From mp44sturm-rocks at yahoo.com Tue Jul 1 07:38:12 2008 From: mp44sturm-rocks at yahoo.com (Sandra B. Gee) Date: Tue Jul 1 07:38:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any good shows in Houston? In-Reply-To: <4869C450.4060400@hal-pc.org> Message-ID: <216901.24562.qm@web34202.mail.mud.yahoo.com> There is also a smaller show held by the Clear Lake Gem and Mineral Society. It is usually in February. See: http://www.hawkwindnovels.com/page2.html More information about the Houston Gem and Mineral Society: http://www.hgms.org/ Click on the link at the top of the page "annual show". There are also a number of shows directed at the jewelry making business. I don't know specifics of those. Sandra Gee. --- On Tue, 7/1/08, jbacko wrote: > From: jbacko > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Any good shows in Houston? > To: corson@infodyn.com, "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > Date: Tuesday, July 1, 2008, 12:44 AM > Tom Corson wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I am looking for some info on mineral shows in > Houston. > > > > Are there any? When? Where? Etc... > > > > Opinions as to show size, attendance, and quality most > welcome and > > appreciated... > > > > Cheers, > > TC > > > The Houston Gem and Mineral Society's annual show will > be held September > 26-28, 2008 at the Humble Civic Center, just East of > Intercontinental > Airport. This is a major show and will include the American > Federation > of Mineral Societies Meeting this year. > > Check out the HGMS website http://www.hgms.org of details. > > john > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From SMKELL45 at aol.com Tue Jul 1 16:32:33 2008 From: SMKELL45 at aol.com (SMKELL45@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 1 16:34:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] re Allende meteorite Message-ID: I got hold of a sample of the Allende meteorite, CV-3. I recognized the chondrules and the calcium-aluminum inclusions. Does anyone know if the CAI's are a recognized mineral? I like my labels to be as descriptive as possible. Thanks smkell **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kaze_no_sennyo at yahoo.com Tue Jul 1 18:08:02 2008 From: kaze_no_sennyo at yahoo.com (Dani blah) Date: Tue Jul 1 18:08:05 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello Everyone!!! Message-ID: <210967.56922.qm@web38106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Well, it was suggested that I introduce myself since I'm new, so I suppose I shall.? :)? My name's Dani, I'm 28 years old, and I've been collecting rocks since before I can remember.? My grandmother used to buy me a new stone every time we would go to the local flea market, and I've grown the collection to two full shadow boxes since then.? At one point I was quite diligent about keeping everything labeled and organized, until my grandfather knocked both boxes off the wall while vacuuming one day.? Oops!? Most of them are re-labeled and back where they belong now, thanks to a kind-hearted geology professor who wasn't put off by my distraught sob story.? :) Most of the specimens that I have have been purchased from random mineral shops and flea markets.? I have relatively few stones that I've actually collected myself, although I would like to find places where I can do that at some point.? I have a few Herkimer Diamonds that my grandmother got for me (she lived in upstate New York), a fistful of mica shists that I've picked up from driveways around the countryside, a rock from the wall of the Rochepot castle in France, and a couple of random fossil rocks that I found around my mom's backyard.? Everything else that I have was bought, or sucked up in my grandfather's vacuum ;)? I'm hoping to get some good pictures of the rocks that I do have soon, and catalog them on a website somewhere.? It'd be handy if I ever lose the tags again, and that way I can show them off to anyone here that would be interested in seeing them too.? :)? I'm sure my collection is nothing compared to most of yours, but that's why I'm here.? I'm always up for meeting like minded people and sharing information.? So that's me!? Nice to meet all of you, and hopefully someday I'll be able to offer something interesting to the group!? Thanks for letting me join in the fun! ~dani --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 1 18:17:38 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 1 18:17:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] re Allende meteorite In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You might want to start with the Wikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allende_meteorite and then move on to recent research finding exotic components like graphite whiskers http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/320/5872/91 before looking at the more conventional inclusions http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/lpsc2008/pdf/2121.pdf The Allende is probably the most studied meteorite ever. If you are not careful your label could become a bookshelf full of literature. Kreigh On Tuesday, Jul 1, 2008, at 19:32 America/Detroit, SMKELL45@aol.com wrote: > I got hold of a sample of the Allende meteorite, CV-3. I recognized > the > chondrules and the calcium-aluminum inclusions. Does anyone know if > the CAI's are > a recognized mineral? I like my labels to be as descriptive as > possible. > Thanks smkell > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > fuel-efficient used cars. > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From jcessna at nist.gov Tue Jul 1 18:26:23 2008 From: jcessna at nist.gov (Jeffrey T. Cessna) Date: Tue Jul 1 18:26:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello Everyone!!! In-Reply-To: <210967.56922.qm@web38106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <210967.56922.qm@web38106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080701212018.0217f3d8@nist.gov> Welcome, Dani. If you want to get out and collect a good way to start is to find out if there is a local club near you. You can look on the American Federation of Mineral and Lapidary Societies Page http://www.amfed.org/ for your local chapter and explore further from there. Then go to a meeting. If you are lucky you will have your choice. I belong to 4 clubs in the mid-atlantic area and they each have their own flavor. I would even have a few more choices if I weren't busy some nights. Cheers, Jeff At 09:08 PM 7/1/2008, you wrote: >Well, it was suggested that I introduce myself since I'm new, so I >suppose I shall. :) My name's Dani, I'm 28 years old, and I've >been collecting rocks since before I can remember. My grandmother >used to buy me a new stone every time we would go to the local flea >market, and I've grown the collection to two full shadow boxes since >then. At one point I was quite diligent about keeping everything >labeled and organized, until my grandfather knocked both boxes off >the wall while vacuuming one day. Oops! Most of them are >re-labeled and back where they belong now, thanks to a kind-hearted >geology professor who wasn't put off by my distraught sob story. :) > >Most of the specimens that I have have been purchased from random >mineral shops and flea markets. I have relatively few stones that >I've actually collected myself, although I would like to find places >where I can do that at some point. I have a few Herkimer Diamonds >that my grandmother got for me (she lived in upstate New York), a >fistful of mica shists that I've picked up from driveways around the >countryside, a rock from the wall of the Rochepot castle in France, >and a couple of random fossil rocks that I found around my mom's >backyard. Everything else that I have was bought, or sucked up in >my grandfather's vacuum ;) > >I'm hoping to get some good pictures of the rocks that I do have >soon, and catalog them on a website somewhere. It'd be handy if I >ever lose the tags again, and that way I can show them off to anyone >here that would be interested in seeing them too. :) I'm sure my >collection is nothing compared to most of yours, but that's why I'm >here. I'm always up for meeting like minded people and sharing information. > >So that's me! Nice to meet all of you, and hopefully someday I'll >be able to offer something interesting to the group! Thanks for >letting me join in the fun! > >~dani > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From Pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 1 18:29:06 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 1 18:29:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] re Allende meteorite Message-ID: In a message dated 7/1/2008 5:34:47 PM Mountain Daylight Time, SMKELL45@aol.com writes: got hold of a sample of the Allende meteorite, CV-3. I recognized the chondrules and the calcium-aluminum inclusions. Does anyone know if the CAI's are a recognized mineral? I like my labels to be as descriptive as possible. Thanks smkell Now there's a question I can't resist trying to help answer--not something I'd ever thought about before, specifically. Doing a little web browsing, I'm seeing, "They [CAI's] consist of high-temperature minerals, including silicates and oxides of calcium, aluminum, and titanium." "Refractory inclusions or CAI's (Calcium Aluminum-rich Inclusions) are a mineralogically and chemically diverse group of structures mainly seen in carbonaceous chondrites. "Fluffy Type A's are perhaps the most altered of CAI's. ... The primary mineral assemblage of these inclusions is melilite, V-rich spinel, perovskite, and hibonite." "We have made a detailed examination of the mineralogy, textures, and assemblages of six calcium-aluminum-rich inclusions (CAI) in the Allende meteorite. They can be classified into four types - hibonite-bearing, fassaite- and olivine-bearing, feldspathoid-bearing and fassaite-bearing CAI that are hibonite and olivine free. ..." It sounds like the CAI's are composed of a wide variety of minerals; so, trying to label one as to its mineral composition, is sort of like taking a sample of basalt, and labelling it as to what minerals it's composed of--except, I think there are a lot more minerals in the CAI's than in typical basalt. Cheers, Pete **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jonnaakamom at gmail.com Tue Jul 1 19:34:21 2008 From: jonnaakamom at gmail.com (Jonna) Date: Tue Jul 1 19:34:23 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] got my master's In-Reply-To: <48607C4B.50605@verizon.net> References: <0B8AD156-2D26-11DD-ADD8-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> <069D2623-E93A-40CD-A8FC-590527A70ABF@roadrunner.com> <000f01c8c22c$ce767b40$655fe842@Titans> <016001c8c2d5$fc3b33a0$929c324a@marilyn> <48607C4B.50605@verizon.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 11:47 PM, DonH wrote: > > To all my list friends, too many to e-mail individually, I want to let you > know I received my master's in geology last Friday. Thanks to all for their > encouragement and support. > > All the best, > Don Well this is wonderful news! For years now I pop up and pay attention when you post in the belief that you are one who knows what he's talking about. And I learn lots of little things. So now I can say that I learned such and such from a geologist! Congrats to you!! Jonna in Minnesota From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 1 19:49:51 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 1 19:49:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: How to make Fluorite octahedra? In-Reply-To: <000501c8da98$c8359ca0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <8AEDB43E-47E1-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Sudden exposure to direct sunlight sometimes worked for me. It has been years since I made any, but I wonder if laser pointers would work. Hmmmm, how about the TV Remote? There are a couple dozen minerals that contain Iodine. It is not a very long stretch to finding NI3 in nature. You could collect purple dust, air with an excess of nitrogen, and an interesting video. Then you simply need to convince the IMA to accept Leaverite as a valid mineral. Kreigh On Monday, Jun 30, 2008, at 06:05 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Fun part: if you grow a crystal of NI3 and try to measure it by X-ray > diffraction it is likely to blow up... The energy of the X-rays may be > enough... > > Axel > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens >> gene@fossilnut.com >> Verzonden: zondag 29 juni 2008 5:16 >> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors >> Onderwerp: Re: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: How to make Fluorite octahedra? >> >> NI3 is great for door locks and the feet of chairs too. >> >> Gene Hartstein >> Newark, DE >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors" >> >> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2008 10:13 PM >> Subject: OT: Re: [Rockhounds] Re: How to make Fluorite octahedra? >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 1 20:14:24 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 1 20:17:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hello Everyone!!! In-Reply-To: <210967.56922.qm@web38106.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dani, If you add a small label to each specimen with an identifying number, and write the number on the back of each label, your specimens won't get mixed up again. Welcome to the list! Kreigh On Tuesday, Jul 1, 2008, at 21:08 America/Detroit, Dani blah wrote: > Well, it was suggested that I introduce myself since I'm new, so I > suppose I shall.? :)? My name's Dani, I'm 28 years old, and I've been > collecting rocks since before I can remember.? My grandmother used to > buy me a new stone every time we would go to the local flea market, > and I've grown the collection to two full shadow boxes since then.? At > one point I was quite diligent about keeping everything labeled and > organized, until my grandfather knocked both boxes off the wall while > vacuuming one day.? Oops!? Most of them are re-labeled and back where > they belong now, thanks to a kind-hearted geology professor who wasn't > put off by my distraught sob story.? :) > > Most of the specimens that I have have been purchased from random > mineral shops and flea markets.? I have relatively few stones that > I've actually collected myself, although I would like to find places > where I can do that at some point.? I have a few Herkimer Diamonds > that my grandmother got for me (she lived in upstate New York), a > fistful of mica shists that I've picked up from driveways around the > countryside, a rock from the wall of the Rochepot castle in France, > and a couple of random fossil rocks that I found around my mom's > backyard.? Everything else that I have was bought, or sucked up in my > grandfather's vacuum ;)? > > I'm hoping to get some good pictures of the rocks that I do have soon, > and catalog them on a website somewhere.? It'd be handy if I ever lose > the tags again, and that way I can show them off to anyone here that > would be interested in seeing them too.? :)? I'm sure my collection is > nothing compared to most of yours, but that's why I'm here.? I'm > always up for meeting like minded people and sharing information.? > > So that's me!? Nice to meet all of you, and hopefully someday I'll be > able to offer something interesting to the group!? Thanks for letting > me join in the fun! > > ~dani > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Wed Jul 2 07:26:05 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Wed Jul 2 07:28:47 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nostalgia References: <8AEDB43E-47E1-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001201c8dc4f$90248a20$0200000a@LarryRush> Items for sale from a 1937 issue of "Rocks and Minerals".......... Lazulite XL, 2X3",Georgia....................$3.50 (R.W.Tuthill, Indiana) Iron Arcs, battery operated (for fluorescents).... ......$10. (Edw. Roedder, Pa.) Dana's System of Mineralogy...............$15.50 (John Grenzig, NY) Virgin Valley Opals, assortment............$3.00 (Mark Foster, Oregon) Zircons, gemmy blue, 4 carats..............$1.50 (Peter Zodac, NY) Emerald crystals, Colombia...................$1-3 (Van Esselstyn, NY) Ellenville Quartz clusters....................$.35-.50 (E. McElroy, NY) Ah...the "good old days", especially interesting since I just came back from a large mineral show over the week-end! I didn't see any bargains like this there, either. Larry From bj9709 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 2 10:04:31 2008 From: bj9709 at yahoo.com (Brett Allen Johnson) Date: Wed Jul 2 10:06:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] More fun with NaCO3 crystals... Message-ID: <842459.93240.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> jbacko, so what you are saying is to make a super saturated solution of NaCO3+H2O and let evaporate to grow well formed crystals? Is this like growing epsom crystals? I will give it a go and report back after I get some success. Thanks, Brett ps. Do you have any other mixture/growing tips you would like to share with the Group? jbacko worte: Sodium Carbonate (Washing Soda) readily makes lots of "stepped"? crystals from ordinary evaporation of saturated solutions.? They will cover the bottom of the jar easily and can be broken out if desired. However, they will not last in open air as they dessicate and turn again into a white powder.? The same thing happens to copper sulfate, iron sulfate and sodium bicarbonate.? Bicarbonate is harder to make into large crystals. But it is relatively easy to make the crystals; they just will not be stable. Borax will do the same thing, but more slowly. Potassium permanganate makes nice monoclinic crystals. The usual "stalactites" are made by growing silicates from sodium silicate (Water Glass) and coloring them with seed crystals of various kinds. Copper makes blue, nickel green, zinc creamy-white,? etc. john --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From albalmer at copper.net Wed Jul 2 10:56:35 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Wed Jul 2 10:56:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] More fun with NaCO3 crystals... In-Reply-To: <842459.93240.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <842459.93240.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 2 Jul 2008 10:04:31 -0700 (PDT), Brett Allen Johnson wrote: >jbacko, so what you are saying is to make a super saturated solution of NaCO3+H2O and let evaporate to grow well formed crystals? Is this like growing epsom crystals? I will give it a go and report back after I get some success. Thanks, Brett >ps. Do you have any other mixture/growing tips you would like to share with the Group? > The MIT Press has an inexpensive book named "Crystals and Crystal Growing" by A. Holden and P. Morrison. I think it's still in print (although my MIT days were a *long* time ago.) It's pretty basic. I think it was one of the "help the high school teacher" series. Found it. It is still in print, but the price has gone from the 5.95 I remember to 21.95 :-) http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?ttype=2&tid=5354 > >jbacko worte: > >Sodium Carbonate (Washing Soda) readily makes lots of "stepped"? >crystals from ordinary evaporation of saturated solutions.? They will >cover the bottom of the jar easily and can be broken out if desired. >However, they will not last in open air as they dessicate and turn again >into a white powder.? The same thing happens to copper sulfate, iron >sulfate and sodium bicarbonate.? Bicarbonate is harder to make into >large crystals. > >But it is relatively easy to make the crystals; they just will not be >stable. Borax will do the same thing, but more slowly. > >Potassium permanganate makes nice monoclinic crystals. > >The usual "stalactites" are made by growing silicates from sodium >silicate (Water Glass) and coloring them with seed crystals of various >kinds. >Copper makes blue, nickel green, zinc creamy-white,? etc. > > john > > > > > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From gene at fossilnut.com Wed Jul 2 17:41:32 2008 From: gene at fossilnut.com (gene@fossilnut.com) Date: Wed Jul 2 17:41:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Fun with Sodium Carbonate... References: <525262.20438.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <8CAA901319D36D9-1A20-1201@FWM-D21.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <71ACDD2A6F574057B700023F7A921FBB@your4dacd0ea75> I'll second that for sodium carbonate. It tends to want to form more seed crystals, rather than deposit on existing seeds. As I recall it's a function of how much supersaturation the particular material will allow. Carbonate alllows very little. On the opposite end of this one is sodium thiosulfate, where you can take the decahydrate crystals and heat them to dissolve the material in its own water of hydration, cool it, and still have a solution. Then add one speck of thiosulfate and the whole thing instantly solidifies. One method to address that is to cycle the temperture slowly up and down. What happens is that raising the temperature dissolves that smallest crystals faster than the bigger ones because they have the greatest surface to volume ratio. In effect you "digest' the smaller seed crystals and redeposit on the ones that remain during the cooling. This process needs to be controlled and is lots slower than growing easy to grow crystals, but it is used (in effect) in commercial crystallizers to grow crystals to the size needed to effectively filter them. Gene Hartstein ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Fun with Sodium Carbonate... > Hi Brett, > > Some chemicals/minerals readily form large crystals, and some just > don't--they are prone to just crystallize as fine-grained powders when > their solutions are dried or evaporated.? Sodium carbonate, I think, as > well as sodium bicarbonate, are two of the latter--I believe they are just > hard to produce as large (or even, readily visible) crystals.? So yes, I > suspect one readily gets massive stalactites from sodium carbonate, but > not much in the way of crystals. > > P.S., as you probably know, sodium bicarbonate occurs naturally, though > rarely, as the mineral nahcolite.? A more common mineral is trona, which > is a mixed sodium carbonate-bicarbonate hydrate.? Sodium carbonate > decahydrate is the mineral, natron, but it is also not very common. > > Pete > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brett Allen Johnson > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Sent: Mon, 30 Jun 2008 1:02 pm > Subject: [Rockhounds] Fun with Sodium Carbonate... > > > > I am trying to build a nice collection of all the Carbonates. I have > started my > collection with both the massive form (calcite travertine, smithsonite > nodules, > rhodochrosite stalactite, etc) and large individual crystals > (rhodochrosite > cubes, calcite points, siderite blades, etc). > Recently, I found NaCo3 at the hardware store (pool PH thingy). It comes > in a > powdery form and it easily dissolved in water. > One of the crystal growing website says, "...to make a stalactite." by > using a > solution of water / NaCO3 and wool string. That is fine and dandy for a > massive > form of the crystallized NaCO3, but I would like to large crystals of > NaCO3, > too. > Any Suggestion??? > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From rocknate at gmail.com Wed Jul 2 17:55:37 2008 From: rocknate at gmail.com (Nathan Martin) Date: Wed Jul 2 17:57:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nostalgia In-Reply-To: <001201c8dc4f$90248a20$0200000a@LarryRush> References: <8AEDB43E-47E1-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> <001201c8dc4f$90248a20$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: Larry, A quick check of the inflation index at http://www.bls.gov/CPI/ suggests that we should multiply these values by a factor of 15 to assess their cost in 2008 dollars. Even with that adjustment it seems that there may still have been some values back then but its a little less certain. Nate Martin Lexington, MA On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 10:26 AM, Lawrence Rush wrote: > Items for sale from a 1937 issue of "Rocks and Minerals".......... > > Lazulite XL, 2X3",Georgia....................$3.50 > (R.W.Tuthill, Indiana) > > Iron Arcs, battery operated (for fluorescents).... > ......$10. (Edw. Roedder, Pa.) > > Dana's System of Mineralogy...............$15.50 > (John Grenzig, NY) > > Virgin Valley Opals, assortment............$3.00 > (Mark Foster, Oregon) > > Zircons, gemmy blue, 4 carats..............$1.50 > (Peter Zodac, NY) > > Emerald crystals, Colombia...................$1-3 > (Van Esselstyn, NY) > > Ellenville Quartz clusters....................$.35-.50 > (E. McElroy, NY) > > > Ah...the "good old days", especially interesting since I just came back from > a large mineral show over the week-end! I didn't see any bargains like this > there, either. > > Larry > From corson at infodyn.com Wed Jul 2 19:27:33 2008 From: corson at infodyn.com (Tom Corson) Date: Wed Jul 2 19:32:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! Message-ID: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> Hi, Having spent so many years in high tech, I don't impress easily when it comes to new software "gizmos", but this is simply a "must see" and I wanted to share it with all of you. I discovered this browser plug-in called PicLens which allows me to design a web page which can display a collection of images as a virtual 3D image wall (you can literally "walk" down it!). So I put together a page containing a photo of each of the specimens I have online using this technology. Here is the link: http://infodyn.dyndns.org:8880/store/pl_images.html Now, to see the 3d image wall, you need to download and install the PicLens plug-in, otherwise all you will see is a traditional type slideshow and not the really cool stuff. Here are the instructions: 1) Load the above web page. 2) Click on the link which says "get the PicLens plugin" and install it (it's simple and easy). 3) Restart your browser and reload the above page. 4) Click on the link which says "Start Slide Show". 5) You will now see the entire collection as a draggable 3d image wall. Each specimen can be zoomed in by clicking it with the mouse. You can drag with the mouse to "walk" down the wall. This is one of the coolest things I've seen in a long time. I hope you enjoy it! Cheers, TC ________________________________ Thomas W. Corson OBG International corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 http://www.obgrocks.com World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors ________________________________ From donhalterman at verizon.net Wed Jul 2 21:13:37 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Wed Jul 2 21:13:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] got my master's In-Reply-To: References: <0B8AD156-2D26-11DD-ADD8-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> <069D2623-E93A-40CD-A8FC-590527A70ABF@roadrunner.com> <000f01c8c22c$ce767b40$655fe842@Titans> <016001c8c2d5$fc3b33a0$929c324a@marilyn> <48607C4B.50605@verizon.net> Message-ID: <486C51F1.5030200@verizon.net> Jonna wrote: > Well this is wonderful news! . . . Thanks to all. Well I don't want to burden the list with personal posts, so I'll combine one answer for all those with questions and comments. It is important to note that having a degree is like getting a driver's license: you know just enough to be dangerous. My eight years of serious mineral collecting and spending time with grizzled mineralogists taught me a lot and I would have never had an A in classes like x-ray analysis and advanced mineralogy without having a broad qualtitative understanding of x-ray diffraction and crystallography going in the door. Also, having a brutal task-master in Chemistry I at Drexel helped so much more than I might have imagined. Unfortunately, it seemed like I had the perfect job lined up for the last month or so before I finished, but just when they were supposed to send me a salary package, they sent a rejection notice instead. I am still shocked by that, and I am scrambling to look for work at this time. That's about all there is to that story. I am busy packing my belongings and staying positive. I may not get exactly what I want, but there are jobs out there, so I'm not too worried about it. Best, Don From zebulon at isr.umich.edu Thu Jul 3 07:35:43 2008 From: zebulon at isr.umich.edu (Peter Sparks) Date: Thu Jul 3 07:35:47 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! In-Reply-To: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> Message-ID: <6F651C1505A4A048923BCF2D756A7E4905709285@isr-mail2.ad.isr.umich.edu> Okay, I usually don't go for these plugins either but this is a really cool way to quickly scroll through a large number of photos if you have good bandwith. Thanks for sharing the info! -- Peter -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tom Corson Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 10:28 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! Hi, Having spent so many years in high tech, I don't impress easily when it comes to new software "gizmos", but this is simply a "must see" and I wanted to share it with all of you. I discovered this browser plug-in called PicLens which allows me to design a web page which can display a collection of images as a virtual 3D image wall (you can literally "walk" down it!). So I put together a page containing a photo of each of the specimens I have online using this technology. Here is the link: http://infodyn.dyndns.org:8880/store/pl_images.html Now, to see the 3d image wall, you need to download and install the PicLens plug-in, otherwise all you will see is a traditional type slideshow and not the really cool stuff. Here are the instructions: 1) Load the above web page. 2) Click on the link which says "get the PicLens plugin" and install it (it's simple and easy). 3) Restart your browser and reload the above page. 4) Click on the link which says "Start Slide Show". 5) You will now see the entire collection as a draggable 3d image wall. Each specimen can be zoomed in by clicking it with the mouse. You can drag with the mouse to "walk" down the wall. This is one of the coolest things I've seen in a long time. I hope you enjoy it! Cheers, TC ________________________________ Thomas W. Corson OBG International corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 http://www.obgrocks.com World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors ________________________________ -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From bobl at peaktopeak.com Thu Jul 3 10:28:18 2008 From: bobl at peaktopeak.com (Bob Loeffler) Date: Thu Jul 3 10:28:20 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! In-Reply-To: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> Message-ID: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Wow!!!!! Amazing!!!! That is the best plugin EVER! I'm a computer guy (for the last 25 years) and I've never seen a piece of software this cool. Oh, and nice specimens, Tom. :-) One other feature I noticed is that you can zoom in and out from the wall if you have a "scroll wheel" on your mouse. Scroll it forward and you "move closer" to the wall; scroll it back and you "move further away" from the wall. And it looks like they support all of the major web browers. Very cool! Thanks for telling us about it, Tom! Bob -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tom Corson Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 8:28 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! Hi, Having spent so many years in high tech, I don't impress easily when it comes to new software "gizmos", but this is simply a "must see" and I wanted to share it with all of you. I discovered this browser plug-in called PicLens which allows me to design a web page which can display a collection of images as a virtual 3D image wall (you can literally "walk" down it!). So I put together a page containing a photo of each of the specimens I have online using this technology. Here is the link: http://infodyn.dyndns.org:8880/store/pl_images.html Now, to see the 3d image wall, you need to download and install the PicLens plug-in, otherwise all you will see is a traditional type slideshow and not the really cool stuff. Here are the instructions: 1) Load the above web page. 2) Click on the link which says "get the PicLens plugin" and install it (it's simple and easy). 3) Restart your browser and reload the above page. 4) Click on the link which says "Start Slide Show". 5) You will now see the entire collection as a draggable 3d image wall. Each specimen can be zoomed in by clicking it with the mouse. You can drag with the mouse to "walk" down the wall. This is one of the coolest things I've seen in a long time. I hope you enjoy it! Cheers, TC ________________________________ Thomas W. Corson OBG International corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 http://www.obgrocks.com World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors ________________________________ -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Thu Jul 3 10:54:39 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Thu Jul 3 10:54:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Trip Report Pics (sorta off topic) Message-ID: Here are links to more pics from the "Up One Side Down the Other" trip. Gettysburg BattleField http://pawpawtiger.spaces.live.com/photos/cns!156E2AA3FBAB93F3!3575/ Shenandoah N.P. http://pawpawtiger.spaces.live.com/photos/cns!156E2AA3FBAB93F3!3665/ Note: You can see all my pics that you'd care to view on the Spaces site by simply clicking on the album tabs. Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jabac at hal-pc.org Fri Jul 4 05:09:51 2008 From: jabac at hal-pc.org (jbacko) Date: Fri Jul 4 05:17:10 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] More fun with NaCO3 crystals... In-Reply-To: <842459.93240.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <842459.93240.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <486E130F.9010607@hal-pc.org> Brett Allen Johnson wrote: > jbacko, so what you are saying is to make a super saturated solution of NaCO3+H2O and let evaporate to grow well formed crystals? Is this like growing epsom crystals? I will give it a go and report back after I get some success. Thanks, Brett > ps. Do you have any other mixture/growing tips you would like to share with the Group? > > The main things to do are: 1. Use a very clean glass jar (like a mayonnaise or Ball canning jar). 2. Use clean and soft water; distilled water is easily available. 3, Saturate your solution with a moderately warm but not hot temperature (~150-160 F.) It doesn't hurt to boil the solution but that tends to put too much material in solution and make it a bit unstable for large xtal growth. Make certain that ALL of the material is dissolved. 4. Cover the solution such that evaporation can take place but NO dust particles can get into the jar. 5. Put the jar in a dark, quiet place and let it sit until it does it's thing. Don't be in too much of a hurry to find out what is going on; any disturbance will cause rapid growth of small crystals. This may occur despite your best efforts. 6. After a week or two, you should have some nice crystals. Try it first with copper sulfate as it is very easy to grow into large crystals. Then repeat the operation using one of the larger crystals as a seed, It has to be large enough to not completely dissolve in the warm water solution. Be absolutely certain that all of the material except your seed is in solution. After a few days you should have one (or a few) large xtal(s). 7. Your results will vary according to the materials and conditions. If you live next to a railroad or airport, for instance, you are probably going to get a lot of periodic vibration, which is not good. 8. Copper Sulfate is available at place like pool or septic suppliers as it is used as an algaecide. Sometimes one can find relatively pure iron sulfate as a soil conditioner. Epsom salts is at the pharmacy (and sometimes small quantities of U.S.P. copper sulfate). Nitrates can be found in quick-dissolving fertilizers, but they are usually too mixed up and of too poor a quality to be of much use. Nonetheless, one can "refine" them by successive evaporation and fractional separation. Nickel Sulfate will have to come from a chemical supply house as far as I know. Sodium Thiosulfate used to be commonly available as a photographic fixer, but silver-based photography is rapidly disappearing and it may be tough to find. It can be grown as relatively large crystals if the solution is not too hot or too strong to begin with; once it supersaturates, any shock will crystallize the whole mass as fine crystals (as mentioned above). Washing Soda, Bicarbonate of Soda, and Borax are all at your local supermarket. Washing Soda does not work well with seed crystals; usually one gets a mass of relatively large interlocking "stepped" crystals no matter what one does. Agricultural sulfur can be dissolved in something like toluene and crystallized, but it is not an operation for the careless or foolhardy. 9. Sources? When I was young, we could write away to all the advertisers in Chemical and Engineering News for samples; I filled up a whole basement lab that way. I don't think that is allowed anymore. Nuts! I guess your local high-school or college chemistry teacher is as good a source of info on where to get things as any. 10. Have fun. Crystals are neat! (At least Nature thinks so.) john From jwolfe_3 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 4 07:16:46 2008 From: jwolfe_3 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Wolfe) Date: Fri Jul 4 07:16:49 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary rough and supplies in Ontario Message-ID: <541142.73331.qm@web53610.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi I'm new to the site and have been pouring over each email trying to soak in as much information as possible. I've just purchased a Genie grinder that I'm hoping to use to make some lovely cabs from my ever growing collection of rocks. My problem is that my collection is from everywhere else but where I live. Does anyone know of a local supplier in the Toronto/ Southern Ontario area that I can purchase lapidary supplies from? It seems silly with the population we have around here that I can't find anything. Anything I have found online seems to have gone under! I had to order stuff from Calgary just so I could use my saw! Any help would be most appreciated! Jenn the newbie! __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ From lavenderfish at cox.net Fri Jul 4 07:56:10 2008 From: lavenderfish at cox.net (Carol Carter-Wientjes) Date: Fri Jul 4 07:56:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary rough and supplies in Ontario References: <541142.73331.qm@web53610.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <041f01c8dde6$18c6d6c0$6501a8c0@YOUR6D949099C0> Jenn, Congrats on your new toy, you'll love cabbing on it. Hans Durstling is a Canadian lapidary fellow, somewhere near the Bay of Fundy I think, who may be able to point you in the right directions up there (I'm in Louisiana) He has a website with contact info so you could probably email him and ask for his help. Website is http://www.virtualfundy.com/default.htm Hope that'll help, CaroL From tjokela at execulink.com Fri Jul 4 10:17:18 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Fri Jul 4 10:19:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary rough and supplies in Ontario References: <541142.73331.qm@web53610.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001701c8ddf9$d0505560$6600a8c0@Junior> Hi Jenn, Your best bet for lapidary rough and equipment is Robert Hall Originals in St.George. He's just off the 403 near Brantford, and has the largest rockshop in Ontario if not Canada. Hundreds of tons of rough plus some minerals, fossils, beading supplies, and everything you could ever imagine made out of pewter. Anything you need that he doesn't have can be ordered in. Great guy, great place to visit. 800-360-2813 http://www.roberthalloriginals.com There are one or two other places but I don't have their info at my fingertips. Find out who's closest by joining a local club, of which there are a bunch in Toronto, listed at: http://www.ccfms.ca/Online_Resources/canada_clubs.htm#ONTARIO I'm fairly sure none of them have summer meetings, but some have an extensive field trip schedule so if that interests you get in touch with them asap. Lastly, a great way to find dealers is at gem and mineral shows. The Bancroft Gemboree is at the end of July; Scarborough is in Sept/Oct?, London in November, etc. Cheers, Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Pleasure: http://www.ontariominerals.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jennifer Wolfe" To: Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 10:16 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary rough and supplies in Ontario > Hi I'm new to the site and have been pouring over each email trying to > soak in as much information as possible. > > I've just purchased a Genie grinder that I'm hoping to use to make some > lovely cabs from my ever growing collection of rocks. My problem is that > my collection is from everywhere else but where I live. Does anyone know > of a local supplier in the Toronto/ Southern Ontario area that I can > purchase lapidary supplies from? It seems silly with the population we > have around here that I can't find anything. Anything I have found online > seems to have gone under! I had to order stuff from Calgary just so I > could use my saw! Any help would be most appreciated! > > Jenn the newbie! From Lapidry at aol.com Fri Jul 4 10:20:42 2008 From: Lapidry at aol.com (Lapidry@aol.com) Date: Fri Jul 4 10:20:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary rough and supplies in Ontario Message-ID: Jenn: You and I are in basically the same category, since I live near Rochester, NY. We live in an area that doesn't produce much lapidary material. As a result, there are far fewer people involved in lapidary in this area than in areas with raw material that can be collected, such as the west coast. Supply follows demand and the number of dealers has dropped significantly in the last couple decades. Best bet has really become eBay. Next best bet is to go to your local shows and hope to run across a couple dealers who are still carting at least some of that heavy rough around with them to shows and hope it hasn't been picked over for the last 30 years. The only relatively new lapidary dealer in our immediate area in the last decade or so does the vast majority of his business over eBay. As such, he has a lot of great material because he's always getting new stuff in. His name is Vaughn Nagle and he lives in Adams Basin, NY and sells very extensively on eBay. He does, however, allow people to come to his very large shop, by appointment, to select stuff in person. I don't have his e-mail off hand but know someone I can get it from if you are interested in a road trip across the border. He's about 60 miles from the border at Niagara Falls. Vaughn doesn't do shows. I have no financial interest in Vaughn's business so this isn't an ad for him, just a recommendation. His selection is very good and his prices tend to be reasonable, plus he's a great guy to work with. Let me know if you need his e-mail or have any questions.... Dan In a message dated 7/4/2008 10:17:16 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jwolfe_3@yahoo.com writes: Hi I'm new to the site and have been pouring over each email trying to soak in as much information as possible. I've just purchased a Genie grinder that I'm hoping to use to make some lovely cabs from my ever growing collection of rocks. My problem is that my collection is from everywhere else but where I live. Does anyone know of a local supplier in the Toronto/ Southern Ontario area that I can purchase lapidary supplies from? It seems silly with the population we have around here that I can't find anything. Anything I have found online seems to have gone under! I had to order stuff from Calgary just so I could use my saw! Any help would be most appreciated! Jenn the newbie! __________________________________________________________________ Looking for the perfect gift? Give the gift of Flickr! http://www.flickr.com/gift/ -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 4 21:57:54 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 4 21:59:40 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Do you have any Rare Earth minerals in your collection? Message-ID: The media focuses on oil today, but mining is still important to our current way of life. The electronics industry is based on rare earth doping of silicon to make computers, TVs, and the internet possible. Some people are paying attention and note that we are running out of supplies of the rare earth minerals that make our current technology possible. Some estimates say we will run out within ten years... http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0806/ref.shtml If you don't have any rare earth minerals in your collection, you might want to look for some now, before they become unaffordable. Kreigh From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 4 22:46:33 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 4 22:46:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] More fun with NaCO3 crystals... In-Reply-To: <486E130F.9010607@hal-pc.org> Message-ID: You may get better results if you make your saturated solution in one container, with some excess, and pour most of the saturated solution into a second container, before adding your seed crystal. Kreigh On Friday, Jul 4, 2008, at 08:09 America/Detroit, jbacko wrote: > Brett Allen Johnson wrote: >> jbacko, so what you are saying is to make a super saturated solution >> of NaCO3+H2O and let evaporate to grow well formed crystals? Is this >> like growing epsom crystals? I will give it a go and report back >> after I get some success. Thanks, Brett >> ps. Do you have any other mixture/growing tips you would like to >> share with the Group? >> >> > The main things to do are: > > 1. Use a very clean glass jar (like a mayonnaise or Ball canning > jar). > > 2. Use clean and soft water; distilled water is easily available. > > 3, Saturate your solution with a moderately warm but not hot > temperature (~150-160 F.) It doesn't hurt to boil the solution but > that tends to put too much material in solution and make it a bit > unstable for large xtal growth. Make certain that ALL of the material > is dissolved. > > 4. Cover the solution such that evaporation can take place but NO > dust particles can get into the jar. > > 5. Put the jar in a dark, quiet place and let it sit until it does > it's thing. Don't be in too much of a hurry to find out what is going > on; any disturbance will cause rapid growth of small crystals. This > may occur despite your best efforts. > > 6. After a week or two, you should have some nice crystals. Try it > first with copper sulfate as it is very easy to grow into large > crystals. Then repeat the operation using one of the larger crystals > as a seed, It has to be large enough to not completely dissolve in the > warm water solution. Be absolutely certain that all of the material > except your seed is in solution. After a few days you should have one > (or a few) large xtal(s). > > 7. Your results will vary according to the materials and > conditions. If you live next to a railroad or airport, for instance, > you are probably going to get a lot of periodic vibration, which is > not good. > > 8. Copper Sulfate is available at place like pool or septic > suppliers as it is used as an algaecide. Sometimes one can find > relatively pure iron sulfate as a soil conditioner. Epsom salts is at > the pharmacy (and sometimes small quantities of U.S.P. copper > sulfate). Nitrates can be found in quick-dissolving fertilizers, but > they are usually too mixed up and of too poor a quality to be of much > use. Nonetheless, one can "refine" them by successive evaporation and > fractional separation. Nickel Sulfate will have to come from a > chemical supply house as far as I know. Sodium Thiosulfate used to be > commonly available as a photographic fixer, but silver-based > photography is rapidly disappearing and it may be tough to find. It > can be grown as relatively large crystals if the solution is not too > hot or too strong to begin with; once it supersaturates, any shock > will crystallize the whole mass as fine crystals (as mentioned above). > Washing Soda, Bicarbonate of Soda, and Borax are all at your local > supermarket. Washing Soda does not work well with seed crystals; > usually one gets a mass of relatively large interlocking "stepped" > crystals no matter what one does. Agricultural sulfur can be dissolved > in something like toluene and crystallized, but it is not an operation > for the careless or foolhardy. > > 9. Sources? When I was young, we could write away to all the > advertisers in Chemical and Engineering News for samples; I filled up > a whole basement lab that way. I don't think that is allowed anymore. > Nuts! I guess your local high-school or college chemistry teacher is > as good a source of info on where to get things as any. > > 10. Have fun. Crystals are neat! (At least Nature thinks so.) > > > > john > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From jabac at hal-pc.org Sat Jul 5 02:00:35 2008 From: jabac at hal-pc.org (jbacko) Date: Sat Jul 5 02:01:30 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] More fun with NaCO3 crystals... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <486F3833.3090603@hal-pc.org> Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > You may get better results if you make your saturated solution in one > container, with some excess, and pour most of the saturated solution > into a second container, before adding your seed crystal. > > Kreigh > Yes, but watch out! It is very easy to spill some micro crystals into the stock and ruin the effect. I have found it is usually better to make a nearly saturated solution that is clearly fully dissolved, and let natural evaporation take care of the rest. It takes a lot longer but the results are usually better. It is nice to have a seed crystal in most cases, but having one that has grown in the first batch that is clean and single is better as a source than the original powder, especially if the quality is N.F. or less. But the best thing is to try everything and see what works. Most materials are cheap and easily worked with, and fun. The kids like it all except that they are a bit impatient for results. Growing things in water glass is the best introduction for them. And don't forget making sugar crystals on a string. They are actually very interesting as they occur in both right and left hand versions (as, dextrose and levulose). Pasteur discovered that while working with grape sugars. I suppose one can get dextrose at a pharmacy. Levulose is in fructose. A challenge is to grow large sugar crystals from maple syrup or molasses, and determine which kind they are. Try researching right and left-handed crystals in common substances. You can start with quartz. john From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 5 12:00:48 2008 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Sat Jul 5 12:00:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Microminerals and supplies from Sauktown Sales Message-ID: <672387.52746.qm@web34305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> A new list will be posted later today on www.sauktown.com This month's list includes barahonaite-(Al) (too new for Fleischer 2008!)?and natropharmacosiderite from Gold Hill, Utah, pickeringite from the type locality in Chile and on the Dryer list Cuzticite from Moctezuma, Mexico, the type locality. With regard to supplies, there's good news and bad news. The good news is that we can now supply "tack", a new kind that's not quite as sticky as the blue stuff and is easier to remove. The bad news is that the price of plastic micromount boxes has increased, due to drastic increases in the price of polystyrene resin. The new prices are: 28 cents for black bottom/clear top, 24 cents for other configurations. Jim Daly Sauktown Sales www.sauktown.com orders@sauktown.com ? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tjokela at execulink.com Sat Jul 5 15:36:45 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Sat Jul 5 15:36:44 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Do you have any Rare Earth minerals in your collection? References: Message-ID: <002301c8deef$9b0e6120$6600a8c0@Junior> Bah, rare earths are neither rare nor are they earths. The doomsday folks have been making all sorts of claims about what we're going to run out of in the next ten years. Same old baloney. T ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Saturday, July 05, 2008 12:57 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Do you have any Rare Earth minerals in your collection? > The media focuses on oil today, but mining is still important to our > current way of life. The electronics industry is based on rare earth > doping of silicon to make computers, TVs, and the internet possible. > > Some people are paying attention and note that we are running out of > supplies of the rare earth minerals that make our current technology > possible. Some estimates say we will run out within ten years... > > http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0806/ref.shtml > > If you don't have any rare earth minerals in your collection, you might > want to look for some now, before they become unaffordable. > > Kreigh > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From brenick at gmail.com Sun Jul 6 06:53:19 2008 From: brenick at gmail.com (Brenda Van Dyke) Date: Sun Jul 6 06:53:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! In-Reply-To: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <97175ae90807060653u44dd96cft2f65d4216bf387cc@mail.gmail.com> I say "wow" too! I am very new to computer stuff compared to you guys, (only a half dozen or so) and was able to do a quick (kinda :o) page to try on our club website... http://www.indianmoundsrockclub.com/images/NickBrenda/gallery.html Nothing like your page Tom, but for a semi-beginner, and not without a few trial-and-errors, I like it! And am looking forward to using it for our club and myself! Thanks for sharing the info! Brenda, Indian Mounds Rock & Mineral Club www.indianmoundsrockclub.com On Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 1:28 PM, Bob Loeffler wrote: > Wow!!!!! Amazing!!!! That is the best plugin EVER! I'm a computer guy > (for the last 25 years) and I've never seen a piece of software this cool. > Oh, and nice specimens, Tom. :-) > > One other feature I noticed is that you can zoom in and out from the wall > if > you have a "scroll wheel" on your mouse. Scroll it forward and you "move > closer" to the wall; scroll it back and you "move further away" from the > wall. > > And it looks like they support all of the major web browers. Very cool! > Thanks for telling us about it, Tom! > > Bob > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tom Corson > Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2008 8:28 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! > > Hi, > > Having spent so many years in high tech, I don't impress easily when it > comes to new software "gizmos", but this is simply a "must see" and I > wanted > to share it with all of you. > > I discovered this browser plug-in called PicLens which allows me to design > a > web page which can display a collection of images as a virtual 3D image > wall > (you can literally "walk" down it!). > > So I put together a page containing a photo of each of the specimens I have > online using this technology. > > Here is the link: > http://infodyn.dyndns.org:8880/store/pl_images.html > > Now, to see the 3d image wall, you need to download and install the PicLens > plug-in, otherwise all you will see is a traditional type slideshow and not > the really cool stuff. > > Here are the instructions: > > 1) Load the above web page. > 2) Click on the link which says "get the PicLens plugin" and install it > (it's simple and easy). > 3) Restart your browser and reload the above page. > 4) Click on the link which says "Start Slide Show". > 5) You will now see the entire collection as a draggable 3d image wall. > Each > specimen can be zoomed in by clicking it with the mouse. You can drag with > the mouse to "walk" down the wall. > > This is one of the coolest things I've seen in a long time. I hope you > enjoy > it! > > Cheers, > TC > ________________________________ > > Thomas W. Corson OBG International > corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive > 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 > http://www.obgrocks.com > World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors > ________________________________ > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rower at start.no Sun Jul 6 14:36:16 2008 From: rower at start.no (Ronald Werner) Date: Sun Jul 6 14:36:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - Message-ID: <12711.1215380176@start.no> Sorry Kreigh, but some correction is needed here! REE are to my best knowledge NOT used for doping semiconductors. That's the privilige of the group III and V elements. Tim is of course absolutely right: REE's are not rare at all! They are rather abundant, though concentrated in economic quantities in a limited number of deposits only. China seems to have most of the reserves, but the Mountain Pass deposit in California is a major reserve base for the US. No, we won't run out of REE's in ten years. It will take much, much longer, and before that we will have run out of many other elements. REE's are of strategical importance in numerous high-tech and defence applications. Also in our daily life we have become rather dependant on these phantastically interesting metals. Especially in optical and magnetical applications they are of great importance. Yes, REE's are boring by appearance, and early scientists had good reasons to call them "rare earths". The mixtures of oxides early scientists managed to prepare were typically earth-like brownish. The pure oxides of some are actually quite nice, cerium-oxide being nice yellowish and neodymium-oxide light pink. I guess modern purists would gladly get rid of such ancient terms like REE's and would rather speak of the lanthanides, thereby excluding yttrium, and technically seen also lutetium. I am more a romanticus and will always speak of the REE's and include yttrium and lutetium, and will even mention scandium as being rather close to the family. Good samples of the classic REE's minerals -aeschynite, euxenite, fergusonite, polycrase etc.- from norwegian deposits have already become expensive and hard to find. Samples of the REE-containing minerals that constitute present day ore are as far as I know basically without any significance for collectors. I believe the Mountain Pass ore consists mainly of corns of bastn?site. Anyone who has ever seen a good crystal, please DO correct me! Regards, Ronald Werner Norway ------------------------------------------------------------------------- F? din egen, gratis e-postadresse p? Start.no From jr50wv at yahoo.com Sun Jul 6 14:47:16 2008 From: jr50wv at yahoo.com (J. R. Hodel) Date: Sun Jul 6 14:47:20 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] fossil ID Request Message-ID: <849608.53878.qm@web56304.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Hi: A friend at work found a nice chert in her driveway with a little vug and a (probably marine) fossil in it.? If you look at the rock with a 10x loupe you can see numerous micro-fossils in the chert.? I'm not much of a fossil guy, but I know there are several on the list.? She was thinking an archimedes of some sort, but I think the layers are too close for that, the best archimedes I've seen were about a twist each 1 or 2 cm or thereabouts, this has a layer each mm or close to it. I have a pretty good 60mm Micro Nikkor lens, and took a reasonable picture of it, which I've reduced to a 98k file for emailing.? If anyone wants a look, let me know your email.? Given that this driveway is in Charleston, WV, I expect the crushed stone on it came from somewhere on the Ohio River, as most of the aggregate around here is from Shamblin Stone, and they have all their rock barged in. Thanks in advance! JR in WV --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From corson at infodyn.com Sun Jul 6 19:26:42 2008 From: corson at infodyn.com (Tom Corson) Date: Sun Jul 6 19:27:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! In-Reply-To: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: Very nice job, Brenda! The page looks great. Using PicLens sure "spices up" the presentation... TC ________________________________ Thomas W. Corson OBG International corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 http://www.obgrocks.com World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors ________________________________ > -----Original Message----- > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 09:53:19 -0400 > From: "Brenda Van Dyke" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > <97175ae90807060653u44dd96cft2f65d4216bf387cc@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > I say "wow" too! > > I am very new to computer stuff compared to you guys, (only a > half dozen or > so) and was able to do a quick (kinda :o) page to try on our > club website... > http://www.indianmoundsrockclub.com/images/NickBrenda/gallery.html > > Nothing like your page Tom, but for a semi-beginner, and not > without a few trial-and-errors, I like it! And am looking > forward to using it for our club and myself! > > Thanks for sharing the info! > Brenda, > Indian Mounds Rock & Mineral Club > www.indianmoundsrockclub.com > > > > > > From magnet at crocoite.com Sun Jul 6 20:33:55 2008 From: magnet at crocoite.com (=?iso-8859-1?Q?magnet?=) Date: Sun Jul 6 20:34:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Sixth Issue of Australian & New Zealand Mineral Collector Magazine Out Now... Message-ID: <20080707033355.8544.qmail@webmachine101.com> Hi all The sixth issue of the Australian and New Zealand Mineral Collector magazine is now out. This issue contains articles on plumbian orthoclase from Broken Hill, a report on the 2008 Gemboree, the Biggenden Mine, Queensland, Henderson's Quarry, New Zealand, and more. It is full colour, 28 pages, and only $10US available from Lulu - http://www.lulu.com/smartarts For those not in the US, if you are going to order a copy directly, can I suggest that you use the 'Standard' option for shipping. It is by far most economical, and usually arrives within a couple of weeks. Regards Steve Check out Steve's Spot at http://crocoite.blogspot.com/ This year's Australasian Mineral Society Seminar is in Tasmania Check details here --> http://www.tasmanianlapidary.org.au/jamss2008.htm From rain1950 at gmail.com Mon Jul 7 08:54:05 2008 From: rain1950 at gmail.com (Dave Bese) Date: Mon Jul 7 08:56:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Dave sent you a friend request on Tagged :) Message-ID: <200807071554.m67Fs5Jp023310@bubbleator.drizzle.com> If you can't see this email please click here Dave Bese Dave Bese has added you as a friend Is Dave your friend? Click Yes if Dave is your friend, otherwise click No.But you have to click! Please respond or Dave may think you said no :( Click here to block all emails from Tagged Inc., 110 Pacific Mall Box #117, San Francisco, CA. 94111 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- text/html (html body -- converted) --- From brenick at gmail.com Mon Jul 7 08:54:25 2008 From: brenick at gmail.com (Brenda Van Dyke) Date: Mon Jul 7 08:56:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! In-Reply-To: References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Tom...long way to go, but it looks like fun to get there! BTW if I had any doubts about moving from Internet Explorer to Firefox, I don't anymore. I don't know if it is anything that I am doing (or not doing) but I sure like the way PicLens work with Firefox compared with IE. Brenda On 7/6/08, Tom Corson wrote: > > Very nice job, Brenda! The page looks great. > > Using PicLens sure "spices up" the presentation... > > TC > > ________________________________ > > Thomas W. Corson OBG International > corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive > 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 > http://www.obgrocks.com > World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors > ________________________________ > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > Message: 1 > > Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 09:53:19 -0400 > > From: "Brenda Van Dyke" > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] A new approach to displaying mineral photos! > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors" > > Message-ID: > > <97175ae90807060653u44dd96cft2f65d4216bf387cc@mail.gmail.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > > I say "wow" too! > > > > I am very new to computer stuff compared to you guys, (only a > > half dozen or > > so) and was able to do a quick (kinda :o) page to try on our > > club website... > > http://www.indianmoundsrockclub.com/images/NickBrenda/gallery.html > > > > Nothing like your page Tom, but for a semi-beginner, and not > > without a few trial-and-errors, I like it! And am looking > > forward to using it for our club and myself! > > > > Thanks for sharing the info! > > Brenda, > > Indian Mounds Rock & Mineral Club > > www.indianmoundsrockclub.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Mon Jul 7 09:02:08 2008 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Mon Jul 7 09:03:43 2008 Subject: [ADMIN]Re: [Rockhounds] Dave sent you a friend request on Tagged :) References: <200807071554.m67Fs5Jp023310@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <2827C692DFC84ADAABC4C193F0E5A5AB@Notebook> List, We're sending a message to Dave about this. Consider it handled. John Siebel Admin Team ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Bese" To: Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 8:54 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] Dave sent you a friend request on Tagged :) From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Mon Jul 7 11:17:02 2008 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Mon Jul 7 11:17:14 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> Not rockhound... But there sure a bunch of clever folks here. One of my glass buddies is looking for a moisture sensor that will operate inside of a 2000F kiln. Here's the application: she creates molds out of a plaster/silica/gunk mix that contains water. She's got that inside a kiln along with a load of glass that will eventually fill the kiln. An electronic controller controls (what else would a controller do, eh?) the time & temperature of the kiln. In this case, she wants to heat the kiln and have it sit at, say, 1000F until the moisture in the mold bakes out. When that happens, the moisture in the air inside the kiln should drop. When that drop occurs the kiln resumes heating up to the full melt temperature. The fly in the ointment is finding a moisture sensor that can survive 2000F. Any suggestions? GcB From rik.dillen at skynet.be Mon Jul 7 11:34:36 2008 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Mon Jul 7 11:34:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - In-Reply-To: <12711.1215380176@start.no> References: <12711.1215380176@start.no> Message-ID: <000d01c8e060$1be73a80$53b5af80$@dillen@skynet.be> REE are even used in some very special steel qualities nowadays. One of the purposes is to use it as a scavenger for sulfur. Manganese is used for that traditionally, but MnS has in some steel grades the tendency to form large flaky pancake-like structures underneath the steel skin, which, in certain cases/circumstances might give rise to flake formation. Cerium sulfide on the contrary forms very small, hard spherical precipitates instead, which improves steel quality. The big drawback is the price, of course (in the steel industry they don't need grams, but many tons). Grts, Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, ?B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Ronald Werner Sent: Sunday, July 06, 2008 11:36 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - Sorry Kreigh, but some correction is needed here! REE are to my best knowledge NOT used for doping semiconductors. That's the privilige of the group III and V elements. Tim is of course absolutely right: REE's are not rare at all! They are rather abundant, though concentrated in economic quantities in a limited number of deposits only. China seems to have most of the reserves, but the Mountain Pass deposit in California is a major reserve base for the US. No, we won't run out of REE's in ten years. It will take much, much longer, and before that we will have run out of many other elements. REE's are of strategical importance in numerous high-tech and defence applications. Also in our daily life we have become rather dependant on these phantastically interesting metals. Especially in optical and magnetical applications they are of great importance. Yes, REE's are boring by appearance, and early scientists had good reasons to call them "rare earths". The mixtures of oxides early scientists managed to prepare were typically earth-like brownish. The pure oxides of some are actually quite nice, cerium-oxide being nice yellowish and neodymium-oxide light pink. I guess modern purists would gladly get rid of such ancient terms like REE's and would rather speak of the lanthanides, thereby excluding yttrium, and technically seen also lutetium. I am more a romanticus and will always speak of the REE's and include yttrium and lutetium, and will even mention scandium as being rather close to the family. Good samples of the classic REE's minerals -aeschynite, euxenite, fergusonite, polycrase etc.- from norwegian deposits have already become expensive and hard to find. Samples of the REE-containing minerals that constitute present day ore are as far as I know basically without any significance for collectors. I believe the Mountain Pass ore consists mainly of corns of bastn?site. Anyone who has ever seen a good crystal, please DO correct me! Regards, Ronald Werner Norway ------------------------------------------------------------------------- F? din egen, gratis e-postadresse p? Start.no -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Jul 7 12:51:51 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Jul 7 12:53:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - In-Reply-To: <000d01c8e060$1be73a80$53b5af80$@dillen@skynet.be> References: <12711.1215380176@start.no> <000d01c8e060$1be73a80$53b5af80$@dillen@skynet.be> Message-ID: <005001c8e06a$e64efab0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Indeed my friend! Cerium is also a good replacement for Mn2+ in fluorescent calcite... The so-called Terlingua Type Calcite. Beautiful pink fluorescence under LW-UV. Greetzzzz Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Rik Dillen > Verzonden: maandag 7 juli 2008 19:35 > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors' > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] REE - > > REE are even used in some very special steel qualities nowadays. > One of the purposes is to use it as a scavenger for sulfur. > Manganese is used for that traditionally, but MnS has in some > steel grades the tendency to form large flaky pancake-like > structures underneath the steel skin, which, in certain > cases/circumstances might give rise to flake formation. > Cerium sulfide on the contrary forms very small, hard > spherical precipitates instead, which improves steel quality. > The big drawback is the price, of course (in the steel > industry they don't need grams, but many tons). > > Grts, > > Rik DILLEN > Doornstraat 15, ?B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail > rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Ronald Werner > Sent: Sunday, July 06, 2008 11:36 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - > > Sorry Kreigh, but some correction is needed here! > > REE are to my best knowledge NOT used for doping > semiconductors. That's the privilige of the group III and V elements. > > Tim is of course absolutely right: REE's are not rare at all! > They are rather abundant, though concentrated in economic > quantities in a limited number of deposits only. > > China seems to have most of the reserves, but the Mountain > Pass deposit in California is a major reserve base for the US. > > No, we won't run out of REE's in ten years. It will take > much, much longer, and before that we will have run out of > many other elements. > > REE's are of strategical importance in numerous high-tech and > defence applications. > > Also in our daily life we have become rather dependant on > these phantastically interesting metals. Especially in > optical and magnetical applications they are of great importance. > > Yes, REE's are boring by appearance, and early scientists had > good reasons to call them "rare earths". The mixtures of > oxides early scientists managed to prepare were typically > earth-like brownish. > > The pure oxides of some are actually quite nice, cerium-oxide > being nice yellowish and neodymium-oxide light pink. > > I guess modern purists would gladly get rid of such ancient > terms like REE's and would rather speak of the lanthanides, > thereby excluding yttrium, and technically seen also lutetium. > > I am more a romanticus and will always speak of the REE's and > include yttrium and lutetium, and will even mention scandium > as being rather close to the family. > > Good samples of the classic REE's minerals -aeschynite, > euxenite, fergusonite, polycrase etc.- from norwegian > deposits have already become expensive and hard to find. > > Samples of the REE-containing minerals that constitute > present day ore are as far as I know basically without any > significance for collectors. I believe the Mountain Pass ore > consists mainly of corns of bastn?site. Anyone who has ever > seen a good crystal, please DO correct me! > > Regards, > > Ronald Werner > Norway > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ----------- > F? din egen, gratis e-postadresse p? Start.no > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Paintricks at aol.com Mon Jul 7 14:25:12 2008 From: Paintricks at aol.com (Paintricks@aol.com) Date: Mon Jul 7 14:25:23 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? Message-ID: Hi there, I recently have become interested and am learning how to refine my gold and scrap metal. I'm looking for the best ways to refine out the copper and leads out of the final end steps. What are the safest ways without noxious chemicals with my heated bucket foundry? Would it be possible to crush up the tailing pile material off the old gold mines here in the area and at least get some amounts of gold from it? I'm finding Phonolite with Fluorite, galena, some Copper, Sphalerite and pyrite. Gold has to be in there somewhere. The gold mines here are going through the old tailings from the gold rush and producing values out of it. This stuff sure has all the characteristics of gold values. It would be fun to at least try to refine some of it in small amounts to see what comes out of it. Kind of a mad scientist approach at it. Thanks, Kevin **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Jul 7 16:26:30 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Jul 7 16:26:40 2008 Subject: OT: Re: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: <004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: <20D39AE3-4C7C-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> A quick Google search turned up... http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/els/09254005/1995/00000025/ 00000001/art85155 Abstract: A high-temperature humidity sensor for use in ambient atmospheres has been developed, the first in industry, using a limiting-current zirconia solid-electrolyte planar oxygen sensor. We have now developed a multisensor capable of measuring both the humidity and oxygen content simultaneously by further improving the features of the planar electrode configuration of this high-temperature humidity sensor. In considering the application of this sensor to direct firing or combustion systems, we have investigated the individual effects of concentration of O2, CO2, CO, and Noitx upon the water vapor pressure measurements. As a result, we find that the oxygen concentration has the most effect, and also that, in parallel with theoretical studies, approximately correct water vapor pressure measurements can be obtained when the data are compensated with respect to the oxygen concentration. We shall also report the effects of CO2, CO, and NOitx, We verify that practical high-temperature humidity sensors can be realized for use in direct firing systems by using this multisensor. ... I also note from my search that lumber kilns use microwave based moisture sensors that don't have to be inside the kiln -- they only need a window into the kiln or exhaust stack. Perhaps one of them could be adapted. Kreigh On Monday, Jul 7, 2008, at 14:17 America/Detroit, Gary Brown wrote: > Not rockhound... But there sure a bunch of clever folks here. > > One of my glass buddies is looking for a moisture sensor that will > operate > inside of a 2000F kiln. Here's the application: she creates molds > out of a > plaster/silica/gunk mix that contains water. She's got that inside a > kiln > along with a load of glass that will eventually fill the kiln. An > electronic controller controls (what else would a controller do, eh?) > the > time & temperature of the kiln. In this case, she wants to heat the > kiln > and have it sit at, say, 1000F until the moisture in the mold bakes > out. > When that happens, the moisture in the air inside the kiln should drop. > When that drop occurs the kiln resumes heating up to the full melt > temperature. > > The fly in the ointment is finding a moisture sensor that can survive > 2000F. > Any suggestions? > > GcB > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Jul 7 19:28:48 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Jul 7 19:28:55 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <9889B6D4-4C95-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Kevin, It is not that difficult to make a home smelter that can process a pail of crushed ore and give you bloom, or maybe a batch of molten metal and slag, depending on the metal/ore. A length of large diameter pipe (sheet metal will do), a large and small cardboard tube, some firebrick cement, some clay, a canister vacuum for tuyres, a flux, and some charcoal or coke. Plans are readily available if you do a little searching (online or at your library). A small kiln/smelter can also process scrap metal and give you molten metal you can cast. This is a lot more friendly to the environment, and much easier to do. Your neighbors, and the EPA, may object to your smelting ore, but they probably won't object to you occasionally melting scrap in small volumes (unless it contains lead) for casting. I made a smelter over 30 years ago that could process around a half gallon or ore, and smelted several batches of iron in my backyard. It was one of those mad scientist things, just to be able to say I had done it. I had a blast melting hematite (it took a carbon arc to boil asbestos -- I was in a melting phase). The problem that arises is when your ore is not a single mineral and you end up with an alloy of several metals in your ingot. If you are really lucky the different metals will separate and harden in layers that can be split. You might want to gravity separate your crushed ore and do multiple batches. Lead can be removed from a bloom with a cupellation hearth. Watch out for the nasty fumes. Add some charcoal on top as you need a reducing atmosphere. Silver and gold are often recovered by dissolving the remaining base metals with acids, and chemically processing the residue to separate the silver from the gold. You could do it yourself, but it may be more cost effective to sell any mixed metal ingots to a precious metals recovery firm. You might be surprised how profitable recycling metals (even scrap iron from dead appliances and pipes) is. Unless you have a _LOT_ of ore/tailings, I would suggest you would come out ahead selling good specimens of the ore/tailings available to you . . . but it is a _LOT_ of Fun to smelt a batch of ore and get metal. Kreigh On Monday, Jul 7, 2008, at 17:25 America/Detroit, Paintricks@aol.com wrote: > Hi there, > I recently have become interested and am learning how to refine my > gold > and scrap metal. I'm looking for the best ways to refine out the > copper and > leads out of the final end steps. What are the safest ways without > noxious > chemicals with my heated bucket foundry? > Would it be possible to crush up the tailing pile material off the > old > gold mines here in the area and at least get some amounts of gold from > it? I'm > finding Phonolite with Fluorite, galena, some Copper, Sphalerite and > pyrite. > Gold has to be in there somewhere. The gold mines here are going > through > the old tailings from the gold rush and producing values out of it. > This stuff > sure has all the characteristics of gold values. It would be fun to > at > least try to refine some of it in small amounts to see what comes out > of it. > Kind of a mad scientist approach at it. > Thanks, > Kevin > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > fuel-efficient used cars. > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From cycadwood at aol.com Mon Jul 7 21:11:56 2008 From: cycadwood at aol.com (Frank Daniels) Date: Mon Jul 7 21:12:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer Message-ID: <000501c8e0b0$c37d64e0$4a782ea0$@com> Does anyone know where I can get some mist killer? Thanks, Frank PS Mist killer is a thick fluid one adds to oil in a rock saw to keep it from misting excessively. Frank Daniels Minerals & Fossils 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81507 minerals@frankdanielsminerals.com www.frankdanielsminerals.