAL.CA (Ronnie Van Dommelen) Date: Tue Nov 9 08:29:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull In-Reply-To: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> References: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <1100017783.4190f077cd654@my2.dal.ca> Hi All, I know this is a mineral list, not a fossil list, but there are a few fossil folks on this list that might be interested. Just read this great story, with a photo of an amazing 300 million year old skull! http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20041109.wamph1109/BNStory/specialScienceandHealth/ (you might have to cut and paste the link into your browser in multiple pieces because of the length of it) Ronnie Van Dommelen From SMKELL45 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 08:50:19 2004 From: SMKELL45 at aol.com (SMKELL45@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 9 08:50:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Calcite Message-ID: <3EFC9AE5.03118EA2.0079B709@aol.com> Let's begin again. I received a specimen of Calcite on a matrix of massive Pyrite. The majority of the crystals of Calcite were clearly hexagonal and tabular. They were in random positions, not like poker chip calcite. When illuminated with SW the calcite, only, fluoresed a slightly pinkish red, with no noticeable phosphorescence. The label indicated that it came from Peru. Has anyone seen similar material and if so could they suggest where in Peru it might be found.smkell From Gslrocks at aol.com Tue Nov 9 08:52:07 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 9 08:52:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Calcite Message-ID: <85.1a3d5a71.2ec24fb7@aol.com> material like that can be spectacular under a MW midwave lamp if you have access to one i would definitely try it out on that specimen. Greg Lesinski GSLROCKS 4726 Porter Center Rd. Lewiston NY 14092 Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books website www.gslrocks.com GSLROCKS@AOL.COM 716-754-9729 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From bg at his.com Tue Nov 9 09:06:53 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Tue Nov 9 09:07:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Calcite In-Reply-To: <3EFC9AE5.03118EA2.0079B709@aol.com> References: <3EFC9AE5.03118EA2.0079B709@aol.com> Message-ID: On Nov 9, 2004, at 11:50 AM, SMKELL45@aol.com wrote: > Let's begin again. I received a specimen of Calcite on a matrix of > massive Pyrite. The majority of the crystals of Calcite were clearly > hexagonal and tabular. They were in random positions, not like poker > chip calcite. When illuminated with SW the calcite, only, fluoresed a > slightly pinkish red, with no noticeable phosphorescence. The label > indicated that it came from Peru. Has anyone seen similar material and > if so could they suggest where in Peru it might be found.smkell > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From lanny at lrream.com Tue Nov 9 09:11:26 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Tue Nov 9 09:09:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull In-Reply-To: <1100017783.4190f077cd654@my2.dal.ca> References: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> <1100017783.4190f077cd654@my2.dal.ca> Message-ID: <6375EBF4-3272-11D9-A551-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> HI Ronnie, Actually it is the Rockhounds list. All things "rockhound" are welcome. That includes fossils, gem/lapidary, rocks, apparently the planets according to so many posts here, and even minerals. Right Aaron and everyone, or has it changed in the last dozen years? Nice story, thanks for the link (and I'm a dedicated mineral minded person!) Regards, Lanny On Nov 9, 2004, at 8:29 AM, Ronnie Van Dommelen wrote: > Hi All, > > I know this is a mineral list, not a fossil list, but there are a few > fossil > folks on this list that might be interested. Just read this great > story, with > a photo of an amazing 300 million year old skull! > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20041109.wamph1109/ > BNStory/specialScienceandHealth/ > > (you might have to cut and paste the link into your browser in > multiple pieces > because of the length of it) > > Ronnie Van Dommelen > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From arf at mc.net Tue Nov 9 09:37:48 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Tue Nov 9 09:38:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID References: <20041109152356.95528.qmail@web51005.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00a801c4c682$e0f77b60$275f70d1@S0033035959> From: "Jim Daly" > What's the hardness? Sounds kinda like serpentine. > That's soft- around 3, I think. Scratches easily with a metal scribe and the streak is green. I think I lean toward the serpentinite suggestion. js > Jim > --- Jack Schmidling wrote: > > > I suppose this is an exercise in futility but one of > > the reasons I blow hot > > and cold on this science is the frustration of > > trying to figure out what a > > particular piece of rock or mineral is. When I was > > a kid I had a mentor who > > was pretty good at it but she is long gone and 50 > > years later I am still > > struggling to identiy more than a handfull of > > minerals by sight. > > > > It occurred to me that (thanks to Al Gore) we can > > post pictures to the web > > and at least get suggestions of where to start > > looking for the answers. > > > > A typical rock I frequently bring in because it > > looks something like > > amazonite but turns out not to be after cutting > > and/or washing. It has a > > greenish look to it and a somewhat greasy feel but > > when sliced open is > > nearly black with sometimes a marble pattern of > > light material in it. It > > looks a lot like a new counter top we just bought. > > > > I have taken a picture of one such rock which > > includes the rock and a sliced > > surface. > > > > I am having problems with my FTP but when I resolve > > it, it will be at: > > > > http://schmidling.com/rock1.htm > > > > Have a look and give me some ideas. > > > > Thanks, > > > > p.s. I presume that image attachements are not > > allowed on the list? > > > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > > http://schmidling.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Nov 9 09:53:49 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Nov 9 09:53:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Calcite In-Reply-To: <3EFC9AE5.03118EA2.0079B709@aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Smkell, these are the localities, according to "mindat", in Peru where calcite and pyrite are found together. I marked the localities from which I have a specimen with a "+". They all fluoresce from bright red under LW to pinkish. It all depends on the concentration of manganese and lead. Some of the stuff is even light pink in daylight and will fluoresce in blue light. None of my calcite specimens are hexagonal. Hexagonal crystals that fluoresce pink, orange or violet in SW may as well be apatite. The apatite/pyrite combination is found in at least two localities in Peru. They are marked with a "?". One coincides with a calcite/pyrite locality: the Huanzala mine. I add this info because in your first e-mail you wrote that MOST of the crystals are hexagonal "with a few rhombs"... That could indicate that both apatite and calcite are present. Are your crystals white or pink? Transparent, translucent or opaque? How large are they? These are all observations you should share if you want us to stand a chance of finding out what your specimen is and where it's from. Axel Here are the localities; + Ancash Department Bolognesi Province + Pachapaqui District Pallasca Province Pasto Bueno District Huancavelica Department Angaraes Province Julcani District Min.Rec. 28, no.4 (1997) Castrovirreyna Province Castrovirreyna District Min.Rec. 28, no.4 (1997) Min.Rec. 28, no.4 (1997) +? Huanuco Department Dos de Mayo Province Huallanca District +? Huanzala Mine Jun?n Department Yauli Province Morococha District Min.Rec. 28, #4 (1997) La Libertad Department Santiago de Chuco Province Quiruvilca District Quiruvilca Mine (La Libertad Mine; ASARCO Mine) Min.Rec. 28, #4 (1997) Lima Department Cajatambo Province Raura District Min.Rec. 28, no. 4 (1997) + Huarochiri Province Casapalca + Casapalca Mine [www.johnbetts-fineminerals.com] Pasco Department Alcides Carri?n Province Cerro de Pasco Atacocha District Min.Rec. 28, no.4 (1997) Milpo Mine D. Slade collection ? San Jose de Huayllay district Huaron Mining District ? Huaron Mines No reference listed Puno Department San Rafael Mine -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens SMKELL45@aol.com Verzonden: dinsdag 9 november 2004 17:50 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] Calcite Let's begin again. I received a specimen of Calcite on a matrix of massive Pyrite. The majority of the crystals of Calcite were clearly hexagonal and tabular. They were in random positions, not like poker chip calcite. When illuminated with SW the calcite, only, fluoresed a slightly pinkish red, with no noticeable phosphorescence. The label indicated that it came from Peru. Has anyone seen similar material and if so could they suggest where in Peru it might be found.smkell _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From shm at tapnet.net Tue Nov 9 09:53:52 2004 From: shm at tapnet.net (SHM) Date: Tue Nov 9 09:53:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull In-Reply-To: <6375EBF4-3272-11D9-A551-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> Message-ID: <000001c4c685$14262250$9ce4a5ce@D3JM7W21> I'll second that -- Ronnie, thanks for the link. I too am a dedicated mineral person, but I enjoy fossils just as much. However, I don't collect fossils and am entirely ignorant about them (no money and no time, respectively), so I particularly enjoy a good bit of fossil news when it comes around. And besides, that skull is a rock now, isn't it? Perfectly appropriate for our list. Thanks again- Earl -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Lanny Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 12:11 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull HI Ronnie, Actually it is the Rockhounds list. All things "rockhound" are welcome. That includes fossils, gem/lapidary, rocks, apparently the planets according to so many posts here, and even minerals. Right Aaron and everyone, or has it changed in the last dozen years? Nice story, thanks for the link (and I'm a dedicated mineral minded person!) Regards, Lanny On Nov 9, 2004, at 8:29 AM, Ronnie Van Dommelen wrote: > Hi All, > > I know this is a mineral list, not a fossil list, but there are a few > fossil > folks on this list that might be interested. Just read this great > story, with > a photo of an amazing 300 million year old skull! > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20041109.wamph1109/ > BNStory/specialScienceandHealth/ > > (you might have to cut and paste the link into your browser in > multiple pieces > because of the length of it) > > Ronnie Van Dommelen > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From kahako at aloha.net Tue Nov 9 10:33:43 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Tue Nov 9 10:04:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] lava in the ocean again Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041109075729.02dd9010@mail.aloha.net> Hi folks, Lava from Kilauea is going into the ocean again. For those who are new to the list, here's the website with great pictures, and you can go to image archives and see ones from the past; 2002 was an especially good year. http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/kilauea/update/main.html Aloha, Kitty From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 9 12:24:26 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 9 12:26:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock ID Message-ID: In a message dated 11/9/04 5:03:08 AM Pacific Standard Time, arf@mc.net writes: I posted the wrong url anyway... ******* I went to _http://schmidling.com/index.htm_ (http://schmidling.com/index.htm) and thoroughly enjoyed the visit. Now I remember why I don't have time to surf the web. The marbles were beautiful -- even the first one. I think I'll try faceting some obsidian using old tinker toys and my 8 inch "All-you-need" as a jamb peg facetor. I'm thinking of using obsidian because it is softer than quartz or glass, and around here it is cheaper than marbles. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jbryankramer at msn.com Tue Nov 9 15:07:34 2004 From: jbryankramer at msn.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Tue Nov 9 15:07:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] UV Light Trade In-Reply-To: <018b01c4c618$48d37970$b75e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: I have one or possibly two 254 nm 'pencil' type UV lamps with power supplies that I'd be happy to trade for some rocks. These are Jetlight brand and as near as I can tell they go for about $250 list. For those who haven't seen one these are bare lamps which look like a pencil stub about 3 inches or 75 mm long and about 1/4 inch or 7 mm in diameter. They produce 4400 (lumens? I don't recall the right units, I think tis is the right output.). The units are used but work OK. (model numbers are 78-2046-2H for the lamp and PS2000-20 for the power supply. I have one 'Y' adapter so you could run two lamps from one power supply. Now these are unshielded lamps and have to be used with eye protection. It would be easy to fabricate a shield though. They'd possibly work well in a display cabinet. I like crystals of all sorts, but have plenty of quartz right now. If interested email me with your offer. Bryan From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Tue Nov 9 15:18:45 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 9 15:21:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull References: <419019C9.408A@Tomaszewski.net> <1100017783.4190f077cd654@my2.dal.ca> Message-ID: <001d01c4c6b2$768c48c0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Awesome! And lots of us are fossil folks. (Pun intended.) Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ronnie Van Dommelen" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 10:29 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazing Fossil Skull > Hi All, > > I know this is a mineral list, not a fossil list, but there are a few fossil > folks on this list that might be interested. Just read this great story, with > a photo of an amazing 300 million year old skull! > > http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20041109.wamph1109/BNStory/specialScienceandHealth/ > > (you might have to cut and paste the link into your browser in multiple pieces > because of the length of it) > > Ronnie Van Dommelen > From bova at mindspring.com Tue Nov 9 17:36:01 2004 From: bova at mindspring.com (Carol Bova) Date: Tue Nov 9 17:34:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser In-Reply-To: <7370783D-31AE-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> Message-ID: Hi Folks, If anyone has a pic of Mark Liccini or Walt Bowser that I could publish with a memorial story in the first returning issue of the The Eclectic Lapidary.. would you please contact me? Many thanks, Carol Carol J. Bova bova@bovagems.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/enriched --- From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Tue Nov 9 17:42:37 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Tue Nov 9 17:42:41 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser References: Message-ID: <00aa01c4c6c6$8f209d00$6402a8c0@remains> is Mark Liccini deceased as well? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Bova" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 6:36 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser > Hi Folks, > If anyone has a pic of Mark Liccini or Walt Bowser that I could publish > with a memorial story in the first returning issue of the The Eclectic > Lapidary.. would you please contact me? > Many thanks, > Carol > > Carol J. Bova > bova@bovagems.com > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/enriched > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From bova at mindspring.com Tue Nov 9 18:16:23 2004 From: bova at mindspring.com (Carol Bova) Date: Tue Nov 9 18:14:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser In-Reply-To: <00aa01c4c6c6$8f209d00$6402a8c0@remains> Message-ID: <84C4282A-32BE-11D9-8CD1-000A95773806@mindspring.com> Yes, Michael, sorry to say, Mark died in 2002. Carol On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 08:42 PM, Michael Schmidt wrote: > is Mark Liccini deceased as well? > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Bova" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 6:36 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt > Bowser > > >> Hi Folks, >> If anyone has a pic of Mark Liccini or Walt Bowser that I could >> publish with a memorial story in the first returning issue of the The >> Eclectic Lapidary.. would you please contact me? >> Many thanks, >> Carol >> >> Carol J. Bova >> bova@bovagems.com >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/enriched >> --- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From tam2819 at cox.net Tue Nov 9 18:44:03 2004 From: tam2819 at cox.net (T.A.Masters) Date: Tue Nov 9 18:44:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser References: <00aa01c4c6c6$8f209d00$6402a8c0@remains> Message-ID: <41918073.10107@cox.net> Yes Michael, A few years back. Terrie From Samstress17 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 19:20:13 2004 From: Samstress17 at aol.com (Samstress17@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 9 19:20:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser Message-ID: <82.1ac46e8f.2ec2e2ed@aol.com> Now Walt Bowser- theres a man that I miss! I still think of him a lot. There is a picture of him on a little memorial page- here is a link. http://www.openallday.au.com/Tribute2Walt.html Perhaps if you contact the openallday folks, you can get permission to use that picture. Good luck :-) Take care.... Sam ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you make money doing what you love to do, you'll never work a day in your life. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Nov 9 19:59:58 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Nov 9 19:56:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser References: Message-ID: <4191917D.55D3@Tomaszewski.net> Hi Carol, Last time I checked (a couple to a few months ago) you could still go to www.Archive.org, use their "Way Back Machine", and visit the websites of both gentlemen from out of the past. I believe you could find both their pictures on their websites, and it would be fair use (IMHO, IANAL) to use them as they were their publicity photos. I have been back to Mark's website a number of times via Archive.org to do research. Mark had a wonderful collection of knowledge and lore, and I am thankful that it is still available. I still miss my regular but erratic correspondence with him. Walt was also an old online friend, and I am pleased to have a number of his personally collected specimens to remember him by. I learned many lessons from Walt. You have made a good selection in remembering Walt and Mark. They were both outstanding Rockhounds, on a global basis! Good to hear from you again. Kreigh Carol Bova wrote: > > Hi Folks, > If anyone has a pic of Mark Liccini or Walt Bowser that I could publish > with a memorial story in the first returning issue of the The Eclectic > Lapidary.. would you please contact me? > Many thanks, > Carol > > Carol J. Bova > bova@bovagems.com > From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 9 20:23:12 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 9 20:23:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser Message-ID: <1dc.2fa90239.2ec2f1b0@aol.com> In a message dated 11/9/04 7:20:36 PM Pacific Standard Time, Samstress17@aol.com writes: Now Walt Bowser- theres a man that I miss! I still think of him a lot. ==============================XXXXXX============================ Yes, he was one nice guy. I say without ever having met him in person. His emails in reply to my sometimes simplistic questions, and the little off list notes and frequently off topic banter, made him real. That is hard to do with the written word. His writing showed a sagacious teacher who saw fun in most things, especially the hidden humor in human interactions. Grant Johnston, Chico, CA --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com Wed Nov 10 08:15:30 2004 From: scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) Date: Wed Nov 10 08:22:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser References: Message-ID: <003201c4c740$802306b0$e405a940@gbm> Hi Carol, I have a GREAT pic of Walt in Changsha, China, back in 2000, when he invited me on his first China mineral tour. It is a printed pic, but I can digitize it and send it your way. We had the times of our lives! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carol Bova" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 5:36 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] looking for photos of Mark Liccini and Walt Bowser > Hi Folks, > If anyone has a pic of Mark Liccini or Walt Bowser that I could publish > with a memorial story in the first returning issue of the The Eclectic > Lapidary.. would you please contact me? > Many thanks, > Carol > > Carol J. Bova > bova@bovagems.com > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/enriched > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From adrian at brentnall.fsnet.co.uk Wed Nov 10 14:50:21 2004 From: adrian at brentnall.fsnet.co.uk (Adrian Brentnall) Date: Wed Nov 10 14:52:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! Message-ID: <00b801c4c777$b5b23fd0$0300a8c0@ifriend> Hi All Firstly - a brief 'about me' - as requested. I'm Adrian, currently living in Suffolk, in the extreme East of the UK - but born & bred in Cornwall - where I developed an interest in mineralogy & rockhounding from an early age. Haven't done much in terms of 'rocks' for a good few years - but now rekindling an interest - particularly in a little light slabbing, cabbing & polishing - partly for fun and partly to include in my stained-glass artwork. With this in mind I treated myself to a second-hand Beacon Star saw/grind/polish combo - which was auctioned on Ebay. Final price was reasonable, even taking the shipping costs (USA - UK) into account. Slight trouble is that the bearings appear to be a bit 'tired' - quite noisy & with a fair bit of 'slop'.... ....so - I'm looking for some replacement bearings - ideally in the UK but I'll buy them in the USA if necessary. The original bearings seem to be marked SKF 454204r012 A quick check with a vernier shows it to have the following measurements Internal diameter 0.75" Maximum outer diameter 1.862" Width of outer bearing housing 0.590" Width of inner 0.852" It seems to be very difficult to locate an equivalent item here in the UK - managed to find some metric bearings very cheaply (washing machine spares !) - but they were imperial - and attempt so shim from 22mm down to the 19mm / .75" shaft were not very successful. (Can't win 'em all !) In did get in touch with the people who bought out Beacon Star - and they've apparently located and equivalent SKF part - but they're $92 each! - plus shipping - which is beyond a joke.... So - can any kind soul recommend an alternative - I'd love to get this old combo unit back up & running again. Kind of fulfilling a teenage dream - when I was active in rockhounding I couldn't afford anything more high-tech than a rock tumbler - so it's partly a nostalgia trip! Many thanks in advance Adrian Suffolk UK From jaybates at rcn.com Wed Nov 10 15:18:35 2004 From: jaybates at rcn.com (jaybates) Date: Wed Nov 10 15:15:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! References: <00b801c4c777$b5b23fd0$0300a8c0@ifriend> Message-ID: <000501c4c77b$9af57960$6401a8c0@cable.rcn.com> Go to SKF bearings on google. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Brentnall" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 2:50 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! > Hi All > Firstly - a brief 'about me' - as requested. > I'm Adrian, currently living in Suffolk, in the extreme East of the UK - but > born & bred in Cornwall - where I developed an interest in mineralogy & > rockhounding from an early age. > Haven't done much in terms of 'rocks' for a good few years - but now > rekindling an interest - particularly in a little light slabbing, cabbing & > polishing - partly for fun and partly to include in my stained-glass > artwork. > > With this in mind I treated myself to a second-hand Beacon Star > saw/grind/polish combo - which was auctioned on Ebay. Final price was > reasonable, even taking the shipping costs (USA - UK) into account. Slight > trouble is that the bearings appear to be a bit 'tired' - quite noisy & with > a fair bit of 'slop'.... > > ....so - I'm looking for some replacement bearings - ideally in the UK but > I'll buy them in the USA if necessary. The original bearings seem to be > marked > > SKF 454204r012 > > A quick check with a vernier shows it to have the following measurements > > Internal diameter 0.75" > Maximum outer diameter 1.862" > Width of outer bearing housing 0.590" > Width of inner 0.852" > > It seems to be very difficult to locate an equivalent item here in the UK - > managed to find some metric bearings very cheaply (washing machine spares > !) - but they were imperial - and attempt so shim from 22mm down to the 19mm > / .75" shaft were not very successful. (Can't win 'em all !) > > In did get in touch with the people who bought out Beacon Star - and they've > apparently located and equivalent SKF part - but they're $92 each! - plus > shipping - which is beyond a joke.... > > So - can any kind soul recommend an alternative - I'd love to get this old > combo unit back up & running again. Kind of fulfilling a teenage dream - > when I was active in rockhounding I couldn't afford anything more high-tech > than a rock tumbler - so it's partly a nostalgia trip! > > Many thanks in advance > Adrian > Suffolk UK > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From murowchickj at umkc.edu Wed Nov 10 15:19:55 2004 From: murowchickj at umkc.edu (J B Murowchick) Date: Wed Nov 10 15:19:59 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! In-Reply-To: <00b801c4c777$b5b23fd0$0300a8c0@ifriend> Message-ID: Adrian- You might try Grainger Industrial Supply at www.grainger.com. We use them all the time for replacement parts. I'm looking at their catalog (excuse me, catalogue) right now, and they have hundreds of bearings under the Power transmission section. I think that you can view the catalog on-line, but you might have to fill out some info. They have outlets all over the US, and they have an export service for overseas orders. For Europe, call 847 965-7662 (fax 847 965-7608)--US numbers. I can't tell what kind of bearing you need from the info you gave, but I'll bet there's something suitable in the catalog. >From what I saw, though, $92 isn't unusually high for some bearings. Good luck, and if I find anything in particular, I'll let you know. Jim __________________________________________________________ Dr. James B. Murowchick Associate Professor Office: (816) 235-2979 Geosciences, 420 Flarsheim Hall Fax: (816) 235-5535 University of Missouri-Kansas City E-mail: murowchickj@umkc.edu 5110 Rockhill Road Kansas City, MO 64110 on 11/10/04 4:50 PM, Adrian Brentnall at adrian@brentnall.fsnet.co.uk wrote: > Hi All > Firstly - a brief 'about me' - as requested. > I'm Adrian, currently living in Suffolk, in the extreme East of the UK - but > born & bred in Cornwall - where I developed an interest in mineralogy & > rockhounding from an early age. > Haven't done much in terms of 'rocks' for a good few years - but now > rekindling an interest - particularly in a little light slabbing, cabbing & > polishing - partly for fun and partly to include in my stained-glass > artwork. > > With this in mind I treated myself to a second-hand Beacon Star > saw/grind/polish combo - which was auctioned on Ebay. Final price was > reasonable, even taking the shipping costs (USA - UK) into account. Slight > trouble is that the bearings appear to be a bit 'tired' - quite noisy & with > a fair bit of 'slop'.... > > ....so - I'm looking for some replacement bearings - ideally in the UK but > I'll buy them in the USA if necessary. The original bearings seem to be > marked > > SKF 454204r012 > > A quick check with a vernier shows it to have the following measurements > > Internal diameter 0.75" > Maximum outer diameter 1.862" > Width of outer bearing housing 0.590" > Width of inner 0.852" > > It seems to be very difficult to locate an equivalent item here in the UK - > managed to find some metric bearings very cheaply (washing machine spares > !) - but they were imperial - and attempt so shim from 22mm down to the 19mm > / .75" shaft were not very successful. (Can't win 'em all !) > > In did get in touch with the people who bought out Beacon Star - and they've > apparently located and equivalent SKF part - but they're $92 each! - plus > shipping - which is beyond a joke.... > > So - can any kind soul recommend an alternative - I'd love to get this old > combo unit back up & running again. Kind of fulfilling a teenage dream - > when I was active in rockhounding I couldn't afford anything more high-tech > than a rock tumbler - so it's partly a nostalgia trip! > > Many thanks in advance > Adrian > Suffolk UK > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From jbryankramer at msn.com Wed Nov 10 16:03:57 2004 From: jbryankramer at msn.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Nov 10 16:04:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! In-Reply-To: <00b801c4c777$b5b23fd0$0300a8c0@ifriend> Message-ID: SKF is a big commericial bearing supplier, we use a lot of them where I work. So you should be able to locate another supplier. In the US I'd just suggest that you check the yellow pages for "Bearings and Drives" which is company found all over the US since you are in the UK that probably won't work. However SKF does have a website and does seem to have UK offices so try www.skf.com. They can give you the name of a local distributer. Another possibility is calling a local machine shop for a suggested supplier. Bryan -------Original Message----- --....so - I'm looking for some replacement bearings - ideally --in the UK but --I'll buy them in the USA if necessary. The original bearings --seem to be --marked -- --SKF 454204r012 -- --A quick check with a vernier shows it to have the following --measurements -- --Internal diameter 0.75" --Maximum outer diameter 1.862" --Width of outer bearing housing 0.590" --Width of inner 0.852" -- --It seems to be very difficult to locate an equivalent item --here in the UK - --managed to find some metric bearings very cheaply (washing --machine spares --!) - but they were imperial - and attempt so shim from 22mm --down to the 19mm --/ .75" shaft were not very successful. (Can't win 'em all !) -- --In did get in touch with the people who bought out Beacon --Star - and they've --apparently located and equivalent SKF part - but they're $92 --each! - plus --shipping - which is beyond a joke.... -- --So - can any kind soul recommend an alternative - I'd love to --get this old --combo unit back up & running again. Kind of fulfilling a --teenage dream - --when I was active in rockhounding I couldn't afford anything --more high-tech --than a rock tumbler - so it's partly a nostalgia trip! -- --Many thanks in advance --Adrian --Suffolk UK -- --_______________________________________________ --Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List --WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds --Subscription Services: --http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds -- From arf at mc.net Wed Nov 10 17:19:49 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Wed Nov 10 17:21:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Diamonds Message-ID: <025d01c4c78c$b723c4a0$275f70d1@S0033035959> Well, I did some experimenting with my sand and grease and if this works, I have lots of diamonds. I suspect it only works when done properly and I am just flailing at windmills. The most discouraging aspect was brought to light by some photos on diamondrough.com. Any notion that an amateur can spot a diamond by sight is quickly dispelled. The whole image of industrial diamonds looks like random sand. I am in need of lots more info on this subject and seem to find nothing searching the net. Any more help would be much appreciated. But anyway, here is what I did. I rubbed a petri dish with vaseline and sloshed some sand around in water and poured this into the dish. I then swirled it around a bit and then poured out the sand, riced gently with water and inspected what was left under the microscope. Not quite sure how to prove anything at this point but it seems that if wash off the grease with a solvent and dry the stones, I should be able to test the whetting individually but I have not worked this out yet. For what it's worth, I posted a picture of what I got at http://schmidling.com/dia4.jpg The two stones are about 1 mm long. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From SMKELL45 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 07:31:43 2004 From: SMKELL45 at aol.com (SMKELL45@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 11 07:31:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Message-ID: <15.379d7089.2ec4dfdf@aol.com> Recently I was given a piece of Carborundum, possibly from Poland. I hit it with my sw light and portions of it fluoresed a bright yellow. Any ideas on why this is happening, anybody else with that experience? smkell --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Gslrocks at aol.com Thu Nov 11 07:48:12 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 11 07:48:27 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Message-ID: <75.37ffdd9c.2ec4e3bc@aol.com> it could be hydrocarbons formed during its creation or another scenario is what happened to me with some specimens on my work bench. A cat got into the garage and did 2 things. It knocked a bottle of charcoal starter and also broke a fluorescent lamp ( normal cool white one) on the work bench. The result was i had blue and yellow fluorescing foreign material all over some prime material i was working on. The ended up being scrapped because of the cat. Greg Lesinski GSLROCKS 4726 Porter Center Rd. Lewiston NY 14092 Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books website www.gslrocks.com GSLROCKS@AOL.COM 716-754-9729 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Thu Nov 11 07:57:24 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Thu Nov 11 07:57:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum References: <75.37ffdd9c.2ec4e3bc@aol.com> Message-ID: <032f01c4c807$22c02300$6402a8c0@remains> should have scrapped the cat instead ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 8:48 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > it could be hydrocarbons formed during its creation or another scenario is > what happened to me with some specimens on my work bench. A cat got into > the > garage and did 2 things. It knocked a bottle of charcoal starter and also > broke a > fluorescent lamp ( normal cool white one) on the work bench. The result > was i > had blue and yellow fluorescing foreign material all over some prime > material > i was working on. The ended up being scrapped because of the cat. > > > Greg Lesinski > GSLROCKS > 4726 Porter Center Rd. > Lewiston NY > 14092 > Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books > website www.gslrocks.com > GSLROCKS@AOL.COM > 716-754-9729 > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From afox at drizzle.com Thu Nov 11 08:36:29 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Thu Nov 11 08:36:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Google Indexing Message-ID: After receiving about 50 responses, I've made a decision. The vote is approximately 2:1 (36 to 17) for continuing to allow Google to index the Rockhounds archives. In general, respondants have generally indicated that the access to information provided I have, however, sent a reasonably nasty letter to Google about their software ignoring fairly obvious META tags and the robots.txt file. Not the way for a good company to behave. I will be modifying the Python module (with Drizzle's permission and help) within Pipermail to add some additional obsfucation to the email headers. This will, however, not affect email addresses in the message body. CAVEATS ------- 1) Within the next year or so, Rockhounds will most likely move to a colocated server. A group of us is arranging to rent a virtual server from a colocation company to give us greater flexibility to run servers (Jabber IM, Apache, a BZFlag server, and highly customized Postfix | ClamAV | Spamassassin mail accounts). When this happens, I'll have more direct control over the mailing list software and the archiving software. The archives will become fully indexed and searchable, and, at that point, I can look at writing perl scripts to parse the messages and further obsfucate the email addresses in the archive files. 2) Spam. So far, there haven't been any widespread reports of spammers obtaining addresses from the archives (a little obscure). If this changes and is documentable, we'll re-address the decision. 3) I will be out of the country Nov 20 to February 5. List administration may be spotty during that time. If you have problems, please be patient; it may be a few days before I can get to you. Thanks, all. Back to rockhounding. All comments - flames to me off-list, please. Aaron Rockhounds Admin -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot From LarryRush at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 11 08:56:28 2004 From: LarryRush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Thu Nov 11 08:55:46 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Kudos, Aaron References: <4167B647.9000005@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <01c701c4c80f$6456eee0$0100007f@fekib> I would like to express my thanks to Aaron for a fine job running this list. It was especially nice during the last election not to have had to put up with the inevitable political flame wars that would have erupted without his superlative efforts in administering this list, with it's varied membership. As many will remember, the last Rockhounds discussion list succumbed due to the unending flames and side discussions that caused a lot of dissent. Thanks, Aaron, for not allowing that to happen here. I, for one, really appreciate your diligent efforts! Larry Rush --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 09:07:19 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:07:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <75.37ffdd9c.2ec4e3bc@aol.com> Message-ID: Greg, only one way out: take your SW lamp and fry the cat... It's bad for the cat but it'll make you feel better! Roughly the same thing happened to me. Last summer I had invited some guys of my club and their spouses to a BBQ. They had helped me set up the fluorescence booth at our 2004 show and the commemorative display about SS Columbia and the FBI story. I couldn't have done that alone since I was suffering from acute problems with my back. To brighten up the evening some (and because it was the hottest day of summer and I had a few beers more than I'm used to), I started playing with a canister of fluorescent paint and a spray flask with eosin and a 125 Watts LW UV spot. I did that in the back of my yard, some 20 meters of the CLOSED door of my hobby room ad everybody had great fun, I vaguely recall. The stuff still managed to contaminate some specimens of my collection. Those aerosols are real party-poopers ;-))) Cheers Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Gslrocks@aol.com Verzonden: donderdag 11 november 2004 16:48 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum it could be hydrocarbons formed during its creation or another scenario is what happened to me with some specimens on my work bench. A cat got into the garage and did 2 things. It knocked a bottle of charcoal starter and also broke a fluorescent lamp ( normal cool white one) on the work bench. The result was i had blue and yellow fluorescing foreign material all over some prime material i was working on. The ended up being scrapped because of the cat. Greg Lesinski GSLROCKS 4726 Porter Center Rd. Lewiston NY 14092 Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books website www.gslrocks.com GSLROCKS@AOL.COM 716-754-9729 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Gslrocks at aol.com Thu Nov 11 09:11:02 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:11:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Message-ID: <7a.6611f120.2ec4f726@aol.com> well i have a big yard .. but it is full of about 20-30,000 lbs of rocks. I dont think i could have sprayed that anywhere and not hit something of value. Ask Earl Don H or a few others just about any space that will fit a specimen has one, two ten, a hundred...lol up to and including the restroom! --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 09:21:02 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:21:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <7a.6611f120.2ec4f726@aol.com> Message-ID: Now I get these disturbing mental images of you causing a rock-slide by just tearing of a sheet of toilet paper... Say it ain't that bad? -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Gslrocks@aol.com Verzonden: donderdag 11 november 2004 18:11 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum well i have a big yard .. but it is full of about 20-30,000 lbs of rocks. I dont think i could have sprayed that anywhere and not hit something of value. Ask Earl Don H or a few others just about any space that will fit a specimen has one, two ten, a hundred...lol up to and including the restroom! --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Thu Nov 11 09:21:25 2004 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:21:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <7a.6611f120.2ec4f726@aol.com> Message-ID: <200411111721.iABHLbue022133@bubbleator.drizzle.com> "A house without rocks isn't a home." (c) 2004 GcB "A bathroom without rocks in it is just a bathroom." (c) 2004 ditto "Always pick a girlfriend who brings home more rocks than you do." (c) etc etc etc "If the cat knocks over the 1 gal jar of honey, roll the cat in the honey and throw the cat into the back yard." (c) c1978 my ex wife > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Gslrocks@aol.com > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:11 AM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > well i have a big yard .. but it is full of about 20-30,000 > lbs of rocks. I dont think i could have sprayed that anywhere > and not hit something of value. > Ask Earl Don H or a few others just about any space that will > fit a specimen has one, two ten, a hundred...lol up to and > including the restroom! > From morningstar at att.net Thu Nov 11 09:25:00 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:25:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Message-ID: <111120041725.5264.4193A06C0002D5F70000149021587667209D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Axel Emmermann" > Now I get these disturbing mental images of you causing a rock-slide by just > tearing of a sheet of toilet paper... Say it ain't that bad? It's that bad. They're on the kitchen table too. DD From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 09:40:20 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 09:40:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <111120041725.5264.4193A06C0002D5F70000149021587667209D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> Message-ID: Well, my friends, it has finally happened. Evolution has reversed... my arms are getting longer from carrying heavy loads of rocks and whem I'm standing in my hobby room and look around, I feel like I 'm a caveman. I guess a psychoanalyst would call my specific aberration fluotroglodytism. TROGLODYTES RUUUUULE, YEAH.... Cave-Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens morningstar@att.net Verzonden: donderdag 11 november 2004 18:25 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Axel Emmermann" > Now I get these disturbing mental images of you causing a rock-slide by just > tearing of a sheet of toilet paper... Say it ain't that bad? It's that bad. They're on the kitchen table too. DD _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From shm at tapnet.net Thu Nov 11 10:56:51 2004 From: shm at tapnet.net (SHM) Date: Thu Nov 11 10:56:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c4c820$350d9dd0$7ce4a5ce@D3JM7W21> -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Axel Emmermann Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:21 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Now I get these disturbing mental images of you causing a rock-slide by just tearing off a sheet of toilet paper... Say it ain't that bad? - - - - - - Don is correct; it's that bad (or good . . .). The porcelain throne itself used to be tilted 20 degrees from vertical because the floor was caving in, and one had to use a seat belt in there to keep from falling off. You think I'm joking, don't you? But I must say I have twice driven six hours one-way to visit Greg and family (and rocks), and will do so again, and again. It's a great experience, even without the cat. Cheers- Earl From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 11:41:37 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 11:41:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <000001c4c820$350d9dd0$7ce4a5ce@D3JM7W21> Message-ID: >Don is correct; it's that bad (or good . . .). The porcelain throne itself >used to be tilted 20 degrees from vertical because the floor was caving in, >and one had to use a seat belt in there to keep from falling off. Glueing sandpaper on the seat will keep you from sliding off without the need of a seat belt. If you forget the seat belt before standing up, you may become a little...hmmm... burdened. Cheers From Docia1154 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 13:10:27 2004 From: Docia1154 at aol.com (Docia1154@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 11 13:10:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Kudos, Aaron Message-ID: <1e9.2e89a3b5.2ec52f43@aol.com> amen In a message dated 11/11/2004 10:59:32 AM Central Standard Time, LarryRush@worldnet.att.net writes: I would like to express my thanks to Aaron for a fine job running this list. It was especially nice during the last election not to have had to put up with the inevitable political flame wars that would have erupted without his superlative efforts in administering this list, with it's varied membership. As many will remember, the last Rockhounds discussion list succumbed due to the unending flames and side discussions that caused a lot of dissent. Thanks, Aaron, for not allowing that to happen here. I, for one, really appreciate your diligent efforts! Larry Rush --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Gslrocks at aol.com Thu Nov 11 13:21:11 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 11 13:21:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Message-ID: <68.48786ea2.2ec531c7@aol.com> lol well floor beams, floor and everything else was replaced that monday..err tuesday. The throne room is now worthy of all who care to partake.. but you get a nice view of fluorescents all over the house and garage during the day and the night time is saved for wandering the yard, driveway and racks of fluorescent materialthat does not need to be stored indoors. Just got another rack and 150 flats to fill before the snow flys... anyone coming over to help? You can follow me back after the FMS meeting on saturday...ROFL Greg Lesinski GSLROCKS 4726 Porter Center Rd. Lewiston NY 14092 Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books website www.gslrocks.com GSLROCKS@AOL.COM 716-754-9729 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 13:32:49 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 13:32:52 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Kudos, Aaron In-Reply-To: <1e9.2e89a3b5.2ec52f43@aol.com> Message-ID: Exactly my idea, Larry. I, being an "opinionated outsider", was invited to discuss American politics and the election theme off list by a member of the list. It was an interesting experience and it ended by the both of us respectfully "agreeing to disagree" ;-))) I learned however how difficult it is to NOT hurt each others beliefs and convictions by discussing these things through an only "semi-fleeting" medium such as e-mail. It was wise of Aaron to stay ahead of matters. Kudos indeed. Cheers Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Docia1154@aol.com Verzonden: donderdag 11 november 2004 22:10 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Kudos, Aaron amen In a message dated 11/11/2004 10:59:32 AM Central Standard Time, LarryRush@worldnet.att.net writes: I would like to express my thanks to Aaron for a fine job running this list. It was especially nice during the last election not to have had to put up with the inevitable political flame wars that would have erupted without his superlative efforts in administering this list, with it's varied membership. As many will remember, the last Rockhounds discussion list succumbed due to the unending flames and side discussions that caused a lot of dissent. Thanks, Aaron, for not allowing that to happen here. I, for one, really appreciate your diligent efforts! Larry Rush --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From tjokela at execulink.com Thu Nov 11 13:37:12 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Thu Nov 11 13:37:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Google Indexing References: Message-ID: <003d01c4c836$9ad0a250$6401a8c0@Junior> Hey Aaron, I appreciate your taking care of the list. I can only imagine the time you've spent on all the various technical issues. The list is a great source of fun and information, so thanks! Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Aaron Fox" To: "Rockhounds mailing list" Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:36 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Google Indexing > After receiving about 50 responses, I've made a decision. The vote is > approximately 2:1 (36 to 17) for continuing to allow Google to index the > Rockhounds archives. In general, respondants have generally indicated > that the access to information provided > > I have, however, sent a reasonably nasty letter to Google about their > software ignoring fairly obvious META tags and the robots.txt file. Not > the way for a good company to behave. > > I will be modifying the Python module (with Drizzle's permission > and help) within Pipermail to add some additional obsfucation to the email > headers. This will, however, not affect email addresses in the message > body. > > CAVEATS > ------- > 1) Within the next year or so, Rockhounds will most likely move to a > colocated server. A group of us is arranging to rent a virtual server from > a colocation company to give us greater flexibility to run servers (Jabber > IM, Apache, a BZFlag server, and highly customized Postfix | ClamAV | > Spamassassin mail accounts). > > When this happens, I'll have more direct control over the mailing list > software and the archiving software. The archives will become fully > indexed and searchable, and, at that point, I can look at writing perl > scripts to parse the messages and further obsfucate the email addresses in > the archive files. > > 2) Spam. So far, there haven't been any widespread reports of spammers > obtaining addresses from the archives (a little obscure). If this changes > and is documentable, we'll re-address the decision. > > 3) I will be out of the country Nov 20 to February 5. List administration > may be spotty during that time. If you have problems, please be patient; > it may be a few days before I can get to you. > > Thanks, all. Back to rockhounding. All comments - flames to me off-list, > please. > > Aaron > Rockhounds Admin > > -- > afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox > FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your > computer. Press any key to reboot > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 14:41:14 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 14:41:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <68.48786ea2.2ec531c7@aol.com> Message-ID: >The throne room is now worthy of all who care to partake.. No, get real??? You installed those thingies that dangle from the ceiling like in the subway cars... What's their name... the things you hang on to keep upright (LMAO) >but you get a nice view of fluorescents all over the house and garage during the day >and the night time is saved for wandering the yard, driveway and racks of >fluorescent materialthat does not need to be stored indoors. Just got another rack >and 150 flats to fill before the snow flys... anyone coming over to help? You >can follow me back after the FMS meeting on saturday...ROFL NOW you got my attention... I'm even a little jealous ;-))) Glow'm Axel From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Thu Nov 11 14:52:44 2004 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Thu Nov 11 14:52:58 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, "Strap Hangers". GcB > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Axel Emmermann > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 4:41 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > > > >The throne room is now worthy of all who care to partake.. > > No, get real??? You installed those thingies that dangle from > the ceiling like in the subway cars... What's their name... > the things you hang on to keep upright (LMAO) ..... From kahako at aloha.net Thu Nov 11 15:28:57 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Thu Nov 11 14:59:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041111132552.02a59e20@mail.aloha.net> At 12:52 PM 11/11/2004, Gary Brown wrote: >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, >"Strap Hangers". > >...thingies that dangle from > > the ceiling like in the subway cars... What's their name... > > the things you hang on to keep upright (LMAO) >Axel OK, so now tell me what LMAO means! Aloha, Kitty From morningstar at att.net Thu Nov 11 15:07:51 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Thu Nov 11 15:04:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041111132552.02a59e20@mail.aloha.net> References: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <6.1.2.0.0.20041111132552.02a59e20@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <4193F0C7.6030002@att.net> Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > OK, so now tell me what LMAO means! laughing my a** off From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 15:11:24 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 15:11:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: Gary wrote: >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, >"Strap Hangers". Hence the name for people clinging to the strap and fighting to stay on the throne: .rap hangers Please replace the dot by any letter of your choice as long as it's a "C"... NOw how did we get here? Oh yes, houses full of fluorescent minerals... Any coprolites on your shelves, Greg??? Come on, get us back on topic, please ;-))) From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 11 15:18:43 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 11 15:18:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041111132552.02a59e20@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: Oh, Kitty... I believe it is short for "launching my amateurish obfuscations" but I'm not sure. Maybe Don has a point but I don't see how one can laugh "an animal of the horse family which is smaller than a horse and has longer ears and a braying call off". This American slang is more difficult than I thought. Cheers Axel (going to bed now with new mental images and a slight frown) -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Kitty & Bill Heacox Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 0:29 Aan: gbrown@catspaw-minerals.com; Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum At 12:52 PM 11/11/2004, Gary Brown wrote: >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, >"Strap Hangers". > >...thingies that dangle from > > the ceiling like in the subway cars... What's their name... > > the things you hang on to keep upright (LMAO) >Axel OK, so now tell me what LMAO means! Aloha, Kitty _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From johnjold at comcast.net Thu Nov 11 15:31:47 2004 From: johnjold at comcast.net (John Joldersma) Date: Thu Nov 11 15:31:50 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <4193F0C7.6030002@att.net> References: <200411112252.iABMqvf7011469@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <6.1.2.0.0.20041111132552.02a59e20@mail.aloha.net> <4193F0C7.6030002@att.net> Message-ID: If any of you visited Krissy the Spammer's website (she afflicted several rock groups last Spring) You would have found her favorite ROTFLMAO. I was too dense to figure out that that meant rolling on the floor laughing my a** off. The fellow who clued me in started by saying, "I am really ashamed that I know this!" On Nov 11, 2004, at 6:07 PM, Don H wrote: > Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > >> OK, so now tell me what LMAO means! > > laughing my a** off > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From geenet2 at mchsi.com Thu Nov 11 20:16:26 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Thu Nov 11 20:16:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum References: Message-ID: <002001c4c86e$612b4540$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Methinks the list is taking a night off, or......just releasing all the tension from the elections... Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: ; "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:11 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > Gary wrote: > > >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, > >"Strap Hangers". > > Hence the name for people clinging to the strap and fighting to stay on the > throne: .rap hangers > Please replace the dot by any letter of your choice as long as it's a "C"... > NOw how did we get here? Oh yes, houses full of fluorescent minerals... Any > coprolites on your shelves, Greg??? Come on, get us back on topic, please > ;-))) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From johnjold at comcast.net Thu Nov 11 20:38:58 2004 From: johnjold at comcast.net (John Joldersma) Date: Thu Nov 11 20:38:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <002001c4c86e$612b4540$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> References: <002001c4c86e$612b4540$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: > Come on, get us back on topic, please ;-))) Does anybody remember the topic? > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 11 20:45:46 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 11 20:42:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum References: <200411111721.iABHLbue022133@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <41943F26.2090@Tomaszewski.net> Gary Brown wrote: > > "A house without rocks isn't a home." > > (c) 2004 GcB > > "A bathroom without rocks in it is just a bathroom." > > (c) 2004 ditto Above the towel rack, my basement bathroom has a 3x6 foot set of rock display shelves. Close the bathroom door and expose another wall case. So many rocks, so little space. Every laundry room should have rocks displayed on three walls (windows block the fourth side). Kreigh From jr50wv at yahoo.com Fri Nov 12 04:21:18 2004 From: jr50wv at yahoo.com (J. R. Hodel) Date: Fri Nov 12 04:21:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rocks everywhere.... Message-ID: <20041112122118.22664.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> ...42! Hi all, I was fascinated by the image of the throne listing at however-many degrees that one needed a seatbelt! At first when someone mentioned having rocks in their bathroom I began to feel deprived, but then I remembered that there are several fossils embedded in the grout at the foot of a glass block wall between the shower and the throne. One is a turtle coprolite, and don't ask me how Dan determined that identification. I also want to applaud the management of the Rockhounds list, I'm a computer professional, and I know how hard a job it is to manage any system! Regarding politics, I remain amazed that people....well, I won't go there, even tho it's really hard not to. Many crystals are naturally fluorescent, and I belive that corundum is one that does occasionally glow in the dark. Perhaps, tho, it should be cleaned vigorously to be sure it isn't contaminated. I have some natural rubies that glow brightly. That effect could be spotty because the trace impurities were available sometimes and not others, or in a different ratio ot times. and 42 is the answer, now I just need the question! JR in West Virginia. Amusingly, I typed this whole email in a page with someone else's email address, and only noticed at the last moment. He would have been surprised! JR __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Fri Nov 12 04:51:13 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Nov 12 04:51:16 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rocks everywhere.... In-Reply-To: <20041112122118.22664.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: JR wrote >I have >some natural rubies that glow brightly. That effect >could be spotty because the trace impurities were >available sometimes and not others, or in a different >ratio ot times. or twinning! Especially visible in rubys from Priler, Macedonia (FRY)... the multiple question is 42 is: a) the number of degrees that your throne is tilted b) the number of rooms in your house that are filled with rocks c) your age d) the sum of Si and Al atoms in the unit cell of paulingite-Ca. e) atomic number of molybdenum Cheers Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens J. R. Hodel Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 13:21 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] Rocks everywhere.... ...42! Hi all, I was fascinated by the image of the throne listing at however-many degrees that one needed a seatbelt! At first when someone mentioned having rocks in their bathroom I began to feel deprived, but then I remembered that there are several fossils embedded in the grout at the foot of a glass block wall between the shower and the throne. One is a turtle coprolite, and don't ask me how Dan determined that identification. I also want to applaud the management of the Rockhounds list, I'm a computer professional, and I know how hard a job it is to manage any system! Regarding politics, I remain amazed that people....well, I won't go there, even tho it's really hard not to. Many crystals are naturally fluorescent, and I belive that corundum is one that does occasionally glow in the dark. Perhaps, tho, it should be cleaned vigorously to be sure it isn't contaminated. I have some natural rubies that glow brightly. That effect could be spotty because the trace impurities were available sometimes and not others, or in a different ratio ot times. and 42 is the answer, now I just need the question! JR in West Virginia. Amusingly, I typed this whole email in a page with someone else's email address, and only noticed at the last moment. He would have been surprised! JR __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Fri Nov 12 06:47:25 2004 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Fri Nov 12 06:47:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Way Cool Martian Image In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200411121447.iACElh2e025537@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Now THIS is a way-cool Martian image: http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20041111a/opportuni ty_sol_280_navcam_view-B285R1.jpg (The above is ALL on one line... ) Here's a link to the main site: http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html Gary Brown Catspaw Minerals Home of MasMils/PLUS Mine Location Disk PS. Have you loaded the new Mozilla Firefox browser yet? Beats the heck out of IE! Go to: (http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/) to download. From buff1 at ptd.net Fri Nov 12 07:08:05 2004 From: buff1 at ptd.net (Dennis Buffenmyer) Date: Fri Nov 12 07:08:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Way Cool Martian Image In-Reply-To: <200411121447.iACElh2e025537@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200411121447.iACElh2e025537@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <4194D1D5.6060900@ptd.net> Yes, way cool but... are you eluding to the fact of erosional marks in the bank?? I guess one of my questions is how can you tell the differance between an atmospheric and dust erosional pattern and a water worn pattern?? This may be basic geology here but I may have missed the boat... and would be relative to my understanding of geologic processes here on terra firma..... Gary Brown wrote: > Now THIS is a way-cool Martian image: > >http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/press/opportunity/20041111a/opportuni >ty_sol_280_navcam_view-B285R1.jpg > >(The above is ALL on one line... ) > >Here's a link to the main site: > >http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/home/index.html > >Gary Brown >Catspaw Minerals >Home of MasMils/PLUS Mine Location Disk > >PS. Have you loaded the new Mozilla Firefox browser yet? Beats the heck >out of IE! Go to: (http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/) to download. > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Fri Nov 12 08:06:35 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:06:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <002001c4c86e$612b4540$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: In people's lepublic of China, we have lathel good technique fol leleaving tension flom election... Vely populal... As a result we don't have time to label our minerals properly: a friend of mine bought a sch?rl that is labeled "Dali Yunan" Anybody on the list who has a more complete locality? Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Jeanette Wimpee Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 5:16 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum Methinks the list is taking a night off, or......just releasing all the tension from the elections... Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: ; "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:11 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > Gary wrote: > > >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway riders, > >"Strap Hangers". > > Hence the name for people clinging to the strap and fighting to stay on the > throne: .rap hangers > Please replace the dot by any letter of your choice as long as it's a "C"... > NOw how did we get here? Oh yes, houses full of fluorescent minerals... Any > coprolites on your shelves, Greg??? Come on, get us back on topic, please > ;-))) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Fri Nov 12 08:14:27 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:14:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Carborundum References: Message-ID: <022a01c4c8d2$af223b00$6402a8c0@remains> that's really nice...lots of class, Axel. Did you ever think that there MAY be Asian, specificallyChinese, people on the list who wouldn't appreciate your sense of humour? as someone who's first language is probably NOT English, I would have thought you to be a little more understanding of other race's efforts in the pronounciation of English.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 9:06 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > In people's lepublic of China, we have lathel good technique fol leleaving > tension flom election... > Vely populal... > > As a result we don't have time to label our minerals properly: a friend of > mine bought a sch?rl that is labeled "Dali Yunan" > Anybody on the list who has a more complete locality? > > Axel > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Jeanette Wimpee > Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 5:16 > Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > > Methinks the list is taking a night off, or......just releasing all the > tension from the elections... > Jeanette > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Axel Emmermann" > To: ; "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list > for rock and gem collectors" > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:11 PM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > >> Gary wrote: >> >> >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway > riders, >> >"Strap Hangers". >> >> Hence the name for people clinging to the strap and fighting to stay on > the >> throne: .rap hangers >> Please replace the dot by any letter of your choice as long as it's a > "C"... >> NOw how did we get here? Oh yes, houses full of fluorescent minerals... > Any >> coprolites on your shelves, Greg??? Come on, get us back on topic, please >> ;-))) >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From erongo at mweb.co.za Fri Nov 12 08:39:14 2004 From: erongo at mweb.co.za (Willie Steyn) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:39:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] tension Message-ID: <007d01c4c8d6$25b238d0$8e91fea9@Namibiaminerals> Me think you should go and relieve your tension. English is not my native language and I`m not very fluent in it but I really enjoyed Axel`s "tongue in the cheek joke". We have the gggg..sound in our language , Afrikaans ,and I would love to hear somebody English pronouncing that. The guy working with me is Asian and he had a good laugh and said it made him home sick. Keep them coming Axel it leleaves tension. Willie South Africa --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Fri Nov 12 08:47:33 2004 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:47:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] tension In-Reply-To: <007d01c4c8d6$25b238d0$8e91fea9@Namibiaminerals> Message-ID: <200411121647.iACGlcsv016847@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Heh heh... "Creamora manure" was always what seemed to come out of my mouth when I tried to greet my buddies at ESCOM (aka EVKOM) in the morning when I was working in J'burg back in the late 70's. It reminds me of the joke where the punchline is: "Buy a donkey? Bloody hell man, I've already bought you a coat!" GcB > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Willie Steyn > Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:39 AM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] tension > > Me think you should go and relieve your tension. > English is not my native language and I`m not very fluent in > it but I really enjoyed Axel`s "tongue in the cheek joke". We > have the gggg..sound in our language , Afrikaans ,and I would > love to hear somebody English pronouncing that. The guy > working with me is Asian and he had a good laugh and said it > made him home sick. > Keep them coming Axel it leleaves tension. > Willie > South Africa From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Fri Nov 12 08:48:08 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:48:09 2004 Subject: xelRE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum In-Reply-To: <022a01c4c8d2$af223b00$6402a8c0@remains> Message-ID: My apologies to all that may feel offended... This is such an old joke (probably even older over here)that it has become "public domain" and without malicious intent. Maybe it's different on your side of the Atlantic. You can't say "election" over here without triggering someone to tell it... Asel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Michael Schmidt Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 17:14 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum that's really nice...lots of class, Axel. Did you ever think that there MAY be Asian, specificallyChinese, people on the list who wouldn't appreciate your sense of humour? as someone who's first language is probably NOT English, I would have thought you to be a little more understanding of other race's efforts in the pronounciation of English.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 9:06 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > In people's lepublic of China, we have lathel good technique fol leleaving > tension flom election... > Vely populal... > > As a result we don't have time to label our minerals properly: a friend of > mine bought a sch?rl that is labeled "Dali Yunan" > Anybody on the list who has a more complete locality? > > Axel > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Jeanette Wimpee > Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 5:16 > Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > > Methinks the list is taking a night off, or......just releasing all the > tension from the elections... > Jeanette > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Axel Emmermann" > To: ; "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list > for rock and gem collectors" > Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:11 PM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Carborundum > > >> Gary wrote: >> >> >They are called "A Strap", Axel . Hence the name for subway > riders, >> >"Strap Hangers". >> >> Hence the name for people clinging to the strap and fighting to stay on > the >> throne: .rap hangers >> Please replace the dot by any letter of your choice as long as it's a > "C"... >> NOw how did we get here? Oh yes, houses full of fluorescent minerals... > Any >> coprolites on your shelves, Greg??? Come on, get us back on topic, please >> ;-))) >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From john.f.alcorn at gte.net Fri Nov 12 08:46:30 2004 From: john.f.alcorn at gte.net (John Alcorn) Date: Fri Nov 12 08:48:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] collecting jasper and chalcedony near Ludlow, CA References: <20040929023627.590213384B@ws7-3.us4.outblaze.com> <415B50D2.9080704@comcast.net> Message-ID: <004501c4c8d7$2b85f660$6ec00304@ROSENANTE> This could be long and boring but it IS on topic..... My brother Dave and I had the opportunity to take a friend of mine, his wife, 10 year old daughter and 8 year old son out on a rockhounding trip. Since the kids had never gone on this type of adventure, I wanted to make sure they experienced success and had fun too. That translates to, they needed to find cool looking rocks and see some interesting stuff in the desert. The best place I could think of was Lavic Siding, a locality where nice looking jaspar and some chalcedony can be found. Even though Lavic has been well known for decades as a collection site it still has abundant, colorful chunks of multi-colored jaspar. It is quite suitable for tumbling and produces some really nice "treasures." Things were going smoothly after we met at a diner in Victorville, breakfasted, and gotten on Interstate 15 north, towards Barstow. Reaching there we turned east but left the I 40 interstate as soon as we could and got old Route 66, just past the Marine Base in Barstow, heading towards Needles, CA. We had some recent rains of over an inch, and the evidence was still obvious as the dry lakes(playas) were puddled with water, the mud looking deep and sticky. Elsewhere, vast tracts of basalt covered desert intersect the road at various points. Coming from an eruption of the Pisgah Crater the cinders are mined today for use in road construction and rail road bed maintenence. Just before the road crosses the interstate there is a dirt road that turns toward the south and leads to the collecting site. To paraphrase Burns, "The best laid plans of mice and men of times go awry." As we approached the rail crossing we found it had been removed. There was no way to cross the tracks at that spot or anywhere else that we could see. Lavic would have to wait for another day as we could not/would not cross the tracks there. We poked around a bit, watched a train go by, and decided to explore the north side of the freeway, a place I had read about but not visited. Into the trucks we got and set out back the way we came. We turned north onto Butterfly Mine Road and cruised for a mile or so before stopping and going on a hike. What a great weather package we got yesterday, it was balmy, not too anything, just right. Our hikes took us all on various paths, the kids with their various adults of choice and the dog with everybody. We did keep an eye on each other as the area is said to have open shafts although none were seen by us. There isn't a great quantity of jaspar in the area but a few pieces of really nice chalcedony, including several pink and orange, were found by each of us. Some of the rocks were beautifully shaped and patterned. The kids were delighted, as were their parents. The group decided that, with all the news about Mt. Saint Helens and constant news about the Hawaiian eruptions (thank you Mrs. Heacox), it was a good idea to show the kids a real volcano, with complete cinder cone. Fortunately there was one not too far away. Off to Amboy we went. Amboy is a town in the Mojave Desert. Calling Amboy a town is generous, the gas station(sometimes they have gas if you have enough cash), a diner and closed hotel, several railroad building make up the bulk of it. It does however, have a very nice, classic 600+ foot tall cinder cone with some hiking trails to the top. The kids and their parents were thrilled. More hikes were taken as well as photos for the proud mom and dad. As our day together ended and we were strarting to get ready to head home I gave the kids some tumbled jaspar and agate pieces I had collected on a previous trip to the area. You'd have thought I'd given them gold nuggets! We had a blast taking our friends out to experience the desert. The kids had a day they won't forget and the rockhounding community gets some new members. On the way home Dave and I poked around and found an alternative route into the Lavic site (probably could have gotten new directions from the internet though) so its on our list for the next trip this direction. john From erongo at mweb.co.za Fri Nov 12 09:28:16 2004 From: erongo at mweb.co.za (Willie Steyn) Date: Fri Nov 12 09:29:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] tension References: <200411121647.iACGlcsv016847@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00de01c4c8dc$ffda1860$8e91fea9@Namibiaminerals> Just loved that one. It is the best pronunciation of "Goeie more meneer" , Good morning sir, that I have yet heard. Thanks Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Brown" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 6:47 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] tension > Heh heh... > > "Creamora manure" was always what seemed to come out of my mouth when I > tried to greet my buddies at ESCOM (aka EVKOM) in the morning when I was > working in J'burg back in the late 70's. It reminds me of the joke where > the punchline is: > > "Buy a donkey? Bloody hell man, I've already bought you a coat!" > > GcB > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of >> Willie Steyn >> Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:39 AM >> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >> Subject: [Rockhounds] tension >> >> Me think you should go and relieve your tension. >> English is not my native language and I`m not very fluent in >> it but I really enjoyed Axel`s "tongue in the cheek joke". We >> have the gggg..sound in our language , Afrikaans ,and I would >> love to hear somebody English pronouncing that. The guy >> working with me is Asian and he had a good laugh and said it >> made him home sick. >> Keep them coming Axel it leleaves tension. >> Willie >> South Africa > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From DOMMELEN at DAL.CA Fri Nov 12 10:14:09 2004 From: DOMMELEN at DAL.CA (Ronnie Van Dommelen) Date: Fri Nov 12 10:14:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mineralogy of Nova Scotia - Relaunch Message-ID: <1100283249.4194fd7135330@my2.dal.ca> Hi All, Some of you may know that I maintain a website called The Mineralogy of Nova Scotia. It's basically an online workbook that I use to organize info relating to local minerals. Over the past year or so, I have been looking for a new spot to keep my website - something with more space and lifespan than my school web account. I have found a new spot and just finished moving things over. The new address is: http://nsminerals.atspace.com/ There are some major changes from the old site. A new look, more info, and lots more photos. As usual, I am always adding more material as I learn more, collect more, and have time. Because of this, some of the "Studies" pages are currently being reworked and there will be some technical errors (ex. fluorescence animation). For any other errors, please let me know so that they can be corrected. I hope you find it interesting! Ronnie Van Dommelen From j&gcornish at tenforward.com Fri Nov 12 10:49:18 2004 From: j&gcornish at tenforward.com (John and Gloria Cornish) Date: Fri Nov 12 10:49:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mineralogy of Nova Scotia - Relaunch In-Reply-To: <1100283249.4194fd7135330@my2.dal.ca> References: <1100283249.4194fd7135330@my2.dal.ca> Message-ID: <419505AE.90702@tenforward.com> Hi Ronnie and Everyone, For those of you who may have not seen his Nova Scotia website, your really missing something terrific here. Ronnie has really done a great job and I wish there were more regional sites out there of this caliber. Hey Ronnie, I'm still looking forward to that fluorescing barite and calcite photo upgrade! What a killer rock!! Take care everyone, see ya, John Ronnie Van Dommelen wrote: >Hi All, > >Some of you may know that I maintain a website called The Mineralogy of Nova >Scotia. It's basically an online workbook that I use to organize info relating >to local minerals. Over the past year or so, I have been looking for a new spot >to keep my website - something with more space and lifespan than my school web >account. I have found a new spot and just finished moving things over. The >new address is: > >http://nsminerals.atspace.com/ > >There are some major changes from the old site. A new look, more info, and lots >more photos. As usual, I am always adding more material as I learn more, >collect more, and have time. Because of this, some of the "Studies" pages are >currently being reworked and there will be some technical errors (ex. >fluorescence animation). For any other errors, please let me know so that they >can be corrected. I hope you find it interesting! > >Ronnie Van Dommelen >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > From j&gcornish at tenforward.com Fri Nov 12 10:50:33 2004 From: j&gcornish at tenforward.com (John and Gloria Cornish) Date: Fri Nov 12 10:50:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] collecting jasper and chalcedony near Ludlow, CA In-Reply-To: <004501c4c8d7$2b85f660$6ec00304@ROSENANTE> References: <20040929023627.590213384B@ws7-3.us4.outblaze.com> <415B50D2.9080704@comcast.net> <004501c4c8d7$2b85f660$6ec00304@ROSENANTE> Message-ID: <419505F9.4010201@tenforward.com> Hey John, I just wanted to drop a quick note to thank you for your trip report. I enjoyed reading it this morning. All the very best, John John Alcorn wrote: > This could be long and boring but it IS on topic..... > > My brother Dave and I had the opportunity to take a friend of mine, > his wife, 10 year old daughter and 8 year old son out on a > rockhounding trip. Since the kids had never gone on this type of > adventure, I wanted to make sure they experienced success and had fun > too. That translates to, they needed to find cool looking rocks and > see some interesting stuff in the desert. The best place I could > think of was Lavic Siding, a locality where nice looking jaspar and > some chalcedony can be found. > Even though Lavic has been well known for decades as a collection > site it still has abundant, colorful chunks of multi-colored jaspar. > It is quite suitable for tumbling and produces some really nice > "treasures." Things were going smoothly after we met at a diner in > Victorville, breakfasted, and gotten on Interstate 15 north, towards > Barstow. Reaching there we turned east but left the I 40 interstate > as soon as we could and got old Route 66, just past the Marine Base in > Barstow, heading towards Needles, CA. We had some recent rains of > over an inch, and the evidence was still obvious as the dry > lakes(playas) were puddled with water, the mud looking deep and > sticky. Elsewhere, vast tracts of basalt covered desert intersect the > road at various points. Coming from an eruption of the Pisgah Crater > the cinders are mined today for use in road construction and rail road > bed maintenence. Just before the road crosses the interstate there is > a dirt road that turns toward the south and leads to the collecting site. > To paraphrase Burns, "The best laid plans of mice and men of times > go awry." As we approached the rail crossing we found it had been > removed. There was no way to cross the tracks at that spot or anywhere > else that we could see. Lavic would have to wait for another day as > we could not/would not cross the tracks there. We poked around a bit, > watched a train go by, and decided to explore the north side of the > freeway, a place I had read about but not visited. Into the trucks we > got and set out back the way we came. > We turned north onto Butterfly Mine Road and cruised for a mile or > so before stopping and going on a hike. What a great weather package > we got yesterday, it was balmy, not too anything, just right. Our > hikes took us all on various paths, the kids with their various adults > of choice and the dog with everybody. We did keep an eye on each > other as the area is said to have open shafts although none were seen > by us. There isn't a great quantity of jaspar in the area but a few > pieces of really nice chalcedony, including several pink and orange, > were found by each of us. Some of the rocks were beautifully shaped > and patterned. The kids were delighted, as were their parents. > The group decided that, with all the news about Mt. Saint Helens and > constant news about the Hawaiian eruptions (thank you Mrs. Heacox), it > was a good idea to show the kids a real volcano, with complete cinder > cone. Fortunately there was one not too far away. Off to Amboy we went. > Amboy is a town in the Mojave Desert. Calling Amboy a town is > generous, the gas station(sometimes they have gas if you have enough > cash), a diner and closed hotel, several railroad building make up the > bulk of it. It does however, have a very nice, classic 600+ foot tall > cinder cone with some hiking trails to the top. The kids and their > parents were thrilled. More hikes were taken as well as photos for > the proud mom and dad. > As our day together ended and we were strarting to get ready to head > home I gave the kids some tumbled jaspar and agate pieces I had > collected on a previous trip to the area. You'd have thought I'd > given them gold nuggets! We had a blast taking our friends out to > experience the desert. The kids had a day they won't forget and the > rockhounding community gets some new members. > On the way home Dave and I poked around and found an alternative > route into the Lavic site (probably could have gotten new directions > from the internet though) so its on our list for the next trip this > direction. > > john > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From arf at mc.net Fri Nov 12 12:45:32 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Fri Nov 12 12:48:49 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite Message-ID: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite may be something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine what this is so any other ideas will be welcome. I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed faces and a few polished cabs. Pics at http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the past two years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry country. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From tjokela at execulink.com Fri Nov 12 13:06:31 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Fri Nov 12 13:06:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> "Amazonite", properly called microcline, a member of the feldspar family, will demonstrate good cleavage, which is pretty distinctive. I don't see it in your pix, but it's nearly impossible to ID mins from pix. It's not hard to acquire a piece of feldspar to compare - a few bucks at a local show or eBay will get you a specimen. Have you tried asking folks in local clubs, mineral shows, museums, universities? Checked the Illinois issue of R&M and MR? (I think they've both done special issues on the state, if I remember correctly.) Dollars to donuts there's at least one field collecting guide to the state, if not a half dozen. Have you done the basic tests for hardness, solubility, cleavage, etc.? Posting pix online is about the least useful way to ID minerals; find an experienced local collector and I'm betting you'll get an ID in about ten seconds. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Schmidling" To: "aRockhounds" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:45 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite may be > something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine what > this is so any other ideas will be welcome. > > I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed faces > and a few polished cabs. Pics at > http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg > > These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the past > two > years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry country. > > js > > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From adrian at brentnall.fsnet.co.uk Fri Nov 12 13:55:21 2004 From: adrian at brentnall.fsnet.co.uk (Adrian Brentnall) Date: Fri Nov 12 13:58:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! References: <00b801c4c777$b5b23fd0$0300a8c0@ifriend> Message-ID: <061901c4c902$909f19c0$0300a8c0@ifriend> HI Again Firstly - thanks to everybody who replied to my plea for help. Strangely enough, I _had_ done some 'googling' before posting my request - and had also been in touch with several of the local bearing distributors in an attempt to find replacement bearings. They all came up against the 'obsolete part' brick wall.... The SKF site is certainly comprehensive - but, as in all things, the trick is knowing where to look, and what to ask for Eventually I contacted SKF UK's technical help - who couldn't have been more helpful. An exchange of emails and a digital picture later, they'd identified an equivalent part - and, once the part number was known, the local distributor was able to order a pair for delivery after the weekend - so it looks like 'problem solved'.... I hadn't thought of going straight to SKF's tech people - but that would seem to be the answer. Just in case anybody else is looking for replacement bearings for an elderly Beacon Star Combo - then the SKF replacement appears to be YET 204-012.... ...and they seem to be about 13 UK pounds each + TAX - which is a great improvement over what Diamond Pacific quoted me ($90 each!).. Thanks all Adrian Suffolk UK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Brentnall" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 10:50 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Intro & Beacon Star bearings problem! > Hi All > Firstly - a brief 'about me' - as requested. > I'm Adrian, currently living in Suffolk, in the extreme East of the UK - > but born & bred in Cornwall - where I developed an interest in mineralogy > & rockhounding from an early age. > Haven't done much in terms of 'rocks' for a good few years - but now > rekindling an interest - particularly in a little light slabbing, cabbing > & polishing - partly for fun and partly to include in my stained-glass > artwork. > > With this in mind I treated myself to a second-hand Beacon Star > saw/grind/polish combo - which was auctioned on Ebay. Final price was > reasonable, even taking the shipping costs (USA - UK) into account. Slight > trouble is that the bearings appear to be a bit 'tired' - quite noisy & > with a fair bit of 'slop'.... > > ....so - I'm looking for some replacement bearings - ideally in the UK but > I'll buy them in the USA if necessary. The original bearings seem to be > marked > > SKF 454204r012 > > A quick check with a vernier shows it to have the following measurements > > Internal diameter 0.75" > Maximum outer diameter 1.862" > Width of outer bearing housing 0.590" > Width of inner 0.852" > > It seems to be very difficult to locate an equivalent item here in the > UK - managed to find some metric bearings very cheaply (washing machine > spares !) - but they were imperial - and attempt so shim from 22mm down to > the 19mm / .75" shaft were not very successful. (Can't win 'em all !) > > In did get in touch with the people who bought out Beacon Star - and > they've apparently located and equivalent SKF part - but they're $92 > each! - plus shipping - which is beyond a joke.... > > So - can any kind soul recommend an alternative - I'd love to get this old > combo unit back up & running again. Kind of fulfilling a teenage dream - > when I was active in rockhounding I couldn't afford anything more > high-tech than a rock tumbler - so it's partly a nostalgia trip! > > Many thanks in advance > Adrian > Suffolk UK > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Fri Nov 12 13:55:11 2004 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Fri Nov 12 15:56:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Illinois References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <001b01c4c902$4db45d00$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Jack, I'm curious where in northern Illinois you are. I have several relatives in the area and I visit whenever I can (not often enough) but haven't done much rockhounding there since I was a kid. My initial rockhound experience was collecting crinoid stem segments on the beaches of Lake Michigan and in the limestone gravel along railroad tracks. A few years back Julie and I found some galena along the Mississippi River near (duh) Galena, IL. I've got a nephew in Rockford that I'm due to visit sometime soon. Any sites near there? You also mentioned the possible serpentinite specimens that you have. Is that from Illinois? Former Land Of Lincolnite John D. Siebel Santa, Idaho john@pandemoniumgraphics.com www.pandemoniumgraphics.com From arf at mc.net Fri Nov 12 16:38:06 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Fri Nov 12 17:24:28 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <00f401c4c91f$867d1510$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Tim Jokela Jr." > "Amazonite", properly called microcline, a member of the feldspar family, > will demonstrate good cleavage The question is, is all microcline.... amazonite? > Have you tried asking folks in local clubs, mineral shows, museums, > universities? As I said in a previous posting, I took a few pieces to a local show and if I asked "could this be Amazonite?" the response always was ... yes. If I said what is this... I got mumbles. > Have you done the basic tests for hardness, solubility, > cleavage, etc.? Yes, no, no. How does one test for cleavage? > Posting pix online is about the least useful way to ID minerals; find an > experienced local collector and I'm betting you'll get an ID in about ten > seconds.... No doubt but how do you find an expeienced local collector? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 12 17:24:48 2004 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Fri Nov 12 17:24:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <20041113012449.44150.qmail@web51002.mail.yahoo.com> Jack, I missed the northern Illinois part when I replied earlier. Are you anywhere near DuPage County? If so, stop by the Mineralogy Study Group of ESCONI's meeting tomorrow night (Saturday) at the College of SuPage in Glen Ellyn, Bldg. K, Room 161 at 7:30 PM. The members, including me, will be glad to look. Jim Daly > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack Schmidling" > To: "aRockhounds" > Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:45 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > > > > It has come to my attention that what I have been > calling Amazonite may be > > something else. It has been rather frustrating > trying to determine what > > this is so any other ideas will be welcome. > > > > I have posted a picture with several stones as > found and some sawed faces > > and a few polished cabs. Pics at > > http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg > > > > These stones and a few more were found in our > vegie garden over the past > > two > > years. Location is northern Illinois and this is > gravel quarry country. > > > > js > > > > > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > http://schmidling.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com From scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com Fri Nov 12 17:27:23 2004 From: scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) Date: Fri Nov 12 17:34:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Stibnite-Included Quartz specimens now available- Message-ID: <010901c4c91f$ef683690$93104ed1@gbm> Hello all, I have started posting the best Bottomley prospect specimens that I have so far collected- http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite%20Included%20Quartz%20for%20Sale%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From mosasaur47 at msn.com Fri Nov 12 17:44:52 2004 From: mosasaur47 at msn.com (Kenneth Quinn) Date: Fri Nov 12 17:46:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> <00f401c4c91f$867d1510$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: > > The question is, is all microcline.... amazonite? No - in fact, amazonite is definitely rare whereas microcline is fairly common; it is usually off-white or a very light shade of brown (say, tan). Microcline has a hardness of 6, and would scratch most steels. Testing for cleavage is easy; break the specimen! For microcline, the prominent cleavage faces would meet at an angle that is a frog hair away from 90 degrees - thus the name, which means small angle. That distinguishes it from orthoclase, which has a 90 degree cleavage. Kenneth Quinn From arf at mc.net Fri Nov 12 20:01:43 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Fri Nov 12 20:57:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior><00f401c4c91f$867d1510$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <011801c4c93d$4a2519f0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Kenneth Quinn" > Testing for cleavage is easy; break the specimen! Not sure what you mean by "break" it but it does not soundlike something I want to do to a beautiful piece of rough. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From arf at mc.net Fri Nov 12 21:00:53 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Fri Nov 12 21:00:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <20041113012449.44150.qmail@web51002.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <011e01c4c93d$c41c6600$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Jim Daly" > I missed the northern Illinois part when I replied > earlier. Are you anywhere near DuPage County? I am in Marengo. stop by the Mineralogy Study Group of ESCONI's meeting > tomorrow night (Saturday) at the College of SuPage in > Glen Ellyn, Bldg. K, Room 161 at 7:30 PM. The members, > including me, will be glad to look. Thanks for the offer but I just have a hell of a time motivating myself to go anywhere. Do you make house calls? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From arf at mc.net Fri Nov 12 21:03:41 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Fri Nov 12 21:04:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Illinois References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <001b01c4c902$4db45d00$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Message-ID: <013201c4c93e$46a5e8d0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "John Siebel" > I've got a nephew in Rockford that I'm due to visit sometime soon. Any sites near > there? Don't know of any other than my garden. I am in Marengo, midway between Rockford and Elgin. > You also mentioned the possible serpentinite specimens that you have. Is > that from Illinois? Well, it is now but I presume the glaciers brought it here. It is quite common if that is really what it is. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Nov 13 03:34:30 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Nov 13 03:34:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds]WAS Carborundum now Chinese label In-Reply-To: Message-ID: >ROTFLMAO. I was too dense to figure out that that meant I once, in an inspired mood, used: ROFWFTEPCGFAIPODFL Nobody understood that it meant; rolling on floor with face turning egg-plant color gasping for air in puddle of drool from laughing. Now back on topic: doe anyone have a clue where "Dali Yunan" is? It 's somewhere in China and they find schorl (tourmaline) there. Cheers Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens John Joldersma Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 0:32 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Carborundum If any of you visited Krissy the Spammer's website (she afflicted several rock groups last Spring) You would have found her favorite ROTFLMAO. I was too dense to figure out that that meant rolling on the floor laughing my a** off. The fellow who clued me in started by saying, "I am really ashamed that I know this!" On Nov 11, 2004, at 6:07 PM, Don H wrote: > Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > >> OK, so now tell me what LMAO means! > > laughing my a** off > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 13 06:49:05 2004 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Sat Nov 13 06:49:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <011e01c4c93d$c41c6600$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <20041113144905.20914.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> Jack, No house calls- I'm about 100 miles the other side of Glen Ellyn, in Indiana. I'll check at the meeting tonight to see if there are any knowledgeable members up your way. Jim --- Jack Schmidling wrote: > From: "Jim Daly" > > > I missed the northern Illinois part when I replied > > earlier. Are you anywhere near DuPage County? > > I am in Marengo. > > > stop by the Mineralogy Study Group of ESCONI's > meeting > > tomorrow night (Saturday) at the College of SuPage > in > > Glen Ellyn, Bldg. K, Room 161 at 7:30 PM. The > members, > > including me, will be glad to look. > > Thanks for the offer but I just have a hell of a > time motivating myself to > go anywhere. > > Do you make house calls? > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > http://schmidling.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com From arf at mc.net Sat Nov 13 11:24:54 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Sat Nov 13 11:25:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <20041113144905.20914.qmail@web51007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <01aa01c4c9b6$8d1522e0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Daly" > No house calls- I'm about 100 miles the other side of > Glen Ellyn, in Indiana. I'll check at the meeting > tonight to see if there are any knowledgeable members > up your way. Just kidding but it would be nice to know someone in the area. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From rockcurrier at cs.com Sat Nov 13 17:19:01 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Sat Nov 13 17:18:52 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Amazonite is the blue and blue green variety of microcline feldspar. The color comes from lead. This was discovered and verified by Dr. Gene Foord of the USGS some years ago. Gene said he could look at a piece and estimate the lead concentration. I had not the slightest doubt that he could do it, but there is probably no one left alive that can now do that. There are a number of good amazonite localities around the world and I think they are all found in pegmatites. As far as collectors are concerned, the various Colorado localities have produced the best specimens. By best I mean amazonite crystals that have the darkest color and associated with dark smoky quartz crystals. The best of these are striking specimens indeed. Some of these have been sold for more than $50,000 each. The locality around Crystal Peak in Teller county is still producing specimens today. The classical collection technique was/is to walk the hills keeping an eye on the ground for smoky quartz crystals or quartz crystal fragments and follow the float back up hill till you found where it came from and then start digging. Many times you would encounter collapsed pockets full of quartz and amazonite. Almost all of the specimens found in this area are stained with iron minerals, sometimes quite heavily necessitating extensive cleaning in oxalic acid. Until recently, amazonite crystals from localities other than the Colorado were quite rare. Ethiopia has recently started to produce amazonite crystals. These specimens are mostly of a lighter color than the Colorado specimens, frequently a sort of baby blue color. They are also found in pegmatites associated with the granitic rocks of the region. They are associated with albite and smoky quartz crystals. The size of the crystals from the pegs near Konso in the southern part of the country can be much larger than those from Colorado. I saw one crystal of amazonite that must have been nearly a foot in diameter, and I also saw crystals of smoky quartz longer than a foot and at least six inches in diameter. Larger crystals have/probably are found. I saw a little grungy fluorite from the pegs here but hardly anything else. The area that produces the crystals is quite extensive, probably larger than the area in Colorado that produces amazonite. The specimens are dug exclusively by the tribal farmers on their steep hillside farms. They find quartz crystals laying in the soil or fragments of amazonite and start digging. The material I have seen thus far is not as heavily stained with iron minerals as the Colorado material typically is. If you are interested in amazoite for cutting material, the material from the Kola Peninsula and that from the pegmatites in Minas Gerais are probably the best. The color of the Brazilian material ranges from a so so blue to the most intense blue that I have ever seen in amazonite. One year, a dealer in Governador Valaderas was offering to sell the best quality fror $50 per kg. At the time I thought it was an outrageous price, and now I am sorry that I did not buy a few kgs of the material because I have not seen any of that quality before or since. Usually the amzaonite from Brazil is not abundant, and the pieces are not large enough to make lapidary objects larger than your fist. If you want large material you will need to get some of the Kola peninsula material. They have a pegmatite there that produces massive dark blue amazonite up to the size of refigerators. Containers of this material have been shipped to China for the lapidary factories. During the summer, the amazonite can be hauled out over the frozen tundra to regular roads. During the summer, the ground is so swampy that the only way it can be gotten out is by hellicopter. This last bit of information was word of mouth communication from Gean Foord who spent time at the locality. The Russian material is easy to spot because almost all of it has more or less regular tiny white flakes of albite? The Chinese have also been selling items made from a pale blue material that they say is from China, but I really don't know anything aobut this material. From arf at mc.net Sat Nov 13 17:37:38 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Sat Nov 13 17:39:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Rock Currier" > By best I mean amazonite crystals that have the darkest color and associated with dark smoky quartz > crystals. I think I need a review of just what is meant by "crystal". The word congers up all sorts of mental pictures but none of them look like the stuff I have which seem to be better described as rocks. See http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg Are these pieces of large crystals or something else entirely? The stuff obviously makes beautiful gems and it is hard to believe that one could buy it by the kilo, particularly as I have never seen it on any of the rough sales sites. Is the "crystal" stuff transparent? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From kahako at aloha.net Sat Nov 13 18:53:14 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Nov 13 18:24:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Subject Change (Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12) In-Reply-To: <020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> <020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041113165008.02a59810@mail.aloha.net> Small reminder to those on the Digest version of this list: Please change the Subject to something relevant to the topic. "Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12" means nothing to the rest of us. Thanks, Kitty From j&gcornish at tenforward.com Sat Nov 13 18:41:44 2004 From: j&gcornish at tenforward.com (John and Gloria Cornish) Date: Sat Nov 13 18:41:42 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 In-Reply-To: <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <4196C5E8.4020109@tenforward.com> Hi Rock and Everyone, Great comments as usual. Thanks for taking the time! John Rock Currier wrote: >Amazonite is the blue and blue green variety of microcline feldspar. The >color comes from lead. This was discovered and verified by Dr. Gene Foord of >the USGS some years ago. Gene said he could look at a piece and estimate the >lead concentration. I had not the slightest doubt that he could do it, but >there is probably no one left alive that can now do that. There are a number >of good amazonite localities around the world and I think they are all found >in pegmatites. As far as collectors are concerned, the various Colorado >localities have produced the best specimens. By best I mean amazonite >crystals that have the darkest color and associated with dark smoky quartz >crystals. The best of these are striking specimens indeed. Some of these >have been sold for more than $50,000 each. The locality around Crystal Peak >in Teller county is still producing specimens today. The classical >collection technique was/is to walk the hills keeping an eye on the ground >for smoky quartz crystals or quartz crystal fragments and follow the float >back up hill till you found where it came from and then start digging. Many >times you would encounter collapsed pockets full of quartz and amazonite. >Almost all of the specimens found in this area are stained with iron >minerals, sometimes quite heavily necessitating extensive cleaning in oxalic >acid. Until recently, amazonite crystals from localities other than the >Colorado were quite rare. Ethiopia has recently started to produce amazonite >crystals. These specimens are mostly of a lighter color than the Colorado >specimens, frequently a sort of baby blue color. They are also found in >pegmatites associated with the granitic rocks of the region. They are >associated with albite and smoky quartz crystals. The size of the crystals >from the pegs near Konso in the southern part of the country can be much >larger than those from Colorado. I saw one crystal of amazonite that must >have been nearly a foot in diameter, and I also saw crystals of smoky quartz >longer than a foot and at least six inches in diameter. Larger crystals >have/probably are found. I saw a little grungy fluorite from the pegs here >but hardly anything else. The area that produces the crystals is quite >extensive, probably larger than the area in Colorado that produces >amazonite. The specimens are dug exclusively by the tribal farmers on their >steep hillside farms. They find quartz crystals laying in the soil or >fragments of amazonite and start digging. The material I have seen thus far >is not as heavily stained with iron minerals as the Colorado material >typically is. > If you are interested in amazoite for cutting material, the material >from the Kola Peninsula and that from the pegmatites in Minas Gerais are >probably the best. The color of the Brazilian material ranges from a so so >blue to the most intense blue that I have ever seen in amazonite. One year, >a dealer in Governador Valaderas was offering to sell the best quality fror >$50 per kg. At the time I thought it was an outrageous price, and now I am >sorry that I did not buy a few kgs of the material because I have not seen >any of that quality before or since. Usually the amzaonite from Brazil is >not abundant, and the pieces are not large enough to make lapidary objects >larger than your fist. If you want large material you will need to get some >of the Kola peninsula material. They have a pegmatite there that produces >massive dark blue amazonite up to the size of refigerators. Containers of >this material have been shipped to China for the lapidary factories. During >the summer, the amazonite can be hauled out over the frozen tundra to >regular roads. During the summer, the ground is so swampy that the only way >it can be gotten out is by hellicopter. This last bit of information was >word of mouth communication from Gean Foord who spent time at the locality. >The Russian material is easy to spot because almost all of it has more or >less regular tiny white flakes of albite? The Chinese have also been selling >items made from a pale blue material that they say is from China, but I >really don't know anything aobut this material. > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > From cjkuo at verizon.net Sat Nov 13 19:14:50 2004 From: cjkuo at verizon.net (Jimmy Kuo) Date: Sat Nov 13 19:16:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <001e01c4c9f8$1cc5bd50$0c02a8c0@LOSJKUOLT2> Regarding lead as the principle color agent of amazonite, there's plenty of lead in NW Arizona. And I've found pegmatite there also. But no amazonite. How does it come about? Jimmy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rock Currier" To: Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:19 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 > Amazonite is the blue and blue green variety of microcline feldspar. The > color comes from lead. This was discovered and verified by Dr. Gene Foord of > the USGS some years ago. Gene said he could look at a piece and estimate the > lead concentration. I had not the slightest doubt that he could do it, but > there is probably no one left alive that can now do that. There are a number > of good amazonite localities around the world and I think they are all found > in pegmatites. As far as collectors are concerned, the various Colorado > localities have produced the best specimens. By best I mean amazonite > crystals that have the darkest color and associated with dark smoky quartz > crystals. The best of these are striking specimens indeed. Some of these > have been sold for more than $50,000 each. The locality around Crystal Peak > in Teller county is still producing specimens today. The classical > collection technique was/is to walk the hills keeping an eye on the ground > for smoky quartz crystals or quartz crystal fragments and follow the float > back up hill till you found where it came from and then start digging. Many > times you would encounter collapsed pockets full of quartz and amazonite. > Almost all of the specimens found in this area are stained with iron > minerals, sometimes quite heavily necessitating extensive cleaning in oxalic > acid. Until recently, amazonite crystals from localities other than the > Colorado were quite rare. Ethiopia has recently started to produce amazonite > crystals. These specimens are mostly of a lighter color than the Colorado > specimens, frequently a sort of baby blue color. They are also found in > pegmatites associated with the granitic rocks of the region. They are > associated with albite and smoky quartz crystals. The size of the crystals > from the pegs near Konso in the southern part of the country can be much > larger than those from Colorado. I saw one crystal of amazonite that must > have been nearly a foot in diameter, and I also saw crystals of smoky quartz > longer than a foot and at least six inches in diameter. Larger crystals > have/probably are found. I saw a little grungy fluorite from the pegs here > but hardly anything else. The area that produces the crystals is quite > extensive, probably larger than the area in Colorado that produces > amazonite. The specimens are dug exclusively by the tribal farmers on their > steep hillside farms. They find quartz crystals laying in the soil or > fragments of amazonite and start digging. The material I have seen thus far > is not as heavily stained with iron minerals as the Colorado material > typically is. > If you are interested in amazoite for cutting material, the material > from the Kola Peninsula and that from the pegmatites in Minas Gerais are > probably the best. The color of the Brazilian material ranges from a so so > blue to the most intense blue that I have ever seen in amazonite. One year, > a dealer in Governador Valaderas was offering to sell the best quality fror > $50 per kg. At the time I thought it was an outrageous price, and now I am > sorry that I did not buy a few kgs of the material because I have not seen > any of that quality before or since. Usually the amzaonite from Brazil is > not abundant, and the pieces are not large enough to make lapidary objects > larger than your fist. If you want large material you will need to get some > of the Kola peninsula material. They have a pegmatite there that produces > massive dark blue amazonite up to the size of refigerators. Containers of > this material have been shipped to China for the lapidary factories. During > the summer, the amazonite can be hauled out over the frozen tundra to > regular roads. During the summer, the ground is so swampy that the only way > it can be gotten out is by hellicopter. This last bit of information was > word of mouth communication from Gean Foord who spent time at the locality. > The Russian material is easy to spot because almost all of it has more or > less regular tiny white flakes of albite? The Chinese have also been selling > items made from a pale blue material that they say is from China, but I > really don't know anything aobut this material. > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From johnjold at comcast.net Sat Nov 13 19:52:14 2004 From: johnjold at comcast.net (John Joldersma) Date: Sat Nov 13 19:52:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <011e01c4c93d$c41c6600$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> References: <20041113012449.44150.qmail@web51002.mail.yahoo.com> <011e01c4c93d$c41c6600$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <9201DD75-35F0-11D9-B9BA-000A95D8C7A8@comcast.net> I have been looking for Princess Mine Amazonite. Near Bancroft, Ontario. with no luck. I did come up with these three. Enjoy! John http://www.smokycrystals.com/AMAZONITE.html http://www.mindat.org/min-184.html http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~adg/adg-psstimages.html#amazon From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sat Nov 13 21:47:50 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Nov 13 21:44:15 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite {was: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12} References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> <020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> Jack Schmidling wrote: > > From: "Rock Currier" > > > By best I mean amazonite crystals that have the darkest color and > associated with dark smoky quartz > > crystals. > > I think I need a review of just what is meant by "crystal". The word > congers up all sorts of mental pictures but none of them look like the stuff > I have which seem to be better described as rocks. Crystals can be rocks instead of the flashier clear stuff like quartz. Galena, Pyrite, Feldspars, and Calcite are good examples. Feldspars, like Calcite, tend to break into rhombohedrons (Galena and Pyrite into cubes). This is what is meant by cleavage, the breaking along smooth, regular surfaces. These cleaved surfaces are commonly known by the public as crystals. What you appear to have is amazonite in a massive form that has been broken/cleaved into chunks, but it is hard to tell from pictures, so it could be something else. Have you done a hardness and streak test yet? > > See http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg > > Are these pieces of large crystals or something else entirely? > > The stuff obviously makes beautiful gems and it is hard to believe that one > could buy it by the kilo, particularly as I have never seen it on any of the > rough sales sites. > > Is the "crystal" stuff transparent? > > js From horstwindisch at absamail.co.za Sun Nov 14 01:47:31 2004 From: horstwindisch at absamail.co.za (Horst Windisch) Date: Sun Nov 14 04:27:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <000401c4ca45$475f0420$a73e27c4@privatehome> Hi all, Your remark of identifying minerals from pictures requires a comment. A still less useful method of trying to ID them is by telephone!! "I have a yellow mineral in my hand, can you please tell me what this is?" (Speaking from experience) Horst----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Jokela Jr." To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > "Amazonite", properly called microcline, a member of the feldspar family, > will demonstrate good cleavage, which is pretty distinctive. I don't see > it in your pix, but it's nearly impossible to ID mins from pix. It's not > hard to acquire a piece of feldspar to compare - a few bucks at a local > show or eBay will get you a specimen. > > Have you tried asking folks in local clubs, mineral shows, museums, > universities? Checked the Illinois issue of R&M and MR? (I think they've > both done special issues on the state, if I remember correctly.) Dollars > to donuts there's at least one field collecting guide to the state, if not > a half dozen. Have you done the basic tests for hardness, solubility, > cleavage, etc.? > > Posting pix online is about the least useful way to ID minerals; find an > experienced local collector and I'm betting you'll get an ID in about ten > seconds. > > Cheers, > > Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com > Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com > The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com > Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack Schmidling" > To: "aRockhounds" > Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:45 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > > >> It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite may >> be >> something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine what >> this is so any other ideas will be welcome. >> >> I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed faces >> and a few polished cabs. Pics at http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg >> >> These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the past >> two >> years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry country. >> >> js >> >> >> PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm >> Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rik.dillen at skynet.be Sun Nov 14 07:52:50 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Nov 14 07:53:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite In-Reply-To: <001e01c4c9f8$1cc5bd50$0c02a8c0@LOSJKUOLT2> Message-ID: <000001c4ca62$01e69170$0100a8c0@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Jimmy Kuo *Sent: zondag 14 november 2004 4:15 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite * * Regarding lead as the principle color agent of amazonite, there's plenty of lead in NW Arizona. And I've found pegmatite there also. But no amazonite. How does it come about? >>>>> Even if I'm sceptical about the Pb/color relationship statement (see other reaction), don't confuse the supposition that there is a link between the color of amazonite and its Pb-concentration with the actual occurrence of amazonite. Both statements have nothing to do with eachother. Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From rik.dillen at skynet.be Sun Nov 14 07:52:50 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Nov 14 07:53:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 In-Reply-To: <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <000101c4ca62$025f43e0$0100a8c0@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Rock Currier *Sent: zondag 14 november 2004 2:19 *To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com *Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12 * * *Amazonite is the blue and blue green variety of microcline feldspar. The color comes from lead. This was discovered and verified by Dr. Gene Foord of the USGS some years ago. Gene said he could look at a piece and estimate the lead concentration. I had not the slightest doubt that he could do it, but there is probably no one left alive that can now do that. >>>>> Gene "said"... is there any publication ? I would like to see actual (analysed) concentrations of lead and the connection with the color. I must admit that I am VERY sceptic about that statement... any references to a publication ? Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From tjokela at execulink.com Sun Nov 14 08:09:35 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Sun Nov 14 08:09:30 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite {was: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12} References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com><01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5><020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> > Crystals can be rocks instead of the flashier clear stuff like quartz. > Galena, Pyrite, Feldspars, and Calcite are good examples. Er, no, crystals cannot be rocks. Quartz, galena, pyrite, feldspar, and calcite are all minerals. Let's not confuse the guy too much, please. Below is a simplified breakdown of minerals, crystals, and rocks. Bear in mind that definitions like this are relatively fluid, and opinions vary quite a bit. I don't really want to get into a debate about these definitions, it's been done. 1) "A mineral is an element or chemical compound that is normally crystalline and that has been formed as a result of geological processes." - E.H. Nickel 2) A crystal is a regular and repeated arrangement of atoms. (paraphrasing J.Sinkankas) 3) Rocks are composed of minerals. They don't form crystals like minerals do; eg. you'll never see a nice sharp marble crystal, or a perfect dodecahedron of basalt. (The above is highly simplified, and I'm leaving out some rather interesting technical intricacies, so to the experts out there, please don't flame me, I'm not interested in starting a debate.) Beginners are often confused about what's a rock and what's a mineral; I've found that it's a simple concept that is surprisingly hard to explain. Best way is to give examples; eg. granite is a very common rock that is generally composed of three different minerals: feldspar, quartz, and mica. Some rocks are composed of colorful minerals, and make interesting lapidary material, but by and large everything you see on display at a mineral show, all those shiny crystal clusters, are minerals. (Which is why the term "rockhound" makes no sense! To the general public anything lying on the ground is a rock, but "rockhounds" almost never actually collect rocks, they're generally of no interest unless you're a geologist.) Minerals make up rock, and mineral crystals are found within rocks; for example much of Southern Ontario is covered by a thick bed of dull brown limestone. Openings within the limestone are home to lovely crystals of celestine, fluorite, sphalerite, galena, calcite, dolomite, etc. Minerals and rocks have certain geological and chemical relationships; eg. this limestone is really simple stuff, home to under 30 minerals. A mineral like diamond will never be found in this rock, it is formed under entirely different conditions. I hope this helps a bit. I highly recommend you track down a copy of "Mineralogy" by John Sinkankas, it is an invaluable reference. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com From morningstar at att.net Sun Nov 14 08:16:06 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Sun Nov 14 08:12:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite In-Reply-To: <000001c4ca62$01e69170$0100a8c0@maxdata> References: <000001c4ca62$01e69170$0100a8c0@maxdata> Message-ID: <419784C6.50708@att.net> > Even if I'm sceptical about the Pb/color relationship statement (see other reaction), don't confuse the supposition that there At the Rochester Mineralogical Symposium two years ago, one of Skip Simmons grad students, Pam Rein, did a presentation on the color of amazonite (I rememberd that because it was right after mine): http://www.uno.edu/pegmatology/abstract/abstrein.html Enjoy, Divalent Don From morningstar at att.net Sun Nov 14 08:33:20 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Sun Nov 14 08:29:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite {was: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12} In-Reply-To: <001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com><01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5><020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> <001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <419788D0.3040703@att.net> Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > Er, no, crystals cannot be rocks. I think it's even simpler than you made it. Remember when we were new: we didn't know what is obvious to us now, that the *molecular building blocks* of minerals are crystalline (what are called the unit cells), even though the external appearance of a specimen may or may not have definite crystal faces. I think that needs to be specifically explained because it is the most fundamental fact in understanding what "crystalline" means. Jack (and others), It is like opening a box of Legos . . . well, when I was a kid anyway, when Legos consisted of blocks instead of model-like specific parts. None the less, this box contains various shapes, each with a regular form and a regular number of nubs and holes for connecting to other blocks. Gather all the little cubes, the ones with four nubs. Now, you could stack them together to build a very large and perfect cube that sits on your table. Perhaps this is a pyrite or fluorite. You can also stack them together in a random arragement that looks like modern art, and which is not recognizable as anything in particular. This is also pyrite or fluorite, and the structural building blocks are crystalline regular arrangements; however to the human eye on a large scale the form is not obviously "a crystal." So, whether you have a perfect freestanding hexagonal crystal of, say, quartz, or a vein filled with quartz, the molecular building blocks are still crystalline units of quartz just as the tiny regular Lego blocks are all the same when you take your model apart. Having said that, I hope this makes sense. It is oversimplified, but it is a good beginning for someone starting from scratch. Don From arf at mc.net Sun Nov 14 06:48:53 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Sun Nov 14 08:46:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior> <000401c4ca45$475f0420$a73e27c4@privatehome> Message-ID: <02d601c4ca69$716137b0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Horst Windisch" > Your remark of identifying minerals from pictures requires a comment. A > still less useful method of trying to ID them is by telephone!! "I have a > yellow mineral in my hand, can you please tell me what this is?" That is why I didn't just ask "what is my green stone". I took the trouble to post images of the rough stone, a few sliced surfaces and cut gems. I also mentioned hardness, greasyness and several other characteristics in previous messages. Probably not enough for a positive id but enough to eliminate lots of minerals and at least possibly a "looks like" sort of statement. I looked at the photos suggested in other links and they "look" a good deal like what I have. So to discredit photos out of hand is a bit pompous. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From Bozo5 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:11:35 2004 From: Bozo5 at aol.com (Bozo5@aol.com) Date: Sun Nov 14 09:11:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite Message-ID: <29.661ca936.2ec8ebc7@aol.com> Based on the photos, I guess Aventurine. Is that found around there? Flint --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From lanny at lrream.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:10 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Sun Nov 14 09:36:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite {was: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12} In-Reply-To: <001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com><01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5><020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> <001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: ... or a perfect dodecahedron of basalt. How true that statement is Tim. We all know basalt comes in long hexagonal prismatic crystals... OK, so just to keep the record clean, the columns are only cooling features of a lava flow, a rock structure, not crystals. Lanny From lanny at lrream.com Sun Nov 14 09:45:16 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Sun Nov 14 09:44:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite {was: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 12} In-Reply-To: <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> <020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Careful Kreigh, You are confusing things with your use of the term "rocks" in this case. Galena, pyrite, feldspars, and calcite are not rocks. And they don't have to be crystals either. They are minerals, and they are crystalline. But being crystalline does not mean each and every piece is a crystal. A crystal has a specific orderly shape, but minerals most often occur in irregular grains and lumps. A nice crystal is really a rarity and we have to work so hard and diligently to find one. Also, pyrite commonly is in cubes, but it has no cleavage and cannot be cleaved into a cube. Regards, Lanny > > Crystals can be rocks instead of the flashier clear stuff like quartz. > Galena, Pyrite, Feldspars, and Calcite are good examples. > > Feldspars, like Calcite, tend to break into rhombohedrons (Galena and > Pyrite into cubes). This is what is meant by cleavage, the breaking > along smooth, regular surfaces. These cleaved surfaces are commonly > known by the public as crystals. > > What you appear to have is amazonite in a massive form that has been > broken/cleaved into chunks, but it is hard to tell from pictures, so it > could be something else. Have you done a hardness and streak test yet? > > >> >> See http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg >> >> Are these pieces of large crystals or something else entirely? >> >> The stuff obviously makes beautiful gems and it is hard to believe >> that one >> could buy it by the kilo, particularly as I have never seen it on any >> of the >> rough sales sites. >> >> Is the "crystal" stuff transparent? >> >> js > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sun Nov 14 09:54:06 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Nov 14 09:54:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite In-Reply-To: <419784C6.50708@att.net> Message-ID: Hi my Divalent friend just glanced at proposed link and am now puzzled by contradictory data feeds... (yes, an "aaargh" would be appropriate here). Some amazonite will fluoresce medium or weak red under SW. Even more amazonite will do so when cooled below say -40?C. The activator is said to be Fe?+ (I don't remember 2+ or 3+ but it's unimportant). Anyway, you cannot have both Fe2+ and Fe3+ in one mineral and still expect the mineral to fluoresce since charge transfer will kill the fluorescence. Now if you have three valencies of lead present in the amazonite, would that not cause charge transfer between some of the lead and the iron? Or am I seeing things that aren't there (post Halloween stress syndrome???) Polyvalent Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Don H Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 17:16 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite > Even if I'm sceptical about the Pb/color relationship statement (see other reaction), don't confuse the supposition that there At the Rochester Mineralogical Symposium two years ago, one of Skip Simmons grad students, Pam Rein, did a presentation on the color of amazonite (I rememberd that because it was right after mine): http://www.uno.edu/pegmatology/abstract/abstrein.html Enjoy, Divalent Don _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From kahako at aloha.net Sun Nov 14 11:22:34 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sun Nov 14 10:53:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Replying to beginners...and courtesy Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041114092144.02e03400@mail.aloha.net> Thank you to all you experts who reply to beginners (and dummies like me) in a sensitive and informative manner. Tim Jokela, Don H., Kreigh, Earl, Pete, are examples that come to my mind at the moment (I know there are more) of people who generally give explanations that are clear, easy to understand, and not condescending or pompous. I also love the way most of us---most of the time---manage to remain courteous, even under stress. Someone once defined it to me: "Courtesy is made up of those conventions by which we avoid hurting each others feelings." Aloha, Kitty From rik.dillen at skynet.be Sun Nov 14 11:06:39 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Sun Nov 14 11:06:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite In-Reply-To: <419784C6.50708@att.net> Message-ID: <000c01c4ca7d$122369d0$0100a8c0@maxdata> Thanks, divalent Don ! This clears up the situation, euh... made clear to me that it isn't that clear or simple euh... you know what I mean ? Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Don H *Sent: zondag 14 november 2004 17:16 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Amazonite * * * *> Even if I'm sceptical about the Pb/color relationship statement (see *> other reaction), don't confuse the supposition that there * *At the Rochester Mineralogical Symposium two years ago, one of Skip *Simmons grad students, Pam Rein, did a presentation on the color of *amazonite (I rememberd that because it was right after mine): * *http://www.uno.edu/pegmatology/abstract/abstrein.html * *Enjoy, * *Divalent Don * * *_______________________________________________ *Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List *WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds *Subscription Services: *http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds * From horstwindisch at absamail.co.za Sun Nov 14 11:30:18 2004 From: horstwindisch at absamail.co.za (Horst Windisch) Date: Sun Nov 14 11:42:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c0@Junior><000401c4ca45$475f0420$a73e27c4@privatehome> <02d601c4ca69$716137b0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <000201c4ca82$06ccf0b0$503e27c4@privatehome> Hi Jack, I did NOT discredit photos; I was just adding to a remark made by a previous contributor who said that a photo is NOT an ideal method of identifying a mineral. All I said that the method I quoted is still WORSE than a photo ID. Do you catch on now? Horst ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Schmidling" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 4:48 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > From: "Horst Windisch" > >> Your remark of identifying minerals from pictures requires a comment. A >> still less useful method of trying to ID them is by telephone!! "I have a >> yellow mineral in my hand, can you please tell me what this is?" > > That is why I didn't just ask "what is my green stone". > > I took the trouble to post images of the rough stone, a few sliced > surfaces > and cut gems. I also mentioned hardness, greasyness and several other > characteristics in previous messages. Probably not enough for a positive > id > but enough to eliminate lots of minerals and at least possibly a "looks > like" sort of statement. > > I looked at the photos suggested in other links and they "look" a good > deal > like what I have. So to discredit photos out of hand is a bit pompous. > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockcurrier at cs.com Sun Nov 14 11:42:54 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Sun Nov 14 11:42:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 13 References: <200411140202.iAE22ZlZ026290@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <001401c4ca82$23371c30$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Dear JS By crystal I mean freestanding crystals that have grown in pockets in the pegmatites like the typical ubiquitos amethyst crystals you see an every gem and mineral show. (The amethyst grows in amygdaloidal cavieties in basalt, not in pegmatites) I have never seen any transparent amazonite. It is however translucent. Typically the last step in cleaning the specimens or in the lapidary process, they are diped in hot parafin and the excess is wiped off. This fills in all the small cracks and makes the material look a shade darker blue that it would be normally. This same process is used almost without exception on all commercially available tumbled polished stones wheather they need it or not. If you will google amazonite you will get something over 100,000 references to it and I am sure you can find numerous pictures of cystalized specimens as well as lapidary articles made from it. Good hunting. Rock From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Sun Nov 14 13:14:18 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Sun Nov 14 13:14:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite (Princess Mine) References: <20041113012449.44150.qmail@web51002.mail.yahoo.com><011e01c4c93d$c41c6600$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <9201DD75-35F0-11D9-B9BA-000A95D8C7A8@comcast.net> Message-ID: <004401c4ca8e$e7947710$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> I visited Bancroft this summer to do some collecting. The Princess Mine in Bancroft produces sodalite, not amazonite. It is in a nepheline-syenite rock. The Beryl Pit near Quadeville (about 45 minutes NE of Bancroft) produces some nice amazonite in large cleavage masses. It is in a pegmatite - where amazonite is found. (The largest I collected was about 12" x 6", though I saw a larger mass.) The color intensity is quite variable -- even on the same specimen. Alan G. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Joldersma" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 10:52 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > I have been looking for Princess Mine Amazonite. Near Bancroft, > Ontario. > with no luck. I did come up with these three. Enjoy! John > > http://www.smokycrystals.com/AMAZONITE.html > > http://www.mindat.org/min-184.html > > http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~adg/adg-psstimages.html#amazon > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Nov 14 11:35:21 2004 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Sun Nov 14 13:36:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Basalt Crystals References: <200411130202.iAD22DA3015624@bubbleator.drizzle.com><01b801c4c9e7$ecce2de0$bcf3a5d8@rock5><020f01c4c9ea$d036a970$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><4196F0AB.65C4@Tomaszewski.net><001701c4ca64$560dc5a0$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <004e01c4ca81$19428bc0$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> > OK, so just to keep the record clean, the columns are only cooling > features of a lava flow, a rock structure, not crystals. That was my next question. Thanks for clearing that up Lanny. John From Ted at crystalgems.com Sun Nov 14 16:18:37 2004 From: Ted at crystalgems.com (Ted) Date: Sun Nov 14 16:20:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> Jack: Jack: Having dug some share of the amazonite at the Morefield mine in Amelia County Virginia I feel that I am qualified to say... huh? Offhand from looking at your photos I can agree that they resemble amazonite in color and texture. But I do not see any clear signs of cleavage planes. Amazonite is microcline feldspar and rocks (generic description) of microcline almost always display two flat sides at near right angles. Count on at least one side in all microcline rocks having significant flats often displayed as a series of steps. Before adding suppositions to the fire; I'll take some leisure and add some comments on the various other discussions this question caused. Crystals are orderly arrangements of the mineral/element in question. They do not have to have defined sides (crystal points). Many things in nature interfere with rocks forming perfect crystals. Microcline feldspar loves to form huge crystals; say in the order of feet/meters so the resulting small pieces you are looking at may be crystalline, but are not identifiable as a single crystal. http://www.minsocam.org/msa/collectors_corner/arc/large_crystals.htm#TAW1 I have my doubts about lead causing the color in Amazonite. Especially after reading the link provided earlier in this discussion. Plotting a series of poorly related points on a graph and then declaring "...there is an apparent correlation between color intensity and amount of Pb..." is a contradiction of good science. Using words like "apparent" is a verbal deflection mechanism especially when combined with words like correlation. Lawyers would call it "leading the witness". Looking at this summary, I am inclined to dispute lead color correlation and I feel that they have managed to identify lead contamination without clearly identifying the source. It would take many more samples to either achieve scientific agreement amongst peers or to prove significant correlation statistically. Flames can be directed to my email address Ted@Crystalgems.com. So where does this leave you? Some more questions first. You cut some of these stones into cabs. Did you have a problem with cleavage or heat? Microcline will literally disintegrate if mishandled while cutting; becoming a bunch of small slivers each displaying two cleavage planes. Luckier mishandlings will only shear off a section of the stone along a cleavage plane. When cutting microcline on the saw, the first slice of the rind will often fracture along the cleavage plane; again displaying a flat side. Did the stone cut fast or slow? Were you able to apply heavy pressure while polishing or did it require a light touch? Was their a graininess? Compare this to other stones you have cut and you have a relative hardness and texture; which still needs confirmation. Back to the basics: You really need to perform a hardness test. A scratch test and a flame test would also go far to solidify a guesstimate. Some use of acids would help determine/eliminate some possibilities. Please realize that not all acids are the same. If a mineral is affected by hydrochloric, there is no certainty that it will display similar effects from Sulphuric or vinegar. Use proper precautions! My guess(es): Microcline amazonite: Hardness 6; white streak; infusible; displays two cleavage planes at near right angles Chrysoprase: Hardness 7: conchoidal fractures; infusible; no cleavage: (Did I mention that it can be found in serpentinite?) Beryl: Hardness 7.5-8: fuses with difficulty and only around the edges of chips; white streak; imperfect basal cleavage Other possibilities: variscite; opal; apatite and a host of others. Personally without a close examination, I lean towards chrysoprase or beryl. I lean towards beryl based on the look and color of the cut stones; but I confess that is a poor method of guessing rock identification. I do not think it is amazonite. Ted Ted@Crystalgems.com Fredericksburg, VA USA -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Jack Schmidling Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:46 PM To: aRockhounds Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite may be something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine what this is so any other ideas will be welcome. I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed faces and a few polished cabs. Pics at http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the past two years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry country. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu Sun Nov 14 17:05:08 2004 From: rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu (Pete Richards) Date: Sun Nov 14 17:05:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <02d601c4ca69$716137b0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><005001c4c8fb$7c2fa420$6401a8c 0@Junior> <000401c4ca45$475f0420$a73e27c4@privatehome> <02d601c4ca69$716137b0$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: Well, I have chosen to stay on the sidelines on this one so far, but I will step in and see if I can lend some clarity. Or complexity. Or both. 1. in some messages there have been references to crystalline and crystal. Really these terms should describe the same thing, but in common usage they often do not. A crystal is a "chunk" of matter that has an internally consistent chemistry (with some exceptions in the details, especially chemically zoned crystals) organized in a geometrically regular pattern. Some crystals, especially those which grow in a fluid-filled pocket in the host rock, show a regular external morphology which reflects the consistent internal arrangement of their atoms. However, many (most, even) crystals grow until they impinge on other crystals surrounding them, and their external boundaries are determined primarily by their slow and geometrically random collisions with the surrounding crystals. These are still crystals, and rocks composed of such crystals are crystalline, even though no nice external crystal shapes are present. Almost all rocks are composed of crystals and are crystalline. The internal order of the crystalline grains in a rock is shown by many properties that can be viewed in thin sections under the petrographic microscope or other properties such as cleavage. This internal order can also be revealed by sophisticated analyses with tools such as x-ray diffraction and microprobe analysis. A crystal does not have to have a regular external shape to be a crystal. We use the term "euhedral" to indicate that a crystal has a regular external morphology, and the term "anhedral" to indicate that it does not. 2. The mystery mineral. If it is amazonite, it should show the characteristic cleavage of potassium feldspars. I agree that the color is appropriate for amazonite, but the lack of any indication of cleavage makes the identification suspect, as does the locality, which is uncertain at best - certainly the garden is not the ultimate source of these chunks of rock. I have to suggest another unhappy possibility - this stuff may be slag from an iron smelting operation. I have seen many chunks of slag from my own area that are discovered as rocks by someone who wants to know what minerals they contain. If this is slag, it is almost certainly a glass, or mostly so, and it will behave optically as a glass. If it does not have the optical (and other) properties of a feldspar, it is certainly not amazonite. 3. The cause of the green color of amazonite. I agree that it is hard to believe that lead is responsible for this color, and that correlations with bulk chemistry are not very impressive. However, it does not seem to be a simple question of the quantity of lead in the environment or the crystal, but rather a fairly complex issue of incorporation of lead into the feldspar in a specific way that requires a vacancy in the lattice to maintain charge balance (if you did not have at least intro chemistry, you can tune out...), and it is the coupling between the lead and the vacancy that creates the color. This is an elegant theory, and a challenging one in the sense that it is extremely difficult to test, in part because it allows for different intensities of green color for a given amount of lead in a bulk analysis of a given amazonite crystal. While I was a skeptic when I first heard the theory, I am now inclined to believe that it is the best explanation we have for these very pretty and unusual feldspar crystals. 4. The material under discussion, again. Based on what has been presented, I am skeptical that it is amazonite, and inclined to suspect that it is not even a natural material. I hope I am wrong. I'd be glad to examine a small scrap and see what I can determine.... Whew! Maybe I should have stayed on the sideline.... Pete Richards -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From lanny at lrream.com Sun Nov 14 21:49:00 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Sun Nov 14 21:48:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> References: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> Message-ID: <0C9E6BC2-36CA-11D9-85BF-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> I would like to capitulate to the greater mind of Pete and go with thought that a chunk of a mineral does not have to "have defined sides" to be a a crystal. But instead, I decided to see why I held out for the the thought that a crystal has to have at least some semblance of having "crystal faces." My mind has been influenced too much by mineral specimens where of course a well defined crystal is what really _is_ a crystal. My first stop was my own copy of "Dictionary of Geological Terms" by the American Geological Institute. For a crystal, it provides the following: "The regular polyhedral form, bounded by plane surfaces, which is the outward expression of a periodic or regularly repeating internal arrangement of atoms." My belief vindicated. But that wasn't the end, I went online and searched several geologic dictionaries and glossaries and came up with both definitions. So, I am going to capitulate to Pete's more learned and experienced mind and less restrictive definition, but personally, probably still look at any sample/specimen of a mineral as if it is not a crystal if it doesn't have at least some indications of being "bounded by plane surfaces." As to the color of the amazonite variety of microcline being from lead, that has been the accepted explanation for many years as Rock wrote. This was recently more thoroughly defined by the active pegmatite mineral research team of Simmons, Falster, et al from Louisiana and presented at last April's Rochester Symposium (abstract in the Sept.-Oct. 2004, issue or Rocks & Minerals). They present the studies of Hoffmeister and Rossman (1985, Am. Min. 70:794-804), that some amazonite samples have "little or no lead." They correlate this with other studies and suggest that it is lead, water and ionizing radiation that produces the color. (Although I find a significant gap in this abstract in that they don't addess the fact that the studies also mentioned some amazonite has no lead, or maybe the "little or no lead" really meant "very little lead.") As to the subject specimens. I've looked at other pieces of rounded feldspar that in any given photograph you wouldn't necessarily see any cleavage (just because it has cleavage it doesn't have to have any showing). However, these pieces look exactly like small irregular masses of green quartz I've seen in gneisses or other metamorphic rocks. The ribbed outside of the one rough piece is a common texture for such pieces. It will be interesting to see what they are. Regards, Lanny On Nov 14, 2004, at 4:18 PM, Ted wrote: > Jack: > Jack: > Having dug some share of the amazonite at the Morefield mine in Amelia > County Virginia I feel that I am qualified to say... huh? > > Offhand from looking at your photos I can agree that they resemble > amazonite > in color and texture. But I do not see any clear signs of cleavage > planes. > Amazonite is microcline feldspar and rocks (generic description) of > microcline almost always display two flat sides at near right angles. > Count > on at least one side in all microcline rocks having significant flats > often > displayed as a series of steps. > > Before adding suppositions to the fire; I'll take some leisure and add > some > comments on the various other discussions this question caused. > > Crystals are orderly arrangements of the mineral/element in question. > They > do not have to have defined sides (crystal points). Many things in > nature > interfere with rocks forming perfect crystals. Microcline feldspar > loves to > form huge crystals; say in the order of feet/meters so the resulting > small > pieces you are looking at may be crystalline, but are not identifiable > as a > single crystal. > http://www.minsocam.org/msa/collectors_corner/arc/ > large_crystals.htm#TAW1 > > I have my doubts about lead causing the color in Amazonite. Especially > after > reading the link provided earlier in this discussion. Plotting a > series of > poorly related points on a graph and then declaring "...there is an > apparent > correlation between color intensity and amount of Pb..." is a > contradiction > of good science. Using words like "apparent" is a verbal deflection > mechanism especially when combined with words like correlation. Lawyers > would call it "leading the witness". Looking at this summary, I am > inclined > to dispute lead color correlation and I feel that they have managed to > identify lead contamination without clearly identifying the source. It > would > take many more samples to either achieve scientific agreement amongst > peers > or to prove significant correlation statistically. Flames can be > directed to > my email address Ted@Crystalgems.com. > > So where does this leave you? > Some more questions first. > You cut some of these stones into cabs. Did you have a problem with > cleavage > or heat? Microcline will literally disintegrate if mishandled while > cutting; > becoming a bunch of small slivers each displaying two cleavage planes. > Luckier mishandlings will only shear off a section of the stone along a > cleavage plane. When cutting microcline on the saw, the first slice of > the > rind will often fracture along the cleavage plane; again displaying a > flat > side. > > Did the stone cut fast or slow? Were you able to apply heavy pressure > while > polishing or did it require a light touch? Was their a graininess? > Compare > this to other stones you have cut and you have a relative hardness and > texture; which still needs confirmation. > > Back to the basics: > You really need to perform a hardness test. A scratch test and a flame > test > would also go far to solidify a guesstimate. Some use of acids would > help > determine/eliminate some possibilities. Please realize that not all > acids > are the same. If a mineral is affected by hydrochloric, there is no > certainty that it will display similar effects from Sulphuric or > vinegar. > Use proper precautions! > > My guess(es): > Microcline amazonite: Hardness 6; white streak; infusible; displays two > cleavage planes at near right angles > > Chrysoprase: Hardness 7: conchoidal fractures; infusible; no cleavage: > (Did > I mention that it can be found in serpentinite?) > > Beryl: Hardness 7.5-8: fuses with difficulty and only around the edges > of > chips; white streak; imperfect basal cleavage > > Other possibilities: variscite; opal; apatite and a host of others. > Personally without a close examination, I lean towards chrysoprase or > beryl. > I lean towards beryl based on the look and color of the cut stones; > but I > confess that is a poor method of guessing rock identification. I do not > think it is amazonite. > > Ted > Ted@Crystalgems.com > Fredericksburg, VA USA > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Jack > Schmidling > Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:46 PM > To: aRockhounds > Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > > It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite > may be > something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine > what > this is so any other ideas will be welcome. > > I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed > faces > and a few polished cabs. Pics at > http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg > > These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the > past two > years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry > country. > > js > > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 15 05:34:54 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 15 05:35:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> <0C9E6BC2-36CA-11D9-85BF-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> Message-ID: <00d601c4cb18$03cd8230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> From: "Lanny" > I would like to capitulate to the greater mind of Pete and go with > thought that a chunk of a mineral does not have to "have defined sides" > to be a a crystal. But instead, I decided to see why I held out for the > the thought that a crystal has to have at least some semblance of > having "crystal faces." When one cuts a gem from a rough crystal, it no longer has any crystal faces but is still a crystal. Cut a chunk out of a nice clean quartz crystal and what do you have? Still a crystal, I presume. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 15 06:26:03 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Mon Nov 15 06:26:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite Message-ID: <111520041426.23357.4198BC7B00035A1900005B3D21604666489D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Jack Schmidling" > From: "Lanny" > > > I would like to capitulate to the greater mind of Pete and go with > > thought that a chunk of a mineral does not have to "have defined sides" > > to be a a crystal. But instead, I decided to see why I held out for the > > the thought that a crystal has to have at least some semblance of > > having "crystal faces." > > When one cuts a gem from a rough crystal, it no longer has any crystal faces > but is still a crystal. > > Cut a chunk out of a nice clean quartz crystal and what do you have? Still > a crystal, I presume. Hi, That's what I was trying to get across in my last post, regarding the differences in semantics. When most people say "a crystal," we generally mean a free-standing mineral specimen bounded by planar faces. When a scientist says "crystalline," that refers to a substance being arranged in orderly fashion at the molecular level, as I discussed earlier in the Lego analogy, but the specimen in question may or may not have an obvious crystal shape. Two examples to go along with what I think you are asking: 1. If you cut an amethyst into smaller stones and facet them, those are not crystals. They are faceted gemstones. 2. If you facet glass into a faux gemstone, this is not a crystal either; in fact, the sparkling cut glass we call "crystal," "lead crystal," "Waterford crystal," Steuben crystal," etc., is all really a very, very thick liquid; and depending on the context, a very strict scientist wouldn't consider glass a solid at all. I think the confusion surrouding the term "crystal" derives from its root word. According to the American Heritage Dictionary, which is good enough for our purposes, we have-- "ETYMOLOGY: Middle English cristal, from Old French, from Latin crystallum, from Greek krustallos, ice, crystal; see kreus- in Indo-European roots" So, back to the beginning: if you are at a "New Age" gathering and say "crystal," I'd imagine everyone thinks of quartz. If you are at a mineral show and say "crystal," everyone will think about the different specimens for sale with plane-bounded shapes. If you are among scientists and say "crystal", the audience may think of ball-and-stick models, matrix mathematics, or, as my crystallography tutor has me doing at the moment, gluing ping-pong balls together to make lattice structures with names like Hexagonal Closest-Packed, Cubic Closest Packed, Face-Centered Cubic, and Body-Centered Cubic (making the BCC was an experience I'd rather forget). On this list, the word will inspire any or all of the lines of thought above. However, I think it is safe to agree that in most contexts, especially among mineral collectors, the word conjures images of a mineral specimen bounded by intersecting plane faces. I hope that hasn't added more confusion. D-space Don From lanny at lrream.com Mon Nov 15 08:31:32 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Mon Nov 15 08:30:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <00d601c4cb18$03cd8230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> References: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> <0C9E6BC2-36CA-11D9-85BF-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> <00d601c4cb18$03cd8230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: Yes, that is what about half of the definitions apparently say, and as I said, I capitulate to those and Pete Richards statement of the same. However, I am most likely going to continue looking at it for myself as to what the other half of the dictionaries, including that of the American Geological Institute state that a crystal has plane faces, or a crystal form. Irregular pieces, broken pieces, and faceted pieces of minerals don't fit that. Mineral collectors look at a piece of any mineral that does not have this nice form with "faces" and don't see it as a crystal, just like the dictionary of the AGI and some other dictionaries. If you facet a piece of amethyst you have a faceted gemstone, not a crystal, by their definition. And I happen to like that one better for the meaning it puts across, and common usage does carry weight, especially when backed by scientific dictionaries. Thus, for me, a crystal has faces, but I will accept the fact that others don't see it that way and be careful how I use the term "crystal" in public. This was good. I learned something in this, being I had always, I'm sure from way back in the days of mineralogy classes in college thought that crystal only had the definition I go by, and that has been the usage that mineral collectors use, who are the group I associate with mostly now. Rockhounds is great, another lesson learned! Now everyone, if you want to start another discussion on such terms and have some more fun. Think about what a geode is, then look it up in a half dozen dictionaries (not just one dictionary) ... Regards, Lanny On Nov 15, 2004, at 5:34 AM, Jack Schmidling wrote: > From: "Lanny" > >> I would like to capitulate to the greater mind of Pete and go with >> thought that a chunk of a mineral does not have to "have defined >> sides" >> to be a a crystal. But instead, I decided to see why I held out for >> the >> the thought that a crystal has to have at least some semblance of >> having "crystal faces." > > When one cuts a gem from a rough crystal, it no longer has any crystal > faces > but is still a crystal. > > Cut a chunk out of a nice clean quartz crystal and what do you have? > Still > a crystal, I presume. > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 15 11:21:30 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Mon Nov 15 11:21:35 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 14 References: <200411150202.iAF224Hr031629@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00b301c4cb48$501258c0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Dear Jimmy, I assume that you question is not how lead comes about but rather why the amazonite in the pegmatites in NW Arizona do not have amazonite. I like to think my knowledge of minerals is vast, but your question has just proven to me, yet once again that my knowledge is really only half vast. I am unable to answer your question. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than I can answer it but I suspect that ultimately you will have to take that one up with God. Rock From tjokela at execulink.com Mon Nov 15 11:32:43 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Mon Nov 15 11:32:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime><0C9E6BC2-36CA-11D9-85BF-000393AC22E6@lrream.com><00d601c4cb18$03cd8230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <001901c4cb49$e0ae7fc0$6401a8c0@Junior> The beauty of this is when selling ugly massive minerals: that ugly blob is actually an anhedral or perhaps subhedral crystal, not massive at all! Heh, heh, heh. Speaking of crystals, one finds out that a great many crystals are not even single crystals, but intergrowths or twins; eg most wulfenite and quartz crystals are twinned, which is pretty neat. Look at anything in depth and it quickly becomes more complicated and interesting! Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lanny" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 11:31 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > Yes, that is what about half of the definitions apparently say, and as I > said, I capitulate to those and Pete Richards statement of the same. > However, I am most likely going to continue looking at it for myself as to > what the other half of the dictionaries, including that of the American > Geological Institute state that a crystal has plane faces, or a crystal > form. Irregular pieces, broken pieces, and faceted pieces of minerals > don't fit that. > > Mineral collectors look at a piece of any mineral that does not have this > nice form with "faces" and don't see it as a crystal, just like the > dictionary of the AGI and some other dictionaries. If you facet a piece of > amethyst you have a faceted gemstone, not a crystal, by their definition. > And I happen to like that one better for the meaning it puts across, and > common usage does carry weight, especially when backed by scientific > dictionaries. Thus, for me, a crystal has faces, but I will accept the > fact that others don't see it that way and be careful how I use the term > "crystal" in public. > > This was good. I learned something in this, being I had always, I'm sure > from way back in the days of mineralogy classes in college thought that > crystal only had the definition I go by, and that has been the usage that > mineral collectors use, who are the group I associate with mostly now. > Rockhounds is great, another lesson learned! > > Now everyone, if you want to start another discussion on such terms and > have some more fun. Think about what a geode is, then look it up in a half > dozen dictionaries (not just one dictionary) ... > > Regards, > > Lanny > From tjokela at execulink.com Mon Nov 15 11:33:55 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Mon Nov 15 11:33:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 14 References: <200411150202.iAF224Hr031629@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <00b301c4cb48$501258c0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <001f01c4cb4a$0bae5790$6401a8c0@Junior> > I like > to think my knowledge of minerals is vast, but your question has just > proven > to me, yet once again that my knowledge is really only half vast. > Rock LOL!!!!! From rik.dillen at skynet.be Mon Nov 15 11:40:16 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Mon Nov 15 11:40:35 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <001901c4cb49$e0ae7fc0$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <002101c4cb4a$f20b45e0$0100a8c0@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tim *Jokela Jr. *Sent: maandag 15 november 2004 20:33 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite * *Look at anything in depth and it quickly becomes more complicated and interesting! >>>>> Amen ! I just responded to another list (in Dutch) that every time I put some green - blue -greenish blue - bluish green mineral from the dumps in the Austrian Inntal (lots of secondary copper minerals there) into the electron microscope to identify a question-mark-specimen, I end up with solving perhaps one problem and creating 5 new question marks on the same specimen. Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 15 12:31:58 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 15 12:58:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <29.661ca936.2ec8ebc7@aol.com> Message-ID: <016d01c4cb55$e68c4e70$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> From: > Based on the photos, I guess Aventurine. Is that found around there? According to my reverences, it is not even found in North America. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 15 12:56:02 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 15 12:59:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <004f01c4caa8$c98f3a60$0200a8c0@gametime> Message-ID: <016f01c4cb55$e86f3f40$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> From: "Ted" >But I do not see any clear signs of cleavage planes..... Could this not simply be a result of being broken from a much larger piece? > Count > on at least one side in all microcline rocks having significant flats often > displayed as a series of steps. That is certainly visible in the piece on the left in my pic. > You cut some of these stones into cabs. Did you have a problem with cleavage > or heat? None. > Microcline will literally disintegrate if mishandled while cutting; > becoming a bunch of small slivers each displaying two cleavage planes. > Luckier mishandlings will only shear off a section of the stone along a > cleavage plane. When cutting microcline on the saw, the first slice of the > rind will often fracture along the cleavage plane; again displaying a flat > side. None of the above. > Did the stone cut fast or slow? About like quartz or softer. >Were you able to apply heavy pressure while > polishing or did it require a light touch? Don't know... as I treat all stones about the same as far as polishing cabs goes. >Was their a graininess? Only near the surfaces. > Back to the basics: > You really need to perform a hardness test. Big problem here. It will scratch quartz but quartz will also scratch it. I think I need to polish a piece for scratch test. It's hard to tell a streak from a scratch on the rough. > My guess(es): > Microcline amazonite: Hardness 6; white streak; infusible; displays two > cleavage planes at near right angles Streak is white. Not clear on the other tests you suggest. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From kahako at aloha.net Mon Nov 15 13:59:58 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Mon Nov 15 13:30:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite In-Reply-To: <016d01c4cb55$e68c4e70$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> References: <29.661ca936.2ec8ebc7@aol.com> <016d01c4cb55$e68c4e70$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041115115546.030cdd10@mail.aloha.net> At 10:31 AM 11/15/2004, Jack Schmidling wrote: >According to my reverences, it is not even found in North America. >js According to mindat/com aventurine occurs in the following North American locations (with references): Aloha, Kitty Nebraska, Morrill Co. Bayard The Minerals and Gemstones of Nebraska CSD U Neb EC 2 Vermont, Rutland Co. Rutland Station Round Hill MacFall (1975) Gem Hunter's Guide Wisconsin, Wood Co. Veedum quarries R&M 73:11-12 pp 378-399 Wisconsin Mineral Locality Index --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Mon Nov 15 15:49:47 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Mon Nov 15 15:52:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Replying to beginners...and courtesy References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041114092144.02e03400@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <002d01c4cb6d$d07ad080$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Aloha Kitty! Mahalo to all who are patient with us! Glenn Kitty wrote: > Thank you to all you experts who reply to beginners (and dummies like me) > in a sensitive and informative manner. Tim Jokela, Don H., Kreigh, Earl, > Pete, are examples that come to my mind at the moment (I know there are > more) of people who generally give explanations that are clear, easy to > understand, and not condescending or pompous. > > I also love the way most of us---most of the time---manage to remain > courteous, even under stress. Someone once defined it to me: "Courtesy is > made up of those conventions by which we avoid hurting each others feelings." > > Aloha, Kitty > From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 15 18:03:53 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Mon Nov 15 17:55:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 14 References: <200411150202.iAF224Hr031629@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00f101c4cb80$86f14df0$6901a8c0@rock3> I think Divalent Don's (love the name) reference to the technical papers on the cause of coloration in amazonite can't be much improved. http://www.uno.edu/pegmatology/abstract/abstrein I should however comment further about Gene Foord's claim about being able to judge the lead concentration in amazonite by its color. Most of Gene's work was with Colorado Amazonite and that from the Kola Peninsula and when he was talking to me he was talking about Colorado Amazonite. He certainly would not have made that claim about amazonite localities that he had not studied. He was not a boastful individual and always meticulous about what he wrote and said. Gene actually visited the Kola Peninsula and was very impressed with it. Today I had lunch with Mick Brownfield of the USGS. He accompanied Gene when visiting the Kola Peninsula locality and told me some things that I think should be recorded somewhere. He said they took one of the huge old Russian helicopters east from Apatity and flew about an hour and a half to get to the place. There were a number of amazonite bearing pegmatites in the region but the main pit exposed what was a crystal that was claimed by some of the Russians to be 100 meters long by thirty to forty meters wide. It was solid amazonite (with white flecks of albite). The limit to the size of the pieces they could get out was what could be moved out by helicopter. They mined chunks that cleaved into plates (cleavage sections) that they put in bags that were hauled out by the helicopter. He was told that it was destined for use as dimension stone for some building project. On the edge of the "amazonite crystal" on the outer edge of the core of the pegmatite there were accessory minerals which were placed in piles near the pit. In these piles were accessory minerals like plumbomicrolite, tantalite and bismuth. He said they each collected two or three well formed, fairly shiny plumbomicrolite microlite crystals of an inch plus in size and thought they could have gotten many more if they would have had more time to collect. They were also taken by tracked vehicle from the site of the main pit to other smaller pegmatites where they saw small terminated amazonite crystals in the one to two inch range. Rock From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 15 18:04:12 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Mon Nov 15 17:55:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 14 References: <200411150202.iAF224Hr031629@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <00f201c4cb80$923b0390$6901a8c0@rock3> I think Divalent Don's (love the name) reference to the technical papers on the cause of coloration in amazonite can't be much improved. http://www.uno.edu/pegmatology/abstract/abstrein I should however comment further about Gene Foord's claim about being able to judge the lead concentration in amazonite by its color. Most of Gene's work was with Colorado Amazonite and that from the Kola Peninsula and when he was talking to me he was talking about Colorado Amazonite. He certainly would not have made that claim about amazonite localities that he had not studied. He was not a boastful individual and always meticulous about what he wrote and said. Gene actually visited the Kola Peninsula and was very impressed with it. Today I had lunch with Mick Brownfield of the USGS. He accompanied Gene when visiting the Kola Peninsula locality and told me some things that I think should be recorded somewhere. He said they took one of the huge old Russian helicopters east from Apatity and flew about an hour and a half to get to the place. There were a number of amazonite bearing pegmatites in the region but the main pit exposed what was a crystal that was claimed by some of the Russians to be 100 meters long by thirty to forty meters wide. It was solid amazonite (with white flecks of albite). The limit to the size of the pieces they could get out was what could be moved out by helicopter. They mined chunks that cleaved into plates (cleavage sections) that they put in bags that were hauled out by the helicopter. He was told that it was destined for use as dimension stone for some building project. On the edge of the "amazonite crystal" on the outer edge of the core of the pegmatite there were accessory minerals which were placed in piles near the pit. In these piles were accessory minerals like plumbomicrolite, tantalite and bismuth. He said they each collected two or three well formed, fairly shiny plumbomicrolite microlite crystals of an inch plus in size and thought they could have gotten many more if they would have had more time to collect. They were also taken by tracked vehicle from the site of the main pit to other smaller pegmatites where they saw small terminated amazonite crystals in the one to two inch range. Rock From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Mon Nov 15 19:59:07 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Mon Nov 15 19:51:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <004501c4cb90$a00c3420$5ea6490c@pete> Jack, That is nice looking material (I looked at your picture), but yes, it's pretty hard to tell what it actually is. The more bluish-colored stones mounted in the bracelet, don't look like the same material as you show in the sawed pieces--unless the lighting & color balance in the images were much different. There's very little to no amazonite ever found in midwest glacial gravels, to my knowledge, so it's probably something else. Amazonite is (for the most part) restricted to the pegmatites in Colorado, Virginia, plus a very few sites elsewhere in the west (one mine in Nevada is one). Emerald-green mica, often embedded in quartz schist, is called "fuchsite", and can be found in Wyoming and other places; your material looks rather like that. "Aventurine" is a name that is used for a number of different materials, that are green, massive, and sparkly; usually it refers to massive quartz that has a lot of green mica inclusions in it; that's what your material could be, too. If it were amazonite, it would be solid pieces of single crytals, and probably would show good, flat cleavage faces where broken. If the material appears to be a rock rather than a pure mineral--if it shows layering and foliation, with sparkly, mica-rich layers, then I'd call it fuchsite (if it appears to be mostly mica), or fuchsite schist (if less pure), or aventurine (if mostly solid quartz with just little sparkles of mica). To be honest, in the pictures you posted, in the image with the penny, the two pieces on the right look like they could in fact be amazonite (but maybe are not); the largest one, on the left, definitely looks like schist with fuchesite; the lower one, somewhat in between, but from the irregular surface texture I can see, I'd say it is fuchsite schist, no amazonite. The polished stones in the bracelet could be any of the above, or they could also be some other variety of feldspar (which can come in many colors, green to blue to bluish-gray to gray to white to tan to orange. Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Schmidling" To: "aRockhounds" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 1:45 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite > It has come to my attention that what I have been calling Amazonite may be > something else. It has been rather frustrating trying to determine what > this is so any other ideas will be welcome. > > I have posted a picture with several stones as found and some sawed faces > and a few polished cabs. Pics at http://schmidling.com/az2.jpg > > These stones and a few more were found in our vegie garden over the past two > years. Location is northern Illinois and this is gravel quarry country. > > js > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Mon Nov 15 20:04:23 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Mon Nov 15 19:56:50 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Stibnite-Included Quartz specimens now available- References: <010901c4c91f$ef683690$93104ed1@gbm> Message-ID: <006b01c4cb91$6468c220$5ea6490c@pete> Sounds like this ad is just for local collectors who know you and the site, 'cause those are the only ones who will necessarily know where the "Bottomley Prospect" is. Sounds like an English name, but since you're Great Basin, I gather it's not. I guess it must be on the lower side of something, if it's not named after Mr. Bottomley (which I'm sure it is). (Your website doesn't say either, where the place is--no clue!) cheers (just harassing you a bit), Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 6:27 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Stibnite-Included Quartz specimens now available- Hello all, I have started posting the best Bottomley prospect specimens that I have so far collected- http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite%20Included%20Quartz%20for%20Sale%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From arf at mc.net Mon Nov 15 20:16:17 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Mon Nov 15 20:17:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <004501c4cb90$a00c3420$5ea6490c@pete> Message-ID: <025101c4cb93$1e86fa90$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> From: "Peter J. Modreski" > The more bluish-colored stones > mounted in the bracelet, don't look like the same material as you show in > the sawed pieces--unless the lighting & color balance in the images were > much different. You will notice that the backgrounds look different even though the same. The actual background is black felt. By adjusting the color so the background it black, the sample colors are about the right shade of green. There is a lot of blue in the background of the cut stones which I didn't notice till I put the two together. > To be honest, in the pictures you posted, in the image with the > penny, the two pieces on the right look like they could in fact be amazonite > (but maybe are not); the largest one, on the left, definitely looks like > schist with fuchesite; the lower one, somewhat in between, but from the > irregular surface texture I can see, I'd say it is fuchsite schist, no > amazonite.... There is little doubt in my mind that they are all the same. I will look into fuchsite schist. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From kqhayes at chartermi.net Mon Nov 15 22:08:01 2004 From: kqhayes at chartermi.net (kqhayes@chartermi.net) Date: Mon Nov 15 22:08:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ad - new Auction Message-ID: <3khj1l$chi00i@mxip09a.cluster1.charter.net> Folks, If you are interested in auctions, John Veevaert has been working to upgrade his auction site to allow more people to post minerals. He is having two preliminary auctions with several new dealers participating this week and next week. You may want to check this out at www.trinityminerals.com Have a good one, Keith From CrescentStoneINC at aol.com Tue Nov 16 07:58:23 2004 From: CrescentStoneINC at aol.com (CrescentStoneINC@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 16 07:58:28 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Stromatolite Samples Message-ID: <65.3875bfe4.2ecb7d9f@aol.com> From: Crescent Stone Company Dear Collector: We have had some growing pains that have been corrected. All samples will start sending next week. I simply found that I could not do it all, and believe it or not people want to get paid when they work. We are also in the architectual part of the stone business too. I thank you for your patience. Sincerely: Steve DeLong/Owner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From CrescentStoneINC at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:11:47 2004 From: CrescentStoneINC at aol.com (CrescentStoneINC@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 16 08:11:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Free sample of beautiful fossilized stromatolite stone. Message-ID: <9f.522ba9ff.2ecb80c3@aol.com> From: Crescent Stone Company Dear Collector: We have had some growing pains that have been corrected. All samples will start sending next week. I simply found that I could not do it all, and believe it or not people want to get paid when they work. We are also in the architectual part of the stone business too. I thank you for your patience. Sincerely: Steve DeLong/Owner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From CrescentStoneINC at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:13:01 2004 From: CrescentStoneINC at aol.com (CrescentStoneINC@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 16 08:13:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Free sample of beautiful fossilized stromatolite stone. Message-ID: From: Crescent Stone Company Dear Collector: We have had some growing pains that have been corrected. All samples will start sending next week. I simply found that I could not do it all, and believe it or not people want to get paid when they work. We are also in the architectual part of the stone business too. I thank you for your patience. Sincerely: Steve DeLong/Owner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From JScully216 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 12:46:41 2004 From: JScully216 at aol.com (JScully216@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 16 12:46:58 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Tumblers and Digital Cameras Message-ID: <192.330b0905.2ecbc131@aol.com> I'm in the totally astonishing position of having made a small profit this year and am looking for additional expenses. So, I'd love some advice on 1. Digital Cameras. What would you recommend for the best possible close up pictures of mineral specimens. My Olympus is 6 years old. Surely there is better out there now. Ideas on make, model and cost. 2. Tumbler. I'd like a tumbler that has somewhat more capacity than the little kiddie drums that take a month to result in anything and that is vastly faster. (-: Thanks --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From danielz at acmenet.net Tue Nov 16 13:03:54 2004 From: danielz at acmenet.net (Dan Z) Date: Tue Nov 16 13:03:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Tumblers and Digital Cameras References: <192.330b0905.2ecbc131@aol.com> Message-ID: <000301c4cc1f$c8c0af60$6401a8c0@M1Garand> > 2. Tumbler. I'd like a tumbler that has somewhat more capacity than the > little kiddie drums that take a month to result in anything and that is vastly > faster. Any rotary type tumbler is going to take at least a month to make round polished rocks out of hard rough rocks. The best brand is Lortone - solid rubber barrels that don't wear out like the plastic ones and make little noise compared to plastic, quality motors, 1 year warranty, spare parts available, and often lower in cost than the toys. For speed, a vibratory tumbler will polish rough rock in 8 to 10 days. BUT, it will not round them, and it is a LOT noisier. The rocks will shine, but the shape will be about the same as when they went in. The vibratory also requires a lot more attention since the liquid content is critical. It should be run with just enough liquid to allow movement, about a tablespoon or so. Then you watch it to see when the movement stops as rock grit clogs the moisture. Then you add a little more water (I use a squirt or two from a spray bottle) just until the movement starts again. This is usually every four hours or so. Too much liquid and the barrel will wear out quickly, too little and nothing gets polished. Professionals often use both - the first step in a rotary to round them, the final steps in the vibratory for the speed. By the time another batch is ready from the first step in the rotary, the first batch will have completed the remaining steps in the vibratory. -dan z- Many Facets Rock Shop Albany, New York - - Protect your civil rights! Let the politicians know how you feel. Join or donate to the NRA today! http://membership.nrahq.org/default.asp?campaignid=XR014887 From kugeln at msn.com Tue Nov 16 14:49:02 2004 From: kugeln at msn.com (JOHN STOCKWELL) Date: Tue Nov 16 14:50:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Automatic vs Stick in SUV/Question Message-ID: Hi out there! Would welcome opinions as to the relative ease of handling in tight situations; more control with stick? That's what I've always driven, but am thinking of a shift. Thanks. John --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rick.trapp at azgs.az.gov Tue Nov 16 15:20:38 2004 From: rick.trapp at azgs.az.gov (Richard Trapp) Date: Tue Nov 16 15:20:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Automatic vs Stick in SUV/Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <419A8B46.3060005@azgs.az.gov> Assuming you're talking about 4WD situations, Manual is better for going downhill, Automatic is better for starting from a dead stop on a hill going uphill. I've heard that most "serious" 4WD people prefer automatic, I suspect because there is less chance of clutch problems out in the boonies. By "serious" I actually mean people who go out looking for bad places to play with their 4WD. I don't shrink from rough patches, but I don't go looking for them and if there is a chance of harming my vehicle I will either walk the last bit or find another route. I've owned one automatic 4WD which was an OK vehicle, but I prefer manual. If you are getting an automatic 4WD and actually intend to use it, I would advise a 4 or 5 speed automatic transmission with both high and low ranges. My preference for serious rockhounding and camping (but NOT looking for routes that will break your vehicle) is a V8 full-size pickup with five speed manual and a transfer case for low and high range. For a smaller SUV, a 4 cylinder engine can be adequate, but I think 6 cylinders are better. It's not about fuel economy, it's about getting where you want to go. JOHN STOCKWELL wrote: >Hi out there! > >Would welcome opinions as to the relative ease of handling in tight situations; more control with stick? That's what I've always driven, but am thinking of a shift. > >Thanks. > >John > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > -- Rick Trapp Geologist/IT Manager, Arizona Geological Survey rick.trapp@azgs.az.gov --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From cliffjackson9 at earthlink.net Tue Nov 16 15:21:29 2004 From: cliffjackson9 at earthlink.net (Cliff Jackson) Date: Tue Nov 16 15:21:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Automatic vs Stick in SUV/Question Message-ID: <5715849.1100647290095.JavaMail.root@bigbird.psp.pas.earthlink.net> John Get an Auto. I have been 4X4 for years (20+) and you will have much better control. Much better control when you can just pay attention to the driving , going as slow as needed, and not worry about the need to shift. Cliff -----Original Message----- From: JOHN STOCKWELL Sent: Nov 16, 2004 2:49 PM To: rock hounds Subject: [Rockhounds] Automatic vs Stick in SUV/Question Hi out there! Would welcome opinions as to the relative ease of handling in tight situations; more control with stick? That's what I've always driven, but am thinking of a shift. Thanks. John --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Cliff Jackson From kahako at aloha.net Tue Nov 16 15:51:59 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Tue Nov 16 15:22:46 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Automatic vs Stick in SUV/Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041116132800.02ae2eb0@mail.aloha.net> John, I'm sure you'll get responses from many perspectives, but here's one you may not consider---depending on how old you are: You never know when your own body (as opposed to the SUV's) will give out on you. Bill and I got a Mitsubishi Montero 4-wheel drive automatic, new in 1989. We were 46 years old then. We are now 61 years old and Bill has had reconstructive surgery on one hip and a total hip replacement for the other. I've had two surgeries on one knee and one on the other. We are both extremely glad we haven't had to step on a clutch pedal in a long time! That SUV now has 189,000 miles on it, many of those off-road. We still drive it up and down Waipio Valley where some of the road is at a 45 degree angle; we've driven in sand, over crumbling lava fields, across muddy cow pastures, and we regularly haul garbage to the dump with a trailer. Automatic transmission has never been a negative factor in any of those situations, and it has been extremely positive for our orthopedically-challenged lower extremities! Aloha, Kitty At 12:49 PM 11/16/2004, you wrote: >Hi out there! > >Would welcome opinions as to the relative ease of handling in tight >situations; more control with stick? That's what I've always driven, but >am thinking of a shift. > >Thanks. > >John > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Tue Nov 16 15:29:17 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 16 15:31:38 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras References: <192.330b0905.2ecbc131@aol.com> Message-ID: <005301c4cc34$179198c0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Canon Rebel Check it out before you buy anything. Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: > > 1. Digital Cameras. What would you recommend for the best possible close > up pictures of mineral specimens. My Olympus is 6 years old. Surely there is > better out there now. Ideas on make, model and cost. > > From arf at mc.net Tue Nov 16 16:27:35 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Tue Nov 16 16:39:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <29.661ca936.2ec8ebc7@aol.com><016d01c4cb55$e68c4e70$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> <6.1.2.0.0.20041115115546.030cdd10@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <041101c4cc3d$e9aff230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> More data... I polished a flat piece for scratch test and got very good results. 1. It can not be scratched by quartz nor will it scratch quartz. 2. It is scratched by corundum 3. I easily scratches sunstone Clearly, it is not a feldspar. I measured the SG again and it is 2.66. I did not do the fusibility yet but will give it a try. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Nov 16 20:50:38 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Nov 16 20:44:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite References: <29.661ca936.2ec8ebc7@aol.com><016d01c4cb55$e68c4e70$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> <6.1.2.0.0.20041115115546.030cdd10@mail.aloha.net> <041101c4cc3d$e9aff230$2c5c70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <419AD70C.4952@Tomaszewski.net> Jack Schmidling wrote: > > More data... > > I polished a flat piece for scratch test and got very good results. Scratch tests are normally done on a freshly broken or cleaved surface; polishing alters surfaces and can change their hardness, and avoiding the weathered/exposed surface gives a much more accurate measure. Breaking a specimen also gives a cleavage test most of the time. > > 1. It can not be scratched by quartz nor will it scratch quartz. A mineral that is harder (higher Mohs number) will scratch anything softer (lower Mohs number), or equal (same Mohs number) in hardness. No scratches at all suggests a problem with the way you are testing. Try to scratch an 'X' (or an '*') when testing because some minerals have different hardness depending on the direction of scratch on a surface, or on which surface of a crystal structure. Blow it clean, and use a lens to look for your scratch marks. Rinse and wipe it off, and look again. There should be some dust or you are not pressing hard enough. > 2. It is scratched by corundum > 3. I easily scratches sunstone OK, the hardness is 6 to 8 1/2. There are a lot of green minerals within that range. > > Clearly, it is not a feldspar. Sunstone is a feldspar, and still in the range of hardness identified for (most of -- or is it all?) the other feldspars too. > > I measured the SG again and it is 2.66. Oligclase is 2.65, Andesine 2.68, Labradorite (including Sunstone) 2.71, Microcline (including Amazonite) 2.5-2.6. > > I did not do the fusibility yet but will give it a try. > > js If you break off a chunk with a hammer (or just whack! and shatter/break up a chunk -- good therapy sometimes) do you get a surface/surfaces that seems to show crystal faces? Does the surface have corners that look like a slightly bent/distorted corner of a cube? Cleavage is breaking along crystal structure lines, and sometimes you have to make nice thumbnails, and micromounts, out of a minature or small cabinet specimen. If you are seeing the bent cube faces on broken edges, Amazonite is still a good bet from the details so far presented -- cleavage and hardness are usually sufficient to identify it after color. And I think I missed it, what was the streak? Kreigh From geenet2 at mchsi.com Tue Nov 16 20:49:57 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 16 20:50:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Stromatolite Samples References: <65.3875bfe4.2ecb7d9f@aol.com> Message-ID: <006601c4cc60$e3ce6ea0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> We thank YOU, Steve, for the offer of the stromatolite. Waiting patiently.... Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Stromatolite Samples > From: Crescent Stone Company > > > Dear Collector: > > We have had some growing pains that have been corrected. All samples will > start sending next week. I simply found that I could not do it all, and believe > it or not people want to get paid when they work. We are also in the > architectual part of the stone business too. I thank you for your patience. > > > Sincerely: Steve DeLong/Owner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From JScully216 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 09:14:32 2004 From: JScully216 at aol.com (JScully216@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 17 09:14:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanks for all your digital and tumbler Tips Message-ID: <155.43dadb6c.2ecce0f8@aol.com> Thanks to all for your help. (-: John Scully --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tjokela at execulink.com Wed Nov 17 11:45:43 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Wed Nov 17 11:49:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras References: <192.330b0905.2ecbc131@aol.com> <005301c4cc34$179198c0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <000001c4ccde$9ccdb730$6401a8c0@Junior> Yeah, I love mine. Just got a 50mm macro lens for it - yowsah! I don't know a thing about photography, but I sure feel like a pro toting that thing around. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenn Wimpee" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 6:29 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras > Canon Rebel Check it out before you buy anything. > > Glenn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: >> >> 1. Digital Cameras. What would you recommend for the best possible > close >> up pictures of mineral specimens. My Olympus is 6 years old. Surely > there is >> better out there now. Ideas on make, model and cost. >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rik.dillen at skynet.be Wed Nov 17 12:21:29 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Wed Nov 17 12:21:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras In-Reply-To: <000001c4ccde$9ccdb730$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <000001c4cce3$05b55970$ca3488d9@maxdata> If you want to go to a reflexcamera : the newer D 70 of Nikon beats the Canon 300D in a number of points : - faster start-up (much faster than you can push the trigger !) - softer images (less hard colors), but that is a matter of taste and possible post-processing of the images - minimum shutter time 1/8000 ! - faster in image storage - one year more recent electronics and software - extremely easy to learn to work with (if you are used to a classical reflex-camera it is completely self-evident) Something to bear in mind is that if you own already a lot of Nikon lenses it is certainly advisable to stick with Nikon ; if you have lots of Canon lenses you might think about buying the 300 D If you want to compare by yourself go to http://www.dpreview.com/ click and chose and and in a second you will see all characteristics and performances side-by side. You can put whatever cameras side by side, even more than 2 at a time. And you will find much more data, discussion groups, opinions, news etc. concerning the choice of a camera. This is certainly the best site in that respect. Anyway, I am extremely satisfied with my D70 (I have it since May 2004, and made 8000 photos with it in the meantime). You can see some examples on http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen/Photos.htm (thumbnails : click on them to enlarge) Look e.g. at the image of the clock in Antwerp Central Station (row Antwerpen 22/5/2004, 2nd image) ; you will understand how spectacular this photo is if you know that it has been taken without any tripod, out of my hand, with a telelens of 20 years old from the same place where I was standing taking the first photo on that row. And what you see is already quite compressed jpegs : the originals are much better. Any moir? effect comes from your screen or viewing software. No native Moir? effect visible in these photos. If you need more detailed information on the D70 and its use, please contact me off-list (unless it's about things that the others might be interested in). Greetings, and good luck with your choice. Rik DILLEN *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tim *Jokela Jr. *Sent: woensdag 17 november 2004 20:46 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras * * *Yeah, I love mine. Just got a 50mm macro lens for it - yowsah! *I don't know *a thing about photography, but I sure feel like a pro toting *that thing *around. * *Cheers, * *Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com *Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com *The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com *Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com * *----- Original Message ----- *From: "Glenn Wimpee" *To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem *collectors" * *Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 6:29 PM *Subject: [Rockhounds] Advice on Digital Cameras * * *> Canon Rebel Check it out before you buy anything. *> *> Glenn *> *> ----- Original Message ----- *> From: *>> *>> 1. Digital Cameras. What would you recommend for the *best possible *> close *>> up pictures of mineral specimens. My Olympus is 6 years *old. Surely *> there is *>> better out there now. Ideas on make, model and cost. From BETDAV97 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 13:54:20 2004 From: BETDAV97 at aol.com (BETDAV97@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 17 13:54:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain Message-ID: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Hi Group, Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, but can anyone enlighten me more about them. I did do a search on Google, and came up with one single hit; Many Facets Rock Shop, in Albany, NY. The gentleman is a member of the drizzle list, but he knows the same info as me. So two of us can profit from extra info. The specimens originally came from Rich Hamill of Rochester, NY. Maybe those from Rochester may know of him. On another note, the specimens are also for sale, if anyone needs one for thier collection. Rich had a $2.50 price on them, per crystal. I'll lower the price to $2.00 for list members, plus shipping. Thanks, and have a good evening. Dave Phillips Sunset Fossils & Minerals Morgantown, WV --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From herwig.pelckmans at pandora.be Wed Nov 17 14:04:34 2004 From: herwig.pelckmans at pandora.be (herwig pelckmans) Date: Wed Nov 17 14:07:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain References: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Message-ID: <027801c4ccf1$6c629080$bfed76d5@pandora.be> Hi Dave, The correct variety name is TERUELITE, after the town Teruel, located in the province of Aragon, in Spain. Dark, blackish, quite large single crystals of dolomite in a greyish matrix, if I recall correctly. Google for TERUELITE, it will even bring up some old mail from this list !! Cheers, Herwig Herwig Pelckmans Worldwide Mineral Collector Cardijnstraat 12 B-3530 Helchteren Belgium Europe http://www.xlizd.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 10:54 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > Hi Group, > Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. > While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across > some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons > labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but > somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, > but can anyone enlighten me more about them. I did do a search on > Google, and came up with one single hit; Many Facets Rock Shop, > in Albany, NY. The gentleman is a member of the drizzle list, but he > knows the same info as me. So two of us can profit from extra info. > The specimens originally came from Rich Hamill of Rochester, NY. > Maybe those from Rochester may know of him. > On another note, the specimens are also for sale, if anyone needs > one for thier collection. Rich had a $2.50 price on them, per crystal. > I'll lower the price to $2.00 for list members, plus shipping. > Thanks, and have a good evening. > Dave Phillips > Sunset Fossils & Minerals > Morgantown, WV > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Nov 17 17:41:05 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Nov 17 17:31:39 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain References: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Message-ID: <419BFB73.3E68@Tomaszewski.net> Dave, Search for teruelite and you can find out about the mineral. And I am interested in a specimen. How much do you need for shipping? Where do I send my check? Kreigh BETDAV97@aol.com wrote: > > Hi Group, > Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. > While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across > some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons > labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but > somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, > but can anyone enlighten me more about them. I did do a search on > Google, and came up with one single hit; Many Facets Rock Shop, > in Albany, NY. The gentleman is a member of the drizzle list, but he > knows the same info as me. So two of us can profit from extra info. > The specimens originally came from Rich Hamill of Rochester, NY. > Maybe those from Rochester may know of him. > On another note, the specimens are also for sale, if anyone needs > one for thier collection. Rich had a $2.50 price on them, per crystal. > I'll lower the price to $2.00 for list members, plus shipping. > Thanks, and have a good evening. > Dave Phillips > Sunset Fossils & Minerals > Morgantown, WV > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Lapadary at aol.com Wed Nov 17 18:05:35 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 17 18:05:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain Message-ID: <159.445407c0.2ecd5d6f@aol.com> In a message dated 11/17/04 5:32:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, Kreigh@tomaszewski.net writes: Dave, Search for teruelite and you can find out about the mineral. And I am interested in a specimen. How much do you need for shipping? Where do I send my check? I'm interested too. Do you take Paypal? My zip is 95926 Grant Johnston, Chico, CA --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rik.dillen at skynet.be Thu Nov 18 10:24:05 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Thu Nov 18 10:24:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Purpurite question Message-ID: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> Does anyone know if purpurite was known in the antiquity already as a pigment for art works ? This is a question of someone who is doing research on the subject. Thanks for any hint or information and greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From bg at his.com Thu Nov 18 11:05:45 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Thu Nov 18 11:06:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] MATRIX magazine Message-ID: Dear Rockhounds, As most of you know, Jay Lininger, editor, publisher and primary author of MATRIX magazine, passed away last month. I just had a long talk with his widow, Paula. She does not know what to do with the magazine. Jay devoted much of his time for the last decade to producing this fine publication on the history of mining and minerals and the people involved. It would be a shame to have this publication discontinued. There are many articles in process for several new issues and the next issue is partially completed. Paula handles most of the "office work" - mailing list, subscriptions, accounting matters and the like, but she is not a minerals person and can not take on the editing. She would like to find someone who would be willing to become the new editor. If you have any interest in this or know someone who might, please call her weekdays at MATRIX Publishing (717) 764-9673. Cathy Gaber From LarryRush at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 18 13:11:43 2004 From: LarryRush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Thu Nov 18 13:11:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras References: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> Message-ID: <001e01c4cdb3$35f7f860$bd904c0c@fekib> A follow-up question on the discussion on digital cameras........ Is an optical zoom of 3X essentially the same as a 3x macro lens in film cameras? Are macro lenses made for digital cameras, or does the optical zoom provide all that is needed for close-up shots? I find that even with the optical zoom feature, my digital camera cannot focus on images closer than 4-5 cm. What do I need to do this? Thanks.............Larry Rush --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Gslrocks at aol.com Thu Nov 18 14:11:04 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 18 14:11:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras Message-ID: <9d.530ded9d.2ece77f8@aol.com> even the Macros settings are different on most digital cameras. I can focus as close as 1 cm with my Sony F505V's and F717. My friend has a Ricoh that will only focus at 5 cm in macro mode. Greg Lesinski GSLROCKS 4726 Porter Center Rd. Lewiston NY 14092 Fluorescent minerals, ultraviolet lamps and reference books website www.gslrocks.com GSLROCKS@AOL.COM 716-754-9729 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From afox at drizzle.com Thu Nov 18 14:25:13 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Thu Nov 18 14:25:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Sad News Message-ID: Tom Dibblee, ridgetop mapper extrodinare, passed away in Santa Barbara, CA. Anyone who has studied Southern California geology has used one of Tom's maps at one time or another. I've attached the information that I received from AEG regarding Tom. -------------------------------------------------- For anyone who has done geology in SoCal, I am sure you are aware of Tom's contributions. He was 95 and working on updating the more than 100 geologic quad maps (15 min and 7.5 min) that he mapped during his career up to the week before he passed away. I am sure there will be article's re: Tom's accomplishments in several geologic professional journals in the future. Not only did he map ~1/5th of California, he was the first (with co-worker Mason Hill in the mid-1950s) to recognize and publish that the San Andreas fault had several 100 km of displacement. I had the good fortune while in Santa Barbara of spending two days in the field with him on a college field trip and a fault study in an area where he had done the original geologic mapping, as well as meeting with him at his home several times to obtain and discuss preprints of some of his geologic maps for other projects. Mark P. Molinari Senior Project Geologist URS Corporation Century Square 1501 Fourth Avenue, Suite 1400 Seattle, WA 98101-1616 (206) 438-2700 ext. 2235 (866) 495-1404 Direct FAX (866) 495-5288 Office FAX mark_molinari@urscorp.com ----- Forwarded by Mark Molinari/Seattle/URSCorp on 11/18/04 12:54 PM From: To: 11/18/04 11:51 AM Subject: Tom Dibblee Tom Dibblee, southern California's local legend, died yesterday at his home in Santa Barbara. Please forward this note on to those who may wish to know as Tom was an inspiration to so many. Funeral services will be held on Tuesday November 23 at 10:00 in the Mission Church. Plans for a Reception and Memorial Service are being finalized. The intention is to hold the reception at the Natural History Museum about 1:00. More later. - Matt H., SoCal Chair -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot From cweinber at bcpl.net Thu Nov 18 15:07:00 2004 From: cweinber at bcpl.net (Carolyn Weinberger) Date: Thu Nov 18 15:10:01 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] MATRIX magazine In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8D750044-39B6-11D9-8F4F-0005025E4230@bcpl.net> Cathy, Wonder if Mitch Portnoy might be interested? Of course, he's already doing Mineral News, and this is a far more involved project. Or maybe John White? Just thoughts. C On Thursday, November 18, 2004, at 02:05 PM, Catherine Gaber wrote: > Dear Rockhounds, > > As most of you know, Jay Lininger, editor, publisher and primary > author of MATRIX magazine, passed away last month. I just had a long > talk with his widow, Paula. She does not know what to do with the > magazine. Jay devoted much of his time for the last decade to > producing this fine publication on the history of mining and minerals > and the people involved. It would be a shame to have this publication > discontinued. > > There are many articles in process for several new issues and the next > issue is partially completed. Paula handles most of the "office work" > - mailing list, subscriptions, accounting matters and the like, but > she is not a minerals person and can not take on the editing. She > would like to find someone who would be willing to become the new > editor. If you have any interest in this or know someone who might, > please call her weekdays at MATRIX Publishing (717) 764-9673. > > Cathy Gaber > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From lanny at lrream.com Thu Nov 18 15:17:11 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Thu Nov 18 15:52:24 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras In-Reply-To: <001e01c4cdb3$35f7f860$bd904c0c@fekib> References: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> <001e01c4cdb3$35f7f860$bd904c0c@fekib> Message-ID: Hi Larry, The end result of a macro lens is much the same as being able to focus close with a "normal" lens. Of course the amount of the closeup effect and amount of what you might perceive as magnification varies with the lens's focal length. This isn't quite the same as a 3x lens compared to a 3x macro lens, because the 3x lens may not focus close. Macro lenses are made for digital cameras, but it has to be DSLR (that is a digital SLR), a camera in which you an change lenses. You can get good results using add on lenses made for close focusing to a standard digital camera. These are made for many models. They aren't as good of quality lenses, but they can be quite adequate. The optical zoom feature of a lens typically does not improve how close you can focus, in fact, most lenses have a greater focus distance with the lens zoomed in than with it zoomed out. Thus you negate the effect of the telephoto property for things that are close. You can make it look like you are closer to (enlarge) and object that is far away, but not one that is close. For an add on close up lens, do a search for: Raynox lens. These mount on your cameras existing lens. There are other brands, but these do work well; Vivitar probably makes some too. Regards, Lanny On Nov 18, 2004, at 1:11 PM, Lawrence Rush wrote: > A follow-up question on the discussion on digital cameras........ > > Is an optical zoom of 3X essentially the same as a 3x macro lens in > film cameras? Are macro lenses made for digital cameras, or does the > optical zoom provide all that is needed for close-up shots? > > I find that even with the optical zoom feature, my digital camera > cannot focus on images closer than > 4-5 cm. What do I need to do this? > > Thanks.............Larry Rush > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Thu Nov 18 15:56:01 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Thu Nov 18 15:58:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras References: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> <001e01c4cdb3$35f7f860$bd904c0c@fekib> Message-ID: <002d01c4cdca$2e9ac7c0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> From: "Lawrence Rush" Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras A follow-up question on the discussion on digital cameras........ Is an optical zoom of 3X essentially the same as a 3x macro lens in film cameras? Are macro lenses made for digital cameras, or does the optical zoom provide all that is needed for close-up shots? *Nope, not even close. The "MACRO" feature is a focus thing, not a magnifier.* I find that even with the optical zoom feature, my digital camera cannot focus on images closer than 4-5 cm. What do I need to do this? *A "macro" lens or feature.* Thanks.............Larry Rush *De nada!!!! I am quite an amateur myself. Photography is another one of my many hobbies that I really enjoy but only know enough about to get into trouble and cause serious irritation to serious, truly knowledgeble experts. * ROTFL Glenn Wimpee --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rik.dillen at skynet.be Thu Nov 18 13:24:54 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Thu Nov 18 16:55:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras In-Reply-To: <001e01c4cdb3$35f7f860$bd904c0c@fekib> Message-ID: <000001c4cdb5$0f7161c0$a7c5f051@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Lawrence Rush *Sent: donderdag 18 november 2004 22:12 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras * *Is an optical zoom of 3X essentially the same as a 3x macro lens in film cameras? Are macro lenses made for digital cameras, or does the optical zoom provide all that is needed for close-up shots? >>>>> There are some big optical differences between typical reflexcameras and so-called point-and-shoot cameras. The (only, fixed) lens on a PAS camera is always a compromise between a wide angle lens, a portrait lens, a telelens and a macrolens. A real macro-lens intended for a reflex camera is optically much more complex (much more optical elements) that is much better corrected for macro-work. On the other hand the range of a PAS lens is much wider. To use a macro-lens for small objects (image < 2 cm) you need a bellows or extension rings to get close enough to the object. PRO reflex-camera with specialised macro-lens : image quality is much better (better lenses, each pixel on the sensor is about 7 X 7 ?m, compared to about 1.5 X 1.5 ?m in a PAS, less noise), much broader range of sensitivity (ISO), shutter (up to 1/8000), better depth of field, very short shutter lag (20-30 ms), immediate start-up of the camera (milliseconds !) CONTRA : much more hassle for the set-up and manipulation of instrumentation, very high price (D70 : 1300 ?, set of extension tubes 250 ?, macro-lens 60 mm f/3.5 500 ?), weight (my camera + several lenses = about 2.5 kg !), voluminous. * *I find that even with the optical zoom feature, my digital camera cannot focus on images closer than 4-5 cm. What do I need to do this? >>>>> There are PAS cameras that can get closer (the newest Nikons e.g.), and with a reflex camera you need bellows or extension tubes to achieve that. Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From bg at his.com Thu Nov 18 17:09:02 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Thu Nov 18 17:09:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] MATRIX magazine In-Reply-To: <8D750044-39B6-11D9-8F4F-0005025E4230@bcpl.net> References: <8D750044-39B6-11D9-8F4F-0005025E4230@bcpl.net> Message-ID: <99A82892-39C7-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> dear carolyn, thanks. fred sch. suggested tom tucker. i just hope steve speyer doesn't want it! cathy On Nov 18, 2004, at 6:07 PM, Carolyn Weinberger wrote: > Cathy, > > Wonder if Mitch Portnoy might be interested? Of course, he's already > doing Mineral News, and this is a far more involved project. Or maybe > John White? > > Just thoughts. > C > > On Thursday, November 18, 2004, at 02:05 PM, Catherine Gaber wrote: > >> Dear Rockhounds, >> >> As most of you know, Jay Lininger, editor, publisher and primary >> author of MATRIX magazine, passed away last month. I just had a long >> talk with his widow, Paula. She does not know what to do with the >> magazine. Jay devoted much of his time for the last decade to >> producing this fine publication on the history of mining and minerals >> and the people involved. It would be a shame to have this publication >> discontinued. >> >> There are many articles in process for several new issues and the >> next issue is partially completed. Paula handles most of the "office >> work" - mailing list, subscriptions, accounting matters and the like, >> but she is not a minerals person and can not take on the editing. She >> would like to find someone who would be willing to become the new >> editor. If you have any interest in this or know someone who might, >> please call her weekdays at MATRIX Publishing (717) 764-9673. >> >> Cathy Gaber >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From bg at his.com Thu Nov 18 17:11:21 2004 From: bg at his.com (Catherine Gaber) Date: Thu Nov 18 17:11:24 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] MATRIX magazine In-Reply-To: <99A82892-39C7-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> References: <8D750044-39B6-11D9-8F4F-0005025E4230@bcpl.net> <99A82892-39C7-11D9-AAFA-000A95A8FEB6@his.com> Message-ID: sorry folks, personal response! From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 18 17:29:13 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 18 17:29:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Purpurite question References: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> Message-ID: <419D4C62.6182@Tomaszewski.net> Rik Dillen wrote: > > Does anyone know if purpurite was known in the antiquity already as a pigment for art works ? > This is a question of someone who is doing research on the subject. > Thanks for any hint or information and greetings, > > Rik DILLEN Kremer Pigments (www.kremer-pigmente.de) includes purpurite pigment in its researched historical pigments (used by the old masters) that they have documented and recreated (often using the original mining locations). If Dr. Georg Kremer can't answer your questions I'm sure he can tell you who could. Kreigh From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 18 18:04:24 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 18 18:04:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras References: <9d.530ded9d.2ece77f8@aol.com> Message-ID: <419D549C.1962@Tomaszewski.net> Gslrocks@aol.com wrote: > > even the Macros settings are different on most digital cameras. I can focus > as close as 1 cm with my Sony F505V's and F717. My friend has a Ricoh that will > only focus at 5 cm in macro mode. All lenses have a minimum focal distance; 4cm is common for macro work with digital cameras, but some are much better. One of the things I have found I can do with my Fuji MX-1200 is use it instead of my eye with any lens, loop, or microscope. Put the center of your hand lens over the center of the camera's digital eye, and focus on the subject by moving the camera and lens together towards the object until it is a picture, watching the camera display to see when it is focused. You might have to adjust the camera/lens spacing for best results, but I usually find just putting them together works (though the magnification is slightly reduced). A bit of tape will hold a hand lens in place if you are doing more than a couple shots. The trick works because you are changing the optics and reducing the minimum focal distance. Kreigh From Gslrocks at aol.com Thu Nov 18 18:18:59 2004 From: Gslrocks at aol.com (Gslrocks@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 18 18:19:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras Message-ID: <86.1b796cbe.2eceb213@aol.com> when i bought those cameras i basically did not know anything, it took a bit of reckoning to do UV pictures but after 2-400 pics a night i figured out the strong and weak points of each model. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From arf at mc.net Thu Nov 18 17:52:33 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Thu Nov 18 19:30:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds Message-ID: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would float. Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it might be if it even exists. Any ideas? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From morningstar at att.net Thu Nov 18 20:13:31 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Thu Nov 18 20:13:30 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds In-Reply-To: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> References: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <419D72EB.1060002@att.net> Jack Schmidling wrote: > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would > float. > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it > might be if it even exists. Well . . . actually I think you'd get the quartz to float first, since the SG is ~2.65 and diamond is ~3.52. However you are thinking along the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: the solution you want is Thallium Malonate Formate (Clerici Solution). I am telling you this because you would have eventually found it anyway, or someone would have told you. Now comes the obligatory melodrama that annoys the initiated and astounds the innocent: heavy liquids are not for the beginner. The denser, the nastier, and Clerici's Solution is among the nastiest. http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/thallium_f_V1.shtml http://www.cargille.com/heavyliq.shtml I don't know if there are safer alternatives in that SG range; for some purposes, a barite slurry can fill the same role, with an SG a little higher than Clerici's, and almost non-toxic, except you would have a difficult time separating small clear mineral grains out of it I suppose. But yes, for professional purposes and under controlled circumstances, a calibrated and clear solution such as Clerici's would be the way to go for what you want to do. However, please hold out for a safer alternative. Good luck, Don From mosasaur47 at msn.com Thu Nov 18 20:27:56 2004 From: mosasaur47 at msn.com (Kenneth Quinn) Date: Thu Nov 18 20:29:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds References: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> <419D72EB.1060002@att.net> Message-ID: > the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: the > solution you want is Thallium Malonate Formate (Clerici Solution). I am > telling you this because you would have eventually found it anyway, or > someone would have told you. Now comes the obligatory melodrama that > annoys the initiated and astounds the innocent: heavy liquids are not > for the beginner. The denser, the nastier, and Clerici's Solution is > among the nastiest. > At the Arkansas Geological Commission, we had much more occasion that most state surveys to determine if something was a diamond. There, we used a liquid - can't remember the full name, we shortened it to "tetrabromo". It too was a nasty, toxic substance. BTW, barite would also sink in it. Place a rough diamond by a piece of quartz or glass and the difference in luster is pretty obvious, at least to me. Kenneth Quinn From arf at mc.net Thu Nov 18 20:30:21 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Thu Nov 18 20:30:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds References: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> <419D72EB.1060002@att.net> Message-ID: <013101c4cdf0$7eeb9530$b25e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Don H" > Well . . . actually I think you'd get the quartz to float first, since > the SG is ~2.65 and diamond is ~3.52. However you are thinking along > the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: I just finished reading the Ganoskin article. I should have googled before asking. Nice to know my old brain still works just has few gaps in the data base. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 18 20:32:50 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 18 20:32:24 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds References: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <419D7752.1CA@Tomaszewski.net> Jack Schmidling wrote: > > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would > float. > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it > might be if it even exists. > > Any ideas? > > js Get out your trusty CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics and look thru the table of specific gravity of liquids for one in the range you can obtain. Elutriation also gives you a method of sorting by specific gravity. Kreigh From Lapadary at aol.com Thu Nov 18 20:47:39 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Thu Nov 18 20:47:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions Message-ID: <1a0.2bfcce1c.2eced4eb@aol.com> I saw a small, round faceted sapphire for sale on eBay. It was .05 carats and looked pretty good in the photo. I was wondering how many facets there were on it but I couldn't tell. My guess is that at least 16 facets would be necessary to shape a round stone. That got me curious about how small a faceted stone could be, using normal faceting tools. And how many facets does it take to make a round shape? Each facet must be pretty small if the finished product is 1/20 carat. Measuring the angles must take a real precision tool. Does anybody know what the minimum facet able size is (excluding emerald cuts)? The .05 carat sapphire on eBay didn't get any bids, not even the $.99 cent opening bid. I think the $2.99 shipping and handling kept people away? Who would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? Grant Johnston, Chico, CA --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 18 21:05:13 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 18 21:04:41 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions References: <1a0.2bfcce1c.2eced4eb@aol.com> Message-ID: <419D7EE3.B1F@Tomaszewski.net> Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > The .05 carat sapphire on eBay didn't get any bids, not even the $.99 cent > opening bid. I think the $2.99 shipping and handling kept people away? Who > would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? If you had multiple computer controlled faceting units, 99 cents might make a profit. From afox at drizzle.com Thu Nov 18 23:10:21 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Thu Nov 18 23:10:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... (fwd) Message-ID: FYI. God, I'm still at work, 23:10. Sigh. -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 22:26:29 -0800 From: Luke Kim To: afox@drizzle.com Subject: Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... Hello my name is Luke Kim and am the Publicity Chair for the Pasadena Lapidary Society (PLS). We currently do not have a website nor a web group, this is forthcoming though. Our club address is: Pasadena Lapidary Society, P.O. Box 5025, Pasadena, CA 91117-0025 Luke Kim Graphic Designer / Web Designer / IT Darkside Graphic Design Studio 323.401.2116 (Mobile) darksidegds@sbcglobal.net From folmstead at rcn.com Fri Nov 19 05:59:11 2004 From: folmstead at rcn.com (Fred Olmstead) Date: Fri Nov 19 05:42:15 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] NVMC Show In-Reply-To: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> References: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <419DFC2F.9070004@rcn.com> YOU ARE INVITED SATURDAY Nov. 20 - 10:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m. SUNDAY Nov 21 - 10:00 a.m. - 4:00 p.m. The Northern Virginia Mineral Club,Inc. Annual Gem, Mineral, & Fossil Show at George Mason University Fairfax, Virginia Student Union Building II Free shuttle bus from parking lot to show Silent Auction on Sunday 2:00 p.m Mini Mines & Fossil Dig for kids and Quizzes Quality Mineral & Fossil Dealers Demonstrations, Exhibits Door Prizes Some of the Displays ---Daylignt--- Minerals from the Luck Stone Quarries Cataclysm!!! Record in the Rocks Minerals collected on Club Field Trips Some Sands of the World Minerals of Butte, Montana Minerals of Franklin, New Jersey ---Fuorescent Mineral Cases----- Hardystonite, Esperite and Friends Midwave Ultraviolet Classics Ride the Ultraviolet Waves!! >Come... Enjoy... > > > > > > > From rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu Fri Nov 19 06:49:18 2004 From: rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu (Pete Richards) Date: Fri Nov 19 06:49:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain In-Reply-To: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> References: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Message-ID: I might point out that these cannot be octahedrons because the symmetry group to which dolomite belogs does not include the octahedron as a form. If you were to measure one of these crystals carefully, you would find that the angles between the faces are not the same as the angles between the faces of an octahedron, though they are fairly close. These crystals are pseudo-octahedrons, and are formed from six faces belonging to a rhombohedron (I'm not sure which one) and two faces from the basal pinacoid {0001}. On my single example, the edges of the pinacoid faces are etched into grooves, which allows them to be distinguished from the faces of the rhombohedron. The Ol' Crystallographer >Hi Group, > Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. >While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across >some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons >labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but >somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, >but can anyone enlighten me more about them. I did do a search on >Google, and came up with one single hit; Many Facets Rock Shop, >in Albany, NY. The gentleman is a member of the drizzle list, but he >knows the same info as me. So two of us can profit from extra info. >The specimens originally came from Rich Hamill of Rochester, NY. >Maybe those from Rochester may know of him. > On another note, the specimens are also for sale, if anyone needs >one for thier collection. Rich had a $2.50 price on them, per crystal. >I'll lower the price to $2.00 for list members, plus shipping. >Thanks, and have a good evening. >Dave Phillips >Sunset Fossils & Minerals >Morgantown, WV > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu Fri Nov 19 06:51:33 2004 From: rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu (Pete Richards) Date: Fri Nov 19 06:51:37 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain In-Reply-To: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> References: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Message-ID: Hi Dave, I'd be potentially interested in one of these "teruelites" too. How big are the crystals? How sharp? On matrix or off? Regards, Pete -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From LarryRush at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 19 07:04:30 2004 From: LarryRush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Fri Nov 19 07:03:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras References: <9d.530ded9d.2ece77f8@aol.com> <419D549C.1962@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <003201c4ce49$132f06c0$d4884c0c@fekib> Good thinking, Kreigh! Thanks, and thanks to all who gave me the great tips on my digital "macro" questions!! Larry Rush ----- Original Message ----- From: Kreigh Tomaszewski To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 9:04 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras Gslrocks@aol.com wrote: > > even the Macros settings are different on most digital cameras. I can focus > as close as 1 cm with my Sony F505V's and F717. My friend has a Ricoh that will > only focus at 5 cm in macro mode. All lenses have a minimum focal distance; 4cm is common for macro work with digital cameras, but some are much better. One of the things I have found I can do with my Fuji MX-1200 is use it instead of my eye with any lens, loop, or microscope. Put the center of your hand lens over the center of the camera's digital eye, and focus on the subject by moving the camera and lens together towards the object until it is a picture, watching the camera display to see when it is focused. You might have to adjust the camera/lens spacing for best results, but I usually find just putting them together works (though the magnification is slightly reduced). A bit of tape will hold a hand lens in place if you are doing more than a couple shots. The trick works because you are changing the optics and reducing the minimum focal distance. Kreigh _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rik.dillen at skynet.be Fri Nov 19 10:44:37 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Fri Nov 19 10:45:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c4ce67$d5afad30$4169c950@maxdata> Here is a scan of my (only) specimen of aragonite, var. teruleite. Go to http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen/photos.htm and scroll down to the bottom of the page Size of the specimen is roughly 6X6 cm (XX nearly 1 cm). Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Pete Richards *Sent: vrijdag 19 november 2004 15:52 *To: BETADAV97@aol.com *Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain * * *Hi Dave, * *I'd be potentially interested in one of these "teruelites" *too. How big are the crystals? How sharp? On matrix or off? * *Regards, *Pete *-- *-------------------------------------------------------------------- *R. Peter Richards *rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu * *Mineral collector *Crystallographer *SHAPE for the Macintosh _______________________________________________ *Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List *WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds *Subscription Services: *http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds * * From mela at bartnet.net Fri Nov 19 11:07:39 2004 From: mela at bartnet.net (Mel Albright) Date: Fri Nov 19 11:07:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions References: <1a0.2bfcce1c.2eced4eb@aol.com> Message-ID: <002d01c4ce6b$0db00b00$f6b3950c@jessie> I have done a 1 mm faceted (simplified DRB) stone and 8 facets looked round enough for all practical purposes. At that size, you have to be real close to see them anyway. Mel From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 19 11:40:24 2004 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Fri Nov 19 11:40:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds In-Reply-To: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <20041119194024.60327.qmail@web51001.mail.yahoo.com> The "tetrabromide" that Ken mentioned is probably acetylene tetrabromide. Yes, it's hazardous, but the recommended diluents are worse: carbon tetrachloride and benzene! All three are positively benign compared to the thallous formate, though. A drop of that stuff is enough to kill a horse. I'm not sure I'd want to use it even in a glove box. Jim Daly --- Jack Schmidling wrote: > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort > diamonds from quartz. > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz > and the diamonds would > float. > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find > such a liquid and what it > might be if it even exists. > > Any ideas? > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > http://schmidling.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today! http://my.yahoo.com From rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu Fri Nov 19 11:46:10 2004 From: rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu (Pete Richards) Date: Fri Nov 19 11:46:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain In-Reply-To: <000001c4ce67$d5afad30$4169c950@maxdata> References: <000001c4ce67$d5afad30$4169c950@maxdata> Message-ID: You must mean dolomite.... Cheers, Pete >Here is a scan of my (only) specimen of aragonite, var. teruleite. >Go to >http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen/photos.htm >and scroll down to the bottom of the page >Size of the specimen is roughly 6X6 cm (XX nearly 1 cm). > >Greetings, > >Rik DILLEN >Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas >Belgium > >E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > >Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From rik.dillen at skynet.be Fri Nov 19 12:05:20 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Fri Nov 19 12:06:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000c01c4ce73$2001b440$4169c950@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Pete Richards *Sent: vrijdag 19 november 2004 20:46 *To: rik.dillen@skynet.be *Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain * *You must mean dolomite.... * >>>>> Oh hell, of course !! Time to wake up :>)) (it's 21:00 h now) Greetings, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From tjokela at execulink.com Fri Nov 19 13:14:00 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Fri Nov 19 13:13:59 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions References: <1a0.2bfcce1c.2eced4eb@aol.com> Message-ID: <006901c4ce7c$b0a7f3c0$6401a8c0@Junior> > Does anybody know what the minimum facet able size is (excluding emerald > cuts)? > I asked that question on this list a loooong time ago, and was told that 1mm across is about the minimum. Faceting machines are indeed extremely precise - and expensive. I've been told a good unit starts at something like $4,000. > Who > would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? > Most cutting is done overseas for pitiful wages. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com From scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com Fri Nov 19 16:30:37 2004 From: scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) Date: Fri Nov 19 16:38:41 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Updated web site with 147 new stibnite-included quartz crystals from Bottomley- References: <000001c4cce3$05b55970$ca3488d9@maxdata> Message-ID: <030801c4ce98$28640190$f0114ed1@gbm> Hello All, I am pleased to announce that I have posted group pictures of the remaining 147, $10-$30 stibnite-included quartz specimens I have from our dig at the Bottomley mine, Pershing County, Nevada. Enjoy! http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite%20Included%20Quartz%20for%20Sale%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals 3895 Lisa Ct, #C Reno, NV 89503 (775) 322-9067 www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com From Lapadary at aol.com Fri Nov 19 17:00:21 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 19 17:00:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah Message-ID: <1a0.2c0424ce.2ecff125@aol.com> This is a nice write up about Sunstone Knoll near Delta, UTAH. Also, this site is just off the pavement and makes good winter collecting _http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm_ (http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm) Grant Johnston --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Lapadary at aol.com Fri Nov 19 17:25:08 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Fri Nov 19 17:25:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions Message-ID: <7b.38b244fd.2ecff6f4@aol.com> In a message dated 11/19/04 11:08:42 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, mela@bartnet.net writes: I have done a 1 mm faceted (simplified DRB) stone and 8 facets looked round enough for all practical purposes. At that size, you have to be real close to see them anyway. ====================== Thanks Mel, Does DRB mean round brilliant? Approximately what would 1 mm be in carats? I've subsequently found several small faceted stone on eBay, including a .06 c arat, yellow brilliant cut diamond. Some of the photos are great but there is nothing to show scale. I'm not interested in buying a diamond but such small stones arouse my curiosity. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From afox at drizzle.com Fri Nov 19 22:16:43 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Fri Nov 19 22:16:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah In-Reply-To: <1a0.2c0424ce.2ecff125@aol.com> Message-ID: I've done this trip, and, although it was an easy drive, didn't really have all that much luck as a collecting locality. Had much more fun going after ozokerite and the Vernon Wonderstone, both of which are also easy winter drives. Has anyone had good luck at Sunstone Knoll, or am I just an abberation? (It wouldn't be the first time...) Write up was good, however. a. > This is a nice write up about Sunstone Knoll near Delta, UTAH. Also, this > site is just off the pavement and makes good winter collecting > > _http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm_ > (http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm) > > Grant Johnston > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > -- afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your computer. Press any key to reboot From scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com Fri Nov 19 22:49:47 2004 From: scottkleine at greatbasinminerals.com (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) Date: Fri Nov 19 22:57:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] I have updated web site with 147 new stibnite-included quartz crystals from Bottomley- References: Message-ID: <037701c4cecd$2052c790$f0114ed1@gbm> Hello All, I am pleased to announce that I have posted group pictures of the remaining 147, $10-$30 stibnite-included quartz specimens I have from our dig at the Bottomley mine, Pershing County, Nevada. Enjoy! http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite%20Included%20Quartz%20for%20Sale%20Page.htm All the best! Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals www.greatbasinminerals.com scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com From JWachsmuth at gmx.de Sat Nov 20 00:59:06 2004 From: JWachsmuth at gmx.de (Juergen Wachsmuth) Date: Sat Nov 20 00:56:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain References: <65.389634fc.2ecd228c@aol.com> Message-ID: <419F075A.C1FCA6FA@gmx.de> Hello, as far as I guess you are talking about specimens of teruelite. This is a black variety of dolomite coloured by organic substances. The name is given after the town Teruel, Aragon, Spain. I would not say the name is discredited as it never was accepted as a species. It is a historic name given to these crystals by local collectors / scientists back in 1845; other sources say 1873 (citation is Quiroga, F. (1873), Anal.Soc.Espan.Hist.Nat., ser. 1, vol. 2, p.249). I never saved any other reference from this journal, and did not read this one. It may be pretty difficult to get it outside of Spain. I have no idea by whow and when the identity of teruelite and dolomite was determined. According to BAUER (1977) the locality is situated about 5 km from Teruel near the road to Valdecebro. Crystals up to 2 cm were reported and available at that time. Other minerals at the locality: red quartz crystals about 5-10 mm length ("Eisenkiesel"), lots of massive gypsum. Bauer,F.(1977): Sammelnotizen aus Spanien, Lapis, Jg. 02, Nr. 10, p. 26 Regards, Juergen Wachsmuth Ulm - Germany TDAV97@aol.com schrieb: > Hi Group, > Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. > While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across > some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons > labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but > somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, > but can anyone enlighten me more about them. > Thanks, and have a good evening. > Dave Phillips > Sunset Fossils & Minerals > Morgantown, WV > From BNMJEFF at aol.com Sat Nov 20 03:54:48 2004 From: BNMJEFF at aol.com (BNMJEFF@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 20 03:54:58 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] gem & mineral society show Message-ID: <1c5.204701a4.2ed08a88@aol.com> The Gem & Mineral Society of the Palm Beaches 38th Annual Gem, mineral, fossil, jewelry show and sale Sat. Nov. 20, 2004 9-6PM Sun Nov 21. 2004 10-5PM Quality dealers from all over the USA.... Fossil and running water flume mine..goede cracking.. Viist... www.gemandmineral.cc for $2.00 off admission coupon --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From lanny at lrream.com Sat Nov 20 09:20:56 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Sat Nov 20 09:19:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8A00685A-3B18-11D9-9DA1-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> Hi Aaron, Collecting sunstones on the knoll is difficult. I've talked with a couple people who did well, but they wouldn't reveal any secrets. Many years ago when I lived in Utah for a short time and first heard about the locality I stopped in for a while and picked up a few on the knoll, it was such a convenient stop on the way to the Thomas Range. Ended up with a small plastic vial about half the size of a 35 mm film can full. Several years ago, while down their exploring again, I stopped in "just for old times sake," and was walking around the knoll not finding anything at all and decided to take a look at those big flats off the east side hoping there were some that had been eroded out. Easy pickings out there, the sunstones were scattered all over like small pieces of glass glistening in the sunshine. It only took a little while to pick up a small handful. Later I heard that I didn't make such a brilliant discovery, that is where most people collect. On an FM trip I took the group out there as we were driving by and everyone did well. Regards, Lanny On Nov 19, 2004, at 10:16 PM, Aaron Fox wrote: > I've done this trip, and, although it was an easy drive, didn't really > have all that much luck as a collecting locality. Had much more fun > going > after ozokerite and the Vernon Wonderstone, both of which are also easy > winter drives. > > Has anyone had good luck at Sunstone Knoll, or am I just an abberation? > (It wouldn't be the first time...) > > Write up was good, however. > > a. > > >> This is a nice write up about Sunstone Knoll near Delta, UTAH. Also, >> this >> site is just off the pavement and makes good winter collecting >> >> _http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm_ >> (http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm) >> >> Grant Johnston >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> > > -- > afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox > FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your > computer. Press any key to reboot > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From Lapadary at aol.com Sat Nov 20 11:19:58 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 20 11:20:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah Message-ID: <7f.518ffc19.2ed0f2de@aol.com> In a message dated 11/19/04 10:17:00 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, afox@drizzle.com writes: Has anyone had good luck at Sunstone Knoll, or am I just an abberation? (It wouldn't be the first time...) =============================== The secret is to go on a day when the sun is out (and the black flies are not). Then you go onto the flat behind the knoll -- opposite the RR tracks. There is no reason to climb the hill unless you have hard rock tools. The flat is littered with millions of loose sunstones. The first time I saw the sunstones I thought I was looking at detritus from a broken windshield. Foe best results, take along a kid -- or somebody else built close to the ground. My understanding these sunstones are not facet quality. I'm not sure why. The don't have the color or schiller seen in Oregon sunstones but when the sun hits them they really light up. I think they could be improved by faceting, just like diamonds, so I'm not sure why they are not considered jewel quality. I think hunting on Sunstone Knolls is good practice for Topaz Mountain -- or vice versa. If the sun is out and you are in the correct area, they are hard to miss. There is a major difference, the sunstones can be located in a 10 - 15 minute drive from Delta. Topaz Mountain is an hour drive down the Bush-Wellman Road. Then there is a mile or two of dirt road leading into the cove. However, an hour at each place should give a good supply of material. You should be able to fill a pill bottle in an hour or two, if you can bend over that often in an hour. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kahako at aloha.net Sat Nov 20 12:08:58 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Nov 20 11:39:38 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] lava update Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> Sorry if this is repetitious, but the URL below has as nice a variety of photos of the present lava activity at Kilauea as you're likely to find on one page: helicopter views of the crater and ocean entry, daytime and night pics of lava pouring and dripping into the sea, and red lava crawling across old cooled stuff. Nearly all are worth clicking on "large" to see the image fill your screen. http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/kilauea/update/main.html Aloha, Kitty -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.1 - Release Date: 11/19/2004 From rockcurrier at cs.com Sat Nov 20 13:50:35 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Sat Nov 20 13:41:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 19 References: <200411200202.iAK22Dun019237@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000801c4cf4a$f7feffb0$6901a8c0@rock3> Dear Grant, In one of the Gems and Gemology magazines of several years ago I think that their trade laboratories enchanted a full cut round standard brilliant cut diamonds (57 facets?) if a point or so. 100 points = 1 carat. I think the stone was cut just to show it could be done and not for commercial purposes. I don't know what that would measure in millimeters. Certainly you would need a microscope to see it and count the faces. Rock ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 18:02 Subject: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 19 > Send Rockhounds mailing list submissions to > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > rockhounds-request@lists.drizzle.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > rockhounds-owner@lists.drizzle.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Rockhounds digest..." > > > [Rockhounds-Digest] > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Digital cameras (Kreigh Tomaszewski) > 2. Re: Digital cameras (Gslrocks@aol.com) > 3. Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Jack Schmidling) > 4. Re: Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Don H) > 5. Re: Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Kenneth Quinn) > 6. Re: Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Jack Schmidling) > 7. Re: Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Kreigh Tomaszewski) > 8. faceting questions (Lapadary@aol.com) > 9. Re: faceting questions (Kreigh Tomaszewski) > 10. Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... (fwd) (Aaron Fox) > 11. NVMC Show (Fred Olmstead) > 12. Re: Terulite, Terul, Spain (Pete Richards) > 13. Terulite, Terul, Spain (Pete Richards) > 14. Re: Digital cameras (Lawrence Rush) > 15. RE: Terulite, Terul, Spain (Rik Dillen) > 16. Re: faceting questions (Mel Albright) > 17. Re: Specific Gravity and Diamonds (Jim Daly) > 18. RE: Terulite, Terul, Spain (Pete Richards) > 19. RE: Terulite, Terul, Spain (Rik Dillen) > 20. Re: faceting questions (Tim Jokela Jr.) > 21. Updated web site with 147 new stibnite-included quartz > crystals from Bottomley- (Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals) > 22. sunstones in Utah (Lapadary@aol.com) > 23. Re: faceting questions (Lapadary@aol.com) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:04:24 -0500 > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <419D549C.1962@Tomaszewski.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Gslrocks@aol.com wrote: > > > > even the Macros settings are different on most digital cameras. I can focus > > as close as 1 cm with my Sony F505V's and F717. My friend has a Ricoh that will > > only focus at 5 cm in macro mode. > > All lenses have a minimum focal distance; 4cm is common for macro work > with digital cameras, but some are much better. > > One of the things I have found I can do with my Fuji MX-1200 is use it > instead of my eye with any lens, loop, or microscope. Put the center of > your hand lens over the center of the camera's digital eye, and focus on > the subject by moving the camera and lens together towards the object > until it is a picture, watching the camera display to see when it is > focused. You might have to adjust the camera/lens spacing for best > results, but I usually find just putting them together works (though the > magnification is slightly reduced). A bit of tape will hold a hand lens > in place if you are doing more than a couple shots. > > The trick works because you are changing the optics and reducing the > minimum focal distance. > > Kreigh > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:18:59 EST > From: Gslrocks@aol.