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Mon Jul 7 21:25:03 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Mon Jul 7 21:25:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - In-Reply-To: <005001c8e06a$e64efab0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <12711.1215380176@start.no> <000d01c8e060$1be73a80$53b5af80$@dillen@skynet.be> <005001c8e06a$e64efab0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: Why "so-called"? Isn't Terlingua a real locality? Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > From: axel.emmermann@pandora.be> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] REE - > Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:51:51 +0200> > Indeed my friend!> Cerium is also a good replacement for Mn2+ in fluorescent calcite... The> so-called Terlingua Type Calcite.> Beautiful pink fluorescence under LW-UV.> > Greetzzzz > Axel> > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----> > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Rik Dillen> > Verzonden: maandag 7 juli 2008 19:35> > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors'> > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] REE - > > > > REE are even used in some very special steel qualities nowadays.> > One of the purposes is to use it as a scavenger for sulfur. > > Manganese is used for that traditionally, but MnS has in some > > steel grades the tendency to form large flaky pancake-like > > structures underneath the steel skin, which, in certain > > cases/circumstances might give rise to flake formation. > > Cerium sulfide on the contrary forms very small, hard > > spherical precipitates instead, which improves steel quality. > > The big drawback is the price, of course (in the steel > > industry they don't need grams, but many tons).> > > > Grts,> > > > Rik DILLEN> > Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail > > rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > > Ronald Werner> > Sent: Sunday, July 06, 2008 11:36 PM> > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - > > > > Sorry Kreigh, but some correction is needed here!> > > > REE are to my best knowledge NOT used for doping > > semiconductors. That's the privilige of the group III and V elements.> > > > Tim is of course absolutely right: REE's are not rare at all! > > They are rather abundant, though concentrated in economic > > quantities in a limited number of deposits only. > > > > China seems to have most of the reserves, but the Mountain > > Pass deposit in California is a major reserve base for the US.> > > > No, we won't run out of REE's in ten years. It will take > > much, much longer, and before that we will have run out of > > many other elements.> > > > REE's are of strategical importance in numerous high-tech and > > defence applications. > > > > Also in our daily life we have become rather dependant on > > these phantastically interesting metals. Especially in > > optical and magnetical applications they are of great importance.> > > > Yes, REE's are boring by appearance, and early scientists had > > good reasons to call them "rare earths". The mixtures of > > oxides early scientists managed to prepare were typically > > earth-like brownish.> > > > The pure oxides of some are actually quite nice, cerium-oxide > > being nice yellowish and neodymium-oxide light pink. > > > > I guess modern purists would gladly get rid of such ancient > > terms like REE's and would rather speak of the lanthanides, > > thereby excluding yttrium, and technically seen also lutetium.> > > > I am more a romanticus and will always speak of the REE's and > > include yttrium and lutetium, and will even mention scandium > > as being rather close to the family.> > > > Good samples of the classic REE's minerals -aeschynite, > > euxenite, fergusonite, polycrase etc.- from norwegian > > deposits have already become expensive and hard to find.> > > > Samples of the REE-containing minerals that constitute > > present day ore are as far as I know basically without any > > significance for collectors. I believe the Mountain Pass ore > > consists mainly of corns of bastn?site. Anyone who has ever > > seen a good crystal, please DO correct me!> > > > Regards,> > > > Ronald Werner> > Norway> > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------> > -----------> > F? din egen, gratis e-postadresse p? Start.no> > > > --> > _______________________________________________> > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> > > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________> > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> > > > > -- > _______________________________________________> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> Subscription Services:> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 8 03:19:00 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 8 03:19:01 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - In-Reply-To: References: <12711.1215380176@start.no><000d01c8e060$1be73a80$53b5af80$@dillen@skynet.be> <005001c8e06a$e64efab0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <000f01c8e0e4$0a36d4b0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Yes but Terlingua is no longer an active locality, I was told. There are however many localities that produce calcite with a similar fluorescence... The "so-called" Terlingua-Type calcites? ;-))) We even find spots of REE-activated calcite in quarries in Belgian karst areas. If I remember correctly it 's cerium(/lead?) + manganese/lead that cause the pink fluorescence in long wave UV and cerium =>europium that are responsible for the blue phosphorescence in short wave. Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Glenn Wimpee > Verzonden: dinsdag 8 juli 2008 5:25 > Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] REE - > > Why "so-called"? Isn't Terlingua a real locality? > Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > From: axel.emmermann@pandora.be> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] REE - > Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 21:51:51 > > +0200> > Indeed my friend!> Cerium is also a good > replacement for Mn2+ > > in fluorescent calcite... The> so-called Terlingua Type Calcite.> > > Beautiful pink fluorescence under LW-UV.> > Greetzzzz > Axel> > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----> > Van: > > rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Rik Dillen> > > > Verzonden: maandag 7 juli 2008 19:35> > Aan: > 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > > A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors'> > Onderwerp: RE: > > [Rockhounds] REE - > > > > REE are even used in some very special > > steel qualities nowadays.> > One of the purposes is to use it as a > > scavenger for sulfur. > > Manganese is used for that traditionally, > > but MnS has in some > > steel grades the tendency to form > large flaky > > pancake-like > > structures underneath the steel skin, which, in > > certain > > cases/circumstances might give rise to flake > formation. > > > > Cerium sulfide on the contrary forms very small, hard > > > spherical > > precipitates instead, which improves steel quality. > > The big > > drawback is the price, of course (in the steel > > industry > they don't > > need grams, but many tons).> > > > Grts,> > > > Rik DILLEN> > > > Doornstraat 15, B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail > > > > rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : > http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> > From: > > rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > > > Ronald > > Werner> > Sent: Sunday, July 06, 2008 11:36 PM> > To: > > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Subject: [Rockhounds] REE - > > > > > > Sorry Kreigh, but some correction is needed here!> > > > > REE are to my > > best knowledge NOT used for doping > > semiconductors. That's the > > privilige of the group III and V elements.> > > > Tim is of course > > absolutely right: REE's are not rare at all! > > They are rather > > abundant, though concentrated in economic > > quantities in > a limited > > number of deposits only. > > > > China seems to have most of the > > reserves, but the Mountain > > Pass deposit in California > is a major > > reserve base for the US.> > > > No, we won't run out of > REE's in ten > > years. It will take > > much, much longer, and before that we will > > have run out of > > many other elements.> > > > REE's are of > > strategical importance in numerous high-tech and > > defence > > applications. > > > > Also in our daily life we have become rather > > dependant on > > these phantastically interesting metals. > Especially > > in > > optical and magnetical applications they are of great > > importance.> > > > Yes, REE's are boring by appearance, and early > > scientists had > > good reasons to call them "rare earths". The > > mixtures of > > oxides early scientists managed to prepare were > > typically > > earth-like brownish.> > > > The pure oxides > of some are > > actually quite nice, cerium-oxide > > being nice yellowish and > > neodymium-oxide light pink. > > > > I guess modern purists would > > gladly get rid of such ancient > > terms like REE's and > would rather > > speak of the lanthanides, > > thereby excluding yttrium, and > > technically seen also lutetium.> > > > I am more a > romanticus and will > > always speak of the REE's and > > include yttrium and lutetium, and > > will even mention scandium > > as being rather close to the > family.> > > > > > Good samples of the classic REE's minerals -aeschynite, > > > > euxenite, fergusonite, polycrase etc.- from norwegian > > deposits > > have already become expensive and hard to find.> > > > > Samples of the > > REE-containing minerals that constitute > > present day ore > are as far > > as I know basically without any > > significance for collectors. I > > believe the Mountain Pass ore > > consists mainly of corns of > > bastn?site. Anyone who has ever > > seen a good crystal, please DO > > correct me!> > > > Regards,> > > > Ronald Werner> > Norway> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------> > > > -----------> > F? din egen, gratis e-postadresse p? Start.no> > > > > > --> > _______________________________________________> > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home > > Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> > > > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________> > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home > > Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________> Rockhounds@drizzle > > Mailing List> Subscription Services:> > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> List > Home Page, > > with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From nospam at orerockon.com Tue Jul 8 06:36:46 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Tue Jul 8 06:36:48 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer In-Reply-To: <000501c8e0b0$c37d64e0$4a782ea0$@com> References: <000501c8e0b0$c37d64e0$4a782ea0$@com> Message-ID: <000001c8e0ff$aab6fb20$0024f160$@com> http://www.lacywest.com/catalogs/lacywest.pdf I am sure others sell it as well. I found it by the gallon a couple years ago but I can't find the site. I thought it was GeoTools (in Utah I think) but their site seems to have "gone away" or I am searching for the wrong name. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Frank Daniels Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:12 PM To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer Does anyone know where I can get some mist killer? Thanks, Frank PS Mist killer is a thick fluid one adds to oil in a rock saw to keep it from misting excessively. Frank Daniels Minerals & Fossils 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81507 minerals@frankdanielsminerals.com www.frankdanielsminerals.com Tim Fisher 18403 S Clear Acres Drive Oregon City, OR 97045 NEW PHONE (503) 631-8961 NEW CELL (503) 860-5629 Email address at http://OreRockOn.com From Pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 8 07:28:27 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 07:28:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of the stones... Message-ID: Sure, Terlingua is a "real" locality, whether or not material can currently be collected. I consider Terlingua one of the Great Blank Spots in information about mineral localities. Because, I think, anyone who knew or knows the least thing about where exactly (or even, generally) around Terlingua the fluorescent & phosphorescent calcite is found, has kept their knowledge very private, not wanting anyone else to jump them and collect it there, I don't believe I have ever heard or read anything, about just where (what mines or propsects, or whatever) and in exactly what mode of occurrence, this "classic" calcite is from; nor have I ever read anything at all resembling first-hand collecting stories about it. Please, anyone, correct me if I am wrong, and if such material has ever been written or shared! I think there is less known about the source of the Terlingua calcite, than there used to be about things in "Darkest Africa"! I've read about people visiting Terlingua and collecting calcite, but it has been "common" calcite, not the strongly fluorescent material. In a message dated 7/8/2008 4:19:21 AM Mountain Daylight Time, axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: If I remember correctly it 's cerium(/lead?) + manganese/lead that cause the pink fluorescence in long wave UV and cerium =>europium that are responsible for the blue phosphorescence in short wave. And, Axel, I think you are going beyond anything that is definitely known here. Yes, it has been hypothesized that europium is "probably" the cause of the blue fluorescence and phosphorescence, but that's about it I think, as far as real knowledge. Other minerals that fluoresce due to europium (such as fluorite) fluoresce LW rather than short, and do not phosphoresce; and Mn/Pb produces the common red/orange fl. in calcite, but that's quite unlike the pink LW of Terlingua-type calcite. So I still think everybody is just guessing at this. I know a few people have played around with some research on this, but I don't think anything formal or conclusive has ever been published--again, I'd LOVE to know that I am wrong, and I would love it if anyone could direct us to any actual published articles giving hard data about this type of calcite! keep on rockin' and glowin', Pete **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From sicree at verizon.net Tue Jul 8 08:07:38 2008 From: sicree at verizon.net (Sicree, Andrew, Ph.D.) Date: Tue Jul 8 07:46:44 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] itacolumite / flexible sandstone In-Reply-To: <200807070100.m6710BZB013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: I'm looking for someone selling itacolumite / flexible sandstone. Anyone know a source? I have a guy looking to purchase some. Thanks! Andrew Andrew A. Sicree, Ph.D. From bigred at grantspass.com Tue Jul 8 07:48:09 2008 From: bigred at grantspass.com (Jan Arnold) Date: Tue Jul 8 07:48:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] purple jasper Message-ID: <48737E29.8060906@grantspass.com> Just returned from a trip to Northern Nevada and Southern Eastern Oregon. While there I found two pieces of a deep purple jasper. It was probably not native to the area because both pieces had been shaped into tools. Does anyone have any idea where this purple jasper originates? Jan Arnold From PBarnhill at nc.rr.com Tue Jul 8 07:54:30 2008 From: PBarnhill at nc.rr.com (peggy barnhill) Date: Tue Jul 8 07:55:19 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] itacolumite / flexible sandstone In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <45D43FBE-CD7C-435C-8A86-99CD8C718520@nc.rr.com> Hi Andrew I have a friend that has a number of pieces and is interested in selling. What size do you need? Thanks Peggy On Jul 8, 2008, at 11:07 AM, Sicree, Andrew, Ph.D. wrote: > > I'm looking for someone selling itacolumite / flexible sandstone. > Anyone know a source? > I have a guy looking to purchase some. > > Thanks! > > Andrew > > Andrew A. Sicree, Ph.D. > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 8 10:41:31 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 10:45:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] to Rockhounds List Admin - access problem for Earl Verbeek Message-ID: <8CAAF38FDDD1C18-1264-53B@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Hi, Rockhounds List admin team, I just tried writing to the address given for the Admin Team on the info page about the Rockhounds Listserv (?http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds) which was,? rhladmin@drizzle.com , but?it bounced? back to me, so it looks like that's not a real working address; so, I guess I'll just need to post this to the whole list (sorry to all, just delete please if you ain't the admin gang) to get through. Earl Verbeek wrote to me & said that he's been trying to write a post to the List, but it does not seem to be recognizing him as a member--he's not sure why, or what might have changed to cause this, but he's hoping you can help him, and he asked me to relay his message to you.? He's writing from the address I'll give below, which I assume is the one he has used before with the Listserv, and?following it are Earl's notes about his posting problem.? (I'm going to post to the list, the note about Terlingua calcite that Earl was unsuccessfully trying to post himself.) Thanks--Pete Modreski Earl is writing from:?? everbeek@ptd.net, P.S., Earl's "other" address, but not the one he was trying to post from, is, "Sterling Hill Mining Museum" ? >From Earl: "Within moments of receiving your message from the Rockhounds list I replied to it, but I?ve just received a message that my reply is being held up for the following reason: "Post by a nonmember to a members-only group." Now I certainly am a member, and I was replying to a message that Rockhounds sent to ME, so how can a problem like this arise? I?ve no idea. In any event my original reply is below, now a little late. If you feel it?s worth anything I suppose you could try to pass it along to the Rockhounds group yourself. For the moment I?ve given up." ? "I just got a bounce on my e-mail to the Rockhounds admin group, where I asked them to fix the problem with my messages being held up. Apparently an alleged nonmember can?t contact the admin folks to tell them they?re a member after all ? a perfect Catch-22. So, would you please pass this on to the admin team at Rockhounds for me, so I can become a participating member?" "Cheers- Earl" --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 8 10:45:52 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 10:46:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite In-Reply-To: <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CAAF3999603E7C-1264-5A6@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Dear List, Here's the?comment that Earl Verbeek tried to post to the List earlier today, but couldn't get recognized by the Listserv.---Pete I've had two people tell me that the source of the "real" Terlingua calcite, the blue-fl. SW and pink-fl. LW material, was the Little 38 mine (hope I got the name right), and ONLY that one mine.? Both of them were there and collected the fl. calcite from the dumps of this mine (one when some of the dump material apparently was reprocessed as road aggregate), so they have some firsthand knowledge.? Just passing it on FWIW. ? A somewhat similar problem concerns the "Terlingua-type" calcite from San Saba, Texas.? Is that San Saba the city, or somewhere in San Saba County?? I've never seen the locality given to any useful degree of specificity.? Anyone out there know where this stuff comes from? ? ????????????? Cheers-??? Earl?? (at?? everbeek@ptd.net?? ) ? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Tue Jul 8 11:15:03 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Tue Jul 8 11:16:39 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] How to change your Rockhounds address References: <8CAAF38FDDD1C18-1264-53B@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Message-ID: <007901c8e126$94137890$0600a8c0@Montana> So to the List (and to Earl): When you suddenly seem to have a problem posting to the list, but you're receiving OK, generally what has happened is your default email address (for sending) has changed. You can only post from the address that *receives* the rockhounds email, unless you have a second account set up (as described toward the end of this email). Here is how to find out the address you are signed up with, if you're not sure. In Outlook Express (not sure about other mail programs), to find out the address that mail is coming *to*, right click a rockhounds email, and choose properties. Click the details tab, and scroll down to the very bottom. You'll see "X-Rcpt-To:" and the email address that you are signed up with. In my case, it says "X-Rcpt-To: ". In Earl's case it probably says "everbeek@sterlinghillminingmuseum.org" which is the address he's signed up with. Here is how to change your signup address: Go to this link: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds (included at the bottom of every rockhounds email). Scroll down to the bottom of the page, and enter the email address you found in Outlook in the last form field on the page, and click "Unsubscribe or Edit Options". This will bring you to a page where you can change your email address. Here is how to keep *receiving* email from your old address, but send it on a new one: Sign up for a second account and set your options for the second account to Mail Delivery: Disabled (so you won't get two copies of every email). I'll let Earl decide whether he wants to sign up for a separate account or modify his existing one. Realize that many of you did NOT include your names when you signed up, so if this happens, I have no way of knowing locating your email address - you'll have to find it by examining the headers, as described above. Regarding the RHLAdmin address...I need to get a Google Gmail address for that and post it on the page. That address gets 300-400 Spam emails per day, and about one actual email to it per month. So the bounce that Earl would have gotten from this address would have been "mailbox full". I finally gave up, since mostly you guys contact us using our regular email addresses, anyway. Julie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 10:41 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] to Rockhounds List Admin - access problem for EarlVerbeek Hi, Rockhounds List admin team, I just tried writing to the address given for the Admin Team on the info page about the Rockhounds Listserv ( http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds) which was, rhladmin@drizzle.com , but it bounced back to me, so it looks like that's not a real working address; so, I guess I'll just need to post this to the whole list (sorry to all, just delete please if you ain't the admin gang) to get through. Earl Verbeek wrote to me & said that he's been trying to write a post to the List, but it does not seem to be recognizing him as a member--he's not sure why, or what might have changed to cause this, but he's hoping you can help him, and he asked me to relay his message to you. He's writing from the address I'll give below, which I assume is the one he has used before with the Listserv, and following it are Earl's notes about his posting problem. (I'm going to post to the list, the note about Terlingua calcite that Earl was unsuccessfully trying to post himself.) Thanks--Pete Modreski Earl is writing from: everbeek@ptd.net, P.S., Earl's "other" address, but not the one he was trying to post from, is, "Sterling Hill Mining Museum" >From Earl: "Within moments of receiving your message from the Rockhounds list I replied to it, but I?ve just received a message that my reply is being held up for the following reason: "Post by a nonmember to a members-only group." Now I certainly am a member, and I was replying to a message that Rockhounds sent to ME, so how can a problem like this arise? I?ve no idea. In any event my original reply is below, now a little late. If you feel it?s worth anything I suppose you could try to pass it along to the Rockhounds group yourself. For the moment I?ve given up." "I just got a bounce on my e-mail to the Rockhounds admin group, where I asked them to fix the problem with my messages being held up. Apparently an alleged nonmember can?t contact the admin folks to tell them they?re a member after all ? a perfect Catch-22. So, would you please pass this on to the admin team at Rockhounds for me, so I can become a participating member?" "Cheers- Earl" --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle .com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 8 12:23:06 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 8 12:23:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite In-Reply-To: <8CAAF3999603E7C-1264-5A6@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> <8CAAF3999603E7C-1264-5A6@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Message-ID: <006201c8e130$0cf39930$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Paul Garland has visited the site. I'll CC him. Paul, any two cents on the below message? Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens pmodreski@aol.com > Verzonden: dinsdag 8 juli 2008 18:46 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com; everbeek@ptd.net > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite > > Dear List, > > Here's the?comment that Earl Verbeek tried to post to the > List earlier today, but couldn't get recognized by the > Listserv.---Pete > > > > > I've had two people tell me that the source of the "real" > Terlingua calcite, the blue-fl. SW and pink-fl. LW material, > was the Little 38 mine (hope I got the name right), and ONLY > that one mine.? Both of them were there and collected the fl. > calcite from the dumps of this mine (one when some of the > dump material apparently was reprocessed as road aggregate), > so they have some firsthand knowledge.? Just passing it on FWIW. > > ? > > A somewhat similar problem concerns the "Terlingua-type" > calcite from San Saba, Texas.? Is that San Saba the city, or > somewhere in San Saba County?? I've never seen the locality > given to any useful degree of specificity.? Anyone out there > know where this stuff comes from? > > ? > > ????????????? Cheers-??? Earl?? (at?? everbeek@ptd.net?? ) > > > > > ? > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From jcessna at nist.gov Tue Jul 8 13:03:11 2008 From: jcessna at nist.gov (Jeffrey T. Cessna) Date: Tue Jul 8 13:03:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite In-Reply-To: <006201c8e130$0cf39930$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> <8CAAF3999603E7C-1264-5A6@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> <006201c8e130$0cf39930$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080708155823.0236b3e0@nist.gov> Actually, Paul Garland has entered the Terlingua (Little 38 Mine) site into Google Earth (the stand alone program, for those who are not familiar). I am not sure what layer it is in because I have a lot of them turned on. Out of curiosity I entered Terlingua to see where in TX it was and found Paul's entry about 3 miles to the west of the town. Cheers, Jeff At 03:23 PM 7/8/2008, you wrote: >Paul Garland has visited the site. >I'll CC him. > >Paul, any two cents on the below message? > >Cheers >Axel > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens pmodreski@aol.com > > Verzonden: dinsdag 8 juli 2008 18:46 > > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com; everbeek@ptd.net > > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite > > > > Dear List, > > > > Here's the?comment that Earl Verbeek tried to post to the > > List earlier today, but couldn't get recognized by the > > Listserv.---Pete > > > > > > > > > > I've had two people tell me that the source of the "real" > > Terlingua calcite, the blue-fl. SW and pink-fl. LW material, > > was the Little 38 mine (hope I got the name right), and ONLY > > that one mine.? Both of them were there and collected the fl. > > calcite from the dumps of this mine (one when some of the > > dump material apparently was reprocessed as road aggregate), > > so they have some firsthand knowledge.? Just passing it on FWIW. > > > > ? > > > > A somewhat similar problem concerns the "Terlingua-type" > > calcite from San Saba, Texas.? Is that San Saba the city, or > > somewhere in San Saba County?? I've never seen the locality > > given to any useful degree of specificity.? Anyone out there > > know where this stuff comes from? > > > > ? > > > > ????????????? Cheers-??? Earl?? (at?? everbeek@ptd.net?? ) > > > > > > > > > > ? > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 8 13:28:35 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 13:31:19 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20080708155823.0236b3e0@nist.gov> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <97175ae90807070854l2886969dx9a5782397dd3a73d@mail.gmail.com> <8CAAF3999603E7C-1264-5A6@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> <006201c8e130$0cf39930$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <7.0.1.0.2.20080708155823.0236b3e0@nist.gov> Message-ID: <8CAAF5054E27F96-968-336@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Out of curiosity I just checked what's on Mindat.? A "plethora" of different mine names are listed for calcite from the Terlingua district, one of which is the Little 38 mine.? There are 8 photos posted?on Mindat of calcite from Terlingua, most of which are yellow-amber scalenohedral crystals from the Perry Pit, Mariposa mine (California Mountain mine).? Just one of the photos posted is of the blue-fluorescent calcite, and its caption doesn't give a specific location. Pete -----Original Message----- From: Jeffrey T. Cessna To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 2:03 pm Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite Actually, Paul Garland has entered the Terlingua (Little 38 Mine) site into Google Earth (the stand alone program, for those who are not familiar). I am not sure what layer it is in because I have a lot of them turned on. Out of curiosity I entered Terlingua to see where in TX it was and found Paul's entry about 3 miles to the west of the town.? ? Cheers,? Jeff? ? At 03:23 PM 7/8/2008, you wrote:? >Paul Garland has visited the site.? >I'll CC him.? >? >Paul, any two cents on the below message?? >? >Cheers? >Axel? >? > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----? > > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com? > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens pmodreski@aol.com? > > Verzonden: dinsdag 8 juli 2008 18:46? > > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com; everbeek@ptd.net? > > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite? > >? > > Dear List,? > >? > > Here's the?comment that Earl Verbeek tried to post to the? > > List earlier today, but couldn't get recognized by the? > > Listserv.---Pete? > >? > >? > >? > >? > > I've had two people tell me that the source of the "real"? > > Terlingua calcite, the blue-fl. SW and pink-fl. LW material,? > > was the Little 38 mine (hope I got the name right), and ONLY? > > that one mine.? Both of them were there and collected the fl.? > > calcite from the dumps of this mine (one when some of the? > > dump material apparently was reprocessed as road aggregate),? > > so they have some firsthand knowledge.? Just passing it on FWIW.? > >? > > ?? > >? > > A somewhat similar problem concerns the "Terlingua-type"? > > calcite from San Saba, Texas.? Is that San Saba the city, or? > > somewhere in San Saba County?? I've never seen the locality? > > given to any useful degree of specificity.? Anyone out there? > > know where this stuff comes from?? > >? > > ?? > >? > > ????????????? Cheers-??? Earl?? (at?? everbeek@ptd.net?? )? > >? > >? > >? > >? > > ?? > >? > >? > >? > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative? > > text/plain (text body -- kept)? > > text/html? > > ---? > > --? > > _______________________________________________? > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? > > Subscription Services:? > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? > >? >? >--? >_______________________________________________? >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? >Subscription Services:? >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? ? -- _______________________________________________? Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? Subscription Services:? http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 8 17:07:07 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 8 17:07:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of the stones... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Some writings from someone who has collected Terlingua calcite http://www.terlinguacalcite.com/html/about_terlingua_calcite.html and a report on the collecting status http://www.terlinguacalcite.com/html/collecting_status.html A note it comes from the Mercury mines in Terlingua http://www.fluorescentminerals.com/terlinguacal.html A list of the mines around Terlingua http://www.mindat.org/lsearch.php?loc=terlingua On Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008, at 10:28 America/Detroit, Pmodreski@aol.com wrote: > > > Sure, Terlingua is a "real" locality, whether or not material can > currently > be collected. > > > I consider Terlingua one of the Great Blank Spots in information about > mineral localities. Because, I think, anyone who knew or knows the > least thing > about where exactly (or even, generally) around Terlingua the > fluorescent & > phosphorescent calcite is found, has kept their knowledge very > private, not > wanting anyone else to jump them and collect it there, I don't > believe I have > ever heard or read anything, about just where (what mines or > propsects, or > whatever) and in exactly what mode of occurrence, this "classic" > calcite is from; > nor have I ever read anything at all resembling first-hand collecting > stories > about it. Please, anyone, correct me if I am wrong, and if such > material > has ever been written or shared! I think there is less known about > the source > of the Terlingua calcite, than there used to be about things in > "Darkest > Africa"! I've read about people visiting Terlingua and collecting > calcite, but > it has been "common" calcite, not the strongly fluorescent material. > > In a message dated 7/8/2008 4:19:21 AM Mountain Daylight Time, > axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: > > > If I remember correctly it 's cerium(/lead?) + manganese/lead that > cause the > pink fluorescence in long wave UV and cerium =>europium that are > responsible > for the blue phosphorescence in short wave. > > > > > And, Axel, I think you are going beyond anything that is definitely > known > here. Yes, it has been hypothesized that europium is "probably" the > cause of > the blue fluorescence and phosphorescence, but that's about it I > think, as far > as real knowledge. Other minerals that fluoresce due to europium > (such as > fluorite) fluoresce LW rather than short, and do not phosphoresce; and > Mn/Pb > produces the common red/orange fl. in calcite, but that's quite unlike > the pink > LW of Terlingua-type calcite. So I still think everybody is just > guessing > at this. I know a few people have played around with some research on > this, > but I don't think anything formal or conclusive has ever been > published--again, I'd LOVE to know that I am wrong, and I would love > it if anyone could > direct us to any actual published articles giving hard data about > this type of > calcite! > > keep on rockin' and glowin', > Pete > > > > > **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for > fuel-efficient used cars. > (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 8 17:12:41 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 8 17:12:47 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] purple jasper In-Reply-To: <48737E29.8060906@grantspass.com> Message-ID: Purple jasper beads, sold under the trade name Imperial Purple Jasper come from South Africa. On Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008, at 10:48 America/Detroit, Jan Arnold wrote: > Just returned from a trip to Northern Nevada and Southern Eastern > Oregon. While there I found two pieces of a deep purple jasper. It > was probably not native to the area because both pieces had been > shaped into tools. Does anyone have any idea where this purple jasper > originates? > > Jan Arnold > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From cycadwood at aol.com Tue Jul 8 17:36:20 2008 From: cycadwood at aol.com (Frank Daniels) Date: Tue Jul 8 17:36:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer In-Reply-To: <000001c8e0ff$aab6fb20$0024f160$@com> References: <000501c8e0b0$c37d64e0$4a782ea0$@com> <000001c8e0ff$aab6fb20$0024f160$@com> Message-ID: <002b01c8e15b$cfaeebc0$6f0cc340$@com> When I googled the subject, I found this. Does anyone have more information on the subject? > I stopped all my Almag mist problems with Raytech's Mist Killer. > Dear Jim, I recently bought some of the Raytech Mist Killer, but didn't start using it because of the warning on the label that says "contains a chemical known in the State of California to cause cancer" which leads me to wonder if breathing the mist killer is worse than breathing the mist. Do you, or anyone else, know anything about this? Sherris -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Tim Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 7:37 AM To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] mist killer http://www.lacywest.com/catalogs/lacywest.pdf I am sure others sell it as well. I found it by the gallon a couple years ago but I can't find the site. I thought it was GeoTools (in Utah I think) but their site seems to have "gone away" or I am searching for the wrong name. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Frank Daniels Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:12 PM To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer Does anyone know where I can get some mist killer? Thanks, Frank PS Mist killer is a thick fluid one adds to oil in a rock saw to keep it from misting excessively. Frank Daniels Minerals & Fossils 2024 Freedom Court Grand Junction, CO 81507 minerals@frankdanielsminerals.com www.frankdanielsminerals.com Tim Fisher 18403 S Clear Acres Drive Oregon City, OR 97045 NEW PHONE (503) 631-8961 NEW CELL (503) 860-5629 Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From albalmer at copper.net Tue Jul 8 17:55:11 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Tue Jul 8 17:55:15 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mist killer In-Reply-To: <002b01c8e15b$cfaeebc0$6f0cc340$@com> References: <000501c8e0b0$c37d64e0$4a782ea0$@com> <000001c8e0ff$aab6fb20$0024f160$@com> <002b01c8e15b$cfaeebc0$6f0cc340$@com> Message-ID: On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:36:20 -0600, "Frank Daniels" wrote: >because of the warning on the label that says "contains a chemical known in >the State of California to cause cancer" Hard to find anything without that label. IMO, the State of California goes so far in their fearmongering that they make it *more* difficult to know what's really dangerous. -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From Pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 8 19:10:48 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 19:10:55 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of the stones... Message-ID: Thanks a lot, Kreigh, that certainly clarifies where the Terlingua calcite comes from, and how it [was] collected, Pete **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From diente at prismnet.com Tue Jul 8 19:23:13 2008 From: diente at prismnet.com (diente@prismnet.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 19:23:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua calcite In-Reply-To: <8CAAF5054E27F96-968-336@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> References: <200807070100.m6710BZH013606@bubbleator.drizzle.com>, <7.0.1.0.2.20080708155823.0236b3e0@nist.gov>, <8CAAF5054E27F96-968-336@Webmail-mg10.sim.aol.com> Message-ID: <4873DAC1.21555.30F9B002@diente.prismnet.com> Hi, Pete. >From what I understand, the little 38 mine was where the terlingua calcite came from. I have also heard that all of the dump was ground up for road base. There is also some terlingua type calcite from Mexico that we called Boquillas calcite, which has the same type of fluorescence, but was prettier in daylight, with bright pink color zones in white areas. Most of this was acid washed, and supposedly left out in the sun to enhance the pink color. Here are some photos of the real terlingua calcite, and of the boquillas. I'll look for the daylight photos of the boquillas. I'll get around to posting this to mindat, when I can measure the specimens. http://diente.smugmug.com/gallery/5363856_t24bH#328305635_m7T4n As to the San Saba calcite, there is a quarry somewhere in the hill country area where this comes from. A friend of mine is working on getting permission for a field trip, but this has been a rare occurrence, as far as I know. (I have only heard of one trip years ago that was by selective invitation). I'll see if I can get a more specific locality for you. Supposedly this calcite has a very long phosphorescence. There is also a locality near Llano, Tx that was on an a ranch owned by an Austin Gem and MIneral society member. We found a couple of locations on the ranch that had the typical blue fl. response to sw U.V. Some also had yellow and orange fl. responses as well. I think I can run down some pics of these specimens, and post them to the above site, or take some photos myself, of the specimens I have. These two areas were cleaned out of specimens by club members, and no more was found.......and the owner sold the ranch. We also found a couple of small pieces of calcite with the blue response here in Austin during road construction at Howard Lane, but only with some small specks of the blue. Every other piece of calcite around Austin (that I have seen), just has the cream colored fl., if any at all. Paul Bordovsky Austin, TX > Out of curiosity I just checked what's on Mindat.? A "plethora" of different mine names are listed for calcite from the Terlingua district, one of which is the Little 38 mine.? There are 8 photos posted?on Mindat of calcite from Terlingua, most of which are yellow-amber scalenohedral crystals from the Perry Pit, Mariposa mine (California Mountain mine).? Just one of the photos posted is of the blue-fluorescent calcite, and its caption doesn't give a specific location. > > Pete > > >Axel? > > > Dear List,? > > >? > > > Here's the?comment that Earl Verbeek tried to post to the? > > > List earlier today, but couldn't get recognized by the? > > > Listserv.---Pete? > > >? > > >? > > >? > > >? > > > I've had two people tell me that the source of the "real"? > > > Terlingua calcite, the blue-fl. SW and pink-fl. LW material,? > > > was the Little 38 mine (hope I got the name right), and ONLY? > > > that one mine.? Both of them were there and collected the fl.? > > > calcite from the dumps of this mine (one when some of the? > > > dump material apparently was reprocessed as road aggregate),? > > > so they have some firsthand knowledge.? Just passing it on FWIW.? > > >? > > > ?? > > >? > > > A somewhat similar problem concerns the "Terlingua-type"? > > > calcite from San Saba, Texas.? Is that San Saba the city, or? > > > somewhere in San Saba County?? I've never seen the locality? > > > given to any useful degree of specificity.? Anyone out there? > > > know where this stuff comes from?? From VevaBailey at aol.com Tue Jul 8 20:12:47 2008 From: VevaBailey at aol.com (VevaBailey@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 8 20:22:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] purple jasper Message-ID: Without seeing a picture it is hard to tell what kind of rock it is. It could be purple burro jasper (not sure of exact name) I have some Arizona. Veva ______________________________________________________________________________ _-________ In a message dated 7/8/2008 5:13:05 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, Kreigh@tomaszewski.net writes: Purple jasper beads, sold under the trade name Imperial Purple Jasper come from South Africa. On Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008, at 10:48 America/Detroit, Jan Arnold wrote: > Just returned from a trip to Northern Nevada and Southern Eastern > Oregon. While there I found two pieces of a deep purple jasper. It > was probably not native to the area because both pieces had been > shaped into tools. Does anyone have any idea where this purple jasper > originates? > > Jan Arnold > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From jsmall47 at earthlink.net Wed Jul 9 07:28:44 2008 From: jsmall47 at earthlink.net (Jim Small) Date: Wed Jul 9 07:35:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: mist killer In-Reply-To: <200807090101.m6911ES7020635@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200807090101.m6911ES7020635@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20080709102553.02902860@pop.earthlink.net> As the Raytech no longer sells this the only thing I can suggest is trying STP oil treatment. Even when Hale was running the old lapidary list STP was the suggested alternative. I've not tried it, so cannot testify to the effectiveness. Jim Small Small Wonders Lapidary Church Hill, TN From lanny.r at roadrunner.com Wed Jul 9 09:27:12 2008 From: lanny.r at roadrunner.com (Lanny R) Date: Wed Jul 9 09:27:19 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip Message-ID: Good summer day to you all, Looks like nothing but summer weather for most of us. The steady hot summer weather is doing a good job of eliminating the delay in the snow melt. Thus the area east of Clarkia, Idaho is mostly free of snow and there should be no snowbanks blocking roads soon. For those interested in going up in the Freezeout area for garnets and kyanite, the planned trip is still on if anyone wants to go. I'm looking at August now, generally during the week is better for me, but no date is set. We can take a couple of days and look for garnets and kyanite in several areas and if anyone wants more time, I can give them directions to more locations. There also is the Forest Service star garnet diggings near Clarkia for those who want something else to do before or after the trip (it's closed Wed. and Turs. open the rest of the week). Can't predict the weather more than 5 minutes in advance, but typically in recent years it has been hot and sunny up there, nights might be cool. Thunderstorms are possible, and in past years rain, snow and anything else was possible. The main road on the divide is mostly at 5,800 to 6,100 feet, it runs through the forest, and open grassy or rocky ridges. Collecting will consist of working in hard rock, decomposed rock and picking crystals up off the surface of the ground. Collecting can be difficult to easy, your choice. The road is mostly in good condition and can be negotiated with a pickup and most likely even a car with good clearance (I haven't driven it in two years, but it generally doesn't change much). Regards, Lanny From jeanne at jeannius.com Wed Jul 9 16:54:28 2008 From: jeanne at jeannius.com (Jeanne Rhodes-Moen) Date: Wed Jul 9 16:54:31 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds Message-ID: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during the last Ice Age.. http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html From codeburner at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 17:43:49 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Jul 9 17:43:55 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: <004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: OK I have been without WIFI for a couple of days. But at 1000 or 2000 degrees you are no longer looking for water you are looking for steam, you might even start getting some disassociation at the higher temp. That would probably need a ir spectrometer type detector which would cost a LOT more than she is interested in paying. The only other approach I can see is to pump some air out, cool it to room temp and run more normal tests on the room temp condensate. More practically is to use weights, weigh the mold cold. Heat it for say 15, 30, 45, 60, 75 minutes. Cool it down and reweigh, when you get a constant weight the water is gone. You'd have to use a fresh mold for each test. Then just heat the molds for that time you determined ever after. There is no cheap instrumental method that I know of. BK On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Gary Brown wrote: > Not rockhound... But there sure a bunch of clever folks here. > > One of my glass buddies is looking for a moisture sensor that will operate > inside of a 2000F kiln. Here's the application: she creates molds out of > a > plaster/silica/gunk mix that contains water. She's got that inside a kiln > along with a load of glass that will eventually fill the kiln. An > electronic controller controls (what else would a controller do, eh?) the > time & temperature of the kiln. In this case, she wants to heat the kiln > and have it sit at, say, 1000F until the moisture in the mold bakes out. > When that happens, the moisture in the air inside the kiln should drop. > When that drop occurs the kiln resumes heating up to the full melt > temperature. > > The fly in the ointment is finding a moisture sensor that can survive > 2000F. > Any suggestions? > > GcB > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 17:58:02 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Jul 9 17:58:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: <9889B6D4-4C95-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <9889B6D4-4C95-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Kreigh, I thought that I had heard that most, if not all, of the western ore gold tailing piles had already been given the cyanide treatment back in the 1960's and 70's. There was sort of a second gold rush of people finding the tailings and treating them when gold prices spiked back then. Wouldn't that mean little or no gold remaining? BK On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 10:28 PM, Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > Kevin, > > It is not that difficult to make a home smelter that can process a pail of > crushed ore and give you bloom, or maybe a batch of molten metal and slag, > depending on the metal/ore. A length of large diameter pipe (sheet metal > will do), a large and small cardboard tube, some firebrick cement, some > clay, a canister vacuum for tuyres, a flux, and some charcoal or coke. Plans > are readily available if you do a little searching (online or at your > library). > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Paintricks at aol.com Wed Jul 9 18:18:43 2008 From: Paintricks at aol.com (Paintricks@aol.com) Date: Wed Jul 9 18:50:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? Message-ID: The big boys in the area here have the means to refine the old tailings and get some values for their efforts. Not sure how much per ton tho. I'm small time and just learning the craft. Fascinating to me. :) **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 20:27:51 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Jul 9 20:27:57 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What I was getting at is the fact that all those tailing piles have been worked two or three times and smelting the remains is probably not going to recover anything. BK On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 9:18 PM, wrote: > The big boys in the area here have the means to refine the old tailings and > get some values for their efforts. Not sure how much per ton tho. > I'm small time and just learning the craft. Fascinating to me. > :) > > > > **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live > music > scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! > (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Jul 9 20:29:08 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Jul 9 20:29:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5B4CA424-4E30-11DD-940F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Bryan, Cyanide treatment works best when the ore is crushed; cyanide does not recover native gold. You are correct that the richest tailings have been reprocessed, many more than once. I've even lost a collecting location in Michigan from reprocessing - it is all gone. If you find tailing piles of rock, they have probably not been reprocessed. There are still a lot of gold ore piles left, and they are being looked at again by mining companies. BTW, My oldest daughter lives in Denver and recently visited an old gold mine in the area. She sent me four specimens from the tailings as a gift (I'm easy, give me rocks and minerals anytime, but tell me where they came from), selected because they all looked different. One of them showed a bunch of 1-2 mm nuggets of native gold on the matrix surface. I'm still trying to identify all the odd minerals. Gold is where you find it, and it is still out there. Kreigh On Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008, at 20:58 America/Detroit, J Bryan Kramer wrote: > Kreigh, I thought that I had heard that most, if not all, of the > western ore > gold tailing piles had already been given the cyanide treatment back > in the > 1960's and 70's. There was sort of a second gold rush of people > finding the > tailings and treating them when gold prices spiked back then. > > Wouldn't that mean little or no gold remaining? > > BK > > On Mon, Jul 7, 2008 at 10:28 PM, Kreigh Tomaszewski > > wrote: > >> Kevin, >> >> It is not that difficult to make a home smelter that can process a >> pail of >> crushed ore and give you bloom, or maybe a batch of molten metal and >> slag, >> depending on the metal/ore. A length of large diameter pipe (sheet >> metal >> will do), a large and small cardboard tube, some firebrick cement, >> some >> clay, a canister vacuum for tuyres, a flux, and some charcoal or >> coke. Plans >> are readily available if you do a little searching (online or at your >> library). >> >> > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From codeburner at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 20:30:27 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Jul 9 20:33:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: John McPhee covered this in one of his excellent books, Range and Basin IIRC. BK On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 11:27 PM, J Bryan Kramer wrote: > What I was getting at is the fact that all those tailing piles have been > worked two or three times and smelting the remains is probably not going to > recover anything. > > BK > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 9:18 PM, wrote: > >> The big boys in the area here have the means to refine the old tailings >> and >> get some values for their efforts. Not sure how much per ton tho. >> I'm small time and just learning the craft. Fascinating to me. >> :) >> >> >> >> **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live >> music >> scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! >> (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Jul 9 20:33:09 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Jul 9 20:33:35 2008 Subject: [JunkMail] Re: [Rockhounds] Any Gold home refiners here? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It doesn't take much per ton to make it profitable if you already have the resources to do the processing. On Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008, at 21:18 America/Detroit, Paintricks@aol.com wrote: > The big boys in the area here have the means to refine the old > tailings and > get some values for their efforts. Not sure how much per ton tho. > I'm small time and just learning the craft. Fascinating to me. > :) > > > > **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live > music > scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! > (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From codeburner at gmail.com Wed Jul 9 20:49:23 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Wed Jul 9 20:49:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> Message-ID: I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside their pyramids in Taos NM. BK On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen wrote: > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during the > last Ice Age.. > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Thu Jul 10 07:19:10 2008 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Thu Jul 10 07:26:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: <00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> Yeh... Any sensor that would do what she wants would be REALLY expensive. The cool 'n check wouldn't work... It's a continuous process and once you start, you can't stop. ~~ however ~~ Your weighing idea gives me an idea. When the mold is made a "standard" block of mold gunk would sit on some sort of weighing sensor. When ALL the water was driven out that block would weigh less and it could trip the sensor. Of course I'm waving my arms here...but it's an idea. I've BCC'd my friend on this... GcB > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J > Bryan Kramer > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 7:44 PM > To: gbrown@catspaw-minerals.com; Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A > mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor > > OK I have been without WIFI for a couple of days. But at 1000 > or 2000 degrees you are no longer looking for water you are > looking for steam, you might even start getting some > disassociation at the higher temp. That would probably need a > ir spectrometer type detector which would cost a LOT more > than she is interested in paying. The only other approach I > can see is to pump some air out, cool it to room temp and run > more normal tests on the room temp condensate. > > More practically is to use weights, weigh the mold cold. Heat > it for say 15, 30, 45, 60, 75 minutes. Cool it down and > reweigh, when you get a constant weight the water is gone. > You'd have to use a fresh mold for each test. Then just heat > the molds for that time you determined ever after. There is > no cheap instrumental method that I know of. > > BK > From albalmer at copper.net Thu Jul 10 10:14:07 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Thu Jul 10 10:14:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: <00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> <00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 09:19:10 -0500, "Gary Brown" wrote: >Yeh... Any sensor that would do what she wants would be REALLY expensive. >The cool 'n check wouldn't work... It's a continuous process and once you >start, you can't stop. What BK is suggesting is calibrating the process. If you can determine the conditions needed, then repeat them, it will work. > >~~ however ~~ > >Your weighing idea gives me an idea. When the mold is made a "standard" >block of mold gunk would sit on some sort of weighing sensor. When ALL the >water was driven out that block would weigh less and it could trip the >sensor. Of course I'm waving my arms here...but it's an idea. Sounds like a promising idea. It could be as simple as a "seesaw" balance and a metal contact. > >I've BCC'd my friend on this... >> >> More practically is to use weights, weigh the mold cold. Heat >> it for say 15, 30, 45, 60, 75 minutes. Cool it down and >> reweigh, when you get a constant weight the water is gone. >> You'd have to use a fresh mold for each test. Then just heat >> the molds for that time you determined ever after. There is >> no cheap instrumental method that I know of. >> >> BK >> -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From codeburner at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 17:10:20 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Thu Jul 10 17:10:26 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor In-Reply-To: <00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble> <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi> <00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: There are lab instruments that do just what you suggest, they have a built in scale, they are computerized and generate all sorts of data. But first they work on small samples, a couple of grams, and second think $20000 and up for one. LECO is a big manufacturer of that sort of thing, you can google them. A normal scale would not survive those sort of temps. BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:19 AM, Gary Brown wrote: > Yeh... Any sensor that would do what she wants would be REALLY expensive. > The cool 'n check wouldn't work... It's a continuous process and once you > start, you can't stop. > > ~~ however ~~ > > Your weighing idea gives me an idea. When the mold is made a "standard" > block of mold gunk would sit on some sort of weighing sensor. When ALL the > water was driven out that block would weigh less and it could trip the > sensor. Of course I'm waving my arms here...but it's an idea. > > I've BCC'd my friend on this... > > GcB > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J > > Bryan Kramer > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 7:44 PM > > To: gbrown@catspaw-minerals.com; Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A > > mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Hi Temp Moisture Sensor > > > > OK I have been without WIFI for a couple of days. But at 1000 > > or 2000 degrees you are no longer looking for water you are > > looking for steam, you might even start getting some > > disassociation at the higher temp. That would probably need a > > ir spectrometer type detector which would cost a LOT more > > than she is interested in paying. The only other approach I > > can see is to pump some air out, cool it to room temp and run > > more normal tests on the room temp condensate. > > > > More practically is to use weights, weigh the mold cold. Heat > > it for say 15, 30, 45, 60, 75 minutes. Cool it down and > > reweigh, when you get a constant weight the water is gone. > > You'd have to use a fresh mold for each test. Then just heat > > the molds for that time you determined ever after. There is > > no cheap instrumental method that I know of. > > > > BK > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Jul 10 18:28:29 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Jul 10 18:28:39 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] fossil ID Request In-Reply-To: <849608.53878.qm@web56304.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: JR, Hard to tell from the picture, but the size and shape suggest Microdoma to me. You can see some Microdoma at https://kb.osu.edu/dspace/ bitstream/1811/22682/1/V080N2_059.pdf. Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 6, 2008, at 17:47 America/Detroit, J. R. Hodel wrote: > Hi: > > A friend at work found a nice chert in her driveway with a little vug > and a (probably marine) fossil in it.? If you look at the rock with a > 10x loupe you can see numerous micro-fossils in the chert.? I'm not > much of a fossil guy, but I know there are several on the list.? She > was thinking an archimedes of some sort, but I think the layers are > too close for that, the best archimedes I've seen were about a twist > each 1 or 2 cm or thereabouts, this has a layer each mm or close to > it. > > I have a pretty good 60mm Micro Nikkor lens, and took a reasonable > picture of it, which I've reduced to a 98k file for emailing.? If > anyone wants a look, let me know your email.? > > Given that this driveway is in Charleston, WV, I expect the crushed > stone on it came from somewhere on the Ohio River, as most of the > aggregate around here is from Shamblin Stone, and they have all their > rock barged in. > > Thanks in advance! > > JR in WV > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From syonix at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 18:57:26 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (Jacob Linder) Date: Thu Jul 10 18:58:01 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> Message-ID: <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> Did you even read it? I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area that came from another and they speculated that it was from an asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into the air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... It says nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's just hyped nonsense trashtalk. "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " ... "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " ... "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." --- Have a good day. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside their pyramids in Taos NM. BK On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen wrote: > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during > the last Ice Age.. > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: 7/9/2008 6:32 PM From codeburner at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 19:06:02 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:06:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: You should read "The Barren Lands" < http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > Did you even read it? > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read the > story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area that came from > another and they speculated that it was from an asteroid hitting, thus toss > debris from the ground it hit into the air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't > seem all that "crazy"... It says nothing about "all" of them coming from a > comet.. That's just hyped nonsense trashtalk. > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and > Indiana > reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada several thousand > years ago. The question is, how? " > ... > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air during > the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south by rivers > formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > ... > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got here > because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but we've got a lot > more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > --- > > Have a good day. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside their > pyramids in Taos NM. > > BK > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > wrote: > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during > > the last Ice Age.. > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: 7/9/2008 > 6:32 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 19:07:51 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (Jacob Linder) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:08:32 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com><004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> I will check it out, thank you. I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than that .. Much appreicated. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds You should read "The Barren Lands" < http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/re f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > Did you even read it? > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read > the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area that > came from another and they speculated that it was from an asteroid > hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into the air, or from > glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... It says nothing about > "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's just hyped nonsense trashtalk. > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and > Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada several > thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > ... > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air > during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south by > rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > ... > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got here > because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but we've got > a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > --- > > Have a good day. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > Kramer > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > BK > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > wrote: > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during > > the last Ice Age.. > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > 7/9/2008 > 6:32 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 6:43 PM From codeburner at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 19:15:59 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:16:04 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is usually correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No comets are needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I will check it out, thank you. > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on here > for > a while learning as much as I can, and when something like that is said, > and > I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than that .. Much > appreicated. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > < > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/re > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then know > where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > Did you even read it? > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read > > the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area that > > came from another and they speculated that it was from an asteroid > > hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into the air, or from > > glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... It says nothing about > > "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's just hyped nonsense trashtalk. > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and > > Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada several > > thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > ... > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air > > during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south by > > rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > ... > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got here > > because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but we've got > > a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > --- > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > BK > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > wrote: > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada during > > > the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > 7/9/2008 > > 6:32 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 19:21:05 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (Jacob Linder) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:21:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com><004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq><005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: <005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> I did, and that's why I said what I said. Stuff hits the earth all the time. When stuff hits the earth, it could cause things to be displaced by the energy of the impact. There is actually a lot of science behind the idea that the last ice age came to an end because of an event such as this. And I think personally that billions of gallons of rushing water from the ice melting (regardless of what triggered it frankly) has the capacity to transport vast amounts of material from point a to point b.. So either scenario is very plausible in my opinion. I mean how else would material move from point a to b.. Thru Water or the air.. Or I suppose continental drift for that matter. Anyway, looks like a great book I just bought it from Amazon I'll check it out thanks for the rec. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:16 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is usually correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No comets are needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I will check it out, thank you. > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on > here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like > that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than > that .. Much appreicated. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > < > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071 > 857/re > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_sr_ > 1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1> > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then > know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > Did you even read it? > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read > > the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area > > that came from another and they speculated that it was from an > > asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into the > > air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... It says > > nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's just hyped nonsense trashtalk. > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and > > Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada > > several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > ... > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air > > during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south > > by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > ... > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got > > here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but > > we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > --- > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > BK > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > wrote: > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada > > > during the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > 7/9/2008 > > 6:32 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 6:43 PM From codeburner at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 19:29:58 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:30:05 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: <005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: When you get massive floods you get scablands like western Washington created by the Lake Missoula floods: Just where are those scablands in Ohio? BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I did, and that's why I said what I said. > Stuff hits the earth all the time. When stuff hits the earth, it could > cause > things to be displaced by the energy of the impact. There is actually a lot > of science behind the idea that the last ice age came to an end because of > an event such as this. And I think personally that billions of gallons of > rushing water from the ice melting (regardless of what triggered it > frankly) > has the capacity to transport vast amounts of material from point a to > point > b.. So either scenario is very plausible in my opinion. I mean how else > would material move from point a to b.. Thru Water or the air.. Or I > suppose > continental drift for that matter. > > Anyway, looks like a great book I just bought it from Amazon I'll check it > out thanks for the rec. > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:16 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: > > > > That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is usually > correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No comets are > needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > I will check it out, thank you. > > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on > > here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like > > that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than > > that .. Much appreicated. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > > > < > > > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071 > > 857/re > > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_sr_ > > 1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1> > > > > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then > > know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > > > BK > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder > wrote: > > > > > Did you even read it? > > > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually read > > > the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one area > > > that came from another and they speculated that it was from an > > > asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into the > > > air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... It says > > > nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's just hyped > nonsense trashtalk. > > > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio and > > > Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada > > > several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > > ... > > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the air > > > during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried south > > > by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > > ... > > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got > > > here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but > > > we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > Kramer > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > collectors > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > > > BK > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada > > > > during the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.html > > > > > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > North Florida, USA > > > photos at: > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > --- > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > > 7/9/2008 > > > 6:32 PM > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > 7/10/2008 > > 6:43 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockhounds at adelphia.net Thu Jul 10 19:54:26 2008 From: rockhounds at adelphia.net (rockhounds@adelphia.net) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:56:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip Message-ID: <27272481.1215744866360.JavaMail.root@web22> We were up there last August and 1 party drove their mini van up there with 7 people in it. It did hit bottom a few times though. Fun trip and maybe pick a few huckleberrys on the way. We would love to go Kelly and Valerie ---- Lanny R wrote: > Good summer day to you all, > > Looks like nothing but summer weather for most of us. The steady hot > summer weather is doing a good job of eliminating the delay in the > snow melt. Thus the area east of Clarkia, Idaho is mostly free of snow > and there should be no snowbanks blocking roads soon. > > For those interested in going up in the Freezeout area for garnets and > kyanite, the planned trip is still on if anyone wants to go. I'm > looking at August now, generally during the week is better for me, but > no date is set. > > We can take a couple of days and look for garnets and kyanite in > several areas and if anyone wants more time, I can give them > directions to more locations. There also is the Forest Service star > garnet diggings near Clarkia for those who want something else to do > before or after the trip (it's closed Wed. and Turs. open the rest of > the week). > > Can't predict the weather more than 5 minutes in advance, but > typically in recent years it has been hot and sunny up there, nights > might be cool. Thunderstorms are possible, and in past years rain, > snow and anything else was possible. The main road on the divide is > mostly at 5,800 to 6,100 feet, it runs through the forest, and open > grassy or rocky ridges. > > Collecting will consist of working in hard rock, decomposed rock and > picking crystals up off the surface of the ground. Collecting can be > difficult to easy, your choice. The road is mostly in good condition > and can be negotiated with a pickup and most likely even a car with > good clearance (I haven't driven it in two years, but it generally > doesn't change much). > > Regards, > > Lanny > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From codeburner at gmail.com Thu Jul 10 19:58:00 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Thu Jul 10 19:58:05 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nova show on Lake Missoula Message-ID: I stumbled across this: It looks interesting for those of you who can see NOVA on PBS. It is on the Lake Missoula Floods in Washington State. BK -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Thu Jul 10 23:08:29 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (Jacob Linder) Date: Thu Jul 10 23:09:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com><004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq><005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq><005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: <006701c8e31c$8a477f30$6401a8c0@worldhq> I don't claim to be an expert on the topic. But what I'm saying is the stuff im reading says otherwise. You obviously know a lot and I don't want to disrepect you.. Check this out http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/entry.php?rec=1350&nm=Minerals-of-Ohio Diamonds - Carbon. At least six diamonds have been found in Ohio in sediments deposited by glaciers of the Pleistocene Ice Age. All were small crystals. As with gold, these minerals were carried to Ohio from Canada by glaciers. In recent years, diamond-bearing kimberlite pipes have been discovered in the Canadian shield and they may have been the source for rare Ohio diamonds. -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:30 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds When you get massive floods you get scablands like western Washington created by the Lake Missoula floods: Just where are those scablands in Ohio? BK On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I did, and that's why I said what I said. > Stuff hits the earth all the time. When stuff hits the earth, it could > cause things to be displaced by the energy of the impact. There is > actually a lot of science behind the idea that the last ice age came > to an end because of an event such as this. And I think personally > that billions of gallons of rushing water from the ice melting > (regardless of what triggered it > frankly) > has the capacity to transport vast amounts of material from point a to > point b.. So either scenario is very plausible in my opinion. I mean > how else would material move from point a to b.. Thru Water or the > air.. Or I suppose continental drift for that matter. > > Anyway, looks like a great book I just bought it from Amazon I'll > check it out thanks for the rec. > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:16 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: > > > > That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is > usually correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No > comets are needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > I will check it out, thank you. > > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on > > here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like > > that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than > > that .. Much appreicated. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > > > < > > > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/08050 > > 71 > > 857/re > > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_s > > r_ 1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1> > > > > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then > > know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > > > BK > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder > wrote: > > > > > Did you even read it? > > > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually > > > read the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one > > > area that came from another and they speculated that it was from > > > an asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into > > > the air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... > > > It says nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's > > > just hyped > nonsense trashtalk. > > > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio > > > and Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada > > > several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > > ... > > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the > > > air during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried > > > south by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > > ... > > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got > > > here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but > > > we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > Kramer > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > collectors > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > > > BK > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern N. > > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada > > > > during the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.ht > > > > ml > > > > > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > North Florida, USA > > > photos at: > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > --- > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > > 7/9/2008 > > > 6:32 PM > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > 7/10/2008 > > 6:43 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 6:43 PM From codeburner at gmail.com Fri Jul 11 05:54:48 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Fri Jul 11 05:54:54 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: <006701c8e31c$8a477f30$6401a8c0@worldhq> References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> <006701c8e31c$8a477f30$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: No that is exactly what the Barren Lands says, no comets required. There are a lot of Kimberlite pipes in North America tho, not just the ones in Canada. Most don't have diamonds. And I am no expert. BK On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 2:08 AM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I don't claim to be an expert on the topic. But what I'm saying is the > stuff > im reading says otherwise. You obviously know a lot and I don't want to > disrepect you.. Check this out > > http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/entry.php?rec=1350&nm=Minerals-of-Ohio > > Diamonds - Carbon. At least six diamonds have been found in Ohio in > sediments deposited by glaciers of the Pleistocene Ice Age. All were small > crystals. As with gold, these minerals were carried to Ohio from Canada by > glaciers. In recent years, diamond-bearing kimberlite pipes have been > discovered in the Canadian shield and they may have been the source for > rare > Ohio diamonds. > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:30 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > When you get massive floods you get scablands like western Washington > created by the Lake Missoula floods: > > > > Just where are those scablands in Ohio? > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > I did, and that's why I said what I said. > > Stuff hits the earth all the time. When stuff hits the earth, it could > > cause things to be displaced by the energy of the impact. There is > > actually a lot of science behind the idea that the last ice age came > > to an end because of an event such as this. And I think personally > > that billions of gallons of rushing water from the ice melting > > (regardless of what triggered it > > frankly) > > has the capacity to transport vast amounts of material from point a to > > point b.. So either scenario is very plausible in my opinion. I mean > > how else would material move from point a to b.. Thru Water or the > > air.. Or I suppose continental drift for that matter. > > > > Anyway, looks like a great book I just bought it from Amazon I'll > > check it out thanks for the rec. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:16 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: > > > > > > > > That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is > > usually correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No > > comets are needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. > > > > BK > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder > wrote: > > > > > I will check it out, thank you. > > > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on > > > here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like > > > that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than > > > that .. Much appreicated. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > Kramer > > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > collectors > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > > > > > < > > > > > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/08050 > > > 71 > > > 857/re > > > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > > com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_s > > > r_ 1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1> > > > > > > > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then > > > know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > > > > > BK > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder > > wrote: > > > > > > > Did you even read it? > > > > > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually > > > > read the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one > > > > area that came from another and they speculated that it was from > > > > an asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into > > > > the air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... > > > > It says nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's > > > > just hyped > > nonsense trashtalk. > > > > > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio > > > > and Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada > > > > several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > > > ... > > > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the > > > > air during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried > > > > south by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > > > ... > > > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got > > > > here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but > > > > we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > > Kramer > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > > collectors > > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > > > > > BK > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern > N. > > > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada > > > > > during the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.ht > > > > > ml > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > > North Florida, USA > > > > photos at: > > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > > --- > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > > > 7/9/2008 > > > > 6:32 PM > > > > > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > North Florida, USA > > > photos at: > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > --- > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > > 7/10/2008 > > > 6:43 PM > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > 7/10/2008 > > 6:43 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From albalmer at copper.net Fri Jul 11 09:17:26 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Fri Jul 11 09:17:31 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 22:15:59 -0400, "J Bryan Kramer" wrote: >The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: > > > >That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is usually >correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No comets are >needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. Ockham is overworked. Note the "usually" above, and remember that zebras do exist, in spite of the Razor. -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From pmodreski at aol.com Fri Jul 11 09:28:52 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Fri Jul 11 09:30:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds In-Reply-To: References: <48754FB4.1000001@jeannius.com> <004f01c8e2f9$77f506e0$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005901c8e2fa$eca02a00$6401a8c0@worldhq> <005a01c8e2fc$c631af40$6401a8c0@worldhq> <006701c8e31c$8a477f30$6401a8c0@worldhq> Message-ID: <8CAB18A56866F69-A4C-4B67@webmail-nf14.sim.aol.com> I think that stuff about a meteor(comet) impact transporting the diamonds etc. is really, really, really, speculative--I had kind of "rolled my eyes heavenward" when I first read that.? I think some scientists just like to disseminate those great-sounding speculative ideas because they get themselves lots of publicity in the news media and maybe help them get new grant funding, irrespective of what the probability is that their hypothesis really matches reality.? Yes, glaciers by themselves do a fine job of transporting that stuff... Just my 2 cents, Pete -----Original Message----- From: J Bryan Kramer To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 6:54 am Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds No that is exactly what the Barren Lands says, no comets required. There are a lot of Kimberlite pipes in North America tho, not just the ones in Canada. Most don't have diamonds. And I am no expert. BK On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 2:08 AM, Jacob Linder wrote: > I don't claim to be an expert on the topic. But what I'm saying is the > stuff > im reading says otherwise. You obviously know a lot and I don't want to > disrepect you.. Check this out > > http://www.ohiohistorycentral.org/entry.php?rec=1350&nm=Minerals-of-Ohio > > Diamonds - Carbon. At least six diamonds have been found in Ohio in > sediments deposited by glaciers of the Pleistocene Ice Age. All were small > crystals. As with gold, these minerals were carried to Ohio from Canada by > glaciers. In recent years, diamond-bearing kimberlite pipes have been > discovered in the Canadian shield and they may have been the source for > rare > Ohio diamonds. > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:30 PM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > When you get massive floods you get scablands like western Washington > created by the Lake Missoula floods: > > > > Just where are those scablands in Ohio? > > BK > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Jacob Linder wrote: > > > I did, and that's why I said what I said. > > Stuff hits the earth all the time. When stuff hits the earth, it could > > cause things to be displaced by the energy of the impact. There is > > actually a lot of science behind the idea that the last ice age came > > to an end because of an event such as this. And I think personally > > that billions of gallons of rushing water from the ice melting > > (regardless of what triggered it > > frankly) > > has the capacity to transport vas t amounts of material from point a to > > point b.. So either scenario is very plausible in my opinion. I mean > > how else would material move from point a to b.. Thru Water or the > > air.. Or I suppose continental drift for that matter. > > > > Anyway, looks like a great book I just bought it from Amazon I'll > > check it out thanks for the rec. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > Kramer > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:16 PM > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > The best way to look at these "theories" is to use Ockham's Razor: > > > > > > > > That's the principal that states that the simplest explanation is > > usually correct. When you hear hoof beats think horse not zebra. No > > comets are needed to explain the presence of diamonds or gold. > > > > BK > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Jacob Linder > wrote: > > > > > I will check it out, thank you. > > > I want trying to be an ass, I've just been listening and reading on > > > here for a while learning as much as I can, and when something like > > > that is said, and I don't get your reply I wanted a little more than > > > that .. Much appreicated. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > Kramer > > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 7:06 PMazor > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > collectors > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > You should read "The Barren Lands" > > > > > > < > > > > > > http://www.amazon.com/Barren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/08050 > > > 71 > > > 857/re > > > f=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1 > > com/Bar ren-Lands-Search-Diamonds-American/dp/0805071857/ref=pd_bbs_s > > > r_ 1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215741849&sr=8-1> > > > > > > > > > > An excellent book, a good scientific detective story and you'll then > > > know where the diamonds came from. Good price too. > > > > > > BK > > > > > > On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Jacob Linder > > wrote: > > > > > > > Did you even read it? > > > > > > > > I would love to hear exactly why you think the that? I actually > > > > read the story and it says that they found a few specimen in one > > > > area that came from another and they speculated that it was from > > > > an asteroid hitting, thus toss debris from the ground it hit into > > > > the air, or from glacier melt.. Doesn't seem all that "crazy"... > > > > It says nothing about "all" of them coming from a comet.. That's > > > > just hyped > > nonsense trashtalk. > > > > > > > > "New chemical analyses of diamond, gold and silver found in Ohio > > > > and Indiana reveal the minerals were transported there from Canada > > > > several thousand years ago. The question is, how? " > > > > ... > > > > "The diamonds, gold and silver could have been ejected into the > > > > air during the blasts, West said, or they could have been carried > > > > south by rivers formed from the melt water of liquified glaciers. " > > > > ... > > > > "We're a long way from saying categorically that these things got > > > > here because of this event," West said. "They're consistent, but > > > > we've got a lot more work to do to show there's a direct connection." > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Have a good day. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan > > > > Kramer > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:49 PM > > > > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > > collectors > > > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds > > > > > > > > I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside > > > > their pyramids in Taos NM. > > > > > > > > BK > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 7:54 PM, Jeanne Rhodes-Moen > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > a new theory says that gold, silver, diamonds etc found in Eastern > N. > > > > > America may have come from a comet that shattered over Canada > > > > > during the last Ice Age.. > > > > > > > > > > http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080707-canada-diamonds.ht > > > > > ml > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > > North Florida, USA > > > > photos at: > > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > > --- > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1543 - Release Date: > > > > 7/9/2008 > > > > 6:32 PM > > > > > > > > -- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > > Subscription Services: > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listi nfo/rockhounds > > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, > > > and put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > > North Florida, USA > > > photos at: > > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > > multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > > --- > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > > 7/10/2008 > > > 6:43 PM > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > > put on the breastplate of righteousness." > > > > > > J Bryan Kramer > > North Florida, USA > > photos at: > > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: > > 7/10/2008 > > 6:43 PM > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put > on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.7/1545 - Release Date: 7/10/2008 > 6:43 PM > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Pa ge, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Fri Jul 11 15:45:32 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Fri Jul 11 15:45:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of the stones... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000b01c8e3a7$d3470670$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Hi Pete & all. I wrote: > If I remember correctly it 's cerium(/lead?) + > manganese/lead that cause the pink fluorescence in long wave > UV and cerium =>europium that are responsible for the blue > phosphorescence in short wave. And then you wrote: > And, Axel, I think you are going beyond anything that is > definitely known here. Yes, it has been hypothesized that > europium is "probably" the cause of the blue fluorescence > and phosphorescence, but that's about it I think, as far as > real knowledge. And then I write again: Absolutely. I know remember that I read about Glen Waychunas having researched this type of material and I believe that the conclusion was indeed a "probable" or something along those lines. It was also a slip of the keyboard ;-)) I should have phrased it more like "If I remember correctly it 's BELIEVED TO BE cerium(/lead?) + manganese/lead etcetera... I beg extensive pardons from everybody all over the place. I'm usually more careful. >Other minerals that fluoresce due to > europium (such as > fluorite) fluoresce LW rather than short, Yes, but wasn't there something said about the blue fluorescence actually NOT being fluorescence but phosphorescence caused by energy transfer (electrochemically) between cerium and europium? You can actually see the ph coming up if you flash a SW light over a TT-calcite. Short pink burst and then it turns blue. I have REE-doped ceramics that behave the same way but slower (red-pink to blue over a period of several seconds). > and do not > phosphoresce; and Mn/Pb produces the common red/orange fl. in > calcite, but that's quite unlike the pink LW of > Terlingua-type calcite. Not if you shine a REALLY REALLY LW source on it. Under 390 nm all my TT-calcite glows orange red... The shorter the wavelength the stronger the blue PH gets. At 350 nm you get a few specimens that fluoresce straw-yellow to pink and at 320 nm some specimens are nearly white. > So I still think everybody is just > guessing at this. I know a few people have played around > with some research on this, but I don't think anything > formal or conclusive has ever been published--again, I'd LOVE > to know that I am wrong, and I would love it if anyone could > direct us to any actual published articles giving hard data > about this type of calcite! Yeah, I'd love to know too ;-))) Cheers Axel From leeper at molalla.net Fri Jul 11 22:05:09 2008 From: leeper at molalla.net (Doug Leeper) Date: Fri Jul 11 22:06:09 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 12 References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC> If you have a piece of this calcite that does this that you can part with, I can obtain a very accurate response in the visible spectrum, possibly that may show the source? I'm thinking like emission lines you get from various elements... I have sources with 365nm, 290nm, 390nm, and 460nm dominant wavelengths I could stimulate it with. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 6:01 PM Subject: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 12 > Send Rockhounds mailing list submissions to > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > rockhounds-request@lists.drizzle.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > rockhounds-owner@lists.drizzle.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Rockhounds digest..." > > > [Rockhounds-Digest] > > Today's Topics: > > 1. RE: REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of the > stones... (Axel Emmermann) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 00:45:32 +0200 > From: "Axel Emmermann" > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] REE, calcite, and lost and hidden secrets of > the stones... > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors'" > Message-ID: <000b01c8e3a7$d3470670$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="us-ascii" > > Hi Pete & all. > > I wrote: >> If I remember correctly it 's cerium(/lead?) + >> manganese/lead that cause the pink fluorescence in long wave >> UV and cerium =>europium that are responsible for the blue >> phosphorescence in short wave. > > And then you wrote: > >> And, Axel, I think you are going beyond anything that is >> definitely known here. Yes, it has been hypothesized that >> europium is "probably" the cause of the blue fluorescence >> and phosphorescence, but that's about it I think, as far as >> real knowledge. > > And then I write again: > Absolutely. I know remember that I read about Glen Waychunas having > researched this type of material and I believe that the conclusion was > indeed a "probable" or something along those lines. It was also a slip of > the keyboard ;-)) I should have phrased it more like "If I remember > correctly it 's BELIEVED TO BE cerium(/lead?) + manganese/lead etcetera... > I beg extensive pardons from everybody all over the place. I'm usually > more > careful. > >>Other minerals that fluoresce due to >> europium (such as >> fluorite) fluoresce LW rather than short, > > Yes, but wasn't there something said about the blue fluorescence actually > NOT being fluorescence but phosphorescence caused by energy transfer > (electrochemically) between cerium and europium? > You can actually see the ph coming up if you flash a SW light over a > TT-calcite. Short pink burst and then it turns blue. I have REE-doped > ceramics that behave the same way but slower (red-pink to blue over a > period > of several seconds). > >> and do not >> phosphoresce; and Mn/Pb produces the common red/orange fl. in >> calcite, but that's quite unlike the pink LW of >> Terlingua-type calcite. > > Not if you shine a REALLY REALLY LW source on it. Under 390 nm all my > TT-calcite glows orange red... The shorter the wavelength the stronger the > blue PH gets. At 350 nm you get a few specimens that fluoresce > straw-yellow > to pink and at 320 nm some specimens are nearly white. > >> So I still think everybody is just >> guessing at this. I know a few people have played around >> with some research on this, but I don't think anything >> formal or conclusive has ever been published--again, I'd LOVE >> to know that I am wrong, and I would love it if anyone could >> direct us to any actual published articles giving hard data >> about this type of calcite! > > Yeah, I'd love to know too ;-))) > > Cheers > Axel > > > > ------------------------------ > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > End of Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 12 > ****************************************** From donhalterman at verizon.net Fri Jul 11 22:48:13 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Fri Jul 11 22:45:44 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC> Message-ID: <4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> Doug Leeper wrote: > If you have a piece of this calcite that does this that you can part > with, I can obtain a very accurate response in the visible spectrum, > possibly that may show the source? > > I'm thinking like emission lines you get from various elements... > > I have sources with 365nm, 290nm, 390nm, and 460nm dominant wavelengths > I could stimulate it with. Hi Doug, I think the issue here is that we don't know the exact electron transitions that cause the colors. I encourage your experimentation, but you might like to know what has gone before. Some experiments were performed on this calcite by a young student who was working with George Rossman at CalTech. The results were published in UV Waves, a publication of the Fluorescent Mineral Society. I don't have the issue at hand and I don't remember exactly what was, and was not, determined by those experiments. Along with Earl Verbeek at the Sterling Hill Mining Museum and the Thomas S. Warren Museum of Fluorescence, I used a Varian Cary Eclipse UV-VIS spectrophotometer to run continuous scans on Terlingua-type calcites. Their emissions are complex, with at least three and possibly four emission peaks in the LW UV as well as in the visible, along with the issues of primary and secondary fluorescence and phosphorescence. I was speaking with an experienced spectroscopist last week about another matter, and the subject of this calcite came up. The consensus was that more detailed work needs to be done, possibly using laser ablation inductively coupled mass spectrometry to ascertain the trace elements, and I think it would be useful to conduct single-crystal x-ray diffraction to try to determine the distributions and ordering of those trace elements. If anyone has done these things, neither of us was aware of it. Certain substitutions and their effects are well known; others are not. For example, divalent europium can substitute nicely for calcium in many structures (depending on how many oxygen surround the calcite in the coordination polyhedron), due to its size and charge. Europium is known to produce a blue fluorescence, though I imagine this is not an iron-clad rule and may depend upon what mineral it is substituted into and also what co-activators exist as well, and also structural defects introduced into the mineral. On the other hand, some activators are not well documented at all, though there may be educated speculation for some of them. The end result is that you may get a well-defined emission spectrum for Terlingua-type calcite, but the real challenge is defining the cause of each primary and secondary fluorescence and the phosphorescence seen at each excitation wavelength, since it all changes as the excitation wavelength increases. Unfortunately, all my specimens are packed away in preparation for moving to wherever my new job (when I get one) will be, or else I would send you a piece. If no one on the list has some to spare, you can always buy a small piece from an Internet dealer. I encourage you to see what you can discover. best, Don From AFunWench at aol.com Sat Jul 12 00:35:29 2008 From: AFunWench at aol.com (AFunWench@aol.com) Date: Sat Jul 12 00:39:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Article: Rain of Diamonds Message-ID: "J Bryan Kramer" _codeburner@gmail.com_ (mailto:codeburner@gmail.com) I assume this theory was developed by those idiots sitting inside their pyramids in Taos NM. BK I think...the "idots" are named DeBeers, and they're sitting in South Africa. Take a moment, and view (at least) the first video. Nice, dramatic film. Thanks, Meade The Diamond Odessy-Origin of Diamonds _http://www.debeers.com/stry/video02_ (http://www.debeers.com/stry/video02) In the beginning there was the ancient eternal night and then a bright light in the darkness, Genesis ? Lightening and Thunder ? the first meaning of the word diamond. The Diamond Odyssey-Valley of diamonds _http://www.debeers.com/stry/video01_ (http://www.debeers.com/stry/video01) It is a thousand year old legend that still travels around the world through time, it appears in Chinese writings in Arab texts in European narratives but in all languages in all civilisations it has but one name The legend of the Valley of Diamonds. **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 12 05:17:05 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 12 05:17:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com><001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC> <4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> Message-ID: <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Hi Don, I hadn't seen Doug Leeper's response to this issue because it was automatically moved to the waste-bin. "Issue" being the key word. All "Rockhounds Digest... Vol..., Issue..." go directly into the waste bin. I have too little time to go figure out what is inside messages from people that deliberately obscure the content by changing a perfectly clear title to something so unimaginative. I'm sure most of us appreciate how the title of the message changed back to "Terlingua-type calcite". This being said, you wrote: > For example, divalent europium can substitute nicely for > calcium in many structures (depending on how many oxygen > surround the calcite in the coordination polyhedron), due to > its size and charge. Europium is known to produce a blue > fluorescence, though I imagine this is not an iron-clad rule > and may depend upon what mineral it is substituted into and > also what co-activators exist as well, and also structural > defects introduced into the mineral. On the other hand, some > activators are not well documented at all, though there may > be educated speculation for some of them. I'd have to look up the exact page (it's somewhere around p. 200) but I think that my Marfunin says somewhere that DIVALENT REE don't feel the crystal field effect much whereas higher valences of REE do. That has to do with it being not the outer electrons but the "underlying" shell" doing the transition number on us while shielded by . So the spectrum of Eu2+ in feldspars, quartz and other minerals should be quite similar (not congruent but similar) so basically blue. If this is true (if it isn't I'm still blaming my memory losses on the anesthetics ;-))) then large differences between spectra of Eu2+ activated minerals would rather be caused by absorption, other activators, energy exchange between Eu2+ and other REE or similar elements like yttrium or scandium, inclusion of organic matter and other minerals. The very strong electro negativity of Fluor may do "something" to the spectrum of fluorite or not, but caged in in oxygen-polyhedra there should be little or no shifts of the peaks that are species-dependent. Or I'm wrong and it are the trivalent REE that don't react much to crystal field effects and non of the above is true... Anyway, I'm glad I could clear that up (very LOL). There, now I've said it. ;-) I 'm trying to get myself to re-read the entire "Spectroscopy, Luminescence and Radiation Centers in Minerals" by Arnold Marfunin. I didn't quite get the full concept the first time around ;-))) So I thought that my vague ramblings might better be interpreted and revised by some bright new professional ;-))) Any sense to be found in this??? Axel From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Sat Jul 12 06:36:00 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Sat Jul 12 06:36:14 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit Message-ID: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals in our daily life. I have found plenty of information at www.mii.org and at the USGS. My plan is to set up an office with a computer, clock radio, desk lamp, metal desk and chair, etc. and display minerals used to make those products. (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling and room lights...) I welcome exhibit suggestions. Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does anyone know what materials were added to the steel for strength. I know that titanium, antimony, etc. are added to strengthen steel. Alan G. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From donhalterman at verizon.net Sat Jul 12 10:41:23 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Sat Jul 12 10:38:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com><001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC> <4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <4878ECC3.9090100@verizon.net> Hi Axel, That makes sense in as much as I know crystal field theory. However, learning crystal field theory requires a suspension of sanity and opening one's mind to the concept that an electron is both a particle and a wave, among other things. It is so arcane that even in advanced mineralogy class, we only touched upon the basics. The rest is very elaborate and ponderous mathematics. But yes, the bonding behavior and the electron transitions that produce color are governed by the orbital configuration and by the structure into which an atom is bound. In addition, some color effects are anisotropic, which means they are dependent upon the orientation of the material relative to the light entering it. Most people know this as "pleochroism" or "dichroism", among other terms. best, Don From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 12 12:00:12 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 12 12:00:14 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> References: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> Message-ID: <003101c8e451$831d5280$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Marvelous idea Alan! A ballpoint pen alone may require enough minerals to fill the desk. ;-))) I think you're in for a shock if you look at the number of minerals involved. A ballpoint pen needs: Molybdenum, copper, tungsten, carbon and some other metals for the tip. Silica as a filler and friction reducer, titanium dioxide as a whitener for the pigments, chromium and several rare earth elements as catalyst for making the polyethylene ink tube, iron and trace elements for the metal spring..... What would you need to make a laser printer? Selenium, tellurium..... I hope you have a BIG office with lots of display room. Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Alan Goldstein > Verzonden: zaterdag 12 juli 2008 14:36 > Aan: Rockhounds List > Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit > > I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals > in our daily life. I have found plenty of information at > www.mii.org and at the USGS. My plan is to set up an office > with a computer, clock radio, desk lamp, metal desk and > chair, etc. and display minerals used to make those products. > (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling and room lights...) > > I welcome exhibit suggestions. > > Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does > anyone know what materials were added to the steel for > strength. I know that titanium, antimony, etc. are added to > strengthen steel. > > Alan G. > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Sat Jul 12 16:42:48 2008 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Sat Jul 12 16:42:57 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books In-Reply-To: References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: <019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi> I'm downsizing the geology book collection that I put together back in the 60's and have a lot of Illinois, Kentucky, Ohio, and who-knows-what state survey publications. Is there any interest on the list in them? I'd like to sell them to the list first, then there off to eBay. If there's interest, I'll make up a list. Gary From hugheslapidary at comcast.net Sat Jul 12 17:56:52 2008 From: hugheslapidary at comcast.net (hugheslapidary) Date: Sat Jul 12 17:50:18 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> <019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: I am interested one can never have enough books. Please make a list. Brian -------------------------------------------------- From: "Gary Brown" Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 4:42 PM To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books > I'm downsizing the geology book collection that I put together back in the > 60's and have a lot of Illinois, Kentucky, Ohio, and who-knows-what state > survey publications. Is there any interest on the list in them? I'd like > to sell them to the list first, then there off to eBay. If there's > interest, I'll make up a list. > > Gary > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From sunstone3 at hvc.rr.com Sat Jul 12 17:59:54 2008 From: sunstone3 at hvc.rr.com (Carolyn Reynard) Date: Sat Jul 12 17:53:30 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> <019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: <000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> I am interested in seeing a list! Carolyn Reynard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Brown" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 7:42 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books > I'm downsizing the geology book collection that I put together back in the > 60's and have a lot of Illinois, Kentucky, Ohio, and who-knows-what state > survey publications. Is there any interest on the list in them? I'd like > to sell them to the list first, then there off to eBay. If there's > interest, I'll make up a list. > > Gary > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Sat Jul 12 18:45:53 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Sat Jul 12 18:45:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit References: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> <003101c8e451$831d5280$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <83491EFBFC254E57B3EB59E4CC103D38@Goldstein> The Mineral Information Institute indicates there are 35 minerals and metals in a computer. Why they distinguish metals from minerals, I do not know. I don't have every element represented in the collection I plan to use (my own, plus any I need from some other local collectors). The exhibit will have a good representative selection. My plan is to number the office items and list them on the labels with the minerals. I also plan to cluster minerals based on the important element (i.e., iron minerals, copper, lead, barium, fluorine, etc.). Obviously some minerals will be used in a lot of products. One of the objectives of the exhibit is to show the beautiful and colorful minerals that are sacrificed (and save from the mill) to make those products. Regards, Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 3:00 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit > Marvelous idea Alan! > A ballpoint pen alone may require enough minerals to fill the desk. ;-))) > I think you're in for a shock if you look at the number of minerals > involved. > A ballpoint pen needs: > Molybdenum, copper, tungsten, carbon and some other metals for the tip. > Silica as a filler and friction reducer, titanium dioxide as a whitener > for > the pigments, chromium and several rare earth elements as catalyst for > making the polyethylene ink tube, iron and trace elements for the metal > spring..... > > What would you need to make a laser printer? Selenium, tellurium..... I > hope > you have a BIG office with lots of display room. > > Cheers > Axel > > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Alan Goldstein >> Verzonden: zaterdag 12 juli 2008 14:36 >> Aan: Rockhounds List >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit >> >> I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals >> in our daily life. I have found plenty of information at >> www.mii.org and at the USGS. My plan is to set up an office >> with a computer, clock radio, desk lamp, metal desk and >> chair, etc. and display minerals used to make those products. >> (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling and room lights...) >> >> I welcome exhibit suggestions. >> >> Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does >> anyone know what materials were added to the steel for >> strength. I know that titanium, antimony, etc. are added to >> strengthen steel. >> >> Alan G. >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From folmstead at rcn.com Sat Jul 12 19:28:12 2008 From: folmstead at rcn.com (Frederick Olmstead) Date: Sat Jul 12 19:28:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nat'l Limestone, pa In-Reply-To: <000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> <019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi> <000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Message-ID: <4879683C.5030701@rcn.com> Hello I am looking for the email for the National Limestone Quarry, PA 217 Quarry Road or email for Eric... the Pres. Thankzzz GeorgiaO From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sat Jul 12 19:42:21 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Jul 12 19:42:25 2008 Subject: [JunkMail] [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> Message-ID: <5101D6BC-5085-11DD-B42F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Alan, Most stainless steel medical instruments use cobalt as an additive for strength, toughness, and for the ability to keep sharp edges. I applaud your exhibit concept! When you finish it, would you consider sharing your list of common objects and the minerals that contribute to them? I'm always looking for for new ways to connect minerals to everyday life in my classroom presentations. And since you are talking about dental stuff, don't forget the pumice grit and fluoride in toothpaste. I always get a reaction when kids find out they brush their teeth (also a mineral) with rocks. Kreigh On Saturday, Jul 12, 2008, at 09:36 America/Detroit, Alan Goldstein wrote: > I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals in our > daily life. I have found plenty of information at www.mii.org and at > the USGS. My plan is to set up an office with a computer, clock radio, > desk lamp, metal desk and chair, etc. and display minerals used to > make those products. (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling and room > lights...) > > I welcome exhibit suggestions. > > Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does anyone know > what materials were added to the steel for strength. I know that > titanium, antimony, etc. are added to strengthen steel. > > Alan G. > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sat Jul 12 20:10:32 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sat Jul 12 20:10:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nat'l Limestone, pa In-Reply-To: <4879683C.5030701@rcn.com> Message-ID: <412CD052-5089-11DD-B42F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> A quick google search returns http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/product-compint-0000536258-page.html that gives Private Company, Headquarters Location PO Box 397, Middleburg, PA17842, United States (570)837-1635, Perhaps the phone number will help. Kreigh On Saturday, Jul 12, 2008, at 22:28 America/Detroit, Frederick Olmstead wrote: > > Hello From lanny.r at roadrunner.com Sat Jul 12 21:51:22 2008 From: lanny.r at roadrunner.com (Lanny R) Date: Sat Jul 12 21:53:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> References: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> Message-ID: <54A0839F-3B4A-4B32-834B-1ECEE046EBF3@roadrunner.com> Hi Alan, Great project. The Nevada Division of Minerals has an active program on providing that kind of education materials to teachers and schools. Go to the following link; they have a lot of info. Specifically, click on the "Education Materials" link. There are a lot of individual items on what minerals are required for various common items, how much we use each day, etc. One page shows a car and how much of each metal is in it, and how much ore it takes to produce it. http://minerals.state.nv.us/prog_education.htm And there is the Mineral Information Institute with similar info: http://www.mii.org Good luck with it. Regards, Lanny On Jul 12, 2008, at 6:36 AM, Alan Goldstein wrote: > I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals in our > daily life. I have found plenty of information at www.mii.org and at > the USGS. My plan is to set up an office with a computer, clock > radio, desk lamp, metal desk and chair, etc. and display minerals > used to make those products. (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling > and room lights...) > > I welcome exhibit suggestions. > > Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does anyone know > what materials were added to the steel for strength. I know that > titanium, antimony, etc. are added to strengthen steel. > > Alan G. > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sun Jul 13 02:58:23 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Jul 13 02:58:30 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <83491EFBFC254E57B3EB59E4CC103D38@Goldstein> References: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein><003101c8e451$831d5280$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <83491EFBFC254E57B3EB59E4CC103D38@Goldstein> Message-ID: <000701c8e4cf$0027ca30$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > The Mineral Information Institute indicates there are 35 > minerals and metals in a computer. Why they distinguish > metals from minerals, I do not know. Maybe because some minerals are used "as is" in plastics and ceramics. For example: micas and clay minerals are often used to enhance electric insulation of plastics. Silica is used to reduce friction in sheet plastic. Here's another: sulfur to vulcanize the rubber anti-friction pads under your keyboard. Gallium, indium, arsenic for the LED lights. Chlorine in the PVC of the power cables would come from halite. Magnetite for the floppy disks and harrdive. Mercury and xenon for the UV lamps for hardening the glues, plastics and varnishes are used for making your office but are no longer part of it. Do you want to include those? Cheers Axel From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Sun Jul 13 08:26:14 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Sun Jul 13 08:41:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit References: <53BBB753E81B49A288C26C0E2FD8B336@Goldstein> <003101c8e451$831d5280$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <83491EFBFC254E57B3EB59E4CC103D38@Goldstein> <000701c8e4cf$0027ca30$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <6424F1D090C9410A818649272D019FED@Goldstein> I am only going to use materials in the final product, with the exception of a few things (like fluorite to help purify molten iron). I don't want to research every step. No time and it is beyond the scope of the exhibit. This exhibit will run from late August through late November. I don't intend to put in hundreds of hours of research time for an exhibit that is only up for four months. I've only got 6 display cases anyway. They are large enough to hold several hundred specimens. And since this is an exhibit for the general public, I am going to utilize more pretty pieces than ores. Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 5:58 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit >> The Mineral Information Institute indicates there are 35 >> minerals and metals in a computer. Why they distinguish >> metals from minerals, I do not know. > > Maybe because some minerals are used "as is" in plastics and ceramics. > For example: micas and clay minerals are often used to enhance electric > insulation of plastics. Silica is used to reduce friction in sheet > plastic. > > Here's another: sulfur to vulcanize the rubber anti-friction pads under > your > keyboard. Gallium, indium, arsenic for the LED lights. Chlorine in the PVC > of the power cables would come from halite. Magnetite for the floppy disks > and harrdive. > Mercury and xenon for the UV lamps for hardening the glues, plastics and > varnishes are used for making your office but are no longer part of it. Do > you want to include those? > > Cheers > Axel > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From kadok at infowest.com Sun Jul 13 09:40:11 2008 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Sun Jul 13 09:30:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Nat'l Limestone, pa In-Reply-To: <4879683C.5030701@rcn.com> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi> <019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> <4879683C.5030701@rcn.com> Message-ID: <001801c8e507$1ebf1470$0200a8c0@kadok> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] Nat'l Limestone, pa >Hello >I am looking for the email >for the >National Limestone Quarry, PA >217 Quarry Road >or email for Eric... the Pres. >Thankzzz >GeorgiaO Just Google it1 Margaret -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Sun Jul 13 13:18:24 2008 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Sun Jul 13 13:18:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] AD: Old Geology Books In-Reply-To: <000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi> <000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Message-ID: <020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi> Here's the list: http://www.catspaw-minerals.com/images/geol%20pubs.txt I'd like to get $50 plus shipping for the lot. GcB From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Sun Jul 13 15:28:03 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Sun Jul 13 15:30:50 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> <020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi> Message-ID: <001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush> I recently inherited a bunch of things from an old defunct rock shop.....lots of minerals and lapidary material, which I have yet to identify, sort, and itemize. But, there was one fossil which I can offer to anyone who wants it. It is the imprint of an Ammonite (I think). You can see it at: www.ConnRoxMinerals.com/Ammonite I do not know where it was found, or anything at all about it. It is in a limestone matrix, and is approx. 20X25X7 cm in overall size, and the base has been sawn to stand upright. If anyone wants it, make me a reasonable offer ( including $10 postage)............. Larry Rush From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Sun Jul 13 15:32:03 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Sun Jul 13 15:34:49 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi> <001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush> Well, that didn't work.... try: http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lawrence Rush" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 6:28 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) >I recently inherited a bunch of things from an old defunct rock >shop.....lots of minerals and lapidary material, which I have yet to >identify, sort, and itemize. > > But, there was one fossil which I can offer to anyone who wants it. It is > the imprint of an Ammonite (I think). You can see it at: > > www.ConnRoxMinerals.com/Ammonite > > I do not know where it was found, or anything at all about it. It is in a > limestone matrix, and is approx. 20X25X7 cm in overall size, and the base > has been sawn to stand upright. > > If anyone wants it, make me a reasonable offer ( including $10 > postage)............. > > Larry Rush > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From VevaBailey at aol.com Sun Jul 13 16:12:09 2008 From: VevaBailey at aol.com (VevaBailey@aol.com) Date: Sun Jul 13 16:15:21 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) Message-ID: Hi Larry; The page to look at the Ammonite can't be found. Veva ______________________________________________________________________________ ____ In a message dated 7/13/2008 3:31:28 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, larryrush@worldnet.att.net writes: I recently inherited a bunch of things from an old defunct rock shop.....lots of minerals and lapidary material, which I have yet to identify, sort, and itemize. But, there was one fossil which I can offer to anyone who wants it. It is the imprint of an Ammonite (I think). You can see it at: www.ConnRoxMinerals.com/Ammonite I do not know where it was found, or anything at all about it. It is in a limestone matrix, and is approx. 20X25X7 cm in overall size, and the base has been sawn to stand upright. If anyone wants it, make me a reasonable offer ( including $10 postage)............. Larry Rush -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From VevaBailey at aol.com Sun Jul 13 16:14:01 2008 From: VevaBailey at aol.com (VevaBailey@aol.com) Date: Sun Jul 13 16:15:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) Message-ID: Sorry, I didn't look at the next posting!! Veva In a message dated 7/13/2008 3:35:19 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, larryrush@worldnet.att.net writes: Well, that didn't work.... try: http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lawrence Rush" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 6:28 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Ammonite (Ad) >I recently inherited a bunch of things from an old defunct rock >shop.....lots of minerals and lapidary material, which I have yet to >identify, sort, and itemize. > > But, there was one fossil which I can offer to anyone who wants it. It is > the imprint of an Ammonite (I think). You can see it at: > > www.ConnRoxMinerals.com/Ammonite > > I do not know where it was found, or anything at all about it. It is in a > limestone matrix, and is approx. 20X25X7 cm in overall size, and the base > has been sawn to stand upright. > > If anyone wants it, make me a reasonable offer ( including $10 > postage)............. > > Larry Rush > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 13 18:57:40 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 13 18:57:46 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Millions of years ago, the American Southwest sat next to East Antarctica Message-ID: <3D9D7C41-5148-11DD-B42F-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> What a juxtaposition: About 800 million years ago, East Antarctica, now one of the coldest regions on Earth, abutted what is now California?s Death Valley, one of the hottest. Both locales were part of an equatorial supercontinent called Rodinia, says John Goodge, a geologist at the University of Minnesota Duluth. http://sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/34011/title/Howdy%2C_neighbor! From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 13 19:18:35 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 13 19:18:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years Message-ID: <29B78C17-514B-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> In the lab, the Moon rocks look nondescript ? dark gray basalt, a whitish mineral called anorthosite and mixtures of the two with crystals thrown in. Yet nearly 40 years after the Apollo astronauts brought the first rocks back to Earth, these pieces of the Moon are still providing scientists with new secrets from another world. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the Moon Rocks so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? They are still available. Kreigh From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 13 19:27:29 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 13 19:27:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <6424F1D090C9410A818649272D019FED@Goldstein> Message-ID: <67E62604-514C-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Alan, Any chance of your photographing the exhibit specimens in detail and putting it on the Museum's website, with the labels as text captions to the pictures? The variety of common objects and specimens should make some interesting search engine index entries and draw traffic to your website. It would also draw a lot of rockhounds. ;-} Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 13, 2008, at 11:26 America/Detroit, Alan Goldstein wrote: > I am only going to use materials in the final product, with the > exception of a few things (like fluorite to help purify molten iron). > I don't want to research every step. No time and it is beyond the > scope of the exhibit. > > This exhibit will run from late August through late November. I don't > intend to put in hundreds of hours of research time for an exhibit > that is only up for four months. I've only got 6 display cases anyway. > They are large enough to hold several hundred specimens. And since > this is an exhibit for the general public, I am going to utilize more > pretty pieces than ores. > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" > > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors'" > Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 5:58 AM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit > > >>> The Mineral Information Institute indicates there are 35 >>> minerals and metals in a computer. Why they distinguish >>> metals from minerals, I do not know. >> >> Maybe because some minerals are used "as is" in plastics and ceramics. >> For example: micas and clay minerals are often used to enhance >> electric >> insulation of plastics. Silica is used to reduce friction in sheet >> plastic. >> >> Here's another: sulfur to vulcanize the rubber anti-friction pads >> under your >> keyboard. Gallium, indium, arsenic for the LED lights. Chlorine in >> the PVC >> of the power cables would come from halite. Magnetite for the floppy >> disks >> and harrdive. >> Mercury and xenon for the UV lamps for hardening the glues, plastics >> and >> varnishes are used for making your office but are no longer part of >> it. Do >> you want to include those? >> >> Cheers >> Axel >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 13 19:56:06 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 13 19:56:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mineral exhibit In-Reply-To: <54A0839F-3B4A-4B32-834B-1ECEE046EBF3@roadrunner.com> Message-ID: <67A83B24-5150-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Thanks Lanny! When I do a classroom presentation I always offer the teacher an opportunity to photocopy my folder of public domain earth science handouts (some have come from Pete Modreski; thanks Pete!). Your Nevada link has let me add several new handouts to my folder. I appreciate your sharing the resource. Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 13, 2008, at 00:51 America/Detroit, Lanny R wrote: > Hi Alan, > > Great project. The Nevada Division of Minerals has an active program > on providing that kind of education materials to teachers and schools. > Go to the following link; they have a lot of info. Specifically, click > on the "Education Materials" link. There are a lot of individual items > on what minerals are required for various common items, how much we > use each day, etc. One page shows a car and how much of each metal is > in it, and how much ore it takes to produce it. > > http://minerals.state.nv.us/prog_education.htm > > And there is the Mineral Information Institute with similar info: > > http://www.mii.org > > Good luck with it. > > Regards, > > Lanny > > > > On Jul 12, 2008, at 6:36 AM, Alan Goldstein wrote: > >> I am developing an exhibit on the use of rocks and minerals in our >> daily life. I have found plenty of information at www.mii.org and at >> the USGS. My plan is to set up an office with a computer, clock >> radio, desk lamp, metal desk and chair, etc. and display minerals >> used to make those products. (Also the floor, walls & paint, ceiling >> and room lights...) >> >> I welcome exhibit suggestions. >> >> Question -- I'm going to display some dental picks. Does anyone know >> what materials were added to the steel for strength. I know that >> titanium, antimony, etc. are added to strengthen steel. >> >> Alan G. >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Jul 14 09:24:23 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Jul 14 09:24:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <29B78C17-514B-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <29B78C17-514B-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001d01c8e5ce$13db1e10$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > > http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ > 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A > > Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the > Moon Rocks so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to > borrow one? They are still available. > > Kreigh > Absolutely Kreigh! Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth elements would be in their lowest possible oxidation state. I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of fluorescence on those lunar samples. Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I would LOVE to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) Cheers Axel From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Jul 14 09:42:04 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Jul 14 09:42:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <4878ECC3.9090100@verizon.net> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com><001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC><4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <4878ECC3.9090100@verizon.net> Message-ID: <001e01c8e5d0$8c7c1700$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Don H wrote: > is bound. In addition, some color effects are anisotropic, > which means they are dependent upon the orientation of the > material relative to the light entering it. Most people know > this as "pleochroism" or "dichroism", among other terms. > I have some nice pics of anisotopic effects in fluorescence. I'm not sure if I sent them before..I'll send you som off list. Cheers Axel From pmodreski at aol.com Mon Jul 14 09:54:01 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Mon Jul 14 09:54:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <001e01c8e5d0$8c7c1700$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com><001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC><4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <4878ECC3.9090100@verizon.net> <001e01c8e5d0$8c7c1700$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <8CAB3E959F90107-86C-A4A@webmail-dd20.sysops.aol.com> Axel, I'd enjoy receiving those too, if you don't mind.? (Don't remember if I have seen those pictures of yours before, or not.) I'm curious as to how visible this phenomenon really is--and that it is truly anisotropic fluorescence that one is seeing, and not just an artifact of irregular shape or transparency of the specimen (you know me, always the skeptic!). Thank you, Pete -----Original Message----- From: Axel Emmermann To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Sent: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:42 am Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite Don H wrote: > is bound. In addition, some color effects are anisotropic, > which means they are dependent upon the orientation of the > material relative to the light entering it. Most people know > this as "pleochroism" or "dichroism", among other terms. > I have some nice pics of anisotopic effects in fluorescence. I'm not sure if I sent them before..I'll send you som off list. Cheers Axel -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Mon Jul 14 10:29:10 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Mon Jul 14 10:29:10 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite In-Reply-To: <8CAB3E959F90107-86C-A4A@webmail-dd20.sysops.aol.com> References: <200807120101.m6C11od9011045@bubbleator.drizzle.com><001a01c8e3dc$db4bfe40$0201a8c0@DOUGSPC><4878459D.6050108@verizon.net> <001001c8e419$32d16c40$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <4878ECC3.9090100@verizon.net><001e01c8e5d0$8c7c1700$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <8CAB3E959F90107-86C-A4A@webmail-dd20.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <002301c8e5d7$20e00220$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Immediately. ;-))) > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens pmodreski@aol.com > Verzonden: maandag 14 juli 2008 17:54 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite > > Axel, > > I'd enjoy receiving those too, if you don't mind.? (Don't > remember if I have seen those pictures of yours before, or not.) > > I'm curious as to how visible this phenomenon really is--and > that it is truly anisotropic fluorescence that one is seeing, > and not just an artifact of irregular shape or transparency > of the specimen (you know me, always the skeptic!). > > Thank you, > Pete > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Axel Emmermann > To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors' > Sent: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 10:42 am > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Terlingua-type calcite > > > > Don H wrote: > > > is bound. In addition, some color effects are anisotropic, which > > means they are dependent upon the orientation of the > material relative > > to the light entering it. Most people know this as > "pleochroism" or > > "dichroism", among other terms. > > > > I have some nice pics of anisotopic effects in fluorescence. > I'm not sure if I sent them before..I'll send you som off list. > > Cheers > Axel > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From turnea55 at hotmail.com Mon Jul 14 12:28:00 2008 From: turnea55 at hotmail.com (Andrew Turner) Date: Mon Jul 14 12:28:46 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit Message-ID: I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was worth bringing up considering my recent visit. Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History while on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's always good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter dismay, the entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now gone. This was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the world as it contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals often collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines and pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons I revisited the museum was to see this room again. Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate change" exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as ridiculing me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax dollars each year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" technologies. They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the world to go into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is really needed, why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science museum a few miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this display in), not to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral collections to make room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems to be the current trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about their collections, I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a Mt. Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like someone "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. Andrew Turner Victorville, CA USA From donhalterman at verizon.net Mon Jul 14 13:06:01 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Mon Jul 14 13:03:18 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <487BB1A9.7000409@verizon.net> The best thing to do is write a well-worded, detailed letter to the curator, the board of regents, and the president of Harvard. It may not do any good, but silence implies consent. BTW, that sort of propaganda doesn't belong in a science museum either... maybe in Ripley's Believe It or Not. best, Don From Kenny.Gay at ncmail.net Mon Jul 14 13:54:27 2008 From: Kenny.Gay at ncmail.net (Kenny Gay) Date: Mon Jul 14 13:54:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath Message-ID: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> List, I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from 1830 till 1888, and was Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. He is not listed in Mineralogical Record biographical section. Thanks in advance! Kenny North Carolina Geological Survey From sunstone3 at hvc.rr.com Mon Jul 14 14:16:57 2008 From: sunstone3 at hvc.rr.com (Carolyn Reynard) Date: Mon Jul 14 14:15:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit References: Message-ID: <001801c8e5f6$f2811340$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Andrew your e-mail was most distressing. Event by event we see our mineral treasures being sold off or packed up and stored (out of sight and probably sold off in the future). We need to protect our great collections! Chances are there was big money behind this decision. It is time for rockhounds to unite! Carolyn Reynard Poughkeepsie, NY ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Turner" To: Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was > worth bringing up considering my recent visit. > > Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History while > on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's always > good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter dismay, the > entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now gone. This > was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the world as it > contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals often > collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines and > pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even > danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons I > revisited the museum was to see this room again. > > Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate change" > exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as ridiculing > me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax dollars each > year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" technologies. > They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the world to go > into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is really needed, > why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science museum a few > miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this display in), not > to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral collections to make > room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems to be the current > trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about their collections, > I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. > > Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any > radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a Mt. > Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like someone > "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. > > Andrew Turner > Victorville, CA USA > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From rik.dillen at skynet.be Mon Jul 14 14:21:26 2008 From: rik.dillen at skynet.be (Rik Dillen) Date: Mon Jul 14 14:21:29 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath In-Reply-To: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> References: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: <000101c8e5f7$933f6f70$b9be4e50$@dillen@skynet.be> I might be able to find some information in my literature on the mineral rathite, a thallium sulfosalt found in the famous Lengenbach quarry, Binntal, Wallis, Switzerland, type locality for many other sulphosalts as well (lengenbachite, sartorite, baumhauerite etc.). We went there about 10 times on holidays, and have known the Imhof family (remember "imhofite" - named for Joseph Imhof) personally. I will need a few days to figure out whether I can supply you (et al.) with more information on von Rath. It's bedtime here :>) Greetings. Rik DILLEN Doornstraat 15, ?B-9170 Sint-Gillis-Waas Belgium E-mail rik.dillen@skynet.be Homepage : http://users.skynet.be/rik.dillen -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Kenny Gay Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 10:54 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath List, I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from 1830 till 1888, and was Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. He is not listed in Mineralogical Record biographical section. Thanks in advance! Kenny North Carolina Geological Survey -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From gregaweis at msn.com Mon Jul 14 14:29:07 2008 From: gregaweis at msn.com (GREGORY WEISBROD) Date: Mon Jul 14 14:29:10 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit [OT] Message-ID: It is strange that those touting political correctness and open minded acceptance of diversity push their pet agendas with such fascist intensity. Of course, we do need to be saved from ourselves and there is not much time. It is still the Cenozoic, though, so it may not be too late. Except, maybe, if you have been exposed to an excess of radiation from living atop a mountain or in a root cellar in Pennsylvania. > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:06:01 -0700> From: donhalterman@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > > The best thing to do is write a well-worded, detailed letter to the > curator, the board of regents, and the president of Harvard. It may not > do any good, but silence implies consent.