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: <86.1b796cbe.2eceb213@aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > when i bought those cameras i basically did not know anything, it took a bit > of reckoning to do UV pictures but after 2-400 pics a night i figured out the > strong and weak points of each model. > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 19:52:33 -0600 > From: "Jack Schmidling" > Subject: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "aRockhounds" > Message-ID: <00a401c4cde8$1b002e80$b25e70d1@S0033035959> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would > float. > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it > might be if it even exists. > > Any ideas? > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:13:31 -0500 > From: Don H > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <419D72EB.1060002@att.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > Jack Schmidling wrote: > > > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would > > float. > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it > > might be if it even exists. > > Well . . . actually I think you'd get the quartz to float first, since > the SG is ~2.65 and diamond is ~3.52. However you are thinking along > the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: the > solution you want is Thallium Malonate Formate (Clerici Solution). I am > telling you this because you would have eventually found it anyway, or > someone would have told you. Now comes the obligatory melodrama that > annoys the initiated and astounds the innocent: heavy liquids are not > for the beginner. The denser, the nastier, and Clerici's Solution is > among the nastiest. > > http://risk.lsd.ornl.gov/tox/profiles/thallium_f_V1.shtml > http://www.cargille.com/heavyliq.shtml > > I don't know if there are safer alternatives in that SG range; for some > purposes, a barite slurry can fill the same role, with an SG a little > higher than Clerici's, and almost non-toxic, except you would have a > difficult time separating small clear mineral grains out of it I suppose. > > But yes, for professional purposes and under controlled circumstances, a > calibrated and clear solution such as Clerici's would be the way to go > for what you want to do. However, please hold out for a safer > alternative. > > > Good luck, > > Don > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 22:27:56 -0600 > From: "Kenneth Quinn" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > > the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: the > > solution you want is Thallium Malonate Formate (Clerici Solution). I am > > telling you this because you would have eventually found it anyway, or > > someone would have told you. Now comes the obligatory melodrama that > > annoys the initiated and astounds the innocent: heavy liquids are not > > for the beginner. The denser, the nastier, and Clerici's Solution is > > among the nastiest. > > > > > At the Arkansas Geological Commission, we had much more occasion that most > state surveys to determine if something was a diamond. There, we used a > liquid - can't remember the full name, we shortened it to "tetrabromo". It > too was a nasty, toxic substance. BTW, barite would also sink in it. > > Place a rough diamond by a piece of quartz or glass and the difference in > luster is pretty obvious, at least to me. > > Kenneth Quinn > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 22:30:21 -0600 > From: "Jack Schmidling" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <013101c4cdf0$7eeb9530$b25e70d1@S0033035959> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > From: "Don H" > > > Well . . . actually I think you'd get the quartz to float first, since > > the SG is ~2.65 and diamond is ~3.52. However you are thinking along > > the right track and that is good. None the less, prepare to die: > > I just finished reading the Ganoskin article. I should have googled before > asking. Nice to know my old brain still works just has few gaps in the data > base. > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:32:50 -0500 > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <419D7752.1CA@Tomaszewski.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Jack Schmidling wrote: > > > > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort diamonds from quartz. > > > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz and the diamonds would > > float. > > > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find such a liquid and what it > > might be if it even exists. > > > > Any ideas? > > > > js > > > Get out your trusty CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics and look thru > the table of specific gravity of liquids for one in the range you can > obtain. > > Elutriation also gives you a method of sorting by specific gravity. > > Kreigh > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:47:39 EST > From: Lapadary@aol.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: <1a0.2bfcce1c.2eced4eb@aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > I saw a small, round faceted sapphire for sale on eBay. It was .05 carats > and looked pretty good in the photo. I was wondering how many facets there were > on it but I couldn't tell. My guess is that at least 16 facets would be > necessary to shape a round stone. > > That got me curious about how small a faceted stone could be, using normal > faceting tools. And how many facets does it take to make a round shape? Each > facet must be pretty small if the finished product is 1/20 carat. Measuring > the angles must take a real precision tool. > > Does anybody know what the minimum facet able size is (excluding emerald > cuts)? > > The .05 carat sapphire on eBay didn't get any bids, not even the $.99 cent > opening bid. I think the $2.99 shipping and handling kept people away? Who > would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? > > Grant Johnston, Chico, CA > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 00:05:13 -0500 > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] faceting questions > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <419D7EE3.B1F@Tomaszewski.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > > The .05 carat sapphire on eBay didn't get any bids, not even the $.99 cent > > opening bid. I think the $2.99 shipping and handling kept people away? Who > > would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? > > If you had multiple computer controlled faceting units, 99 cents might > make a profit. > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:10:21 -0800 (PST) > From: Aaron Fox > Subject: [Rockhounds] Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... (fwd) > To: Rockhounds mailing list > Message-ID: > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > FYI. > > God, I'm still at work, 23:10. Sigh. > > -- > afox at drizzle dot com || http://www.drizzle.com/~afox > FATAL ERROR: Windows has detected that a gnat has farted near your > computer. Press any key to reboot > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 22:26:29 -0800 > From: Luke Kim > To: afox@drizzle.com > Subject: Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... > > Hello my name is Luke Kim and am the Publicity Chair for the Pasadena > Lapidary Society (PLS). We currently do not have a website nor a web group, > this is forthcoming though. Our club address is: Pasadena Lapidary Society, > P.O. Box 5025, Pasadena, CA 91117-0025 > > Luke Kim > Graphic Designer / Web Designer / IT > Darkside Graphic Design Studio > 323.401.2116 (Mobile) > darksidegds@sbcglobal.net > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 08:59:11 -0500 > From: Fred Olmstead > Subject: [Rockhounds] NVMC Show > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: <419DFC2F.9070004@rcn.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > YOU ARE INVITED > > SATURDAY Nov. 20 - 10:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m. > SUNDAY Nov 21 - 10:00 a.m. - 4:00 p.m. > > The Northern Virginia Mineral Club,Inc. > Annual Gem, Mineral, & Fossil Show > > at George Mason University > Fairfax, Virginia > Student Union Building II > > Free shuttle bus from parking lot to show > > Silent Auction on Sunday 2:00 p.m > Mini Mines & Fossil Dig for kids and Quizzes > > Quality Mineral & Fossil Dealers > Demonstrations, Exhibits > Door Prizes > > Some of the Displays > > ---Daylignt--- > Minerals from the Luck Stone Quarries > Cataclysm!!! Record in the Rocks > Minerals collected on Club Field Trips > Some Sands of the World > Minerals of Butte, Montana > Minerals of Franklin, New Jersey > > ---Fuorescent Mineral Cases----- > Hardystonite, Esperite and Friends > Midwave Ultraviolet Classics > Ride the Ultraviolet Waves!! > > >Come... Enjoy... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 09:49:18 -0500 > From: Pete Richards > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > I might point out that these cannot be octahedrons because the symmetry group to which dolomite belogs does not include the octahedron as a form. If you were to measure one of these crystals carefully, you would find that the angles between the faces are not the same as the angles between the faces of an octahedron, though they are fairly close. These crystals are pseudo-octahedrons, and are formed from six faces belonging to a rhombohedron (I'm not sure which one) and two faces from the basal pinacoid {0001}. On my single example, the edges of the pinacoid faces are etched into grooves, which allows them to be distinguished from the faces of the rhombohedron. > > The Ol' Crystallographer > > > >Hi Group, > > Since the amazonite topic has faded, I'll throw out something new. > >While going through some old boxes in the garage, I came across > >some crystals I had forgotten about. They are a black octahedrons > >labeled Dolomite, var; Terulite, Terul, Spain. I used to sell them but > >somehow this batch got put away. I know the name is discredited, > >but can anyone enlighten me more about them. I did do a search on > >Google, and came up with one single hit; Many Facets Rock Shop, > >in Albany, NY. The gentleman is a member of the drizzle list, but he > >knows the same info as me. So two of us can profit from extra info. > >The specimens originally came from Rich Hamill of Rochester, NY. > >Maybe those from Rochester may know of him. > > On another note, the specimens are also for sale, if anyone needs > >one for thier collection. Rich had a $2.50 price on them, per crystal. > >I'll lower the price to $2.00 for list members, plus shipping. > >Thanks, and have a good evening. > >Dave Phillips > >Sunset Fossils & Minerals > >Morgantown, WV > > > > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > >multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > >--- > >_______________________________________________ > >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > >Subscription Services: > >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > -- > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > R. Peter Richards > rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu > > Mineral collector > Crystallographer > SHAPE for the Macintosh > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 09:51:33 -0500 > From: Pete Richards > Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > To: "BETADAV97@aol.com" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hi Dave, > > I'd be potentially interested in one of these "teruelites" too. How big are the crystals? How sharp? On matrix or off? > > Regards, > Pete > -- > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > R. Peter Richards > rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu > > Mineral collector > Crystallographer > SHAPE for the Macintosh > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 10:04:30 -0500 > From: "Lawrence Rush" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <003201c4ce49$132f06c0$d4884c0c@fekib> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > Good thinking, Kreigh! Thanks, and thanks to all who gave me the great tips on my digital "macro" questions!! > > Larry Rush > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 9:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Digital cameras > > > Gslrocks@aol.com wrote: > > > > even the Macros settings are different on most digital cameras. I can focus > > as close as 1 cm with my Sony F505V's and F717. My friend has a Ricoh that will > > only focus at 5 cm in macro mode. > > All lenses have a minimum focal distance; 4cm is common for macro work > with digital cameras, but some are much better. > > One of the things I have found I can do with my Fuji MX-1200 is use it > instead of my eye with any lens, loop, or microscope. Put the center of > your hand lens over the center of the camera's digital eye, and focus on > the subject by moving the camera and lens together towards the object > until it is a picture, watching the camera display to see when it is > focused. You might have to adjust the camera/lens spacing for best > results, but I usually find just putting them together works (though the > magnification is slightly reduced). A bit of tape will hold a hand lens > in place if you are doing more than a couple shots. > > The trick works because you are changing the optics and reducing the > minimum focal distance. > > Kreigh > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 19:44:37 +0100 > From: "Rik Dillen" > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors'" > Message-ID: <000001c4ce67$d5afad30$4169c950@maxdata> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="us-ascii" > > Here is a scan of my (only) specimen of aragonite, var. teruleite. > Go to > http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen/photos.htm > and scroll down to the bottom of the page > Size of the specimen is roughly 6X6 cm (XX nearly 1 cm). > > Greetings, > > Rik DILLEN > Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas > Belgium > > E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > > Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > >>> Belgian minerals > >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! > >>> Exchange list > > MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 > Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) > Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen > http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html > Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ > > > > *-----Original Message----- > *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > *Pete Richards > *Sent: vrijdag 19 november 2004 15:52 > *To: BETADAV97@aol.com > *Subject: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > * > * > *Hi Dave, > * > *I'd be potentially interested in one of these "teruelites" > *too. How big are the crystals? How sharp? On matrix or off? > * > *Regards, > *Pete > *-- > *-------------------------------------------------------------------- > *R. Peter Richards > *rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu > * > *Mineral collector > *Crystallographer > *SHAPE for the Macintosh _______________________________________________ > *Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > *WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > *Subscription Services: > *http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > * > * > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 13:07:39 -0600 > From: "Mel Albright" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] faceting questions > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <002d01c4ce6b$0db00b00$f6b3950c@jessie> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > I have done a 1 mm faceted (simplified DRB) stone and 8 facets looked round > enough for all practical purposes. At that size, you have to be real close > to see them anyway. > Mel > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 17 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 11:40:24 -0800 (PST) > From: Jim Daly > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Specific Gravity and Diamonds > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <20041119194024.60327.qmail@web51001.mail.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > The "tetrabromide" that Ken mentioned is probably > acetylene tetrabromide. Yes, it's hazardous, but the > recommended diluents are worse: carbon tetrachloride > and benzene! All three are positively benign compared > to the thallous formate, though. A drop of that stuff > is enough to kill a horse. I'm not sure I'd want to > use it even in a glove box. > Jim Daly > --- Jack Schmidling wrote: > > > I had this great brainstorm for a way to sort > > diamonds from quartz. > > > > Find a liquid with an sg just a bit more than quartz > > and the diamonds would > > float. > > > > Pondering it further, I am clueless where to find > > such a liquid and what it > > might be if it even exists. > > > > Any ideas? > > > > js > > > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, > > http://schmidling.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today! > http://my.yahoo.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 18 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 14:46:10 -0500 > From: Pete Richards > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > To: "rik.dillen@skynet.be" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > You must mean dolomite.... > > Cheers, > Pete > > > >Here is a scan of my (only) specimen of aragonite, var. teruleite. > >Go to > >http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen/photos.htm > >and scroll down to the bottom of the page > >Size of the specimen is roughly 6X6 cm (XX nearly 1 cm). > > > >Greetings, > > > >Rik DILLEN > >Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas > >Belgium > > > >E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > > > >Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > -- > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > R. Peter Richards > rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu > > Mineral collector > Crystallographer > SHAPE for the Macintosh > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 19 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 21:05:20 +0100 > From: "Rik Dillen" > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors'" > Message-ID: <000c01c4ce73$2001b440$4169c950@maxdata> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="US-ASCII" > > *-----Original Message----- > *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > *Pete Richards > *Sent: vrijdag 19 november 2004 20:46 > *To: rik.dillen@skynet.be > *Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terulite, Terul, Spain > * > *You must mean dolomite.... > * > >>>>> Oh hell, of course !! Time to wake up :>)) (it's 21:00 h now) > Greetings, > > Rik DILLEN > Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas > Belgium > > E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be > > Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > >>> Belgian minerals > >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! > >>> Exchange list > > MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 > Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) > Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html > Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 20 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:14:00 -0500 > From: "Tim Jokela Jr." > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] faceting questions > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <006901c4ce7c$b0a7f3c0$6401a8c0@Junior> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > > Does anybody know what the minimum facet able size is (excluding emerald > > cuts)? > > > > I asked that question on this list a loooong time ago, and was told that 1mm > across is about the minimum. Faceting machines are indeed extremely > precise - and expensive. I've been told a good unit starts at something > like $4,000. > > > > Who > > would bother faceting a stone only worth .99 cents? > > > > Most cutting is done overseas for pitiful wages. > > Cheers, > > Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com > Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com > The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com > Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 21 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:30:37 -0800 > From: "Scott Kleine, Great Basin Minerals" > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Updated web site with 147 new stibnite-included > quartz crystals from Bottomley- > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <030801c4ce98$28640190$f0114ed1@gbm> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hello All, > > I am pleased to announce that I have posted group pictures of the > remaining 147, $10-$30 stibnite-included quartz specimens I have from our > dig at the Bottomley mine, Pershing County, Nevada. Enjoy! > > http://www.greatbasinminerals.com/Bottomley%20Stibnite%20Included%20Quartz%2 0for%20Sale%20Page.htm > > All the best! > > Scott Kleine- Great Basin Minerals > 3895 Lisa Ct, #C > Reno, NV 89503 > (775) 322-9067 > www.greatbasinminerals.com > scottkleine@greatbasinminerals.com > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 22 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 20:00:21 EST > From: Lapadary@aol.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: <1a0.2c0424ce.2ecff125@aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > This is a nice write up about Sunstone Knoll near Delta, UTAH. Also, this > site is just off the pavement and makes good winter collecting > > _http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm_ > (http://geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/rockmineral/collecting/sunstone.htm) > > Grant Johnston > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 23 > Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 20:25:08 EST > From: Lapadary@aol.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] faceting questions > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: <7b.38b244fd.2ecff6f4@aol.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > In a message dated 11/19/04 11:08:42 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, > mela@bartnet.net writes: > > I have done a 1 mm faceted (simplified DRB) stone and 8 facets looked round > enough for all practical purposes. At that size, you have to be real close > to see them anyway. > ====================== > Thanks Mel, > > Does DRB mean round brilliant? Approximately what would 1 mm be in carats? > I've subsequently found several small faceted stone on eBay, including a .06 c > arat, yellow brilliant cut diamond. Some of the photos are great but there is > nothing to show scale. I'm not interested in buying a diamond but such small > stones arouse my curiosity. > > Grant > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds mailing list > Rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > End of Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 19 > ***************************************** > From mela at bartnet.net Sat Nov 20 17:27:11 2004 From: mela at bartnet.net (Mel Albright) Date: Sat Nov 20 17:27:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions References: <7b.38b244fd.2ecff6f4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000d01c4cf69$3be55ee0$4bb2950c@jessie> Sorry I goofed - SRB for Standard round brilliant is what I meant. The D is too close to the S I guess. I don't know the weight but I'd guess it at 3-4 points. That 0.6 point is really small. 1 point melee is normally the smallest you can get. Check out the catalogs for more info. From Lapadary at aol.com Sat Nov 20 19:08:05 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 20 19:08:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions Message-ID: <1dc.30807b45.2ed16095@aol.com> In a message dated 11/20/04 5:27:43 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, mela@bartnet.net writes: Sorry I goofed - SRB for Standard round brilliant is what I meant. The D is too close to the S I guess. =================== Anybody that can facet something that small must have really talented fingers. I don't think a simple typo detracts from that ability. Is the math involved in faceting really that hard now that there are programs like Gem Cad? I have a friend who inherited a facetor and some pretty good stones. She also inherited hundreds of pounds of rough rock and some lapidary equipment. She uses some of the lapidary equipment but if I suggest she try faceting she just shakes her head and mumbles something about math. And Glenn Kline wrote he has never seen a woman in facet competition. Would she need to understand math to use her facetor? Thanks, Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From MCGINNISG at aol.com Sat Nov 20 21:21:23 2004 From: MCGINNISG at aol.com (MCGINNISG@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 20 21:21:27 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals Message-ID: Is any one familiar with the outer green coating on the Amethyst geodes and cathedrals that come from Southern Brazil. Some of the green coatings appear to be natural, while others appear to be a painted on substance. Thank you. T. McGinnis --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From SMKELL45 at aol.com Sun Nov 21 02:15:39 2004 From: SMKELL45 at aol.com (SMKELL45@aol.com) Date: Sun Nov 21 02:15:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals Message-ID: <45.1bbd07ec.2ed1c4cb@aol.com> Hi. I bought a Heulandite geode from the Parana area of Brazil. It had a thin green coating that underlay the Heulandite crystals. Someone identified it as celadonite. Maybe yours is similar. smkell --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From sggcmeyer at msn.com Sun Nov 21 05:30:12 2004 From: sggcmeyer at msn.com (Gary and Sue Meyer) Date: Sun Nov 21 05:34:07 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about video Message-ID: I was at a small rock and mineral show yesterday in Boulder, Colorado. One dealer was selling a new video about rhodochrosite and the Sweet Home Mine. I watched it late last night and found it to be very interesting and extremely well done. I'd recommend it to anyone with an interest in mining history, geology, or mineral collecting. The DVD cover lists Silver Mountains Productions and a web site of www.silvermp.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 21 09:01:42 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 21 08:53:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals - green coating References: <45.1bbd07ec.2ed1c4cb@aol.com> Message-ID: <002b01c4cfeb$c743f3c0$d6a4490c@pete> Celadonite is the common identity of that green coating that is often found coating vesicles in basalt, from Brazil and elsewhere (the same can be found at Wolf Creek Pass, in Colorado). Celadonite is a green, iron-rich mineral, related to the micas. Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 3:15 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals > Hi. I bought a Heulandite geode from the Parana area of Brazil. It had a thin > green coating that underlay the Heulandite crystals. Someone identified it as > celadonite. Maybe yours is similar. smkell > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 21 09:04:51 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 21 08:56:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] rhodo video References: Message-ID: <003101c4cfec$37b8b5a0$d6a4490c@pete> A number of mineral dealers are selling copies of this video, which I've only seen bits of on video monitors at the Denver Show, but everyone says it is very good. Look for it from "better mineral dealers" (or at any rate, those who have Colorado connections) at shows everywhere. P.S., I'll be at the Boulder show this afternoon, giving a slide show on "Colorado gemstones" at 3 p.m. (the show closes at 4). For anyone local, their show is at the Elks Lodge, way up on the north side of town. Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary and Sue Meyer" To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 6:30 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Question about video I was at a small rock and mineral show yesterday in Boulder, Colorado. One dealer was selling a new video about rhodochrosite and the Sweet Home Mine. I watched it late last night and found it to be very interesting and extremely well done. I'd recommend it to anyone with an interest in mining history, geology, or mineral collecting. The DVD cover lists Silver Mountains Productions and a web site of www.silvermp.com From danielz at acmenet.net Sun Nov 21 09:42:42 2004 From: danielz at acmenet.net (Dan Z) Date: Sun Nov 21 09:42:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals References: Message-ID: <000301c4cff1$81003940$6401a8c0@M1Garand> The green coating is mostly natural, but the cathedrals are usually "touched up" with paint to make the color uniform all the way across. Sometimes cracks in the cathedrals are repaired with epoxy colored the same green (watch for raised or slightly shiny lines on the back). Often the bases are filled on the bottom with concrete to make the cathedral sit straight. This is also colored or painted green. Usually there is much more concrete than necessary, since the cathedrals are sold by the pound. -dan z- Many Facets Rock Shop Albany, NY - - Protect your civil rights! Let the politicians know how you feel. Join or donate to the NRA today! http://membership.nrahq.org/default.asp?campaignid=XR014887 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 12:21 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Amethyst Cathedrals > Is any one familiar with the outer green coating on the Amethyst geodes and > cathedrals that come from Southern Brazil. Some of the green coatings appear to > be natural, while others appear to be a painted on substance. Thank you. > T. McGinnis > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From kadok at infowest.com Sun Nov 21 10:12:52 2004 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Sun Nov 21 10:12:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] lava update In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <20041121181244.7239DCB98D2@delivery.infowest.com> Really neat stuff, Kitty! Thanks! Margaret Subject: [Rockhounds] lava update Sorry if this is repetitious, but the URL below has as nice a variety of photos of the present lava activity at Kilauea as you're likely to find on one page: helicopter views of the crater and ocean entry, daytime and night pics of lava pouring and dripping into the sea, and red lava crawling across old cooled stuff. Nearly all are worth clicking on "large" to see the image fill your screen. http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/kilauea/update/main.html Aloha, Kitty -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.1 - Release Date: 11/19/2004 _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From afox at drizzle.com Sun Nov 21 12:23:16 2004 From: afox at drizzle.com (Aaron Fox) Date: Sun Nov 21 12:23:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... (fwd) Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 22:28:02 -0800 From: Luke Kim To: Aaron Fox Subject: Re: Info for Pasadena Lapidary Society... Aaron: Here is the link for the Pasadena Lapidary Society's Yahoo group site: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PLS_RockHounds/ To Join PLS all the information is listed in the message board and if they would like to join the club the fees are there and they can also join the online group which is free. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PLS_RockHounds/join Luke Kim Graphic Designer / Web Designer / IT Darkside Graphic Design Studio 323.401.2116 (Mobile) darksidegds@sbcglobal.net From FOSSILNUT at aol.com Fri Nov 19 12:42:36 2004 From: FOSSILNUT at aol.com (FOSSILNUT@aol.com) Date: Sun Nov 21 12:42:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Virginia Mineral Club Show this Weekend Message-ID: <142.39221472.2ecfb4bc@aol.com> YOU ARE INVITED SATURDAY Nov. 20 - 10:00 a.m. - 6:00 p.m. SUNDAY Nov 21 - 10:00 a.m. - 4:00 p.m. The Northern Virginia Mineral Club,Inc. Annual Gem, Mineral, & Fossil Show at George Mason University Fairfax, Virginia Student Union Building II Free shuttle bus from parking lot to show Silent Auction on Sunday 2:00 p.m Mini Mines & Fossil Dig for kids and Quizzes Quality Mineral & Fossil Dealers Demonstrations, Exhibits Door Prizes Some of the Displays ---Daylignt--- Minerals from the Luck Stone Quarries Cataclysm!!! Record in the Rocks Minerals collected on Club Field Trips Some Sands of the World Minerals of Butte, Montana Minerals of Franklin, New Jersey ---Fuorescent Mineral Cases----- Hardystonite, Esperite and Friends Midwave Ultraviolet Classics Ride the Ultraviolet Waves!! >Come... Enjoy... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From mela at bartnet.net Sun Nov 21 14:14:02 2004 From: mela at bartnet.net (Mel Albright) Date: Sun Nov 21 14:14:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] faceting questions References: <1dc.30807b45.2ed16095@aol.com> Message-ID: <000501c4d017$6b16d460$c7b3950c@jessie> Hi Glenn The total math required for faceting uses a $10 WalMart calculator. You put a number in - hit the tangent key, store it. Put in another number, hit the tangent key, divide by the stored number and then multiply by the angle given in the facet diagram. (Better known as the tangent ratio rule) That transforms settings from a faceting guide for a particular cut to a stone with a different refractive index.. (See below) GemCad is totally unneeded unless you aspire to create a design of your own. If she buys the book "Faceting for Amateurs" by Glenn and Martha Vargas, she can teach herself easily. (buy it even if she gets lessons) Add a book of designs from Long and Steele and you're fixed for life. (Google for source) There is also a free computer program which has many many stone designs. I'm pretty sure the local rock club can find some instructions for a beginner - see www.amfed.org for clubs. There is also a faceting e-mail swap group that is active and has members that can answer any question from the simplist to the most complex. As far as women faceting, lots do. I taught one who is now far more skilled than I am. Talk her into it. The fun of making her own stones for jewelry is wild. If she cuts to size, mountings of every type are available at reasonable cost. Also gifts for Friends, relatives, etc. Just don't plan making a living doing it. Mel From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Sun Nov 21 18:24:00 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sun Nov 21 18:26:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: lava update References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <003e01c4d03a$54da74e0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Mahalo Kitty! Not only are they worth looking at "large" I have saved so many that I've got to burn a disc of the pics to regain my computer speed! LOL!!! Glenn - From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" Subject: [Rockhounds] lava update > Sorry if this is repetitious, but the URL below has as nice a variety of > photos of the present lava activity at Kilauea as you're likely to find on > one page: helicopter views of the crater and ocean entry, daytime and > night pics of lava pouring and dripping into the sea, and red lava crawling > across old cooled stuff. Nearly all are worth clicking on "large" to see > the image fill your screen. > > http://hvo.wr.usgs.gov/kilauea/update/main.html > > Aloha, Kitty > > From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Sun Nov 21 19:36:11 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sun Nov 21 19:38:42 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mobile Rock & Gem Society Show Nov26-28 References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> <003e01c4d03a$54da74e0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <00b601c4d044$69ab3d00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> The Mobile Rock & Gem Society Show is November 26-28, Friday 4-9PM, Saturday 9AM-6PM, Sunday 10AM-5PM ! Jewelry, Gems, Minerals, Fossils, Kids' Dig & Sluice ! Ya'll come ! Glenn Wimpee From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Sun Nov 21 19:48:46 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Sun Nov 21 19:48:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD:Fossilised Baby Boa References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> <003e01c4d03a$54da74e0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> <00b601c4d044$69ab3d00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <045301c4d046$2b72abc0$6402a8c0@remains> Hi I have a a very nice fossilised baby boa constrictor for sale. The specimen is from Messel, Germany, and is Eocene in age, about 53 million years old. The matrix plate measures 18cm by 15 cm, and the snake is centered quite nicely. The animal is complete and in fantastic condition, but the head of the snake is hidden behind the body. Fossils from Messel are now illegal to collect, as it is a World Heritage site. This specimen, like all otger Messel fossils, comes from an old private collection. Other than the most common species of fish, fossils from Messel are getting to be VERY difficult to source. The price for this specimen is $2200USD. Shipping included. If you have any interest in thgis specimen, please email me offlist at dmichaelschmidt@shaw.ca or dmschmidt@sprint.ca and I will send you pics and more info on the specimen and on the site. Thanks Michael From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Sun Nov 21 19:48:46 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Sun Nov 21 19:49:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD:Fossilised Baby Boa References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041120095958.03cfac70@mail.aloha.net> <003e01c4d03a$54da74e0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> <00b601c4d044$69ab3d00$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <046601c4d046$513236f0$6402a8c0@remains> Hi I have a a very nice fossilised baby boa constrictor for sale. The specimen is from Messel, Germany, and is Eocene in age, about 53 million years old. The matrix plate measures 18cm by 15 cm, and the snake is centered quite nicely. The animal is complete and in fantastic condition, but the head of the snake is hidden behind the body. Fossils from Messel are now illegal to collect, as it is a World Heritage site. This specimen, like all otger Messel fossils, comes from an old private collection. Other than the most common species of fish, fossils from Messel are getting to be VERY difficult to source. The price for this specimen is $2200USD. Shipping included. If you have any interest in thgis specimen, please email me offlist at dmichaelschmidt@shaw.ca or dmschmidt@sprint.ca and I will send you pics and more info on the specimen and on the site. Thanks Michael From Lapadary at aol.com Sun Nov 21 20:22:31 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Sun Nov 21 20:22:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? Message-ID: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Kreigh and others, Several years ago I bought three pieces of blue - green ore, identified as shattuckite, from Alex Reyes at Reyes Rockshop in Benson, AZ. I was told it was "shattuckite from Bisbee." I think I paid about $30 for the three pieces and the total weight is around 1 pound. All three piece have small amounts of gray matrix attached. When wet, one 4 oz. rock is almost solid blue, a deep azure blue, very similar to Azurite. The other two pieces have veins of the same azure blue going through green rock. For those familiar with cooper ores, it is a malachite green when wet but fades to a whiter color as it dries. (Actually, when it is dry it looks a lot like amazonite.) It think the blue is probably shattuckite just because Reyes said it was, - but I don't know what the host rock, the matrix, would be, and I'm not sure if the green is shattuckite or a related material. That leads to the question, can every rock be identified? If I sent a piece to be tested in a lab should I test the blue, the green, or both? Is a scanning electron microscope the right test? Below my name I've listed several things it might be, based on color, streak color, hardness, etc. They are all a lot alike. Kreigh recently tested a piece of rose quartz but I can't remember the specific test or the lab he used. Is there a specific test for shattuckite? I could just cut it into slabs and sell them on eBay, but ........................? No, I wanna know. Grant Shattuckite (Copper Silicate Hydroxide) Aurichalcite (Zinc Copper Carbonate Hydroxide) Azurite (Hydrated Copper Carbonate) Chrysocolla (Hydrated Copper Silicate) Turquoise (Hydrated Copper Aluminum Phosphate) Malachite (Copper Carbonate Hydroxide) Chalcocite (Copper Sulfide) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 21 20:53:59 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 21 20:46:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? References: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Message-ID: <002001c4d04f$5092ac80$1ba5490c@pete> Grant, As to "whether every rock could be identified", the answer is--in theory, if you care enough and are willing to expend enough effort and perhaps, pay enough money for it, yes, they can. But in practice, it often turns out not to be worth doing what is needed to identify every rock. In many cases, most people will be satisfied with a reasonable "sight identification" based on observable characteristics, telling what the mineral most likely is, sometimes with more certainty than others. If something is really puzzling, and the owner cares enough, then he can do what's needed to have it properly identified. One of the best and most reliable means for identifcation, is X-ray diffraction analysis. This requires usually just a small chip from the sample, and there are several commercial labs that will do this for collectors, at a modest but not trivial cost; I don't have immediately at hand any of the addresses or costs of places that do this, but I think you could expect to pay somewhere between $10 to $20 (or more) per sample to have this done. Thus, it becomes a "how much do you care" question, where the cost of analysis approaches or exceeds what you paid for the material. Usually, people might have this done if they have a large quantity of the material and want to be sure what it is, or if they think it is something rare and unusual; or are just plain curious and "want to know". XRD analysis woudl definitely confirm whether your material was shattuckite or not. And yes, if your samples had several colors of material in it, you'd have to make a judgement decision of how many different portions of the sample were worth paying to have analyzed. Since shattuckite is normally deep blue, the green material is probably something else (malachite and/or chrysocolla being most likely). Your description of deep blue for the material does fit shattuckite, so it is likely that this is what it really is. From your statement about the other material fading to a lighter color, I think chrysocolla is more likely than malachite. Malachite will bubble in acid--an easy test. Likewise, azurite will bubble in HCl; if your dark blue material doesn't, that's a good indication that it is shattuckite. Of course, that's why people learn how to do such simple tests as can be done easily themselves--to confirm what things are, without the expense of sending them to a lab. But there is a limit to what homemade tests can do--there certainly aren't enough simple tests to discriminate between all the 4000+ known minerals! Sincerely, Pete Modreski ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 9:22 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? > Kreigh and others, > > Several years ago I bought three pieces of blue - green ore, identified as > shattuckite, from Alex Reyes at Reyes Rockshop in Benson, AZ. I was told it > was "shattuckite from Bisbee." I think I paid about $30 for the three pieces > and the total weight is around 1 pound. All three piece have small amounts of > gray matrix attached. > > When wet, one 4 oz. rock is almost solid blue, a deep azure blue, very > similar to Azurite. The other two pieces have veins of the same azure blue going > through green rock. For those familiar with cooper ores, it is a malachite > green when wet but fades to a whiter color as it dries. (Actually, when it is > dry it looks a lot like amazonite.) It think the blue is probably shattuckite > just because Reyes said it was, - but I don't know what the host rock, the > matrix, would be, and I'm not sure if the green is shattuckite or a related > material. > > That leads to the question, can every rock be identified? If I sent a piece > to be tested in a lab should I test the blue, the green, or both? Is a > scanning electron microscope the right test? Below my name I've listed several > things it might be, based on color, streak color, hardness, etc. They are all a > lot alike. > > > Kreigh recently tested a piece of rose quartz but I can't remember the > specific test or the lab he used. Is there a specific test for shattuckite? > > I could just cut it into slabs and sell them on eBay, but > ........................? > No, I wanna know. > > Grant > > > Shattuckite (Copper Silicate Hydroxide) > Aurichalcite (Zinc Copper Carbonate Hydroxide) > Azurite (Hydrated Copper Carbonate) > Chrysocolla (Hydrated Copper Silicate) > Turquoise (Hydrated Copper Aluminum Phosphate) > Malachite (Copper Carbonate Hydroxide) > Chalcocite (Copper Sulfide) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com Mon Nov 22 06:07:18 2004 From: Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com (Schlinsog, Anthony) Date: Mon Nov 22 06:06:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah Message-ID: I was just there a couple of weeks ago and had some good luck. Like what was said earlier, you want to look on the flats east of the knolls. There are some tracks that you can drive down there on. Within an hour and a half I had a Ziplock bag full of sunstones, the largest around a 1/2 inch, most around a 1/4 inch. I noticed that the size and number varied as I walked across the flats. If you don't see that many on the ground, keep walking and exploring until you find an area with a greater density of sunstones (probably no farther than a 1/4 mile east of the knoll). Walking into the sun will help reveal them. Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- north west of Sunstone Knoll. Anthony Schlinsog -----Original Message----- From: Lapadary@aol.com [mailto:Lapadary@aol.com] Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 1:20 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones in Utah In a message dated 11/19/04 10:17:00 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, afox@drizzle.com writes: Has anyone had good luck at Sunstone Knoll, or am I just an abberation? (It wouldn't be the first time...) =============================== The secret is to go on a day when the sun is out (and the black flies are not). Then you go onto the flat behind the knoll -- opposite the RR tracks. There is no reason to climb the hill unless you have hard rock tools. The flat is littered with millions of loose sunstones. The first time I saw the sunstones I thought I was looking at detritus from a broken windshield. Foe best results, take along a kid -- or somebody else built close to the ground. My understanding these sunstones are not facet quality. I'm not sure why. The don't have the color or schiller seen in Oregon sunstones but when the sun hits them they really light up. I think they could be improved by faceting, just like diamonds, so I'm not sure why they are not considered jewel quality. I think hunting on Sunstone Knolls is good practice for Topaz Mountain -- or vice versa. If the sun is out and you are in the correct area, they are hard to miss. There is a major difference, the sunstones can be located in a 10 - 15 minute drive from Delta. Topaz Mountain is an hour drive down the Bush-Wellman Road. Then there is a mile or two of dirt road leading into the cove. However, an hour at each place should give a good supply of material. You should be able to fill a pill bottle in an hour or two, if you can bend over that often in an hour. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Mon Nov 22 08:02:25 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Mon Nov 22 07:54:26 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D., P.S. References: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Message-ID: <004301c4d0ac$a9753680$eea4490c@pete> To Grant and the List, A followup to my comments yesterday about identifying your shattuckite or any other mineral. One person who does do mineral identifications for a modest price is, I believe, Bart Cannon--I'm sure some of you on the list have used his services. Does Bart just do SEM analysis? That is very useful for many minerals, but it only tells you what the chemical elements present are, and it only detects the metals and heavier elements, not the light elements (i.e., usually not sensitive to H, Li, Be, B, C, N, O). Shattuckite, for example, is a copper silicate, so all an SEM analysis would show would be the presence of Cu and Si; it could probably not distinguish between shattuckite, chrysocolla, and any other copper silicates, and even an intimate mixture of malachite or azurite intergrown with quartz might cause ambiguity. I believe also that someone at the University of Utah (or Utah Geological Survey?) has also advertized mineral identification by XRD for a modest price. If you or anyone is interested, I could check and find out specifics of whether this is still done (probably someone on the list knows this already). Sincerely, Pete From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 22 08:25:07 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Mon Nov 22 08:25:09 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D., P.S. Message-ID: <112220041625.27773.41A212E20007DDF700006C7D21602807489D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> Wow! Are you talking about EDS, or XRD? You've mentioned both; but I have found XRD to be very expensive. McCrone Associates quoted me a price of $500. The best bet is to "know someone" who can do it in school or at their lab for free or at least for a modest price. If someone does know a place where we can get single-crystal or powder XRD for a reasonable price, I'd love to know! Shattuckite is also a hydroxide, which makes EDS more difficult. Don -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "Peter J. Modreski" > To Grant and the List, > > A followup to my comments yesterday about identifying your shattuckite or > any other mineral. > > One person who does do mineral identifications for a modest price is, I > believe, Bart Cannon--I'm sure some of you on the list have used his > services. Does Bart just do SEM analysis? That is very useful for many > minerals, but it only tells you what the chemical elements present are, and > it only detects the metals and heavier elements, not the light elements > (i.e., usually not sensitive to H, Li, Be, B, C, N, O). From lanny at lrream.com Mon Nov 22 09:13:13 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Mon Nov 22 09:12:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? In-Reply-To: <002001c4d04f$5092ac80$1ba5490c@pete> References: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> <002001c4d04f$5092ac80$1ba5490c@pete> Message-ID: Hi Pete and all, If anyone out there knows someone who will run samples for $10-20 please let me know. Excalibur charges $55 and Cannon Microprobe charges from $25 to $95, depending on just exactly what you want. Both use SEM and EDS and Cannon also has XRD (if it's working). Cannon does have an economy mode semi quantitative analysis (identifies what's in the sample, but not the amount) for $25 for one grain down to $9 each for 10 or more sent to him mounted on double sided tape (tiny grain only needed). I use the economy analysis a lot to get started with the micros at mines; you can come up with quite a number of positive IDs with this data and the physical data (such as a cream colored blocky crystal that makes you think wulfenite except for the color might come back with Pb and Mo only, makes one about 99.99% sure it is wulfenite). It also leaves a lot of unknowns. It's amazing how many yellow, green and blue microcystalline coatings, or even distinct, sharp crystals, come back with Pb>Ca>Cu>P>Si or something similar with a little Zn, As or S thrown in! The unknowns are piling up, where is the $10-20 analysis! Regards, Lanny On Nov 21, 2004, at 8:53 PM, Peter J. Modreski wrote: ...... > hand any of the addresses or costs of places that do this, but I think > you > could expect to pay somewhere between $10 to $20 (or more) per sample > to > have this done. ... From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 22 09:41:07 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Mon Nov 22 09:41:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? Message-ID: <112220041741.18423.41A224B30002D1D3000047F721602807489D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Lanny > Hi Pete and all, > > If anyone out there knows someone who will run samples for $10-20 > please let me know. ... Cannon does have an > economy mode semi quantitative analysis (identifies what's in the > sample, but not the amount) for $25 for one grain down to $9 each for > 10 or more sent to him mounted on double sided tape (tiny grain only > needed). Lanny, et al., I think that Bart is who he is talking about. I've never heard of any EDS being done that cheaply anywhere else. When you think about it, $9 barely pays for the costs of running the machine during the analysis. Excalibur and Minresco are the only two I know that cater specifically to collectors (besides Bart Cannon); however, as several of us have said, let us know if there are others! Don From murowchickj at umkc.edu Mon Nov 22 14:00:44 2004 From: murowchickj at umkc.edu (J B Murowchick) Date: Mon Nov 22 14:00:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses In-Reply-To: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Message-ID: At the risk of being inundated with samples to analyze, I might be able to help. I can do basic XRD analyses of sample powders for $10-35, sometimes more, depending on how much effort I have to put into it. If I am provided a few grams or more of relatively clean sample, I can usually make an identification fairly easily. We have MDI Jade software on our Rigaku powder diffractometer, and the search/match software works fairly well (though some mineralogical/chemical common sense is needed by the operator). In the best case scenario, I would analyze a few grams of powdered, single-phase sample that has a pattern in the PDF database. A 20-minute, 2-degree/minute scan should provide the info needed for an identification. The near worst-case scenario would involve a few hundred milligrams of sample containing several phases. Tentative IDs from XRD might need to be followed up with polarized light microscopy/immersion oils, which would take more time and expertise, and hence, be more expensive. (Worst case would involve insufficient sample with multiple phases, some or all of which are not in the PDF database.) I would be willing to collect a pattern and send it back to the sender for them to figure out to help keep the price down--(maybe $15). With a digital ASCII file of the pattern, software like MacDiff (free, search Google for MacDiff or try http://servermac.geologie.uni-frankfurt.de/Staff/Homepages/Petschick/RainerE .html) could be used for ID. MacDiff contains a pretty good database, and additional patterns can be added, if you have phases not in the database (e.g., obscure or rare minerals), but you have diffraction data for them (or a calculated pattern). Basically, we charge a $10/sample users fee to help maintain the diffractometer (a new X-ray tube can run between $2000 and 3000). I also need to recoup my time, but I could have a student run the sample if I can't do it. The student should be paid for their time, too. With the $10 users fee, though, I think most simple samples could be done for under $30. I would like to work costs out with each client, though. If I am inundated with requests, I will have to limit the number of analyses I can do per month. If you need an analysis, contact me before you send anything, and we'll see if we can work something out. I am not running a commercial lab, though, and XRD services must take a back seat to my other duties as a mineralogy professor. I am always looking for ways to involve students, and possibly provide a little support for them as well as for the lab, so I am open to analyzing samples for fellow collectors. I would also suggest that anyone needing analyses contact any nearby universities with geology departments with your requests. You will get quite mixed results--from "Not a chance, no time, forget it" to "Sure, send me a sample". Waiting for the flood of requests, Jim __________________________________________________________ Dr. James B. Murowchick Associate Professor Office: (816) 235-2979 Geosciences, 420 Flarsheim Hall Fax: (816) 235-5535 University of Missouri-Kansas City E-mail: murowchickj@umkc.edu 5110 Rockhill Road Kansas City, MO 64110 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tjokela at execulink.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:50 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Mon Nov 22 14:16:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? References: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001c4d0e0$ea01e160$6401a8c0@Junior> Shattuckite is a fairly distinctive deep blue. I'd imagine any serious collector or dealer could tell it apart from the minerals on your list. Azurite will be a deeper blue, closer to black, and you don't see solid thick chunks of massive azurite that often. Pure solid aurichalcite is highly unlikely and would be much lighter blue; chrysocolla and turquoise are much lighter blue as well. Malachite is of course green, and chalcocite is a heavy bluish-black metallic sulfide that bears no resemblance to any of the above. In most cases color isn't a very good ID tool, but in this case it isn't that bad. Having specimens of these minerals in hand to compare should make it easier. The shattuckite specimen in my reference collection is from the New Cornelia Mine, AZ, and is a solid vein section. Low power magnification reveals the distinctive feathery, radiating acicular xl structure. If your specimens have any small openings, there will likely be micro crystals, which should also be quite different in appearance from the species on your list. I recall seeing shattuckite in an AZ rock shop for something like $30 or $50 a pound; it really is an unusual gemstone. I hope this helps a bit. If anybody finds it overly pompous, my apologies. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 22 15:45:12 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Mon Nov 22 15:45:01 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41A27A08.9060903@att.net> J B Murowchick wrote: > At the risk of being inundated with samples to analyze, I might be able > to help. HOLY COW! Lock your doors, block the streets, and arm yourselves. Here come the samples, I'd imagine. > In the best case scenario, I would analyze a few grams of powdered, > single-phase sample that has a pattern in the PDF database. At this point I would interject that a lot of readers might not know about XRD. Behold our tax dollars at work: this site gives a good, simple explanation without being condescending, and some necessary technical information like Bragg's Law (thanks, USGS!): http://pubs.usgs.gov/info/diffraction/html/ The following site is also an excellent introduction (check the links at the bottom too!): http://www.ilpi.com/inorganic/glassware/xrd.html The motivated reader can search the web for "powder XRD," and "x-ray powder diffraction," to obtain a wealth of information on the subject. Be careful not to confuse this with single-crystal diffraction, which is basically related, but orders of magnitude more difficult to understand (translation: I find powder fairly easy, but am still working hard at single-crystal); and more importantly, it is not what he is offering. > The near worst-case scenario would involve a few hundred milligrams of > sample containing several phases. Indeed! And therein lies the key: 80% of analysis is preparation. I often hear complaints from analysts that people send them huge chunks of rock, with the phase in question not clearly identified, and a note saying "I want it back." But this is not Star Trek. It really helps if the customer can isolate what looks like a pure sample of the mineral in question, small, and without any hope of getting it back in one piece. Here we note that my experience with XRD is limited to sending out a nominally homogeneous sample in a sealed vial and receiving a powder pattern back in the mail, ready for peak-matching. I have read up on XRD sample prep but have not done it; in other words, I am hoping a more experienced preparator can jump in here and give some tips on sample prep and perhaps some good reading references. > You will get > quite mixed results--from "Not a chance, no time, forget it" to "Sure, send > me a sample". Your offer is rare and generous. I, for one, thank you for being so open. Don From Lapadary at aol.com Mon Nov 22 17:04:36 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 22 17:04:43 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D. Message-ID: <1ed.2f5dc419.2ed3e6a4@aol.com> Thanks to Tim, Jim, Pete, and others for your reply. I think I'll try the acid test before I do anything further. I've already got a batch of oxalic and some muriatic acid out in the garage so it will not cost anything. It sounds like my sample fits the description of shattuckite so I'll stay with that until I have a reason to change it. Kreigh recently tested a sample of something to see if it was rose quartz and from what I can remember the price was $50 -- $60. The offer of XRD at a reasonable cost sound great. Its a cheap test and a learning experience for a student all in one. But I like Don's suggestion best. I need to learn what XRD does before I start sending in samples. Grant Johnston, Chico, CA Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tjokela at execulink.com Mon Nov 22 17:46:26 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Mon Nov 22 17:46:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses References: <41A27A08.9060903@att.net> Message-ID: <003c01c4d0fe$3ecbc9f0$6401a8c0@Junior> Dunno if it's been mentioned before, but there's a nifty little writeup in Min Rec of the various modern analytical techniques. Has funny little diagrams of scientists getting hit with x-rays and whatnot. I plugged a few keywords into MinDex to try and get the exact issue, without success, but it's out there for them's that wants it. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don H" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses >J B Murowchick wrote: > >> At the risk of being inundated with samples to analyze, I might be >> able >> to help. > > HOLY COW! Lock your doors, block the streets, and arm yourselves. Here > come the samples, I'd imagine. > >> In the best case scenario, I would analyze a few grams of powdered, >> single-phase sample that has a pattern in the PDF database. > > At this point I would interject that a lot of readers might not know about > XRD. Behold our tax dollars at work: this site gives a good, simple > explanation without being condescending, and some necessary technical > information like Bragg's Law (thanks, USGS!): > > http://pubs.usgs.gov/info/diffraction/html/ > > The following site is also an excellent introduction (check the links at > the bottom too!): > > http://www.ilpi.com/inorganic/glassware/xrd.html > > The motivated reader can search the web for "powder XRD," and "x-ray > powder diffraction," to obtain a wealth of information on the subject. Be > careful not to confuse this with single-crystal diffraction, which is > basically related, but orders of magnitude more difficult to understand > (translation: I find powder fairly easy, but am still working hard at > single-crystal); and more importantly, it is not what he is offering. > >> The near worst-case scenario would involve a few hundred milligrams of >> sample containing several phases. > > Indeed! And therein lies the key: 80% of analysis is preparation. I > often hear complaints from analysts that people send them huge chunks of > rock, with the phase in question not clearly identified, and a note saying > "I want it back." But this is not Star Trek. It really helps if the > customer can isolate what looks like a pure sample of the mineral in > question, small, and without any hope of getting it back in one piece. > Here we note that my experience with XRD is limited to sending out a > nominally homogeneous sample in a sealed vial and receiving a powder > pattern back in the mail, ready for peak-matching. I have read up on XRD > sample prep but have not done it; in other words, I am hoping a more > experienced preparator can jump in here and give some tips on sample prep > and perhaps some good reading references. > > > You will get >> quite mixed results--from "Not a chance, no time, forget it" to "Sure, >> send >> me a sample". > > Your offer is rare and generous. I, for one, thank you for being so open. > > Don > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Nov 22 17:59:44 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Nov 22 17:57:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? References: <6d.38cb1dcc.2ed2c387@aol.com> Message-ID: <41A298E9.5C74@Tomaszewski.net> Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > > Kreigh recently tested a piece of rose quartz but I can't remember the > specific test or the lab he used. Is there a specific test for shattuckite? > > I could just cut it into slabs and sell them on eBay, but > ........................? > No, I wanna know. > > Grant > I had Excalibur run EDS and give me their educated guess as to minerals scanned. EDS is not definitive, but it gives good clues to help confirm or deny a tentative identification. Labs are not cheap, but when you gotta know what it is you need one. I think highly of Excalibur and expect to continue using their services when I need something analyized. Kreigh P.S., The 'rose quartz' turned out to be K Feldspar druze on quartz. From lanny at lrream.com Mon Nov 22 21:42:13 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Mon Nov 22 21:41:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses In-Reply-To: <003c01c4d0fe$3ecbc9f0$6401a8c0@Junior> References: <41A27A08.9060903@att.net> <003c01c4d0fe$3ecbc9f0$6401a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <6D4EC39E-3D12-11D9-9DA1-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> Hi Tim, Sorry about that. I can see that a few more key words would be a help. Out of curiousity, I searched on "X-ray" in the information window and the third record was one of the series you mentioned. Then, a search on "State of the Art" in the title brought up the whole series. MR 3-4, 1971, 2:2, State of the Art - Crystallography, The basics MR 5-6, 1971, 2-3 - crystallography part 2, single crystalmethods MR 7-8, 1971 2:4, - X-Ray, the powder method MR 1-2, 1972 3:1 - crystal growth, part 1 MR 3-4, 1972 3:2 - crystal growth part 2 MR 5-6, 1972 3:3 - crystal growth part 3 MR 7-8, 1972 3-4 - electron microscopes and electron microprobe Regards, Lanny On Nov 22, 2004, at 5:46 PM, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > Dunno if it's been mentioned before, but there's a nifty little > writeup in Min Rec of the various modern analytical techniques. Has > funny little diagrams of scientists getting hit with x-rays and > whatnot. I plugged a few keywords into MinDex to try and get the exact > issue, without success, but it's out there for them's that wants it. > > Cheers, > > Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com > Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com > The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com > Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don H" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 6:45 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses > From lanny at lrream.com Mon Nov 22 22:09:35 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Mon Nov 22 22:08:27 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Shattuckite I.D.? In-Reply-To: <112220041741.18423.41A224B30002D1D3000047F721602807489D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> References: <112220041741.18423.41A224B30002D1D3000047F721602807489D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> Message-ID: <3FE93A8C-3D16-11D9-9DA1-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> Yes, it is Bart Cannon, I didn't realize I had created any confusion just writing Cannon, for Cannon Microprobe. I still don't see anyone doing any real identification of any kind for the low price of $10-20, except perhaps what Jim Murowchick has offered. I like the data I get from Bart Cannon for only $9 if I mount 10 or more grains as per his instructions ($25 for just one). However, it does not give you a positive ID if your specimen really is an unknown. As I wrote previously, for specimens where the crystal shape, color and other physical characteristics are a definite help, then knowing the main elements present can be nearly 100% positive, but just as often, it only tells you that the specimen is a Pb arsenate or something like that. I just sent 30 samples to Bart, all mounted as tiny grains in three neat little rows on a piece of double sided sticky tape. About half of them are basically just confirmations, I'm sure they are wulfenite or pyromorphite, but many of the wulfenites are just weird enough in their forms that I'm not positive. These analyses will either confirm wulfenite (not a whole lot of minerals come back with just Pb and Mo in a microprobe analysis). Or they will show something else, either leaving a total unknown or fairly positively pointing to something else. For the "pyromorphite" it will confirm the trilogy with the Pb, and which of the three - mimetite, vanadinite, pyromorphite - with the As, V, or P analysis, or show something else entirely. For the other half of the specimens, same idea. About half will probably come back with results that could fit 3-10 minerals, or only 1. For those that are left up in the air, its more money for a real identification. X-ray is typically not an option. There just isn't enough of a sample for XRD, none of these guys do single crystal analysis. That's a big problem with micros. Bart does this semiquantitative analysis for such a low price because he can do them rapidly. You have to mount a tiny grain on a piece of double stick tape on a piece of card stock, or something similar. The grains should be of equal size (not an absolute) and spaced about the same distance apart in straight lines. Thus he can fix up the mount, put it in the machine and just go down the line one after another. In this quick fashion his data is only at the precision that an element is present and one is in greater quantity than the other. If you want quantitative analysis or EDS(X), then it takes a lot more time, and costs much more money. The cheapo method is a big help, but it doesn't provide real answers expect where your only question is something like is this mimetite or pyromorphite. Murowchick's offer is good, but probably won't work for many of my samples because of the quantity of sample needed. When you have nothing but 0.1-0.5 mm crystals, it's really hard to come up with "a few grams" of sample. I emailed Bart about his XRD and he said it is $40 for a pattern, that doesn't include a search (you get to do the ID work, or pay more), he needs enough powdered specimen to cover a 4 x 10 mm area of a slide, also darn hard to come up with from micro specimens! Regards, Lanny On Nov 22, 2004, at 9:41 AM, morningstar@att.net wrote: > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > From: Lanny >> Hi Pete and all, >> >> If anyone out there knows someone who will run samples for $10-20 >> please let me know. ... Cannon does have an >> economy mode semi quantitative analysis (identifies what's in the >> sample, but not the amount) for $25 for one grain down to $9 each for >> 10 or more sent to him mounted on double sided tape (tiny grain only >> needed). > > Lanny, et al., > > I think that Bart is who he is talking about. I've never heard of any > EDS being done that cheaply anywhere else. When you think about it, > $9 barely pays for the costs of running the machine during the > analysis. Excalibur and Minresco are the only two I know that cater > specifically to collectors (besides Bart Cannon); however, as several > of us have said, let us know if there are others! > > Don > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From danielz at acmenet.net Tue Nov 23 08:46:02 2004 From: danielz at acmenet.net (Dan Z) Date: Tue Nov 23 08:46:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] [AD] Dealer Special - magnetite crystals Message-ID: <000501c4d17b$eb8c7590$6401a8c0@M1Garand> A deal! 288 grams - over 10 ounces - of shiny magnetite octahedrons from Brumado, Brazil. Sizes mostly 1 cm across and smaller (about 225 crystals in the package). We retail them for $1.97 each. You can have the package for $80 (less than 36 cents per crystal), plus $7 for Priority-One shipping (U.S. only). Contact Many Facets Rock Shop Albany, NY 518-456-0678 info@manyfacets.com -dan z- From hkrocke at sprint.ca Tue Nov 23 10:07:14 2004 From: hkrocke at sprint.ca (HilmarKrocke) Date: Tue Nov 23 10:10:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- north west of Sunstone Knoll. Anthony Schlinsog _______________________________________________________________ Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the Trilobites? Thank you. Hilmar --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rik.dillen at skynet.be Tue Nov 23 10:31:54 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Tue Nov 23 10:32:06 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Low-cost XRD analyses (Long) In-Reply-To: <41A27A08.9060903@att.net> Message-ID: <000001c4d18a$b554ebb0$e8cbf051@maxdata> *question, small, and without any hope of getting it back in one piece. Here we note that my experience with XRD is limited to sending out a nominally homogeneous sample in a sealed vial and receiving a powder pattern back in the mail, ready for peak-matching. I have read up on XRD sample prep but have not done it; in other words, I am hoping a more experienced preparator can jump in here and give some tips on sample prep and perhaps some good reading references. >>>>> I have prepared and analysed many, many powder samples myself (at least, until about 10-12 years ago). PRINCIPLE X-ray diffraction yields DIFFRACTION PATTERNS (according to Bragg's law) that give information on so called d-distances, that are distances between planes of a certain zone. The set of all peaks found + relative intensities can be compared to known sets (known minerals, e.g.) and when a set matches with one in the database the mineral is identified with a very high certainty. Pure compounds mostly have something like 10 to 40 or so lines in a pattern. [Yes, I know that it is impossible to give a course on X-ray diffractometry in a few lines...] CAVEATS >From the moment on that two different compounds are present in the same order of magnitude, the diffraction pattern becomes very complex (20 to 80 peaks), and more so if 3 or more components are present. When many peaks are present overlap between certain peaks occurs, and you must take into account that in a diffraction pattern with e.g. 100 peaks you don't know which one is due to which component, in other word, you would have to match all possible peak combinations with all known patterns, which is even for a fast computer a nearly hopeless task sometimes. Lesson : purify your sample VERY well. Hand-pick microcrystals under the microscope if necessary. I have spent more than once a whole evening to collect enough micro-crystals to get 10-20 mg of material. X-ray powder diffractometry is based on the fact that all grains are randomly oriented in the sample. If you grind asbestos, micas etc. there is much chance that most of the "grains" (in those cases more like hair fragments or small flakes) will lie flat in a plane, which is called preferential orientation. The consequence is that the intensity distribution is completely different from the "official" pattern for a randomly ariented sample. Some peaks (d-distances) might even completely disappear or be dominant over all the rest. Lesson : if you want to X-ray flaky, micaceous, fiber-like materials or materials with a perfect cleavage in a certain crystallographic direction you might need very specialised sample preparation techniques to overcome that problem. Some minerals, e.g. pyroxenes and amphiboles, have such analoguous X-ray patterns, that you can hardly see any difference when comparing the spectra. Lesson : there are cases where X-ray diffraction is not an easy task to distinguish between very comparable structures. X-ray diffraction is a purely physical method, so it yields absolutely nothing int erms of the actual chemical composition. In order to facilitate very much the search, it is wise to know the chemical composition before trying to identify the exact species by XRD. Lesson : only X-ray chemically analysed samples : if you can limit the search to compounds that e.g. only contain Fe and S the system will have to compare only perhaps 10 or so diffraction patterns from the database of mineralogical structures instead of all 4000-5000. In amorphous X-ray diffraction just does not occur (simplified). The diffraction "pattern" you would obtain just contains some background fluctuations and/or one or more broad low intensity bands. Lesson : amorphous materials cannot be analysed by XRD Some minerals are very sensitive to the treatment with X-rays (some silver compounds, loss of crystal water, thermal micro-explosions of grains containing liquid or gaseous inclusions etc.). Lesson : use your eyes and brains and do not trust 100 % your computer who does the actual matching. EPILOG Free extra lesson : depending on the XRD-camera and sample holder for powder diffractometry a quantity of about 5 to 30 mg is needed (minimal) More : the sample has to be powdered to a granulometry of something in the order of magnitude of 1-10 ?m. If necessary grind the sample (e.g. hand picked micro-crystals) in an agate mortar & pestle. Extremely fine powders (as sometimes in clays etc.), meaning grain sizes down to a few nm, sometimes appear as almost amorphous, simply because there are not enough subsequent planes in those nanocrystals to yield significant X-ray diffraction. Practical consideration : take into account that with a classical goniometer a fast survey diffraction pattern takes perhaps an hour or so, a very sensitive and detailed diffraction pattern can take up to 10 hours. Some modern diffractometers are equipped with simultaneous detectors, which are extremely fast (e.g. a few minutes for a good pattern), but mostly with much less resolution (coarser peaks). The price of a diffractometer is in the order of magnitude of 150 000 to 250 000 ? (200 000 to 330 000 $). X-ray diffractometry can be used for all types of crystallographic materials, so also for metals, organic products, all types of salts and other inorganic (crystalline !) products. Many hundred thousand patterns are available in databases. Most systems have minerals as a separate set to limit search extend. Greetings, and good luck with your next X-ray diffraction experiment. Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com Tue Nov 23 10:52:37 2004 From: Anthony.Schlinsog at GEHA.com (Schlinsog, Anthony) Date: Tue Nov 23 10:51:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah Message-ID: I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the same. Anthony Schlinsog -----Original Message----- From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- north west of Sunstone Knoll. Anthony Schlinsog _______________________________________________________________ Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the Trilobites? Thank you. Hilmar --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. From litleval at ruralnetwork.net Tue Nov 23 12:52:00 2004 From: litleval at ruralnetwork.net (Linda Rasmussen) Date: Tue Nov 23 12:53:00 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah References: Message-ID: <005201c4d19e$488c2ac0$695fe842@pavilion> Hello Anthony, I am very interested in the maps you have, I am planning on going into that area and spending several weeks the upcoming spring, anything in your maps is going to make it so much easier for me, thank you for the time you are spending in helping the rest of us dirt diggers. we appreachieate it. Best to you Wayne Rasmussen ----- Original Message ----- From: Schlinsog, Anthony To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 11:52 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > same. > > Anthony Schlinsog > > -----Original Message----- > From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > Anthony Schlinsog > _______________________________________________________________ > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > Trilobites? > > Thank you. > > Hilmar > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 23 13:22:00 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 23 13:22:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites and topaz Message-ID: <195.32cc62ec.2ed503f8@aol.com> In a message dated 11/23/04 12:53:51 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, litleval@ruralnetwork.net writes: I am very interested in the maps you have, I am planning on going into that area and spending several weeks the upcoming spring, anything in your maps is going to make it so much easier for me, thank you for the time you are spending in helping the rest of us dirt diggers. we appreachieate it. I'm trying to get back over that way again too. A few years ago a lady named Sue (who used Opal Eyes as her email address) organized a Memorial Day trip to Topaz Mountain. She knew the area well and said the end of May was the latest it would be comfortable in that area. I went there a couple times at Memorial Day and I agree with her. In fact, I recall a day or two in May when the Cove was toooooo damn hot to be comfortable. The Cove at Topaz Mountain is a narrow, steep, treeless canyon. The sun reflects off the white rhyolite and the Cove gets real hot. But if you want topaz it is worth the trip. There are millions of them scattered through the sand and billions more weathering out of the rhyolite host rock. The topaz is hard to see without the sun shinning on them, so you need to be there on a sunny day, just not to sunny. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockcurrier at cs.com Tue Nov 23 13:48:42 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 23 13:39:58 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 21 References: <200411220203.iAM22h23004638@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <009c01c4d1a6$33b961a0$6901a8c0@rock3> Most of the amethyst geodes from Brazil come from near the little city of Ametista Sur in Rio Grande do Sul state. The name of this town used to be Sao Gabriel (I hope I have the spelling correct) All the geodes from this region, sometimes called Irai have a green "skin" when dug from the basalt. It is commonly thought to be the mineral celadonite, but I have never seen or heard of an analysis to confirm that. It appears that it is this green mineral coating or related minerals that allow the geodes from this region to be removed cleanly from the basalt during the mining process. The amethyst geodes from the basalts in Uruguay, some distance to the south do not have this "skin" and are not easily removed from the basalt. When the Uruguayan geodes are removed from the basalt, a lot of basalt is removed with them. Flat lying basalt flows are the norm for both regions. Near Ametista Sul the basalt flow with the greatest concentration of amethyst amygdaloids is mined from horizontal tunnels driven into the basalt parallel to each other. Pillars are left in place between the tunnels to hold up the ground. There are about 5000 miners engaged in mining geodes here and the mines have become extensive and in places resemble an endless low ceiling room with pillars in every direction as far as your light can penetrate. When mining for the amethysts, rock drills are used and periodically these drills encounter an amethyst geode and when the drill breaks into the geode, the drill lurches forward into the cavity. Then more care is taken with further drilling and blasting to, if possible remove it intact from the basalt. The last step involves the use of hand held pneumatic hammers and even hammers and chisels. They all have a green skin of celadonite?. Because of their method of removal they all have a drill hole in them. They are then taken by truck, packed in wood chips from local saw mills to factories, many of them in Sodedade (the center of the amethyst and agate trade in Brazil where most of them are cut in half long ways and polished. The half that has the hole in it is carefully and cunningly filled in with amethyst crystals of similar size and color. Almost all the geodes from the mines have a fair amount of epoxy that is run into the cracks that are caused by the mining process. You used to be able to easily see the cracks by looking at the backs of the geodes, but not any more. Today the process is to add a cement base to the geodes (as generous as possible because they are sold by the kg) and the whole back side of the geode is painted with a slurry of cement or plaster that has been colored to resemble the color of the original celadonite(?) Agates are mined along with the amethyst, but little care is taken to remove them undamaged from the basalt, so most of them are cracked and broken by the mining process. These agates are referred to as irai agates and can be quite attractive. Most of them have white and gray to blue banding but occasionally striking yellow colors are encountered. If anyone know of any analysis that definitely identifies the green coating on these geodes I would like to hear about it. Rock From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Tue Nov 23 17:32:33 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Tue Nov 23 17:32:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger Message-ID: <000c01c4d1c5$79774a80$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Reading the latest issue of Mineral News, there was a report that the Academy of Natural Sciences (Philadelphia) is trying to dispose of their mineral collections. Many of them are of historical significance. For instance, the Seybert collection is the oldest mineral collection in the U.S.! There appears to be no interest and minimal effort to preserve the collections intact. They are interested in selling them piecemeal rather than transfer them to a willing museum to preserve them. I urge everyone to contact the Academy to reconsider their plan. Alan --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Tue Nov 23 17:34:59 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Tue Nov 23 17:34:46 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat on-line? Message-ID: <001301c4d1c5$cfe6fa00$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> I've been trying to access www.mindat.org on-line today. Is their server down? I was able to load some mine and quarry photos into their archive last night, but when I tried to do anything else, it wouldn't work. I have sent the site owner several e-mails, but have not received a response. Alan --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From danweinrich at charter.net Tue Nov 23 17:41:17 2004 From: danweinrich at charter.net (Dan Weinrich) Date: Tue Nov 23 17:41:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat on-line? References: <001301c4d1c5$cfe6fa00$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <007e01c4d1c6$b174fb20$6601a8c0@S0029989181> I've had trouble off and on today as well ..... at times I was able to access without problem, other times not ... Dan Weinrich ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alan Goldstein" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 7:34 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat on-line? I've been trying to access www.mindat.org on-line today. Is their server down? I was able to load some mine and quarry photos into their archive last night, but when I tried to do anything else, it wouldn't work. I have sent the site owner several e-mails, but have not received a response. Alan --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From geenet2 at mchsi.com Tue Nov 23 18:21:13 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 23 18:21:42 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah References: Message-ID: <003701c4d1cc$4589aa40$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> We would love to have a map for collecting trilobites. We'll be heading out west again next May. Jeanette and Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Schlinsog, Anthony" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > same. > > Anthony Schlinsog > > -----Original Message----- > From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > Anthony Schlinsog > _______________________________________________________________ > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > Trilobites? > > Thank you. > > Hilmar > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From geenet2 at mchsi.com Tue Nov 23 18:22:56 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 23 18:23:24 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] map to trilobites in Utah References: Message-ID: <003b01c4d1cc$82b12ec0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Forgot to include our email address... geenet2@mchsi.com Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Schlinsog, Anthony" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > same. > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > Anthony Schlinsog > _______________________________________________________________ > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > Trilobites? > > Thank you. > > Hilmar > > From jayhawkmn at yahoo.com Tue Nov 23 18:24:47 2004 From: jayhawkmn at yahoo.com (June Young) Date: Tue Nov 23 18:24:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041124022447.97976.qmail@web51004.mail.yahoo.com> I would be interested in maps. Thanks June HilmarKrocke wrote: 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- north west of Sunstone Knoll. Anthony Schlinsog _______________________________________________________________ Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the Trilobites? Thank you. Hilmar --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Nov 23 20:39:12 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Nov 23 20:38:35 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger References: <000c01c4d1c5$79774a80$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <41A41045.1C01@Tomaszewski.net> Alan, I suspect it is too late. The pattern is not that uncommon. Where is the line forming to buy the specimens? They usually give discounts if you buy a whole collection. Kreigh Alan Goldstein wrote: > > Reading the latest issue of Mineral News, there was a report that the Academy of Natural Sciences (Philadelphia) is trying to dispose of their mineral collections. Many of them are of historical significance. For instance, the Seybert collection is the oldest mineral collection in the U.S.! There appears to be no interest and minimal effort to preserve the collections intact. They are interested in selling them piecemeal rather than transfer them to a willing museum to preserve them. > > I urge everyone to contact the Academy to reconsider their plan. > > Alan From MCGINNISG at aol.com Tue Nov 23 21:23:15 2004 From: MCGINNISG at aol.com (MCGINNISG@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 23 21:23:27 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] min-dat on line Message-ID: <1a4.2bdbb2a7.2ed574c3@aol.com> Min-dat has been down most of the day if you try to access it directly... However if you can enter thru a sidedoor like asking yahoo for, let say, "Himalaya mine"....you get right through. Tim --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From DOMMELEN at DAL.CA Wed Nov 24 05:59:48 2004 From: DOMMELEN at DAL.CA (Ronnie Van Dommelen) Date: Wed Nov 24 05:59:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides Message-ID: <1101304788.41a493d417a81@my2.dal.ca> Hi All, I have a question for those people who use fiber light guides with their microscopes. I have an option to get the guide with or without a spot lens on the user end of the guide. I am thinking that the lens is not necessary. Would others agree? Thanks in advance. Ronnie van Dommelen From morningstar at att.net Wed Nov 24 06:35:41 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Wed Nov 24 06:35:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides Message-ID: <112420041435.5518.41A49C3C000D9F980000158E21612436469D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: Ronnie Van Dommelen > > I have an option to get the guide with or without a spot lens on the user end of > the guide. I am thinking that the lens is not necessary. Would others agree? Hi, I have found the spot lenses useful, especially at high magnifications, and into deep vesicles. Sometimes the spot can wash out your view, but most spot add-ons are adjustable for focus--and you can always move the tip back a little to decrease the glare. Check to see if the spot lens is removable, and adjustable. If you really don't want to pay for it now--perhaps it is about $40-$75 extra?--it may cost you more to add on later. Hope this helps, Don From Mauricedegraaf at xs4all.nl Wed Nov 24 08:21:44 2004 From: Mauricedegraaf at xs4all.nl (Maurice de Graaf) Date: Wed Nov 24 08:21:46 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides In-Reply-To: <1101304788.41a493d417a81@my2.dal.ca> Message-ID: Hi, THe focus lenses on the end of the fibre optics are VERY usefull in my opinion. First of all, withouth them most of the light ends up (far) outside the field of view of the scope. That is a waste of light, that you could use well on your specimen. More importantly in my model the lenses sit in holders. These holders are neccesary too for daylight filters. The light from fibre optics is still much to yellow, even when run at max power. Slightly blue filters compensate for that. It is a must if you want to judge colors, look at pale yellow minerals or take pictures. So when you need the holders for the filters, you can as well purchase the lenses. For my system the whole set of holder, lens and daylight filers where about $10 each. It is DEFINITELY worth the money. (at http://maurice.strahlen.org/minerals/aleksandrite.htm, you see an Alexandrite with full power and daylight filters and one at 50% power without filters to illustrate the alexandrite effect) Finally a free tip: do not run your fibre optic lights at 100% when just looking. When you turn down the 'volume' to 90% your bulps will last up to ten times longer, while the difference in light color is neglectible. I only use 100% power when taking pics. cheers, Maurice -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]On Behalf Of Ronnie Van Dommelen Sent: woensdag 24 november 2004 15:00 To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides Hi All, I have a question for those people who use fiber light guides with their microscopes. I have an option to get the guide with or without a spot lens on the user end of the guide. I am thinking that the lens is not necessary. Would others agree? Thanks in advance. Ronnie van Dommelen _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From morningstar at att.net Wed Nov 24 08:32:00 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (morningstar@att.net) Date: Wed Nov 24 08:32:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides Message-ID: <112420041632.5808.41A4B77F000C6036000016B021612436469D0E9B9C090207029D0103@att.net> > Finally a free tip: do not run your fibre optic lights at 100% when just > looking. When you turn down the 'volume' to 90% your bulps will last up to > ten times longer, while the difference in light color is neglectible. I only > use 100% power when taking pics. That's a very nice tip Maurice. Also, I might add something, now that Maurice reminded me: for units that have variable power, turn it on with the rheostat at 10% or whatever the lowest setting is, and then turn it up to 90%. This extends the life of the filament even further! If you notice what happens at home, most light bulbs "blow" when you turn them on; it is the thermal shock of all that heat in a cold filament. Don From kadok at infowest.com Wed Nov 24 09:05:57 2004 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Wed Nov 24 09:06:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat on-line? In-Reply-To: <001301c4d1c5$cfe6fa00$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <20041124170600.9ACD6CB9E6C@delivery.infowest.com> Seems to be working OK now (Wed. AM) Margaret -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Alan Goldstein Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 6:35 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat on-line? I've been trying to access www.mindat.org on-line today. Is their server down? I was able to load some mine and quarry photos into their archive last night, but when I tried to do anything else, it wouldn't work. I have sent the site owner several e-mails, but have not received a response. Alan --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From tjokela at execulink.com Wed Nov 24 10:06:11 2004 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Wed Nov 24 10:06:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides References: <1101304788.41a493d417a81@my2.dal.ca> Message-ID: <009101c4d250$480f5ec0$6401a8c0@Junior> Methinks you need the lens thingy for sure. Should be some lying around the optics lab you could, er, 'liberate'. (I jest.) Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Great minerals for sale: http://www.element51.com The minerals of Ontario: http://www.ontariominerals.com Minerals through the microscope: http://www.micromounts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ronnie Van Dommelen" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:59 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Fiber Optic Light Guides > Hi All, > > I have a question for those people who use fiber light guides with their > microscopes. > > I have an option to get the guide with or without a spot lens on the user > end of > the guide. I am thinking that the lens is not necessary. Would others > agree? > > Thanks in advance. > > Ronnie van Dommelen > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From j&gcornish at tenforward.com Wed Nov 24 12:22:57 2004 From: j&gcornish at tenforward.com (John and Gloria Cornish) Date: Wed Nov 24 12:23:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Kitsap Mineral and Gem Society Show Report Message-ID: <41A4EDA1.7020300@tenforward.com> 11/24/2004 Kitsap Mineral and Gem Society Show Report By John Cornish j&gcornish@tenforward.com Hi Everyone, This last weekend, November 20th and the 21st, the folks of the Kitsap Mineral and Gem Society hosted their 21st annual Fall Festival of Gems. Gloria and I are members and were excited that this special weekend had finally arrived. Of Washington State geological hobbyist clubs, the Kitsap Society is the largest organization west of Puget Sound. The Society is strengthened by an active and dedicated membership which is additionally blessed with a thriving Junior program. For over 60 years, this group of northwest enthusiasts has kept the mineral and fossil torches a' blazing and this last weekend's show reflected their passion in spades. The Show was held in the spacious Presidents Hall of the Kitsap County Fairgrounds. This year the entire Hall was secured for our event and this expansion proved to be a wonderful thing in every sense. New areas were established for a wide range of demonstrators whose talents varied from Cabochon making to Sphere making, from Intarsia to Rock Painting and beyond. Additional seating areas were also generously spread about where many of our guests rested tired feet or relaxed taking a bite to eat. As a behind the scenes benefit for Kitsap Society members, this is where we had our wonderful potluck pre- show dinner and post- show pizza feast -- yum, yum! Continually buzzing with activity, this area was hopping throughout the show, and the main room, that place was busy, busy, busy! We set show attendance records over the weekend and folks came through steadily during both days. Oh we had a few quiet times, but really, for the most part, smiling faces abounded. A favorite of most and certainly of mine, were the wonderful display cases presented by the membership and their invited guests. Over 70 of these were offered and their treasures varied far and wide, ranging across the many and varied aspects of our hobby. There were gracefully carved lapidary treasures and Green River formation fossil fish from Wyoming, there were petrified woods and Carnelian agate, faceted this and cabochoned that, knapped this and crystallized that, yes, there were truly some decent cases offered. Among these for me, those displays offering crystallized specimens are those I most eagerly seek, I was not to be disappointed! Chief among these displays was the terrific Rice Northwest Museum of Rocks and Minerals case which featured new 2004 Indian acquisitions from the Rudy Tschernich zeolite collection (soon to be featured within a newly constructed gallery currently being built). Rudy's case displayed 7 specimens, among these was a monstrous foot-plus long translucent stilbite center piece with 3 inch doubly terminated crystals (purchased in Denver, Colorado at the Holiday Inn Show), a mind boggling scolecite club-like spray of crystals nearly a foot long whose main crystal was an unbelievable 2 inches wide (purchased in Kelso, Washington at the Pacific Northwest Friends of Mineralogy Symposium), several dinner plate sized specimens of fragile scolecite with dramatically diverging sprays of silky white crystals whose lengths ranged from 2 to 6 inches (purchased in Tucson, Arizona), 2 killer heulandite specimens, one with large 3 inch green celadonite included crystals and the other a fantastically mirror lustered soft, beautiful pink, and finally, a mordenite matrixed opaque white gathering of stellerite in radiating hemispheres to 3 inches; a truly phenomenal case. Gloria and I presented two display cases and both featured specimens (of which I'm perhaps overly proud) from our two claims in Challis, Idaho; the Rat's Nest and the Summer Storm. In our Rat's Nest case, we displayed the finest examples of many of the species as thus far collected. Among these was our foot tall and wide center piece specimen featuring a matrix framed pocket of white mordenite and pink heulandite upon which are perched the largest and best group of calcites thus far recovered. They are transparent yellow pseudo hexagonal tabular crystals nearly an inch thick and 3 inches across which are perfectly positioned right in the center of the pocket in high relief. Several other calcite/ zeolite combination specimens in the miniature size range were also displayed. The right corner of the case was dominated by a large 8 x 8 inch open mouthed matrix pocket specimen perfectly offering the piled fluffy mordenite jumble we often encounter centered within newly opened pockets mounding a top of the other minerals and alluding to the claims name to my way of thinking. Below this and on both sides of the case were two exceptional small cabinet sized specimens featuring incredibly delicate white acicular crystallized mordenite, one in association with pink heulandite. There was a nice miniature with one inch long stilbites associated with heulandite, and then there were the heulandites themselves. Of those displayed, two specimens featured exceptional orange crystals and another featured the largest single crystal discovered thus far, a 3 inch doubly terminated monster on matrix. All of these specimens were collected during the 2003 and 2004 collecting seasons. For our Summer Storm display, we really brought out the big gun. This is a 147 pound monster pocket which was collected this year. Whittled down from a much larger boulder-sized behemoth, this jelly bean shaped specimen really dominates a display case fantastically. A large viewing window has been opened into the essentially hollow rock to offer its crystalline bounty superbly. The Summer Storms claim to fame is its production of world class quartz pseudomorphs after apophyllite. This pocket features pseudomorphs over an inch wide and twice that tall in a solid pocket lining associated with a large hanging veil-like yellow calcite fan overgrown magically by bright sparkling drusy quartz crystals. We placed several other smaller specimens as accentuants to this over-sized center piece and then topped the whole display off with two 8 x 10 photographs showing actual collecting on the claim. Back at the show, 13 dealers were spread about offering their wares. These offered goods varying from tools to books, from cabochons to faceted stones, from jewelry to opal, from crystals to fossils. The good folks of the Kitsap Society's Show Committee over the last 21 years have really developed a wonderful group of vendors and the consistent quality of their inventories always entices many to acquire their special and unique treasures. For the second year now, Gloria and I are proud to count ourselves among this group. We offer a colorful array of crystallized treasures from U.S. and world localities and obviously feature specimens from the Rat's Nest and the Summer Storm claims (and from a third we own, Big Chief, located in Washington State, which produces quartz and pyrite specimens). We further offer one other wonderful activity, where using a large pipe cutter, I crack Mexican coconut geodes. This is a real blast and a funner activity for a Rock Show I cannot envision. We use this big tool to compress and crack the geodes open for immediate gratification. No cutting, no polishing, just set the tool up and compress the handle and -POP- the geode cracks perfectly to expose as one young man once said, a rock with a surprise inside! We had some real winners go home with folks this show, there were awesome deep purple amethysts and delicate gemmy clear calcites and then there were my favorites, the blue banded agate lined geodes which are overgrown by clear quartz crystals to create a glowing turquoise-like blue field of glittery sparkling crystals. Man, I just love these things! They may be simple to some, but least they forget, its the simple pleasures in life that are the most rewarding too! We cracked geodes 'til the cows came home or so it seemed and just flat had way too good of a time. But like all good things, they seem to end too soon. Sunday's 5:00 PM closing time came and went and with it, another terrific show has come to an end. Everyone banded together to breakdown the show and then met one final time over pizza to share their stories before finishing up and taking off for home. Where the ring of voices once pealed, with the closing and locking of the doors, now only the silence remains. It'll be a year until next we all meet again, I'm already counting the days! All the very best everyone. Take care, John --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockcurrier at cs.com Wed Nov 24 12:29:33 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Wed Nov 24 12:29:08 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 23 References: <200411240203.iAO230qM019053@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <023701c4d264$4fe02a30$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Comments concerning the proposed sale of the mineral collection(s) in the Academy of Science in Philadelphia. When the mineral collections, most notably perhaps the Vaux collection, were given to the Academy, it was the intention of all involved that the collection would be cherished and maintained intact. I do not know what sort of letters of understanding or legal documents, if any, may have been signed relating to the preservation of the collection when it was given to the institution. Even if there were legal documents signed, I don't know if current case law requires, after 100+ years? that collections like these be kept in tact. Certainly it was the hope of the Vaux family that the collection would be preserved intact in perpetuity. Some institutions have accepted collections with the understanding that they would be preserved in perpetuity, but I do not think that any institution today will accept collections on that basis. The reason for this is that times change and the institutions must change with the times or go out of business. One only has to look at the sad state of mineralogy in our public institutions to know that things have changed greatly and are continuing to change at a rapid rate. The Academy of science has not had a curator for their mineral collection for a number of years and it is obvious that they really don't have any use for the mineral collections that was entrusted to their care. We can all write letters to them, pointing out to them their moral obligation to cherish and nurture their mineral collection in the manner that it used to be, but I fear that it that would be like asking them to put toothpaste back in a tube. At best we (the mineral collecting community in general) may be able to stop them from selling the collection. We can not however make them cherish it, hire a curator for it, provide generous display area for it or spend a lot of money to make that display a reality. If we can stop the sale about the best we can hope for is that they will let the collection molder away in some basement room open to the slow vandalism of underpaid janitorial staff or anyone else who might have access to the room. Eventually water will leak into the room, rotting the shelving units and the drawers will collapse on themselves damaging the specimens. Would it not be better to make the specimens available to collectors who would kill their grandmother for some of the old classics contained in the collection. Would not the specimens be best cared for in the possession of those who are willing to pay the most money for them those who certainly know more about them than the current owner? As it stands now, the general public and mineral collectors are not even able to see the specimens and this will likely not change even if the Academy can be talked into keeping the collection. Rock Currier From morningstar at att.net Wed Nov 24 13:12:26 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Wed Nov 24 13:12:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger In-Reply-To: <023701c4d264$4fe02a30$bcf3a5d8@rock5> References: <200411240203.iAO230qM019053@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <023701c4d264$4fe02a30$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <41A4F93A.3070100@att.net> Rock Currier wrote: > Comments concerning the proposed sale of the mineral collection(s) in the > Academy of Science in Philadelphia. Folks, *Please*, *please* insert the correct subject when you're replying to a digest message. Thanks. Rock, you make some excellent and rational points. If the current leadership of the Academy is not interested in their world-class and historical mineral collection, a dedicated but small group of collectors and scientists is not going to change their minds. Their first response would likely be, "Are you people going to provide the funding?" Museums, more than ever, are expected to become self-sustaining businesses. However, Rock, I think that many folks in the scientific community would like to see the collection donated to another institution. It is difficult these days to find an institution to trust; but in the end there is always the Smithsonian. Don From rik.dillen at skynet.be Wed Nov 24 13:37:28 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Wed Nov 24 13:37:41 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger In-Reply-To: <41A4F93A.3070100@att.net> Message-ID: <000701c4d26d$cf0b29a0$22d2c850@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Don H *Sent: woensdag 24 november 2004 22:12 *To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors *Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger * *However, Rock, I think that many folks in the scientific community would like to see the collection donated to another institution. It is difficult these days to find an institution to trust; but in the end there is always the Smithsonian. >>>>> Alias "the warehouse of the USA" :>)))) I heard rumors that they hardly accept donations because of full cellars. Anyway, I am proud that there is at least one specimen from my collection is since 1994 present in the Smithsonian collection (destinezite/diadochite from Belgium). As a colleague stated lately : "in the near future the best collecting sites will be the cellars of passed-away collectors (and closed down museum collections)". Unfortunate reality... Best regards, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From morningstar at att.net Wed Nov 24 13:54:04 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Wed Nov 24 13:53:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] historical mineral collections in danger In-Reply-To: <000701c4d26d$cf0b29a0$22d2c850@maxdata> References: <000701c4d26d$cf0b29a0$22d2c850@maxdata> Message-ID: <41A502FC.1070401@att.net> Rik Dillen wrote: >>>>>>Alias "the warehouse of the USA" :>)))) > > I heard rumors that they hardly accept donations because of full cellars. I think they have suitable room in their off-site warehouse to hold a significant collection such as this. Quite frankly, I'd rather see it go to to the Royal Ontario Museum than be destroyed. > As a colleague stated lately : "in the near future the best collecting sites will be the cellars of passed-away collectors (and > closed down museum collections)". Unfortunate reality... Indeed. Especially when, in our children's lifetimes, there is a crisis in natural resources and scientists need to go back to old matertial to find clues to economically viable deposits (read Fred Pough's introduction to his Peterson Field Guide) and there is nowhere to turn. Don From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Wed Nov 24 16:48:36 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Wed Nov 24 16:48:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Academy collections References: <200411240203.iAO230qM019053@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <023701c4d264$4fe02a30$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <007301c4d288$8190c430$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> As a former curator of the second oldest collection in the U.S. (the Troost collection), I have an affinity for keeping the most significant collections in the U.S. intact. Particularly the earlist collections... The museum where I worked became a science center a couple of years before I changed jobs. They have returned collections of artifacts to a few donors and closed some indefinitely renewable artifact loans with NASA. But the Troost collection is still viewed by their management as a community / national treasure, even as there are no plans to display any quantity of the collection again. If the Louisville Science Center can do it, the Academy can find an alternative to selling the collection off piecemeal. They should make an effort to offer the oldest collections (at a minimum) to the National Museum because they are truly national treasures (current movie not withstanding). There are more late 19th century U.S. collections in existence than those before 1860, and I do not know enough about those collections to comment. I am sure "dumping" major historical collections on the market will create a stir and make people some money. It might be unfair to single out the Academy when other supposed "repositories of knowledge and history" dispose of mineral collections. But pre-1860 American collections are unique; to me it is no different than an art museum deciding to sell a DiVinci or a library selling a Gutenberg Bible to help pay for something else. By the way, the situation with the Academy is not unique to mineralogy. Many other types of natural history collections are also in grave danger. It is part of the paradigm shift in museums from a collections focus to a visitor focus. Alan Goldstein P.S. Over the past 10 years, I have been transferring data from the Troost catalog onto a Filemaker database. This winter I should finish the project - with nearly 13,000 entries! I will provide the science center a copy and make copies available to anyone who wants one at a nominal cost. (Or turn it over to the science center if they agree to take funds from sales and roll it into a preservation or on-line Troost exhibit.) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rock Currier" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 3:29 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 23 > Comments concerning the proposed sale of the mineral collection(s) in the > Academy of Science in Philadelphia. > > When the mineral collections, most notably perhaps the Vaux collection, > were > given to the Academy, it was the intention of all involved that the > collection would be cherished and maintained intact. I do not know what > sort > of letters of understanding or legal documents, if any, may have been > signed > relating to the preservation of the collection when it was given to the > institution. Even if there were legal documents signed, I don't know if > current case law requires, after 100+ years? that collections like these > be > kept in tact. Certainly it was the hope of the Vaux family that the > collection would be preserved intact in perpetuity. Some institutions have > accepted collections with the understanding that they would be preserved > in > perpetuity, but I do not think that any institution today will accept > collections on that basis. The reason for this is that times change and > the > institutions must change with the times or go out of business. One only > has > to look at the sad state of mineralogy in our public institutions to know > that things have changed greatly and are continuing to change at a rapid > rate. The Academy of science has not had a curator for their mineral > collection for a number of years and it is obvious that they really don't > have any use for the mineral collections that was entrusted to their care. > We can all write letters to them, pointing out to them their moral > obligation to cherish and nurture their mineral collection in the manner > that it used to be, but I fear that it that would be like asking them to > put > toothpaste back in a tube. > At best we (the mineral collecting community in general) may be able to > stop them from selling the collection. We can not however make them > cherish > it, hire a curator for it, provide generous display area for it or spend a > lot of money to make that display a reality. If we can stop the sale about > the best we can hope for is that they will let the collection molder away > in > some basement room open to the slow vandalism of underpaid janitorial > staff > or anyone else who might have access to the room. Eventually water will > leak > into the room, rotting the shelving units and the drawers will collapse on > themselves damaging the specimens. Would it not be better to make the > specimens available to collectors who would kill their grandmother for > some > of the old classics contained in the collection. Would not the specimens > be > best cared for in the possession of those who are willing to pay the most > money for them those who certainly know more about them than the current > owner? As it stands now, the general public and mineral collectors are not > even able to see the specimens and this will likely not change even if the > Academy can be talked into keeping the collection. > Rock Currier > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From SheriHelms at aol.com Wed Nov 24 18:16:24 2004 From: SheriHelms at aol.com (SheriHelms@aol.com) Date: Wed Nov 24 18:16:33 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Mississippi Message-ID: <1db.2fcf5b0f.2ed69a78@aol.com> Hi I live in Memphis, TN. My daughter, age 9, is very interested in rocks. We have joined our local mineral club. We are interested in collecting some agate to tumble, or surface collecting we can do. We had been to a lot of places with the club, but I need to find some new places. Does anyone know of some spots? Thanks Sheri --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kahako at aloha.net Wed Nov 24 21:09:24 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Nov 24 20:40:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we wish you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for which to be thankful, for each and every one of you. Aloha, Kitty & Bill -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Nov 25 01:59:58 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Nov 25 01:59:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: > lightening over the ocean, black anvil-shaped cloud over Mauna Kea, thunder driving dog crazy, lava pouring into the ocean.... sounds like Thanksgiving and Armageddon are falling on the same day this year ;-)))) Happy Thanksgiving from Belgium to all Americans on the list! Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Kitty & Bill Heacox Verzonden: donderdag 25 november 2004 6:09 Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we wish you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for which to be thankful, for each and every one of you. Aloha, Kitty & Bill -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From gemnance at houston.rr.com Thu Nov 25 04:30:50 2004 From: gemnance at houston.rr.com (Jim Nance) Date: Thu Nov 25 04:36:28 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah References: Message-ID: <004501c4d2ea$99648b20$6401a8c0@houston.rr.com> Hi Anthony, I would appreciate a copy of your Utah maps. Thanks Jim Nance ----- Original Message ----- From: "Schlinsog, Anthony" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > same. > > Anthony Schlinsog > > -----Original Message----- > From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > Anthony Schlinsog > _______________________________________________________________ > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > Trilobites? > > Thank you. > > Hilmar > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 25 06:43:24 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Thu Nov 25 06:35:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <001701c4d2fd$1f86bfe0$f2a4490c@pete> It sounds pretty neat, there in Hawaii this morning! Enjoy the day, and I'll add my own good wishes for Thanksgiving, to you and everyone on the List (and everyone else in the whole rest of the world, for that matter!). Kitty, I always understood that "there is no lightning in Hawaii"--I guess there's very little, and this is an exception. You may know that this relates to certain kinds of geophysical measurements, that depend on electrical currents always moving through the earth, readjustments of electrical charge in response to lightning discharges always occurring all over the planet; this is called magnetotellurics, and it allows one to measure things about the electrical conductivity of the rocks of the earth's crust. And I'd always been told, that Hawaii is particularly quiet in this regard, because there is so little lightning in the area. This morning in Colorado is quite warm, and breezy; we are to have "chinook" winds today, the warm, descending winds as the air blows down off the mountain front and warms as it compresses. We are coming off a bit of colder weather and light snow the last day or two (only a touch, they had much more rain & snow in the midwest and east, I guess), but after a warm day today there's a bit of snow expected tomorrow, I believe. The sunrise was beautiful this morning--pink and yellow clouds, with patches of blue sky between. I took one picture but I still don't have a digital camera--however, I just had a very similar sunrise picture developed that I took last month, and in a few minutes, Kitty & Bill, I'll email you a copy (and anyone else who'd like one?) to show you "Sunrise in Denver", I'd been shooting slides but I got digital copies made on a CD along with the development--just picked them up yesterday. P.S., I was just listening to a very interesting story on the news, about the "Deep Impact" probe that is about to be launched, and will send an (800-some pound?) "impactor" into an approaching comet some time (8 or 9 months?) from now, to excavate a "football-field-sized" crater and blast out fresh material from the interior of the comet, which the parent probe will study via spectroscopy to learn about its composition. They said the explosion & debris cloud from the impact may even be visible from earth with the naked eye when it happens. Cool--just like science fiction! Once again, all the best to everyone, Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:09 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. From sonskynm at telkomsa.net Thu Nov 25 08:57:03 2004 From: sonskynm at telkomsa.net (Gerhard en Rietha Bindeman) Date: Thu Nov 25 08:58:17 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <000901c4d30f$f2e6aaf0$010aa8c0@gerhard> KITTY WE ARE AT THE START OF A VERY VERY HOT SUMMER IN THE SUNNY SOUTH AFRICA TODAY WAS A 34C ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:09 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this > Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > > Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who > celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we wish > you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. > > Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for which > to be thankful, for each and every one of you. > > Aloha, Kitty & Bill > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Thu Nov 25 10:01:49 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Thu Nov 25 09:53:50 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving summer in Celsius References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> <000901c4d30f$f2e6aaf0$010aa8c0@gerhard> Message-ID: <006901c4d318$d6d55ec0$f2a4490c@pete> Dear Gerhard & Rietha, I think we all "up here" tend to forget about when it's summer in another part of the world, so thanks for reminding us! And when I do my mental (or on my calculator) computation of exactly what 34 C means, and I get 93 F, I really appreciate your warm weather! 'Tis sorry but try, even as pretty much of a scientist, I really don't intuitively relate to temperature in Celsius (or equally, to rainfall in mm!), until I convert them to Fahrenheit, or inches. Until I do the numerical conversion, all I know is "that's warm". It's all what you are used to! I do better with distances in km, at least I have a pretty good feel for what they mean. Enjoy your early (almost) summer down there, Pete in the northern hemisphere. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gerhard en Rietha Bindeman" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 9:57 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > KITTY WE ARE AT THE START OF A VERY VERY HOT SUMMER IN THE SUNNY SOUTH > AFRICA TODAY WAS A 34C From kahako at aloha.net Thu Nov 25 11:05:15 2004 From: kahako at aloha.