> > BTW, that sort of propaganda doesn't belong in a science museum > either... maybe in Ripley's Believe It or Not.> > best,> Don> > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> Subscription Services:> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Mon Jul 14 17:22:09 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Mon Jul 14 17:24:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit References: <001801c8e5f6$f2811340$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Message-ID: I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in John S. White in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. I can't comment on their new exhibits since I haven't seen them. However, global climate change is an earth science topic and a viable topic for any science museum, especially natural science. Folks will find the content objectionable if the exhibit is poorly done or if they have established a mindset that there is no change going on. (Or if they are sharply political in nature.) Every climate specialist I have talked to face-to-face agrees that the scientific evidence points to changes occurring at a significantly faster pace than expected. The question is not that the changes aren't occurring, but to what degree are humans affecting the world. I believe that 6.8 BILLION people have the ability to change our climate. True, we don't spew material as dramatically as a Krakatoa, but unlike a volcano, humans don't stop erupting after a few years. We're the atmospheric energizer bunny... we keep polluting and polluting. Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Reynard" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 5:16 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > Andrew your e-mail was most distressing. Event by event we see our > mineral > treasures being sold off or packed up and stored (out of sight and > probably > sold off in the future). We need to protect our great collections! > Chances > are there was big money behind > this decision. It is time for rockhounds to unite! > Carolyn Reynard > Poughkeepsie, NY > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andrew Turner" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > > >> I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was >> worth bringing up considering my recent visit. >> >> Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History > while >> on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's > always >> good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter dismay, > the >> entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now gone. > This >> was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the world as it >> contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals often >> collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines >> and >> pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even >> danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons >> I >> revisited the museum was to see this room again. >> >> Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate > change" >> exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as > ridiculing >> me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax dollars >> each >> year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" technologies. >> They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the world to go >> into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is really >> needed, >> why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science museum a few >> miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this display in), > not >> to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral collections to > make >> room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems to be the >> current >> trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about their collections, >> I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. >> >> Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any >> radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a >> Mt. >> Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like > someone >> "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. >> >> Andrew Turner >> Victorville, CA USA >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 14 17:29:00 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 14 17:29:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil In-Reply-To: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> References: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: <006301c8e611$c767f2d0$5637d870$@com> http://www.kemmerergazette.com/V2_news_articles.php?heading=0&page=&story_id =469 We have known Bob & Bonnie for about 10 years now. This is an awesome story (we had heard it before lol)! Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com From codeburner at gmail.com Mon Jul 14 18:00:19 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Mon Jul 14 18:04:05 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit In-Reply-To: References: <001801c8e5f6$f2811340$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Message-ID: Here: 31,000 and counting real scientists reject anthropogenic climate change. Climate change has become the new religion of many. BK On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 8:22 PM, Alan Goldstein wrote: > I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in John S. White > in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. > > I can't comment on their new exhibits since I haven't seen them. However, > global climate change is an earth science topic and a viable topic for any > science museum, especially natural science. Folks will find the content > objectionable if the exhibit is poorly done or if they have established a > mindset that there is no change going on. (Or if they are sharply political > in nature.) Every climate specialist I have talked to face-to-face agrees > that the scientific evidence points to changes occurring at a significantly > faster pace than expected. The question is not that the changes aren't > occurring, but to what degree are humans affecting the world. I believe that > 6.8 BILLION people have the ability to change our climate. True, we don't > spew material as dramatically as a Krakatoa, but unlike a volcano, humans > don't stop erupting after a few years. We're the atmospheric energizer > bunny... we keep polluting and polluting. > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Reynard" > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 5:16 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > > > Andrew your e-mail was most distressing. Event by event we see our >> mineral >> treasures being sold off or packed up and stored (out of sight and >> probably >> sold off in the future). We need to protect our great collections! Chances >> are there was big money behind >> this decision. It is time for rockhounds to unite! >> Carolyn Reynard >> Poughkeepsie, NY >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Turner" >> To: >> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM >> Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit >> >> >> I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was >>> worth bringing up considering my recent visit. >>> >>> Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History >>> >> while >> >>> on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's >>> >> always >> >>> good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter dismay, >>> >> the >> >>> entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now gone. >>> >> This >> >>> was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the world as it >>> contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals often >>> collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines >>> and >>> pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even >>> danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons >>> I >>> revisited the museum was to see this room again. >>> >>> Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate >>> >> change" >> >>> exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as >>> >> ridiculing >> >>> me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax dollars >>> each >>> year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" technologies. >>> They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the world to go >>> into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is really >>> needed, >>> why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science museum a few >>> miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this display in), >>> >> not >> >>> to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral collections to >>> >> make >> >>> room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems to be the >>> current >>> trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about their collections, >>> I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. >>> >>> Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any >>> radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a >>> Mt. >>> Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like >>> >> someone >> >>> "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. >>> >>> Andrew Turner >>> Victorville, CA USA >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Ozro1 at aol.com Mon Jul 14 18:12:09 2008 From: Ozro1 at aol.com (Ozro1@aol.com) Date: Mon Jul 14 18:13:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 15 Message-ID: Alan- Do you recall what they did with it/what their plans were? The best specimens from many finds in New England have been donated to Harvard to be enjoyed by future generations. Tara Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:22:09 -0400 From: "Alan Goldstein" Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in John S. White in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From efkern at earthlink.net Mon Jul 14 18:40:42 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Mon Jul 14 18:40:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit References: <001801c8e5f6$f2811340$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash> Message-ID: <001c01c8e61b$cb80a3d0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> I share Andrew's disgust with the removal of the geology collection and its substitution with green P.C. propaganda. Bryan, yes, it's called the Green Religion aka extreme environmentalism; which is about controlling what lesser folk than the annointed ones do with their property, money and time. I've heard they even have rituals; one called 'recycling' as I recall. There's a glut of recycled paper on the market, so much so that much of it ends up in landfills or incinerators. Erich Kern Murrieta, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: J Bryan Kramer To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit Here: 31,000 and counting real scientists reject anthropogenic climate change. Climate change has become the new religion of many. BK On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 8:22 PM, Alan Goldstein wrote: > I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in John S. White > in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. > > I can't comment on their new exhibits since I haven't seen them. However, > global climate change is an earth science topic and a viable topic for any > science museum, especially natural science. Folks will find the content > objectionable if the exhibit is poorly done or if they have established a > mindset that there is no change going on. (Or if they are sharply political > in nature.) Every climate specialist I have talked to face-to-face agrees > that the scientific evidence points to changes occurring at a significantly > faster pace than expected. The question is not that the changes aren't > occurring, but to what degree are humans affecting the world. I believe that > 6.8 BILLION people have the ability to change our climate. True, we don't > spew material as dramatically as a Krakatoa, but unlike a volcano, humans > don't stop erupting after a few years. We're the atmospheric energizer > bunny... we keep polluting and polluting. > > Alan > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carolyn Reynard" > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 5:16 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > > > Andrew your e-mail was most distressing. Event by event we see our >> mineral >> treasures being sold off or packed up and stored (out of sight and >> probably >> sold off in the future). We need to protect our great collections! Chances >> are there was big money behind >> this decision. It is time for rockhounds to unite! >> Carolyn Reynard >> Poughkeepsie, NY >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Turner" >> To: >> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM >> Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit >> >> >> I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was >>> worth bringing up considering my recent visit. >>> >>> Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History >>> >> while >> >>> on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's >>> >> always >> >>> good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter dismay, >>> >> the >> >>> entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now gone. >>> >> This >> >>> was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the world as it >>> contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals often >>> collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines >>> and >>> pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even >>> danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons >>> I >>> revisited the museum was to see this room again. >>> >>> Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate >>> >> change" >> >>> exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as >>> >> ridiculing >> >>> me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax dollars >>> each >>> year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" technologies. >>> They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the world to go >>> into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is really >>> needed, >>> why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science museum a few >>> miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this display in), >>> >> not >> >>> to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral collections to >>> >> make >> >>> room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems to be the >>> current >>> trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about their collections, >>> I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. >>> >>> Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any >>> radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a >>> Mt. >>> Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like >>> >> someone >> >>> "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. >>> >>> Andrew Turner >>> Victorville, CA USA >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From whitbre at sbcglobal.net Mon Jul 14 18:50:56 2008 From: whitbre at sbcglobal.net (Brett Whitenack) Date: Mon Jul 14 18:51:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil In-Reply-To: <006301c8e611$c767f2d0$5637d870$@com> Message-ID: <202142.63569.qm@web81407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Congratulations to the"Bat Girl." Must be pretty exciting to unearth something like that. Only thing that bothers me a little bit is that the specimen went to Canada. Is it going to stay there or is it only on display for a specific amount of time and then come home to Wyoming? I may be in the minority but I strongly believe that rare or unusual fossil specimens should stay within their country or state of origin if they can be studied and properly cared for there. Or at least go back to their place of origin after they have been carefully studied at an accredited university or museum. If they are common varieties or duplicates then I would have no problems at all with them going to other places and in fact encourage that so others around the world can share in the wonders of our prehistoric past. However, it's this type of thing that can cause issues with academia and commercial collectors. This specimen, being the first of its kind, is a type specimen and should stay in Wyoming or at least the U.S. even if it was studied by five different museums and other agencies. If I was a commercial collector and went to Canada and found a new species of dinosaur, and donated or sold it to an institution in Europe or elsewhere, wouldn't the people of Canada feel upset that their fossil heritage is leaving the country? I don't mean to sound negative but that's just my opinion for what it is worth. Lastly, while Bonnie Finney isn't the first and only women to have a fossil species named after her, she is in good company: Mary Anning, famous amateur paleontologist of Lyme Regis, England, had two fossil species named after her. Effigia okeeffeae a toothless crocodile relative in New Mexico named after the artist Georgia O'Keeffe. Nelly Hooper Ludbrook, was an Australian paleontologist who had at least 17 fossil species and one genus of fossil mollusk have been named in her honor. Josephine Ettel Kablick was a Czechoslovakian paleontologist and has many plant fossils named after her. I would wager that Bonnie is the first to have a bat fossil named after her though. What an honor and a way to be remembered for her discovery. Brett W. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Mon Jul 14 19:28:50 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Mon Jul 14 19:28:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum References: Message-ID: <8EF1201A3E7A46FEAAC48605E08DC55B@Goldstein> I suggest contacting the mineral museum curator Carl Francis and ask him directly. I can send you his address or you can find it on the museum website. Alan ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:12 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 15 > Alan- Do you recall what they did with it/what their plans were? The best > specimens from many finds in New England have been donated to Harvard to > be > enjoyed by future generations. > Tara > > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:22:09 -0400 > From: "Alan Goldstein" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > > I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in John S. > White > in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. > > > > > > > **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live > music > scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! > (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Mon Jul 14 20:32:14 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Mon Jul 14 20:32:21 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <001d01c8e5ce$13db1e10$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <9DEBDB58-521E-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Axel, A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up 25K+ hits. Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! Kreigh On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: >> >> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >> >> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >> Moon Rocks so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to >> borrow one? They are still available. >> >> Kreigh >> > > Absolutely Kreigh! > Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment (very > little or no available oxygen) most rare earth elements would be in > their > lowest possible oxidation state. > I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of > fluorescence on those lunar samples. > Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I would LOVE > to go > over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. > It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) > > Cheers > Axel > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From ajs at frii.com Mon Jul 14 21:10:43 2008 From: ajs at frii.com (Alan Silverstein) Date: Mon Jul 14 21:10:46 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] climate change... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080715041043.B12081CC35@io.frii.com> > 31,000 and counting real scientists reject anthropogenic climate > change. Climate change has become the new religion of many. Since the conversation has wandered to this point, off-topic as it might be, I hope you won't mind if I pipe up with my $0.02, and hope it's somewhat related to rocks. As an avid reader of Science News (etc) myself, with a BS from Caltech (meaning some healthy skepticism), I was until recently pretty sure of verity of the CO2 hypothesis. Then someone directed me to a few videos that made a key point -- which I have not seen refuted -- that atmospheric CO2 concentrations do correlate with global temperatures, but it's a lagging correlation! In other words, something else does the warming, which causes more CO2 to linger in the air. (Less dissolved in the oceans and being recycled into carbonate rocks?) So now I have an opener mind about the subject than I did before. :-) What could cause the warming? The plausible countermodel was that solar cosmic particles acting as condensation nuclei for clouds more directly affect the planet's temperature. (I can't recall which way was supposed to make things warmer though. More nuclei => more clouds => more H20 aloft => warmer?) Of course, eco-centric friends have warned me that, "the anti-warming propaganda is being spread by big, well-funded oil companies and others." So I shouldn't believe a word of it. Hopefully this will play out fairly soon, and we'll all know better whether more or fewer rocks will be covered by vegetation in our lifetimes, and if it will be too hot to go rockhounding for them. One thing that concerns me, though, and doesn't seem to be talked about much, is that if human-caused CO2 emissions DO make a difference, we are on the verge of dumping a LOT more of it, Kyoto treaties or not. The easily available (efficient) fossil fuels are getting scarcer. In desperation, I'm sure we'll rationalize our way down from 1000-to-1 through 100-to-1 and 10-to-1 recovery ratios to near (or below, if you believe the anti-ethanol stories) 1-to-1 sources of energy. Never mind rising demand, it's enough to have shorter supplies. Just maintaining the status quo would require an increasing annual dumping of CO2 into the air. What we need is bio-engineered plants that love to turn CO2 + sunlight + a little water + calcium into CaC02 (stable waste product) and long-chain fatty acids (OIL!) Cheers, Alan Silverstein From whitbre at sbcglobal.net Mon Jul 14 21:34:39 2008 From: whitbre at sbcglobal.net (Brett Whitenack) Date: Mon Jul 14 21:34:44 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil Message-ID: <581110.97497.qm@web81407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Brett Whitenack wrote: Congratulations to the"Bat Girl." Must be pretty exciting to unearth something like that. Only thing that bothers me a little bit is that the specimen went to Canada. Is it going to stay there or is it only on display for a specific amount of time and then coming home to Wyoming? I may be in the minority but I strongly believe that rare or unusual fossil specimens should stay within their country or state of origin if they can be studied and properly cared for there. Or at least go back to their place of origin after they have been carefully studied at an accredited university or museum. If they are common varieties or duplicates then I would have no problems at all with them going to other places and in fact encourage that so others around the world can share in the wonders of our prehistoric past. However, it is this type of thing that can cause issues with academia and commercial collectors. This specimen, being the first of its kind, is a type specimen and should stay in Wyoming or at least the U.S. even if it was studied by five different museums and other agencies. If I was a commercial collector and went to Canada and found a new species of dinosaur, and donated or sold it to an institution in Europe or elsewhere, wouldn't the people of Canada feel upset that their fossil heritage is leaving their country? I don't mean to sound negative but that's just my opinion for what it is worth. Lastly, while Bonnie Finney isn't the first and only women to have a fossil species named after her, she is in good company: Mary Anning, famous amateur paleontologist of Lyme Regis, England, had two fossil species named after her. Effigia okeeffeae a toothless crocodile relative in New Mexico named after the artist Georgia O'Keeffe. Nelly Hooper Ludbrook, was an Australian paleontologist who had at least 17 fossil species and one genus of fossil mollusk named in her honor. Josephine Ettel Kablick was a Czechoslovakian paleontologist and has many plant fossils named after her. I would wager that Bonnie is the first to have a bat fossil named after her though. What an honor and a way to be remembered for her discovery. Brett W. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From whitbre at sbcglobal.net Mon Jul 14 21:42:48 2008 From: whitbre at sbcglobal.net (Brett Whitenack) Date: Mon Jul 14 21:42:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] My bad Message-ID: <445371.67704.qm@web81408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I sincerely apologize for the double post. It never came through on my main e-mail account and when I switched over to another address I have I saw that my earlier post was there. I'm still sort of new at this thing. While I'm back here though I will say that this list is really great and I have picked up a lot of good information. I look forward every day to checking what all the other members have to say. Thanks Brett W. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 14 21:55:40 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 14 21:56:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil In-Reply-To: <581110.97497.qm@web81407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <581110.97497.qm@web81407.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <007001c8e637$080e6510$182b2f30$@com> The fossil goes where the experts are; and the Royal Ontario Museum has some of the world's top vertebrate paleontologists. Here's the abstract: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v451/n7180/full/nature06549.html Here's an announcement by the ROM: http://richarddawkins.net/article,2278,Holy-missing-link-Ancient-bat-flew-wi thout-sonar,CBC-News Of the four paleontologists who described the new species, one is from the ROM, two are from the US, and one is from Germany. Seems more like an international effort to me. As stated in the article, it will be on display at the ROM (a cast is already on display), the best natural history museum in Canada, and in North America, in the views of quite a few of us. Quite an honor for Bob & Bonnie if you ask me. I encourage you to visit the ROM; their displays are spectacular, and when their expansion is finished they will have ALL of their major collections on display, something that no other museum in Canada or the USA can say. Who is going to see it in Wyoming? A couple thousand people a year? Hundreds of thousands of people will see it at the ROM. I would be willing to wager that only the Smithsonian has more visitors in a year. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Brett Whitenack Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 9:35 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil Brett Whitenack wrote: Congratulations to the"Bat Girl." Must be pretty exciting to unearth something like that. Only thing that bothers me a little bit is that the specimen went to Canada. Is it going to stay there or is it only on display for a specific amount of time and then coming home to Wyoming? I may be in the minority but I strongly believe that rare or unusual fossil specimens should stay within their country or state of origin if they can be studied and properly cared for there. Or at least go back to their place of origin after they have been carefully studied at an accredited university or museum. If they are common varieties or duplicates then I would have no problems at all with them going to other places and in fact encourage that so others around the world can share in the wonders of our prehistoric past. However, it is this type of thing that can cause issues with academia and commercial collectors. This specimen, being the first of its kind, is a type specimen and should stay in Wyoming or at least the U.S. even if it was studied by five different museums and other agencies. If I was a commercial collector and went to Canada and found a new species of dinosaur, and donated or sold it to an institution in Europe or elsewhere, wouldn't the people of Canada feel upset that their fossil heritage is leaving their country? I don't mean to sound negative but that's just my opinion for what it is worth. Lastly, while Bonnie Finney isn't the first and only women to have a fossil species named after her, she is in good company: Mary Anning, famous amateur paleontologist of Lyme Regis, England, had two fossil species named after her. Effigia okeeffeae a toothless crocodile relative in New Mexico named after the artist Georgia O'Keeffe. Nelly Hooper Ludbrook, was an Australian paleontologist who had at least 17 fossil species and one genus of fossil mollusk named in her honor. Josephine Ettel Kablick was a Czechoslovakian paleontologist and has many plant fossils named after her. I would wager that Bonnie is the first to have a bat fossil named after her though. What an honor and a way to be remembered for her discovery. Brett W. From lanny.r at roadrunner.com Mon Jul 14 22:03:20 2008 From: lanny.r at roadrunner.com (Lanny R) Date: Mon Jul 14 22:03:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip Message-ID: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com> Hi all, For those interested in poking around in the metamorphics east of Clarkia, Idaho and collecting garnet and kyanite, it's looking like the second week of August is when I'm going up for a couple of nights, August 11-13 (or possibly the 12-14). If anyone wants to spend more time, there are other places to go and we can supply information. This is not an organized, planned field trip, not associated with any group. I'm just going to be up there and anyone who wants to come along at the same time is welcome and I'll be happy to give directions to the locations I know. If DonH is able to make the trip, he might have a few ideas too. Anyone who knows of any other locations is welcome to provide information too, in fact, please do. There are no plans or set itinerary, I'm just going to start at the west end and drive east, looking as I go. You are all on your own to come and go as you please. There are places to camp. There is no water, so bring all you will need to rough it in the woods. The route is to go east from Clarkia, up onto the St. Joe River- Clearwater River divide. Most of the route is on Forest Road 301. There are garnets in the area of White Rock Spring, then Freezeout Mountain, then spots along the road a little further east, then down to Goat Mountain and finally over to Moses Butte. The route length is about 6 miles from Clarkia to Gold Center where we start driving up, then about 30 miles in the mountains. Bring your camping gear. The roads are suitable for pickups and I have seen cars with high clearance, but I recommend a pickup or other vehicle more suited to off-highway travel. These are single lane mountain roads with steep drop offs in some areas, so no racing. Some of the locations are along the road with no shoulders to park on, so we might be in someone's way sometimes (usually I don't see any traffic, but others do use the roads). Email me off list if you plan on going up at this time. For those interested in doing other things, there is the Emerald Creek star garnet diggings run by the Forest Service, and the Fossil Bowl site for leaf fossils, both near Clarkia. Regards, Lanny From Pmodreski at aol.com Mon Jul 14 22:28:19 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Mon Jul 14 22:28:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit Message-ID: I had heard about the loss of the New England Room at the Harvard Museum, but not yet seen it [or rather, the lack of it] myself; the New England minerals had still been there the last time I visited. I know Carl Francis, the curator, and I know that he is a really serious mineralogist, so I would presume that those minerals' replacement with a climate change exhibit did not originate with him, but from pressure "higher up" at the University. That is indeed sad. I've never asked Carl directly about this; I should. BTW, I do happen to believe that humans ARE causing accelerated climate change, but I don't necessarily think it requires taking museum away from displaying natural objects, to depict this; that kind of thing can be presented in web sites just as well. I'm sure, though, that those in charge think that presenting a global warming story "live" in a museum is doing the Right Thing, and that people will remember that "if they've seen it in the Harvard Museum, it must be so". [Off this topic, I may write back & respond more, to Alan S.'s comments about global warming.] But, too bad about the New England pegmatite & other minerals, not on display any more. We can at least hope (and with pretty good assurance, I think) that they are at least tucked away safely and securely in the museum storage areas... Pete **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From bova at mindspring.com Mon Jul 14 22:37:03 2008 From: bova at mindspring.com (bova@mindspring.com) Date: Mon Jul 14 22:37:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath Message-ID: <13408324.1216100223786.JavaMail.root@mswamui-backed.atl.sa.earthlink.net> The name is spelled differently in wikipedia and a second online page as Gerhard vom Rath. (see below) Seems to be the right person. The online information appears to be taken from the Encyclopedia Britannica, 11th Edition. Hope this helps. Carol "Gerhard vom Rath (August 20, 1830 - April 23, 1888), was a German mineralogist, born at Duisburg in Prussia. He was educated at Cologne, at Bonn University, and finally at Berlin, where he graduated Ph.D. in 1853. In 1856 he became assistant to Noggerath in the mineralogical museum at Bonn, and succeeded to the directorship in 1872. Meanwhile in 1863 he was appointed extraordinary professor of geology, and in 1872 he became professor of geology and mineralogy in the university at Bonn. He was distinguished for his accurate researches on mineralogy and crystallography; he described a great many new minerals, some of which were discovered by him, and he contributed largely to our knowledge of other minerals, notably in an essay on tridymite. He travelled much in southern Europe, Palestine and the United States, and wrote several essays on petrology, geology and physical geography, on earthquakes and on meteorites. He died at Koblenz in 1888." Work Ein Ausflug nach Kalabrien (Bonn 1871) Der Monzoni im s?dlichen Tirol (1875) Siebenb?rgen (Heidelberg 1880) Durch Italien und Griechenland nach dem Heiligen Land, Reisebriefe (Heidelberg 1882, 2 vols.) Arizona (Heidelberg 1885) Pennsylvanien (Heidelberg 1888) ?ber den Granit (Berlin. 1878) ?ber das Gold (Berlin 1879) Naturwissenschaftliche Studien. Erinnerungen an die Pariser Weltausstellung (Bonn 1879). See also: Laspeyres, Gerhard vom Rath, eine Lebensskizze (Bonn 1888) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_vom_Rath Further reference at: http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Gerhard_Vom_Rath says at the end of the article: "See Obituary with bibliography by Professor H. Laspeyres, in Sitzungsbericht des nat. Vereins der preussischen Rheinlande (1888)." -----Original Message----- >From: Kenny Gay >Sent: Jul 14, 2008 4:54 PM >To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath > >List, >I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century >mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. >Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from 1830 >till 1888, and was >Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. >I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. He >is not listed in Mineralogical >Record biographical section. >Thanks in advance! >Kenny >North Carolina Geological Survey >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From donhalterman at verizon.net Mon Jul 14 22:58:01 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Mon Jul 14 22:58:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip In-Reply-To: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com> References: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com> Message-ID: <487C3C69.5050300@verizon.net> Lanny R wrote: > If DonH is able to make the trip, he might have a few > ideas too. I think you've got them all covered, but I'm familiar with the area in its current state, so I can help out if I'm still here. > are garnets in the area of White Rock Spring, Not sure if I know where those are! > The roads are suitable for pickups and I have > seen cars with high clearance Um, yeah, about that. Parts of the road have not been graded in the three years I've been here, and others (the roads to Goat Mtn/Moses Butte) have been substantially re-dug. I've made most of that route in a road sedan with moderately high clearance, and also did about $500 worth of minor damage (air filter housing, radiator air dam). Taking a car also requires doing things like stopping, getting out, moving big rocks or sometimes filling in potholes with them, and moving on. Some of the side roads are just not passable by sedan; and this is coming from someone who does things like put two wheels up on the embankment to get past a bad spot or build little bridges out of fallen trees, or floor it to get through a pool-sized mud puddle. I have a lot of experience taking a car where a car shouldn't go, and I'm not exaggerating one bit--someone might want to consider very, very carefully before trying it. Better off renting a pickup, or doubling up with someone who has appropriate transportation. Just my alternate observations on the matter. > so no racing. I can't imagine anyone with any sanity trying that! Good thing is, you get good mileage--my avg. speed up there is between 10-15 MPH, with occasional short bursts to 25. > of the locations are along the road with no shoulders to park on, so we > might be in someone's way sometimes (usually I don't see any traffic, > but others do use the roads). There are some pretty wide areas and pull-outs where one can park though. I usually never had a problem leaving enough room for someone to get by; or else I was working close enough to the car that I could hear someone coming (or see the dust trail) and go move it. Despite my warnings about the road surface, the driving is not bad as far as the width of the roads or the drop-offs, etc. My first time up there alone, I was quite nervous, but quickly grew accustomed to it. Despite the remoteness of the area, Road 301 is the "main highway" of St. Joe, and I have always seen other people driving around, and most everyone is very cooperative as "the code of the forest" dictates. The view is magnificent, and I will miss the area very much. > and the Fossil Bowl > site for leaf fossils, both near Clarkia. Oh yeah, you can't not find fossils there. Bring a butter knife to split the claystone! Best, Don From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 15 01:50:42 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 15 01:50:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <9DEBDB58-521E-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <001d01c8e5ce$13db1e10$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <9DEBDB58-521E-11DD-AAFA-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <000301c8e657$dd690650$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, etc... I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold lamp over specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh > Tomaszewski > Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 > Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, > available,and revealing secrets after 40 years > > Axel, > > A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up > 25K+ hits. > Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are > many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! > > Kreigh > > > > > On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel > Emmermann wrote: > > >> > >> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ > >> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A > >> > >> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the > Moon Rocks > >> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? > They are > >> still available. > >> > >> Kreigh > >> > > > > Absolutely Kreigh! > > Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment > > (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth > elements would be > > in their lowest possible oxidation state. > > I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of > > fluorescence on those lunar samples. > > Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I > would LOVE > > to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. > > It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) > > > > Cheers > > Axel > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From codeburner at gmail.com Tue Jul 15 06:53:23 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Tue Jul 15 06:53:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] climate change... In-Reply-To: <20080715041043.B12081CC35@io.frii.com> References: <20080715041043.B12081CC35@io.frii.com> Message-ID: The fact that the religious proponents flatly refuse to engage in a public debate with the scientists that find their evidence a bit thin is telling. There has been one such debate and the audience was firmly pro-warming before it started and just as firmly non-believers when the debate was over. Since that there have been no more despite many invitations. Gore and Hansen both flatly refuse to do so. These UN documents are not scientific documents they are political documents, if you examine the credentials of the signers you will see that most are not scientists in the Climate field. The very idea that these people announce that 'the debate is over' should ring loud alarms in the head of anyone with scientific training. I don't know if this is the video that you watched but it is a good start: BK On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 12:10 AM, Alan Silverstein wrote: > > 31,000 and counting real scientists reject anthropogenic climate > > change. Climate change has become the new religion of many. > > Since the conversation has wandered to this point, off-topic as it might > be, I hope you won't mind if I pipe up with my $0.02, and hope it's > somewhat related to rocks. > > As an avid reader of Science News (etc) myself, with a BS from Caltech > (meaning some healthy skepticism), I was until recently pretty sure of > verity of the CO2 hypothesis. Then someone directed me to a few videos > that made a key point -- which I have not seen refuted -- that > atmospheric CO2 concentrations do correlate with global temperatures, > but it's a lagging correlation! In other words, something else does the > warming, which causes more CO2 to linger in the air. (Less dissolved in > the oceans and being recycled into carbonate rocks?) > > So now I have an opener mind about the subject than I did before. :-) > > What could cause the warming? The plausible countermodel was that solar > cosmic particles acting as condensation nuclei for clouds more directly > affect the planet's temperature. (I can't recall which way was supposed > to make things warmer though. More nuclei => more clouds => more H20 > aloft => warmer?) > > Of course, eco-centric friends have warned me that, "the anti-warming > propaganda is being spread by big, well-funded oil companies and > others." So I shouldn't believe a word of it. > > Hopefully this will play out fairly soon, and we'll all know better > whether more or fewer rocks will be covered by vegetation in our > lifetimes, and if it will be too hot to go rockhounding for them. > > One thing that concerns me, though, and doesn't seem to be talked about > much, is that if human-caused CO2 emissions DO make a difference, we are > on the verge of dumping a LOT more of it, Kyoto treaties or not. The > easily available (efficient) fossil fuels are getting scarcer. In > desperation, I'm sure we'll rationalize our way down from 1000-to-1 > through 100-to-1 and 10-to-1 recovery ratios to near (or below, if you > believe the anti-ethanol stories) 1-to-1 sources of energy. Never mind > rising demand, it's enough to have shorter supplies. Just maintaining > the status quo would require an increasing annual dumping of CO2 into > the air. > > What we need is bio-engineered plants that love to turn CO2 + sunlight + > a little water + calcium into CaC02 (stable waste product) and > long-chain fatty acids (OIL!) > > Cheers, > Alan Silverstein > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Tue Jul 15 08:56:35 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Tue Jul 15 09:01:21 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush> <002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> Help.......all you Paleontologists... Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? I'm leaning toward the concretion origin, but would like a professional opinion. (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") thanks....Larry http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 15 09:10:18 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 15 09:10:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help In-Reply-To: <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush><002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush> <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <002801c8e695$469c1990$6401a8c0@AxelHP> I have seen those in stalactites... We call them "druipgaten" in Dutch, which would roughly translate as "drip holes". Is this from a hot spring (or where one used to be)? Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Lawrence Rush > Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 16:57 > Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors > Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] ID help > > Help.......all you Paleontologists... > > Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? > I'm leaning toward the concretion origin, but would like a > professional opinion. > > (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") > > thanks....Larry > > > http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Tue Jul 15 09:21:20 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Tue Jul 15 09:26:29 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush><002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush><000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> <002801c8e695$469c1990$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <001801c8e696$d11e35c0$0200000a@LarryRush> Axel: Part of my problem is that the labels were destroyed by mice (a story for another time) so I don't know where these came from. I have maybe 50 of these sans labels. Thanks for the "cave' theory, a good possibility. Larry ========================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 12:10 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] ID help >I have seen those in stalactites... We call them "druipgaten" in Dutch, > which would roughly translate as "drip holes". > Is this from a hot spring (or where one used to be)? > > Axel > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Lawrence Rush >> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 16:57 >> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] ID help >> >> Help.......all you Paleontologists... >> >> Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? >> I'm leaning toward the concretion origin, but would like a >> professional opinion. >> >> (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") >> >> thanks....Larry >> >> >> http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com Tue Jul 15 09:37:10 2008 From: gbrown at catspaw-minerals.com (Gary Brown) Date: Tue Jul 15 09:37:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help In-Reply-To: <001801c8e696$d11e35c0$0200000a@LarryRush> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush><002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush><000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush><002801c8e695$469c1990$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001801c8e696$d11e35c0$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <03a101c8e699$075cb4c0$6601a8c0@okapi> I seem to remember seeing something like this associated with the celestite coming out of a quarry near Windsor, Canada. Let me poke around The Basement and see if I can bring one of 'em to the surface again. GcB > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Lawrence Rush > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 11:21 AM > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] ID help > > Axel: Part of my problem is that the labels were destroyed by > mice (a story for another time) so I don't know where these > came from. I have maybe 50 of these sans labels. > > Thanks for the "cave' theory, a good possibility. > > Larry From rpr at heidelberg.edu Tue Jul 15 11:11:56 2008 From: rpr at heidelberg.edu (R. Peter Richards) Date: Tue Jul 15 11:15:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help In-Reply-To: <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush> <002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush> <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: They look like calcareous worm tubes, but I wonder why a little worm such as would fit in the hole would make such a thick-walled tube. An awful lot of metabolic work.... On Jul 15, 2008, at 11:56 AM, Lawrence Rush wrote: > Help.......all you Paleontologists... > > Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? I'm > leaning toward the concretion origin, but would like a professional > opinion. > > (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") > > thanks....Larry > > > http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html ___________________________________ R. Peter Richards rpr@heidelberg.edu Morphological crystallographer --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Tue Jul 15 12:03:29 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Tue Jul 15 12:06:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush><002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush><000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> <002801c8e695$469c1990$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <000801c8e6ad$78045660$0200000a@LarryRush> Yes, you are right, Axel............... In Dana's text book, under Aragonite: Stalactite; Coralloidal: In groupings of delicate interlacing and coalescing stems, of a snow-white color and looking a little like coral; often called Fos-Ferri (Eisenbluthe, Germ.) Me: It is a bit difficult to imagine these forming, as they are massed in large adhered groups, often showing curls and curves, with no matrix. Thanks!! ( I have about 50 of these, would you like one?) Larry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Axel Emmermann" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 12:10 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] ID help >I have seen those in stalactites... We call them "druipgaten" in Dutch, > which would roughly translate as "drip holes". > Is this from a hot spring (or where one used to be)? > > Axel > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Lawrence Rush >> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 16:57 >> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] ID help >> >> Help.......all you Paleontologists... >> >> Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? >> I'm leaning toward the concretion origin, but would like a >> professional opinion. >> >> (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") >> >> thanks....Larry >> >> >> http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From murowchickj at umkc.edu Tue Jul 15 12:08:44 2008 From: murowchickj at umkc.edu (Jim Murowchick) Date: Tue Jul 15 12:09:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help In-Reply-To: <000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: They look more like drip tubes than worm tubes to me. Worm tubes usually have much thinner walls--thick walls would be a lot of work, as Pete pointed out. Are the holes truly round, or could there be faces from overgrowth on a subsequently-dissolved acicular mineral? I've seen similar tube structures of pyrite formed (according to Mavrogenes) by H2S bubbles exiting the wall of a cavity, then rising upward. With a little oxidation, pyrite can form, producing a small chimney. Jim Murowchick On 7/15/08 10:56 AM, "Lawrence Rush" wrote: > Help.......all you Paleontologists... > > Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? I'm leaning > toward the concretion origin, but would like a professional opinion. > > (Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") > > thanks....Larry > > > http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html From corson at infodyn.com Tue Jul 15 12:56:40 2008 From: corson at infodyn.com (Tom Corson) Date: Tue Jul 15 12:59:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Harvard Museum In-Reply-To: <200807151910.m6FJAGrU003334@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200807151910.m6FJAGrU003334@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <8FFF7541698242A39B1241B907A4D095@Grimble> I just recently returned from attending this year's Maine Pegmatite Workshop (which I heartily recommend by the way!)... Getting to hang out for 10 days with the likes of Frank Perham was a real blast in and of itself, not to mention 10 days of digging pegs, many of which are not normally accessible to the public. There were numerous miner/owners there from very famous localities like Mt. Mica, Palermo, Harvard, Pulsifer, Emmons, and the like. The subject of the Harvard Museum removing the New England collection most definitely came up and, suffice it to say, Harvard is unlikely to receive any more donations/support from these folks... The removal of the collection is not only appalling, it defies logic - it was one of the most acclaimed displays of NE minerals ever. The spirits of Palache, Frondel, and Hurlbut would be appalled. Unfortunately, museums are becoming more about entertainment and less about doing science each year. If people want that kind of entertainment, they should go to Disney World. ________________________________ Thomas W. Corson OBG International corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 http://www.obgrocks.com World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors ________________________________ > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:12:09 EDT > From: Ozro1@aol.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 15 > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Alan- Do you recall what they did with it/what their plans > were? The best > specimens from many finds in New England have been donated to > Harvard to be > enjoyed by future generations. > Tara > > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:22:09 -0400 > From: "Alan Goldstein" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > > I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in > John S. White > in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. > > From whitbre at sbcglobal.net Tue Jul 15 13:07:33 2008 From: whitbre at sbcglobal.net (Brett Whitenack) Date: Tue Jul 15 13:07:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil In-Reply-To: <007001c8e637$080e6510$182b2f30$@com> Message-ID: <922786.50089.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Tim, I haven't been to the ROM but I'll add it to my"To do list." We all have one of those don't we? "The fossil goes where the experts are" I don't dispute that the ROM has very capable and learned experts but as you point out, two of the four paleontologists are from the United States. I think part of my issue is due to patriotism. Is there any reason the Finney's contacted the ROM instead of a U.S. museum? After thinking it over, I can see your point about the amount of people who would see the specimen if it was returned to Wyoming. However, other good homes would be the Smithsonian or the AMNH. The important thing in the end the specimen went to a very auspicious institution and if not in the U.S. at least it remained in North America and not in some private collection overseas. Though I bet deep down the curator at the AMNH hated to see it go to the ROM instead of their museum. And I do agree that it is indeed quite an honor for the Finney's. I think most of us would like to be able to do what they do and enjoy it. And, as a fellow Kansan I congratulate Bonnie on her find. Brett W. Tim wrote: The fossil goes where the experts are; and the Royal Ontario Museum has some of the world's top vertebrate paleontologists. Here's the abstract: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v451/n7180/full/nature06549.html Here's an announcement by the ROM: http://richarddawkins.net/article,2278,Holy-missing-link-Ancient-bat-flew-wi thout-sonar,CBC-News Of the four paleontologists who described the new species, one is from the ROM, two are from the US, and one is from Germany. Seems more like an international effort to me. As stated in the article, it will be on display at the ROM (a cast is already on display), the best natural history museum in Canada, and in North America, in the views of quite a few of us. Quite an honor for Bob & Bonnie if you ask me. I encourage you to visit the ROM; their displays are spectacular, and when their expansion is finished they will have ALL of their major collections on display, something that no other museum in Canada or the USA can say. Who is going to see it in Wyoming? A couple thousand people a year? Hundreds of thousands of people will see it at the ROM. I would be willing to wager that only the Smithsonian has more visitors in a year. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From ldog68 at hotmail.com Tue Jul 15 13:59:14 2008 From: ldog68 at hotmail.com (laurence dushane) Date: Tue Jul 15 14:03:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Cool sand pics! Message-ID: http://discovermagazine.com/photos/01-each-grain-of-sand-a-tiny-work-of-art _________________________________________________________________ It?s a talkathon ? but it?s not just talk. http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_JustTalk --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Tue Jul 15 14:10:35 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Tue Jul 15 14:12:26 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Cool sand pics! References: Message-ID: <006801c8e6bf$4e1fad60$0600a8c0@Montana> That's a *great* link. Julie ----- Original Message ----- From: "laurence dushane" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 1:59 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Cool sand pics! http://discovermagazine.com/photos/01-each-grain-of-sand-a-tiny-work-of-art _________________________________________________________________ It?s a talkathon ? but it?s not just talk. http://www.imtalkathon.com/?source=EML_WLH_Talkathon_JustTalk --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From teyancey at suddenlink.net Tue Jul 15 15:00:53 2008 From: teyancey at suddenlink.net (Thomas Yancey) Date: Tue Jul 15 15:04:40 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil and scientists In-Reply-To: <922786.50089.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <922786.50089.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Keep in mind that there are fewer and fewer paleontologists in the USA that have the training to do good descriptive work in identifying and describing new fossils. Most paleontologists are being trained in working with numerical tools and databases. Therefore, when an undescribed fossil is found, it is most likely to be sent to an expert located in another country. What has happened in paleontology is similar to what has happened with the economy: it is increasingly globalized. An expert on any group is likely to live in a distant country and if the fossil is to be described and recorded for others to learn about, it will have to be sent outside our own country. In science, this works out pretty well. On the other hand, it means a steadily decreasing number of scientists who work directly with fossils and there are fewer positions for anyone who wants to do descriptive paleontology. Tom Yancey >Tim, > > I haven't been to the ROM but I'll add it to my"To do list." We >all have one of those don't we? > > "The fossil goes where the experts are" > > I don't dispute that the ROM has very capable and learned experts >but as you point out, two of the four paleontologists are from the >United States. I think part of my issue is due to patriotism. Is >there any reason the Finney's contacted the ROM instead of a U.S. >museum? > > After thinking it over, I can see your point about the amount of >people who would see the specimen if it was returned to Wyoming. >However, other good homes would be the Smithsonian or the AMNH. The >important thing in the end the specimen went to a very auspicious >institution and if not in the U.S. at least it remained in North >America and not in some private collection overseas. Though I bet >deep down the curator at the AMNH hated to see it go to the ROM >instead of their museum. > > And I do agree that it is indeed quite an honor for the Finney's. >I think most of us would like to be able to do what they do and >enjoy it. And, as a fellow Kansan I congratulate Bonnie on her find. > > Brett W. > >Tim wrote: > The fossil goes where the experts are; and the Royal Ontario Museum has some >of the world's top vertebrate paleontologists. Here's the abstract: >http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v451/n7180/full/nature06549.html > >Here's an announcement by the ROM: >http://richarddawkins.net/article,2278,Holy-missing-link-Ancient-bat-flew-wi >thout-sonar,CBC-News > >Of the four paleontologists who described the new species, one is from the >ROM, two are from the US, and one is from Germany. Seems more like an >international effort to me. As stated in the article, it will be on display >at the ROM (a cast is already on display), the best natural history museum >in Canada, and in North America, in the views of quite a few of us. Quite an >honor for Bob & Bonnie if you ask me. I encourage you to visit the ROM; >their displays are spectacular, and when their expansion is finished they >will have ALL of their major collections on display, something that no other >museum in Canada or the USA can say. Who is going to see it in Wyoming? A >couple thousand people a year? Hundreds of thousands of people will see it >at the ROM. I would be willing to wager that only the Smithsonian has more >visitors in a year. > >Tim Fisher >Ore-ROCK-On! >Email address at http://OreRockOn.com > > > > > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html -- Thomas Yancey From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 15 15:09:28 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 15 15:09:27 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help In-Reply-To: <000801c8e6ad$78045660$0200000a@LarryRush> References: <8827A0546A994B8483271EFE655C395C@Grimble><200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><004c01c8e05d$a7e4cff0$6601a8c0@okapi><00eb01c8e297$ec37fb50$6601a8c0@okapi><019b01c8e478$fe4ae9f0$6601a8c0@okapi><000901c8e483$c38d1170$bbe6ce45@feldsparflash><020301c8e525$9a68f6e0$6601a8c0@okapi><001501c8e537$b7726a70$0200000a@LarryRush><002201c8e538$460374a0$0200000a@LarryRush><000901c8e693$5c341fc0$0200000a@LarryRush><002801c8e695$469c1990$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <000801c8e6ad$78045660$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <006101c8e6c7$73325d20$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > Yes, you are right, Axel............... Well, ir's a possible explanation. Another possibility that crossed my mind is that the aragonite may have grown on thin needles of a more soluble mineral like gypsum or maybe even on capilairy-roots of plants that my nave hung from a cavern ceiling. Just ideas, I really don't have the foggiest notion ;-))) > > In Dana's text book, under Aragonite: > > Stalactite; Coralloidal: In groupings of delicate interlacing > and coalescing stems, of a snow-white color and looking a > little like coral; often called Fos-Ferri (Eisenbluthe, Germ.) Yes, that's it. > ( I have about 50 of these, would you like one?) That's mighty friendly, Larry. However, I collect only specimens that fluoresce in UV and only if they come with a location. I have a similar specimen from Greece. It doesn't fluoresce, alas ;-))) Maybe donate it in my behalf next time someone needs specimens to hand out to kids or some other school project? Actually , I haven't seen much fluorescing Flos-ferri yet... Rather surprising since aragonte is often fluorescent. Cheers Axel From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 15 15:47:21 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 15 15:49:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath In-Reply-To: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: Kenny, Have you tried to search genealogical records? Kreigh On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 16:54 America/Detroit, Kenny Gay wrote: > List, > I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century > mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. > Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from > 1830 till 1888, and was > Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. > I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. > He is not listed in Mineralogical > Record biographical section. > Thanks in advance! > Kenny > North Carolina Geological Survey > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From tjokela at execulink.com Tue Jul 15 16:23:13 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Tue Jul 15 16:23:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie bat - (ROM review) References: <922786.50089.qm@web81406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002101c8e6d1$c138fd30$6600a8c0@Junior> Funny the ROM should come up. I visited it last week, to see the new refurbed exterior, the Darwin exhibit, and the paleo gallery. (No mineral gallery, sigh, it's supposedly coming this January.) Twenty bucks to get in was a bit of a surprise, but lunch was a very good pizza and parking was only fifteen bucks. The Darwin exhibit was ok, but nothing really special. A one hour PBS special would teach you more about his life. It was cool to see his actual rock hammer and read his journal entries from the voyage of the Beagle. Terrible display space, poorly lit, small print labels, and they've paid no attention to sound quality. With tons of people, kids, multiple video screens, it seemed terribly noisy to me. The new architecture is worthless for displaying anything, all goofy triangular angles and whatnot. My buddy suggested the display was organized by an art major who didn't want any input from a scientist. Extremely annoying trying to find your way around the place with all the recent construction. The paleo exhibit was about the same. They've got the priceless fossils to be sure, but we found unlabelled cases, switched labels, poor lighting, and again with the ridiculous architecture making for a confused, convoluted, impractical exhibit. Hidden little rooms, walls with weird angles, that sort of crap. The 2 meter NY eurypterid was worth the trip. Lots of insane stuff from the Green River and Germany; a fridge-sized fish from Kansas was amazing. A major disappointment was the lack of local material; I saw a single horn coral from Arkona, none of the wonderful Ontario Ordivician fossils. Not a single piece from the Burgess Shale. The new style of labelling is nuts; a case of 40 things all numbered, with the name and loc listed off to the side, numerically. An incredible Alberta ammonite, bright red, maybe 50cm across... no label! The bright spot was that more fossils will be coming, supposedly in '09 or '10, which is something to look forward to. The gallery at present is grand fun for kids, and those who don't care about what anything actually is. I guess the museum really is forced to cater to the utterly ignorant public, as in the four hours or so that we were there we didn't see anybody really looking at the labels or really studying anything, nose to glass. For advanced amateurs it's a mixture of depressing and infuriating. So all in all a fun trip with a good buddy, but the modern style of museum exhibit is depressing. Typically Canadian sort of thing, a priceless and massive collection, but only a tiny fraction of it is on display, and it's displayed in a half-ass manner. Millions upon millions of dollars spent on modern architecture... when all that's needed to display stuff properly is nothing more complex than a big, square, well-lit room. Lastly, if y'all want to get nationalistic and patriotic about the earth sciences... I want all of Canada's fossils back here in Canada. All the Alberta vertebrates and ammonites. All the tens of thousands of Burgess Shale specimens at the Smithsonian. All the incredible, absolutely one of a kind stuff collected by folks from Michigan out of the Devonian beds at Arkona. Oh, and all the fabulous minerals from Saint-Hilaire, and Francon, and the Yukon phosphates too. A lot of this stuff should never have been allowed across the border to begin with. See how nationalism cuts both ways? Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com http://www.ontariominerals.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brett Whitenack" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 4:07 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Bob & Bonnie Finney rare bat fossil > Tim, > > I haven't been to the ROM but I'll add it to my"To do list." We all have > one of those don't we? > > "The fossil goes where the experts are" > > I don't dispute that the ROM has very capable and learned experts but as > you point out, two of the four paleontologists are from the United States. > I think part of my issue is due to patriotism. Is there any reason the > Finney's contacted the ROM instead of a U.S. museum? From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Tue Jul 15 16:42:53 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Tue Jul 15 16:45:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help Message-ID: <011d01c8e6d4$801a1f70$0200000a@LarryRush> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] ID help > Thanks, Tom: > > At your suggestion, I have posted a few more photos at the same URL. > > http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html > > There is not much differentiation between any of these specimens. > > I suppose an explanation is in order here..... > > I recently purchased the contents of a defunct rock shop. All of the > inventory had been stored for over 20 years in a leaky outdoor shed. When > it was turned over to me, I found that almost every label was gone, > disintegrated or chewed into mouse nests. Mouse droppings and nest > material was everywhere, the boxes had crumbled, everything was filthy and > much damage done. These specs. were in a bottom layer wooden box, and were > relatively clean. But I found only one label that might fit, on the floor. > It read "Aragonite (Flos Ferri), Arizona". > These were the most likely of the inventory that the label would fit. > > They are apparently a carbonate and probably deposited from a solute in a > liquid. It seemed probable to me that they could have been deposited in a > dripping water cave or vug environment, then broke free from weight, > landing in a wet pile on the floor, where they adhered in masses over > time. Some of these chunks are in the order of 6-8cm thick. I had my > doubts tho, and thought that worms may have been an alternative. > > From the postings so far, it seems that the worm tubes can be ruled out. > Calcareous Tufa incrustations over twigs or plant stems, as you suggest, > might be right. I'm open to anything, not being well versed in such > things. > > Larry > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Thomas Yancey" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 5:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] ID help > > >> Larry, >> >> The tubes are too small for any fossil worm tubes I am aware of, so I >> doubt they are that. The idea of being a cave deposit is interesting, but >> does not seem right either. I suggest you make some comparisons to tufa >> deposits in hard water springs. These often will encrust plant materials >> and could produce something like this. These are very thick, which is >> extreme for hard water springs tufa, but still within the realm of >> possibility. >> >> This will give you something to consider. If you have a chance, take a >> couple more photos for better visualization. >> >> Why do you say the mineral is aragonite and not calcite? >> >> To m Yancey >> >> >>>Help.......all you Paleontologists... >>> >>>Is this an Aragonite concretion or an example of worm tubes? I'm leaning >>>toward the concretion origin, but would like a professional opinion. >>> >>>(Note the centered holes in each of the "tubes") >>> >>>thanks....Larry >>> >>>http://www.connroxminerals.com/ammonite.html >>> >> >> -- >> Thomas Yancey > From tjokela at execulink.com Tue Jul 15 17:38:39 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Tue Jul 15 17:38:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ID help References: <011d01c8e6d4$801a1f70$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <000301c8e6dc$4be5bcc0$6600a8c0@Junior> Almost positively AZ aragonite. I seem to recall them fluorescing nicely under SW. Shame the specimens were so poorly looked after, it sucks having to throw out good specimens, but they do fill up pot holes nicely. Tim Jokela Jr., tjokela@execulink.com Pleasure: http://www.ontariominerals.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lawrence Rush" To: "Lawrence Rush" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 7:42 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] ID help >> relatively clean. But I found only one label that might fit, on the >> floor. It read "Aragonite (Flos Ferri), Arizona". >> These were the most likely of the inventory that the label would fit. From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Tue Jul 15 18:07:24 2008 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Tue Jul 15 18:08:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip References: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com> Message-ID: Hi Lanny, You wrote: > Email me off list if you plan on going up at this time. I see no reason not to keep this on-list so folks can assess the interest. Julie and I will be there assuming that nothing weird comes up (which is the norm these days). John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lanny R" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 10:03 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip > Hi all, > > For those interested in poking around in the metamorphics east of > Clarkia, Idaho and collecting garnet and kyanite, it's looking like the > second week of August is when I'm going up for a couple of nights, August > 11-13 (or possibly the 12-14). If anyone wants to spend more time, there > are other places to go and we can supply information. This is not an > organized, planned field trip, not associated with any group. I'm just > going to be up there and anyone who wants to come along at the same time > is welcome and I'll be happy to give directions to the locations I know. > If DonH is able to make the trip, he might have a few ideas too. Anyone > who knows of any other locations is welcome to provide information too, > in fact, please do. There are no plans or set itinerary, I'm just going > to start at the west end and drive east, looking as I go. You are all on > your own to come and go as you please. There are places to camp. There is > no water, so bring all you will need to rough it in the woods. > > The route is to go east from Clarkia, up onto the St. Joe River- > Clearwater River divide. Most of the route is on Forest Road 301. There > are garnets in the area of White Rock Spring, then Freezeout Mountain, > then spots along the road a little further east, then down to Goat > Mountain and finally over to Moses Butte. The route length is about 6 > miles from Clarkia to Gold Center where we start driving up, then about > 30 miles in the mountains. > > Bring your camping gear. The roads are suitable for pickups and I have > seen cars with high clearance, but I recommend a pickup or other vehicle > more suited to off-highway travel. These are single lane mountain roads > with steep drop offs in some areas, so no racing. Some of the locations > are along the road with no shoulders to park on, so we might be in > someone's way sometimes (usually I don't see any traffic, but others do > use the roads). > > Email me off list if you plan on going up at this time. > > For those interested in doing other things, there is the Emerald Creek > star garnet diggings run by the Forest Service, and the Fossil Bowl site > for leaf fossils, both near Clarkia. > > Regards, > > Lanny > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Tue Jul 15 18:56:32 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Tue Jul 15 18:56:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <000301c8e657$dd690650$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no references. I wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a simple test? Maybe daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis of any glowing grains would be enough to get a paper published. At least I assume that is the goal of any loan of the moonrocks. If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and shine a big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. But that would be expensive. Maybe we should try to mobilize rockhounds around the world to go into their yards some specific evening and shine their black lights on the moon to see if it glows. Maybe the Planetary Society could be interested in helping, and a viral marketing campaign for the news media to pick up on. Lots of people besides rockhounds have black lights. Could be fun, and a new category in the Guiness Book of Records. The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of moonlight shows any peaks that might be a contribution from fluorescence? Moonlight is generally assumed to have the same spectrum as sunlight, but there may be overlooked differences if it were reviewed in fine detail. We might also find some dark spectra where light is absorbed (to be emitted later as fluorescence). Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from the reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? We might be able to find out if moon rocks fluoresce without getting our hands on one. Always good to have a 'Plan B', but I would rather think up a way to get my hands on a moon rock legally. Good point. Kreigh On Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008, at 04:50 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, etc... > I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold > lamp over > specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. > > Cheers > Axel > > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh >> Tomaszewski >> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 >> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors >> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, >> available,and revealing secrets after 40 years >> >> Axel, >> >> A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up >> 25K+ hits. >> Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are >> many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! >> >> Kreigh >> >> >> >> >> On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel >> Emmermann wrote: >> >>>> >>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >>>> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >>>> >>>> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >> Moon Rocks >>>> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? >> They are >>>> still available. >>>> >>>> Kreigh >>>> >>> >>> Absolutely Kreigh! >>> Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment >>> (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth >> elements would be >>> in their lowest possible oxidation state. >>> I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of >>> fluorescence on those lunar samples. >>> Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I >> would LOVE >>> to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. >>> It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) >>> >>> Cheers >>> Axel >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From rocknate at gmail.com Tue Jul 15 21:11:57 2008 From: rocknate at gmail.com (Nathan Martin) Date: Tue Jul 15 21:12:03 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Harvard Museum In-Reply-To: <8FFF7541698242A39B1241B907A4D095@Grimble> References: <200807151910.m6FJAGrU003334@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <8FFF7541698242A39B1241B907A4D095@Grimble> Message-ID: Tom, I'm glad that you enjoyed the Pegmatite workshop. I've been wanting to go for several years and hope to finally attend next year. I feel that some of your comments about the Harvard Museum are a little off target. The loss of the New England room is an unfortunate situation and nobody feels it more strongly than those of us who live in the area, but it has little to do with entertainment and more to do with conflicting educational objectives (i.e.: University politics). Most of the New England collection has carefully been put into storage. As I understand it an Earth sciences professor at the university "needed" more space for a lab and/or displays and the museum was forced to give up some space to accomodate this. The loss of the New England room was the result. It was a decision driven by the University, not by the museum. Some of the classic New England specimens have been incorporated into the remaining museum displays but many of us still feel the significant loss of ability to continue to see this part of the collection. The hard truth has been previously discussed many times before. Mineralogy as a science has been deemphasized and other earth sciences disciplines now receive the grants that make for a successful university career. Universities devote resources to those areas that bring in the money and other areas suffer. Having said this I think the Harvard Museum remains a significant resource for the mineral collecting community. They are trying to do the right things with the resources available to them. My club (Boston Mineral Club) does a mineral madness festival at the museum every other year. We set up special displays on fluorescent minerals, collecting tools, microminerals, etc and have a great time giving away specimens to kids. The museum staff are great to work with. I highly recommend a visit to the Harvard Museum of Natural History (which includes the Mineral Museum) on your next trip to the East coast. best regards, Nate Martin Lexington, MA On 7/15/08, Tom Corson wrote: > I just recently returned from attending this year's Maine Pegmatite Workshop > (which I heartily recommend by the way!)... > > Getting to hang out for 10 days with the likes of Frank Perham was a real > blast in and of itself, not to mention 10 days of digging pegs, many of > which are not normally accessible to the public. > > There were numerous miner/owners there from very famous localities like Mt. > Mica, Palermo, Harvard, Pulsifer, Emmons, and the like. The subject of the > Harvard Museum removing the New England collection most definitely came up > and, suffice it to say, Harvard is unlikely to receive any more > donations/support from these folks... > > The removal of the collection is not only appalling, it defies logic - it > was one of the most acclaimed displays of NE minerals ever. The spirits of > Palache, Frondel, and Hurlbut would be appalled. > > Unfortunately, museums are becoming more about entertainment and less about > doing science each year. > > If people want that kind of entertainment, they should go to Disney World. > > ________________________________ > > Thomas W. Corson OBG International > corson@infodyn.com 2435 E Mayview Drive > 520-225-0244 Green Valley, AZ 85614 > http://www.obgrocks.com > World Class Minerals For World Class Collectors > ________________________________ > > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:12:09 EDT > > From: Ozro1@aol.com > > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 15 > > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > > > Alan- Do you recall what they did with it/what their plans > > were? The best > > specimens from many finds in New England have been donated to > > Harvard to be > > enjoyed by future generations. > > Tara > > > > Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 20:22:09 -0400 > > From: "Alan Goldstein" > > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > > > > I believe the revision of the Harvard Museum was discussed in > > John S. White > > in either Min Rec or Rocks & Minerals several years ago. > > > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From smtravis at plateautel.net Tue Jul 15 21:17:25 2008 From: smtravis at plateautel.net (steve travis) Date: Tue Jul 15 21:17:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years References: <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <005c01c8e6fa$dac0a590$799d324a@marilyn> When I was show chairman at Topeka we investigated what it would take. simple but very expensive insurance, armed transportation, security on site, you will find they are availble or were, but very difficult to get. You could probably take you equipment to them for a reasonable cost but thats my best suggestion. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 6:56 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and revealing secrets after 40 years > You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no references. I > wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a simple test? Maybe > daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis of any glowing grains > would be enough to get a paper published. At least I assume that is the > goal of any loan of the moonrocks. > > If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and shine a > big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. But that would be > expensive. Maybe we should try to mobilize rockhounds around the world to > go into their yards some specific evening and shine their black lights on > the moon to see if it glows. Maybe the Planetary Society could be > interested in helping, and a viral marketing campaign for the news media > to pick up on. Lots of people besides rockhounds have black lights. Could > be fun, and a new category in the Guiness Book of Records. > > The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of moonlight > shows any peaks that might be a contribution from fluorescence? Moonlight > is generally assumed to have the same spectrum as sunlight, but there may > be overlooked differences if it were reviewed in fine detail. We might > also find some dark spectra where light is absorbed (to be emitted later > as fluorescence). > > Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from the > reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? We might be able to find out if > moon rocks fluoresce without getting our hands on one. Always good to have > a 'Plan B', but I would rather think up a way to get my hands on a moon > rock legally. > > Good point. > > Kreigh > > > > > > On Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008, at 04:50 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: > >> Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, etc... >> I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold lamp >> over >> specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. >> >> Cheers >> Axel >> >> >>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh >>> Tomaszewski >>> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 >>> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >>> collectors >>> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, >>> available,and revealing secrets after 40 years >>> >>> Axel, >>> >>> A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up >>> 25K+ hits. >>> Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are >>> many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! >>> >>> Kreigh >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel >>> Emmermann wrote: >>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >>>>> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >>>>> >>>>> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >>> Moon Rocks >>>>> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? >>> They are >>>>> still available. >>>>> >>>>> Kreigh >>>>> >>>> >>>> Absolutely Kreigh! >>>> Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment >>>> (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth >>> elements would be >>>> in their lowest possible oxidation state. >>>> I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of >>>> fluorescence on those lunar samples. >>>> Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I >>> would LOVE >>>> to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. >>>> It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) >>>> >>>> Cheers >>>> Axel >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>> Subscription Services: >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Justin at the-vug.com Tue Jul 15 22:11:11 2008 From: Justin at the-vug.com (Justin@the-vug.com) Date: Tue Jul 15 22:11:20 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years References: <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> <005c01c8e6fa$dac0a590$799d324a@marilyn> Message-ID: <00a801c8e702$612c4060$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> The one specimen of moon rock that ever passed through my hands was under a gram and over $2,000. How about going to Tucson with your light? =) I'm sure someone at the Westward Look has to have a couple moon rocks! ----- Original Message ----- From: "steve travis" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 9:17 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and revealing secrets after 40 years > When I was show chairman at Topeka we investigated what it would take. > simple but very expensive insurance, armed transportation, security on > site, you will find they are availble or were, but very difficult to get. > You could probably take you equipment to them for a reasonable cost but > thats my best suggestion. Steve > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 6:56 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and > revealing secrets after 40 years > > >> You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no references. I >> wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a simple test? Maybe >> daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis of any glowing grains >> would be enough to get a paper published. At least I assume that is the >> goal of any loan of the moonrocks. >> >> If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and shine a >> big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. But that would be >> expensive. Maybe we should try to mobilize rockhounds around the world to >> go into their yards some specific evening and shine their black lights on >> the moon to see if it glows. Maybe the Planetary Society could be >> interested in helping, and a viral marketing campaign for the news media >> to pick up on. Lots of people besides rockhounds have black lights. Could >> be fun, and a new category in the Guiness Book of Records. >> >> The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of moonlight >> shows any peaks that might be a contribution from fluorescence? Moonlight >> is generally assumed to have the same spectrum as sunlight, but there may >> be overlooked differences if it were reviewed in fine detail. We might >> also find some dark spectra where light is absorbed (to be emitted later >> as fluorescence). >> >> Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from the >> reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? We might be able to find out if >> moon rocks fluoresce without getting our hands on one. Always good to >> have a 'Plan B', but I would rather think up a way to get my hands on a >> moon rock legally. >> >> Good point. >> >> Kreigh >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008, at 04:50 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: >> >>> Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, etc... >>> I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold lamp >>> over >>> specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Axel >>> >>> >>>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh >>>> Tomaszewski >>>> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 >>>> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >>>> collectors >>>> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, >>>> available,and revealing secrets after 40 years >>>> >>>> Axel, >>>> >>>> A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up >>>> 25K+ hits. >>>> Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are >>>> many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! >>>> >>>> Kreigh >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel >>>> Emmermann wrote: >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >>>>>> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >>>>>> >>>>>> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >>>> Moon Rocks >>>>>> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? >>>> They are >>>>>> still available. >>>>>> >>>>>> Kreigh >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Absolutely Kreigh! >>>>> Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment >>>>> (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth >>>> elements would be >>>>> in their lowest possible oxidation state. >>>>> I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of >>>>> fluorescence on those lunar samples. >>>>> Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I >>>> would LOVE >>>>> to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. >>>>> It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) >>>>> >>>>> Cheers >>>>> Axel >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>> Subscription Services: >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From DrkHorse42 at aol.com Wed Jul 16 04:07:34 2008 From: DrkHorse42 at aol.com (DrkHorse42@aol.com) Date: Wed Jul 16 04:08:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] New Chemical Element Found Message-ID: New Chemical Element Found! - Governmentium (Gv) Science lesson for today: Study of recent hurricane and gasoline issues have proved the existence of a new chemical element. A major research institution has recently announced the discovery of the heaviest element yet known to science. The new element has been named "Governmentium (Gv)." Governmentium (Gv) has one neutron, 25 assistant neutrons, 88 deputy neutrons, and 198 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an atomic mass of 312. These 312 particles are held together by forces called morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of lepton-like particles called peons. Governmentium is inert. However, it can be detected, because it impedes every reaction with which it comes into contact. A minute amount of Governmentium can cause a reaction, that would normally take less than a second, to take over four days to complete. Governmentium has a normal half-life of four years; it does not decay, but instead undergoes a reorganization in which a portion of the assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places. In fact, Governmentium's mass will actually increase over time, since each reorganization will cause more morons to become neutrons, forming isodopes. This characteristic of moron promotion leads some scientists to believe that Governmentium is formed whenever morons reach a critical concentration. This hypothetical quantity is referred to as Critical Morass. When catalyzed with money, Governmentium becomes Administratium (Am) -- an element which radiates just as much energy as Governmentium since it has half as many peons but twice as many morons. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Wed Jul 16 07:56:06 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Wed Jul 16 07:57:50 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath In-Reply-To: References: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: <002601c8e754$13b41fe0$3b1c5fa0$@com> I did a quick search of the $$ genealogy sites that wwe subscribe to and came up with a little. I located a "Prof. Gerhard von Rath" in a 1902 Bonn directory "Alphabetisches Namen- und Firmen-Verzeichniss nebst Angabe des Standes und der Wohnung der Einwohner von Bonn" = (roughly) "Alphabetic name and company directories, together with an indication of the status and residence of the inhabitants of Bonn". "Rath, Gerhard vom, Professor und Geh. Bergrath, Ww., Baumsch. Allee 11. (Ph.) 1097." I am pretty sure this means that this is the widow of Gerhard von Rath. Also, on a German genealogy site, the following: Gerhard von Rath, Ehepartner und Kinder (spouse and children) Maria Gertrud BLANCK; born 1 JAN 1815 - Emanuella VON RATH, Duisburg (about 50 miles NNW of Bonn) Might be his father? The contact is listed as luise.wenkheimer@gmx.de Also, Gerhard Rath, geboren: 01.01.1827 (usually 01/01 would mean sometime during 1827) Hackenbroich b.Dormagen (neighborhood in Dormagen, about 35 miles NNW of Bonn) gestorben: um (about) 1901 Horrem b.Dormagen (?). Eltern Wilhelm RATH, 26.01.1803; Margaretha PINTGEN, 05.04.1803 (parents). Ehepartner und Kinder 07.10.1853 - Anna Maria MAUSBERG, 08.02.1861 - Margaretha RATH (no wife listed, these are both his children). contact Dieter Klein kn.privat@netcologne.de Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Kreigh Tomaszewski Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 3:47 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] von Rath Kenny, Have you tried to search genealogical records? Kreigh On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 16:54 America/Detroit, Kenny Gay wrote: > List, > I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century > mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. > Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from > 1830 till 1888, and was > Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. > I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. > He is not listed in Mineralogical > Record biographical section. > Thanks in advance! > Kenny > North Carolina Geological Survey From jwolfe_3 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 09:21:21 2008 From: jwolfe_3 at yahoo.com (Jennifer Wolfe) Date: Wed Jul 16 09:22:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Lapidary classes / mentors Message-ID: <130199.81357.qm@web53612.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I was wondering if anyone was aware of any lapidary classes that were available in Ontario? I was hoping to take a class to further my comfort level with doing it as well as meet other folks that are interested in it as well. I think that I might have some luck with some of the local rock clubs once they start up again in September, but in the meantime I thought I would ask around! I would also love to find a local mentor that I can bounce ideas off and get some help working with some difficult materials. I met a wonderful man named Russ at Honeycreek Gems in Davenport, Iowa who took some time to show me what he could in a day, but unfortunately for me it's too far away to go back for more help! Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Jenn __________________________________________________________________ Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail. Click on Options in Mail and switch to New Mail today or register for free at http://mail.yahoo.ca From rhill at lpl.arizona.edu Wed Jul 16 09:41:49 2008 From: rhill at lpl.arizona.edu (Rik Hill) Date: Wed Jul 16 09:41:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] New Chemical Element Found In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <487E24CD.3090708@lpl.arizona.edu> Excellent! DrkHorse42@aol.com wrote: > > > New Chemical Element Found! - Governmentium (Gv) > > Science lesson for today: > > Study of recent hurricane and gasoline issues have proved the existence of a > new chemical element. A major research institution has recently announced > the discovery of the heaviest element yet known to science. The new element > has been named "Governmentium > (Gv)." > > Governmentium (Gv) has one neutron, 25 assistant neutrons, 88 deputy > neutrons, and 198 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an atomic mass of 312. > > These 312 particles are held together by forces called morons, which are > surrounded by vast quantities of lepton-like particles called peons. > > Governmentium is inert. However, it can be detected, because it impedes > every reaction with which it comes into contact. A minute amount of Governmentium > can cause a reaction, that would normally take less than a second, to take > over four days to complete. > > Governmentium has a normal half-life of four years; it does not decay, but > instead undergoes a reorganization in which a portion of the assistant > neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places. In fact, Governmentium's mass will > actually increase over time, since each reorganization will cause more morons > to become neutrons, forming isodopes. > > This characteristic of moron promotion leads some scientists to believe that > Governmentium is formed whenever morons reach a critical concentration. This > hypothetical quantity is referred to as Critical Morass. > > When catalyzed with money, Governmentium becomes Administratium (Am) -- an > element which radiates just as much energy as Governmentium since it has half > as many peons but twice as many morons. > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > From JWachsmuth at gmx.de Wed Jul 16 11:38:51 2008 From: JWachsmuth at gmx.de (Juergen Wachsmuth) Date: Wed Jul 16 11:35:37 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath References: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: <487E403B.282DC7D2@gmx.de> He named Jordanite and sartorite. vom Rath, G., Mineralogische Mitteilungen, Ann. Chim. Phys. 122 (1864) 371-399. Regards, J?rgen Kenny Gay schrieb: > List, > I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century > mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath. > Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from 1830 > till 1888, and was > Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn. > I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. He > is not listed in Mineralogical > Record biographical section. > Thanks in advance! > Kenny > North Carolina Geological Survey > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Wed Jul 16 11:45:30 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Wed Jul 16 11:45:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <000301c8e657$dd690650$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <000301c8e774$1f2f1120$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > > You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no references. > I wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a simple test? One would have to look at samples from all kinds of rock but basically the lightest colored ones would have the biggest chance of fluorescing. The pristine environment in which they are kept would enhance our chance of finding fluorescent ones. In air we are limited to the 253.7 nm UV lights. Any shorter wavelength would only produce ozone. In nitrogen atmosphere you could probably shine a 180 nm lamp on the specimens. > Maybe daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis of any glowing > grains would be enough to get a paper published. At least I assume > that is the goal of any loan of the moonrocks. It would be of minor scientific community and economic interest. But it would be an unforgettable moment for any glowhound to see a rock from the Apollo collection light up! In any color or any brightness for that matter ;-))). > If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and > shine a big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. You'd have to be there to see the glow and the laser would have to be in orbit around earth. > But that would be expensive. No kidding ;-)) > Maybe we should try to > mobilize rockhounds around the world to go into their yards some > specific evening and shine their black lights on the moon to see if it > glows. Much better... While they're looking up, a loved one can gently pour some beer into them to help them steady their aim... Or just for the fun of it... > Maybe the Planetary Society could be > interested in helping, and a viral marketing campaign for the news > media to pick up on. Lots of people besides rockhounds have black > lights. Could be fun, and a new category in the Guiness Book of > Records. The biggest blackout ever due to invisible light? Hmm... > The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of > moonlight shows any peaks that might be a contribution from > fluorescence? Good thought experiment... There are no hydrothermal minerals on the moon and also no metamorphic (except perhaps contact metamorphosis where the basalt flows ran over the sanidine floor. Sanidine and feldspars may fluoresce due to iron or REE or replacement of Si by Ti, Al, etc... There's also some zircon and klastic material may hold members of the sodalite family. > Moonlight is generally assumed to have the same spectrum as sunlight, > but there may be overlooked differences if it were reviewed in fine > detail. We might also find some dark spectra where light is absorbed > (to be emitted later as fluorescence). There's probably a lot of emission in the near infrared (drowning in the heat signal?). I think you can do quite some research from "just" reflected sunlight. > Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from > the reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? I haven't the foggiest ;-))) I used to know all that but it has been replaced by other stuff... I think that the spectra of the sun's disk and corona are quite different but I wouldn't see how it could help us to make the moon light up. > We might be able to find out if moon rocks fluoresce without getting > our hands on one. Always good to have a 'Plan B', but I would rather > think up a way to get my hands on a moon rock legally. There's rumor about going to the moon again. Perhaps rocks would get cheaper then? Cheers Axel From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Wed Jul 16 11:46:40 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Wed Jul 16 11:46:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <00a801c8e702$612c4060$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> References: <6A11CBE6-52DA-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net><005c01c8e6fa$dac0a590$799d324a@marilyn> <00a801c8e702$612c4060$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> Message-ID: <000401c8e774$490e5dc0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > The one specimen of moon rock that ever passed through my > hands was under a gram and over $2,000. Probably a lunar meteorite? Axel From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Jul 16 20:00:24 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Jul 16 20:03:30 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <00a801c8e702$612c4060$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> Message-ID: <80A8A10E-53AC-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> It is illegal to own/have a moon rock in the US without a permit. I hope you did not meet one of the stolen specimens. Many years ago I had an opportunity to touch a moon rock at the Smithsonian; it was a thrill I will never forget -- I have touched the Moon. Kreigh On Wednesday, Jul 16, 2008, at 01:11 America/Detroit, wrote: > The one specimen of moon rock that ever passed through my hands was > under a gram and over $2,000. > > How about going to Tucson with your light? =) I'm sure someone at the > Westward Look has to have a couple moon rocks! > ----- Original Message ----- From: "steve travis" > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 9:17 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and > revealing secrets after 40 years > > >> When I was show chairman at Topeka we investigated what it would >> take. simple but very expensive insurance, armed transportation, >> security on site, you will find they are availble or were, but very >> difficult to get. You could probably take you equipment to them for a >> reasonable cost but thats my best suggestion. Steve >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" >> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors" >> Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 6:56 PM >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and >> revealing secrets after 40 years >> >> >>> You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no >>> references. I wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a >>> simple test? Maybe daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis >>> of any glowing grains would be enough to get a paper published. At >>> least I assume that is the goal of any loan of the moonrocks. >>> >>> If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and >>> shine a big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. But >>> that would be expensive. Maybe we should try to mobilize rockhounds >>> around the world to go into their yards some specific evening and >>> shine their black lights on the moon to see if it glows. Maybe the >>> Planetary Society could be interested in helping, and a viral >>> marketing campaign for the news media to pick up on. Lots of people >>> besides rockhounds have black lights. Could be fun, and a new >>> category in the Guiness Book of Records. >>> >>> The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of >>> moonlight shows any peaks that might be a contribution from >>> fluorescence? Moonlight is generally assumed to have the same >>> spectrum as sunlight, but there may be overlooked differences if it >>> were reviewed in fine detail. We might also find some dark spectra >>> where light is absorbed (to be emitted later as fluorescence). >>> >>> Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from >>> the reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? We might be able to find >>> out if moon rocks fluoresce without getting our hands on one. Always >>> good to have a 'Plan B', but I would rather think up a way to get my >>> hands on a moon rock legally. >>> >>> Good point. >>> >>> Kreigh >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008, at 04:50 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, >>>> etc... >>>> I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold >>>> lamp over >>>> specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. >>>> >>>> Cheers >>>> Axel >>>> >>>> >>>>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>>>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>>>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh >>>>> Tomaszewski >>>>> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 >>>>> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >>>>> collectors >>>>> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, >>>>> available,and revealing secrets after 40 years >>>>> >>>>> Axel, >>>>> >>>>> A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up >>>>> 25K+ hits. >>>>> Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are >>>>> many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! >>>>> >>>>> Kreigh >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel >>>>> Emmermann wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >>>>>>> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >>>>> Moon Rocks >>>>>>> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? >>>>> They are >>>>>>> still available. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Kreigh >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Absolutely Kreigh! >>>>>> Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment >>>>>> (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth >>>>> elements would be >>>>>> in their lowest possible oxidation state. >>>>>> I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of >>>>>> fluorescence on those lunar samples. >>>>>> Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I >>>>> would LOVE >>>>>> to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. >>>>>> It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers >>>>>> Axel >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>> Subscription Services: >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Justin at the-vug.com Wed Jul 16 21:06:15 2008 From: Justin at the-vug.com (Justin@the-vug.com) Date: Wed Jul 16 21:06:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years References: <80A8A10E-53AC-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <007d01c8e7c2$75aea2b0$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> Ah, You are correct, it was a lunar meterorite I was thinking of. Guess you'll just have to find a curator and plead. =-) Justin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 8:00 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and revealing secrets after 40 years > It is illegal to own/have a moon rock in the US without a permit. I hope > you did not meet one of the stolen specimens. > > Many years ago I had an opportunity to touch a moon rock at the > Smithsonian; it was a thrill I will never forget -- I have touched the > Moon. > > Kreigh > > > > > On Wednesday, Jul 16, 2008, at 01:11 America/Detroit, > wrote: > >> The one specimen of moon rock that ever passed through my hands was under >> a gram and over $2,000. >> >> How about going to Tucson with your light? =) I'm sure someone at the >> Westward Look has to have a couple moon rocks! >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "steve travis" >> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >> >> Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 9:17 PM >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and >> revealing secrets after 40 years >> >> >>> When I was show chairman at Topeka we investigated what it would take. >>> simple but very expensive insurance, armed transportation, security on >>> site, you will find they are availble or were, but very difficult to >>> get. You could probably take you equipment to them for a reasonable cost >>> but thats my best suggestion. Steve >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" >>> >>> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 6:56 PM >>> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available,and >>> revealing secrets after 40 years >>> >>> >>>> You're right Axel. I'm a little surprised I could find no references. I >>>> wonder if they would loan a moon rock for such a simple test? Maybe >>>> daylight and black light photos, and SEM analysis of any glowing grains >>>> would be enough to get a paper published. At least I assume that is the >>>> goal of any loan of the moonrocks. >>>> >>>> If not, we could always wait for a new moon and a dark night, and shine >>>> a big industrial UV laser at it to see if the moon glows. But that >>>> would be expensive. Maybe we should try to mobilize rockhounds around >>>> the world to go into their yards some specific evening and shine their >>>> black lights on the moon to see if it glows. Maybe the Planetary >>>> Society could be interested in helping, and a viral marketing campaign >>>> for the news media to pick up on. Lots of people besides rockhounds >>>> have black lights. Could be fun, and a new category in the Guiness Book >>>> of Records. >>>> >>>> The Sun puts out a lot of UV light. Wonder if the spectrum of moonlight >>>> shows any peaks that might be a contribution from fluorescence? >>>> Moonlight is generally assumed to have the same spectrum as sunlight, >>>> but there may be overlooked differences if it were reviewed in fine >>>> detail. We might also find some dark spectra where light is absorbed >>>> (to be emitted later as fluorescence). >>>> >>>> Would spectra from a total eclipse show any helpful differences from >>>> the reduction of UV in earth's atmosphere? We might be able to find out >>>> if moon rocks fluoresce without getting our hands on one. Always good >>>> to have a 'Plan B', but I would rather think up a way to get my hands >>>> on a moon rock legally. >>>> >>>> Good point. >>>> >>>> Kreigh >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008, at 04:50 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Yes Kreigh but those are all X-ray fluorescence, laser ablation, >>>>> etc... >>>>> I find no reference to just normal UV fluorescence. You know: hold >>>>> lamp over >>>>> specimen and go AAAAAH and OOOOOOOOH. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers >>>>> Axel >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>>>>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>>>>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kreigh >>>>>> Tomaszewski >>>>>> Verzonden: dinsdag 15 juli 2008 4:32 >>>>>> Aan: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >>>>>> collectors >>>>>> Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, >>>>>> available,and revealing secrets after 40 years >>>>>> >>>>>> Axel, >>>>>> >>>>>> A google search on "fluorescence on lunar samples" turned up >>>>>> 25K+ hits. >>>>>> Looks like it is being done. But it also looks like there are >>>>>> many unexplored opportunities. Good suggestion! >>>>>> >>>>>> Kreigh >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Monday, Jul 14, 2008, at 12:24 America/Detroit, Axel >>>>>> Emmermann wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/science/space/ >>>>>>>> 08moon.html?em&ex=1216094400&en=82ab430be8c95359&ei=5087%0A >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Any suggestions of what yet needs to be studied about the >>>>>> Moon Rocks >>>>>>>> so maybe some of us can have an opportunity to borrow one? >>>>>> They are >>>>>>>> still available. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Kreigh >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Absolutely Kreigh! >>>>>>> Since geoformation on the moon happened in a reducing environment >>>>>>> (very little or no available oxygen) most rare earth >>>>>> elements would be >>>>>>> in their lowest possible oxidation state. >>>>>>> I don't have knowledge of any research being done in the field of >>>>>>> fluorescence on those lunar samples. >>>>>>> Lower gravitation would also cause less differentiation. I >>>>>> would LOVE >>>>>>> to go over some of those light colored rocks with my UV lamps. >>>>>>> It's not very likely that will ever happen but still ;-))) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>> Axel >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>>> Subscription Services: >>>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>> Subscription Services: >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Pmodreski at aol.com Wed Jul 16 21:08:44 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Wed Jul 16 21:08:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets... Message-ID: About glowing Moon rocks... I was quite sure I'd seen articles in the past about luminescence of lunar samples, and with a little searching on Google, all these below, and more, turn up. Some caveats, though. When "luminescence" is studied, in most cases they are studying it via the strongest excitation possible, which is electron bombardment (cathodoluminescence). Often, the kind of luminescence observed is similar to that seen with UV, only the electron irradiated luminescence is much stronger, hence easier to observe and record spectra. There usually isn't much reason, other than totally academic interest, for spending much time and effort studying the usually much weaker, UV-excited luminescence, hence, less is written about it. But nonetheless, some of the papers below do (in their titles) refer to UV-irradiated luminescence. One still has to keep in mind, that what they are observing, with senstive spectrometers, may be so weak as to be pretty much imperceptible to the human eye. And also in fact, I've seen some papers (and I think some listed below, refer to this) that use the laboratory studies of electron- or proton-bombardment luminescence, to make analogies to luminescence recorded by instruments from the surface of the moon, inferred to be due to bombardment by high-energy solar particles. This is very much like Kreigh's idea, of zapping the moon with a strong laser to look for luminescence! Keep on rockin' & glowin'... Pete ==================================================== The cause and significance of luminescence in lunar plagioclase _http://www.jstor.org/pss/74868_ (http://www.jstor.org/pss/74868) (only first page displayed online free of charge) And all these publications (and more) are listed on the NASA website: _Luminescence of Apollo 11 and 12 lunar samples_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=501862&id=4&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Luminescence of Apollo 11 and 12 rocks measured with UV, X ray, and proton radiation NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1970 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 71N24358; Document ID: 19710014882; Report Number: NASA-CR-114970 _Lunar sample luminescence_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=931682&id=5&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Evaluating luminescence of lunar rocks by comparing them with similar terrestrial rocks and minerals NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1970 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 71N10080; Document ID: 19710000606 _Luminescence studies of Apollo 11 lunar samples_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=970762&id=6&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Luminescence efficiencies of Apollo 11 lunar and terrestrial rocks and minerals, using UV excitation NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1970 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 70A41656; Document ID: 19700065540 _Luminescence of Apollo 11 and Apollo 12 lunar samples_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=378634&id=7&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Apollo 11 and 12 rocks luminescence under proton, electron, UV and X irradiation NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1971 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 71A43774; Document ID: 19710063077 _Luminescence of Apollo 11 and 12 lunar samples. Lunar sample analysis program_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=468466&id=8&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Luminescence measurements on Apollo 11 and Apollo 12 lunar soil samples NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1971 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 71N19778; Document ID: 19710010303; Report Number: NASA-CR-114899 _Luminescence of Apollo 14 and Apollo 15 lunar samples._ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=225781&id=9&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Luminescence measurements have been made of Apollo 14 lunar samples with far UV, X-ray, and proton irradiation and of Apollo 15 lunar samples with X-ray irradiation. Preliminary efficiencies with the far UV are in the range ... NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1972 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 73A19882; Document ID: 19730035080 _Luminescence analysis of lunar samples returned by Apollo: Luminescence of Apollo 14 and Apollo 15 lunar samples_ (http://ntrs.nasa.gov/search.jsp?R=992735&id=10&qs=N=4294960820&Ns=PublicationYear%7C0) Author(s): Greenman, N. N.; Gross, H. G. Abstract: Luminescence measurements were made of Apollo 14 lunar samples with far UV X-ray, and proton irradiation and of Apollo 15 lunar samples with X-ray irradiation. Preliminary efficiencies with the far UV are in the range 0.001 ... NASA Center: NASA (non Center Specific) Publication Year: 1972 Added to NTRS: 2004-11-03 Accession Number: 72N21860; Document ID: 19720014210; Report Number: NASA-CR-115512 **************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com! (http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From mstreman53 at yahoo.com Wed Jul 16 21:13:43 2008 From: mstreman53 at yahoo.com (Mr EMan) Date: Wed Jul 16 21:16:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath-Von vs Vom OT In-Reply-To: <487E403B.282DC7D2@gmx.de> Message-ID: <27571.25862.qm@web55206.mail.re4.yahoo.com> A bit OT but what is the distinction between the German "VoN" and "VoM" This made a world of difference in searching. Elton From donhalterman at verizon.net Wed Jul 16 21:39:31 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Wed Jul 16 21:38:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath-Von vs Vom OT In-Reply-To: <27571.25862.qm@web55206.mail.re4.yahoo.com> References: <27571.25862.qm@web55206.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <487ECD03.1020102@verizon.net> Mr EMan wrote: > A bit OT but what is the distinction between the German "VoN" and "VoM" > This made a world of difference in searching. "Von" means "of," and when preceding a name, is an honorific term. "Vom" is a contraction of "von dem," which means "of the" in the masculine (and possibly neuter) gender of the dative case. I'm not aware of "vom" being used in the honorific sense, but this may be an archaic use, or else it's been far too long since I minored in German... best, Don From nospam at orerockon.com Wed Jul 16 22:29:11 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Wed Jul 16 22:30:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath-Von vs Vom OT In-Reply-To: <487ECD03.1020102@verizon.net> References: <27571.25862.qm@web55206.mail.re4.yahoo.com> <487ECD03.1020102@verizon.net> Message-ID: <004301c8e7ce$0b80f8a0$2282e9e0$@com> Vom is an archaic term. I think it fell out of favor during the Wilhelminian era (pre-WW I). I haven't run into it searching for German relatives after about 1890. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of DonH Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 9:40 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] von Rath-Von vs Vom OT Mr EMan wrote: > A bit OT but what is the distinction between the German "VoN" and "VoM" > This made a world of difference in searching. "Von" means "of," and when preceding a name, is an honorific term. "Vom" is a contraction of "von dem," which means "of the" in the masculine (and possibly neuter) gender of the dative case. I'm not aware of "vom" being used in the honorific sense, but this may be an archaic use, or else it's been far too long since I minored in German... best, Don From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Jul 17 02:46:44 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Jul 17 02:46:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000901c8e7f2$062c0830$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Indeed Pete & Kreigh, If found one (1 ;-) reference to lunar rock luminescence on page 192 of "Spectroscopy, Luminescence and Radiation Centers in Minerals" by Arnold S. Marfunin. The entire message is comprised in a few lines, stating that protonoluminescence caused by the solar wind induces intense emission bands in lunar surface rocks. That's it... No wavelengths, no intensities... I guess that the issue is much less important now that our sun is so active that we're no longer in the direct line of fire of the sun's magnetic field. I read that it reaches almost to Jupiter these days. If that's true, we should see far less northern lights than usual. Much less solar wind reaching the moon too? We are now in fact much better shielded from cosmic radiation too by the sun's bloated magnetic field. Some scientists believe that this may reduce cloud formation and make our climate dryer. I don't see any of that happening now, so maybe I should revise my sources??? Axel From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Jul 17 02:57:38 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Jul 17 03:01:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Moon Rocks still in demand, available, and revealing secrets after 40 years In-Reply-To: <80A8A10E-53AC-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <00a801c8e702$612c4060$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> <80A8A10E-53AC-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <000d01c8e7f3$8bd65d90$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > > It is illegal to own/have a moon rock in the US without a > permit. I hope you did not meet one of the stolen specimens. If you bought any: please send your full name and address directly to the FBI Tampa Division, West Gray Street, Tampa, Florida. Do not pass "go", you will receive no money if you do. Axel ;-)))) From pmodreski at aol.com Thu Jul 17 06:32:30 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 17 06:32:46 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath In-Reply-To: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> References: <487BBD03.7060104@ncmail.net> Message-ID: <8CAB628B2700DDE-948-107@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com> Kenny, I'd written to?my German mineralogist friend, Renate Schumacher, about your request re. vom Rath, and she just forwarded me several biographical articles about him (I think they are all in German, I haven't opened the files yet, but perhaps they will help you.? I'll forward these to you at your own address, in a minute.? She wondered why you were interested in his life---I didn't remember if you'd said anything, about why you were researching his life.? But, I'll send the articles to you now.? She is at the University of Bonn, which is where vom Rath studied in the 19th century. Best wishes, Pete -----Original Message----- From: Kenny Gay To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 2:54 pm Subject: [Rockhounds] von Rath List,? I'm trying to find biographical information about a 19th century mineralogist from Germany, Gerhard von Rath.? Does anyone know of any books or articles about him. He lived from 1830 till 1888, and was? Professor of Mineralogy in/at Bonn.? I have been unable to locate any biographical information about him. He is not listed in Mineralogical? Record biographical section.? Thanks in advance!? Kenny? North Carolina Geological Survey? -- _______________________________________________? Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? Subscription Services:? http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From lanny.r at roadrunner.com Thu Jul 17 09:01:39 2008 From: lanny.r at roadrunner.com (Lanny R) Date: Thu Jul 17 09:04:31 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip In-Reply-To: <487C3C69.5050300@verizon.net> References: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com> <487C3C69.5050300@verizon.net> Message-ID: <68AA948F-93C1-46D1-B369-8A7016ECB8F4@roadrunner.com> Hi Don, Thanks for the additional information. There's no problem with someone getting out and moving a big rock on occasion! We need to do that more often, it's easier on tires, even for off-road tires. I've been looking through my notes on the garnet locations up there, and White Rock Spring may have been a mistake, bad memory. My notes only state that on one trip I started looking along the road at White Rock Spring. The place I actually noted garnets first was Squaw Spring area. That isn't to say there are none back there, I'm sure I haven't looked at every foot of the route! I hope you make the trip; I'm looking forward to your explaining what you think geologically/mineralogically about that particular outcrop on Freezeout. Regards, Lanny On Jul 14, 2008, at 10:58 PM, DonH wrote: > Lanny R wrote: > >> If DonH is able to make the trip, he might have a few ideas too. > > I think you've got them all covered, but I'm familiar with the area > in its current state, so I can help out if I'm still here. > >> are garnets in the area of White Rock Spring, > > Not sure if I know where those are! > >> The roads are suitable for pickups and I have seen cars with high >> clearance > > Um, yeah, about that. Parts of the road have not been graded in the > three years I've been here, and others (the roads to Goat Mtn/Moses > Butte) have been substantially re-dug. I've made most of that route > in a road sedan with moderately high clearance, and also did about > $500 worth of minor damage (air filter housing, radiator air dam). > Taking a car also requires doing things like stopping, getting out, > moving big rocks or sometimes filling in potholes with them, and > moving on. Some of the side roads are just not passable by sedan; > and this is coming from someone who does things like put two wheels > up on the embankment to get past a bad spot or build little bridges > out of fallen trees, or floor it to get through a pool-sized mud > puddle. I have a lot of experience taking a car where a car > shouldn't go, and I'm not exaggerating one bit--someone might want > to consider very, very carefully before trying it. Better off > renting a pickup, or doubling up with someone who has appropriate > transportation. Just my alternate observations on the matter. > > > so no racing. > > I can't imagine anyone with any sanity trying that! Good thing is, > you get good mileage--my avg. speed up there is between 10-15 MPH, > with occasional short bursts to 25. > >> of the locations are along the road with no shoulders to park on, >> so we might be in someone's way sometimes (usually I don't see >> any traffic, but others do use the roads). > > There are some pretty wide areas and pull-outs where one can park > though. I usually never had a problem leaving enough room for > someone to get by; or else I was working close enough to the car > that I could hear someone coming (or see the dust trail) and go move > it. > > Despite my warnings about the road surface, the driving is not bad > as far as the width of the roads or the drop-offs, etc. My first > time up there alone, I was quite nervous, but quickly grew > accustomed to it. Despite the remoteness of the area, Road 301 is > the "main highway" of St. Joe, and I have always seen other people > driving around, and most everyone is very cooperative as "the code > of the forest" dictates. The view is magnificent, and I will miss > the area very much. > > >> and the Fossil Bowl site for leaf fossils, both near Clarkia. > > Oh yeah, you can't not find fossils there. Bring a butter knife to > split the claystone! > > > Best, > Don > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Thu Jul 17 12:18:05 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Thu Jul 17 12:20:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Cutting Material - AD References: Message-ID: <000a01c8e841$d70b7630$0200000a@LarryRush> Please indulge my advertising for one more time...... I have had a chance to go through the old rock shop material, and have separated out the cutting material. There are approximately 400 pounds of this. I want to sell it wholesale as a lot. I have not yet had a chance to look at the specimen material yet, some 25 flats. If anyone is interested, please contact me OFF-LINE and I will send a listing, with details and price. Thanks.....Larry From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Fri Jul 18 13:02:50 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Fri Jul 18 13:02:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check THIS out! And this: U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? Ya'll have any comments? Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pmodreski at aol.com Fri Jul 18 13:46:27 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Fri Jul 18 13:46:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8CAB72E7BE756FB-B68-911C@webmail-ng19.sysops.aol.com> Hi Glenn, Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? No, that's just dreaming and wishful thinking. If you'd lived in or seen papers & news in the North Dakota area, you'd have been reading a lot about the Bakken Formation, before and after that USGS evaluation report was released. A lot of very speculative and unrealistic claims were being made about the possible amount of oil in the Bakken Formation, such as the "2 trillion barrels" that you quoted. Here is a good (and quite lengthy, detailed, but written for the general reader) summary about oil in the Bakken Formation, from an oil industry newsletter: http://www.theoildrum.com/node/3868 The USGS news release was titled, and is online at, 3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana?s Bakken Formation?25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate? http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1911 That 1995 estimate was 151 million barrels; the technology?for producing oil from this type of a formation has improved a lot since then.? The 3 to 4 billion barrels is nice, but it's still a little speculative as to how to produce that oil economically; only a small fraction of that is being produced now.? And the "trillions" of barrels of oil is very far beyond any reasonable expectation of what can ever be produced. Sorry... Pete -----Original Message----- From: Glenn Wimpee To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Fri,=2 018 Jul 2008 2:02 pm Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The .S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and ilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western /3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check HIS out! nd this: .S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - /20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the argest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They eported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the ther proven reserves on earth. s much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. an we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? a'll have any comments? lenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me -- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- ultipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html -- - ______________________________________________ ockhounds@drizzle Mailing List ubscription Services: ttp://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds ist Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: ttp://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Fri Jul 18 14:30:03 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Fri Jul 18 14:31:54 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Home metal casting Message-ID: I thought this cool site might be of interest to people on the list, we had some questions about refining ore not too long ago. I just stumbled across this: BK -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kcbaran at arczip.com Fri Jul 18 16:06:41 2008 From: kcbaran at arczip.com (Charles Baran) Date: Fri Jul 18 16:14:40 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <48812201.1020902@arczip.com> Good by, Arabs!!! Now just fight amongst your selves! Chuck Glenn Wimpee wrote: >Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > >And this: > > >U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. > > >As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > >Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > >Ya'll have any comments? >Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- > > From Justin at the-vug.com Fri Jul 18 17:16:22 2008 From: Justin at the-vug.com (Justin@the-vug.com) Date: Fri Jul 18 17:16:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read References: <48812201.1020902@arczip.com> Message-ID: <009801c8e934$acf83ce0$6d01a8c0@windows2df367b> Ewww...what did I just step in? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Baran" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 4:06 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > Good by, Arabs!!! Now just fight amongst your selves! > > Chuck > > Glenn Wimpee wrote: > >>Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. >>The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only >>scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a >>revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this >>area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme >>eastern Montana ... check THIS out! >> >> And this: >> >> U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report >> Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky >> Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than >> 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil >> inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. As much >> as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. >> Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? >> Ya'll have any comments? >>Glenn >> >> >> EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me >> >> >>--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >>multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >>--- >> > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From efkern at earthlink.net Fri Jul 18 18:13:26 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Fri Jul 18 18:13:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read References: <8CAB72E7BE756FB-B68-911C@webmail-ng19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <001201c8e93c$a62ee5a0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Sorry if this is a bit off topic, but I'm not the one wringing my hands about an economic 'crisis', which I agree doesn't belong here. I'm a tad annoyed by misinformation. First of all, those of you who get most of your news from TV may believe there's an economic crisis. I emphasize 'believe'. A recession is defined by two consecutive quarters of negative economic growth. We haven't had even one quarter of negative growth.... 96% of home mortgage holders are making their payments on time. The 4% who don't are getting their 10 seconds of fame on the nightly news. To those who say, yeah but it'll take 5 plus years to get that oil, I say, that's what you people were saying 10 years ago too, and had we drilled then, that oil would be available NOW. So, when would you like to start? Pete is right that drilling now won't save us in the short term, but consider this: Now that there's serious talk going on about drilling off of the outer continental shelf, and political pressure to drill in ANWR and other places, the price of crude oil has, this week, had its largest price decline EVER. From a high of $147. a barrel a week ago, it closed today at $128.88 a barrel. Oil which was uneconomic to produce when the price was $25. a barrel, sounds like a good gamble to me now, even at $75. a barrel. Stating a deposit is "uneconomic to produce" is meaningless when disconnected from current market prices. Given a choice between drilling and hand wringing, I'll take drilling. Erich Kern Murrieta, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: pmodreski@aol.com To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 1:46 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Hi Glenn, Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? No, that's just dreaming and wishful thinking. If you'd lived in or seen papers & news in the North Dakota area, you'd have been reading a lot about the Bakken Formation, before and after that USGS evaluation report was released. A lot of very speculative and unrealistic claims were being made about the possible amount of oil in the Bakken Formation, such as the "2 trillion barrels" that you quoted. Here is a good (and quite lengthy, detailed, but written for the general reader) summary about oil in the Bakken Formation, from an oil industry newsletter: http://www.theoildrum.com/node/3868 The USGS news release was titled, and is online at, 3 to 4.3 Billion Barrels of Technically Recoverable Oil Assessed in North Dakota and Montana?s Bakken Formation?25 Times More Than 1995 Estimate? http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1911 That 1995 estimate was 151 million barrels; the technology for producing oil from this type of a formation has improved a lot since then. The 3 to 4 billion barrels is nice, but it's still a little speculative as to how to produce that oil economically; only a small fraction of that is being produced now. And the "trillions" of barrels of oil is very far beyond any reasonable expectation of what can ever be produced. Sorry... Pete -----Original Message----- From: Glenn Wimpee To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Fri,=2 018 Jul 2008 2:02 pm Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The .S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and ilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western /3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check HIS out! nd this: .S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - /20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the argest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They eported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the ther proven reserves on earth. s much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. an we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? a'll have any comments? lenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rpr at heidelberg.edu Fri Jul 18 18:28:53 2008 From: rpr at heidelberg.edu (R. Peter Richards) Date: Fri Jul 18 18:28:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA In-Reply-To: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> References: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: In material said to be from the Virginia Crushed Stone Co., Centerville, VA, I have vugs lined with prehnite. Late stage crystallization has produced loose stacks of microcrystals, or in some cases, crystals impaled on byssolite fibers. These crystals show nearly all of their faces, making them a delight for someone like me who likes crystal form first and foremost. They seem to be of two sorts, though both are platy with a six-sided morphology that is consistent with orthorhombic symmetry. One can think of a diamond with the blunt angles cut off symmetrically. (Man, it's hard doing this without graphics!!!!) On one type, the truncating faces are shorter than the faces of the basic diamond, the un-truncated points of the diamond are formed by faces that meet at a bit less than 90? (from a photo I measure 82?), and the faces are striated parallel to lines running between these untruncated points. If you're trained, think tabular on {001}, bounded by {110} truncated by {100} or {010}. On the other type, the crystals are thinner tabular, the truncating edges are longer, there are no striations, and the angles at the un- truncated points are more nearly 120? (I measure 100?). Can anybody say if these are both the same mineral? Are they both prehnite (my guess)? Does anybody have any additional information about these beautiful microcrystals and their presumed mode of formation? And can anybody offer any advice about how to remove the brown gunk - smectite or something similar - without ruining these crystals? I can send digital images to anyone who is interested - contact me offline. Thanks, Pete Richards From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 18 18:30:02 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 18 18:30:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Home metal casting In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3597BB16-5532-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Thanks Bryan! That is a useful website. Kreigh On Friday, Jul 18, 2008, at 17:30 America/Detroit, J Bryan Kramer wrote: > I thought this cool site might be of interest to people on the list, > we had > some questions about refining ore not too long ago. I just stumbled > across > this: > > > > BK > > -- > "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and > put on > the breastplate of righteousness." > > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 18 19:09:30 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 18 19:09:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Glenn, We've got lots of oil reserves that could be tapped to increase supply and bring down prices somewhat. It would also let us reduce the $$$ flowing out of the country every day for oil and keep it in our economy. But it won't solve the problem of basing our economy on what is essentially a non-renewable resource. Drilling could buy us time to solve the harder problem of renewable energy. Even if we converted all our corn to ethanol, we could only meet 5% of demand. Atomic power is a good near term solution but it has a long term downside with waste. Wind, solar, and geothermal have great potential. Mine tailings are often reprocessed as technology improves. The same is happening in the oil industry, as the recent upgrade report on the Bakken Formation shows. Technology improvements are also making oil shale more attractive -- as is the increasing prices for oil. Gas is still cheaper than bottled water. Rising prices will force the market to find a solution, and force us all to alter our behaviors. As beer becomes cheaper than gas the rule will become "Drink, don't drive". Cheers! Kreigh On Friday, Jul 18, 2008, at 16:02 America/Detroit, Glenn Wimpee wrote: > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my > mind. The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that > only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. > It was a revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much > oil was in this area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South > Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > And this: > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report > Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky > Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more > than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have > more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on > earth. > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > Ya'll have any comments? > Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 18 19:28:35 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 18 19:32:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <633799AC-553A-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Mindat lists one source in Centerville Quarry (MRDS - 10154716), Centerville, Augusta Co., Virginia, USA and notes it is a past producer. Epidote and Prehnite were the only minerals listed. Both minerals are relatively safe from most common cleaners, so pick a less valuable specimen and throw some chemicals at it. Kreigh On Friday, Jul 18, 2008, at 21:28 America/Detroit, R. Peter Richards wrote: > In material said to be from the Virginia Crushed Stone Co., > Centerville, VA, I have vugs lined with prehnite. Late stage > crystallization has produced loose stacks of microcrystals, or in some > cases, crystals impaled on byssolite fibers. These crystals show > nearly all of their faces, making them a delight for someone like me > who likes crystal form first and foremost. They seem to be of two > sorts, though both are platy with a six-sided morphology that is > consistent with orthorhombic symmetry. One can think of a diamond > with the blunt angles cut off symmetrically. (Man, it's hard doing > this without graphics!!!!) > > On one type, the truncating faces are shorter than the faces of the > basic diamond, the un-truncated points of the diamond are formed by > faces that meet at a bit less than 90? (from a photo I measure 82?), > and the faces are striated parallel to lines running between these > untruncated points. If you're trained, think tabular on {001}, > bounded by {110} truncated by {100} or {010}. > > On the other type, the crystals are thinner tabular, the truncating > edges are longer, there are no striations, and the angles at the > un-truncated points are more nearly 120? (I measure 100?). > > Can anybody say if these are both the same mineral? Are they both > prehnite (my guess)? Does anybody have any additional information > about these beautiful microcrystals and their presumed mode of > formation? > > And can anybody offer any advice about how to remove the brown gunk - > smectite or something similar - without ruining these crystals? > > I can send digital images to anyone who is interested - contact me > offline. > > Thanks, > Pete Richards > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From donhalterman at verizon.net Fri Jul 18 19:50:35 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Fri Jul 18 19:47:29 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA In-Reply-To: References: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <4881567B.8070101@verizon.net> Pete, If those really are clays, try a warm (but not hot) saline solution to disperse them. Good luck, Don From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Fri Jul 18 21:53:57 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Fri Jul 18 21:57:41 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Arowhead Alpines 6th Annual Rock Show Message-ID: The Arrowhead Alpines Nursery is holding their 6th annual Rock Show on July 26 and 27 from 10 am to 7 pm in Fowlerville, MI. Family conflicts prevent me from attending this year, but this is a good rock show. Give my regards to Bob and Brigitta (and the other vendors) if you can attend. Kreigh From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Fri Jul 18 22:27:13 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Fri Jul 18 22:27:19 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <8CAB72E7BE756FB-B68-911C@webmail-ng19.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CAB72E7BE756FB-B68-911C@webmail-ng19.