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Thu Nov 25 10:35:49 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] lightning (was Thanksgiving) In-Reply-To: <001701c4d2fd$1f86bfe0$f2a4490c@pete> References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> <001701c4d2fd$1f86bfe0$f2a4490c@pete> Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.0.20041125081757.03927bd0@mail.aloha.net> A lot of people---and dogs---in Hawaii will strongly dispute the idea that "there is no lightning in Hawaii." At least 3 or 4 times a year we have spectacular thunder and lightening storms, and more often then that there are flashes of lightening that don't amount to storms. We see lighting leaping from cloud to cloud out over the ocean, as well as huge flashes and classic "bolts" over Mauna Kea and Mauna Loa. Two years ago a lightening strike blew out the electronic gate-opener at the entrance to our property. Last year lighting destroyed our Public Radio tower, and the year before it hit the electric plant and we were without power for 24 hours. Everyone here has surge protectors for all their electronic devices, and many of us have back-up generators for the frequent occasions when the power goes out---due to lightning. The public swimming pools all have signs warning that in the event of lightning everyone must immediately leave the water and the pool will be closed; this happens several times a year. Eight years ago there was a storm that appeared to be centered directly over our house: there was a huge flash of lightning with an immediate thunder clap that made the windows rattle and the whole house vibrate, and then we saw a ball of blue-green light appear to float out from our TV set. It remained for several seconds and "St. Elmo's Fire" was all I could think to call it. The storm that began here yesterday at 2pm continued throughout the night. It's 8am now and it appears to be abating, which gives us something more to be thankful for! We got very little sleep because of the brilliant flashes of lightning and crashing thunder---much of it had that "tearing" sound as if something very large were being ripped apart---and our poor dog was terrified and tried to climb into bed with us! (This is Le'a, a malamute/shepherd mix, same age as "Hoku" the rockhound who was truly a hound, who died last July.) We are hoping the storm continues to die out, so we can be sure we will have electricity to cook our turkey! Yes, Pete, we do have lightning in Hawaii! Aloha, Kitty At 04:43 AM 11/25/2004, you wrote: >Kitty, I always understood that "there is no lightning in Hawaii"--I guess >there's very little, and this is an exception. You may know that this >relates to certain kinds of geophysical measurements, that depend on >electrical currents always moving through the earth, readjustments of >electrical charge in response to lightning discharges always occurring all >over the planet; this is called magnetotellurics, and it allows one to >measure things about the electrical conductivity of the rocks of the earth's >crust. And I'd always been told, that Hawaii is particularly quiet in this >regard, because there is so little lightning in the area. > >Pete > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:09 PM >Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > > > > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this >Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > >-- >No virus found in this incoming message. >Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. >Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 From rockcurrier at cs.com Thu Nov 25 14:57:08 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Thu Nov 25 14:56:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Philadelphia Academy of Science References: <200411250201.iAP20wnb015359@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <02a501c4d342$1ca38fc0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> As I understand the current situation, the Academy may not be in a position to give the collection to another institution. They do understand that the collection is worth a considerable amount of money and would like to convert the collection (a non performing asset) into money much needed for other programs that they consider to be much more interesting to the general public. The collection has been appraised, apparently by the person that they have selected to handle the sale for them, at $5 million plus dollars but that number is just one number I have heard through the rumor mills. That might be what the collection is worth on a retail basis. It seems a little high to me, but then it has been many years since I have seen the collection. At any rate, it is doubtful that anyone would pay that kind of price for it. I think the Academy is looking hard for a major institutional buyer but the rumor mill says that as yet, none have stepped forward with an offer anywhere near the asking price. Even if it does go to a major institution, probably only a few of the specimens would ever make it to any kind of display and it would still be very difficult for the average collector to see any of the stuff. During the last 20 years I doubt that more than a handful of collectors has even seen the collection at the Academy. I think that the collection would better off sold to collectors who would really care for the specimens. Rock Currier From geenet2 at mchsi.com Thu Nov 25 15:24:28 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Thu Nov 25 15:24:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> <001701c4d2fd$1f86bfe0$f2a4490c@pete> Message-ID: <001e01c4d345$e9830ae0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> I'd like the picture of the sunrise in Denver. My daughter lives in Lakewood, has a digital camera, but is somehow too busy to send me any pictures. She works the night shift at Walmart up in the foothills and gets to see the sunrise and early morning a lot and tells me how beautiful it is. She thinks the neatest thing is listening to the coyotes howl (bark?) to each other all night. Keeping this rock related, we visited the Red & Green Rock shop when we visited in August. I was in rock heaven! We drove home with the car loaded down with rocks from Utah and Colorado. The old gent there told us the shop was up for sale and IF my daughter has permanently relocated to Colorado I'd be mighty tempted to buy it. BTW...we're about to have our FIRST cool weather of the season here in L.A. That is Lower Alabama. We're going from the 80's on Monday to a low in the 30's tonight and I've been bringing in all the tropical plants from the yard. I'm thankful I have a sunny southern exposure back porch to turn into a greenhouse all winter. Had to move buckets and boxes of rocks to accommodate all the plants. Thankfully, Jeanette geenet@mchsi.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter J. Modreski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 8:43 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > It sounds pretty neat, there in Hawaii this morning! Enjoy the day, and > I'll add my own good wishes for Thanksgiving, to you and everyone on the > List (and everyone else in the whole rest of the world, for that matter!). > > Kitty, I always understood that "there is no lightning in Hawaii"--I guess > there's very little, and this is an exception. You may know that this > relates to certain kinds of geophysical measurements, that depend on > electrical currents always moving through the earth, readjustments of > electrical charge in response to lightning discharges always occurring all > over the planet; this is called magnetotellurics, and it allows one to > measure things about the electrical conductivity of the rocks of the earth's > crust. And I'd always been told, that Hawaii is particularly quiet in this > regard, because there is so little lightning in the area. > > This morning in Colorado is quite warm, and breezy; we are to have "chinook" > winds today, the warm, descending winds as the air blows down off the > mountain front and warms as it compresses. We are coming off a bit of > colder weather and light snow the last day or two (only a touch, they had > much more rain & snow in the midwest and east, I guess), but after a warm > day today there's a bit of snow expected tomorrow, I believe. The sunrise > was beautiful this morning--pink and yellow clouds, with patches of blue sky > between. I took one picture but I still don't have a digital > camera--however, I just had a very similar sunrise picture developed that I > took last month, and in a few minutes, Kitty & Bill, I'll email you a copy > (and anyone else who'd like one?) to show you "Sunrise in Denver", I'd been > shooting slides but I got digital copies made on a CD along with the > development--just picked them up yesterday. > > P.S., I was just listening to a very interesting story on the news, about > the "Deep Impact" probe that is about to be launched, and will send an > (800-some pound?) "impactor" into an approaching comet some time (8 or 9 > months?) from now, to excavate a "football-field-sized" crater and blast out > fresh material from the interior of the comet, which the parent probe will > study via spectroscopy to learn about its composition. They said the > explosion & debris cloud from the impact may even be visible from earth with > the naked eye when it happens. Cool--just like science fiction! > > Once again, all the best to everyone, > Pete > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kitty & Bill Heacox" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:09 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > > > > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this > Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Nov 25 17:36:45 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Nov 25 17:33:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <41A687FE.30E5@Tomaszewski.net> Aloha, We had storms in Michigan last night that dropped up to two inches of snow an hour, leaving just under a foot on the ground this morning. I think I would have preferred your thunderstorm. Happy Thanksgiving! Kreigh Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this > Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > > Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who > celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we wish > you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. > > Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for which > to be thankful, for each and every one of you. > > Aloha, Kitty & Bill > From newryqs at rochester.rr.com Fri Nov 26 05:19:40 2004 From: newryqs at rochester.rr.com (Van) Date: Fri Nov 26 05:19:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Purpurite question References: <002b01c4cd9b$ccc453a0$a7c5f051@maxdata> <419D4C62.6182@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001701c4d3ba$960b5780$6601a8c0@nathanqa8gl7gx> When I was on the staff at Ward's Natural Science Establishment, we'd get frequent calls from art conservationists, particularly museums. Mineral pigments were frequently sought, although there wasn't a particular call for purpurite or its more common iron analog, heterosite. In fact, much of what is called purpurite is actually heterosite. How old are the "ancients"? Pegmatites are relatively new to the mining scene, although some French, Russian, and German pegmatites were being worked at least by the 1700's. It would be interesting to know a bit about when pegmatites were being worked. Blasting as a mining technique was "invented" in 1600, but was probably slow in being used outside of the metal mining industry, particularly as hand drill technology had to improve for cutting into quartz and feldspar. Fortunately, heterosite-purpurite is found in outcrops in several places and outcrops may have been a limited source for this very precious pigment. Kremer's pigment site is informative about the earliest usage of some pigments, but is silent about when "purpurite" began to be used. Given the late date that heterosite was named (1825), one wonders why it escaped the attention of mineralogists, if it were known to pigment formularies? (Purpurite was first named in 1907 and 1910.) What is the earliest known fresco or painting which has identified heterosite-purpurite as a pigment? Was the pigment natural is my big question? It should be very easy to make manganese III and iron III phosphate and a bit easier to get when one is low on purple - at least easier than bidding one's minions to hustle back with some before the plaster dries. Tempus et flux et fresco(!) nemo hic expectant. Or something like that. Van ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Purpurite question > Rik Dillen wrote: >> >> Does anyone know if purpurite was known in the antiquity already as a >> pigment for art works ? >> This is a question of someone who is doing research on the subject. >> Thanks for any hint or information and greetings, >> >> Rik DILLEN > > Kremer Pigments (www.kremer-pigmente.de) includes purpurite pigment in > its researched historical pigments (used by the old masters) that they > have documented and recreated (often using the original mining > locations). If Dr. Georg Kremer can't answer your questions I'm sure he > can tell you who could. > > Kreigh > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From newryqs at rochester.rr.com Fri Nov 26 07:06:04 2004 From: newryqs at rochester.rr.com (Van) Date: Fri Nov 26 07:06:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger References: <000701c4d26d$cf0b29a0$22d2c850@maxdata> <41A502FC.1070401@att.net> Message-ID: <009d01c4d3c9$730fa970$6601a8c0@nathanqa8gl7gx> I guess part of the issue is that the Philadelphia Academy's (PA) collection represents a major historical accumulation as well as a place where people once trusted that their goodies would remain for infinity (or a hundred years, whichever came first). These days, museums no longer take restricted gifts, unless they really want the gift, then they bend all over the place. Much of the PA collection, I would believe, is unrestricted and it's only the Vaux trust which is needed to be broken. The PA's breaking of a trust would seriously undermine the future confidence in that museum to responsibly handle another major gift - or be worthy of one. Since Samuel Gordon's time, there has been a diminishing interest by the PA administration to support the mineralogy collection, particularly when the paleontology influence was strong on staff. (I guess paleontologists have always been sensitive that minerals were called fossils, long before today's fossils were called fossils.) There is now the chance for a "western" museum to get some roots by purchasing the collection and moving it along the same route that the western migrations took. I suspect that they would need a real "angel" to bring the deal around. Moving a major collection, housing it, and supporting it could cost more than the collection's simple purchase price. Of course, someone might just put it into "cold storage", which would be cheaper in the short term, but there would be need for a special gallery, staff, convenient storage, etc. to make use of the collection. Philadelphia has a recent experience of discarding its history, particularly the scientific history. Wished I'd heard in advance of the auction they had for the Franklin Institute.We are yet to actually enter the time period when electronics will be able to record and allow rapid access to what we call history. To be sure, there are all sorts of digital devices available, but there is only the hint of really getting long term storage of easilly accesssed digital information. (Am actually writing a grant proposal today for an organziation who has a mandate to supply digital records on demand.) Specimens will never be supplanted by electrons, however. I was advisor to a donor of, as well as appraisor for, an important mineral collection. The proposed recipient was enthusiastic about receiving the gift, but was a government. I mused that the government, which was not offering to hire support staff, might just as easily need the office space where the collection was to be housed and the collection, in five years, might end up in cold storage. I told the prospective donor that in the foreseeable future, the collection could also undergo "shrinkage", as boxes of stored specimens went out the door by unknown "agencies". Cold storage itself undergoes periods of stress and pressure and low priority rocks could be hauled to a landfill in preference to a higher priority commodity such as office supplies, etc. I found the donor a better place to give the specimens to. I worked for a town which wanted to insure its museum collection of minerals and they needed an appraisal. They had a catalog of the 15,000 specimens and a nice museum with old fashioned glass display cases. After looking over the exhibits, of nineteenth century specimens which included a wonderful japanese stibnite, etc., I asked to see the specimens in storage and we searched and unwraped specimens in boxes. I persisted, "Let's look at them all." "That's it" was the reply. I then told them that they had a problem, "Right here in River City". They were 14,300 specimens "short". (They weren't very good at guessing how many beans there were in the jar.) The problem was that they had to convince the townspeople that the specimens didn't disappear on their "shift". After a bit of research, everyone agreed that the remaining minerals must have been in the old town hall which burned in 1931. Lots more stories like this, many gloomier. Rock is correct, the collector who has to actually pay for a specimen is likely to do a better job at curating than someone who receives a gift. Unfortunately, my experience as an estate appraisor of minerals, geological books, correspondence, photographs, artifacts, etc. has shown that collectors are terrible at making a provision for the disposition of their collections. Additionally, I might add that, even concerning collections where there was a will, the exectutors usually (scratch that - insert almost always) mishandled the estate. The optimistic summary is that it is a wonder that we have anything from our past. Sic transit gloria mundi. Van From maxwellqe2 at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 26 12:55:10 2004 From: maxwellqe2 at worldnet.att.net (Linda Eshbaugh) Date: Fri Nov 26 12:56:50 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Illinois References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959> <001b01c4c902$4db45d00$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Message-ID: <000e01c4d3fa$4040f4a0$9b98490c@5f06g01> Hello - Rockford, Il has a great Natural history museum - The Burpee (no kidding). Their current claim to fame is Jane - a possible Nanno-tyrannosaurus that is not quite out of the rock yet. Every February, The Burpee puts on Paleofest - a 2 day program featuring speakers like Bob Bakker, Dan Serreno etc. We live in the Milwaukee area, and try to go every year. The Burpee also leads a few trips to local quarries. The web site is: www.burpee.org Also, there is a nice Rock/Gem shop in Rockton, IL - just north of Rockford. Called "The Gem Shop". They usually have a lot of nice things. And, may know of some places to go. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Siebel" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:55 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Illinois > Jack, > > I'm curious where in northern Illinois you are. I have several relatives in > the area and I visit whenever I can (not often enough) but haven't done much > rockhounding there since I was a kid. My initial rockhound experience was > collecting crinoid stem segments on the beaches of Lake Michigan and in the > limestone gravel along railroad tracks. A few years back Julie and I found > some galena along the Mississippi River near (duh) Galena, IL. I've got a > nephew in Rockford that I'm due to visit sometime soon. Any sites near > there? > > You also mentioned the possible serpentinite specimens that you have. Is > that from Illinois? > > Former Land Of Lincolnite > > John D. Siebel > Santa, Idaho > john@pandemoniumgraphics.com > www.pandemoniumgraphics.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From jayhawkmn at yahoo.com Fri Nov 26 14:27:32 2004 From: jayhawkmn at yahoo.com (June Young) Date: Fri Nov 26 14:27:35 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] map to trilobites in Utah In-Reply-To: <003b01c4d1cc$82b12ec0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <20041126222732.40990.qmail@web51001.mail.yahoo.com> artesian17396@yahoo.com Jeanette Wimpee wrote:Forgot to include our email address... geenet2@mchsi.com Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Schlinsog, Anthony" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > same. > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a couple > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > Anthony Schlinsog > _______________________________________________________________ > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > Trilobites? > > Thank you. > > Hilmar > > _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From s.l.haas at att.net Fri Nov 26 18:56:08 2004 From: s.l.haas at att.net (s.l.haas@att.net) Date: Fri Nov 26 18:56:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] map to trilobites in Utah Message-ID: <112720040256.21193.41A7ECC80004F77C000052C921603760219C0E0E08D204D29C@att.net> I would be interested in the maps. thanks -------------- Original message from June Young : -------------- > artesian17396@yahoo.com > > Jeanette Wimpee wrote:Forgot to include our email address... > geenet2@mchsi.com > Jeanette > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Schlinsog, Anthony" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > > same. > > > > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a > couple > > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > > > Anthony Schlinsog > > _______________________________________________________________ > > > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > > Trilobites? > > > > Thank you. > > > > Hilmar > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From yeomans at smartt.com Fri Nov 26 20:43:44 2004 From: yeomans at smartt.com (Greg Yeomans) Date: Fri Nov 26 20:43:55 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah References: <005201c4d19e$488c2ac0$695fe842@pavilion> Message-ID: <00be01c4d43b$adffd4c0$840334d1@D3SBFG11> Anthony: Please add me to your list of rockhounds who would appreciate receiving the maps you mentioned. Tips like this are always welcome!! Greg Yeomans ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Rasmussen" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > Hello Anthony, > > I am very interested in the maps you have, I am planning on going into > that area and spending several weeks the upcoming spring, anything in > your maps is going to make it so much easier for me, thank you for > the time you are spending in helping the rest of us dirt diggers. we > appreachieate it. > > Best to you > > Wayne Rasmussen > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Schlinsog, Anthony > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 11:52 AM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > > same. > > > > Anthony Schlinsog > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] > > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > > > > 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony > > > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a > couple > > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > > > Anthony Schlinsog > > _______________________________________________________________ > > > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > > Trilobites? > > > > Thank you. > > > > Hilmar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this email belongs to > the sender which is confidential and may be legally privileged. The > information is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named > above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that > any disclosure, copying, distribution, or the taking of any action in > reliance on the contents of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have > received this email in error, please immediately delete and destroy all > copies of the original email and its attachments, and notify the sender. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > From Docia1154 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 04:46:24 2004 From: Docia1154 at aol.com (Docia1154@aol.com) Date: Sat Nov 27 04:46:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah Message-ID: <8.5c7533f2.2ed9d120@aol.com> me too, me too please. and thank you so very much for sharing these with everyone. Docia In a message dated 11/26/2004 10:45:51 PM Central Standard Time, yeomans@smartt.com writes: Anthony: Please add me to your list of rockhounds who would appreciate receiving the maps you mentioned. Tips like this are always welcome!! Greg Yeomans ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Rasmussen" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > Hello Anthony, > > I am very interested in the maps you have, I am planning on going into > that area and spending several weeks the upcoming spring, anything in > your maps is going to make it so much easier for me, thank you for > the time you are spending in helping the rest of us dirt diggers. we > appreachieate it. > > Best to you > > Wayne Rasmussen > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Schlinsog, Anthony > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 11:52 AM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > > I'll email you some maps. Any others that are interested, I'll do the > > same. > > > > Anthony Schlinsog > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: HilmarKrocke [mailto:hkrocke@sprint.ca] > > Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 12:07 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] sunstones and trilobites in Utah > > > > > > 2004.11.22 06:07Schlinsog, Anthony > > > > Some good side trips from this would be to collect Dugway geodes - a > couple > > of hours north of there. Topaz mountain - about an hour west of Delta. > > There are a number of great Trilobite collecting sites an hour or so west- > > north west of Sunstone Knoll. > > > > Anthony Schlinsog > > _______________________________________________________________ > > > > Could you please give us a more detailed location - description for the > > Trilobites? > > > > Thank you. > > > > Hilmar > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sat Nov 27 17:22:41 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Nov 27 17:20:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away References: <005501c4d4d0$586fbb20$cfb3950c@jessie> Message-ID: <41A927B9.9A1@Tomaszewski.net> Margie, Thank you for sharing. I only knew Mel online, but he was one of my correspondents that I wish was a neighbor. His wisdom, wit, and experience will be missed. My Prayers are with you and your family. Kreigh Mel Albright wrote: > > Hello, It is my sad message to inform you of the passing of my father, Melvin Albright, this morning early due to complications after a broken hip. He had been improving, then had a very sudden and unexpected blood clot to the lung that took him immediately. We know it was only minutes, and believe he was even asleep when it happened. > > He is lying in state at Stumpff funeral home > 1600 SE Washington > Bartlesville, OK 74006 > 918-333-4300 > c/o Mr. Ed House > > A memorial service will be held for him on Wed Dec 1st at 11:00 AM at the First United Presbyterian Church here in Bartlesville, with reception to follow. The church is at 5th and Dewey. > > Memorial funds are being set up for the church and for the Green Country Lions Club in lieu of flowers. > > He is survived by his wife, Jessie Albright > Rt 3 Box 8500 > Bartlesville, OK 74003 918-336-8036 > > Daughters Marjorie and Judi, and grandchildren. > > Our family appreciates your prayers during this time. > > Margie From arf at mc.net Sat Nov 27 19:52:54 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Sat Nov 27 19:53:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again Message-ID: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, massive emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me now. Most interestingly, I met one of the lurkers on this group, Hi Karen.... who recalled the discussion immediately. Most participants suggested that she and her whatever in the booth were the experts on the subject and he/they came up with the serpentine and I went away happy. A bit later, I ran into someone with a beautiful serpentine carving and I asked him how one carves something so hard and he gave me a confused look and said "hard"? He let me scratch the bottom with my steel pocket scale. So, I go back to Karen and say how can this be? my stuff is as hard as quartz. All I could get was that the hardness is variable. When I got home to my books, I find hardness of 2-4 for serpentine. So, can anyone shed any light on this? js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From kqhayes at chartermi.net Sat Nov 27 20:13:38 2004 From: kqhayes at chartermi.net (kqhayes@chartermi.net) Date: Sat Nov 27 20:13:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away Message-ID: <3k7897$icvr0h@mxip12a.cluster1.charter.net> I agree: Mel was a great guy. My condolences... Keith Hayes > > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Date: 2004/11/28 Sun AM 01:22:41 GMT > To: rocksandfossils@yahoogroups.com > CC: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > , > Mel Albright > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away > > Margie, > > Thank you for sharing. > > I only knew Mel online, but he was one of my correspondents that I wish > was a neighbor. His wisdom, wit, and experience will be missed. > > My Prayers are with you and your family. > > Kreigh > > > > > > Mel Albright wrote: > > > > Hello, It is my sad message to inform you of the passing of my father, Melvin Albright, this morning early due to complications after a broken hip. He had been improving, then had a very sudden and unexpected blood clot to the lung that took him immediately. We know it was only minutes, and believe he was even asleep when it happened. > > > > He is lying in state at Stumpff funeral home > > 1600 SE Washington > > Bartlesville, OK 74006 > > 918-333-4300 > > c/o Mr. Ed House > > > > A memorial service will be held for him on Wed Dec 1st at 11:00 AM at the First United Presbyterian Church here in Bartlesville, with reception to follow. The church is at 5th and Dewey. > > > > Memorial funds are being set up for the church and for the Green Country Lions Club in lieu of flowers. > > > > He is survived by his wife, Jessie Albright > > Rt 3 Box 8500 > > Bartlesville, OK 74003 918-336-8036 > > > > Daughters Marjorie and Judi, and grandchildren. > > > > Our family appreciates your prayers during this time. > > > > Margie > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From pchil at botsnet.bw Sat Nov 27 23:11:40 2004 From: pchil at botsnet.bw (P.C. Hulley) Date: Sat Nov 27 22:50:46 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving References: <6.1.2.0.0.20041124184840.03f431b0@mail.aloha.net> Message-ID: <007201c4d519$b04ab040$c848a7a8@hulley> Happy Thanksgiving to all List members who celebrate this holiday, from another really hot place, Botswana! Thanks to El Nino we are having a drought, with the threat of water restrictions looming on the horizon. Pete get out your calculator again, at 9.00pm last night, it was still 36oC We could certainly use some of that lightning and thunder with its accompanying rain here! Hildagarde Hulley ----- Original Message ----- From: Kitty & Bill Heacox To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:09 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this > Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > > Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who > celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we wish > you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. > > Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for which > to be thankful, for each and every one of you. > > Aloha, Kitty & Bill > > > -- > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From john.f.alcorn at gte.net Sun Nov 28 06:35:36 2004 From: john.f.alcorn at gte.net (John Alcorn) Date: Sun Nov 28 06:36:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away References: <3k7897$icvr0h@mxip12a.cluster1.charter.net> Message-ID: <000e01c4d557$867a4e90$6ec00304@ROSENANTE> Mel used to close his posts to this list with something like, hug someone you love today . Good advice. Bon voyage Mel. John Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away >I agree: Mel was a great guy. My condolences... > > Keith Hayes From buff1 at ptd.net Sun Nov 28 06:57:52 2004 From: buff1 at ptd.net (Dennis Buffenmyer) Date: Sun Nov 28 06:57:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again In-Reply-To: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <41A9E770.4040609@ptd.net> Jack, I am guessing just like a lot of others who have seen the pictures, but the evidence seems to be coming in. While I am not a professional I might offer my opinions and ask a few more questions. Does this material occur anywhere else other than you garden?? I.E. the neighbors yard, or surrounding properties? The green that I saw from the picture was more of a kelly or bottle green, on the massive pieces but the cut pieces sure did look like an amazonite green with the exception of not having the very thin white or red stripes . "Serpentine" as a stone tends to be variegated in colorization and tends toward a paler green. EXCEPT for.... . I live in south-eastern Pa. very near the serpentine/chrome barrens that are on the PA/MD border. There is a variety of serpentine that has been silicified ( not sure if that is the correct usage, but meaning that silica in the form of amorphous silica has been incorporated into the rock ) which we call "Williamsite". It was once almost common at these sites but is now almost sold by the gram. I am wondering if this is the case for your material. You have now posed a most curious question, as I was unaware of this type of geology being present in wisconsin. This is why I asked if anywhere else other than your garden; wondering if perhaps some previous tenant had admired the material and took it home for "garden rock". In all honesty, from the pictures you presented and from the cut material it most reminds me of chrysoprase. ( anyone remember the term prase being used for agatized stone??) But, wisconsin seems to be miles away from the australian sites. I should tend to doubt the idea of emerald or massive emerald as this mineral is never amorphous from my understanding, and would nearly always show some form of cleavage on a broken edge. This having been said, I dont think we can doubt that Jack has found something worthy. Even if it is just cutting material, It seems jack has found its value in being able to fashion cabochons from it and as such should be of some worth to Mr Schmidling. If this turns out to be of an occurance beyond his little garden I would suggest to him that he contact someone from his state's geological survey or dept of environmental resources to determine why this "rock" has not been documented or described before. This may turn out to be a significant source of geological information that has been bypassed for all these years. And by the way that idea just stimies my imagination as so much of this country has been surveyed and assessed so as to determine wealth that it seems unlikely any new geological occurances are going to occur in the lower 48 especially the ones east of the rockies. So, Mr Schmidling; it would seem that you have at least stoked the campfire for this topic of conversation, and would implore you to get a positive identification from your state, ( I would assume this would be free of charge ) if this turns out to be something bigger than your garden. And congratulations on finding a very nice material suitable for cutting. If there is an abundance of this material, you could count me in on a pound or two depending how much you may wish to charge for the stuff. I'll even go so far as to say I'll offer you $10 for a fist size chunk and then I would be able to possibly better identify it for you.... Dennis Buffenmyer Jack Schmidling wrote: >So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, massive >emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me >now. > >Most interestingly, I met one of the lurkers on this group, Hi Karen.... >who recalled the discussion immediately. Most participants suggested that >she and her whatever in the booth were the experts on the subject and >he/they came up with the serpentine and I went away happy. > >A bit later, I ran into someone with a beautiful serpentine carving and I >asked him how one carves something so hard and he gave me a confused look >and said "hard"? He let me scratch the bottom with my steel pocket scale. > >So, I go back to Karen and say how can this be? my stuff is as hard as >quartz. All I could get was that the hardness is variable. > >When I got home to my books, I find hardness of 2-4 for serpentine. > >So, can anyone shed any light on this? > >js > >PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm >Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > From morningstar at att.net Sun Nov 28 07:39:13 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Sun Nov 28 07:38:47 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again In-Reply-To: <41A9E770.4040609@ptd.net> References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> <41A9E770.4040609@ptd.net> Message-ID: <41A9F121.1020006@att.net> > Jack Schmidling wrote: > >> So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, >> massive >> emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me >> now. Jack, Unfortunately you have seen the dark side of sight-ID. Some people will take a guess because they don't want to seem like they're not being helpful; some really believe they have the right ID but they don't. It is quite likely that what you have is a rock--i.e., a mixture of minerals. It may have come from somewhere else; bulk rock is often used for riprap, garden fill, construction fill, etc. I haven't been following this thread in complete detail so I may have missed the locality where you found it. If I didn't come from a formation in situ, i.e., if you didn't break it out of a rock formation in the ground or a roadcut, isn't it possible that it is "foreign" material imported from somewhere else? It seems you have some sort of silicate-based rock there, and even that is a best guess based solely on the circumstantial evidence presented over the Internet, and I would be willing to say it isn't amazonite, also based on the evidence presented, but otherwise I'll keep my mouth shut. Well, one more thing: fuchsite is very distinctive, obviously a mica, and with a green color that almost doesn't look natural. If a person said that, they must have seen mica--do you see mica flakes or sheets in there? (sorry if the mica issue has already been explored--as I said, I can't follow every thread in detail, but I try to help when I can). Good luck, Don From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 28 10:34:02 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 28 10:26:29 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> Hi Jack, & List, Read your latest message & the replies, about your green rocks "from your vegetable garden", and I went back and looked at the pictures again. Yes, as Don or Dennis said, it shows how hard it is to (try to) identify things just by sight--especially just from a picture, but even in person, too. There are just so many, in this case, green, even an attractive shade of green, rocks and minerals, and combinations thereof, it's really hard to tell for sure. A recent time, back this spring, one of the mineral clubs here was collecting specimens that they would send to a club back east, as a "swap" for a crate full of rocks and minerals that had been sent to them from a club in, Virginia I think it was. One fellow had brought in a couple of green stones that he thought were worth including in the "return" box. He thought they were "maybe jade" and was asking for opinions, and he thought they were pretty special because "they were the only green rocks like that, that he'd found around there". Most people didn't think they were really jade, but were at a loss as to what to call them; and I guess most people were afraid to tell him too blatantly, that these were probably not of any real lapidary or mineral value, they were just "green" rocks of who knows what, and that was that. Now, yours, really do look like a very attractive color of green, so they are certainly "keepers", whatever they are. An honest assessment of their "lapidary value"--of course, it's all in the eye of the beholder (or the polisher), but most stones that are not "gem quality", and just have a mottled, patterned appearance when polished--well, part of the value (to whomever) comes from the appearance and color, and part comes from knowing that this is an example of "something known as a (semi-)precious stone", not just "a pretty rock". Thus, even if the texture is somewhat irregular and the color is not "top quality", people always prize a polished piece of turquoise, jade, chrysoprase, etc., because it IS those things, and not just "some old blue-green rock". Now your picture, again; the color is very attractive, it almost does remind one of chrysoprase or something similar. You are right, serpentine is always softer, so if it's quite hard, it can't be serpentine. There are so many possible variations of quartz, intergrown with various green minerals, that the possibilities are almost (well, not quite) endless. And yes, your material does resemble massive emerald (deep green beryl), such as I've seen from Brazil and elsewhere, too. Based on your finding it in your yard in Indiana, so presumably having come from glacially deposited gravel (assuming that a former rockhound resident didn't just through it there!), it's very unlikely that it could be chrysoprase, or emerald, or amazonite. Even that fuchsite mica schist-that was my suggestion--is probably unlikely and an off base idea. A month or so back, I wrote an email to this list where I gave a list of "green minerals" commonly found in rocks (I don't think this struck any particular chords with anyone, because there wasn't any follow-up discussion on that). Here was my short list, but most of these are softer minerals, probably not what yours is, and it's sure not an exhaustive list: actinolite (and other amphiboles) chlorite (various members of the group) serpentine (also, a group) pumpellyite (incl. "chlorastrolite" = "greenstone") epidote celadonite (common, lining vesicles in basalts) muscovite (sometimes green) prehnite (colored by iron??) illite (sometimes, and other clay minerals) And just for the sake of thinking about it, I have in front of me two purchased sets of polished "stones", probably made in China, here are the green stones in them: amazonite "African turquoise" (mottled, dull pale green with black inclusions--who knows if it's real turquoise or not) aventurine (again, which I believe is used for either quartz or feldspar, green due to inclusions of green mica) "fancy jasper" (a green jasper) jadeite moss agate nephrite jade "rhyolite" (this piece is dark greenish-gray, mottled--again, probably a mixture of one or more green iron-containing minerals, present within the rhyolite, which has probably been metamorphosed) serpentine unakite (pink and green, of course) "butterchert" (a pale greenish...well, I'll accept chert if that's what they want to call it) verdite (a green rock, usually from South Africa--there was a long discussion on this List about what "verdite" is, and to be honest, I can't remember what the bottom line answer was! (I've got to go back on the 'net and look that up again... and I think there was "real verdite" and "look-like verdite") "green opaline" (whatever they mean by that--it's dull greenish gray) "jade" (P.S., the one of these sets, of little polished eggs, cracks me up every time I look at it, because it includes "fuberite", a creamy pale yellow stone, which I have NO clue what somebody meant by that!) Anyway, Jack, I'll make you an offer, if you care to mail to me either one of your sawn pieces, or just a chip from it (say, at least the size of, well, a dime or so), I will do my best to do "something" in the way of a test that will give you a better idea what it is, and I'll write back with the results, and promise to mail you back the piece or the chip (if it's big enough to return). As Don and others who know what petrographic examination can do, even if I just crush a bit of it and look at it under a polarizing microscope, I should be able to tell whether it is, in fact, mostly quartz, with or without some mica inclusions, or mostly feldspar, or..... I won't promise any absolutely positive answer, but I should learn something, and I'll do my best to look at it & get back to you, during the coming weeks--say by Xmas time for sure. I'm just curious to see what it might be. So if you care too, you can send it to my address at the USGS: Pete Modreski, Mail Stop 150 U.S. Geological Survey Box 25046, Federal Center Denver, CO 80225-0046 In years past I had ready access to run XRD patterns myself on our equipment, but now I personally work in a "non-lab" area, so I have to ask other people to take time off their regular work to run such things--so, I can't necessarily promise to do that, which would probably give a definitive answer. But you're welcome to send a piece if you want to. Let me share one last little story, about identifying "green rock" At work at the USGS, we recently had (still have) a box of broken up pieces of green rock in our "Rock Room" of giveaway material for teachers, which came labelled "verde antique". Verde antique, of course, is the traditional name for a fairly common and attractive ornamental stone, also commonly known as "serpentine marble", and that's what we agreed it was. Except for one retired geologist who helps us as a volunteer, who insisted it didn't look like serpentine to him, and, faced with a challenge, he crushed some up and spent a good deal of time and effort, carefully examining it in different refractive index oils on his petrographic microscope. He pronounced the result to be "not serpentine at all, but a mineral in the chlorite group, specifically, I think he decided it was unambiguously, clinochlore. Well, I still wasn't satisfied with this, so since we had a whole box of it to give away, I broke down and took a piece to the people in one of our mineral labs, to ask them to XRD it. The result came back: a serpentine group mineral, specifically, antigorite--no clinochlore or chlorite. So, it just goes to show--even a professional can be misled, in examining rocks. One of the "words of wisdom" from a departed a valued colleague of mine, Eugene Foord, with which I heartily concur, is that if your really care about being correct in identifying a mineral, you should always use at least two different, confirmatory methods of analysis to identify it, to make sure your conclusion is really accurate. Such as, don't just depend on X-ray diffraction, but look at some of the grains with optical microscopy as well, and preferably, examine them also with SEM-EDX so you know something about the chemical composition, too. If you just use one method alone, there are any number of "traps" you can fall into, that might lead you to think it's something that it's really not. cheers (from a snowy, thought not very heavy yet, day in Denver), Pete From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 28 11:12:56 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 28 11:05:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... green rocks... verdite References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> <005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> Message-ID: <006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete> P.S. to the list, Being curious, I "googled" for verdite and still had a hard time finding "what it is", though there are many web refereces to it. Even the archived posts that I could find from our own list, such as from Horst Windisch, didn't explicitly say what it really was. Here's one that I found that claims to be authoritative, from Zimbabwe Marble Company, at http://www.aabc.com/venture/material/marble/marble.htm Verdite is a massive muscovite mica rock, coloured green by a chronium-rich variety of muscovite mica called fushsite. It was first found in 1907 and has been used as a substitute for jade. It often exhibits yellow and red spots. Fairly tough and not heat sensitive, Verdite grinds quickly and is workable with steel tools; it polishes with Linda A on leather. (and, OK, is mis-wrote, it's from Zimbabwe, not South Africa) (and P.P.S., they meant to write "fuchsite", not fushite. Anyone have anything further to add about "verdite"? Pete From arf at mc.net Sun Nov 28 17:18:15 2004 From: arf at mc.net (Jack Schmidling) Date: Sun Nov 28 17:19:13 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> <005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> Message-ID: <01f601c4d5b1$7092c0d0$215e70d1@S0033035959> From: "Peter J. Modreski" > So if you care too, you can send it to my address at the USGS: Thanks for the kind offer. A sample will be in the morning mail. js PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com From geenet2 at mchsi.com Sun Nov 28 18:24:45 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Sun Nov 28 18:25:23 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> <006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete> Message-ID: <005b01c4d5ba$97e028e0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Oh ye fountains of knowledge.... I bought a slab at a rock show this weekend out of a box of "Peruvian Blue Opal". What does anyone know about this material?? This piece is a "picture rock" and has a beautiful, almost detailed scene of mountain lake, hills, and sky. I plan to finish the polish on the faces, and do just a little triming to even it up. Any recommendations on polishing, etc.? I also discovered Biggs Jasper. Does anyone know of a good source of some for cabbing, at a reasonable price? The cabbed pieces at the show were going for 100 to 250 bucks! My hobby just got more expensive... Jeanette From litleval at ruralnetwork.net Sun Nov 28 19:01:03 2004 From: litleval at ruralnetwork.net (Linda Rasmussen) Date: Sun Nov 28 19:01:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete><006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete> <005b01c4d5ba$97e028e0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <00ca01c4d5bf$aa924900$685fe842@pavilion> Jeanette, I dont know about the Opal, but you have described old Owyhee picture Jasper or perhaps Wild Horse Jasper both from Idaho. Are you sure you have Opal ? Biggs Jasper can be bought from Rhodes Cabbin and Gems. 541-467-2357 located near the Dalles Oregon, not far from where the Jasper was mined. You may find some of this material on E-Bay under Rhoads Cabbin, or try Biggs Jasper in the search. He has material from Old miners you only hear about today, every seen Blue Biggs ? He may have some left. If your into pictures in rock ask for Old Owyhee picture Jasper the good material was mined out quite some years ago, the pit was reopened for a time several years ago but the material is not of the high grade the top strata was, it sold for $35. LB. and was well worth it. Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeanette Wimpee To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 7:24 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? > Oh ye fountains of knowledge.... > I bought a slab at a rock show this weekend out of a box of "Peruvian Blue > Opal". What does anyone know about this material?? This piece is a > "picture rock" and has a beautiful, almost detailed scene of mountain lake, > hills, and sky. I plan to finish the polish on the faces, and do just a > little triming to even it up. Any recommendations on polishing, etc.? > I also discovered Biggs Jasper. Does anyone know of a good source of some > for cabbing, at a reasonable price? The cabbed pieces at the show were > going for 100 to 250 bucks! > My hobby just got more expensive... > Jeanette > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From geenet2 at mchsi.com Sun Nov 28 19:34:20 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Sun Nov 28 19:35:01 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete><006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete><005b01c4d5ba$97e028e0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> <00ca01c4d5bf$aa924900$685fe842@pavilion> Message-ID: <000a01c4d5c4$508f6e60$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> >From the results on google.com, it's definitely Peruvian Blue Opal. Light aqua blue strata with clear or white. Mined in Peru. They even have a miner's association website about it, especially since there is a lot of dyed material beaded and sold as PBO. I've just learned what the Biggs Jasper looks like and loved it. Blue would be interesting... Bought some pietersite too, had heard of it but didn't know it was so pretty. All these years I've been into gemmy stuff, and hadn't learned of all these agates and jaspers. It's a whole new world! Now that I've got an All-U-Need to work with, I'm noticing all this new to me material. Thanks, Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Rasmussen" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 9:01 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? > Jeanette, > > I dont know about the Opal, but you have described old Owyhee picture > Jasper or perhaps Wild Horse Jasper both from Idaho. Are you sure > you have Opal ? > > Biggs Jasper can be bought from Rhodes Cabbin and Gems. 541-467-2357 > located near the Dalles Oregon, not far from where the Jasper was mined. > You may find some of this material on E-Bay under Rhoads Cabbin, or > try Biggs Jasper in the search. He has material from Old miners you > only hear about today, every seen Blue Biggs ? He may have some > left. If your into pictures in rock ask for Old Owyhee picture Jasper > the good material was mined out quite some years ago, the pit > was reopened for a time several years ago but the material is not of > the high grade the top strata was, it sold for $35. LB. and was > well worth it. > > Wayne > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jeanette Wimpee > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 7:24 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? > > > > Oh ye fountains of knowledge.... > > I bought a slab at a rock show this weekend out of a box of "Peruvian Blue > > Opal". What does anyone know about this material?? This piece is a > > "picture rock" and has a beautiful, almost detailed scene of mountain > lake, > > hills, and sky. I plan to finish the polish on the faces, and do just a > > little triming to even it up. Any recommendations on polishing, etc.? > > I also discovered Biggs Jasper. Does anyone know of a good source of some > > for cabbing, at a reasonable price? The cabbed pieces at the show were > > going for 100 to 250 bucks! > > My hobby just got more expensive... > > Jeanette > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Nov 28 18:58:06 2004 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Sun Nov 28 20:59:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Northern Illinois References: <007d01c4c8f9$03790050$fe5e70d1@S0033035959><001b01c4c902$4db45d00$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> <000e01c4d3fa$4040f4a0$9b98490c@5f06g01> Message-ID: <011601c4d5bf$47a0b200$3b00a8c0@mshome.net> Thanks Linda! Just sent this info to my nephew. He'll be thrilled. John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Eshbaugh" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > Hello - > > Rockford, Il has a great Natural history museum - The Burpee (no kidding). > The Burpee also leads a few trips to local quarries. The web site is: > www.burpee.org > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Sun Nov 28 22:02:44 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Sun Nov 28 21:54:51 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> <01f601c4d5b1$7092c0d0$215e70d1@S0033035959> Message-ID: <008d01c4d5d9$0c0cc700$c5a6490c@pete> OK, Jack, I'll look forward to receiving it, and I'll see if I can make anything positive out of it! Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack Schmidling" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 6:18 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > From: "Peter J. Modreski" > > > So if you care too, you can send it to my address at the USGS: > > Thanks for the kind offer. A sample will be in the morning mail. > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 00:50:05 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Mon Nov 29 00:49:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Un identified green stone. References: <200411290202.iAT220FU003767@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <049101c4d5f0$6ce571a0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jack Another possibility for the green stone which you tested to be at least as hard as quartz is green grossular garnet. This is sometimes called Transvaal Jade because very pretty green rough was found there many years ago and it looks something like the stone(s) you had. If you google Transvaal Jade you will find nearly a 1000 hits for this material and you can see a picture of some rough at http://www.mineralgallery.co.za/transvaal_jade.htm and some cabs on http://mysite.mweb.co.za/residents/g_debeer/polish.htm. You will see that the variety of green color in the rough and cut is quite variable, although the color of your rough and cut certainly lies in the range of possible colors. There is no guarantee that this is what it is and the real way is going to be for you to have some testing done. If you can polish a flat face you may be able to find a local jeweler with a contact refractometer. With the refractive index, the specific gravity and the color and hardness you can rule out a lot of possibilities. Rock ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 6:02 PM Subject: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 28 > Send Rockhounds mailing list submissions to > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > rockhounds-request@lists.drizzle.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > rockhounds-owner@lists.drizzle.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Rockhounds digest..." > > > [Rockhounds-Digest] > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Amazonite.... again (Jack Schmidling) > 2. Re: Re: Mel's passing away (kqhayes@chartermi.net) > 3. Re: Thanksgiving (P.C. Hulley) > 4. Re: Re: Mel's passing away (John Alcorn) > 5. Re: Amazonite.... again (Dennis Buffenmyer) > 6. Re: Amazonite.... again (Don H) > 7. Re: Amazonite.... again (Peter J. Modreski) > 8. Re: Amazonite.... green rocks... verdite (Peter J. Modreski) > 9. Re: Amazonite.... again (Jack Schmidling) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2004 21:52:54 -0600 > From: "Jack Schmidling" > Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > To: "aRockhounds" > Message-ID: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, massive > emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me > now. > > Most interestingly, I met one of the lurkers on this group, Hi Karen.... > who recalled the discussion immediately. Most participants suggested that > she and her whatever in the booth were the experts on the subject and > he/they came up with the serpentine and I went away happy. > > A bit later, I ran into someone with a beautiful serpentine carving and I > asked him how one carves something so hard and he gave me a confused look > and said "hard"? He let me scratch the bottom with my steel pocket scale. > > So, I go back to Karen and say how can this be? my stuff is as hard as > quartz. All I could get was that the hardness is variable. > > When I got home to my books, I find hardness of 2-4 for serpentine. > > So, can anyone shed any light on this? > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 4:13:38 +0000 > From: > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <3k7897$icvr0h@mxip12a.cluster1.charter.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I agree: Mel was a great guy. My condolences... > > Keith Hayes > > > > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > > Date: 2004/11/28 Sun AM 01:22:41 GMT > > To: rocksandfossils@yahoogroups.com > > CC: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > , > > Mel Albright > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away > > > > Margie, > > > > Thank you for sharing. > > > > I only knew Mel online, but he was one of my correspondents that I wish > > was a neighbor. His wisdom, wit, and experience will be missed. > > > > My Prayers are with you and your family. > > > > Kreigh > > > > > > > > > > > > Mel Albright wrote: > > > > > > Hello, It is my sad message to inform you of the passing of my father, Melvin Albright, this morning early due to complications after a broken hip. He had been improving, then had a very sudden and unexpected blood clot to the lung that took him immediately. We know it was only minutes, and believe he was even asleep when it happened. > > > > > > He is lying in state at Stumpff funeral home > > > 1600 SE Washington > > > Bartlesville, OK 74006 > > > 918-333-4300 > > > c/o Mr. Ed House > > > > > > A memorial service will be held for him on Wed Dec 1st at 11:00 AM at the First United Presbyterian Church here in Bartlesville, with reception to follow. The church is at 5th and Dewey. > > > > > > Memorial funds are being set up for the church and for the Green Country Lions Club in lieu of flowers. > > > > > > He is survived by his wife, Jessie Albright > > > Rt 3 Box 8500 > > > Bartlesville, OK 74003 918-336-8036 > > > > > > Daughters Marjorie and Judi, and grandchildren. > > > > > > Our family appreciates your prayers during this time. > > > > > > Margie > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 09:11:40 +0200 > From: "P.C. Hulley" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <007201c4d519$b04ab040$c848a7a8@hulley> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > Happy Thanksgiving to all List members who celebrate this holiday, from > another really hot place, Botswana! Thanks to El Nino we are having a > drought, with the threat of water restrictions looming on the horizon. > Pete get out your calculator again, at 9.00pm last night, it was still 36oC > We could certainly use some of that lightning and thunder with its > accompanying rain here! > > Hildagarde Hulley > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kitty & Bill Heacox > To: > Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:09 AM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Thanksgiving > > > > With lightening dancing over the ocean in front of our house, and a black > > anvil-shaped cloud poised over Mauna Kea behind it; with thunder driving > > our elderly dog crazy, and a view on TV news of lava pouring into the > > ocean, we are especially reminded of Nature's constant activity this > > Thanksgiving eve here in Hawaii. > > > > Bill and I extend our best wishes to all on the Rockhounds list who > > celebrate Thanksgiving in the USA, and to those in other countries, we > wish > > you a pleasant beginning to the winter holiday season. > > > > Amid all the strife around the world, we hope there is still much for > which > > to be thankful, for each and every one of you. > > > > Aloha, Kitty & Bill > > > > > > -- > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > > Version: 7.0.289 / Virus Database: 265.4.2 - Release Date: 11/24/2004 > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 06:35:36 -0800 > From: "John Alcorn" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <000e01c4d557$867a4e90$6ec00304@ROSENANTE> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Mel used to close his posts to this list with something like, hug someone > you love today . > Good advice. > Bon voyage Mel. > John > > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Mel's passing away > > > >I agree: Mel was a great guy. My condolences... > > > > Keith Hayes > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 09:57:52 -0500 > From: Dennis Buffenmyer > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > To: Jack Schmidling , "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing > list for rock and gem collectors" > Message-ID: <41A9E770.4040609@ptd.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Jack, > > I am guessing just like a lot of others who have seen the pictures, but > the evidence seems to be coming in. > While I am not a professional I might offer my opinions and ask a few > more questions. Does this material > occur anywhere else other than you garden?? I.E. the neighbors yard, or > surrounding properties? The green > that I saw from the picture was more of a kelly or bottle green, on the > massive pieces but the cut pieces sure > did look like an amazonite green with the exception of not having the > very thin white or red stripes . "Serpentine" > as a stone tends to be variegated in colorization and tends toward a > paler green. EXCEPT for.... > . I live in south-eastern Pa. very near the serpentine/chrome barrens > that are on the PA/MD border. > There is a variety of serpentine that has been silicified ( not sure if > that is the correct usage, > but meaning that silica in the form of amorphous silica has been > incorporated into the rock ) > which we call "Williamsite". It was once almost common at these sites > but is now almost sold by the gram. I am > wondering if this is the case for your material. > You have now posed a most curious question, as I was unaware of this > type of geology being present in wisconsin. > This is why I asked if anywhere else other than your garden; wondering > if perhaps some previous tenant had admired > the material and took it home for "garden rock". In all honesty, from > the pictures you presented and from the cut material > it most reminds me of chrysoprase. ( anyone remember the term prase > being used for agatized stone??) But, wisconsin > seems to be miles away from the australian sites. > I should tend to doubt the idea of emerald or massive emerald as this > mineral is never amorphous from my understanding, > and would nearly always show some form of cleavage on a broken edge. > This having been said, I dont think we can doubt that Jack has found > something worthy. Even if it is just cutting material, > It seems jack has found its value in being able to fashion cabochons > from it and as such should be of some worth to Mr Schmidling. > If this turns out to be of an occurance beyond his little garden I would > suggest to him that he contact someone from his state's > geological survey or dept of environmental resources to determine why > this "rock" has not been documented or described before. > This may turn out to be a significant source of geological information > that has been bypassed for all these years. > And by the way that idea just stimies my imagination as so much of this > country has been surveyed and assessed so as to determine > wealth that it seems unlikely any new geological occurances are going to > occur in the lower 48 especially the ones east of the rockies. > So, Mr Schmidling; it would seem that you have at least stoked the > campfire for this topic of conversation, and would implore you to get > a positive identification from your state, ( I would assume this would > be free of charge ) if this turns out to be something bigger than your > garden. And congratulations on finding a very nice material suitable for > cutting. If there is an abundance of this material, you could count > me in on a pound or two depending how much you may wish to charge for > the stuff. I'll even go so far as to say I'll offer you $10 for a fist size > chunk and then I would be able to possibly better identify it for you.... > > Dennis Buffenmyer > > > Jack Schmidling wrote: > > >So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, massive > >emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me > >now. > > > >Most interestingly, I met one of the lurkers on this group, Hi Karen.... > >who recalled the discussion immediately. Most participants suggested that > >she and her whatever in the booth were the experts on the subject and > >he/they came up with the serpentine and I went away happy. > > > >A bit later, I ran into someone with a beautiful serpentine carving and I > >asked him how one carves something so hard and he gave me a confused look > >and said "hard"? He let me scratch the bottom with my steel pocket scale. > > > >So, I go back to Karen and say how can this be? my stuff is as hard as > >quartz. All I could get was that the hardness is variable. > > > >When I got home to my books, I find hardness of 2-4 for serpentine. > > > >So, can anyone shed any light on this? > > > >js > > > >PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > >Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > >Subscription Services: > >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 10:39:13 -0500 > From: Don H > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <41A9F121.1020006@att.