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Thanks Pete, Kreigh, and others responding to this post. That old adage "If it sounds..." appears to apply. I am confident that we will find alternate energy sources (not including the world's food supply) and continue to improve the lifestyles of a larger percentage of the world's human population as well as our own. (I know, I know, perish the thought that we might improve and not regress...) And as has been stated, more sources, maybe including oil shale and coal, will become feasible to mine as prices increase. May be some of us will be amongst those making breakthroughs in discovering alternate energy sources and where to mine them. I have be fascinated by the breaking down of H2O and then hitting the gas with a spark since high school chemistry. Almost as much fun as NI3 or small chunks of K. And a side note, fishing off the Alabama coast is much better around the oil and gas rigs than before they were built. Glenn --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From albalmer at copper.net Fri Jul 18 23:15:11 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Fri Jul 18 23:15:14 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 22:09:30 -0400, Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: >Gas is still cheaper than bottled water. ? A gallon of bottled water is about 0.60 USD at Wal-mart, 0.25 at any number of places if you bring your own container. > Rising prices will force the >market to find a solution, and force us all to alter our behaviors. As >beer becomes cheaper than gas the rule will become "Drink, don't drive". :-) -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From sauktown1 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 19 06:11:02 2008 From: sauktown1 at yahoo.com (Jim Daly) Date: Sat Jul 19 06:11:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I'm sure Kreigh is talking about bottled water in 12 oz. or 20 oz. bottles. It's the packaging you're paying for. Jim --- On Fri, 7/18/08, Al Balmer wrote: From: Al Balmer Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Date: Friday, July 18, 2008, 11:15 PM On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 22:09:30 -0400, Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: >Gas is still cheaper than bottled water. ? A gallon of bottled water is about 0.60 USD at Wal-mart, 0.25 at any number of places if you bring your own container. > Rising prices will force the >market to find a solution, and force us all to alter our behaviors. As >beer becomes cheaper than gas the rule will become "Drink, don't drive". :-) -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Sat Jul 19 07:37:59 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Sat Jul 19 07:38:30 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale In-Reply-To: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000501c8e9ad$0b676a80$22363f80$@com> Hey kids guess what? It's the semi-annual "TIM NEEDS CASH NOW!" sale! That's right, act now, and for a limited time only, you can receive a brand spanking new copy of OreRockOn on DVD for the special low, low price of $29.95 + $0.05! That's $29.95 + $0.05! let me repeat myself, that's only $29.95 + $0.05! Why the 5 cents? Because PayPal won't let me charge $29.95! And I don't know why! That's $15.00 off the regular price! A 33% savings! You save enough to get an extra 3 gallons of diesel! Whoo hoo! As usual, click on the CD link below to find out everything there is to know about the DVD! And remember kids, Crazy Eddie's prices are Insaaaaane! (If you are old like me you will remember these commercials LOL) OreRockOn on DVD V 4.2 has 638 (15 new since V 4.0) detailed 1:24,000 scale shaded relief 1:24,000 USGS topographic maps of Pacific Northwest (OR, WA, ID, and a wee bit o' Cali) rock, fossil, and mineral collecting areas, 2,118 waypoints (98 new), 36 site writeups (1 new; many expanded, all new fossil preparation page), and 217 1:100,000 scale USGS or WA DNR Land Ownership maps for each collecting area (5 new). All maps now have mileposts on all major highways. There is a new waypoint file for your GPS, and I even threw in a Google Earth file so you can view satellite photos of each dig site or fly from dig to dig in 3D until you are dizzy (LOL!) Copy and paste the special List Sale Link below to receive your discount via PayPal (all other payment methods please contact me off-list). Click the link or copy and paste it into your browser to order the OreRockOn Dig Locations DVD 4.2 for $29.95 + $0.05: DVD With FREE Media Mail Shipping: http://tinyurl.com/6lp3z9 DVD With USPS Priority Mail Shipping: http://tinyurl.com/5zvcuz Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com Find out more at: http://OreRockOn.com/CD From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 19 08:21:50 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 19 08:22:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Was:OreRockOn on DVD List Sale NOW: oil for the really small investor. In-Reply-To: <000501c8e9ad$0b676a80$22363f80$@com> References: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000501c8e9ad$0b676a80$22363f80$@com> Message-ID: <001201c8e9b3$2b2a0110$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > > That's $15.00 off the regular price! A 33% savings! You save > enough to get an extra 3 gallons of diesel! Whoo hoo! I have a friend in Texas who drives a Toyota Prius... People mock Prius drivers with sneers like "why does it have a steering wheel? If you want to turn just stick your hand out the window". There's a lot less laughing these days, I assume ;-))) Anyway, I had my insurance agent look at my mineral collection. I have several dozens of specimens with petroleum inclusions: quartz from Berbes (Sp) and Afghanistan, fluorite from Cave-In-Rock and Moscona (Sp), barite from St-Laurent-le-Minier (Fr).... People always get that "hungry" look when I tell them that those fluorescent droplets in the rocks are petroleum... Maybe I should lock them in a bank vault? Cheers Axel From albalmer at copper.net Sat Jul 19 09:21:41 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Sat Jul 19 09:21:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 06:11:02 -0700 (PDT), Jim Daly wrote: >I'm sure Kreigh is talking about bottled water in 12 oz. or 20 oz. bottles. It's the packaging you're paying for. >Jim I don't think so. Gasoline in small packages isn't cheaper, either. In any case, a local price for bottled water in the 8 oz size (maximum packaging) is 48 for 7.88. That works out to 2.63/gallon. Keogh must have been talking about something else. > >--- On Fri, 7/18/08, Al Balmer wrote: > >From: Al Balmer >Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read >To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >Date: Friday, July 18, 2008, 11:15 PM > >On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 22:09:30 -0400, Kreigh Tomaszewski > wrote: > >>Gas is still cheaper than bottled water. > >? A gallon of bottled water is about 0.60 USD at Wal-mart, 0.25 at any >number of places if you bring your own container. > >> Rising prices will force the >>market to find a solution, and force us all to alter our behaviors. As >>beer becomes cheaper than gas the rule will become "Drink, don't >drive". > >:-) -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 19 09:25:59 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 19 09:26:02 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mother's pressure cooker... Mineralogical use? Message-ID: <001301c8e9bc$20f72390$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Good morning esteemed list-dwellers, My wife and I were cleaning up (finally) our garage when we stumbled upon several arachnoid garage-dwellers and a pressure cooker that once belonged to her late mother. The flattened remains of the aforementioned arachnoid garage-dwellers are of no interest whatsoever here so we shall not dwell upon those and exclude them from this discussion forthwith. As my lovely wife went forth to place the pressure cooker near or upon the pile of garage-garbage* that had we had already collected I had an epiphany and, with a formidable leap of almost Olympic allure, I tackled the poor woman.** On the downside: I shall not have to concern myself with planning elaborate nocturnal escapades of matrimonial nature for at least a week. Tackling your wife on a cement garage floor in not considered as particularly romantic or good foreplay. On the upside: after being beaten senseless with it I now have in my possession a working pressure cooker. That is to say: it will be complete as soon as I pass the weight, you know , the whistling thingy that hisses and dances on the lid. (Boy, was she mad...!). What I actually wanted to know is this: can a kitchen variety pressure cooker be put to work for any mineralogical purpose? I mean things like inserting activator ions in minerals, recrystallizing stuff like gypsum etc It'll reach about 120 - 129 ? C, which corresponds with a pressure of roughly 30-38 psi (2.1 - 2.6 bar). * do not attempt to read this if you are even remotely dyslexic ** Pardon me the archaic language but I hate garage cleaning, it makes me long for the time before the invention of the automobile and thus, by proxy, the garage. Cheers Axel --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kadok at infowest.com Sat Jul 19 10:06:23 2008 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Sat Jul 19 09:56:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> Glenn; Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much less damage to our planet's atmosphere. My opinion. But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so perhaps this discussion should end here. Margaret -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Glenn Wimpee Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check THIS out! And this: U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? Ya'll have any comments? Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 10:15:20 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 10:15:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> Message-ID: If anyone figures out how to strap a renewable resource to my truck then I'll be interested. So far they are all much more expensive, unpredictable, only work once in awhile, and can't be stored in a tank....worthless in other words. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 1:06 PM, Margaret Malm wrote: > Glenn; > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do need to get into > renewable resources in a big way. If that oil is 2 miles down, and under > the > Rocky Mts. to boot, it's going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say > nothing of the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use our > renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much less damage to > our > planet's atmosphere. > My opinion. > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so perhaps this > discussion should end here. > > Margaret > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From efkern at earthlink.net Sat Jul 19 10:18:43 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Sat Jul 19 10:18:26 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> Message-ID: <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> "Renewables" has a nice warm fuzzy ring to it, but unfortunately there's not enough energy therein to do much for our energy needs. Currently, wind, solar and bio-mass (methane) COMBINED contribute less than 1% of our energy needs. Speaking of environmental damage, ethanol from corn has used so much corn that food prices world-wide have risen, hurting the third world poor the hardest, and depleting our soils of macro and micro nutrients. There are cheaper sources of ethanol available from Brazil, made from sugar cane, but bowing to the corn growers lobby, our Congress has imposed a tarriff on imported ethanol which makes it too high priced to substitute for home grown corn. Please add that to "the facts". Cheers, Erich Kern Murrieta, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: Margaret Malm To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 10:06 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Glenn; Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much less damage to our planet's atmosphere. My opinion. But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so perhaps this discussion should end here. Margaret -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Glenn Wimpee Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme eastern Montana ... check THIS out! And this: U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online - 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? Ya'll have any comments? Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 10:26:58 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 10:27:02 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Message-ID: As interesting as the Bakken deposits are the Green River deposits make them look minor league: < http://money.cnn.com/2007/10/30/magazines/fortune/Oil_from_stone.fortune/index.htm > Unfortunately the Democrats have passed legislation preventing us from using that 800,000,000,000 BBL of oil. Using our own resources would drive oil prices down and keep that money from going to middle east terrorists and tin horn Venezuelan dictators. Modern technology prevents environmental damage. Canadians have a very active and thriving oil shale extraction industry going, that's where they get the oil that they sell to the US. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kern wrote: > > "Renewables" has a nice warm fuzzy ring to it, but unfortunately there's > not enough energy therein to do much for our energy needs. Currently, wind, > solar and bio-mass (methane) COMBINED contribute less than 1% of our energy > needs. > > Speaking of environmental damage, ethanol from corn has used so much corn > that food prices world-wide have risen, hurting the third world poor the > hardest, and depleting our soils of macro and micro nutrients. There are > cheaper sources of ethanol available from Brazil, made from sugar cane, but > bowing to the corn growers lobby, our Congress has imposed a tarriff on > imported ethanol which makes it too high priced to substitute for home grown > corn. > > Please add that to "the facts". > > Cheers, > > Erich Kern > Murrieta, CA > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Margaret Malm > To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' > Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 10:06 AM > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > Glenn; > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do need to get into > renewable resources in a big way. If that oil is 2 miles down, and under > the > Rocky Mts. to boot, it's going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say > nothing of the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use our > renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much less damage to > our > planet's atmosphere. > My opinion. > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so perhaps this > discussion should end here. > > Margaret > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Glenn Wimpee > Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it BLEW my mind. > The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) that only > scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but man was it big. It was a > revised report (hadn't been updated since '95) on how much oil was in this > area of the western 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme > eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > And this: > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry Report Online > - > 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky Mountains > lies > the largest untapped oil reserve in the world is more than 2 TRILLION > barrels. They reported this stunning news: We have more oil inside our > borders, than all the other proven reserves on earth. > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > Ya'll have any comments? > Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Sat Jul 19 10:28:41 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sat Jul 19 10:31:07 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mother's pressure cooker... Mineralogical use? In-Reply-To: <001301c8e9bc$20f72390$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <001301c8e9bc$20f72390$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: Axel wrote(amongst other stuff): " ** Pardon me the archaic language but I hate garage cleaning, it makes me long for the time before the invention of the automobile and thus, by proxy, the garage." No autos, and folks just shoveled horse stuff and straw out of the barn or stall, as horse garages are usually called. As for the cooker and your adventure, I'll not mention the estimated weight I attributed to a person of that other sex (which, by the way, I'll also be trying to maintain a reasonably safe distance from for a time while I sleep on the hot back porch of our cool home) while we were cutting limbs of her brothers home after a small thunderstorm. She started to climb onto a boat on a platform from one of these not so new, but still state of the art climbing devices, aluminum lawn chairs. It was closer than the ladder on the opposite side of the boat, which obviously had been placed there by someone who had faint knowledge of the preferred climbing apparatus, that sturdy aluminum lawn chair. The chair failed to collapse during the climb, but I, in my subtle quest to spend the rest of the summer on the warm porch near rocks and dogs and far,far away from the boudoir pursuits we men so desire, yet prove infinite times we really do not so desire, smashed the heavy aluminum chair frame while pulling a huge limb with my horseless 4WD carriage. I do not consume adult alcholic beverages any more, but I am about to have a big pitcher of something wet and cold. Of course it will also be sugar free. I suspect your cooker could be used for heating weak acids like vinegar or similarly weak bases for cleaning. Don't know about injecting ions or recreating crystals, more likely it would free particles and break down many crystals. Why not just put in a beef brisket and a nice cabbage, season it up, and enjoy in a couple of hours along with your favorite liquid refreshment? Jeanette makes a mean cornbread to go with ours when she's in a really great mood! By the way, be really careful with the old pressure cooker. That whistle thingy might be stopped up. I remember lots of 'em exploding in the old horse and buggy days, and some even more recently. Cheers!!! And thanks for the glowing pics too! Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > From: axel.emmermann@pandora.be > Subject: [Rockhounds] Mother's pressure cooker... Mineralogical use?> > Good morning esteemed list-dwellers,> > My wife and I were cleaning up (finally) our garage when we stumbled upon> several arachnoid garage-dwellers and a pressure cooker that once belonged> to her late mother.> The flattened remains of the aforementioned arachnoid garage-dwellers are of> no interest whatsoever here so we shall not dwell upon those and exclude> them from this discussion forthwith. As my lovely wife went forth to place> the pressure cooker near or upon the pile of garage-garbage* that had we> had already collected I had an epiphany and, with a formidable leap of> almost Olympic allure, I tackled the poor woman.**> > On the downside: I shall not have to concern myself with planning elaborate> nocturnal escapades of matrimonial nature for at least a week. Tackling your> wife on a cement garage floor in not considered as particularly romantic or> good foreplay.> On the upside: after being beaten senseless with it I now have in my> possession a working pressure cooker. That is to say: it will be complete as> soon as I pass the weight, you know , the whistling thingy that hisses and> dances on the lid. (Boy, was she mad...!). > > What I actually wanted to know is this: can a kitchen variety pressure> cooker be put to work for any mineralogical purpose?> I mean things like inserting activator ions in minerals, recrystallizing> stuff like gypsum? etc?> It'll reach about 120 - 129 ? C, which corresponds with a pressure of> roughly 30-38 psi (2.1 - 2.6 bar).> > * do not attempt to read this if you are even remotely dyslexic> ** Pardon me the archaic language but I hate garage cleaning, it makes me> long for the time before the invention of the automobile and thus, by proxy,> the garage.> > Cheers> Axel> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 19 11:40:45 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 19 11:40:49 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy In-Reply-To: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> Message-ID: <002a01c8e9ce$f5124850$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Indeed Margaret! I heard about technology being ready to use thorium instead of uranium/plutonium in nuclear fission reactors. Thorium would be safer and the fission products would cool much faster. You cannot use thorium for weapons-grade fission material so there would be no objections against "rogue-states" using it. As things are now: can we really demand that India and China limit energy consumption while we drive around in our monster-wheel SUVs? Thorium is abundant enough... Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Margaret Malm > Verzonden: zaterdag 19 juli 2008 18:06 > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors' > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > Glenn; > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do > need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that > oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's > going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of > the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use > our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much > less damage to our planet's atmosphere. > My opinion. > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so > perhaps this discussion should end here. > > Margaret > > -----Original Message----- > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > Glenn Wimpee > Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it > BLEW my mind. > The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) > that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but > man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated > since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western > 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme > eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > And this: > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry > Report Online - > 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky > Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world > is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning > news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other > proven reserves on earth. > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > Ya'll have any comments? > Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 19 11:47:11 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 19 11:47:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Message-ID: <002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Hi Erich, > unfortunately there's not enough energy therein to do much > for our energy needs. How much of our needs are real "needs"? ;-))) It seems this concept of "needs" largely depends on your status and geographic location. If you are a goat herder living in quarters that are largely constructed from the dropping of your livelihood, you'd need about 1/10.000th of what a yuppie needs for an hour of relaxation. Cheers Axel From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 12:37:43 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 12:37:48 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy In-Reply-To: <002a01c8e9ce$f5124850$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <002a01c8e9ce$f5124850$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: I read some articles on that, but has anyone actually built a Thorium cycle plant? The development costs would be high when there is a proven technology with plenty of fuel available. Pebble bed reactors are supposed to be be much safer but I haven't heard of any of those being built either. As for the wastes from reactors, this is something that again is highly exaggerated. The most radioactive material decays off quickly from the simple physics of the material. Activity is inversely proportional to half life. So the shortest half life material is the 'hottest' and in 10 years or so is mostly gone. If you are talking about isotopes that last for tens of thousands of years then you are talking about low activity material which is not as hazardous. The normal rule of thumb is that 5 half lives is enough to decay most material. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Indeed Margaret! > > I heard about technology being ready to use thorium instead of > uranium/plutonium in nuclear fission reactors. Thorium would be safer and > the fission products would cool much faster. > You cannot use thorium for weapons-grade fission material so there would be > no objections against "rogue-states" using it. > As things are now: can we really demand that India and China limit energy > consumption while we drive around in our monster-wheel SUVs? > > Thorium is abundant enough... > > Cheers > Axel > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Margaret Malm > > Verzonden: zaterdag 19 juli 2008 18:06 > > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors' > > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > Glenn; > > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do > > need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that > > oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's > > going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of > > the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use > > our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much > > less damage to our planet's atmosphere. > > My opinion. > > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so > > perhaps this discussion should end here. > > > > Margaret > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > > Glenn Wimpee > > Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM > > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it > > BLEW my mind. > > The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) > > that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but > > man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated > > since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western > > 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme > > eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > > > > And this: > > > > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry > > Report Online - > > 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky > > Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world > > is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning > > news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other > > proven reserves on earth. > > > > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > > > Ya'll have any comments? > > Glenn > > > > > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 12:41:19 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 12:41:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> <002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: Not to finger point Axel, but are you advocating and living the life of a goat herder? Have you given up electricity? Water piped to your home? Do you live in a Yurt? You obviously haven't given up the internet....heh. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:47 PM, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Hi Erich, > > > unfortunately there's not enough energy therein to do much > > for our energy needs. > > How much of our needs are real "needs"? ;-))) > It seems this concept of "needs" largely depends on your status and > geographic location. > If you are a goat herder living in quarters that are largely constructed > from the dropping of your livelihood, you'd need about 1/10.000th of what a > yuppie needs for an hour of relaxation. > > Cheers > Axel > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From gregaweis at msn.com Sat Jul 19 13:25:41 2008 From: gregaweis at msn.com (GREGORY WEISBROD) Date: Sat Jul 19 13:25:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> <002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: Let's just hope we never have to find out how basic life can get. Besides camping out, of course. So much of civilization as we know it depends on our mineral resources. If you had a wagon to haul borax from California to New York but needed to haul feed for the mules, you would have no room for the borax. So I guess that is why they invented filling stations. Now some folks are objecting to digging the borax in the first place, and to the mules on account of their pollution. > Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 15:41:19 -0400> From: codeburner@gmail.com> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read> > Not to finger point Axel, but are you advocating and living the life of a> goat herder? Have you given up electricity? Water piped to your home? Do you> live in a Yurt? You obviously haven't given up the internet....heh.> > BK> > On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:47 PM, Axel Emmermann > wrote:> > > Hi Erich,> >> > > unfortunately there's not enough energy therein to do much> > > for our energy needs.> >> > How much of our needs are real "needs"? ;-)))> > It seems this concept of "needs" largely depends on your status and> > geographic location.> > If you are a goat herder living in quarters that are largely constructed> > from the dropping of your livelihood, you'd need about 1/10.000th of what a> > yuppie needs for an hour of relaxation.> >> > Cheers> > Axel> >> > --> > _______________________________________________> > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> >> > > > -- > --> > "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the> horizon."> > Ralph Waldo Emerson> > J Bryan Kramer> North Florida, USA> photos at:> http://pbase.com/photoburner> > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---> multipart/alternative> text/plain (text body -- kept)> text/html> ---> -- > _______________________________________________> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> Subscription Services:> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Sat Jul 19 13:42:53 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sat Jul 19 13:47:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Energy Sources (was: The Bakken Formation) In-Reply-To: References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Message-ID: Looks like I've stepped right in it again... Oil from shale, clean coal, nuclear power (found a rock containing thorium near Easton, PA) & (When are they going to change the spelling to neucular?), solar, wind, biological (flora & fauna - you know how much methane herbivores produce?), water from dams, waves, rain off the roof, natural ocean currents, geothermal wells, and who knows what else? No one I know has said not to look for other viable alternatives to oil, but it seems some are saying "Go back to the stone age NOW! Heck, one of us on this list might discover the next mineral energy source to replace oil when it runs out in several million years if we don't all die because of global warming or an ice age or a close encounter with a foreign body from space (is there a body from space that would not be "foreign"?) or just all go berserk and nuke this planet to rid it of all the bigots? We are naturally creative creatures and I am confident we will survive and continue to progress technologically so we don't have to give up Al Gore's invention, the internet. And we can use our knowledge to help others get out of their mud, straw, dung, or stone huts if they want to progress. We, internationally, have more knowledge and experience than any other civilization ever on this planet, and with that the greatest opportunity the world has ever known to actually have, mostly anyway, peace on earth! We only have to use this knowledge and experience and (UH OH here it is) the resources we have to create an even better lifestyle than any other generation has ever known. So lets keep cookin'! Now, where is my crock pot anyway? Glenn --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From ajs at frii.com Sat Jul 19 14:49:50 2008 From: ajs at frii.com (Alan Silverstein) Date: Sat Jul 19 14:52:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080719214950.A021C1CC35@io.frii.com> > As beer becomes cheaper than gas the rule will become "Drink, don't > drive". And, "Live close to work, save your gas dollars for rockhounding trips." Cheers, Alan Silverstein From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sat Jul 19 15:12:33 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:17:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > Not to finger point Axel, but are you advocating and living > the life of a goat herder? I would suck at that... ;-))) > Have you given up electricity? > Water piped to your home? Do you live in a Yurt? Not likely, no... But some people have none of the above because we squander our resources on "needing" the latest cell phone, i-Pod, .... We "need" a car to go to work, one for the wife, one for the kids, one for all terrain and one for making the neighbors jealous. The latter has to have at least a 3 liter engine. We really are funny people: China buys lots of the steel and when the price of steel goes up we blame the government for not protecting our economic interest. China buys lots of oil and when prices go up we blame the Arabs. Petroleum is made of irreplaceable hydrocarbons. We can make plastics and other durable things of it. Instead we burn it. Why? Because it's there and because people get rich of it. Certainly not because it makes sense ;-))) You > obviously haven't given up the internet....heh. And that is the least of my vices. But I took care of my house qua insulation and I had a completely new heating system installed with a condensation boiler. I shut off the TV between programs I want to see and I try to limit car use. We own one car. Cheers Axel From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sat Jul 19 15:15:44 2008 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:17:59 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip References: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com><487C3C69.5050300@verizon.net> <68AA948F-93C1-46D1-B369-8A7016ECB8F4@roadrunner.com> Message-ID: <0B8BC451E79B42B0B0DDB45B53B0005F@Notebook> A neighbor drove from the St. Joe down to Clarkia yesterday, and it was snow-free. And it's only July! John From albalmer at copper.net Sat Jul 19 15:37:23 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:37:23 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:12:33 +0200, "Axel Emmermann" wrote: >Not likely, no... But some people have none of the above because we squander >our resources on "needing" the latest cell phone, i-Pod, .... Nonsense. Me buying the latest cellphone isn't going to make a bit of difference to your goatherd. In fact, if it contributes to the global economy, it might conceivably benefit him. You sound like my mother telling me I had to eat all my food because there were starving children in China. I've been ignoring this thread, but it's just getting too ridiculous. -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 15:37:27 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:37:32 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> <002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: We burn oil because there is no replacement for it. We have more things than goat herders do because our society has an efficient economic system and efficient scientific and engineering systems. People get what they deserve in the way of government. If the goat herder is happy living in the dark ages then it isn't our business to insist that he does otherwise. Axel, I also have to tell you that the zero sum theory of economics went out with Adam Smith when he overturned the mercantilism theory. Just because you have a cell phone doesn't mean that it was ripped from the hide of the goat herder. If he engaged in valuable economic activity, mining niobium for example, then he too could have a cell phone. BK Not likely, no... But some people have none of the above because we squander > our resources on "needing" the latest cell phone, i-Pod, .... > We "need" a car to go to work, one for the wife, one for the kids, one for > all terrain and one for making the neighbors jealous. The latter has to > have > at least a 3 liter engine. > > We really are funny people: China buys lots of the steel and when the price > of steel goes up we blame the government for not protecting our economic > interest. China buys lots of oil and when prices go up we blame the Arabs. > > Petroleum is made of irreplaceable hydrocarbons. We can make plastics and > other durable things of it. Instead we burn it. Why? Because it's there and > because people get rich of it. Certainly not because it makes sense ;-))) > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From ajs at frii.com Sat Jul 19 15:39:01 2008 From: ajs at frii.com (Alan Silverstein) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:39:04 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bakken Formation => burning petroleum In-Reply-To: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <20080719223901.C7B241CC35@io.frii.com> > Petroleum is made of irreplaceable hydrocarbons. We can make plastics > and other durable things of it. Instead we burn it. Why? Because > it's there... I beg to differ. Long-chain fatty acids (hydrocarbons) are an EXCELLENT mobile fuel source. Nothing much but H and C, both oxidize well with atmospheric O2, high energy density (9 KCal/g), lots of flavors ranging from lard to methane, very stable, relatively safe. Even a hydrogen fuel cell used as a "battery" typically doesn't run on H2, but on some kind of HC where they extract the H. Ethanol, carbohydrates, etc, are poorer because they are already partially "burned" (contain O). I read recently that even today, oil has 50-150 times the energy per mass as the best (lithium) batteries. That's a main reason why purely electric cars are not strong competitors. The way I see it, voltaic cells and oil molecules are both just batteries of different kinds... We can't get more efficient than "nanoscale batteries" in the form of HC molecules. Furthermore, while we are dipping unsustainably into the planet's fossil fuel bank balance, we are not even halfway through the supply. Unfortunately, we ARE done getting all the cheap/easy/clean stuff, and demand continues to rise with population and lifestyle. What's the answer? I say what we need is an efficient way to convert sunlight, H2O, and CO2 into oil. And biology is the way to do it. We just have to tame/design/engineer plants that can do it for us. Unfortunately I don't see a lot of drive in this direction, nor much clear thinking about the subject. (I Am Not An Expert But...) So what can anyone like me do? Well, I'll proselytize like this now and then. Cheers, Alan Silverstein From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sat Jul 19 15:42:14 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:43:43 2008 Subject: [ADMIN][Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP><001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <008f01c8e9f0$b7a49aa0$0600a8c0@Montana> Hey, guys... The discussion on oil reserves has been really interesting, but it's starting to get personal and political. I can point you to some political lists if you want to discuss politics, but no politics on this list. Personal stuff should be off any list. (And no, just because you mention a mineral in whatever metaphor you are using, doesn't qualify it as a post about minerals ;-) Thanks, Julie From efkern at earthlink.net Sat Jul 19 15:44:51 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:44:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy / nuke wastes References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><002a01c8e9ce$f5124850$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <001401c8e9f1$0eeaacf0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Bryan is right about the exaggeration of waste storage problems and the inverse proportionality between half life and radioactivity. France gets something like 75+% of their electric power from nuclear reactors and has no waste storage problem because they recycle the waste into fresh fuel by removing the spent portions that slow the reaction. Here in the US there is a ban on recycling spent fuel from nuclear power plants. I believe it was signed into law by Jimmy Carter. It should be repealed and we'd reduce the storage problem to less than the size of a gymnasium rather than enormous caverns. Fancy that....France is doing it right, and we're not. Cheers, Erich Kern ----- Original Message ----- From: J Bryan Kramer To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 12:37 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy I read some articles on that, but has anyone actually built a Thorium cycle plant? The development costs would be high when there is a proven technology with plenty of fuel available. Pebble bed reactors are supposed to be be much safer but I haven't heard of any of those being built either. As for the wastes from reactors, this is something that again is highly exaggerated. The most radioactive material decays off quickly from the simple physics of the material. Activity is inversely proportional to half life. So the shortest half life material is the 'hottest' and in 10 years or so is mostly gone. If you are talking about isotopes that last for tens of thousands of years then you are talking about low activity material which is not as hazardous. The normal rule of thumb is that 5 half lives is enough to decay most material. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Indeed Margaret! > > I heard about technology being ready to use thorium instead of > uranium/plutonium in nuclear fission reactors. Thorium would be safer and > the fission products would cool much faster. > You cannot use thorium for weapons-grade fission material so there would be > no objections against "rogue-states" using it. > As things are now: can we really demand that India and China limit energy > consumption while we drive around in our monster-wheel SUVs? > > Thorium is abundant enough... > > Cheers > Axel > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Margaret Malm > > Verzonden: zaterdag 19 juli 2008 18:06 > > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > collectors' > > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > Glenn; > > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do > > need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that > > oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's > > going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of > > the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use > > our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much > > less damage to our planet's atmosphere. > > My opinion. > > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so > > perhaps this discussion should end here. > > > > Margaret > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > > Glenn Wimpee > > Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM > > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it > > BLEW my mind. > > The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) > > that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but > > man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated > > since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western > > 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme > > eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > > > > And this: > > > > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry > > Report Online - > > 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky > > Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world > > is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning > > news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other > > proven reserves on earth. > > > > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > > > Ya'll have any comments? > > Glenn > > > > > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 15:50:56 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 15:51:01 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy / nuke wastes In-Reply-To: <001401c8e9f1$0eeaacf0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok> <002a01c8e9ce$f5124850$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001401c8e9f1$0eeaacf0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Message-ID: Yeah, IIRC something like 99% of so called radioactive waste in this country is from hospitals and labs that use isotope tracers. They toss every glove, paper towel, beaker and bench covering in a bag and call it hot waste. It could be safely compressed and buried. I'm sure the logjam that has blocked nuke use in the US is a thing of the past. They are building 2 nuke units just to the west of us and expect them to be on line in 2012. They seem to have sailed thru the regulatory process. BK On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 6:44 PM, Erich Kern wrote: > > Bryan is right about the exaggeration of waste storage problems and the > inverse proportionality between half life and radioactivity. > > France gets something like 75+% of their electric power from nuclear > reactors and has no waste storage problem because they recycle the waste > into fresh fuel by removing the spent portions that slow the reaction. Here > in the US there is a ban on recycling spent fuel from nuclear power plants. > I believe it was signed into law by Jimmy Carter. It should be repealed and > we'd reduce the storage problem to less than the size of a gymnasium rather > than enormous caverns. > > Fancy that....France is doing it right, and we're not. > > Cheers, > Erich Kern > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: J Bryan Kramer > To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors > Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 12:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Was: The Bakken Formation - Now: renewable energy > > > I read some articles on that, but has anyone actually built a Thorium cycle > plant? The development costs would be high when there is a proven > technology > with plenty of fuel available. Pebble bed reactors are supposed to be be > much safer but I haven't heard of any of those being built either. > > As for the wastes from reactors, this is something that again is highly > exaggerated. The most radioactive material decays off quickly from the > simple physics of the material. Activity is inversely proportional to half > life. So the shortest half life material is the 'hottest' and in 10 years > or > so is mostly gone. If you are talking about isotopes that last for tens of > thousands of years then you are talking about low activity material which > is > not as hazardous. The normal rule of thumb is that 5 half lives is enough > to > decay most material. > > BK > > On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Axel Emmermann > > wrote: > > > Indeed Margaret! > > > > I heard about technology being ready to use thorium instead of > > uranium/plutonium in nuclear fission reactors. Thorium would be safer and > > the fission products would cool much faster. > > You cannot use thorium for weapons-grade fission material so there would > be > > no objections against "rogue-states" using it. > > As things are now: can we really demand that India and China limit energy > > consumption while we drive around in our monster-wheel SUVs? > > > > Thorium is abundant enough... > > > > Cheers > > Axel > > > > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > > > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Margaret Malm > > > Verzonden: zaterdag 19 juli 2008 18:06 > > > Aan: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > > > collectors' > > > Onderwerp: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > > > Glenn; > > > Factual or not, the facts still remain that we *really* do > > > need to get into renewable resources in a big way. If that > > > oil is 2 miles down, and under the Rocky Mts. to boot, it's > > > going to cost a great deal more to tap it (to say nothing of > > > the environmental damage), than it would be to simply use > > > our renewable resources. And renewable resources do much much > > > less damage to our planet's atmosphere. > > > My opinion. > > > But this may not be a suitable subject for this website, so > > > perhaps this discussion should end here. > > > > > > Margaret > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > > > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of > > > Glenn Wimpee > > > Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 2:03 PM > > > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > > Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > > > > > > Ever heard of the Bakken Formation? GOOGLE it. I did, and it > > > BLEW my mind. > > > The U.S. Geological Service issued a report in April ('08) > > > that only scientists and oilmen/women knew was coming, but > > > man was it big. It was a revised report (hadn't been updated > > > since '95) on how much oil was in this area of the western > > > 2/3 of North Dakota; western South Dakota; and extreme > > > eastern Montana ... check THIS out! > > > > > > > > > And this: > > > > > > > > > U.S. Oil Discovery- Largest Reserve in the World! Stansberry > > > Report Online - > > > 4/20/2006 Hidden 10,000 feet beneath the surface of the Rocky > > > Mountains lies the largest untapped oil reserve in the world > > > is more than 2 TRILLION barrels. They reported this stunning > > > news: We have more oil inside our borders, than all the other > > > proven reserves on earth. > > > > > > > > > As much as google has on these, I suspect the reports are factual. > > > > > > Can we drill ourselves out of this energy and economic crisis? > > > > > > Ya'll have any comments? > > > Glenn > > > > > > > > > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > > text/html > > > --- > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > > > -- > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > > Subscription Services: > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > -- > -- > > "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the > horizon." > > Ralph Waldo Emerson > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From codeburner at gmail.com Sat Jul 19 15:58:41 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sat Jul 19 16:04:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bakken Formation => burning petroleum In-Reply-To: <20080719223901.C7B241CC35@io.frii.com> References: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <20080719223901.C7B241CC35@io.frii.com> Message-ID: I have heard that there is some interest in genetically engineering trees to directly produce hydrocarbons. Maybe you could tap them like maple trees and get isooctane out of the tap. This is obviously a long term project if anyone is actually working on it. One the other hand I saw mention of modifying trees to tie up carbon, maybe in a pure carbon core of the tree. These could then be buried, assuming of course that atmospheric CO2 is ever shown to be a real problem. Of course if they could produce the carbon in the clear colorless variety that would be all that much more interesting. Diamond logs...heh. BK I say what we need is an efficient way to convert sunlight, H2O, and CO2 > into oil. And biology is the way to do it. We just have to > tame/design/engineer plants that can do it for us. > > Unfortunately I don't see a lot of drive in this direction, nor much > clear thinking about the subject. (I Am Not An Expert But...) So what > can anyone like me do? Well, I'll proselytize like this now and then. > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From efkern at earthlink.net Sat Jul 19 16:15:17 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Sat Jul 19 16:14:58 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Needing / The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <003701c8e9f5$4ee5c700$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Axel, if I understand what you wrote below correctly, are you saying that some are poor because others are rich? I'll break it to you easily off list if you'd like to continue, but that sounds like a zero-sum view of economics you've just written. Honestly, the world doesn't work as a zero-sum system. Human ingenuity and work creates wealth, we doesn't steal it from the less fortunate. By definition, they have nothing of value to steal, aside from the moral imperative not to steal from anyone. We live in California where my wife commutes to work 90 miles round trip every day in her one year old, 1.5 liter Honda car. I think you credit the envy of others far too much as to why people make the choices they do. Our neighbors have a huge Cadillac Escalade, but have three kids and two dogs to go on holiday with to visit the Grannies. Personally, I think "more money than brains" every time I see an Escalade. But, we have the greatest neighbors I could want, and it is their choice after all with money they worked very hard and smart for. They both have doctorates in physical therapy. It seems common among Europeans to dwell on envy and question the choices others make. It is not an attractive trait. Cheers, Erich ----- Original Message ----- From: Axel Emmermann To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 3:12 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read > Not to finger point Axel, but are you advocating and living > the life of a goat herder? I would suck at that... ;-))) > Have you given up electricity? > Water piped to your home? Do you live in a Yurt? Not likely, no... But some people have none of the above because we squander our resources on "needing" the latest cell phone, i-Pod, .... We "need" a car to go to work, one for the wife, one for the kids, one for all terrain and one for making the neighbors jealous. The latter has to have at least a 3 liter engine. We really are funny people: China buys lots of the steel and when the price of steel goes up we blame the government for not protecting our economic interest. China buys lots of oil and when prices go up we blame the Arabs. Petroleum is made of irreplaceable hydrocarbons. We can make plastics and other durable things of it. Instead we burn it. Why? Because it's there and because people get rich of it. Certainly not because it makes sense ;-))) You > obviously haven't given up the internet....heh. And that is the least of my vices. But I took care of my house qua insulation and I had a completely new heating system installed with a condensation boiler. I shut off the TV between programs I want to see and I try to limit car use. We own one car. Cheers Axel -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rpr at heidelberg.edu Sat Jul 19 17:47:35 2008 From: rpr at heidelberg.edu (R. Peter Richards) Date: Sat Jul 19 17:47:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA In-Reply-To: <4881567B.8070101@verizon.net> References: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <4881567B.8070101@verizon.net> Message-ID: Thanks, Don. Don't know exactly what they are, but that seems like a safe thing to try. Unlike Super IronOut, Waller Solution, and HCl, all of which I think will attack prehnite. Cheers, Pete On Jul 18, 2008, at 10:50 PM, DonH wrote: > > Pete, > > If those really are clays, try a warm (but not hot) saline solution > to disperse them. > > Good luck, > Don > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html ___________________________________ R. Peter Richards rpr@heidelberg.edu Morphological crystallographer --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From kahako at hawaiiantel.net Sat Jul 19 18:19:36 2008 From: kahako at hawaiiantel.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sat Jul 19 18:19:51 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADMIN was The Bakken Formation In-Reply-To: <003701c8e9f5$4ee5c700$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <003701c8e9f5$4ee5c700$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> Message-ID: <488292A8.2010406@hawaiiantel.net> Julie has already suggested that this topic has gone far enough, so drop it, please. Aloha, Kitty (Admin Team) From diente at prismnet.com Sat Jul 19 18:25:17 2008 From: diente at prismnet.com (diente@prismnet.com) Date: Sat Jul 19 18:25:26 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Bakken Formation => burning petroleum In-Reply-To: References: <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP>, <20080719223901.C7B241CC35@io.frii.com>, Message-ID: <48824DAD.20824.A22019C@diente.prismnet.com> On 19 Jul 2008 at 18:58, J Bryan Kramer wrote: > I have heard that there is some interest in genetically engineering trees to > directly produce hydrocarbons. There are already engineered bacteria used to clean oilspills by eating the oil, breaking it down into less harmful components. Seems like the bacteria could be engineered to operate in reverse to create oil from the components. Anyway, here is an interesting article from down under saying that carbon plays only a minor role in the recent global warming. http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24036736-7583,00.html Here is a little snippet from that article. The satellites that measure the world's temperature all say that the warming trend ended in 2001, and that the temperature has dropped about 0.6C in the past year (to the temperature of 1980) Land-based temperature readings are corrupted by the "urban heat island" effect: urban areas encroaching on thermometer stations warm the micro-climate around the thermometer, due to vegetation changes, concrete, cars, houses. Anyway, an interesting read. Paul Bordovsky Austin, TX --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From efkern at earthlink.net Sat Jul 19 18:28:19 2008 From: efkern at earthlink.net (Erich Kern) Date: Sat Jul 19 18:28:01 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA References: <200807031728.m63HSITN001620@bubbleator.drizzle.com><4881567B.8070101@verizon.net> Message-ID: <00e401c8ea07$e4f7e0e0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> I've cleaned rust stains off of Prehnite with Iron Out, didn't harm it. Acids will harm it though. Erich Kern Murrieta, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: R. Peter Richards To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Micro zeolite associates from Centreville, VA Thanks, Don. Don't know exactly what they are, but that seems like a safe thing to try. Unlike Super IronOut, Waller Solution, and HCl, all of which I think will attack prehnite. Cheers, Pete On Jul 18, 2008, at 10:50 PM, DonH wrote: > > Pete, > > If those really are clays, try a warm (but not hot) saline solution > to disperse them. > > Good luck, > Don > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html ___________________________________ R. Peter Richards rpr@heidelberg.edu Morphological crystallographer --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From marksigouin at verizon.net Sat Jul 19 22:28:24 2008 From: marksigouin at verizon.net (Mark) Date: Sat Jul 19 22:29:39 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit References: Message-ID: <00f701c8ea29$6eb36b30$6400a8c0@your71um0ya7hl> I was considering going there later this year. Are there still any mineral displays? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Turner" To: Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit >I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was >worth bringing up considering my recent visit. > > Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History > while on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's > always good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter > dismay, the entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is > now gone. This was one of the most well known displays in the US if not > the world as it contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) > minerals often collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class > tourmalines and pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, > and even danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main > reasons I revisited the museum was to see this room again. > > Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate > change" exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as > ridiculing me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax > dollars each year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" > technologies. They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused > the world to go into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit > is really needed, why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a > science museum a few miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put > this display in), not to mention getting rid of one of the most famous > mineral collections to make room for it. It is really pathetic, but this > just seems to be the current trend with museums. If Harvard no longer > cares about their collections, I'll be more than happy to take it off > their hands. > > Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any > radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a Mt. > Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like > someone "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. > > Andrew Turner > Victorville, CA USA > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Pmodreski at aol.com Sat Jul 19 22:40:46 2008 From: Pmodreski at aol.com (Pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Sat Jul 19 22:40:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mother's pressure cooker... Mineralogical use? Message-ID: In a message dated 7/19/2008 10:26:35 AM Mountain Daylight Time, axel.emmermann@pandora.be writes: What I actually wanted to know is this: can a kitchen variety pressure cooker be put to work for any mineralogical purpose? I mean things like inserting activator ions in minerals, recrystallizing stuff like gypsum? etc? It'll reach about 120 - 129 ? C, which corresponds with a pressure of roughly 30-38 psi (2.1 - 2.6 bar). Hi there Axel, As we ramble on about pressure cookers... reading your post, made me wonder about, yes, as you say, could the P & T change have much mineralogical effect? The answer I think is, it could, but of course I can specifically think of any actual minerals that it might help grow, or recrystallize, or whatever..., but "perhaps", and as you say, the ones it would affect most, would be those like gypsum. For a start I wanted to check the figures you quote, because to be honest, I hadn't realized that pressure cookers affect the temperature quite that much. You're right, I don't exactly use them for cooking food on a regular (or even, a decadal) basin, much less to "cook" minerals. So I looked up some info about pressure cookers and confirmed that you are right, it gives the conditions of a "standard" pressure cooker at 15 psi and 257 F, which = 125 C. The website I was looking at says that some European-made pressure cookers only reach 10 psi, not 15, so a correspondly lower temperature, which would be 240 F. (The commercial descriptions of pressure cookers, at least here in the U.S., normally refer to "15 psi", which is the extra increment of pressure added, not the total pressure, which would be this plus the ambient atmospheric pressure, about 14.7 psi. Hence, Axel's figures for pressure, wherein he's quoting the true, total pressure (what they would call psia = absolute), are 30+ psi, instead of 15+.) Now, I'll have to see if I can think of some creative way to make this affect a mineral, in some positive way! Pete **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sun Jul 20 03:52:58 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Jul 20 03:53:47 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read In-Reply-To: References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP><001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <001201c8ea56$c5d46fe0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > Nonsense. Me buying the latest cell phone isn't going to make > a bit of difference to your goatherd. In fact, if it > contributes to the global economy, it might conceivably benefit him. No Al, he won't see a cent of it and if he's unlucky enough to have built his hut on land that has something that's worth anything he's likely to become another casualty of progress. Global economy is us, the West and Japan and half of Korea... We like to think... If the Arabs were to withdraw 0.1 percent of their investments in Europe and the US there would be no more "global economy" and unemployment and famine would be the result. Not that we need them for that... Looking at the disaster of mortgage loans I'd say we're pretty much capable of destroying our own economy by mere greed. Nigeria should be one of the richest countries of the world. It is among the poorest. Myanmar has oil, gold, rubies, sapphires, spices. People live there in slavery. Shell oil company rules Nigeria and Total exploits oil in Myanmar... Coltan (the colmubium-tantalium ore needs to make cell phones, computers and such) is quite expensive. All of the major coltan-producing counties are under the thumb of dictators that are fought by rebels that need guns, which we supply. We, the good guys, take coltan or diamonds as payment for the guns and support the rebels until they win. Then we look for new rebels to support. (We did the same with communism in South America. Think about Sandina) If coltan was bought at the price that the market dictates, a cell-phone would cost 8 times as much as it does now. We cannot afford to let third world countries grow up. The math behind it is unforgiving. There is not enough steel to build a car for all Indians and Chinese. There is not enough coltan for all the world to have a cell phone. It is very cynical that a country that is outgrowing communism like China is capable of bringing a capitalistic world to a grinding halt just by doing what we did. Exactly the same thing: strive for economic expansion without applying morals. Google is currently building server parks in Iceland in order to get rid of some of the costs of cooling. If 1 billion Chinese and 1 billion Indians start logging on to the internet the heat production of that alone may be an "interesting renewable energy source". That will happen... Undeniably. Things are as they are because we, the common man, cannot see what is going on in far off places because we have to "engage" in wanting to see. We have to actively look for answers and constantly wonder "Why and what if". Those who do that have a tendency of enraging those who don't want to know. About 100 years ago, Belgium had a thriving colony, Congo. Rubber, copper, gold, uranium, diamonds... Why is Congo still a poor country? Because tyrants like Mobutu and Kabila sell of these resources to finance a military force to keep rebels at bay that are trading "blood-diamonds" for weapons. Do you feel the extraordinary cunning "win-win" that's in there? Just recently there was a book published in which there were photos of "lazy black workers" of whom a hand was hacked off. A practice that lead back to the entourage of the king Leopold II who looked upon the colony as private property. See the movie Congo: White King, Red Rubber, Black Death (2004) or read the book Red Rubber. The maker of the film was denied access to the archives and the government actively tried to boycott the film. It was broadcasted on both national TV-stations... That IS a positive note ;-))) These things are still happening but on a less personal level... A machine gun is much less cruel and socially acceptable than a machete ;-))) My favorite conspiracy theory: cell-phone manufacturers make deliberately complicated manuals so that you're too busy trying to figure out your latest buy to think about why it's so cheap. Cheers Axel From nospam at orerockon.com Sun Jul 20 06:50:42 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Sun Jul 20 06:51:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip In-Reply-To: <0B8BC451E79B42B0B0DDB45B53B0005F@Notebook> References: <651293B3-24AC-44D1-AD09-E6B9A064FB88@roadrunner.com><487C3C69.5050300@verizon.net> <68AA948F-93C1-46D1-B369-8A7016ECB8F4@roadrunner.com> <0B8BC451E79B42B0B0DDB45B53B0005F@Notebook> Message-ID: <000001c8ea6f$9a083e00$ce18ba00$@com> Yeah, but what about from Superior? LOL! Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of John Siebel Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 3:16 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Idaho metamorphics trip A neighbor drove from the St. Joe down to Clarkia yesterday, and it was snow-free. And it's only July! John From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Sun Jul 20 08:05:59 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Sun Jul 20 08:06:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADMIN was The Bakken Formation In-Reply-To: <488292A8.2010406@hawaiiantel.net> References: <002101c8e9c1$c648d140$0200a8c0@kadok><000a01c8e9c3$7f9513b0$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder><002b01c8e9cf$dcb5c060$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <001a01c8e9ec$8b7651c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP><003701c8e9f5$4ee5c700$6500a8c0@TheBlackAdder> <488292A8.2010406@hawaiiantel.net> Message-ID: <001301c8ea7a$1e8a9f10$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Sorry Kitty, You were at the bottom of 46 messages just saw your and Julie's intervention. It's dropped. Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Kitty & > Bill Heacox > Verzonden: zondag 20 juli 2008 2:20 > Aan: Erich Kern; Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for > rock and gem collectors > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] ADMIN was The Bakken Formation > > > Julie has already suggested that this topic has gone far > enough, so drop it, please. > > Aloha, Kitty (Admin Team) > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From rocknate at gmail.com Sun Jul 20 12:26:00 2008 From: rocknate at gmail.com (Nathan Martin) Date: Sun Jul 20 12:26:02 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit In-Reply-To: <00f701c8ea29$6eb36b30$6400a8c0@your71um0ya7hl> References: <00f701c8ea29$6eb36b30$6400a8c0@your71um0ya7hl> Message-ID: Mark, The Harvard Museum of Natural History still has an impressive display of minerals. Like all other local collectors I wish the New England room was still there but it is still worth a visit in my opinion. Nate Martin Lexington, MA On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 1:28 AM, Mark wrote: > I was considering going there later this year. Are there still any mineral > displays? > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Turner" > To: > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:28 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] Harvard Museum Visit > > >> I believe this was discussed a little awhile back, but I thought it was >> worth bringing up considering my recent visit. >> >> Last week my wife and I visited the Harvard Museum of Natural History >> while on vacation in Boston. I had been there about 5 years ago, but it's >> always good to see the minerals and any new stuff. Anyway, to my utter >> dismay, the entire room devoted to New England geology and mineralogy is now >> gone. This was one of the most well known displays in the US if not the >> world as it contained numerous type locality (and type specimen) minerals >> often collected over 100 years ago. It used to have world-class tourmalines >> and pegmatite minerals from Maine, gem garnets from all over, and even >> danburites from the type locale in Danbury, CT. One of the main reasons I >> revisited the museum was to see this room again. >> >> Anyway, in it's place, we now have a completely interactive "climate >> change" exhibit. This exhibit is completely biased, even going so far as >> ridiculing me when I "voted" against spending hundreds of additional tax >> dollars each year to support foreign governments into trying new "green" >> technologies. They used crazy models to suggest that I basically caused the >> world to go into collapse because of my choices. If such an exhibit is >> really needed, why put it in a "natural history" museum (there is a science >> museum a few miles away, and Al Gore has a big enough house to put this >> display in), not to mention getting rid of one of the most famous mineral >> collections to make room for it. It is really pathetic, but this just seems >> to be the current trend with museums. If Harvard no longer cares about >> their collections, I'll be more than happy to take it off their hands. >> >> Oh, one more thing. Harvard no longer displays any mineral with any >> radioactive elements. So, a world-class museum no longer even shows a Mt. >> Spokane autunite, Maine uraninite, or cuprosklodowskite. Looks like someone >> "freaked" out about seeing these minerals. >> >> Andrew Turner >> Victorville, CA USA >> From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Sun Jul 20 14:22:25 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Sun Jul 20 14:27:00 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here Message-ID: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Hi folks, I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so I thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of rocks and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave me a set of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but fascinating to a child nonetheless. My parents bought me a book which has been a favourite ever since, although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's Guide to Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later went on to get a degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the chemistry of the natural world. I taught science for a couple of years, before ill health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I started making sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a torch and setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems and cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost come full circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and faceting - that would really be the icing on the cake for me. I look forward to chatting with you all. Regards, Helen Hill http://www.hillsgems.co.uk http://www.helensgems.etsy.com helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From kcbaran at arczip.com Sun Jul 20 14:56:31 2008 From: kcbaran at arczip.com (Charles Baran) Date: Sun Jul 20 15:00:21 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <4883B48F.3040502@arczip.com> Well a BIG, hearty welcome! You will find the nicest, most knowledgeable, helpful folks anyplace . Take care and have fun! Chuck Baran Helen Hill wrote: > Hi folks, > > I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so I > thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of rocks > and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave me a set > of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but fascinating to a child > nonetheless. My parents bought me a book which has been a favourite > ever since, although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's Guide to > Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later went on to > get a degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the chemistry of > the natural world. I taught science for a couple of years, before > ill health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I started making > sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a > torch and setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems and > cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost come full > circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and faceting - that > would really be the icing on the cake for me. I look forward to > chatting with you all. > > Regards, > Helen Hill > http://www.hillsgems.co.uk > http://www.helensgems.etsy.com > helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > > > From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Sun Jul 20 16:57:09 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Sun Jul 20 16:59:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: <4883B48F.3040502@arczip.com> References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> <4883B48F.3040502@arczip.com> Message-ID: Hi Chuck, Thank you SO much for your wonderful welcome. I look forward to getting involved in a new group of friendly folk. Helen Hill On 20 Jul 2008, at 22:56, Charles Baran wrote: > Well a BIG, hearty welcome! You will find the nicest, most > knowledgeable, helpful folks anyplace . Take care and have fun! > > Chuck Baran > > Helen Hill wrote: > >> Hi folks, >> >> I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so >> I thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of >> rocks and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave >> me a set of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but >> fascinating to a child nonetheless. My parents bought me a book >> which has been a favourite ever since, although sadly it's gone >> missing - Hamlynn's Guide to Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved >> that book. I later went on to get a degree in chemistry, and >> still had a love of the chemistry of the natural world. I taught >> science for a couple of years, before ill health meant that I had >> to give up. Last year, I started making sterling silver >> jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a torch and >> setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems and >> cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost come >> full circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and faceting >> - that would really be the icing on the cake for me. I look >> forward to chatting with you all. >> >> Regards, >> Helen Hill >> http://www.hillsgems.co.uk >> http://www.helensgems.etsy.com >> helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk >> >> >> > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From kahako at hawaiiantel.net Sun Jul 20 18:06:54 2008 From: kahako at hawaiiantel.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Sun Jul 20 18:07:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <4883E12E.5040603@hawaiiantel.net> Welcome, Helen! You'll find a mix of people here ranging from those who are university professors or in professions that relate to rocks, to those without advanced education who simply appreciate the treasures that come from the earth. Some of us make great expeditions into the wilds to dig up treasures, some make their treasures into jewelry, some buy treasures in rock shops on their travels, and others sell their treasures. On a personal note, I'm a retired teacher who gives volunteer presentations to schools and the local Lyman Museum in Hilo, on the Big Island of Hawaii. My husband, Bill, is a professor of astronomy at University of Hawaii at Hilo. We have a collection of rocks and minerals we like to share as much as possible, with an emphasis on fluorescent ones. At present we are suffering a bit from the effects of vog--volcanic smog-- from Kilauea Volcano. Aloha, Kitty Helen Hill wrote: > > Hi folks, > > I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so I > thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of rocks > and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave me a set > of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but fascinating to a child > nonetheless. My parents bought me a book which has been a favourite > ever since, although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's Guide to > Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later went on to > get a degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the chemistry of > the natural world. I taught science for a couple of years, before ill > health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I started making > sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a > torch and setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems and > cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost come full > circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and faceting - that > would really be the icing on the cake for me. I look forward to > chatting with you all. > > Regards, > Helen Hill > http://www.hillsgems.co.uk > http://www.helensgems.etsy.com > helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > > > From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Jul 20 18:34:03 2008 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Sun Jul 20 18:35:32 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: Welcome to the list Helen. Fun stuff on your website. I love the spider! John From pawpawtiger at hotmail.com Sun Jul 20 18:53:14 2008 From: pawpawtiger at hotmail.com (Glenn Wimpee) Date: Sun Jul 20 18:53:18 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: Hello Helen, Welcome to this really great list! Are you a member of a local Rock and Gem Club yet? Sounds like a great fit for you. I look forward to seeing your posts here! Glenn EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > From: helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here> > Hi folks,> > I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so I > thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of rocks > and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave me a set > of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but fascinating to a child > nonetheless. My parents bought me a book which has been a favourite > ever since, although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's Guide to > Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later went on to > get a degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the chemistry of > the natural world. I taught science for a couple of years, before ill > health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I started making > sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a > torch and setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems and > cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost come full > circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and faceting - that > would really be the icing on the cake for me. I look forward to > chatting with you all.> > Regards,> Helen Hill> http://www.hillsgems.co.uk> http://www.helensgems.etsy.com> helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 20 19:27:30 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 20 19:27:37 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Mother's pressure cooker... Mineralogical use? In-Reply-To: <001301c8e9bc$20f72390$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <9146D1EB-56CC-11DD-B023-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> A pressure relief valve is the most important part of a pressure cooker, or a marriage. You always need a way to safely blow off steam and prevent an explosion. When having a disagreement with one's spouse you should remember that this too shall pass. A pressure cooker can be used for dying agates. Use fluorescent dyes and you might have the latest commercial hit in the retail jewelry industry. With the additional temperature and pressure you should be able to dissolve and recrystalize some interesting minerals, but that probably won't include quartz (but you might be able to make agates from silica gels). You could 'can' sterile rocks for making stone soup. Might be a hit with parents of young children. It would be interesting to test the theory about pyrite disease being caused by microorganisms, and see if you could cure the disease by sterilizing the specimens. You could make gravel out of specimens you want to clean by heating them too fast, or cooling them too quickly. You might be able to simulate a hydro-thermal vent and make some interesting minerals. You could modify an old satellite dish to a solar reflector and use it as a boiler to drive a steam turbine electric power generator to reduce your electric bill. You could turn it into a backyard metal casting furnace or smelter. You could always sell it as scrap metal (it might get more as an antique) and buy Christel a small peace offering. But whatever you do with it, please remember that high pressure steam in a close container is always dangerous; avoid proximity to the pressure relief valve -- live steam is also dangerous (as are steamed wives). Kreigh On Saturday, Jul 19, 2008, at 12:25 America/Detroit, Axel Emmermann wrote: > Good morning esteemed list-dwellers, > > My wife and I were cleaning up (finally) our garage when we stumbled > upon > several arachnoid garage-dwellers and a pressure cooker that once > belonged > to her late mother. > The flattened remains of the aforementioned arachnoid garage-dwellers > are of > no interest whatsoever here so we shall not dwell upon those and > exclude > them from this discussion forthwith. As my lovely wife went forth to > place > the pressure cooker near or upon the pile of garage-garbage* that had > we > had already collected I had an epiphany and, with a formidable leap of > almost Olympic allure, I tackled the poor woman.** > > On the downside: I shall not have to concern myself with planning > elaborate > nocturnal escapades of matrimonial nature for at least a week. > Tackling your > wife on a cement garage floor in not considered as particularly > romantic or > good foreplay. > On the upside: after being beaten senseless with it I now have in my > possession a working pressure cooker. That is to say: it will be > complete as > soon as I pass the weight, you know , the whistling thingy that hisses > and > dances on the lid. (Boy, was she mad...!). > > What I actually wanted to know is this: can a kitchen variety pressure > cooker be put to work for any mineralogical purpose? > I mean things like inserting activator ions in minerals, > recrystallizing > stuff like gypsum? etc? > It'll reach about 120 - 129 ? C, which corresponds with a pressure of > roughly 30-38 psi (2.1 - 2.6 bar). > > * do not attempt to read this if you are even remotely dyslexic > ** Pardon me the archaic language but I hate garage cleaning, it makes > me > long for the time before the invention of the automobile and thus, by > proxy, > the garage. > > Cheers > Axel > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From territoones1 at ameritech.net Sun Jul 20 22:02:42 2008 From: territoones1 at ameritech.net (teresa jetter) Date: Sun Jul 20 22:02:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read-PICC Catalytic Converter Message-ID: <587147.90700.qm@web81702.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Type into the search bar: PICC Pre Ignition Catalytic Converter - coming soon I was reading the information on it and watching the video. It makes sense. The thing is I don't know of anyone who has tried it yet. Gonna wait for awhile to see if it could work on an "OutBack" Teri Jetter ----- Original Message ---- From: GREGORY WEISBROD To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 4:25:41 PM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read Let's just hope we never have to find out how basic life can get. Besides camping out, of course. So much of civilization as we know it depends on our mineral resources. If you had a wagon to haul borax from California to New York but needed to haul feed for the mules, you would have no room for the borax. So I guess that is why they invented filling stations. Now some folks are objecting to digging the borax in the first place, and to the mules on account of their pollution. > Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2008 15:41:19 -0400> From: codeburner@gmail.com> To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] The Bakken Formation - An Interesting Read> > Not to finger point Axel, but are you advocating and living the life of a> goat herder? Have you given up electricity? Water piped to your home? Do you> live in a Yurt? You obviously haven't given up the internet....heh.> > BK> > On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 2:47 PM, Axel Emmermann > wrote:> > > Hi Erich,> >> > > unfortunately there's not enough energy therein to do much> > > for our energy needs.> >> > How much of our needs are real "needs"? ;-)))> > It seems this concept of "needs" largely depends on your status and> > geographic location.> > If you are a goat herder living in quarters that are largely constructed> > from the dropping of your livelihood, you'd need about 1/10.000th of what a> > yuppie needs for an hour of relaxation.> >> > Cheers> > Axel> >> > --> > _______________________________________________> > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> > Subscription Services:> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html> >> > > > -- > --> > "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the> horizon."> > Ralph Waldo Emerson> > J Bryan Kramer> North Florida, USA> photos at:> http://pbase.com/photoburner> > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts ---> multipart/alternative> text/plain (text body -- kept)> text/html> ---> -- > _______________________________________________> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List> Subscription Services:> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Mon Jul 21 05:44:22 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Mon Jul 21 05:44:27 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: <4883E12E.5040603@hawaiiantel.net> References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> <4883E12E.5040603@hawaiiantel.net> Message-ID: <6D82EC31-FCE8-44F1-AB96-832683A55511@tiscali.co.uk> Hi Kitty, Thank you SO much for your warm welcome. I look forward to chatting and learning lots of things rock related. I hope your vog disappears soon - it sounds most unpleasant. Take care, Helen Hill On 21 Jul 2008, at 02:06, Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > > Welcome, Helen! > > You'll find a mix of people here ranging from those who are > university professors or in professions that relate to rocks, to > those without advanced education who simply appreciate the treasures > that come from the earth. Some of us make great expeditions into > the wilds to dig up treasures, some make their treasures into > jewelry, some buy treasures in rock shops on their travels, and > others sell their treasures. > On a personal note, I'm a retired teacher who gives volunteer > presentations to schools and the local Lyman Museum in Hilo, on the > Big Island of Hawaii. My husband, Bill, is a professor of astronomy > at University of Hawaii at Hilo. We have a collection of rocks and > minerals we like to share as much as possible, with an emphasis on > fluorescent ones. At present we are suffering a bit from the > effects of vog--volcanic smog-- from Kilauea Volcano. > > Aloha, Kitty > > Helen Hill wrote: >> >> Hi folks, >> >> I've just found your list today and it sounds like a fun group so I >> thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I developed a love of rocks >> and fossils as a child (in the seventies), when an aunt gave me a >> set of mineral specimens - nothing outstanding but fascinating to a >> child nonetheless. My parents bought me a book which has been a >> favourite ever since, although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's >> Guide to Rocks, Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later >> went on to get a degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the >> chemistry of the natural world. I taught science for a couple of >> years, before ill health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I >> started making sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, >> soldering with a torch and setting with semi-precious and precious >> faceted gems and cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort >> of almost come full circle. I would dearly love to get into >> cabbing and faceting - that would really be the icing on the cake >> for me. I look forward to chatting with you all. >> >> Regards, >> Helen Hill >> http://www.hillsgems.co.uk >> http://www.helensgems.etsy.com >> helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk >> >> >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Mon Jul 21 05:45:03 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Mon Jul 21 05:45:14 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <84612BCE-F557-496C-8CDA-D4FCE317F031@tiscali.co.uk> Hi John, Thanks for your welcome and your compliments on my jewellery. Looking forward to chatting and learning lots! All the best, Helen Hill On 21 Jul 2008, at 02:34, John Siebel wrote: > Welcome to the list Helen. Fun stuff on your website. I love the > spider! > > John > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Mon Jul 21 05:47:52 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Mon Jul 21 05:47:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new here In-Reply-To: References: <34819138-14F4-4BED-83E7-EA64F48F234D@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <7B45F7D9-FB58-4FEC-914A-AED7C5DEF8E8@tiscali.co.uk> Hi Glenn, Thanks for your warm welcome. I've not managed to find a club local enough to me unfortunately. Poor health means I can't travel far, so this group may have to be a substitute. Looking forward to chatting with you all. Take care, Helen Hill On 21 Jul 2008, at 02:53, Glenn Wimpee wrote: > Hello Helen, > > Welcome to this really great list! > > Are you a member of a local Rock and Gem Club yet? > > Sounds like a great fit for you. > > I look forward to seeing your posts here! > Glenn > > > > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOODJoin me > >> From: helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > Subject: [Rockhounds] Hi, I'm new >> here> > Hi folks,> > I've just found your list today and it sounds >> like a fun group so I > thought I'd join. I live in the UK and I >> developed a love of rocks > and fossils as a child (in the >> seventies), when an aunt gave me a set > of mineral specimens - >> nothing outstanding but fascinating to a child > nonetheless. My >> parents bought me a book which has been a favourite > ever since, >> although sadly it's gone missing - Hamlynn's Guide to > Rocks, >> Minerals and Fossils. I loved that book. I later went on to > get a >> degree in chemistry, and still had a love of the chemistry of > the >> natural world. I taught science for a couple of years, before ill > >> health meant that I had to give up. Last year, I started making > >> sterling silver jewellery, by forging and forming, soldering with a >> > torch and setting with semi-precious and precious faceted gems >> and > cabochons. Therefore my love of "rocks" has sort of almost >> come full > circle. I would dearly love to get into cabbing and >> faceting - that > would really be the icing on the cake for me. I >> look forward to > chatting with you all.> > Regards,> Helen Hill> http://www.hillsgems.co.uk >> > http://www.helensgems.etsy.com> helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From zebulon at isr.umich.edu Mon Jul 21 10:27:57 2008 From: zebulon at isr.umich.edu (Peter Sparks) Date: Mon Jul 21 10:28:09 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Home metal casting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6F651C1505A4A048923BCF2D756A7E49057092DA@isr-mail2.ad.isr.umich.edu> I've built my own charcoal kiln, melted aluminum easily and with difficulty melted glass and copper. I have accidently melted steel because of an iron/aluminum = thermite reaction. I have experimented making a Babington oil burner (see and almost have it working, self-sustained. The illustration shows an low-pressurized tube attached to a doorknob with a very small hole that mists the oil that runs in front of it. It can burn very well with a blue flame at front. Mine requires a constant ignition source, something like a glow plug. Anyway, I haven't attempted refining ore but can tell you that poor combustion, impurities in the raw material, moisture, etcera can lead to problems melting and undesirable air pollution, and possibly annoyed neighbors and worse. If you're out in the country then it's not likely as much a problem. I'd be much more cautious within city limits and probably switch to propane/natural gas and clean raw materials. The guys up at Keweenaw Rock & Gem in Houghton,MI take junk copper from the mine dumps and make artistic copper splashes, so there is some small-time smelting going on. I'm pretty sure they run gas. Safety is paramount in doing this, and if you're not sure then please don't. Molten metal is nasty stuff. If you're interested in knowing more about home metal casting contact me offline. -- Peter -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of J Bryan Kramer Sent: Friday, July 18, 2008 5:30 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: [Rockhounds] Home metal casting I thought this cool site might be of interest to people on the list, we had some questions about refining ore not too long ago. I just stumbled across this: BK -- "Stand therefore, and fasten the belt of truth around your waist, and put on the breastplate of righteousness." J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From mineral.maertens at att.net Tue Jul 22 16:53:42 2008 From: mineral.maertens at att.net (Johan) Date: Tue Jul 22 16:53:50 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Nat'l Limestone, pa In-Reply-To: <200807140102.m6E1262M025428@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <072220082353.543.4886730600099EAC0000021F22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF9C020A9B9D0A0E03D2040E9D0A020703@att.net> Best to work with the owner. E-mail doe snot work for him (if he has any). Update: there was a truck accident in the quarry and all collecting access to the quarry was put on hold. There have been many collecting trip to the quarry for calcite, strontianite and wavellite. No collecting until at least fall. -- Johan Maertens From jcessna at nist.gov Wed Jul 23 09:19:48 2008 From: jcessna at nist.gov (Jeffrey T. Cessna) Date: Wed Jul 23 09:23:32 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Nat'l Limestone, pa In-Reply-To: <072220082353.543.4886730600099EAC0000021F22230682229B0A02D 29B9B0EBF9C020A9B9D0A0E03D2040E9D0A020703@att.net> References: <200807140102.m6E1262M025428@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <072220082353.543.4886730600099EAC0000021F22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF9C020A9B9D0A0E03D2040E9D0A020703@att.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20080723121025.023f1900@nist.gov> Johan, Just wondering, was that a collector involved truck accident? I've only been there once, but I found the owner incredibly collector friendly. He went so far as to keep his local collectors out after a blast because our group was driving in from the DC area. There was more strontianite, up to 1 inch, than our group needed and a few nice DT calcites. Cheers, Jeff At 07:53 PM 7/22/2008, you wrote: >Best to work with the owner. >E-mail doe snot work for him (if he has any). > >Update: there was a truck accident in the quarry and all collecting >access to the quarry was put on hold. >There have been many collecting trip to the quarry for calcite, >strontianite and wavellite. > >No collecting until at least fall. > >-- > >Johan Maertens > >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From earlrock at nctv.com Wed Jul 23 15:51:33 2008 From: earlrock at nctv.com (Earl) Date: Wed Jul 23 15:54:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Hendersonville Micromounters Symposium Message-ID: <85F5E4295E64402AA3082AA113326F3E@earlbasement> Announcing The 20th Annual HCGMS Micromounters Symposium in Hendersonville, NC. Date: August 30, 2008 Hours: 8:30 A.M. - 4:30 P.M. Link for additional information and map is below: http://www.hcgms.org/hcgmsannual.htm Bring your 'scope, swapping goodies, and any freebies that you want to dispose of, and enjoy a day of conversation and looking with fellow micromineral collectors. Coffee, some soft drinks and light snacks will be provided, but there is ample food available on Main St. Or feel free to brown bag lunch. Bring the spouse and offspring too, as the Annual Gem & Mineral Spectacular will be going on, and the Apple Festival will be happening on Main St. The Mineral & Lapidary Museum will also be open, and it is well worth your time to visit there. Regards, Earl English No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.5/1569 - Release Date: 7/23/2008 1:31 PM --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From deepskyspy at insightbb.com Wed Jul 23 17:11:21 2008 From: deepskyspy at insightbb.com (Alan Goldstein) Date: Wed Jul 23 17:11:54 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] mindat question Message-ID: If there is a mindat moderator on this list, please contact me directly. I have a question. Thanks! Alan G. --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From JWachsmuth at gmx.de Thu Jul 24 09:22:24 2008 From: JWachsmuth at gmx.de (Juergen Wachsmuth) Date: Thu Jul 24 09:18:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] New Book Minerals of Britain and Ireland References: <200807140102.m6E1262M025428@bubbleator.drizzle.com> <072220082353.543.4886730600099EAC0000021F22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF9C020A9B9D0A0E03D2040E9D0A020703@att.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20080723121025.023f1900@nist.gov> Message-ID: <4888AC40.FC62305D@gmx.de> Hello, today I received my copy of Minerals of Britain and Ireland by A.G. Tindle. It is fantastic, my advice is not to miss this one if you like mineral books. Lots of up-to-date information, and great fotos. It definitely is worth its price of 95 GBP, and even better there was a reduced price at amazon.uk. Regards, J?rgen (I do not know the author personally, and I have no interest in the publishing company) From silverado at frontiernet.net Fri Jul 25 15:03:44 2008 From: silverado at frontiernet.net (Gail) Date: Fri Jul 25 15:03:48 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale References: <370229.98183.qm@web34307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <000501c8e9ad$0b676a80$22363f80$@com> Message-ID: <000a01c8eea2$4f1b7010$c2bd214a@gail7diqufk9xy> This is the DVD I would like to purchase for 29.95 + .05. I will get a postal money order or bank cashiers check in the mail ASAP if this is acceptable. Thanks, C.A.Kling ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim" To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" Cc: "Paleolist" Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 10:37 AM Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale > Hey kids guess what? It's the semi-annual "TIM NEEDS CASH NOW!" sale! > That's > right, act now, and for a limited time only, you can receive a brand > spanking new copy of OreRockOn on DVD for the special low, low price of > $29.95 + $0.05! That's $29.95 + $0.05! let me repeat myself, that's only > $29.95 + $0.05! Why the 5 cents? Because PayPal won't let me charge > $29.95! > And I don't know why! > > That's $15.00 off the regular price! A 33% savings! You save enough to get > an extra 3 gallons of diesel! Whoo hoo! As usual, click on the CD link > below > to find out everything there is to know about the DVD! And remember kids, > Crazy Eddie's prices are Insaaaaane! (If you are old like me you will > remember these commercials LOL) > > OreRockOn on DVD V 4.2 has 638 (15 new since V 4.0) detailed 1:24,000 > scale > shaded relief 1:24,000 USGS topographic maps of Pacific Northwest (OR, WA, > ID, and a wee bit o' Cali) rock, fossil, and mineral collecting areas, > 2,118 > waypoints (98 new), 36 site writeups (1 new; many expanded, all new fossil > preparation page), and 217 1:100,000 scale USGS or WA DNR Land Ownership > maps for each collecting area (5 new). All maps now have mileposts on all > major highways. There is a new waypoint file for your GPS, and I even > threw > in a Google Earth file so you can view satellite photos of each dig site > or > fly from dig to dig in 3D until you are dizzy (LOL!) > > Copy and paste the special List Sale Link below to receive your discount > via > PayPal (all other payment methods please contact me off-list). > > Click the link or copy and paste it into your browser to order the > OreRockOn > Dig Locations DVD 4.2 for $29.95 + $0.05: > > DVD With FREE Media Mail Shipping: > > http://tinyurl.com/6lp3z9 > > DVD With USPS Priority Mail Shipping: > > http://tinyurl.com/5zvcuz > > Tim Fisher > Ore-ROCK-On! > Email address at http://OreRockOn.com > Find out more at: http://OreRockOn.com/CD > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From mineral.maertens at att.net Fri Jul 25 18:27:41 2008 From: mineral.maertens at att.net (Johan) Date: Fri Jul 25 18:30:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 26 In-Reply-To: <200807240102.m6O11uBr000461@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <072620080127.1305.488A7D8D0003349A0000051922230706129B0A02D29B9B0EBF9C020A9B9D0A0E03D2040E9D0A020703@att.net> Jeff, Fortunately the accident was unrelated to mineral collecting. It was a freak work accident. MSHA was all over it. The quarry is now of limits for collectors. Indeed, the owner is very friendly. We talked to him about resuming collecting and he was embarassed to decline our request. Strontianites, calcites and wavelites are indeed beautiful. Limited mineral list but plenty of minerals when the blast is right. -- Johan Maertens From syonix at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 08:52:48 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sat Jul 26 08:55:16 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale Message-ID: <072620081552.9141.488B4850000A4FF6000023B5220076370498070201979C@comcast.net> For those of you who havent had a chance to look at Tim's work (OreRockOn Dvd). I must say it is the best resource i've seen out of all the books and material from the area in 10 years of looking. Thank you Tim, your work is definatly my pleasure.. Worth the money x1000 times over. Thanks to Tim's dvd and some off the beaten path searching i just nabbed my first 90 pound banded agate. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/photo/1007062/One+large+Agate I highly recommend this DVD for anyone ... -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Gail" > This is the DVD I would like to purchase for 29.95 + .05. I will get a > postal money order or bank cashiers check in the mail ASAP if this is > acceptable. > Thanks, C.A.Kling > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tim" > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" > > Cc: "Paleolist" > Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 10:37 AM > Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale > > > > Hey kids guess what? It's the semi-annual "TIM NEEDS CASH NOW!" sale! > > That's > > right, act now, and for a limited time only, you can receive a brand > > spanking new copy of OreRockOn on DVD for the special low, low price of > > $29.95 + $0.05! That's $29.95 + $0.05! let me repeat myself, that's only > > $29.95 + $0.05! Why the 5 cents? Because PayPal won't let me charge > > $29.95! > > And I don't know why! > > > > That's $15.00 off the regular price! A 33% savings! You save enough to get > > an extra 3 gallons of diesel! Whoo hoo! As usual, click on the CD link > > below > > to find out everything there is to know about the DVD! And remember kids, > > Crazy Eddie's prices are Insaaaaane! (If you are old like me you will > > remember these commercials LOL) > > > > OreRockOn on DVD V 4.2 has 638 (15 new since V 4.0) detailed 1:24,000 > > scale > > shaded relief 1:24,000 USGS topographic maps of Pacific Northwest (OR, WA, > > ID, and a wee bit o' Cali) rock, fossil, and mineral collecting areas, > > 2,118 > > waypoints (98 new), 36 site writeups (1 new; many expanded, all new fossil > > preparation page), and 217 1:100,000 scale USGS or WA DNR Land Ownership > > maps for each collecting area (5 new). All maps now have mileposts on all > > major highways. There is a new waypoint file for your GPS, and I even > > threw > > in a Google Earth file so you can view satellite photos of each dig site > > or > > fly from dig to dig in 3D until you are dizzy (LOL!) > > > > Copy and paste the special List Sale Link below to receive your discount > > via > > PayPal (all other payment methods please contact me off-list). > > > > Click the link or copy and paste it into your browser to order the > > OreRockOn > > Dig Locations DVD 4.2 for $29.95 + $0.05: > > > > DVD With FREE Media Mail Shipping: > > > > http://tinyurl.com/6lp3z9 > > > > DVD With USPS Priority Mail Shipping: > > > > http://tinyurl.com/5zvcuz > > > > Tim Fisher > > Ore-ROCK-On! > > Email address at http://OreRockOn.com > > Find out more at: http://OreRockOn.com/CD > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sat Jul 26 08:52:48 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sat Jul 26 08:55:20 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale Message-ID: <072620081552.9141.488B4850000A4FF6000023B5220076370498070201979C@comcast.net> For those of you who havent had a chance to look at Tim's work (OreRockOn Dvd). I must say it is the best resource i've seen out of all the books and material from the area in 10 years of looking. Thank you Tim, your work is definatly my pleasure.. Worth the money x1000 times over. Thanks to Tim's dvd and some off the beaten path searching i just nabbed my first 90 pound banded agate. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/photo/1007062/One+large+Agate I highly recommend this DVD for anyone ... -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Gail" > This is the DVD I would like to purchase for 29.95 + .05. I will get a > postal money order or bank cashiers check in the mail ASAP if this is > acceptable. > Thanks, C.A.Kling > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tim" > To: "'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors'" > > Cc: "Paleolist" > Sent: Saturday, July 19, 2008 10:37 AM > Subject: [Rockhounds] ADVERTISEMENT: OreRockOn on DVD List Sale > > > > Hey kids guess what? It's the semi-annual "TIM NEEDS CASH NOW!" sale! > > That's > > right, act now, and for a limited time only, you can receive a brand > > spanking new copy of OreRockOn on DVD for the special low, low price of > > $29.95 + $0.05! That's $29.95 + $0.05! let me repeat myself, that's only > > $29.95 + $0.05! Why the 5 cents? Because PayPal won't let me charge > > $29.95! > > And I don't know why! > > > > That's $15.00 off the regular price! A 33% savings! You save enough to get > > an extra 3 gallons of diesel! Whoo hoo! As usual, click on the CD link > > below > > to find out everything there is to know about the DVD! And remember kids, > > Crazy Eddie's prices are Insaaaaane! (If you are old like me you will > > remember these commercials LOL) > > > > OreRockOn on DVD V 4.2 has 638 (15 new since V 4.0) detailed 1:24,000 > > scale > > shaded relief 1:24,000 USGS topographic maps of Pacific Northwest (OR, WA, > > ID, and a wee bit o' Cali) rock, fossil, and mineral collecting areas, > > 2,118 > > waypoints (98 new), 36 site writeups (1 new; many expanded, all new fossil > > preparation page), and 217 1:100,000 scale USGS or WA DNR Land Ownership > > maps for each collecting area (5 new). All maps now have mileposts on all > > major highways. There is a new waypoint file for your GPS, and I even > > threw > > in a Google Earth file so you can view satellite photos of each dig site > > or > > fly from dig to dig in 3D until you are dizzy (LOL!) > > > > Copy and paste the special List Sale Link below to receive your discount > > via > > PayPal (all other payment methods please contact me off-list). > > > > Click the link or copy and paste it into your browser to order the > > OreRockOn > > Dig Locations DVD 4.2 for $29.95 + $0.05: > > > > DVD With FREE Media Mail Shipping: > > > > http://tinyurl.com/6lp3z9 > > > > DVD With USPS Priority Mail Shipping: > > > > http://tinyurl.com/5zvcuz > > > > Tim Fisher > > Ore-ROCK-On! > > Email address at http://OreRockOn.com > > Find out more at: http://OreRockOn.com/CD > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Sat Jul 26 13:37:46 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Sat Jul 26 13:40:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Unknown fossil bone Message-ID: <000a01c8ef5f$769e8150$0200000a@LarryRush> I have uncovered another bone fossil in the "Rock Shop" lot I acquired. No label, apparently in limestone, no age, no locality...... Any guesses out there? Mammal, Amphibian, Reptile?? It looks like a leg bone to me. Anybody want this? http://www.connroxminerals.com/bone.html Larry Rush "Noel Coward thought work was more fun than play, but he never, ever worked in the mines" --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 09:29:44 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:30:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate Thanks in advance for your suggestions... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 09:29:44 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:30:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate Thanks in advance for your suggestions... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From tjokela at execulink.com Sun Jul 27 09:38:39 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:39:02 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find References: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> You must tumble it. T ----- Original Message ----- > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch > for a stone of such size. From miolson47 at hotmail.com Sun Jul 27 09:44:03 2008 From: miolson47 at hotmail.com (marilyn olson) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:44:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> References: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to see??? cheers Marilyn _________________________________________________________________ --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 09:46:29 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:46:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> You can find directions to lucas creek @ http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/Washington and pictures of the find @ http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate?t=anon -------------- Original message -------------- From: marilyn olson > > hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to see??? > cheers Marilyn > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 09:46:29 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 09:46:37 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> You can find directions to lucas creek @ http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/Washington and pictures of the find @ http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate?t=anon -------------- Original message -------------- From: marilyn olson > > hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to see??? > cheers Marilyn > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From donhalterman at verizon.net Sun Jul 27 10:08:22 2008 From: donhalterman at verizon.net (DonH) Date: Sun Jul 27 10:04:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> References: <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <488CAB86.2010302@verizon.net> Syonix, Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 10:42:00 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 10:42:04 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> thanks but i didnt. I dont even get my own posts ... you guys here are a real piece of work. -------------- Original message -------------- From: DonH > > Syonix, > > Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From albalmer at copper.net Sun Jul 27 11:53:07 2008 From: albalmer at copper.net (Al Balmer) Date: Sun Jul 27 11:53:09 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> References: <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <1lgp84t4u3k8r9jovsr07mdkjs51fjsvk6@4ax.com> On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:42:00 +0000, syonix@comcast.net wrote: >thanks but i didnt. Yes, you did. Your previous messages had the address twice: To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" , "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" You appear to have corrected the problem now. > I dont even get my own posts ... That's a different problem, probably associated with your mail client, which is one I'm not familiar with. >you guys here are a real piece of work. My, my. A little sensitive, eh? Don said "please", and "thanks." If you see any anomalies in my postings, I won't complain if you tell me. > >-------------- Original message -------------- >From: DonH > >> >> Syonix, >> >> Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. -- Al Balmer Sun City, AZ From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Jul 27 12:11:42 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Sun Jul 27 12:12:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your own posts. Message-ID: <004101c8f01c$a1d1a240$0600a8c0@Montana> This comes up from time to time...if you use the link at the bottom of every rockhounds email (http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds), scroll down to the bottom and enter your email address, you'll be taken to a page where you can set your account options. One of those options is "Not Me Too" or something like that. If this is checked, you won't get copies of your own posts. Uncheck it and save, and you should be good to go. Julie --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From VevaBailey at aol.com Sun Jul 27 12:58:51 2008 From: VevaBailey at aol.com (VevaBailey@aol.com) Date: Sun Jul 27 12:58:59 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: I know what I would do with your agate, I would slice it and create cabs and jewelry. If you don't have a large rock saw, then contact a local rock club and see if they would cut it. Veva ______________________________________________________________________________ _____ In a message dated 7/27/2008 9:31:29 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, syonix@comcast.net writes: http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+A gate I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approach for a stone of such size. I've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up but I'm not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate Thanks in advance for your suggestions... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Sun Jul 27 13:26:31 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 13:26:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your own posts. Message-ID: <072720082026.15900.488CD9F70002301800003E1C220700164198070201979C@comcast.net> thank you!! -------------- Original message -------------- From: "Julie Siebel" > This comes up from time to time...if you use the link at the bottom of every > rockhounds email (http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds), scroll > down to the bottom and enter your email address, you'll be taken to a page where > you can set your account options. > > One of those options is "Not Me Too" or something like that. If this is checked, > you won't get copies of your own posts. Uncheck it and save, and you should be > good to go. > > Julie > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Jul 27 13:52:32 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Sun Jul 27 13:54:34 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? Message-ID: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had THEM try it and they can - lol. http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the same problem :) Please let me know off list. Thx, Julie --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From flint...smith at sbcglobal.net Sun Jul 27 14:25:57 2008 From: flint...smith at sbcglobal.net (Flint Smith) Date: Sun Jul 27 14:28:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <369949.38649.qm@web82501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> That's an impressive one. But, not to be mean, it's not that pretty, at least on my monitor. You have to decide if polishing it will really make it enough better to bother. If you decide to work it, consider sending it to someone to have them cut a sphere out of it syonix@comcast.net wrote: http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate Thanks in advance for your suggestions... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Sun Jul 27 14:43:07 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Sun Jul 27 14:43:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> References: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: How would you tumble that?! In a cement mixer? What a fantastic agate. Helen UK On 27 Jul 2008, at 17:38, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > You must tumble it. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >> approch for a stone of such size. > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Sun Jul 27 15:21:53 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Sun Jul 27 15:23:53 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? References: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> Message-ID: <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't reach the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). Could a few more of you try? Julie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had THEM try it and they can - lol. http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the same problem :) Please let me know off list. Thx, Julie --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk Sun Jul 27 15:28:01 2008 From: helenrhill at tiscali.co.uk (Helen Hill) Date: Sun Jul 27 15:30:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? In-Reply-To: <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> References: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> Message-ID: <951B0DD3-4A16-4C35-924F-89A746873397@tiscali.co.uk> I clicked on the link and it took me to the site okay. Helen UK On 27 Jul 2008, at 23:21, Julie Siebel wrote: > Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who > can't reach the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > > Could a few more of you try? > > Julie > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the > rockhounds subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with > some people and I had THEM try it and they can - lol. > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see > if I can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need > someone(s) else with the same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > Thx, > > Julie > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html Helen Hill helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk From codeburner at gmail.com Sun Jul 27 15:40:38 2008 From: codeburner at gmail.com (J Bryan Kramer) Date: Sun Jul 27 15:40:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? In-Reply-To: <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> References: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> Message-ID: Works fine from Florida On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel wrote: > Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't reach > the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > > Could a few more of you try? > > Julie > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" < > julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > > > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds > subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had > THEM try it and they can - lol. > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can > track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the > same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > Thx, > > Julie > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 27 16:14:47 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 27 16:18:19 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: That is a pretty neat agate, but it looks like you are missing the other half of it. Take you time before cutting it. If you cut it now, and later think of a better way to use it, it is hard to uncut. But you might consider taking off just one end slab to make a flat face and polish it. You could then polish the end slab, or cut it up into smaller stones. A big sphere might be interesting. But I would want to enjoy it as is for quite a while. Thanks for sharing a neat find. Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:29 America/Detroit, syonix@comcast.net wrote: > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/ > The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate > > I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. > > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best > approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and > cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've > never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any > suggestions .. > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/ > The+83.8lb+Agate > > Thanks in advance for your suggestions... > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 27 16:17:11 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 27 16:18:23 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: <243574F4-5C32-11DD-B462-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a decent load? On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > You must tumble it. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >> approch for a stone of such size. > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From tjokela at execulink.com Sun Jul 27 17:41:43 2008 From: tjokela at execulink.com (Tim Jokela Jr.) Date: Sun Jul 27 17:41:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find References: <243574F4-5C32-11DD-B462-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <000501c8f04a$b579be80$6600a8c0@Junior> I'd contact Sotheby's first. Quit job second. Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, and pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. T ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a decent > load? > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > >> You must tumble it. >> >> T >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>> approch for a stone of such size. >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From rockhounds at adelphia.net Sun Jul 27 17:45:00 2008 From: rockhounds at adelphia.net (rockhounds@adelphia.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 17:47:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem Message-ID: <4294005.1217205900652.JavaMail.root@web35> MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it welded/repaired and now finally got it back together. When I cut a rock now the saw has a gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the cut yet is still in contact with the blade at the point the cut started. At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw and saw powered by one motor. The blade looks to be true. Any ideas on the problem? I attached 2 photos --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) image/pjpeg image/pjpeg --- From rockhounds at adelphia.net Sun Jul 27 17:46:47 2008 From: rockhounds at adelphia.net (rockhounds@adelphia.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 17:49:24 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: 18 inch saw Message-ID: <32688378.1217206007229.JavaMail.root@web35> Forgot to sign off kelly Hanson From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 27 18:51:44 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 27 18:56:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <000501c8f04a$b579be80$6600a8c0@Junior> Message-ID: A quick google search turned up 2 inch agate spheres for $40, 4 inch for $300, and 6 inch for $1200 (and I didn't find anything bigger). The trend looks good. That find might make a 12 inch sphere. Sotheby's may be a good idea, but if it were mine I'de want to enjoy it for a while first (and look for the other half). Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:41 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > I'd contact Sotheby's first. > > Quit job second. > > Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. > > Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. > > And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, > and pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. > > But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > > >> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a >> decent load? >> >> >> >> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. >> wrote: >> >>> You must tumble it. >>> >>> T >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>>> approch for a stone of such size. >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Sun Jul 27 19:29:32 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Sun Jul 27 19:32:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem In-Reply-To: <4294005.1217205900652.JavaMail.root@web35> Message-ID: <030F2DE5-5C4D-11DD-B462-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> The pictures got stripped off, but from your description it sounds like the feed is not quite aligned with the blade. As the cut progresses the blade is slightly dished from the misalignment and cuts a wider kerf as a result. Put something in the vise that just contacts the blade as the cut starts, and advance the feed to see where it is as the cut progresses. You might do better to put something into the vise that just contacts the blade at the end of the feed, and back it up to the start to see how far off the alignment is. A wide kerf can also be caused by having the feed not wuite at right angles to the blade, so that the blade appears to wobble. Put something into the vise that just touches the blade, and hand turn the blade to make sure the contact is the same as the blade turns a full circle. Try it at several spots along the feed. Minor misalignments have negative effect on big blades. If you use a pencil as the something in the vise it leaves a nice mark on the blade to show misalignment. Kreigh On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:45 America/Detroit, wrote: > MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it > welded/repaired and now finally got it back together. When I cut a > rock now the saw has a gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the > cut yet is still in contact with the blade at the point the cut > started. > At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. > The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw > and saw powered by one motor. > The blade looks to be true. > Any ideas on the problem? > I attached 2 photos > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/mixed > text/plain (text body -- kept) > image/pjpeg > image/pjpeg > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From info at agatesfromargentina.com Sun Jul 27 19:40:08 2008 From: info at agatesfromargentina.com (Agates From Argentina) Date: Sun Jul 27 19:40:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find References: <200807280101.m6S11jnh023983@bubbleator.drizzle.com> Message-ID: <000601c8f05b$411fc370$6501a8c0@RicardoBirnie> I think you should cut it and polish it! But that?s just me. Wonderful specimen! Ricardo & Claudia Birnie ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:01 PM Subject: Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 30 > Send Rockhounds mailing list submissions to > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > rockhounds-request@lists.drizzle.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > rockhounds-owner@lists.drizzle.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Rockhounds digest..." > > > [Rockhounds-Digest] > > Today's Topics: > > 1. 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (syonix@comcast.net) > 2. 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (syonix@comcast.net) > 3. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Tim Jokela Jr.) > 4. RE: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (marilyn olson) > 5. RE: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (syonix@comcast.net) > 6. RE: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (syonix@comcast.net) > 7. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (DonH) > 8. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (syonix@comcast.net) > 9. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Al Balmer) > 10. [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your own posts. > (Julie Siebel) > 11. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (VevaBailey@aol.com) > 12. Re: [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your own posts. > (syonix@comcast.net) > 13. [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? (Julie Siebel) > 14. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Flint Smith) > 15. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Helen Hill) > 16. Re: [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? (Julie Siebel) > 17. Re: [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? (Helen Hill) > 18. Re: [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? (J Bryan Kramer) > 19. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Kreigh Tomaszewski) > 20. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Kreigh Tomaszewski) > 21. Re: 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find (Tim Jokela Jr.) > 22. 18 inch saw has a problem (rockhounds@adelphia.net) > 23. Re: 18 inch saw (rockhounds@adelphia.net) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 16:29:44 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" , , > "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Message-ID: > <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate > > I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. > > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch > for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up > but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or > heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate > > Thanks in advance for your suggestions... > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 16:29:44 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" , , > "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Message-ID: > <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate > > I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. > > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch > for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up > but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or > heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate > > Thanks in advance for your suggestions... > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 12:38:39 -0400 > From: "Tim Jokela Jr." > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <002c01c8f007$3926a390$6600a8c0@Junior> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > You must tumble it. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch >> for a stone of such size. > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:44:03 -0700 > From: marilyn olson > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to > see??? cheers Marilyn > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 16:46:29 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" , "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Message-ID: > <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > You can find directions to lucas creek @ > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/Washington > > and pictures of the find @ > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate?t=anon > > -------------- Original message -------------- > From: marilyn olson > >> >> hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to >> see??? >> cheers Marilyn >> _________________________________________________________________ >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 16:46:29 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" , "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: > A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Message-ID: > <072720081646.6973.488CA665000C738400001B3D220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > You can find directions to lucas creek @ > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/Washington > > and pictures of the find @ > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate?t=anon > > -------------- Original message -------------- > From: marilyn olson > >> >> hi where is Lucas Creek,wa.??? can you send a photo for everyone to >> see??? >> cheers Marilyn >> _________________________________________________________________ >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 10:08:22 -0700 > From: DonH > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <488CAB86.2010302@verizon.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > > Syonix, > > Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:42:00 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > thanks but i didnt. I dont even get my own posts ... > you guys here are a real piece of work. > > -------------- Original message -------------- > From: DonH > >> >> Syonix, >> >> Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. >> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 11:53:07 -0700 > From: Al Balmer > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <1lgp84t4u3k8r9jovsr07mdkjs51fjsvk6@4ax.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > On Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:42:00 +0000, syonix@comcast.net wrote: > >>thanks but i didnt. > > Yes, you did. Your previous messages had the address twice: > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > , > "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > > > > You appear to have corrected the problem now. > >> I dont even get my own posts ... > > That's a different problem, probably associated with your mail client, > which is one I'm not familiar with. > >>you guys here are a real piece of work. > > My, my. A little sensitive, eh? Don said "please", and "thanks." If > you see any anomalies in my postings, I won't complain if you tell me. >> >>-------------- Original message -------------- >>From: DonH >> >>> >>> Syonix, >>> >>> Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. > > -- > Al Balmer > Sun City, AZ > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 12:11:42 -0700 > From: "Julie Siebel" > Subject: [Rockhounds] [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your own > posts. > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <004101c8f01c$a1d1a240$0600a8c0@Montana> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > This comes up from time to time...if you use the link at the bottom of > every rockhounds email > (http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds), scroll down to the > bottom and enter your email address, you'll be taken to a page where you > can set your account options. > > One of those options is "Not Me Too" or something like that. If this is > checked, you won't get copies of your own posts. Uncheck it and save, and > you should be good to go. > > Julie > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:58:51 EDT > From: VevaBailey@aol.com > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > I know what I would do with your agate, I would slice it and create cabs > and > jewelry. > If you don't have a large rock saw, then contact a local rock club and see > if they would cut it. > Veva > > ______________________________________________________________________________ > _____ > In a message dated 7/27/2008 9:31:29 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > syonix@comcast.net writes: > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+A > gate > > I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. > > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best > approach > for a stone of such size. I've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it > up > but I'm not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or > heard > of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate > > Thanks in advance for your suggestions... > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 20:26:31 +0000 > From: syonix@comcast.net > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [Admin]What to do if you're not getting your > own posts. > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > <072720082026.15900.488CD9F70002301800003E1C220700164198070201979C@comcast.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain > > > thank you!! > -------------- Original message -------------- > From: "Julie Siebel" > >> This comes up from time to time...if you use the link at the bottom of >> every >> rockhounds email (http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds), >> scroll >> down to the bottom and enter your email address, you'll be taken to a >> page where >> you can set your account options. >> >> One of those options is "Not Me Too" or something like that. If this is >> checked, >> you won't get copies of your own posts. Uncheck it and save, and you >> should be >> good to go. >> >> Julie >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:52:32 -0700 > From: "Julie Siebel" > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds > subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I > had THEM try it and they can - lol. > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I > can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with > the same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > Thx, > > Julie > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 14:25:57 -0700 (PDT) > From: Flint Smith > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <369949.38649.qm@web82501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > > That's an impressive one. > > But, not to be mean, it's not that pretty, at least on my monitor. > > You have to decide if polishing it will really make it enough better to > bother. > > If you decide to work it, consider sending it to someone to have them cut > a sphere out of it > > syonix@comcast.net wrote: > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate > > I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. > > I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch > for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up > but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or > heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. > > http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agate > > Thanks in advance for your suggestions... > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:43:07 +0100 > From: Helen Hill > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes > > How would you tumble that?! In a cement mixer? What a fantastic agate. > > Helen > UK > > > On 27 Jul 2008, at 17:38, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > >> You must tumble it. >> >> T >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>> approch for a stone of such size. >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > Helen Hill > helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 15:21:53 -0700 > From: "Julie Siebel" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <016701c8f037$307bb3e0$0600a8c0@Montana> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > > Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't > reach > the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > > Could a few more of you try? > > Julie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Julie Siebel" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds > subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I > had > THEM try it and they can - lol. > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I > can > track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the > same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > Thx, > > Julie > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 17 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 23:28:01 +0100 > From: Helen Hill > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <951B0DD3-4A16-4C35-924F-89A746873397@tiscali.co.uk> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes > > I clicked on the link and it took me to the site okay. > > Helen > UK > > > On 27 Jul 2008, at 23:21, Julie Siebel wrote: > >> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who >> can't reach the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). >> >> Could a few more of you try? >> >> Julie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" >> > > >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors" >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM >> Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? >> >> >> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the >> rockhounds subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with >> some people and I had THEM try it and they can - lol. >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see >> if I can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need >> someone(s) else with the same problem :) Please let me know off list. >> >> Thx, >> >> Julie >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > Helen Hill > helenrhill@tiscali.co.uk > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 18 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:40:38 -0400 > From: "J Bryan Kramer" > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Works fine from Florida > > > > On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel > > wrote: > >> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't >> reach >> the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). >> >> Could a few more of you try? >> >> Julie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" < >> julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >> < >> rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM >> Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? >> >> >> >> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds >> subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I >> had >> THEM try it and they can - lol. >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I >> can >> track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with >> the >> same problem :) Please let me know off list. >> >> Thx, >> >> Julie >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > > -- > -- > > "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the > horizon." > > Ralph Waldo Emerson > > J Bryan Kramer > North Florida, USA > photos at: > http://pbase.com/photoburner > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 19 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 19:14:47 -0400 > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; delsp=yes; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > That is a pretty neat agate, but it looks like you are missing the > other half of it. > > Take you time before cutting it. If you cut it now, and later think of > a better way to use it, it is hard to uncut. > > But you might consider taking off just one end slab to make a flat face > and polish it. You could then polish the end slab, or cut it up into > smaller stones. > > A big sphere might be interesting. > > But I would want to enjoy it as is for quite a while. Thanks for > sharing a neat find. > > Kreigh > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:29 America/Detroit, syonix@comcast.net > wrote: > >> http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/ >> The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek+Agate >> >> I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. >> >> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >> approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and >> cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've >> never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any >> suggestions .. >> >> http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/ >> The+83.8lb+Agate >> >> Thanks in advance for your suggestions... >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 20 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 19:17:11 -0400 > From: Kreigh Tomaszewski > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <243574F4-5C32-11DD-B462-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a decent > load? > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > >> You must tumble it. >> >> T >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>> approch for a stone of such size. >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 21 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 20:41:43 -0400 > From: "Tim Jokela Jr." > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Message-ID: <000501c8f04a$b579be80$6600a8c0@Junior> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=response > > I'd contact Sotheby's first. > > Quit job second. > > Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. > > Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. > > And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, and > pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. > > But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > > >> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a decent >> load? >> >> >> >> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: >> >>> You must tumble it. >>> >>> T >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>>> approch for a stone of such size. >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 22 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:45:00 -0700 > From: > Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Cc: John Siebel > Message-ID: <4294005.1217205900652.JavaMail.root@web35> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it welded/repaired > and now finally got it back together. When I cut a rock now the saw has a > gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the cut yet is still in > contact with the blade at the point the cut started. > At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. > The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw and > saw powered by one motor. > The blade looks to be true. > Any ideas on the problem? > I attached 2 photos > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/mixed > text/plain (text body -- kept) > image/pjpeg > image/pjpeg > --- > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 23 > Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 17:46:47 -0700 > From: > Subject: [Rockhounds] Re: 18 inch saw > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > collectors" > Cc: John Siebel > Message-ID: <32688378.1217206007229.JavaMail.root@web35> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Forgot to sign off > kelly Hanson > > > > ------------------------------ > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > End of Rockhounds Digest, Vol 50, Issue 30 > ****************************************** From rockhounds at adelphia.net Sun Jul 27 19:58:24 2008 From: rockhounds at adelphia.net (rockhounds@adelphia.net) Date: Sun Jul 27 20:04:06 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem Message-ID: <20233044.1217213904915.JavaMail.root@web35> I will try that and report back! Kelly ---- Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > The pictures got stripped off, but from your description it sounds like > the feed is not quite aligned with the blade. As the cut progresses the > blade is slightly dished from the misalignment and cuts a wider kerf as > a result. > > Put something in the vise that just contacts the blade as the cut > starts, and advance the feed to see where it is as the cut progresses. > > You might do better to put something into the vise that just contacts > the blade at the end of the feed, and back it up to the start to see > how far off the alignment is. > > A wide kerf can also be caused by having the feed not wuite at right > angles to the blade, so that the blade appears to wobble. Put something > into the vise that just touches the blade, and hand turn the blade to > make sure the contact is the same as the blade turns a full circle. Try > it at several spots along the feed. > > Minor misalignments have negative effect on big blades. If you use a > pencil as the something in the vise it leaves a nice mark on the blade > to show misalignment. > > Kreigh > > > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:45 America/Detroit, > wrote: > > > MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it > > welded/repaired and now finally got it back together. When I cut a > > rock now the saw has a gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the > > cut yet is still in contact with the blade at the point the cut > > started. > > At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. > > The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw > > and saw powered by one motor. > > The blade looks to be true. > > Any ideas on the problem? > > I attached 2 photos > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/mixed > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > image/pjpeg > > image/pjpeg > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From smtravis at plateautel.net Sun Jul 27 20:19:47 2008 From: smtravis at plateautel.net (steve travis) Date: Sun Jul 27 20:19:55 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem References: <030F2DE5-5C4D-11DD-B462-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <065601c8f060$cb7c0b50$799d324a@marilyn> Put a magic marker in the vice and just touch ie mark the edge of the blade push the vice forward and that will tell you if you have a vice allignment prob if the mark gets wider or gets smooshed against the blade at the other side you have a prob but it can be solved. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:29 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem > The pictures got stripped off, but from your description it sounds like > the feed is not quite aligned with the blade. As the cut progresses the > blade is slightly dished from the misalignment and cuts a wider kerf as a > result. > > Put something in the vise that just contacts the blade as the cut starts, > and advance the feed to see where it is as the cut progresses. > > You might do better to put something into the vise that just contacts the > blade at the end of the feed, and back it up to the start to see how far > off the alignment is. > > A wide kerf can also be caused by having the feed not wuite at right > angles to the blade, so that the blade appears to wobble. Put something > into the vise that just touches the blade, and hand turn the blade to make > sure the contact is the same as the blade turns a full circle. Try it at > several spots along the feed. > > Minor misalignments have negative effect on big blades. If you use a > pencil as the something in the vise it leaves a nice mark on the blade to > show misalignment. > > Kreigh > > > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:45 America/Detroit, > wrote: > >> MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it >> welded/repaired and now finally got it back together. When I cut a rock >> now the saw has a gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the cut yet >> is still in contact with the blade at the point the cut started. >> At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. >> The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw >> and saw powered by one motor. >> The blade looks to be true. >> Any ideas on the problem? >> I attached 2 photos >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/mixed >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> image/pjpeg >> image/pjpeg >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Mon Jul 28 07:01:12 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Mon Jul 28 07:04:04 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Rock Shop for Sale References: <000a01c8ef5f$769e8150$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <00e201c8f0ba$64e483e0$0200000a@LarryRush> Many thanks to all of you who answered my ad to sell the old rock shop inventory, and provided input for questions on un-identified material. I have sold all of the cutting material, and much of the mineral lot. I do have about 20 flats of mineral specimens left, mostly low quality. A lot of Zacatecas and Mapimi material. Thanks very much again. Once again this list has proved to be an invaluable resource, in many different ways! Larry Rush From jaybates at rcn.com Mon Jul 28 08:18:00 2008 From: jaybates at rcn.com (jaybates) Date: Mon Jul 28 08:19:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <488DE328.4010207@rcn.com> Put it on display somewhere if possible. If not put it in your front yard. Any real value is in it's size and cutting it up destroys that value. Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > A quick google search turned up 2 inch agate spheres for $40, 4 inch > for $300, and 6 inch for $1200 (and I didn't find anything bigger). > The trend looks good. > > That find might make a 12 inch sphere. Sotheby's may be a good idea, > but if it were mine I'de want to enjoy it for a while first (and look > for the other half). > > Kreigh > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:41 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > >> I'd contact Sotheby's first. >> >> Quit job second. >> >> Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. >> >> Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. >> >> And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, >> and pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. >> >> But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. >> >> T >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" >> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >> collectors" >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find >> >> >>> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a >>> decent load? >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. >>> wrote: >>> >>>> You must tumble it. >>>> >>>> T >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>>>> approch for a stone of such size. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>>> Subscription Services: >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 28 08:51:26 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 28 08:53:26 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> References: <072720081742.26282.488CB36800083965000066AA220074818498070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <003801c8f0c9$cb343c30$619cb490$@com> I don't know if flaming is standard procedure on "Cash and Treasures", but it sure as heck isn't on this list. Most of "you guys here" have been on this list and its predecessor since the mid-1990s. We have learned netiquette http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netiquette and can consider perfectly requests without snapping back. Please either consider our well-intentioned input silently, or stick to posting on that "other site". 'Nuff said. Out. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of syonix@comcast.net Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 10:42 AM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find thanks but i didnt. I dont even get my own posts ... you guys here are a real piece of work. -------------- Original message -------------- From: DonH > > Syonix, > > Please stop double-posting the messages to the list. Thanks. > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From syonix at comcast.net Mon Jul 28 09:02:10 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:02:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072820081602.18984.488DED810003558000004A28220076370498070201979C@comcast.net> Thank you for your opinions. it honestly helps. If i knew i wouldn't ask now, about the childish behavior.. It is amazing the differences in people on this list. I ask a simple basic question and more than half the replies are calling me a flamer. i have been watching this list for a long time and have see repeated egotrips and flaming done by these very people. it is terrible that in the midst of the ability to get and disperse information there is so much ego and political nonsense in what should be a general friendly list. I frankly dont need to be lectured by people who think thier the best thing since sliced bread. I am done. goodbye good people. as far as the rest of you, regardless of how much you know, or think you know, you're attitudes drive more people away from rock and mineral shows, clubs and outing than you know. I am not alone in oregon Tim. -------------- Original message -------------- From: jaybates > Put it on display somewhere if possible. If not put it in your front > yard. Any real value is in it's size and cutting it up destroys that value. > > Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > A quick google search turned up 2 inch agate spheres for $40, 4 inch > > for $300, and 6 inch for $1200 (and I didn't find anything bigger). > > The trend looks good. > > > > That find might make a 12 inch sphere. Sotheby's may be a good idea, > > but if it were mine I'de want to enjoy it for a while first (and look > > for the other half). > > > > Kreigh > > > > > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:41 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > > > >> I'd contact Sotheby's first. > >> > >> Quit job second. > >> > >> Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. > >> > >> Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. > >> > >> And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, > >> and pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. > >> > >> But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. > >> > >> T > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" > >> > >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > >> collectors" > >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM > >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > >> > >> > >>> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a > >>> decent load? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> You must tumble it. > >>>> > >>>> T > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best > >>>>> approch for a stone of such size. > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >>>> Subscription Services: > >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >>> Subscription Services: > >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > >> -- > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >> Subscription Services: > >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From syonix at comcast.net Mon Jul 28 09:02:10 2008 From: syonix at comcast.net (syonix@comcast.net) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:02:42 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <072820081602.18984.488DED810003558000004A28220076370498070201979C@comcast.net> Thank you for your opinions. it honestly helps. If i knew i wouldn't ask now, about the childish behavior.. It is amazing the differences in people on this list. I ask a simple basic question and more than half the replies are calling me a flamer. i have been watching this list for a long time and have see repeated egotrips and flaming done by these very people. it is terrible that in the midst of the ability to get and disperse information there is so much ego and political nonsense in what should be a general friendly list. I frankly dont need to be lectured by people who think thier the best thing since sliced bread. I am done. goodbye good people. as far as the rest of you, regardless of how much you know, or think you know, you're attitudes drive more people away from rock and mineral shows, clubs and outing than you know. I am not alone in oregon Tim. -------------- Original message -------------- From: jaybates > Put it on display somewhere if possible. If not put it in your front > yard. Any real value is in it's size and cutting it up destroys that value. > > Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > A quick google search turned up 2 inch agate spheres for $40, 4 inch > > for $300, and 6 inch for $1200 (and I didn't find anything bigger). > > The trend looks good. > > > > That find might make a 12 inch sphere. Sotheby's may be a good idea, > > but if it were mine I'de want to enjoy it for a while first (and look > > for the other half). > > > > Kreigh > > > > > > > > On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 20:41 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > > > >> I'd contact Sotheby's first. > >> > >> Quit job second. > >> > >> Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. > >> > >> Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. > >> > >> And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, > >> and pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. > >> > >> But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. > >> > >> T > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" > >> > >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem > >> collectors" > >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM > >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > >> > >> > >>> Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a > >>> decent load? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> You must tumble it. > >>>> > >>>> T > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best > >>>>> approch for a stone of such size. > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >>>> Subscription Services: > >>>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >>>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >>>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >>> Subscription Services: > >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > >> -- > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >> Subscription Services: > >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 28 09:41:02 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:41:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <005301c8f0d0$b9051140$2b0f33c0$@com> I would really appreciate it (actually, I am insisting) if this person were banned from the list. As I said before, in similar cases, I strongly believe that personal attacks on me or anyone on this list are ample reason for a ban. I will not tolerate this behavior anymore; I don't believe for a minute that a threat by me to "leave the list in a hissy fit" will do any good, but nonetheless, here it is. Leaving people like this around to flame away (which, as you and I both know, he will continue to do, since he has the classic "hater" MO, which I am getting very good at recognizing from one email, namely, his first post) is bad for the list, bad for rockhounding, and bad for the members. P.S. I don't blame you if this weren't posted to the entire list, but I am cc:ing it because I think the list members have every right to know my opinion about haters such as this person. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 28 09:43:34 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:43:37 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem In-Reply-To: <4294005.1217205900652.JavaMail.root@web35> References: <4294005.1217205900652.JavaMail.root@web35> Message-ID: <005401c8f0d1$13a32830$3ae97890$@com> You have a misaligned feed, blade, or both. Use a straight-edge and a t-square to figure out which is misaligned with the saw. I.e., the blade shaft should be at exactly a 90? angle with the saw body, and the carriage (actually, the carriage rails, feed screw, AND carriage) should be exactly parallel with the blade. Also, make sure that your blade is perfectly flat, not dished out, and at a 90? angle to the shaft. While you are at it, check the shaft bearings, as worn bearings can produce similar results. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of rockhounds@adelphia.net Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 5:45 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Cc: John Siebel Subject: [Rockhounds] 18 inch saw has a problem MY OLD 18 inch saw stripped the shaft a while back. Had it welded/repaired and now finally got it back together. When I cut a rock now the saw has a gap of about 3/8 of an inch at the end of the cut yet is still in contact with the blade at the point the cut started. At one point the whole delivery system was taken apart. The saw is similar to the old convington type of design with the screw and saw powered by one motor. The blade looks to be true. Any ideas on the problem? I attached 2 photos --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/mixed text/plain (text body -- kept) image/pjpeg image/pjpeg --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 28 09:46:54 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:46:57 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find In-Reply-To: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> References: <072720081629.19990.488CA278000C8F8900004E16220700320198070201979C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <005a01c8f0d1$8b0152d0$a103f870$@com> I have seen collections with carnelian this large and larger from the Pigeon Springs upstream on Lucas. Most were collected 10 years or more ago, but this area is lightly hunted compared to downstream and on neighboring streams. Cut the face off and polish it, or use a wet polisher similar to the Barranca model here http://www.barrancadiamond.com/lap/htl_125.html to smooth and polish it in its natural state. Leaving it as is nets you a $1/lb. hunk of rock; polishing or cutting and polishing nets you a nice show case piece. The color and pattern are better than average but not spectacular, but be aware that both will fade rapidly if you cut too much of the face away. If it was me I would stick with the wet polisher. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com From: syonix@comcast.net [mailto:syonix@comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 9:30 AM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors; nospam@orerockon.com; Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/page/The+83.8lb+Lucas+Creek +Agate I recently pulled out a monster agate from Lucas Creek WA.. I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best approch for a stone of such size. i've given it a good acid bath and cleaned it up but im not sure if cutting it is such a good idea.. i've never seen or heard of an agate this large from the area.. Any suggestions .. http://cash-and-treasures-wiki.travelchannel.com/album/32008/The+83.8lb+Agat e Thanks in advance for your suggestions... --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From nospam at orerockon.com Mon Jul 28 09:51:05 2008 From: nospam at orerockon.com (Tim) Date: Mon Jul 28 09:51:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <006301c8f0d2$20c7c2e0$625748a0$@com> Forgive me if this posts twice. It seems that Outlook, which I have recently been forced by the communists at Comcast to use, doesn't understand the difference between Rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com and Rockhounds@drizzle.com. I would really appreciate it (actually, I am insisting) if this person were banned from the list. As I said before, in similar cases, I strongly believe that personal attacks on me or anyone on this list are ample reason for a ban. I will not tolerate this behavior anymore; I don't believe for a minute that a threat by me to "leave the list in a hissy fit" will do any good, but nonetheless, here it is. Leaving people like this around to flame away (which, as you and I both know, he will continue to do, since he has the classic "hater" MO, which I am getting very good at recognizing from one email, namely, his first post) is bad for the list, bad for rockhounding, and bad for the members. P.S. I don't blame you if this weren't posted to the entire list, but I am cc:ing it because I think the list members have every right to know my opinion about haters such as this person. Tim Fisher Ore-ROCK-On! Email address at http://OreRockOn.com From dr00bert at gmail.com Mon Jul 28 10:05:31 2008 From: dr00bert at gmail.com (Drew) Date: Mon Jul 28 10:05:36 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] NOW OT: Fishing WAS 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find Message-ID: <7aac8040807281005o4e50c600ge8c9aaa6df845ff@mail.gmail.com> Bill Izumi? Who the heck cares about those non-fighting, sissy walleyes? :) No doubt, they're good eating... but that's about it... Harry Murray would be my pick for a guide... bronzebacks on the fly! The only way to go! Drew On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 8:41 PM, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: > I'd contact Sotheby's first. > > Quit job second. > > Leave wife and find hot young blonde third. > > Maybe buy a Ferrari somewhere in there btw 1 and 3. > > And also get a 22' glitter paint bass boat with twin 150 horse Mercs, and > pay Bob Izumi to be my guide... for life. > > But that's just me, some people would just throw the money away. > > T > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kreigh Tomaszewski" < > Kreigh@tomaszewski.net> > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 7:17 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > > > > Wouldn't that require several more similar sized agates to get a decent >> load? >> >> >> >> On Sunday, Jul 27, 2008, at 12:38 America/Detroit, Tim Jokela Jr. wrote: >> >> You must tumble it. >>> >>> T >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>>> I'd like some suggestions as to what the group thinks is the best >>>> approch for a stone of such size. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Mon Jul 28 10:25:59 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Mon Jul 28 11:18:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find References: <006301c8f0d2$20c7c2e0$625748a0$@com> Message-ID: <00da01c8f0d7$0c2a9010$0600a8c0@Montana> I already responded to Tim personally on this message (the first version that he sent). As many of you on the list have asked me to ban someone, you can probably guess my reply. Julie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim" To: "Rockhounds List" Sent: Monday, July 28, 2008 9:51 AM Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] 83.8lbs Lucas Creek WA Agate Find > Forgive me if this posts twice. It seems that Outlook, which I have > recently > been forced by the communists at Comcast to use, doesn't understand the > difference between Rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com and > Rockhounds@drizzle.com. > > I would really appreciate it (actually, I am insisting) if this person > were > banned from the list. As I said before, in similar cases, I strongly > believe > that personal attacks on me or anyone on this list are ample reason for a > ban. I will not tolerate this behavior anymore; I don't believe for a > minute > that a threat by me to "leave the list in a hissy fit" will do any good, > but > nonetheless, here it is. Leaving people like this around to flame away > (which, as you and I both know, he will continue to do, since he has the > classic "hater" MO, which I am getting very good at recognizing from one > email, namely, his first post) is bad for the list, bad for rockhounding, > and bad for the members. > > P.S. I don't blame you if this weren't posted to the entire list, but I am > cc:ing it because I think the list members have every right to know my > opinion about haters such as this person. > > Tim Fisher > Ore-ROCK-On! > Email address at http://OreRockOn.com > > > > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From territoones1 at ameritech.net Mon Jul 28 20:20:07 2008 From: territoones1 at ameritech.net (teresa jetter) Date: Mon Jul 28 20:21:57 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? Message-ID: <573258.42237.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Works in Ohio On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel wrote: > Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't reach > the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > > Could a few more of you try? > > Julie > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" < > julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > > > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds > subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had > THEM try it and they can - lol. > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can > track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the > same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > Thx, > > Julie > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- -- "The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the horizon." Ralph Waldo Emerson J Bryan Kramer North Florida, USA photos at: http://pbase.com/photoburner --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From bilmcc1948 at msn.com Tue Jul 29 04:44:31 2008 From: bilmcc1948 at msn.com (Kirk McCullough) Date: Tue Jul 29 04:44:38 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? In-Reply-To: <573258.42237.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Worked here yesterday. I thought you just wanted negative reports. --Bill McC. Dream big; it's a waste of time to dream little ones. >From: teresa jetter >Reply-To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem >collectors" >To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com:A mailing list for rock and gem >collectors" >Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? >Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2008 20:20:07 -0700 (PDT) > >Works in Ohio > > > > > > >On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel > > wrote: > > > Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't >reach > > the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > > > > Could a few more of you try? > > > > Julie > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" < > > julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> > > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >< > > rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > > Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > > Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > > > > > > > > Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the >rockhounds > > subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I >had > > THEM try it and they can - lol. > > > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > > > Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I >can > > track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with >the > > same problem :) Please let me know off list. > > > > Thx, > > > > Julie > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > > multipart/alternative > > text/plain (text body -- kept) > > text/html > > --- > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > > Subscription Services: > > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > > >-- >-- > >"The thunderbolt falls on an inch of ground; but the light of it fills the >horizon." > >Ralph Waldo Emerson > >J Bryan Kramer >North Florida, USA >photos at: >http://pbase.com/photoburner > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > >--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html >--- >-- >_______________________________________________ >Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >Subscription Services: >http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From berry at relia.net Tue Jul 29 12:48:09 2008 From: berry at relia.net (Kay Berry) Date: Tue Jul 29 12:48:15 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? In-Reply-To: <573258.42237.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <573258.42237.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <488F73F9.2070705@relia.net> Works in Utah teresa jetter wrote: > Works in Ohio > > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel >> wrote: >> > > >> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the only people who can't reach >> the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). >> >> Could a few more of you try? >> >> Julie >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" < >> julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" < >> rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM >> Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? >> >> >> >> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds >> subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had >> THEM try it and they can - lol. >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can >> track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the >> same problem :) Please let me know off list. >> >> Thx, >> >> Julie >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From betdav97 at aol.com Tue Jul 29 13:06:48 2008 From: betdav97 at aol.com (betdav97@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 29 13:07:21 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Message-ID: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> Hi All, Does all cobaltian calcite have to fluoresce, or can some specimens still be be cobaltian calcite, and not fluoresce? Or is it just plain calcite, even though the color is there? Thanks, Dave ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From everbeek at ptd.net Tue Jul 29 13:12:51 2008 From: everbeek at ptd.net (Earl R. Verbeek) Date: Tue Jul 29 13:13:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00b101c8f1b7$7ab43a00$2101a8c0@sterling88d31e> Oooog. This gets us into grey territory right away -- how much cobalt has to be in the calcite structure to call it cobaltian calcite? If defined informally on the basis of color, how deep must that color be? In any event I've never seen a specimen labeled cobaltian calcite that fluoresces at all. Cheers- Earl ---------------------------------------------------- Dr. Earl R. Verbeek Resident Geologist Sterling Hill Mining Museum P: 973-209-7212 F: 973-209-8505 E: shmm@ptd.net -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of betdav97@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 4:07 PM To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Hi All, Does all cobaltian calcite have to fluoresce, or can some specimens still be be cobaltian calcite, and not fluoresce? Or is it just plain calcite, even though the color is there? Thanks, Dave --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 29 13:33:30 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 29 13:36:49 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Hi Dave, Let me try a first answer. I think you have your elements mixed up a bit.? Cobaltian calcite is bright vivid pink in color, but is not normally fluorescent--in fact, I don't think it is ever fluorescent.? It is manganoan (i.e., manganese-containing) calcite that is normally fluorescent red or orange-red.? Manganoan calcite (a.k.a. "manganocalcite") is pale pink, but a much paler, light pastel color than cobaltian calcite. Both of these are mineralogically considered to be just "calcite"; the adjectives cobaltian, manganoan just mean they are varieties that contain?these metal impurities. Sincerely, Pete -----Original Message----- From: betdav97@aol.com To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 2:06 pm Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Hi All,? ?Does all cobaltian calcite have to fluoresce, or can some? specimens still be be cobaltian calcite, and not fluoresce?? Or is it just plain calcite, even though the color is there?? Thanks,? Dave? ? **************************************? See what's new at http://www.aol.com? -- _______________________________________________? Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? Subscription Services:? http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From totis99 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 29 13:53:38 2008 From: totis99 at yahoo.com (teresa otis) Date: Tue Jul 29 13:53:43 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? In-Reply-To: <488F73F9.2070705@relia.net> Message-ID: <835784.95453.qm@web36701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> i'm sending as reply and will try test as original post teresa --- On Tue, 7/29/08, Kay Berry wrote: > From: Kay Berry > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" > Date: Tuesday, July 29, 2008, 1:48 PM > Works in Utah > > teresa jetter wrote: > > Works in Ohio > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel > > > >> wrote: > >> > > > > > >> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the > only people who can't reach > >> the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). > >> > >> Could a few more of you try? > >> > >> Julie > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie > Siebel" < > >> julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> > >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list > for rock and gem collectors" < > >> rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> > >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM > >> Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the > subscription link? > >> > >> > >> > >> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he > can't get to the rockhounds > >> subscription page. I can, John can, I was online > with some people and I had > >> THEM try it and they can - lol. > >> > >> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >> > >> Could some of you see if you can get to this page? > I'd like to see if I can > >> track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need > someone(s) else with the > >> same problem :) Please let me know off list. > >> > >> Thx, > >> > >> Julie > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > >> multipart/alternative > >> text/plain (text body -- kept) > >> text/html > >> --- > >> -- > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >> Subscription Services: > >> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage > Policy: > >> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > >> -- > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > >> Subscription Services: > >> > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage > Policy: > >> > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From totis99 at yahoo.com Tue Jul 29 13:56:48 2008 From: totis99 at yahoo.com (teresa otis) Date: Tue Jul 29 13:56:52 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] test Message-ID: <4295.23218.qm@web36707.mail.mud.yahoo.com> test From julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com Tue Jul 29 13:58:42 2008 From: julie at pandemoniumgraphics.com (Julie Siebel) Date: Tue Jul 29 14:00:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? References: <835784.95453.qm@web36701.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00b201c8f1bd$e8c2c290$0600a8c0@Montana> The problem appears to only be happening in certain areas of continental Europe. I don't need any more US/Canada tests, but those outside of those countries, let me know if there are problems. Please reply off list. Thanks! Julie ----- Original Message ----- From: "teresa otis" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2008 1:53 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? > i'm sending as reply and will try test as original post > > teresa > > > --- On Tue, 7/29/08, Kay Berry wrote: > >> From: Kay Berry >> Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" >> >> Date: Tuesday, July 29, 2008, 1:48 PM >> Works in Utah >> >> teresa jetter wrote: >> > Works in Ohio >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 6:21 PM, Julie Siebel >> > > >> >> wrote: >> >> >> > >> > >> >> Small sample (8 people) thusfar, but so far the >> only people who can't reach >> >> the page are from Belgium (Axel and Ric). >> >> >> >> Could a few more of you try? >> >> >> >> Julie >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie >> Siebel" < >> >> julie@pandemoniumgraphics.com> >> >> To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list >> for rock and gem collectors" < >> >> rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com> >> >> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 1:52 PM >> >> Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the >> subscription link? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he >> can't get to the rockhounds >> >> subscription page. I can, John can, I was online >> with some people and I had >> >> THEM try it and they can - lol. >> >> >> >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> >> >> Could some of you see if you can get to this page? >> I'd like to see if I can >> >> track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need >> someone(s) else with the >> >> same problem :) Please let me know off list. >> >> >> >> Thx, >> >> >> >> Julie >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> >> multipart/alternative >> >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> >> text/html >> >> --- >> >> -- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> >> Subscription Services: >> >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage >> Policy: >> >> >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> >> >> -- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> >> Subscription Services: >> >> >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage >> Policy: >> >> >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From betdav97 at aol.com Tue Jul 29 14:37:04 2008 From: betdav97 at aol.com (betdav97@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 29 14:38:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> Hi Pete, I had bought them for cobaltian calcite, but the fluorescence threw me off. Is it semi-safe to assume the hot pink and hot orange fluorescent ones may be mangoan, and the ones that don't fluoresce, MAY really be cobaltian? They are pinkish to purple in color. I'll go back and see what color the ones that fluoresce are, and if the color is consistant, that may narrow it down. They are from Morocco, which probably may explain the mis-labeling. Thanks, Dave -----Original Message----- From: pmodreski@aol.com To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 4:33 pm Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Hi Dave, Let me try a first answer. I think you have your elements mixed up a bit.? Cobaltian calcite is bright vivid pink in color, but is not normally fluorescent--in fact, I don't think it is ever fluorescent.? It is manganoan (i.e., manganese-containing) calcite that is normally fluorescent red or orange-red.? Manganoan calcite (a.k.a. "manganocalcite") is pale pink, but a much paler, light pastel color than cobaltian calcite. Both of these are mineralogically considered to be just "calcite"; the adjectives cobaltian, manganoan just mean they are varieties that contain?these metal impurities. Sincerely, Pete ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 29 15:23:58 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 29 15:24:11 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8CABFE0EE14F791-17EC-114A@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Dave, It looks like this needs a little more research.? I don't think the African (Congo or Zaire?) cobaltian calcite specimens ever fluoresce, but I see from material described for sale online, that ones from Morocco are said to be brightly fluorescent.? I think that both Earl, who also replied,?and I were not aware of this. I'm wondering if the Morocco material, that is fluorescent, is due to its also containing manganese, which causes the fluorescence, as well as cobalt, which helps make it brighter pink.? We (someone) needs to look up some more info and check this out... I'll write back some more if I learn anything, Pete -----Original Message----- From: betdav97@aol.com To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 3:37 pm Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Hi Pete,? ? I had bought them for cobaltian calcite, but the fluorescence threw me? off. Is it semi-safe to assume the hot pink and hot orange fluorescent? ones may be mangoan, and the ones that don't fluoresce, MAY really be? cobaltian? They are pinkish to purple in color. I'll go back and see what? color the ones that fluoresce are, and if the color is consistant, that may? narrow it down. They are from Morocco, which probably may explain the? mis-labeling.? Thanks,? Dave? ? -----Original Message-----? From: pmodreski@aol.com? To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com? Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 4:33 pm? Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite? ? ? Hi Dave,? ? Let me try a first answer.? ? I think you have your elements mixed up a bit.? Cobaltian calcite is bright? vivid pink in color, but is not normally fluorescent--in fact, I don't think it? is ever fluorescent.? It is manganoan (i.e., manganese-containing) calcite that? is normally fluorescent red or orange-red.? Manganoan calcite (a.k.a.? "manganocalcite") is pale pink, but a much paler, light pastel color than? cobaltian calcite.? ? Both of these are mineralogically considered to be just "calcite"; the? adjectives cobaltian, manganoan just mean they are varieties that contain?these? metal impurities.? ? Sincerely, Pete? ? **************************************? See what's new at http://www.aol.com? -- _______________________________________________? Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List? Subscription Services:? http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds? List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy:? http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html? --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Tue Jul 29 15:25:16 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Tue Jul 29 15:25:18 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com><8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <002101c8f1c9$fa4d4e70$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Dave, Earl and Pete, I almost hate myself for saying this (it's a good thing that I love myself enough to forgive me ;-) but I actually have a specimen that comes from the Shaba (Congo) region that is labeled as cobaltoan calcite. It is a rather convincing purple botryoidal mass that has no collecting value because of dents and damaged spots. I got it for free from a guy that knows I am into fluorescence. The specimen fluoresces a burnt orange under SW but much brighter under medium wave (310 nm). That 's typical of manganoan calcite. Cobalt is, as far as I know, a fluorescence quencher and not an activator. However, two thoughts cross my mind (three, actually, but one is normal for a guy at my age and isn't about rocks): 1) Metakirchheimerite is Cobalt uranyl arsenate and contains essential cobalt in much higher concentration than cobaltoan calcite in which the cobalt is an accidental coloring ion. I have some Metakirchheimerite from the type locality and it fluoresces a strong orange. We measured the spectrum of this orange fluorescence and we found the typical tell-tale vibrational bands of uranyl. 2) It's not because you have fleas that you cannot have lice too (an old Flemish proverb, meaning that it is not forbidden for cobaltoan calcite to have some manganese too besides of cobalt). My specimen fluoresces weak in SW and on the weak side of medium strong in MW at best. Manganese is a powerful activator if it has a good primer around and its fluorescence may just not quite completely be quenched by the cobalt that is unmistakably there. So I think (not sure, just thinking) that cobaltoan calcite can indeed fluoresce if there's an ideal amount of manganese + primer present as well... Hope this helps ;-))) Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens betdav97@aol.com > Verzonden: dinsdag 29 juli 2008 22:37 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > Hi Pete, > I had bought them for cobaltian calcite, but the > fluorescence threw me off. Is it semi-safe to assume the hot > pink and hot orange fluorescent ones may be mangoan, and the > ones that don't fluoresce, MAY really be cobaltian? They are > pinkish to purple in color. I'll go back and see what color > the ones that fluoresce are, and if the color is consistant, > that may narrow it down. They are from Morocco, which > probably may explain the mis-labeling. > Thanks, > Dave > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pmodreski@aol.com > To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 4:33 pm > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > > > Hi Dave, > > Let me try a first answer. > > I think you have your elements mixed up a bit.? Cobaltian > calcite is bright vivid pink in color, but is not normally > fluorescent--in fact, I don't think it is ever fluorescent.? > It is manganoan (i.e., manganese-containing) calcite that is > normally fluorescent red or orange-red.? Manganoan calcite (a.k.a. > "manganocalcite") is pale pink, but a much paler, light > pastel color than cobaltian calcite. > > Both of these are mineralogically considered to be just > "calcite"; the adjectives cobaltian, manganoan just mean they > are varieties that contain?these metal impurities. > > Sincerely, Pete > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From pmodreski at aol.com Tue Jul 29 15:43:14 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 29 15:43:32 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <002101c8f1c9$fa4d4e70$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com><8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com> <002101c8f1c9$fa4d4e70$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <8CABFE39F1348E5-17EC-122C@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Thank you for the comments and insight, Axel. Since cobalt is "known" to be a "quencher" of fluorescence, I would be very surprised if any cobalt-bearing calcite could also be fluorescent. But I can think of more reasons to make this more complicated.? For one, cobalt can be present as either cobalt (II) ions, or cobalt (III) ions, Co+2 or Co+3.? I believe that the former usually colors compounds pale pink, and the later, intense pink, just as Mn+2 is pale pink and Mn+3 is intense red.? Calcite containing Co(II) would properly be called "cobaltoan calcite", whereas that containing Co(III) is what should be called "cobaltian".? It's possible that only Co+2 is a quencher of fluorescence, and that the cobaltian calcite is in fact colored by Co+3, which is not a quencher, and does not prevent Mn also present, from causing fluorescence. There's more to be understood here--let's see if anyone else knows anything pertinent to this! Pete [P.S., I seem to have hit some kind of a key while typing this message that has changed the appearance of the font, and I can't figure out how to change it back; I'll see what it looks like when this message posts, and I hope it doesn't come out looking too weird or illegible!] -----Original Message----- From: Axel Emmermann To: 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Sent: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 4:25 pm Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite Dave, Earl and Pete, I almost hate myself for saying this (it's a good thing that I love myself enough to forgive me ;-) but I actually have a specimen that comes from the Shaba (Congo) region that is labeled as cobaltoan calcite. It is a rather convincing purple botryoidal mass that has no collecting value because of dents and damaged spots. I got it for free from a guy that knows I am into fluorescence. The specimen fluoresces a burnt orange under SW but much brighter under medium wave (310 nm). That 's typical of manganoan calcite. Cobalt is, as far as I know, a fluorescence quencher and not an activator. However, two thoughts cross my mind (three, actually, but one is normal for a guy at my age and isn't about rocks): 1) Metakirchheimerite is Cobalt uranyl arsenate and contains essential cobalt in much higher concentration than cobaltoan calcite in which the cobalt is an accidental coloring ion. I have some Metakirchheimerite from the type locality and it fluoresces a strong orange. We measured the spectrum of this orange fluorescence and we found the typical tell-tale vibrational bands of uranyl. 2) It's not because you have fleas that you cannot have lice too (an old Flemish proverb, meaning that it is not forbidden for cobaltoan calcite to have some manganese too besides of cobalt). My specimen fluoresces weak in SW and on the weak side of medium strong in MW at best. Manganese is a powerful activator if it has a good primer around and its fluorescence may just not quite completely be quenched by the cobalt that is unmistakably there. So I think (not sure, just thinking) that cobaltoan calcite can indeed fluoresce if there's an ideal amount of manganese + primer present as well... Hope this helps ;-))) Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens betdav97@aol.com > Verzonden: dinsdag 29 juli 2008 22:37 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Onderwerp: Re: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From rockincc at gpcom.net Wed Jul 30 06:51:42 2008 From: rockincc at gpcom.net (Bud Stolzenburg) Date: Wed Jul 30 06:48:28 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? References: <006c01c8f02a$b5cb9590$0600a8c0@Montana> Message-ID: <003801c8f24b$665821e0$1b0f020a@bud75kzq4u12oq> works from Nebraska Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie Siebel" To: "Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors" Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 3:52 PM Subject: [Rockhounds] [ADMIN] Test the subscription link? Hey, guys - just got an email from Ric and he can't get to the rockhounds subscription page. I can, John can, I was online with some people and I had THEM try it and they can - lol. http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds Could some of you see if you can get to this page? I'd like to see if I can track down why Ric is having a problem, so I need someone(s) else with the same problem :) Please let me know off list. Thx, Julie --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From betdav97 at aol.com Wed Jul 30 07:44:15 2008 From: betdav97 at aol.com (betdav97@aol.com) Date: Wed Jul 30 07:44:45 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <00b101c8f1b7$7ab43a00$2101a8c0@sterling88d31e> Message-ID: <8CAC069DFB5E0CF-848-145E@webmail-db09.sysops.aol.com> Thanks to Earl, Pete and Axel, Dave ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Wed Jul 30 13:17:12 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Wed Jul 30 13:21:23 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <8CABFE39F1348E5-17EC-122C@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CABFCDC46FBE4E-F20-1920@webmail-dd12.sysops.aol.com><8CABFD17F133117-17EC-B6E@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> <8CABFDA608B7E08-CC4-2771@mblk-d44.sysops.aol.com><002101c8f1c9$fa4d4e70$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <8CABFE39F1348E5-17EC-122C@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <001801c8f281$408462e0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> > Thank you for the comments and insight, Axel. Your welcome, Pete! You can always count on me to make an already confusing situation worse ;-))) I'd rather call my comments and insights "speculations in the process of thinking out loud"... > Since cobalt is "known" to be a "quencher" of fluorescence, I > would be very surprised if any cobalt-bearing calcite could > also be fluorescent. Yes. I am too! Then again, I was always convinced that Iron was a quencher... Turns out it usually is BUT that it can act as an activator in quite a few pretty fluorescing specimens. > But I can think of more reasons to make this more > complicated.? For one, cobalt can be present as either cobalt > (II) ions, or cobalt (III) ions, Co+2 or Co+3.? >I believe > that the former usually colors compounds pale pink, and the > later, intense pink, just as Mn+2 is pale pink and Mn+3 is > intense red.? Calcite containing Co(II) would properly be > called "cobaltoan calcite", whereas that containing Co(III) > is what should be called "cobaltian".? It's possible that > only Co+2 is a quencher of fluorescence, and that the > cobaltian calcite is in fact colored by Co+3, which is not a > quencher, and does not prevent Mn also present, from causing > fluorescence. this is my three cents and layman talk... Take it with a grain of salt... But here goes: Hm... Co3+ in calcite? It would surely affect the way the CO2 behaves, wouldn't it? Ca2+ + (CO2)2- would then create e- centers by ligand and become Co3+ + ((CO2)2- + e-)? Would that, in its turn, not affect the location of any manganese emission peak by crystal field effects? Some of the oxygen ions in the octahedral configuration (was it?) that enclose the manganese would be more negative (one "almost" O3- for every Co3+ that replaces Ca2+). Also, would Co2+ and Co3+ when both present in significant amounts engage in charge-exchange like Fe2+ an Fe3+??? In my vivid imagination it would indeed (I sound like T'ealc in Stargate 1 ;-) be possible for the calcite to be darker in daylight color but VERY unlikely to fluoresce... We would have to get back to this once I get the specimen near a spectrometer. ;-))) > [P.S., I seem to have hit some kind of a key while typing > this message that has changed the appearance of the font, and > I can't figure out how to change it back; I'll see what it > looks like when this message posts, and I hope it doesn't > come out looking too weird or illegible!] Nope, looking good, Pete. From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Jul 30 19:06:02 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Jul 30 19:07:35 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition Message-ID: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Last fall Barrick Mining announced a $10M prize for anyone that could come up with a method of extracting 180M ounces of silver encapsulated in quartz ore from one of their mines. It was announced to this list a few days before the deadline. I registered at http://www.unlockthevalue.com and read all the details. I threw on my thinking cap, tossed around some odd ideas, did some research, and came up with something fun over a rare free weekend. I submitted just before the deadline. Then I found out they had moved the deadline out by four months because of the overwhelming response. My timely submission got a sequence number over 100,000; I stood by my initial submission even though I had months to revise it. I had taken my long shot. Each participant was required to sign a 38 page legal contract that defined how intellectual property rights would be handled should the submission pass the first round of screening. I was very pleased when Barrick executed my contract and informed me I had one of only 238 proposals that were being advanced to their expert panel for further consideration. Today Barrick informed me my proposal was not one of the sixteen being advanced to the funded phase two pilot stage. Selection was based on the risk associated with the proposed technology, as well its viability, the strength of the supporting data, and associated health, safety and environmental issues. Per Barrick's notice, the technological fields detailed in the selected proposals include, microwave, laser, electromagnetic, inorganic and organic chemistry, bioleaching, and mechanics. There is still a (very) remote chance none of the sixteen proposals will work out and my proposal could be re-evaluated, so I can't share my details yet (I have a signed contract; the prize has not been awarded yet). I never seriously expected to win, but I sure had fun trying! Please take away the lesson that Rockhounding is a gateway to real science, and that amateurs can be taken seriously when they pursue it. If it is not grown, it must be mined. Learning more about what comes out of the earth can take you to interesting places/spaces, and give you a lifetime of joy. Kreigh From everbeek at ptd.net Wed Jul 30 19:24:20 2008 From: everbeek at ptd.net (Earl R. Verbeek) Date: Wed Jul 30 19:24:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Wow, Kreigh, that's fantastic! Even better, this honor is going to a fellow who really deserves it. You're a constant and useful presence on this list, so if good things come your way, well, perhaps there is some justice in this world after all. Cheers- Earl On Wed, 30 Jul 2008 22:06:02 -0400, wrote: > Last fall Barrick Mining announced a $10M prize for anyone that could > come up with a method of extracting 180M ounces of silver encapsulated > in quartz ore from one of their mines. It was announced to this list a > few days before the deadline. I registered at > http://www.unlockthevalue.com and read all the details. > > I threw on my thinking cap, tossed around some odd ideas, did some > research, and came up with something fun over a rare free weekend. I > submitted just before the deadline. Then I found out they had moved the > deadline out by four months because of the overwhelming response. > > My timely submission got a sequence number over 100,000; I stood by my > initial submission even though I had months to revise it. I had taken > my long shot. > > Each participant was required to sign a 38 page legal contract that > defined how intellectual property rights would be handled should the > submission pass the first round of screening. I was very pleased when > Barrick executed my contract and informed me I had one of only 238 > proposals that were being advanced to their expert panel for further > consideration. > > Today Barrick informed me my proposal was not one of the sixteen being > advanced to the funded phase two pilot stage. Selection was based on > the risk associated with the proposed technology, as well its > viability, the strength of the supporting data, and associated health, > safety and environmental issues. Per Barrick's notice, the > technological fields detailed in the selected proposals include, > microwave, laser, electromagnetic, inorganic and organic chemistry, > bioleaching, and mechanics. > > There is still a (very) remote chance none of the sixteen proposals > will work out and my proposal could be re-evaluated, so I can't share > my details yet (I have a signed contract; the prize has not been > awarded yet). I never seriously expected to win, but I sure had fun > trying! > > Please take away the lesson that Rockhounding is a gateway to real > science, and that amateurs can be taken seriously when they pursue it. > If it is not grown, it must be mined. Learning more about what comes > out of the earth can take you to interesting places/spaces, and give > you a lifetime of joy. > > Kreigh > > > From john at pandemoniumgraphics.com Wed Jul 30 19:41:09 2008 From: john at pandemoniumgraphics.com (John Siebel) Date: Wed Jul 30 19:45:37 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Well said Earl! Ditto from me and Julie Kreigh. John ----- Original Message ----- From: "Earl R. Verbeek" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 7:24 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition > Wow, Kreigh, that's fantastic! Even better, this honor is going to a > fellow who really deserves it. You're a constant and useful presence on > this list, so if good things come your way, well, perhaps there is some > justice in this world after all. > > Cheers- Earl From kahako at hawaiiantel.net Wed Jul 30 20:03:23 2008 From: kahako at hawaiiantel.net (Kitty & Bill Heacox) Date: Wed Jul 30 20:03:33 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <48912B7B.1040602@hawaiiantel.net> Folks, Kreigh makes no secret of the fact that he doesn't have a degree from a college or university. I think he proves in this Barrick's contest---as well as consistently on this list---that he is one of the smartest and most informed people around in the earth sciences, and perhaps that last qualification ("in earth sciences") is not even required! Formal education is not necessarily a good indication of intelligence, and I'm speaking as one who has a couple of degrees myself. Congratulations, Kreigh, and I salute you! And I admire all the others (like Axel, for example) who prove that rockhounding (as Kreigh says) can lead to real science, and that a self-education can be as valid or better than one obtained through formal advanced eduction systems. Aloha, Kitty Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: Rockhounding is a gateway to real science, and that amateurs can be taken seriously when they pursue it. From kadok at infowest.com Wed Jul 30 20:33:15 2008 From: kadok at infowest.com (Margaret Malm) Date: Wed Jul 30 20:23:13 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <003f01c8f2be$2b3e7280$0200a8c0@kadok> Good on yer, Kreigh! Margaret -----Original Message----- From: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] On Behalf Of Kreigh Tomaszewski Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2008 8:06 PM To: Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition Last fall Barrick Mining announced a $10M prize for anyone that could come up with a method of extracting 180M ounces of silver encapsulated in quartz ore from one of their mines. It was announced to this list a few days before the deadline. I registered at http://www.unlockthevalue.com and read all the details. I threw on my thinking cap, tossed around some odd ideas, did some research, and came up with something fun over a rare free weekend. I submitted just before the deadline. Then I found out they had moved the deadline out by four months because of the overwhelming response. My timely submission got a sequence number over 100,000; I stood by my initial submission even though I had months to revise it. I had taken my long shot. Each participant was required to sign a 38 page legal contract that defined how intellectual property rights would be handled should the submission pass the first round of screening. I was very pleased when Barrick executed my contract and informed me I had one of only 238 proposals that were being advanced to their expert panel for further consideration. Today Barrick informed me my proposal was not one of the sixteen being advanced to the funded phase two pilot stage. Selection was based on the risk associated with the proposed technology, as well its viability, the strength of the supporting data, and associated health, safety and environmental issues. Per Barrick's notice, the technological fields detailed in the selected proposals include, microwave, laser, electromagnetic, inorganic and organic chemistry, bioleaching, and mechanics. There is still a (very) remote chance none of the sixteen proposals will work out and my proposal could be re-evaluated, so I can't share my details yet (I have a signed contract; the prize has not been awarded yet). I never seriously expected to win, but I sure had fun trying! Please take away the lesson that Rockhounding is a gateway to real science, and that amateurs can be taken seriously when they pursue it. If it is not grown, it must be mined. Learning more about what comes out of the earth can take you to interesting places/spaces, and give you a lifetime of joy. Kreigh -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Wed Jul 30 20:28:04 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Wed Jul 30 20:28:12 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <48912B7B.1040602@hawaiiantel.net> Message-ID: Kitty & Bill, I am challenged by the real experts on this list. Mahalo. Kreigh On Wednesday, Jul 30, 2008, at 23:03 America/Detroit, Kitty & Bill Heacox wrote: > Folks, Kreigh makes no secret of the fact that he doesn't have a > degree from a college or university. I think he proves in this > Barrick's contest---as well as consistently on this list---that he is > one of the smartest and most informed people around in the earth > sciences, and perhaps that last qualification ("in earth sciences") is > not even required! Formal education is not necessarily a good > indication of intelligence, and I'm speaking as one who has a couple > of degrees myself. > Congratulations, Kreigh, and I salute you! And I admire all the > others (like Axel, for example) who prove that rockhounding (as Kreigh > says) can lead to real science, and that a self-education can be as > valid or better than one obtained through formal advanced eduction > systems. > Aloha, Kitty > > Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > > Rockhounding is a gateway to real science, and that amateurs can be > taken seriously when they pursue it. > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From bova at mindspring.com Wed Jul 30 22:55:02 2008 From: bova at mindspring.com (Carol J. Bova) Date: Wed Jul 30 22:58:17 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: Kreigh, to get that far in the competition under any circumstances is an accomplishment, and to do it with such short notice is amazing. Congratulations! Carol On Jul 30, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Kreigh Tomaszewski wrote: > Last fall Barrick Mining announced a $10M prize for anyone that > could come up with a method of extracting 180M ounces of silver > encapsulated in quartz ore from one of their mines. It was announced > to this list a few days before the deadline. I registered at http://www.unlockthevalue.com > and read all the details. > > I threw on my thinking cap, tossed around some odd ideas, did some > research, and came up with something fun over a rare free weekend. I > submitted just before the deadline. Then I found out they had moved > the deadline out by four months because of the overwhelming response. > > My timely submission got a sequence number over 100,000; I stood by > my initial submission even though I had months to revise it. I had > taken my long shot. > > Each participant was required to sign a 38 page legal contract that > defined how intellectual property rights would be handled should the > submission pass the first round of screening. I was very pleased > when Barrick executed my contract and informed me I had one of only > 238 proposals that were being advanced to their expert panel for > further consideration. > > Today Barrick informed me my proposal was not one of the sixteen > being advanced to the funded phase two pilot stage. Selection was > based on the risk associated with the proposed technology, as well > its viability, the strength of the supporting data, and associated > health, safety and environmental issues. Per Barrick's notice, the > technological fields detailed in the selected proposals include, > microwave, laser, electromagnetic, inorganic and organic chemistry, > bioleaching, and mechanics. > > There is still a (very) remote chance none of the sixteen proposals > will work out and my proposal could be re-evaluated, so I can't > share my details yet (I have a signed contract; the prize has not > been awarded yet). I never seriously expected to win, but I sure had > fun trying! > > Please take away the lesson that Rockhounding is a gateway to real > science, and that amateurs can be taken seriously when they pursue > it. If it is not grown, it must be mined. Learning more about what > comes out of the earth can take you to interesting places/spaces, > and give you a lifetime of joy. > > Kreigh > From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Jul 31 03:36:48 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Jul 31 03:40:08 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] Update on Barrick's "Unlock The Value" Competition In-Reply-To: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> References: <3A2A318C-5EA5-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> Message-ID: <001401c8f2f9$564155c0$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Kreigh, Congratulations! I look forward to the moment that the prize is awarded and you're free to share your innovative ideas with us. Being among the 238 selectees from over 100.000 candidates is indeed in line with Kitty's assessment of your scientific capabilities. We'll keep our fingers crossed for you. Axel From bj9709 at yahoo.com Thu Jul 31 15:06:45 2008 From: bj9709 at yahoo.com (Brett Allen Johnson) Date: Thu Jul 31 15:11:56 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite Message-ID: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From axel.emmermann at pandora.be Thu Jul 31 15:31:21 2008 From: axel.emmermann at pandora.be (Axel Emmermann) Date: Thu Jul 31 15:31:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004801c8f35d$28b99c20$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Hi Brett, Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. Calcite (CaCO3) Magnesite (MgCO3) Otavite (CdCO3) Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) Siderite (FeCO3) Smithsonite (ZnCO3) Have I forgotten a few? Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also cadmian-smithsonite... Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett > Allen Johnson > Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. > What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? > I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some > say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. > I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and > Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out > what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From pmodreski at aol.com Thu Jul 31 15:52:02 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 31 15:52:15 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CAC1772E6B6BC9-9DC-3A05@webmail-me04.sysops.aol.com> Well now, sir, there is a good question, and tougher to answer than I thought it was.? In fact, I can't exactly find a complete answer. I thought the answer was going to be, cobaltian calcite is a variety of calcite, containing some cobalt; (Ca,Co)CO3;?and, sphaerocobaltite (also spelled spherocobaltite) is pure cobalt carbonate, CoCO3, which also can contain (not necessary) some Ca, hence also (Co,Ca)CO3.? Both minerals are pink-purple; in general, sphaerocobaltite seems to be a deeper, intense magenta color, and to occur in smaller crystals, or in rounded spherules. However, although I find that mindat.org and other sources that I've checked, all list sphaerocobaltite as a mineral such as I describe above, CoCO3, the lastest (2008) edition of the Glossary of Mineral Species does NOT list it as a valid mineral; it simply says, sphaerocobaltite = X, discredited .? It does not give any clue why! This is a new one on me, and I don't know the answer.? Possibly there has been some new, recent scientific paper published saying the sphaerocobaltite isn't what it claims to be and is not a valid mineral... but I have no idea where or what or why.? That's all I can seem to learn.? Perhaps someone else reading this will know something more about it. cheers, Pete -----Original Message----- From: Brett Allen Johnson To: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:06 pm Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From pmodreski at aol.com Thu Jul 31 16:02:09 2008 From: pmodreski at aol.com (pmodreski@aol.com) Date: Thu Jul 31 16:02:25 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <004801c8f35d$28b99c20$6401a8c0@AxelHP> References: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <004801c8f35d$28b99c20$6401a8c0@AxelHP> Message-ID: <8CAC17898717ABB-9DC-3A91@webmail-me04.sysops.aol.com> As a slightly off-topic aside, at a science teachers' meeting I was at the other night, one fellow was wearing a T-shirt with information about an unsual new mineral, a carbonaceous holmium-lanthanum cobalt telluride, i.e., it said, CHoCoLaTe (Isn't this a post, almost worthy of Axel himself?) Cheers, Pete -----Original Message----- From: Axel Emmermann To: bj9709@yahoo.com; 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and gem collectors' Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:31 pm Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite Hi Brett, Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. Calcite (CaCO3) Magnesite (MgCO3) Otavite (CdCO3) Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) Siderite (FeCO3) Smithsonite (ZnCO3) Have I forgotten a few? Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also cadmian-smithsonite... Cheers Axel > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com > [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett > Allen Johnson > Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 > Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com > Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. > What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? > I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some > say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. > I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and > Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out > what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett > > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > -- _______________________________________________ Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List Subscription Services: http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html --- From larryrush at worldnet.att.net Thu Jul 31 16:20:47 2008 From: larryrush at worldnet.att.net (Lawrence Rush) Date: Thu Jul 31 16:23:40 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite References: <704473.57176.qm@web37902.mail.mud.yahoo.com><004801c8f35d$28b99c20$6401a8c0@AxelHP> <8CAC17898717ABB-9DC-3A91@webmail-me04.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <000401c8f364$107e7020$0200000a@LarryRush> But some of us prefer: CoCa CoLa (Cobaltium Calcide/Cobaltium Lanthanide) Larry Rush (Hope this doesn't start something!) ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 7:02 PM Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > As a slightly off-topic aside, at a science teachers' meeting I was at the > other night, one fellow was wearing a T-shirt with information about an > unsual new mineral, a carbonaceous holmium-lanthanum cobalt telluride, > i.e., it said, > CHoCoLaTe > > (Isn't this a post, almost worthy of Axel himself?) > > Cheers, Pete > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Axel Emmermann > To: bj9709@yahoo.com; 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock and > gem collectors' > Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:31 pm > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > > > Hi Brett, > > Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. > It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. > > Calcite (CaCO3) > Magnesite (MgCO3) > Otavite (CdCO3) > Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) > Siderite (FeCO3) > Smithsonite (ZnCO3) > > Have I forgotten a few? > > Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also > cadmian-smithsonite... > > Cheers > Axel > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett >> Allen Johnson >> Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 >> Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >> >> On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. >> What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? >> I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some >> say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. >> I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and >> Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out >> what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Jul 31 18:41:47 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Jul 31 18:41:55 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <000401c8f364$107e7020$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: <015B10FF-5F6B-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> SAcReD CoWS DRaNK WINe Actinium Rhenium Duterium Sulfide Cobalt Tungsten Sulfide Duterium Radium Nitrogen Potassium Tungsten Iodine Neon On Thursday, Jul 31, 2008, at 19:20 America/Detroit, Lawrence Rush wrote: > But some of us prefer: > > CoCa CoLa > > (Cobaltium Calcide/Cobaltium Lanthanide) > > Larry Rush > > (Hope this doesn't start something!) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 7:02 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > >> As a slightly off-topic aside, at a science teachers' meeting I was >> at the other night, one fellow was wearing a T-shirt with information >> about an unsual new mineral, a carbonaceous holmium-lanthanum cobalt >> telluride, i.e., it said, >> CHoCoLaTe >> >> (Isn't this a post, almost worthy of Axel himself?) >> >> Cheers, Pete >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Axel Emmermann >> To: bj9709@yahoo.com; 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for >> rock and gem collectors' >> Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:31 pm >> Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >> >> >> >> Hi Brett, >> >> Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. >> It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. >> >> Calcite (CaCO3) >> Magnesite (MgCO3) >> Otavite (CdCO3) >> Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) >> Siderite (FeCO3) >> Smithsonite (ZnCO3) >> >> Have I forgotten a few? >> >> Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also >> cadmian-smithsonite... >> >> Cheers >> Axel >> >>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett >>> Allen Johnson >>> Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 >>> Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >>> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >>> >>> On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. >>> What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian >>> Calcite? >>> I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some >>> say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. >>> I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and >>> Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out >>> what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >>> multipart/alternative >>> text/plain (text body -- kept) >>> text/html >>> --- >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Jul 31 18:46:56 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Jul 31 18:48:22 2008 Subject: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite In-Reply-To: <000401c8f364$107e7020$0200000a@LarryRush> Message-ID: Some prefer BeEr (Beryllium Erbium) On Thursday, Jul 31, 2008, at 19:20 America/Detroit, Lawrence Rush wrote: > But some of us prefer: > > CoCa CoLa > > (Cobaltium Calcide/Cobaltium Lanthanide) > > Larry Rush > > (Hope this doesn't start something!) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 7:02 PM > Subject: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > >> As a slightly off-topic aside, at a science teachers' meeting I was >> at the other night, one fellow was wearing a T-shirt with information >> about an unsual new mineral, a carbonaceous holmium-lanthanum cobalt >> telluride, i.e., it said, >> CHoCoLaTe >> >> (Isn't this a post, almost worthy of Axel himself?) >> >> Cheers, Pete >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Axel Emmermann >> To: bj9709@yahoo.com; 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for >> rock and gem collectors' >> Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:31 pm >> Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >> >> >> >> Hi Brett, >> >> Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. >> It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. >> >> Calcite (CaCO3) >> Magnesite (MgCO3) >> Otavite (CdCO3) >> Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) >> Siderite (FeCO3) >> Smithsonite (ZnCO3) >> >> Have I forgotten a few? >> >> Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also >> cadmian-smithsonite... >> >> Cheers >> Axel >> >>> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >>> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >>> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett >>> Allen Johnson >>> Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 >>> Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >>> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >>> >>> On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. >>> What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian >>> Calcite? >>> I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some >>> say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. >>> I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and >>> Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out >>> what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >>> multipart/alternative >>> text/plain (text body -- kept) >>> text/html >>> --- >>> -- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >>> Subscription Services: >>> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >>> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >>> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >>> >> >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- >> multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > From Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net Thu Jul 31 19:12:22 2008 From: Kreigh at Tomaszewski.net (Kreigh Tomaszewski) Date: Thu Jul 31 19:15:19 2008 Subject: Chemical Words {was: Re: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite} In-Reply-To: <8CAC17898717ABB-9DC-3A91@webmail-me04.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <46D2E755-5F6F-11DD-8446-0005022E6413@Tomaszewski.net> There are 26,811 English words that can be spelled from the Periodic table... http://www.wellington.org/nandor/chemwords/chemwords.htm The only elements that can be spelled using chemical symbols are: ?arsenic ?ArSeNiC, ArSeNIC ?astatine ?AsTaTiNe ?bismuth ?BiSmUTh, BISmUTh ?carbon ?CaRbON, CArBON ?copper ?CoPPEr, COPPEr ?iron ?IrON ?krypton ?KrYPtON ?neon ?NeON ?phosphorus?? ?PHOsPHoRuS, PHoSPHoRuS, PHOSPHoRus, ?PHOsPHORuS, PHoSPHORuS, PHOSPHORuS?? ?silicon ?SiLiCoN, SILiCoN, SiLiCON, SILiCON ?tin ?TiN ?xenon ?XeNoN, XeNON I knew I had seen this before, it just took me a while to find it again. Enjoy! Kreigh On Thursday, Jul 31, 2008, at 19:02 America/Detroit, pmodreski@aol.com wrote: > As a slightly off-topic aside, at a science teachers' meeting I was at > the other night, one fellow was wearing a T-shirt with information > about an unsual new mineral, a carbonaceous holmium-lanthanum cobalt > telluride, i.e., it said, > CHoCoLaTe > > (Isn't this a post, almost worthy of Axel himself?) > > Cheers, Pete > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Axel Emmermann > To: bj9709@yahoo.com; 'Rockhounds@drizzle.com: A mailing list for rock > and gem collectors' > Sent: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 4:31 pm > Subject: RE: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite > > > > Hi Brett, > > Spherocobaltite (or is it sphaerocobaltite) is CoCO3. > It's one of the pure ones, the "end-members", of the calcite group. > > Calcite (CaCO3) > Magnesite (MgCO3) > Otavite (CdCO3) > Rhodochrosite (MnCO3) > Siderite (FeCO3) > Smithsonite (ZnCO3) > > Have I forgotten a few? > > Mangano-calcite is in between rhodochrosite and calcite, there's also > cadmian-smithsonite... > > Cheers > Axel > >> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- >> Van: rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com >> [mailto:rockhounds-bounces@lists.drizzle.com] Namens Brett >> Allen Johnson >> Verzonden: donderdag 31 juli 2008 23:07 >> Aan: rockhounds@lists.drizzle.com >> Onderwerp: [Rockhounds] RE: Question, Cobaltian Calcite >> >> On the subject of Cobaltian Calcite. >> What is the difference between Sphaerocobaltite and Cobaltian Calcite? >> I have googled both and got many conflicting answers. Some >> say CoCO3, others say (Co,Ca)CO3. >> I am not sure, but I think I have both Sphaerocobaltite and >> Cobaltian Calcite in my collection. So, I need to find out >> what is what = so I can identify my specimens correctly. Thank, Brett >> >> >> >> >> --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/alternative >> text/plain (text body -- kept) >> text/html >> --- >> -- >> _______________________________________________ >> Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List >> Subscription Services: >> http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds >> List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: >> http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >> > > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html > > > > --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- > multipart/alternative > text/plain (text body -- kept) > text/html > --- > -- > _______________________________________________ > Rockhounds@drizzle Mailing List > Subscription Services: > http://lists.drizzle.com/mailman/listinfo/rockhounds > List Home Page, with a link to the List Usage Policy: > http://www.eclecticlapidary.com/Rockhounds/index.html >