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > > > Jack Schmidling wrote: > > > >> So I took my samples to a rock and gem show today and came up with, > >> massive > >> emerald, fuchite, serpentine, Amazonite and several others that escape me > >> now. > > Jack, > > Unfortunately you have seen the dark side of sight-ID. Some people will > take a guess because they don't want to seem like they're not being > helpful; some really believe they have the right ID but they don't. > > It is quite likely that what you have is a rock--i.e., a mixture of > minerals. It may have come from somewhere else; bulk rock is often used > for riprap, garden fill, construction fill, etc. I haven't been > following this thread in complete detail so I may have missed the > locality where you found it. If I didn't come from a formation in situ, > i.e., if you didn't break it out of a rock formation in the ground or a > roadcut, isn't it possible that it is "foreign" material imported from > somewhere else? > > It seems you have some sort of silicate-based rock there, and even that > is a best guess based solely on the circumstantial evidence presented > over the Internet, and I would be willing to say it isn't amazonite, > also based on the evidence presented, but otherwise I'll keep my mouth > shut. Well, one more thing: fuchsite is very distinctive, obviously a > mica, and with a green color that almost doesn't look natural. If a > person said that, they must have seen mica--do you see mica flakes or > sheets in there? (sorry if the mica issue has already been explored--as > I said, I can't follow every thread in detail, but I try to help when I > can). > > Good luck, > > Don > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 11:34:02 -0700 > From: "Peter J. Modreski" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > To: "Jack Schmidling" , "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A > mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Message-ID: <005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi Jack, & List, > > Read your latest message & the replies, about your green rocks "from your > vegetable garden", and I went back and looked at the pictures again. > > Yes, as Don or Dennis said, it shows how hard it is to (try to) identify > things just by sight--especially just from a picture, but even in person, > too. There are just so many, in this case, green, even an attractive shade > of green, rocks and minerals, and combinations thereof, it's really hard to > tell for sure. > > A recent time, back this spring, one of the mineral clubs here was > collecting specimens that they would send to a club back east, as a "swap" > for a crate full of rocks and minerals that had been sent to them from a > club in, Virginia I think it was. One fellow had brought in a couple of > green stones that he thought were worth including in the "return" box. He > thought they were "maybe jade" and was asking for opinions, and he thought > they were pretty special because "they were the only green rocks like that, > that he'd found around there". Most people didn't think they were really > jade, but were at a loss as to what to call them; and I guess most people > were afraid to tell him too blatantly, that these were probably not of any > real lapidary or mineral value, they were just "green" rocks of who knows > what, and that was that. > > Now, yours, really do look like a very attractive color of green, so they > are certainly "keepers", whatever they are. An honest assessment of their > "lapidary value"--of course, it's all in the eye of the beholder (or the > polisher), but most stones that are not "gem quality", and just have a > mottled, patterned appearance when polished--well, part of the value (to > whomever) comes from the appearance and color, and part comes from knowing > that this is an example of "something known as a (semi-)precious stone", not > just "a pretty rock". Thus, even if the texture is somewhat irregular and > the color is not "top quality", people always prize a polished piece of > turquoise, jade, chrysoprase, etc., because it IS those things, and not just > "some old blue-green rock". > > Now your picture, again; the color is very attractive, it almost does remind > one of chrysoprase or something similar. You are right, serpentine is > always softer, so if it's quite hard, it can't be serpentine. There are so > many possible variations of quartz, intergrown with various green minerals, > that the possibilities are almost (well, not quite) endless. And yes, your > material does resemble massive emerald (deep green beryl), such as I've seen > from Brazil and elsewhere, too. > > Based on your finding it in your yard in Indiana, so presumably having come > from glacially deposited gravel (assuming that a former rockhound resident > didn't just through it there!), it's very unlikely that it could be > chrysoprase, or emerald, or amazonite. Even that fuchsite mica schist-that > was my suggestion--is probably unlikely and an off base idea. > > A month or so back, I wrote an email to this list where I gave a list of > "green minerals" commonly found in rocks (I don't think this struck any > particular chords with anyone, because there wasn't any follow-up discussion > on that). Here was my short list, but most of these are softer minerals, > probably not what yours is, and it's sure not an exhaustive list: > > actinolite (and other amphiboles) > chlorite (various members of the group) > serpentine (also, a group) > pumpellyite (incl. "chlorastrolite" = "greenstone") > epidote > celadonite (common, lining vesicles in basalts) > muscovite (sometimes green) > prehnite (colored by iron??) > illite (sometimes, and other clay minerals) > > And just for the sake of thinking about it, I have in front of me two > purchased sets of polished "stones", probably made in China, here are the > green stones in them: > > amazonite > "African turquoise" (mottled, dull pale green with black inclusions--who > knows if it's real turquoise or not) > aventurine (again, which I believe is used for either quartz or feldspar, > green due to inclusions of green mica) > "fancy jasper" (a green jasper) > jadeite > moss agate > nephrite jade > "rhyolite" (this piece is dark greenish-gray, mottled--again, probably a > mixture of one or more green iron-containing minerals, present within the > rhyolite, which has probably been metamorphosed) > serpentine > unakite (pink and green, of course) > "butterchert" (a pale greenish...well, I'll accept chert if that's what they > want to call it) > verdite (a green rock, usually from South Africa--there was a long > discussion on this List about what "verdite" is, and to be honest, I can't > remember what the bottom line answer was! (I've got to go back on the 'net > and look that up again... and I think there was "real verdite" and > "look-like verdite") > "green opaline" (whatever they mean by that--it's dull greenish gray) > "jade" > > (P.S., the one of these sets, of little polished eggs, cracks me up every > time I look at it, because it includes "fuberite", a creamy pale yellow > stone, which I have NO clue what somebody meant by that!) > > Anyway, Jack, I'll make you an offer, if you care to mail to me either one > of your sawn pieces, or just a chip from it (say, at least the size of, > well, a dime or so), I will do my best to do "something" in the way of a > test that will give you a better idea what it is, and I'll write back with > the results, and promise to mail you back the piece or the chip (if it's big > enough to return). As Don and others who know what petrographic examination > can do, even if I just crush a bit of it and look at it under a polarizing > microscope, I should be able to tell whether it is, in fact, mostly quartz, > with or without some mica inclusions, or mostly feldspar, or..... I won't > promise any absolutely positive answer, but I should learn something, and > I'll do my best to look at it & get back to you, during the coming > weeks--say by Xmas time for sure. I'm just curious to see what it might be. > So if you care too, you can send it to my address at the USGS: > > Pete Modreski, Mail Stop 150 > U.S. Geological Survey > Box 25046, Federal Center > Denver, CO 80225-0046 > > In years past I had ready access to run XRD patterns myself on our > equipment, but now I personally work in a "non-lab" area, so I have to ask > other people to take time off their regular work to run such things--so, I > can't necessarily promise to do that, which would probably give a definitive > answer. But you're welcome to send a piece if you want to. > > Let me share one last little story, about identifying "green rock" At work > at the USGS, we recently had (still have) a box of broken up pieces of green > rock in our "Rock Room" of giveaway material for teachers, which came > labelled "verde antique". Verde antique, of course, is the traditional name > for a fairly common and attractive ornamental stone, also commonly known as > "serpentine marble", and that's what we agreed it was. Except for one > retired geologist who helps us as a volunteer, who insisted it didn't look > like serpentine to him, and, faced with a challenge, he crushed some up and > spent a good deal of time and effort, carefully examining it in different > refractive index oils on his petrographic microscope. He pronounced the > result to be "not serpentine at all, but a mineral in the chlorite group, > specifically, I think he decided it was unambiguously, clinochlore. Well, I > still wasn't satisfied with this, so since we had a whole box of it to give > away, I broke down and took a piece to the people in one of our mineral > labs, to ask them to XRD it. The result came back: a serpentine group > mineral, specifically, antigorite--no clinochlore or chlorite. So, it just > goes to show--even a professional can be misled, in examining rocks. > > One of the "words of wisdom" from a departed a valued colleague of mine, > Eugene Foord, with which I heartily concur, is that if your really care > about being correct in identifying a mineral, you should always use at least > two different, confirmatory methods of analysis to identify it, to make sure > your conclusion is really accurate. Such as, don't just depend on X-ray > diffraction, but look at some of the grains with optical microscopy as well, > and preferably, examine them also with SEM-EDX so you know something about > the chemical composition, too. If you just use one method alone, there are > any number of "traps" you can fall into, that might lead you to think it's > something that it's really not. > > cheers (from a snowy, thought not very heavy yet, day in Denver), > Pete > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 12:12:56 -0700 > From: "Peter J. Modreski" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... green rocks... verdite > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > P.S. to the list, > > Being curious, I "googled" for verdite and still had a hard time finding > "what it is", though there are many web refereces to it. Even the archived > posts that I could find from our own list, such as from Horst Windisch, > didn't explicitly say what it really was. Here's one that I found that > claims to be authoritative, from Zimbabwe Marble Company, at > http://www.aabc.com/venture/material/marble/marble.htm > > Verdite is a massive muscovite mica rock, coloured green by a chronium-rich > variety of muscovite mica called fushsite. It was first found in 1907 and > has been used as a substitute for jade. It often exhibits yellow and red > spots. Fairly tough and not heat sensitive, Verdite grinds quickly and is > workable with steel tools; it polishes with Linda A on leather. > > (and, OK, is mis-wrote, it's from Zimbabwe, not South Africa) (and P.P.S., > they meant to write "fuchsite", not fushite. > > Anyone have anything further to add about "verdite"? > > Pete > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2004 19:18:15 -0600 > From: "Jack Schmidling" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... again > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <01f601c4d5b1$7092c0d0$215e70d1@S0033035959> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > From: "Peter J. Modreski" > > > So if you care too, you can send it to my address at the USGS: > > Thanks for the kind offer. A sample will be in the morning mail. > > js > > PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.com/pow.htm > Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.com > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds mailing list > Rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > End of Rockhounds Digest, Vol 6, Issue 28 > ***************************************** > From johnjold at comcast.net Mon Nov 29 08:57:45 2004 From: johnjold at comcast.net (John Joldersma) Date: Mon Nov 29 08:57:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? In-Reply-To: <000a01c4d5c4$508f6e60$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete><006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete><005b01c4d5ba$97e028e0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> <00ca01c4d5bf$aa924900$685fe842@pavilion> <000a01c4d5c4$508f6e60$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: On Nov 28, 2004, at 10:34 PM, Wayne wrote: >> Biggs Jasper can be bought from Rhodes Cabbin and Gems. Tread carefully when dealing with this dude. I bought 3 items on eBay from him last May. When they arrived 27 days later I left identical feedback for all three items, "Nice rock, slow shipping." For that mild rebuke, I was banned from trading with him. He never told me of this action, I had to find out in August when I bid on another of his items any the eBay notice came up. I thought of complaining to eBay, but why fight to bid on his stuff which tends to go for very high prices. Instead I revised my feedback to note his lack of courtesy and compared him to the soup nazi from Seinfeld, "None for you." Generally I have good luck on rough from eBay sources. You will find many sellers who honestly depict and describe their items and have timely shipping. Good people to deal with from my experience are (by eBay id) chimingrock diamondminerals gems24 urchindiver arizona-lapiday-gem-rough wyomaric The first 5 have a wide variety of items. Wyomaric has only Wyoming Jade. Their rough always seems to go cheaply. They have a wide variety of jade, he was a miner with many claims. They only ask $2 lb. for buy it now chunks. From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Nov 29 15:18:19 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Nov 29 15:18:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia Message-ID: Hello list a friend of mine is going on vacation in British Columbia this summer. He's a seasoned professional mineralogist with lots of experience...not just another unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur (LOL, I'm gonna let him read this). Does anyone know of any good collecting sites there? Would he need to rent a camper or a 4WD? T Hanks (confusing Hollywoodian typo) Axel --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) application/ms-tnef --- From dmschmidt at sprint.ca Mon Nov 29 15:28:23 2004 From: dmschmidt at sprint.ca (Michael Schmidt) Date: Mon Nov 29 15:28:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia References: Message-ID: <3f9d01c4d66b$1ea4fb70$6402a8c0@remains> BC is a HUGE place, and there are a lot of very good places to look for minerals or fossils. Thousands and thousands of square kilometers. Obviously, roadside collecting localities will be very well prospected, so going to out of the way sites may produce better specimens. you'll probably need to narrow the field in terms of what he would want to collect.... Moyie in souther BC produces beautiful pyromorphites... the Rock Candy Mine produces fantastic fluorite and barite nephrite can be found all up the Fraser River the Similkameen river is full of placer platinum..... there are tonnes of things available...... and yes, a 4wd would probably be a lot more helpful. Up north, towards the Yukon, there are a lot of interesting localities worth collecting. Unfortunately, the weather and terrain are usually enough to keep most people away ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "Rockhounds@Lists.Drizzle.Com" Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 4:18 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia > Hello list > > a friend of mine is going on vacation in British Columbia this summer. > He's a seasoned professional mineralogist with lots of experience...not > just another unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur (LOL, I'm > gonna > let him read this). Does anyone know of any good collecting sites there? > > Would he need to rent a camper or a 4WD? > > T Hanks (confusing Hollywoodian typo) > > Axel > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/mixed > text/plain (text body -- kept) > application/ms-tnef > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Mon Nov 29 15:29:47 2004 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Mon Nov 29 15:30:12 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] In UK this January (I Hope!) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200411292330.iATNU9pr004940@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Hello all... Looks like I'm going to be making a trip to the UK this January (if the customer comes through, that is!). I'll be in London and Bristol. A couple of questions: - any gem & mineral shows popping up in that time period? - anyone interested in buying / trading for fluorescent material over there? Let's see... The Harrod's sale is right after New Year's Day, right? Regards, Gary http://www.catspaw-minerals.com Home of the MasMils/PLUS Mine Location Disk From Lapadary at aol.com Mon Nov 29 16:53:20 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 29 16:53:32 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger Message-ID: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> In a message dated 11/26/04 7:06:44 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, newryqs@rochester.rr.com writes: I told the prospective donor that in the foreseeable future, the collection could also undergo "shrinkage", as boxes of stored specimens went out the door by unknown "agencies". Cold storage itself undergoes periods of stress and pressure and low priority rocks could be hauled to a landfill in preference to a higher priority commodity such as office supplies, etc. I found the donor a better place to give the specimens to. ============================= Three or four years ago I stopped at the California Gem and Mineral Museum in Mariposa. They had about 100 perky boxes of labeled specimens for sale @ $2 each. I bought a couple dozen that I thought were real bargains. I asked where they came from and she said a collector had left his entire collection to the museum. Since they didn't want them and nobody there knew what they were worth they put the whole collection up for sale at $2 per box. Then she dropped the bomb by telling me another collector had been in a few days earlier and bought two trays of them, with 72 boxes per tray. I had still found about 25 that were worth $5 - $10 each after another collector skimmed the cream from that collection. I felt good about two things. I knew the museum had made a few dollars by selling the collection. I also knew another collector had added some great specimens to his collection. Logic told me he was a collector, not a dealer, because a dealer would have also bought the ones I bought. Just because a collection goes into a museum doesn't mean it will stay there. Grant --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 29 18:06:26 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Mon Nov 29 18:05:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger In-Reply-To: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> References: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> Message-ID: <41ABD5A2.8050306@att.net> Lapadary@aol.com wrote: > I felt good about two things. I knew the museum had made a few dollars by > selling the collection. I also knew another collector had added some great > specimens to his collection. Logic told me he was a collector, not a dealer, > because a dealer would have also bought the ones I bought. > > Just because a collection goes into a museum doesn't mean it will stay there. You know, since the year 2000, a number of people have been working on collection disposition issues. Bill Metropolis from Harvard has lectured on it, Steve Chamberlain lectured on it at Rochester last year, I have lectured locally and presented articles about it . . . too bad this information can't be more widely and completely disseminated (and I have seen a few bad articles on collection dispostion too, so it needs to be peer-reviewed). Sure, an article in all the major publications might be nice, but every person who starts collecting should be given a handbook along with their first specimen, this topic being a major part of it--after all, everything you do with your collection ultimately affects its disposition. Anyway, ranting along . . . as a part-time museum staffer, I find it more and more difficult to convince people that selling or donating a specimen to a museum is a good thing to do. There are too many horror stories out there, the story of the Academy being the latest one. I thank goodness for three things: we are small, and have a lot of control over what goes on; we are happy to have indefinite loans (we can't say "permanent loan" any more because too many people get hung up on the phrase) and collectors are happy to have their pieces on public display and yet still own them; and we have had forward-thinking donors who are simply happy to see their names on the label (we put names on every label) and to share their best pieces with other collectors, or in the case of some dealers, to sell premium pieces at discount prices in order to put their name out in public. However, this is the exception, and large institutional museums are not necessarily collector-friendly. Here is one fact of note: the key problem in the story above is that the donor dumped the specimens on the museum, and it is quite likely the museum had no advance notice of this ill-conceived generosity. While doing research on the subject, it became clear to me that museums do not want donations dumped on them, they want to know what is in your collection, and whether it fits in with their philosophy; and if they do want it, they either want specific pieces, or no strings attached for the whole thing. Don't take my word for it; ask any mineral curator. Only a starving and under-supplied museum might be happy to have anything and everything placed on their doorstep. It is more and more difficult to be an idealist in today's world. The idea of a museum is a place where the best, most fascinating, most wonderful things in the world are preseved and studied; the best of the best are rotated through display, but those that aren't--the things that are aesthetically dull but scientifically important--are carefully cataloged, preserved under controlled conditions, studied, and curated for future generations when we might have analytical methods that can tell us more about them. That dream has been shattered. Now, people express contempt for museums and make remarks about how the specimens will be handled better by collectors. (In most cases, they won't). There is another answer--we should write letters to museums like the Academy, expressing our deep concerns, and inspiring them to return to their missions as institutions described above. They should be places that bring out the best in us and represent what humanity, what it can be, what it can learn, what it can discover. Don From geenet2 at mchsi.com Mon Nov 29 18:22:54 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Mon Nov 29 18:23:44 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete><006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete><005b01c4d5ba$97e028e0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com><00ca01c4d5bf$aa924900$685fe842@pavilion><000a01c4d5c4$508f6e60$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <003f01c4d683$80391160$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> I've bought from chimingrock before, and was satisfied with what I got. Thanks for the "feedback". I do check the feedback on sellers before I bid on anything. Jeanette ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Joldersma" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:57 AM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: Peruvian Blue Opal??? > > On Nov 28, 2004, at 10:34 PM, Wayne wrote: > > >> Biggs Jasper can be bought from Rhodes Cabbin and Gems. > > Tread carefully when dealing with this dude. I bought 3 items > on eBay from him last May. When they arrived 27 days later I left > identical feedback for all three items, "Nice rock, slow shipping." > For that mild rebuke, I was banned from trading with him. He never > told me of this action, I had to find out in August when I bid on > another of his items any the eBay notice came up. I thought of > complaining to eBay, but why fight to bid on his stuff which > tends to go for very high prices. Instead I revised my feedback > to note his lack of courtesy and compared him to the soup nazi > from Seinfeld, "None for you." > Generally I have good luck on rough from eBay sources. > You will find many sellers who honestly depict and describe > their items and have timely shipping. Good people to deal > with from my experience are (by eBay id) > chimingrock > diamondminerals > gems24 > urchindiver > arizona-lapiday-gem-rough > wyomaric > > The first 5 have a wide variety of items. Wyomaric has only > Wyoming Jade. Their rough always seems to go cheaply. > They have a wide variety of jade, he was a miner with many > claims. They only ask $2 lb. for buy it now chunks. > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From mosasaur47 at msn.com Mon Nov 29 19:24:38 2004 From: mosasaur47 at msn.com (Kenneth Quinn) Date: Mon Nov 29 19:26:14 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger References: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> <41ABD5A2.8050306@att.net> Message-ID: When it comes time to dispose of a collection, consider asking geology departments at local universities. Just because you do not have worldbeater specimens does not mean they have no value - as teaching specimens they may be great! I am thinking about one of the places I attended = they had almost no specimens of tourmaline, not even schorl. Kenneth Quinn From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Mon Nov 29 19:35:12 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Mon Nov 29 19:35:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger References: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> <41ABD5A2.8050306@att.net> Message-ID: <001001c4d68d$9a12c270$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> I have a story relating to the value of a collection versus a bunch of specimens, and how as someone full-time in the museum field since 1986, interprets the difference. One of the most interesting acquisitions I had as a curator at the science and history museum was a mineral collection from a shot-gun style house in an area of Louisville called "Portland." A little background - shot-gun houses are those that are narrow and separated by their neighbor by about 2 feet. The median family income in that part of town today is about $10,000, although it varies from block to block. Anyway, we were approached by the son of the deceased collector and invited to the house to see the collection to see if it was worth acquiring. The collection was in part in the attic, in part in the basement. It was mostly in home-made wooden cases with pull out drawers. Specimens were in cardboard boxes with labels and numbers. In addition, there were seven 5x8 three-binders that composed the catalog. The basement had floor jacks to keep the weight of the upstairs collection from warpng the floor joists! The quality of the specimens were average, but with a closer observation, it turned out to be a historical treasure trove. It turns out the bulk of the collection belonged to a fellow named William Greenaway who, in about 1958, gave the collection to the father of person who contacted us. The collection was started in about 1878 (based on catalog records) and was acquired through the entire life of Mr. Greenaway. In addition to the collection and catalog, it contained mineral catalogs from Wards, Geo. English, etc. from the late 19th and early 20th century and correspondence with dealers and other collectors. It also included a large set of "The Mineral Collector" and early "Rocks and Minerals" issues. We acquired the collection -- in its entirity. It did not take up a lot of space. The value of the collection is not so much for display, but rather it provided a comprehensive understanding to mineral collecting in the time frame outlined above. It is a slice of Americana. By the way, the collection was appraised so the family could use the donation as a tax deduction. The same man who owned the collection also had -- tucked in nooks and crannies around the house -- 825 POUNDS of old U.S. stamps! Now that is something I have a hard time grasping! Two small (but high quality) collections were acquired a coupl of years before I got there -- specimens were collected from the 1960's - 1980. They were donated in the early 1980's . Coupled with the Troost collection (ca. 1810 -1850), the Louisville Science Center has, with only four collections, highlight American collection from 1810 to 1980! To me, a collection entails not just specimens, but a catalog with additional information. A truly comprehensive collection includes related material - correspondence, magazines, dealer catalogs & lists, anything that offers a historical context (the stuff that almost always gets thrown away by the family of the deceased). Boxes of minerals with labels? To me that's just a bunch of specimens!!! Alan From morningstar at att.net Mon Nov 29 19:42:42 2004 From: morningstar at att.net (Don H) Date: Mon Nov 29 19:42:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] All mineral collections in danger In-Reply-To: References: <6a.497e861b.2edd1e80@aol.com> <41ABD5A2.8050306@att.net> Message-ID: <41ABEC32.2060801@att.net> Kenneth Quinn wrote: > When it comes time to dispose of a collection, consider asking geology > departments at local universities. Just because you do not have worldbeater > specimens does not mean they have no value - as teaching specimens they may > be great! I am thinking about one of the places I attended = they had > almost no specimens of tourmaline, not even schorl. Oh yes, good point, I forgot about that. I have taken to focusing on oddities, things that need to be studied, that can be donated to a grad program; I also have a supply of disposable specimens for undergrads, meant to be crushed, sliced, scratched, burned, etc. Sometimes universities will request specific things and I can provide them, and this is a way to get an EDS or XRD or two in return. I even have a specimen that is supposed to be featured in a new textbook, because I had one to donate. It's fun to do this, and it makes me feel like I collect minerals for a reason, rather than staring at them on a shelf. Don From MCGINNISG at aol.com Mon Nov 29 20:21:26 2004 From: MCGINNISG at aol.com (MCGINNISG@aol.com) Date: Mon Nov 29 20:21:38 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia Message-ID: <1a5.2bafb5d3.2edd4f46@aol.com> A favorite of many is the Rock Candy Mine http://www.rockcandymine.com/ Lots of easy collecting for the novice or the expert. Tim --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From abloom at ucinet.com Mon Nov 29 18:08:30 2004 From: abloom at ucinet.com (Ann Bloom-Dickison) Date: Mon Nov 29 22:15:20 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia References: Message-ID: <000001c4d6a5$e60435c0$56b523d0@eoni.com> As an "unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur" I resemble that remark. From MCGINNISG at aol.com Tue Nov 30 00:14:09 2004 From: MCGINNISG at aol.com (MCGINNISG@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 30 00:14:18 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs Message-ID: <25.5381839b.2edd85d1@aol.com> Are there any unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs amongst this group??? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From litleval at ruralnetwork.net Tue Nov 30 00:34:19 2004 From: litleval at ruralnetwork.net (Linda Rasmussen) Date: Tue Nov 30 00:35:02 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs References: <25.5381839b.2edd85d1@aol.com> Message-ID: <026c01c4d6b7$63816480$6c5fe842@pavilion> Yoohoo, I might be one of them people, I only have 80 tones of gem stone rock left for sale, like a bird.........cheap, cheap cheap. Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 1:14 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs > Are there any unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs amongst this > group??? > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 22:36:13 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:07:22 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000801c4d6cc$cec02d70$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jeanette, The "Peruvian blue opal" is a real variety of opal that has been colored blue, presumebly by some copper mineral, probably chrysacolla. Like all opal, you have to cut and polish it carefully keeping it as cool as possible so as to prevent cracking. This material comes from southern Peru and has been available in Lima almost continuously for the last twenty years. The best of it is an electric blue that looks like the best gem chrysacolla. This is very rare but other than these very rare pieces, good pieces are from an inch to three inches thick, a good transulcent aquamarine blue color and they frequently have black dendrites included. About five years ago someone got the idea that this stone could be promoted as a new gem stone, and now the better mateial is being sold as Andean Opan and good examples of it are offered at dollars per carat. The good material formerly went at about $40 per kg. It comes in flat vein sections like tiger eye or malachite and the color can range from an almost white, pale blue color to a beautiful translucent aquamarine color. This same area still produces a lot of "chrysacolla" the best of which is quite attractive and has a real tendency to chip and crack when worked. A lot of it was formerly sold to Israel as a replacement for their local Elat sp? stone which had a lot of brown to black jasper and malachite/brochantite? mixed togather in it with the chrysacolla. Rock From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 22:36:17 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:07:34 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000901c4d6cc$cf0091d0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jeanette, The "Peruvian blue opal" is a real variety of opal that has been colored blue, presumebly by some copper mineral, probably chrysacolla. Like all opal, you have to cut and polish it carefully keeping it as cool as possible so as to prevent cracking. This material comes from southern Peru and has been available in Lima almost continuously for the last twenty years. The best of it is an electric blue that looks like the best gem chrysacolla. This is very rare but other than these very rare pieces, good pieces are from an inch to three inches thick, a good transulcent aquamarine blue color and they frequently have black dendrites included. About five years ago someone got the idea that this stone could be promoted as a new gem stone, and now the better mateial is being sold as Andean Opan and good examples of it are offered at dollars per carat. The good material formerly went at about $40 per kg. It comes in flat vein sections like tiger eye or malachite and the color can range from an almost white, pale blue color to a beautiful translucent aquamarine color. This same area still produces a lot of "chrysacolla" the best of which is quite attractive and has a real tendency to chip and crack when worked. A lot of it was formerly sold to Israel as a replacement for their local Elat sp? stone which had a lot of brown to black jasper and malachite/brochantite? mixed togather in it with the chrysacolla. Rock From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 22:36:24 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:07:48 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000b01c4d6cc$cf946d60$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jeanette, The "Peruvian blue opal" is a real variety of opal that has been colored blue, presumebly by some copper mineral, probably chrysacolla. Like all opal, you have to cut and polish it carefully keeping it as cool as possible so as to prevent cracking. This material comes from southern Peru and has been available in Lima almost continuously for the last twenty years. The best of it is an electric blue that looks like the best gem chrysacolla. This is very rare but other than these very rare pieces, good pieces are from an inch to three inches thick, a good transulcent aquamarine blue color and they frequently have black dendrites included. About five years ago someone got the idea that this stone could be promoted as a new gem stone, and now the better mateial is being sold as Andean Opan and good examples of it are offered at dollars per carat. The good material formerly went at about $40 per kg. It comes in flat vein sections like tiger eye or malachite and the color can range from an almost white, pale blue color to a beautiful translucent aquamarine color. This same area still produces a lot of "chrysacolla" the best of which is quite attractive and has a real tendency to chip and crack when worked. A lot of it was formerly sold to Israel as a replacement for their local Elat sp? stone which had a lot of brown to black jasper and malachite/brochantite? mixed togather in it with the chrysacolla. Rock From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 22:36:28 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:07:57 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000c01c4d6cc$cfd71bb0$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jeanette, The "Peruvian blue opal" is a real variety of opal that has been colored blue, presumebly by some copper mineral, probably chrysacolla. Like all opal, you have to cut and polish it carefully keeping it as cool as possible so as to prevent cracking. This material comes from southern Peru and has been available in Lima almost continuously for the last twenty years. The best of it is an electric blue that looks like the best gem chrysacolla. This is very rare but other than these very rare pieces, good pieces are from an inch to three inches thick, a good transulcent aquamarine blue color and they frequently have black dendrites included. About five years ago someone got the idea that this stone could be promoted as a new gem stone, and now the better mateial is being sold as Andean Opan and good examples of it are offered at dollars per carat. The good material formerly went at about $40 per kg. It comes in flat vein sections like tiger eye or malachite and the color can range from an almost white, pale blue color to a beautiful translucent aquamarine color. This same area still produces a lot of "chrysacolla" the best of which is quite attractive and has a real tendency to chip and crack when worked. A lot of it was formerly sold to Israel as a replacement for their local Elat sp? stone which had a lot of brown to black jasper and malachite/brochantite? mixed togather in it with the chrysacolla. Rock From rockcurrier at cs.com Mon Nov 29 22:36:23 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:08:04 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000a01c4d6cc$cf4cdd10$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Jeanette, The "Peruvian blue opal" is a real variety of opal that has been colored blue, presumebly by some copper mineral, probably chrysacolla. Like all opal, you have to cut and polish it carefully keeping it as cool as possible so as to prevent cracking. This material comes from southern Peru and has been available in Lima almost continuously for the last twenty years. The best of it is an electric blue that looks like the best gem chrysacolla. This is very rare but other than these very rare pieces, good pieces are from an inch to three inches thick, a good transulcent aquamarine blue color and they frequently have black dendrites included. About five years ago someone got the idea that this stone could be promoted as a new gem stone, and now the better mateial is being sold as Andean Opan and good examples of it are offered at dollars per carat. The good material formerly went at about $40 per kg. It comes in flat vein sections like tiger eye or malachite and the color can range from an almost white, pale blue color to a beautiful translucent aquamarine color. This same area still produces a lot of "chrysacolla" the best of which is quite attractive and has a real tendency to chip and crack when worked. A lot of it was formerly sold to Israel as a replacement for their local Elat sp? stone which had a lot of brown to black jasper and malachite/brochantite? mixed togather in it with the chrysacolla. Rock From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Nov 30 03:31:33 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Nov 30 03:31:36 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs In-Reply-To: <026c01c4d6b7$63816480$6c5fe842@pavilion> Message-ID: I was standing before the mirror when I dreamed up hat one ;-)))) Yoohooo.... Axel -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com]Namens Linda Rasmussen Verzonden: dinsdag 30 november 2004 9:34 Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs Yoohoo, I might be one of them people, I only have 80 tones of gem stone rock left for sale, like a bird.........cheap, cheap cheap. Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 1:14 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs > Are there any unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs amongst this > group??? > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu Tue Nov 30 05:54:51 2004 From: rpr at nike.heidelberg.edu (Pete Richards) Date: Tue Nov 30 05:54:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Clinoclase from Chile In-Reply-To: <1a5.2bafb5d3.2edd4f46@aol.com> References: <1a5.2bafb5d3.2edd4f46@aol.com> Message-ID: At the recent symposium of the Cleveland Micromineral Society, I picked up a sample that claims to be clinoclase from Amolanus District, Coya, Chile, but I have become suspicious that the locality and/or the identity are wrong. It shows tiny long prisms of a dark blue color. They look very similar to another specimen I have of connellite, not clinoclase, from the Gold Hill Mine, Tooele County, Utah. I find minimal evidence of clinoclase from Chile (i.e. clinoclase is listed in the Szenecs collection of Chilean minerals in the R&M article in Jan. 2003 but I find no other references), or of the existence of Amolanus District, although Coya shows up in a google search in association with mining. Can anybody shed any light on this matter? Pete Richards -- -------------------------------------------------------------------- R. Peter Richards rpr@mail.heidelberg.edu Mineral collector Crystallographer SHAPE for the Macintosh From kadok at infowest.com Tue Nov 30 09:48:40 2004 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Tue Nov 30 09:48:31 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs In-Reply-To: <25.5381839b.2edd85d1@aol.com> Message-ID: <20041130174828.E9A61CB9DD0@delivery.infowest.com> -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of MCGINNISG@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 1:14 AM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs >Are there any unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs amongst this group??? Who? Me? I never will admit to it! [:<}} --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds From horstwindisch at absamail.co.za Tue Nov 30 11:49:56 2004 From: horstwindisch at absamail.co.za (Horst Windisch) Date: Tue Nov 30 11:50:53 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... green rocks... verdite References: <00bc01c4d4fd$c797df50$215e70d1@S0033035959><005201c4d578$db2a70c0$c5a6490c@pete> <006301c4d57e$49c10a80$c5a6490c@pete> Message-ID: <000301c4d715$e9c56790$654227c4@privatehome> Hi List, Pete, thanks for the explanation what verdite is. The verdite found in Zimbabwe is basically the same as found in South Africa. We find it in the Nelspruit/Barberton area which is in the province of Mpumalanga (called Eastern Transvaal, prior to 1994). We also find a darker variety in this area which is locally known as "Buddstone" which is a bit harder than the verdite and takes a better polish. In this discussion other green rocks/minerals, e.g. "Transvaal Jade" were mentioned.. This is basically hydrogrossular garnet. The most common colour is various shades of green, ranging from pale green to apple green, very often with black chromite specks on it. Hardness about 7, very tough, takes a very good polish. Other colours of this material are grey, white, brown and pink, with the latter the most sought after. These various deposits in the area of Brits (North West Province, about 35 miles west of Pretoria) are practically exhausted. Another green one found in our area (some 30 miles East of Pretoria at Forfar) is serpentenised dolomite. This is pale to darkish green in colour, relatively soft, does not take a good polish. In the late sixties there was a chap here in Pretoria who turned this in a lathe to make candle sticks and lamp stands out of this material. The quarry has been disbanded and we as members of the Pretoria Gem and Mineral Club visit this site once about every two years. Regards, Horst ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter J. Modreski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Amazonite.... green rocks... verdite > P.S. to the list, > > Being curious, I "googled" for verdite and still had a hard time finding > "what it is", though there are many web refereces to it. Even the > archived > posts that I could find from our own list, such as from Horst Windisch, > didn't explicitly say what it really was. Here's one that I found that > claims to be authoritative, from Zimbabwe Marble Company, at > http://www.aabc.com/venture/material/marble/marble.htm > > Verdite is a massive muscovite mica rock, coloured green by a > chronium-rich > variety of muscovite mica called fushsite. It was first found in 1907 and > has been used as a substitute for jade. It often exhibits yellow and red > spots. Fairly tough and not heat sensitive, Verdite grinds quickly and is > workable with steel tools; it polishes with Linda A on leather. > > (and, OK, is mis-wrote, it's from Zimbabwe, not South Africa) (and P.P.S., > they meant to write "fuchsite", not fushite. > > Anyone have anything further to add about "verdite"? > > Pete > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > From rik.dillen at skynet.be Tue Nov 30 12:07:03 2004 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Tue Nov 30 12:08:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001201c4d718$34958e60$53c1f051@maxdata> *-----Original Message----- *From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com *[mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of *Axel Emmermann *Sent: dinsdag 30 november 2004 0:18 *To: Rockhounds@Lists.Drizzle.Com *Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia * *a friend of mine is going on vacation in British Columbia this summer. He's a seasoned professional mineralogist with lots of experience...not just another unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur (LOL, I'm gonna let him read this). Does anyone know of any good collecting sites there? *Would he need to rent a camper or a 4WD? >>>>> Well... euh... Axel (living 20 km from here), yes, e.g. in the neighbourhood of Kamloops. Wil let you know more details when we meet next time (actually in a week)... Greetings to all (others as well), Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen >>> Belgian minerals >>> An own find on a Korean (and now again on a Guinean) postage stamp ! >>> Exchange list MINERANT 2005 - 23 and 24 April 2005 Bouwcentrum (Antwerp Expo) Jan Van rijswijcklaan 191 Antwerpen http://www.minerant.org/mka/minerantnl.html Mineral collector's page http://www.minerant.org/ From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Nov 30 13:07:57 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Nov 30 13:07:56 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia In-Reply-To: <001201c4d718$34958e60$53c1f051@maxdata> Message-ID: Rik wrote: >>>>> Well... euh... Axel (living 20 km from here), yes, e.g. in the neighbourhood of Kamloops. Wil let you know more details when we meet next time (actually in a week)... Axel: Oh, thank you Rik... but then you can give the info directly to one of "our" professors... The big one with the pipe. (LOL) Cheers Axel From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Nov 30 13:13:07 2004 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Nov 30 13:13:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs In-Reply-To: <20041130174828.E9A61CB9DD0@delivery.infowest.com> Message-ID: OK, would you rather be a REALISTIC fainthearted pebble-picking amateur then? (LOL) axel >>Who? Me? I never will admit to it! [:<}} From Lapadary at aol.com Tue Nov 30 13:30:42 2004 From: Lapadary at aol.com (Lapadary@aol.com) Date: Tue Nov 30 13:31:03 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs Message-ID: In a message dated 11/30/04 12:36:00 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, litleval@ruralnetwork.net writes: Yoohoo, I might be one of them people, I only have 80 tones of gem stone rock left for sale, like a bird.........cheap, cheap cheap. Where are you at, geographically? Grant, in California. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jpjunk at mc.net Tue Nov 30 15:33:17 2004 From: jpjunk at mc.net (jjunkroski) Date: Tue Nov 30 15:30:19 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Donating collections In-Reply-To: <41ABEC32.2060801@att.net> Message-ID: Yet another suggestion: Quite a few High Schools and Community Colleges are now offering Earth Science classes, and most of them are experiencing budget cuts. A quick phone call to the Science Department chair will probably put you in touch with a teacher who would love to have any of your cast-offs, or duplicates. I'm retiring next year after thirty years in the classroom and will be passing on my teaching collection to my junior colleagues, who are eager to have large, well-selected specimens. They don't need to be superb aesthetic examples, but if they easily and clearly display a characteristic habit, or cleavage or any unusual characteristic they will be very useful. Support your local schools. John From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Nov 30 16:05:23 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Nov 30 16:02:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur {was: British Columbia} References: Message-ID: <41AD0A29.6B72@Tomaszewski.net> Axel Emmermann wrote: > > Hello list > > a friend of mine is going on vacation in British Columbia this summer. > He's a seasoned professional mineralogist with lots of experience...not > just another unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur Axel, I think you demean this list. Most of us have moved our unrealistic dreams well beyond fainthearted pebbles to large boulders (or even to hard rock). We may have once been pebble pups, but now we are incurable Rockhounds. Kreigh From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Tue Nov 30 16:04:44 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 30 16:06:40 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] British Columbia References: <000001c4d6a5$e60435c0$56b523d0@eoni.com> Message-ID: <000801c4d739$5dfd3700$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> "Ann Bloom-Dickison" wrote: > As an "unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur" I resemble that > remark. > You are amongst a bunch of us friends whom also favor that UFP-PA remark. Even moreso as age creeps up. LOL!!!!! Glenn From geenet2 at mchsi.com Tue Nov 30 16:17:18 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 30 16:18:21 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Peruvian blue opal References: <200411300203.iAU237q8014559@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <000801c4d6cc$cec02d70$bcf3a5d8@rock5> Message-ID: <003f01c4d73b$1eba88c0$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> This piece has a nice "scene" in it. Looks just like a blue mountain lake, a little dentritic mountains, white clouds, and blue sky. Nice piece! Just hope I don't mess it up... Keep it cool, like regular opal? Jeanette From geenet2 at mchsi.com Tue Nov 30 16:22:02 2004 From: geenet2 at mchsi.com (Jeanette Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 30 16:23:05 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs References: <20041130174828.E9A61CB9DD0@delivery.infowest.com> Message-ID: <005e01c4d73b$c7e2fa40$6401a8c0@mchsi.com> Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs?? Yep, I are one... From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Tue Nov 30 17:22:50 2004 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Tue Nov 30 17:22:45 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Donating collections References: Message-ID: <003701c4d744$46384fa0$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> I just donated 4 parcels of fossils to a science teacher in Freeport, Maine. He had placed a classified ad in the Mid America Paleontological Society "Digest." I've given stuff to folks in Texas, California, even a university in Leeds, U.K. They do pay the shipping cost. I also put together organized collections for teacher doorprizes at the Falls Fossil Festival. Have been doing this for a few years to encourage educators to attend the event. Next summer, I am organizing a teacher workshop where up to 30 educators can create their own geology resource kits from a large collection donated to our park. It was accepted with the full understanding that the bulk of the collection would be given away to teachers. Give til it hurts - I don't know any collectors who have too few specimens! Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: "jjunkroski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 6:33 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Donating collections > Yet another suggestion: > Quite a few High Schools and Community Colleges are now offering Earth > Science classes, and most of them are experiencing budget cuts. A quick > phone call to the Science Department chair will probably put you in touch > with a teacher who would love to have any of your cast-offs, or > duplicates. > > I'm retiring next year after thirty years in the classroom and will be > passing on my teaching collection to my junior colleagues, who are eager > to > have large, well-selected specimens. They don't need to be superb > aesthetic > examples, but if they easily and clearly display a characteristic habit, > or > cleavage or any unusual characteristic they will be very useful. > > Support your local schools. > > John > > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net Tue Nov 30 18:32:51 2004 From: pjmodreski at worldnet.att.net (Peter J. Modreski) Date: Tue Nov 30 18:24:35 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs References: <000001c4d6a5$e60435c0$56b523d0@eoni.com> Message-ID: <002b01c4d74e$0ee62040$a0a6490c@pete> You (Ann) will be amused to hear that your "I Resemble that Remark" line kept bothering me, because I knew it sounded familiar, but I really couldn't remember who it was from. I was thinking maybe W.C. Fields. (I guess I'm just not an expert on famous comedy lines.) It finally bugged me enough that I searched on the web for it, and after going through a whole lot of "hits" where people USED the line but didn't make any reference to where it originated, I finally figured it out--by one person who made reference to "Curly", which of course gave it away. cheers, Pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ann Bloom-Dickison" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 7:08 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] British Columbia > As an "unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur" I resemble that remark. > From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Tue Nov 30 18:58:33 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 30 19:00:49 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs References: <000001c4d6a5$e60435c0$56b523d0@eoni.com> <002b01c4d74e$0ee62040$a0a6490c@pete> Message-ID: <000701c4d751$a5fa8cc0$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> This "I Resemble that Remark" and many other malapropisms have been used by many comedians intentionally and yet remains very "punny". I enjoy playing with the English language and seeing others do so in fun. These days it is kinda scary when we see so many, even well educated people, seriously unintuitively (intended) abuse grammar. Keep on pickin'! Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter J. Modreski" > You (Ann) will be amused to hear that your "I Resemble that Remark" line > kept bothering me, because I knew it sounded familiar, but I really couldn't > remember who it was from. ......... I finally figured it out--by one person who made reference to > "Curly", which of course gave it away. > > cheers, Pete > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ann Bloom-Dickison" > > As an "unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateur" I resemble that > remark. > > > From pawpawtiger at mchsi.com Tue Nov 30 19:13:55 2004 From: pawpawtiger at mchsi.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Tue Nov 30 19:16:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mobile Rock and Gem Society Show Message-ID: <001101c4d753$cb858880$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> We had a great show Thanksgiving weekend at the Fairgrounds in Mobile, Alabama. Yes, some of us are interested in geology "down here in the South". LOL!!! This was our 9th annual show and it is growing each year. We had lots of dealers with many and varied items, demonstrations by some of our experienced members, a dig and sluice for the kids, plus lots of door prizes and 2 raffles, and some terrific food! Ya'll come see us next year, and we hope to meet lots of ya'll at your area shows and field trips. Glenn --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kward at themineralgallery.com Tue Nov 30 19:45:40 2004 From: kward at themineralgallery.com (Kevin Ward) Date: Tue Nov 30 19:47:25 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mobile Rock and Gem Society Show In-Reply-To: <001101c4d753$cb858880$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> References: <001101c4d753$cb858880$6501a8c0@mchsi.com> Message-ID: <6.1.0.6.2.20041130214135.04809e18@themineralgallery.com> I thought it was one of the best in years. It was good to see more mineral dealers in attendance this year (Fender Natural Resources, Jendon Minerals, Leitzman's) among others. Hopefully next year we will be able to pull in some additional mineral dealers. Kevin The Mineral Gallery and Auction http://www.themineralgallery.com http://www.exceptionalminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockcurrier at cs.com Tue Nov 30 19:52:28 2004 From: rockcurrier at cs.com (Rock Currier) Date: Tue Nov 30 19:51:54 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Specimens for teachers References: <200412010205.iB125UcK000518@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <003c01c4d759$2def3890$bcf3a5d8@rock5> I run a wholesale mineral business and have many continuing requests by teachers for any kinds of scraps that we throw away. For years our trimmings have gone into a barrel that never gets full because of the teachers that come to our establishment and clean it out frequently. We get far more requests for donations from teachers that have no budgets that we can ever comply with. We have teachers that come in and spend their own money to buy cheap specimens that they can use in their class room. We usually sell only to dealers who have resale permits but do bend on our standard policy for teachers. I really feel bad for them. They are trying to teach a little geology, mineralogy, physics and chemistry and have little or no budget for equipment. I know that all of us have tons of more or less rubbish just sitting in our garages that would do much more good if it could be put into the hands of the teachers that could really use it for their teaching. Every collector and dealer should go through their garage and put all the junk stuff in boxes and put labels on it and then call their local schools and try and find these teachers. Perhaps some one in this group could start a web site that could put interested teachers and local collector together so that they could get specimens for free to teach with. Rock From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Nov 30 19:55:18 2004 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Nov 30 19:55:11 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Donating collections References: <003701c4d744$46384fa0$092cca0c@yourb79wz4rose> Message-ID: <41AD4098.244@Tomaszewski.net> Alan, I have too few specimens -- because my specimens don't yet include every known mineral; I am an addicted Rockhound. But I understand your meaning and continue trying to find good homes for the mineral specimens I have too many of. Thanks for the reminder! Kreigh Alan Goldstein wrote: > > I just donated 4 parcels of fossils to a science teacher in Freeport, Maine. > He had placed a classified ad in the Mid America Paleontological Society > "Digest." I've given stuff to folks in Texas, California, even a university > in Leeds, U.K. They do pay the shipping cost. > > I also put together organized collections for teacher doorprizes at the > Falls Fossil Festival. Have been doing this for a few years to encourage > educators to attend the event. > > Next summer, I am organizing a teacher workshop where up to 30 educators can > create their own geology resource kits from a large collection donated to > our park. It was accepted with the full understanding that the bulk of the > collection would be given away to teachers. > > Give til it hurts - I don't know any collectors who have too few specimens! > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "jjunkroski" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 6:33 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Donating collections > > > Yet another suggestion: > > Quite a few High Schools and Community Colleges are now offering Earth > > Science classes, and most of them are experiencing budget cuts. A quick > > phone call to the Science Department chair will probably put you in touch > > with a teacher who would love to have any of your cast-offs, or > > duplicates. > > > > I'm retiring next year after thirty years in the classroom and will be > > passing on my teaching collection to my junior colleagues, who are eager > > to > > have large, well-selected specimens. They don't need to be superb > > aesthetic > > examples, but if they easily and clearly display a characteristic habit, > > or > > cleavage or any unusual characteristic they will be very useful. > > > > Support your local schools. > > > > John > > From litleval at ruralnetwork.net Tue Nov 30 19:01:35 2004 From: litleval at ruralnetwork.net (Linda Rasmussen) Date: Tue Nov 30 20:43:59 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs References: Message-ID: <001e01c4d752$15337340$6d5fe842@pavilion> Hi Grant, Right in the middle of Gem Stone country, near Vale Oregon. Wayne ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Unrealistic fainthearted pebble-picking amateurs > In a message dated 11/30/04 12:36:00 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, > litleval@ruralnetwork.net writes: > > Yoohoo, I might be one of them people, I only have 80 tones of > gem stone rock left for sale, like a bird.........cheap, cheap cheap. > > Where are you at, geographically? > > Grant, in California. > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > WWW: http://www.drizzle.com/~afox/rockhounds > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > From lanny at lrream.com Tue Nov 30 21:47:28 2004 From: lanny at lrream.com (Lanny) Date: Tue Nov 30 21:46:10 2004 Subject: [Rockhounds] Cabelas - tumblers Message-ID: <7C6412DB-435C-11D9-8713-000393AC22E6@lrream.com> I was wondering if anyone else saw these - I've ordered an odd thing or two from Cabelas (a large outdoor/hunting/fishing/camping supplier for those not familiar with the company), so they now think I need a copy of every catalog they publish. No! I don't need camouflage tents, truck covers or long johns! However, today the Cabelas Christmas catalog arrived and it has three models of rock tumblers. That was a surprise. Good looking machines. Maybe the hunters and fishers pick up pebbles while they wait... Lanny